Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

hanspeter baettig

Hi Danny
3200 sm in 17 days; means 188 sm per day
and 3 day with no wind.
You sail realy a Super Maramu or a racing cat ?
tell us the story
SM 16 , Tamango 2
Sardinia, Palau

Von meinem iPhone gesendet

Am 26.07.2017 um 20:58 schrieb Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>:


Hi Pat,

I wont tell Kent about the stowaway. If you take off the three windless days the miles covered in the other 14 days easily tops 200. Not many classes can match that. A big part of it is the ability to go through the night under full sail because it is so easy to reduce sail without leaving the security of the cockpit. Most cruisers in other designs sensibly reduce sail at nightfall.



SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 27 July 2017 at 00:21 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


Danny , That is a great ave. run about 190 . Kent drove up a couple of weeks ago and had dinner with us and discussed his plans. Don't tell him, but I plan to stow away  in his aft lazarett e . My understanding is that when you turn the key , it closes a solenoid that connects the neg. side to the starter solenoid. I would like to know where it is , as it could be could fail someday. If my understanding is incorrect , I would appreciate it if someone would tell me I am mistaken . This would be on a Volvo TMD 22A.


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Wed, Jul 26, 2017 12:05 am
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

Hi Pat,
sorry you wont make NZ by sail, its a great voyage across the Pacific. Some great down wind sailing in big Pacific swells. We did 3200 miles in 17 days and had three days with no wind. These SM have long legs. I think Kent is building up a head of steam to do it.
Sorry, cant give you the solenoid position. I would do a wire trace starting with the battery terminals and working through.
On 26 July 2017 at 13:02 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Danny , Yea email is great .Diane and I would love to see you guys again, I thought it would happen under sail one day , but with four grandchildren in the last two years , it may have to be under wings. I love N.Z. and want to revisit it someday. Do you know where the negative solenoid is located , I want to check the contacts , although that would not explain the Gen. set not starting. 

-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 7:09 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

Hi Pat,
That's the good side of problems, it gets us on to the forum to renew friendships. Great to maintain contact from so far away.
On 26 July 2017 at 09:38 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Danny, The intermittent starting problem I have had for months. The engine would do nothing or it would start right up normally. I switched out batteries , no jumper . I think it is most likely to be a poor connection somewhere and probably on the negative side. Thats where I will start , going out to the boat now to get started . Good to hear from you , say Hi ! to Yvonne .
Thanks,< /span>
Pat SM#123

-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]  0;amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 3:48 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

Hi Pat,
I spin through the posts deleting after read but I believe you said the motors start sometimes, sometimes not. When they start do they spin as per normal or groan. Batteries dont fail and then not fail. You've tried another battery with n o change which gives a pretty positive lead to it not being battery.  Was that by jumper lead or by switching via terminals? The symptoms sound like a bad connection. Not the starting switch because there are separate for each engine. It has to be a common connection. Battery terminals a good starting point
SM 299 Ocean Pearl
On 26 July 2017 at 04:36 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Mark, I ordered a load tester today, something I have meant to do for a long time. I switched out batteries to eliminate it being the battery , but who knows , maybe with my luck , both are bad. I hope so , but that would be too easy. The thing is , there doesn't seem to be enough power to excite the gauges or the alarm buzzer or the glow plug light. Seems like a bad connection on the neg. side somewhere, but what do I know, answer , very little.

< /span>

-----Original Message-----
From: 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 10:36 am
Subject: RE: [Ame l Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

Test the battery with a load tester. If you do not have a load tester you can take the battery to any automotive parts store for testing. Measuring the voltage will not tell you if the battery has enough oomph left in it.
With best regards,
Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
Currently cruising - Grenada
From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Tuesday, Jul y 25, 2017 10:00 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
John,The 11.8v was after turning the key in an attempt to start , but nothing happens not even a click from the solenoid . I can't understand what would bleed off the voltage , nothing is hot to the touch. Even the gauges don't move or alarm button buzz. On the generator the glow plug doesn't light up.
< div class="ox-a770aa1e71-aolmail_ox-dc7bb36eea-aolmail_ox-939b5ba8cb-aolmail_ox-fbd1f879e3-aolmail_MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12.0pt;">Thanks ,Pat

-----Original Message-----
From: john.biohead@...< /a> [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtown ers <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 9:29 am
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
Not sure which model you have but on my SM 37 there is one common starting battery for both the generator and motor.
  Reaching back to my days tinkering with old cars I have a couple of thoughts:
1. wiggling a switch then things work sounds like the switch is not making go od contact.  I assume you are speaking of the battery disconnect switch, not the ignition/starter switch at the helm.    A high resistance connection could cause the symptoms of OK voltage without load,  but when you try to start there  is not enough current to do anything.   ;
2. If the battery is failing it might be able to show OK voltage but not have capacity to start the engines.  When you said after attempting to start the voltage measures 11.8,  was that while starting or after the attempts are completed?   
 If the starter motors don't fire there shouldn't have been a lot of drain on the batt ery.  That 11.8 after an attempt would then point me toward a bad battery.  But you already tried a different battery.  Are you sure all the batteries tried are good and properly charged?  
I am doing some work in the engine room later today, I will take a look at my s tarting circuit and let you know if I see anything that makes sense for these symptoms.
  Regards,  John
John Clark
SV Annie SM 37
Charleston SC

---In amelyachtowners@..., wrote :
For some time I have had an intermittent probably starting my Volvo engine , I would turn the battery switch on and off a few times and it would start . I don't know if that was coincidental or not. Last night we went out to go for a sail and the eng ine would not start and I discovered that the generator would not start either. I would trouble shoot this more myself , but a year ago and reconfirmed a week ago , I agreed to take an elderly couple and their family out on my boat for a sunset sail to celebrate their 50 th Anniversary , they are really looking forward to it and so need to solve this issue within five days. B elow is what I determined last night ;
Neither engine will st art.
Battery shows 12.6 V
Have 12.6 V at both solenoids   
Have 12.6 V at battery wires on back side of battery switches
When I turn the key , the fan comes on , turn the key to start and fan and gauges go dead.
After that Voltage only measures 11. 8
After short time , turn key and fan runs very slowly
Turn key again , fan does not run , gauges dead , even alarm button pushed , nothing
I switched wires to another 12v house battery , same things happen< /d iv>
Generator switch has 12.6 V at the terminals , five white wires , don't know which does what.
The glow plug lite does not even come on.
fuse is good on back side of Gen.
Solenoids don't click
Since battery voltage went down after key is turned a few times , I checked for heat on starter & solenoid , both cool to touch.
It seems logical that whatever the problem is , that it is affecting both engines 
My understand ing is that when the key is turned , the ground is momentarily connected by a switch , where is this switch located ?
Bot h engines would not share this switch , would they.
Do both engines share the same ground?
To me it seems like corrosion on a terminal , but I get 12.6 on the back of the battery switches between the positive and negative wires , from there I have 12.6 at the solenoids 
< /div>
Any thoughts on wh at to check or what may be my problem would be appreciated.






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