Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] can't open saloon floor panels


Ryan Meador
 

Hi James,
Yes, at times there has been a bit of condensation in some of the bilge areas.  I believe it is coming from the topsides, not below the waterline.  The water is still 48°F/9°C.  The air has been down to 13°F/-10°C (last night; I would expect to see only a few more days all winter at that temperature or colder).  I haven't seen any sweating directly on the surfaces exposed to water, but I have seen the occasional drop run from places higher up which I can't see directly.  I am indeed measuring the humidity at table height... I will put a sensor in the bilge and see what it says.  I keep the boat heated to a minimum of 50°F/10°C (I think it got down to 48°F in the engine room last night, which is not actively heated).  I have been vigilant at wiping up water when I see it, but I can't do it 24/7.  With the ambient humidity being so low, I haven't seen any condensation at all in a few days.  With my old boat, it was usually just a few weeks in the fall and spring where I would have condensation, and most of the winter it was dry enough that it wasn't an issue.  If the online calculator I found is to be trusted, the dew point inside the boat should be right around freezing right now, so there won't be condensation on most surfaces (and if there is, it would be frost).  I am confident the panels are in the right locations and orientations as they perfectly span the bulkheads (ribs?) beneath the sole and the rubber lines line up with the rest of the sole.  I'll try out the feeler gauge... I've been looking for an excuse to buy one for years.

Obviously, I need to sail south next winter!

Thanks,
Ryan
SM 233 Iteration
Boston, MA, USA

On Thu, Dec 14, 2017 at 11:00 AM, James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Well I don’t know about that…  I personally really enjoy the warmth of the varnished wooden panels in my Amel….


James

On Dec 14, 2017, at 10:14 AM, Yahoo! Mail sammie.whammie@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


Wood has no place in a boat.


On Wednesday, December 13, 2017 11:52 PM, "James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
Ryan,

   Is there any moisture at all present in the bilge area where the panels are becoming tight?  I would check the hull surfaces and the underside of the floor.   Are you taking your  humidity readings at the level of the floor or higher up in the cabin?   I am guessing that you are heating the boat to well above the current temperature of the water?   If the instrument that you are using to read off the relative humidity is well above the floor then the relative humidity in the bilge could be much higher.  For instance, if you are reading  20C and 53% relative humidity in a location several feet above the floor level, that same air when cooled to 10C in the bilges from the cold water will be at saturation.  (100% relative humidity)    I am confused as to why drying the panels did not seem to help but perhaps the floor itself has swelled enough to create the fit problems?  This is a hard problem to troubleshoot from a distance but in general I usually find that when wooden parts  fit properly when the wood is known to be dry begin to become tight that moisture/swelling of the wood is usually the culprit.   Perhaps the reason that the panels are the tight only in the main cabin is because the cabin sole is because the athwartship dimension of the total panel is the greatest in this area of the boat hence more total swelling.  I assume that you have checked to be sure that the panels are being inserted into the correct location? 

  It might be worth taking a feeler gauge and checking to see where the panels are actually binding since that might provide a clue as to what is going on.  See if there is a pattern that repeats when comparing the Port and Stb. side.  I don’t know how long your lift out panels are but if wood swells unevenly you can end up with a curved shape that might show up from taking a few measurements.  The feeler gauge will also show you the tight areas that you will need to trim if it comes to that...

Best of luck,

James

SV Sueno,  Maramu #220
  
On Dec 13, 2017, at 11:49 PM, Ryan Meador ryan.d.meador@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


James,
I removed all the floor panels and dried them out by propping them up around the saloon for 4 days.  The temperature never went below 50°F/10°C and humidity was never above 50%.  It doesn't seemed to have changed anything.  They're just as hard to fit as before, to the point where I'm afraid to jam the last one in; I might need to use a crowbar to get it open again.  So I have the one at the forward end of the saloon sitting 90 degrees off from where it belongs... there's only a minimal risk of breaking an ankle.

Any other ideas?

Thanks,
Ryan
SM 233 Iteration
Boston, MA, USA

On Sat, Dec 2, 2017 at 8:14 PM, Ryan Meador <ryan.d.meador@gmail.com> wrote:
That's an interesting theory. The water temperature is about 50 degrees right now. I'll give your idea a test.

Thanks,
Ryan

On Dec 2, 2017 7:08 PM, "James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups. com> wrote:
 
Ryan,

   If the boat is currently in cold Boston waters, it is possible that the heated air (with a higher relative humidity) is condensing on the colder panels and soaking in, thereby swelling the wood.   You might try removing one panel, placing it in a relatively high location so that it will see the higher temperatures/lower relative humidity and see if it returns to a size that fits the location.  If the test panel fits after drying for a few days, then you have your answer.  

Best,

James

SV Sueno 
Maramu #220

On Dec 2, 2017, at 7:05 PM, Ryan Meador ryan.d.meador@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@... om> wrote:


There aren't any hinges; all of the panels lift out.

I also just this evening realized that the panel outboard of the table is stuck too, but the ones directly beneath the table are easy to open..

Thanks,
Ryan
SM 233 Iteration
Boston, MA, USA



On Dec 2, 2017 12:34 PM, "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelya chtowners]" <amelyachtowners@... om> wrote:
 
Hi Ryan,
Have you checked the hinges,
Danny
SM 299 Ocean Pearl
On 02 December 2017 at 11:51 "Ryan Meador ryan.d.meador@...  [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@... om> wrote:

 
 
Hi all,
My SM has the wooden floor panels, not the blue ones.  A while after I bought the boat in the beginning of August, I noticed the smoothly-opening floor panels that run the length of the saloon were taking some effort to open.  I chalked it up to humidity.  But it's been getting worse, to the point where I now need to use a tool to grab onto the holes to lift them as my fingers aren't strong enough.  None of the other floor panels on the boat are affected.  My hygrometer has been reading 45-55% for the last few weeks (since I started paying attention) so even if it was humidity, I would have expected them to dry out again by now.  The temperature has dropped a bit, but I've been keeping the boat heated.  The panels are properly aligned with the rubber stripes in the floor.  Any idea what has happened?  I'd rather not shave them down without understanding it.

Thanks,
Ryan
SM 233 Iteration
Boston, MA, USA
 

 













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