Eric,
Wow! That was fast. Thank you. A couple of questions:
When you say "they ordered the parts", are you referring to Amel or Leroy Somer? Also, the reference to "roller bearings" is confusing as I did not find any roller bearings in my assembly. Are you referring to the sealed bearing assembly (which I think are ball bearings) or is it possible that you have a newer version of the gear box?
If you get a chance to post the drawings, I would appreciate being able to see them.
As to the sledge hammer, I was referring to using it to disassemble the bearings and bronze wheel from the inner shaft on which they are mounted. Bronze may not react as well to the hammer approach. Although seating the new wheel with a hammer may not require as much force since you can clean and lubricate the shaft prior to reassembly and reassembly is the point where you care the most about not hurting the parts. So maybe the hammer works.
Regardless, the alternative to taking the boom off and using the hammer is illustrated by Ipanema in the photo section. This I have done and can report that it is quick, easy and works under the worst corrosion conditions. It also avoids disassembly of boom from mast. It does, however, require the fabrication of the "gear puller" that Ipanema illustrates. Mine is simpler and uses slightly thinner stock, but the idea is the same. Thank you Ipanema for sharing.
And while we are thanking people for sharing, Eric, your suggestion of using anti seize compound is a great idea and applies to several other bits of the Amel that are subject to corrosion like the sheave on the line handler for the genoa car.
By the way, when your new gearbox came, was it the Amel version (s/s bolts, white paint) or a "stock version"?
Finally, do you recall the price of this unit?
Fair winds and following seas,
Stephan
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--- In amelyachtowners@..., kimberlite@... wrote:
Hi,
on my sm #376 the gearbox is number gz158600.
They ordered the parts for me from France and it arrived via fedex--expensive but fast.
Justin told me that the reason I did not receive the roller bearings was that Amel assembled the gearbox.
I have photos of the gearbox parts and a parts drawing of the box. Unfortunately, i can not post them from where I am at this time.
With respect to a frozen outhaul shaft, i am quite good mechanically, and besides taking the boom off and bringing it to a machine shop with a press, ansledge hammer works perfectly fine.
There are some photos on this subject in the Kimberlite section.
All that has to be done is to remove the boom and turn it upside down on the deck supporting it with numerous heavy boards. The trick is to install a grade 10 (black) machine bolt and screw it all the way into the shaft. a few hits with a large sledge hammer will remove the shaft quickly without causing any damage.
If you use any other grade bolt it will bend. The grade 10 bolts are also great to use on the autoprop prop puller as the stainless ones supplied will break if the prop is really stuck.
Now before making any salty passage we remove the shaft and smear it anti seize compound-now it always comes out easily.
Fair Winds,
eric
sm376
----- Original Message -----
From: stephreg
Date: Wednesday, November 7, 2012 1:50 pm
Subject: [Amel] Out-haul gearbox for SM2K
To: amelyachtowners@...
To all SM and SMM owners:
To revisit the subject of the out-haul gearbox and update
details, I called Leroy Somer in the USA and spoke with Mathieu
Herieau who told me:
1. Justin is no longer in this position, he has transferred
elsewhere within the Emerson Electric group.
2. The gearbox number within Leroy Somer is MVA M33C with a
ratio of 60. Mathieu told me that the number "102014" is not a
number used within Leroy Somer. The part is manufactured in
France and distributed in the US by someone in South Carolina.
I will update the contact details after Mathieu responds to my
inquiry so you can contact the right person directly.
3. The bronze gear, which is the gear that will take the
majority of wear (after seals and bearings), is handled by LM
Electric in Montreal. I have not contacted them yet, but will
provide contact details if they are willing to source the part.
4. Amel's last purchase of the gearbox appears to be a batch in
2006. I have not contacted Amel to see if they have any
remaining in stock.
5. However, Amel purchased a batch of the bronze gears (Mathieu
called them "wheels") in 2012. Again, I have not contacted Amel
about current inventory.
