Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] 2nd Forestay on Super Maramu


Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Thanks Bill,

Your supportive comments are appreciated. I always hesitate to post criticism of specific businesses but in this case the experience was a good illustration of the need to have properly designed and built sails. And after my unrelenting insistence Doyles did build me the sail I asked for in the first place. 

Kind Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl 

On 15 April 2018 at 01:28 "Bill Rouse brouse@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Danny,

Your experience with Doyle Sails doesn't surprise me. They also seem to be very ridgid in what they will do in other locations, as well. I believe that they feel that they know better than their customers. It is really a shame, but it is understandable that Doyle should know more than most of their customers...in your case, they didn't...and rope does not equal foam! I suspect that they purposefully reduce options to be able to streamline production in their low-cost production facilities. And, how can you blame them when 80% of sails are purchased based on a combination of brand and price.

The choice of sailmakers, sailcloth, construction, and options is complex and is not generally boat specific. It's a combination of boat, sailing destinations, owner preference, required life expectancy of the sails, and specific owner preferences. I believe all of Henri's choices for the original standard suite of 5 sails for the SM was perfect for the vast majority of world cruising SM owners, and I believe a few improvements could have been made on subsequent models for world cruising.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus
Amel School www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970


On Fri, Apr 13, 2018, 14:35 Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

 

Hi Paul,

Going to windward, "more is less" in my opinion. Over-canvassed to windward is uncomfortable and inefficient. We have a heavy weather 90% jib with a high cut foot. Surprisingly going to windward In anything over 15 knots true it is as quick as the big genoa. But unless the windward work is long the effort of changing sails has me preferring to furl the genoa. .HOWEVER all sails are not created equal. I think this fact is partly why there are such differing opinions.

To have a genoa suitable to furl and use in strong winds to windward it needs to be made for the job. 1) The cloth must be heavy enough.Or be made of a robust fabric  2) The sailmaker needs to know what wind strength the sail will be used in, 3) the sail maker needs to know you intend to partly furl it for strong windward work. 3) The sail needs a properly designed foam padded luff. The cheap option of a rope sewn inside the luff is not acceptable.

Do the above and you will get a sail that will furl and retain a reasonable shape. Light cloth and no foam luff and you will have a sack, not a sail if you try to sail with it partly furled.

I gave Doyles in Auckland NZ these instructions when they made me a new genoa some years back. They used too light a cloth, and refused to put a foam luff in saying the rope option was just as good. The result: In light air up to 15 knots it was a beautiful sail. But in stronger wind a sail that distorted so badly they had to replace it. They fiddled around adjusting seams but in the end I had them on board in only 20 knots true and they gave up and made me a new sail. By the time it was made I was in Noumea and they had to ship it up to me.

Lastly, I agree with the comments regarding halyard tension and car position.

Regards

Danny. 

On 13 April 2018 at 22:48 "osterberg.paul.l@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Hello!

I’m curious how do you without a stay sail go upwind in true wind exceeding 25 knots, with occasional gusts of +30 knots, in reasonable comfort. We go comfortable up wind in 20 knots apparent wind with the full Genoa, but if gusts exceeding 24 knots apparent we are definitely over canvased. therefore we start to furl just before 20 knots apparent wind. When we encounter apparent wind of 30 knots we found very poor up wind performance with the Genoa heavily furled and VMG is very poor.

.

 

Paul on S/Y Kerpa SM#259

 


 

 

 

 


 

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