-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: r.zurkirchen [mailto:r.zurkirchen@vtx.ch]
Gesendet: Sonntag, 21. März 2004 11:42
An: 'amelyachtowners-owner@yahoogroups.com'
Betreff: Besan- Traveller

Hi all,

As I am extremely concerned about security on my Amel, I never liked,
when by night or in bad weather, some one or my self had to leave the
cockpit, in order to change manually the position of the besantraveler.
So have I now modified my AMEL SM 2000 #407. The modification is
extremely easy, and so I believe worthwhile.
If anyone is interested, I can send e few pictures ( ZIP 800 KB ) to
show how it looks like.
The boat is now again in the water, after the bad accident with an
unmarked underwater foundation. The repairs been done in Lago di Sibari,
in a very professional and extremely cost reasonable manner.
If interested about the pictures, mail to r.zurkirchen@vtx.ch

Rudy und Rita
SAMANTHA

Dear Eric

It will take me a few days to assemble the info. as soon as I have it I'll send it to you
via the The Owners' Group.

Regards Rob

I FREQUENTLY RUN BOTH THE 30 AMP AS WELL AS THE 50 AMP CHARGERS WHILE
CHARGING MY BATTERIES FROM THE GENSET. AT THE DOCK ON SHOREPOWER I
ONLY RUN THE 30 AMP CHARGER.
COMMENTS ON THIS?
JOHN FOLINO

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, kimberlt <kimberlt@o...>
wrote:

Hi,

Had an Ebenspacher in a previous boat and if was all rust inside
after a few years. Guess they are not really designed for the marine
use more for use in trucks etc.
Heard good comments about the Wallas heaters from Finland, they seem
to be build for marine use (www.wallas.fi)
They have a 4KW diesel heater.
I would like to hear if anybody has experience with these ?

Koen

Dear Rob,

I would like to see your installation. Maybe you can post it to

the Amel

owners site so everyone can look at it.

Fair winds,

Eric





_____

From: KIMBERLITE [mailto:kimberlt@o...]
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2004 2:53 PM
To: %HOME_AMEL
Subject: FW: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: espar/Mikuni heaters







-----Original Message-----
From: amelfango [mailto:rob.molly@m...]
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2004 12:15 PM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: espar/Mikuni heaters



Dear Eric,

Maybe, I didn't make it clear that we have a forced air heater

system,

fitted from new.
In the absence of Super Maramu pics, I can let you have Santorin

ones. The

original
system was an Espar system. I can also give you a full

description of where

all the
components are sited on our boat. Just ask if you think this

would be

helpful.


Rob
Amel Santorin
"Khamsin B"



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Hi,

I am a bit shocked about the Crusader debacle.
As owner of SM #17, I must say that I didn't encounter major
problems.
SM #17 sailed 1 1/2 times around the world

Before deciding to buy a new SM I did a survey of cruising boats in
the 50 foot range, and although I hate a few of the Amel features
(fake teak etc) none of the boats I visited could convince me.
(regardless of price)

Ofcourse nothing is perfect and I had a lot of small problems, wich
are all corrected and also corrected by Amel in their later boats
That's the good thing about Amel. Other yards change their designs
every few years and re-invent new problems again and again.

Guess Ian Shepard must have been very unlucky, having 2 major
failures.
Blaming the failures to single-handed sailing is in my opinion not
relevant.

I don't want to get mixed up with the Crusader debacle, of wich we
all know very little details, but lets hope that Amel solve this
dispute ASAP, and that they choose for a "commercial" solution
rather then go to court. This would prevent big damage to the Amel
reputation and to the re-sale value of our boats.

But I must support Ian in his proposal of a kind of service
bulletins.

When telling Amel about some of my problems their reaction has always
been "We never had this problem before.."
Talking to other owners I discovered that they all had similar
problems and that they also got the same answer from Amel.

The point is that if I had known about these problems, I could easely
corrected them in harbor. Discovering problems in mid ocean or in
Bangladesh is something else...

I proposed Amel to start a kind of service bulletins some years ago
(like in aviation), some just for information and some mandatory
(like AD's in aviation).
Their response was that al owners would force them for free repairs
and that the competition would use it killing Amels reputation.
Guess they started a kind of bulletin after the sinking of Ian's
boat, but only for very serious cases.

But times are changing.
Product liability is getting serious also in Europe now.
All who have been in manufacturing know that covering up known
defects can have very severe results for the company and the
directors.
Sooner or later a "small" known problem could trigger big problems
with personal injury or death.
A big lawsuit could follow and this could be the end of the AMEL
yard.
This would not be good news for us.

By publishing "service bulletins" and "mandatory service bulletins"
to all owners, Amel would tranfer their responsibility to the owner.
By warning us, it would be our responsibility to comply.