6. Mathieu, while looking at the computer notes, observed that
Amel had certain modifications to the stock gearbox made:
stainless bolts to close the case, special paint on the housing,
an adaptation for the connection to the electric motor. The
adaptation to the connection to the electric motor is the only
issue I see to using the stock gearbox. Replacing the bolts
with stainless is straightforward as is applying suitable paint.
On reflecting on this information and talking with my local
machine shop, I believe that it would be easier and possibly
cheaper to overhaul the existing gearbox rather than replacing
it, which would require separating the gearbox from the motor.
If the bronze wheel can be sourced, then the bearings and seals
are standard industrial items. The only other serious wear item
is the top half of the case, which tends to corrode from salt
water sitting on the top around the seal. After significant
corrosion, the seal will no longer seat properly. A poorly
seated seal simply accelerates downstream problems from salt-
water intrusion.
If one has the parts, any half-way competent machine shop can
disassemble the box, pull the seals, bearings and bronze wheel,
replace same, and reassemble. In fact, an Amel owner could
probably accomplish the same with access to a gear puller to
take stuff apart and a press to put it together. Given that the
key to a successful overhaul is the bronze wheel, however, I
would think that using the sledge hammer (recommended by some
for removing the output shaft from the gear box), is a less than
elegant solution.
If you have the gear box in pieces, this would be a good time to
add some grease ports. Posts elsewhere discuss this.
Finally, inspection of the bronze wheel shows just how much wear
it takes when one does not relieve the load on the main sail
before furling or unfurling the sail. I would think that you
could get several decades of service from the gearbox if the
sail was never furled or unfurled under load and the gearbox
were splashed with fresh water after every sail. The ease of
pushing a button has removed the feedback loop so we never
really appreciate how much our equipment works.
Regards,
Stephan (secretly-wants-to-be-a-machinist-himself) Regulinski
--- In amelyachtowners@..., "Mark"
wrote:>
Hi Eric,
I've pasted below msg 8933, which I think has the information you are looking for.
regards, Mark
--------------------
Sorry I didn't post all the information I should've. Justin's
email is
Justin.McMahon _at_ emerson.com I gave him the part information below that someone
else had posted and a couple of pictures of the gearbox and the "Leroy Somer
MINIBIOC MVA-MEVA Installation and maintenance" PDF file. You might also
reference his exchange with me (Mark Hayden).
regards, Mark
Manufacturer: LS Leroy Somer
Made in France
6015 Angoulene
Reducteur N 0256889
Type MVA M33C
Rduction 1/60
--- In amelyachtowners@..., kimberlite wrote:
_____
From: amelyachtowners@...
[mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of kimberlite
Sent: Monday, June 27, 2011 5:29 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: RE: [Amel] Re: FW: : Leroy sommers- out haul gear
box part number
Mark,
Please put in touch with the distributor who could handle
the gearbox order.
Thanks
Eric
_____
From: amelyachtowners@...
[mailto:amelyachtowners@...
] On Behalf Of Mark
Sent: Friday, June 24, 2011 10:57 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel] Re: FW: : Leroy sommers- out haul gear box
part number
I finally reached someone in the US who is responsive and
appears to be able
to source the gearbox. I haven't actually ordered yet as we
are overseas and
need to figure out timing etc.
--Mark
__________________________
Mark,
The gearbox is available. Pricing is $521 ea. FCA
Charleston, SC and
delivery time is about 8 weeks.
The product would be available from the factory in France in
4 weeks if you
wanted to air freight the item. It normally costs about
$3.50 per kg.
If you want to proceed with an order, I can put you in touch
with one of our
distributors.
Best regards,
Justin T. McMahon | Sales & Marketing Manager
Leroy Somer Power & Drives - NA
8100 W. Florissant Ave. | St. Louis MO 63136 | USA
T 314.553.2380 | F 314.553.3403
--- In amelyachtowners@...
