As one of the moderators for the forum I offer my view regarding the rule about negative comments. "Without the ability of the other to respond" is the critical phrase. There are always two sides to any debate. There are people who have good experiences with a contractor while others have the reverse with the same company. Yet this is the same firm. Like it or not we as owners can at times be less than perfect. Actually some of us at times can be downright difficult to deal with. Fact of life. Hence the rule. I am not saying bad experiences are our own fault, of course not but there are two sides and to only hear one is unfair. But then to try and have the forum litigate disputes between owners and contractors would be utterly destructive.
So I think there are very good reasons for the rule and we need to follow it.
We can still provide helpful advice by recommending places we have had good service from.
Likewise I have been disappointed with the negative stuff directed at Bill.
Easy target as he rides the flow from a group of over a thousand fiercely independant individuals and works to give us the most positive forum there is out there. Not easy.
So folks, take care. We have something none of us want to lose.
New Zealand04 July 2021 at 20:37 Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...> wrote:
[Edited Message Follows]I like the Amel Forum, and have been very happy to be a member. But, I still believe that just about everything we write on this forum, is opinion. Even the installation procedure of the BT Seals, seems to be opinion.
I would like clarification on a few statements:
1. However, for as long as "I" own it, "our" group will not be the place to post these issues.
2. Bill leads the idea of independence in thought and experience.
The first statement bags the question, WHO does own this group? Bill has done a great job bringing the Amel owners together, and the group is a place where the owners collectively share ideas, trade experiences, and yes, share opinion. The group COLLECTIVELY answers questions, and is a cool place to get information about our Amels, but the Amel Forum is not just One person.
A while ago I saw that a member asked the question, " Does anyone know a good marina around xxxxxx?". After a question like that, the author is looking for opinion, and depending on who responds, the author can decide on how to use the response. Let's say, there is a rule .... No member of the Amel Owners Group can write anything negative about a marina... Members would be able to respond with only positive opinions about a marina, and all negative responses will be discouraged and removed. No one wants to be part of a group that bickers about this or that, but if the Amel Forum is a place to write positive opinions about a marina (or Supplier), then it must be a place to write negative responses.
Let's say that 10 Amel owners have berthed at a marina, and were all overcharged for electricity, and then had to pay inflated bills. The 10 owners are not able to write anything about the marina on the Amel Forum because they have nothing good to say, but Captan Joe has 900AH at 24V of LiFePO4 had wonderful things to say about the the marina because he didn't have to plug into shore power... And, maybe Captain Joe also gets a 5% commission on every Amel that berths at the marina. So, of coarse, Captain Joe sez wonderful things about the marina, and more Amel owners will go to the marina and have to pay inflated bills. Does anything seem wrong with this?
Regarding contractors -
I have QSails on Aquarius. I am VERY happy with my sails, and have nothing but good things to say about the support I received from QSails. On my YouTube channel I always say good things about my sails, all produced by QSails... I have NEVER received any financial gain from QSails, and I paid full price for EVERYTHING I bought/received from QSails. I promote products that in my opinion are just "Dam Good" products! If a member wrote anything bad about QSails, I would definitely want to know what's up. But, nothing bad can be written on the Forum. Especially regarding a company that potentially has financial ties to the Forum "Owner". All that said, if I had to buy another Sail, right now, I would call QSails!
Aquarius caught fire last week. Yes, she could have burned to the ground. This is no joke. Some of you might smile, because if you have a YouTube channel, you know just how many HATTERS there are out there. The following 24 hours was spent searching for the exact spot where that fire started. I got exactly 2 hours of sleep that night because I was leave Thailand in 3 days. I found the electrical connection where the fire started, and this connection was changed by an American Dude at the North end of Phuket one year ago. The work completed by this guy/company was, in my opinion crap, and in my opinion created the problem that lead to a fire on Aquarius. Almost everything he touched, except for the questionable connection was subsaquently changed by another electrician hired to clean up the previous electricians mess. But, I should not warn the rest of the of the Forum about this guy, because we can't say anything negative about contractors. But, he can sit on Aquarius explain how all the Thai's are all stupid, showing me how his Thai worker ruined a tool he used that day working on Aquarius. I just asked him .... If he is so stupid, what the XXXX is he doing on My Boat?
I also discussed my opinion of this electrical contractor with another Amel 54 owner that had work done by him. That A54 owner confirmed my opinion of his services.
I am not sorry that my opinions are in opposition to the "Owner." And, as a member, I would like the following rule change.
1. If a member writes a good comment or promotes a product or service, all financial ties should also be reviled.
2. As long as a negative comment is in good taste, and not a personal attack, the negative comment should be tolerated. If a member continually makes negative or makes personal attacks, the member may be removed from the Forum. (Like I may be for these statements)
If, because I disagree with the "Owner", I am removed, so be it.