If Amel would offer suggestions or even repair kits to solve the
problems then the reputation of Amel would improve..not killed.

I hate to discover problems the expensive or even dangerous way,
when several other owners had the same problems.
And we are not only talking about major failures but also about the
numerous small problems that are unavoidable in such a complex
product.

If we all push hard enough to convince Amel, it will be good for all
of us, including the warf.
It would be a pitty that Amel would have to learn the hard way, that
product liability is becoming an issue, also in Europe and it would
be nice to be warned and to be able to correct faults before they
become problems.

Your vieuws pls,

Koen

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "Willem J. Kroes"
<w.kroes@h...> wrote:

Hallo Amel owners,

As second owner of 'Kavanga', a 1992 Santorin, I am preparing the
boat this winter for a longer trip this sommer. In that proces I
want to overhaul the electric motors for the main sail and more in
particular the gear boxes attached to these motors.
The motor attached to the mast came off without any problem, but

the

one attached to the boom gives me problems. Although I removed the
two screws it will not come off. I can feel coupling between the
Anderson line tender on top of the boom and the shaft coming out

of

the gear box.
Is there anyone who knows the tric?

Best Regards,

Willem J. Kroes

Hi,

You have to unscrew the bolt fixing the pulley on top of the boom

Koen

Claude,

We have SM#303 and are on the original batteries. We have cruised
full time since taking delivery in July 2000. We have been in
marinas a lot (maybe one day in three) and run the genset if the
batteries are down 20%. In this sense, we have pampered the
batteries.

On the other hand, our friends on Revalation (SM #390), went through
a set of batteries in 8 months. They wondered whether the charger
was misset and was systematically undercharging the batteries.

Stephan

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, Claude Roessiger
<nearlynothing@y...> wrote:

I have SM#308 and we are now on the third set of
batteries. (Incidentally, we were told that one could
run both chargers together, but that now seems
countermanded.) On my old Maramu I used to get 5 years
from batteries. I don't know the answer.
Claude Roessiger

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search - Find what you're looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com

Dear Rob,

I would like to see your installation. Maybe you can post it to the Amel
owners site so everyone can look at it.

Fair winds,

Eric





_____

From: KIMBERLITE [mailto:kimberlt@optonline.net]
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2004 2:53 PM
To: %HOME_AMEL
Subject: FW: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: espar/Mikuni heaters







-----Original Message-----
From: amelfango [mailto:rob.molly@mac.com]
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2004 12:15 PM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: espar/Mikuni heaters



Dear Eric,

Maybe, I didn't make it clear that we have a forced air heater system,
fitted from new.
In the absence of Super Maramu pics, I can let you have Santorin ones. The
original
system was an Espar system. I can also give you a full description of where
all the
components are sited on our boat. Just ask if you think this would be
helpful.


Rob
Amel Santorin
"Khamsin B"



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Dear Eric,

Maybe, I didn't make it clear that we have a forced air heater system, fitted from new.
In the absence of Super Maramu pics, I can let you have Santorin ones. The original
system was an Espar system. I can also give you a full description of where all the
components are sited on our boat. Just ask if you think this would be helpful.


Rob
Amel Santorin
"Khamsin B"

Dear Rob,

Thanks for the info.

We are interested in cruising with a heater and not running the engine or
sitting at a dock.

I guess Amel has –as always- made improvements to their boats as the owners
that I know that have the option are very happy with their heater.

I am still looking for some super maramu photos as I would like to add the
heater to my existing forced fresh air system.

Thanks

Eric





_____

From: amelfango [mailto:rob.molly@mac.com]
Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2004 7:22 PM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: espar/Mikuni heaters



--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "eric freedman" <kimberlt@o...> wro=
te:

does anyone have an espar heater installed on their Super Maramu?
i am looking for pictures of the installation.
thanks
eric
sm 376 kimberlite

Dear Eric et al,

I am surprised that nobody has replied to your request. We own a Santorin =
"Khamsin
B" and it was fitted with an Espar unit. My partner Dennis has had 3 prev=
ious boats
with Espar units and they all proved problematic. being from a racing rath=
er than a
cruising background heating was in the past not such a priority for me.

Taking account of Dennis' experience we looked at alternatives. We decided=
that the
following was the way to go.

1. For in port where 230v shorepower is available - Marina berth - to use=
simple fan
heaters. The Forward cabin has this system from new. Incidentally, does a=
ny other
Santorin owner know where is the heater supposed to go? I have not figured=
out what
the original Amel concept is.