, "Judy and Bill
aboard SV BeBe"
wrote:
Eric,
Check the photo at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amelyachtowners/photos/album/834685605/pic/315> > 936164/view?picmode=
5936164/view?picmode=&mode=tn&order=ordinal&start=1&count=20&dir=asc>
&mode=tn&order=ordinal&start=1&count=20&dir=asc
This should give you all you need for the part.
Bill
BeBe
--- In amelyachtowners@...
, kimberlite wrote:
Bill,
This is the alternator division of Emerson electric that
handles Leroy
Somer.
When I called the number they said that they do not
handle the
gearboxes.
Do you have any other info?
Fair Winds
Eric
Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite
_____
From: amelyachtowners@...
[mailto:amelyachtowners@...
] On Behalf Of
Judy and Bill
aboard
SV BeBe
Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 11:49 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel] Re: FW: : Leroy sommers- out haul gear
box part number
Eric,
Here it is...my first email was sent to gears-
usa"at"leroy-somer.com...I
got
the response from:TechServices.PTSolutions"at"emerson.com
___________________________
from TechServices.PTSolutions"at"emerson.com
to brouse@
date Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 10:18 PM
subject RE: RFQ
Hi Bill,
Good day.
Here is the number of Leroy Somer for direct contact on
this reducer.
7319673000. Thank you. Have a great weekend.
Regards,
Tech
____________________________________________
From: svbebe@
Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2011 3:05 AM
To: gears-usa"at"leroy-somer.com
Subject: RFQ
Availability and price of gearbox number 102014 - see
attached photo
Regards,
Charles W Bill Rouse
Yacht BeBe
3919 Ruskin St.
Houston, TX 77005
--- In amelyachtowners@...
, kimberlite
wrote:
_____
From: kimberlite [mailto:kimberlite@]
Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 10:48 PM
To: 'kimberlite'
Subject: : Leroy sommers- out haul gear box part number
Hi,
I called the phone number and they have no info on the
gearbox.> > > > >
Would you please email me your correspondence with them.
Fair Winds
Eric
Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite
Eric and all,
The Leroy Somer gear reduction gearbox is part number
102014. It can
be
ordered from Leroy Somer at the US phone 731-967-3000.
I got this
information from gears-usa"at"leroy-somer.com. They
told me via email
that
it was available.
I have not called the number for a price because I am
in Greece now.
Let
me
know if this works out for you.
Best,
Bill
BeBe SM2k, #387
Currently Sounion, Greece
--- In amelyachtowners@...
,
kimberlite
wrote:
I am also looking for a gearbox for this motor.
Does anyone have a good contact?
Fair Winds
Eric
Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite
_____
From: amelyachtowners@...
[mailto:amelyachtowners@...
] On Behalf
Of Mark
Sent: Wednesday, June 08, 2011 6:27 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Leroy sommers- out haul gear box part number
It seems like quite a few people are tackling the
problems servicing
their
outhaul gearboxes. I happened to notice the other
day that the top
lip
seal
was shot on mine and started on a two day project to
disassemble the
gearbox.
I tried just about everything to get the inner shaft
removed, except
"getting medieval with a sledge hammer" as one of
the other owners
demonstrated. After bending several 8mm steel
brackets and breaking
my
puller tool, we finally succeeded with a 20mm thick
steal bracket
that
was
fabricated for the purpose. The nice thing about the
approach that
finally
succeeded for us was that all the force was placed
on the outer
shaft of
the
gearbox, none on the boom or the other components of
the gearbox.
I'll
post
a picture when I have a chance.
I found the model information posted by one of the
other owners
here:
Manufacturer: LS Leroy Somer
Made in France
6015 Angoulene
Reducteur N 0256889
Type MVA M33C
Rduction 1/60
I have not been able to reach Leroy Somer via their
contact page.
Can
anyone
recommend a reliable and inexpensive source to order
the gearbox or
parts
from? Any pricing info?
One other question: it seems that the outhaul
gearbox causes more
problems
than the main sail furling gearbox. Is that right?
Is the latter
just
less
exposed to the elements?
thanks, Mark
SM331
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