2. For Motor Sailing I am fitting a matrix heater under the companionway-=
à la car/
truck. Using the heat from the engine which would apart from the heat to t=
he
calorifier would be used to heat the sea. In broad terms from a diesel eng=
ine of 40kW
cruising at c.50% power ie 15/20kW; you have 30% of the energy to each of (=
i) the
power from the engine (ii) exhaust heat (iii) the cooling water and 10% in =
various
other losses noise, incomplete combustion etc. So why not use the c. 15kw =
to the
cooling to heat the boat. With normal engineering losses etc. or if you pr=
efer
buggeration factors there should be about 5/6kW available with this in mind=
I
selected a nominal 5.5kW matrix from which I expet to extract 3/4kW to the =
saloon.
Has any anyone else fitted a similar system?

3. With Dennis' experience in mind I am fitting a Mikuni unit in place of =
the
Eberspächer unit. We'll see how we make out with this unit.

Eric if it is any use to you I'll send you some photos of our installation.=
If you want
this as a poor second to a Super Maramu installation.

We also have a 1989 Amel Fango for sale if anyone is interested please let =
me know.

My e mail is "rob.molly@mac.com"

Rob
Amel Santorin
"khamsin B" formerly "Fidelus"








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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "eric freedman" <kimberlt@o...> wro=
te:

does anyone have an espar heater installed on their Super Maramu?
i am looking for pictures of the installation.
thanks
eric
sm 376 kimberlite

Dear Eric et al,

I am surprised that nobody has replied to your request. We own a Santorin =
"Khamsin
B" and it was fitted with an Espar unit. My partner Dennis has had 3 prev=
ious boats
with Espar units and they all proved problematic. being from a racing rath=
er than a
cruising background heating was in the past not such a priority for me.

Taking account of Dennis' experience we looked at alternatives. We decided=
that the
following was the way to go.

1. For in port where 230v shorepower is available - Marina berth - to use=
simple fan
heaters. The Forward cabin has this system from new. Incidentally, does a=
ny other
Santorin owner know where is the heater supposed to go? I have not figured=
out what
the original Amel concept is.

2. For Motor Sailing I am fitting a matrix heater under the companionway-=
à la car/
truck. Using the heat from the engine which would apart from the heat to t=
he
calorifier would be used to heat the sea. In broad terms from a diesel eng=
ine of 40kW
cruising at c.50% power ie 15/20kW; you have 30% of the energy to each of (=
i) the
power from the engine (ii) exhaust heat (iii) the cooling water and 10% in =
various
other losses noise, incomplete combustion etc. So why not use the c. 15kw =
to the
cooling to heat the boat. With normal engineering losses etc. or if you pr=
efer
buggeration factors there should be about 5/6kW available with this in mind=
I
selected a nominal 5.5kW matrix from which I expet to extract 3/4kW to the =
saloon.
Has any anyone else fitted a similar system?

3. With Dennis' experience in mind I am fitting a Mikuni unit in place of =
the
Eberspächer unit. We'll see how we make out with this unit.

Eric if it is any use to you I'll send you some photos of our installation.=
If you want
this as a poor second to a Super Maramu installation.

We also have a 1989 Amel Fango for sale if anyone is interested please let =
me know.

My e mail is "rob.molly@mac.com"

Rob
Amel Santorin
"khamsin B" formerly "Fidelus"

I understand that there is special boat insurance for amel
owners. could someone give me the full email address?

Best wishes

Ron and Heather Brown-Tradewinds lll

I understand that there is special boat insurance for amel
owners. could someone give me the full email address?

Best wishes

Ron and Heather Brown-Tradewinds lll

I understand that there is special boat insurance for amel
owners. could someone give me the full email address?

Best wishes

Ron and Heather Brown-Tradewinds lll

Doubtful. There aren't a large number of yachts there and it really isn't
"sailing" territory. Within Venice there are only motor boats (vaporetti) because
of the bridges and restrictions.
Charlie Cronheim
S/V MALAIKA II, SM 336
Roma, Italia

My wife and I will visiting Venice in early May. Does anyone know if
there's anyone that day-charters an Amel there?
Thanks
Richard Tate
SM #5 "Spice"

Vito,
When will you be in the BV'IS?
Eric

The batteries that come with the boat are mediocre at best. If you
got 2 1/2 years out of them you did good. I replaced my original set
this year with a set of group 27 trojans wich gace me 40 extra amps
(24v). They seem to be working well. I too use both chargers. I have
the 50 and the 30 amp. Maybe you have the 100 amp charger and it
should not be used in conjuction with the 30 amp. One thing that I
did notice is that the link 10 monitor for some reason resets itself
to a lower amp hour reading safter a few days. So that a full charge
rating may not be a full charge.

Vito Ciaravino

Wanderer

ASM 283



--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "jfolino901"
<jfolino901@y...> wrote:

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, Claude Roessiger
<nearlynothing@y...> wrote:

I have SM#308 and we are now on the third set of
batteries. (Incidentally, we were told that one could
run both chargers together, but that now seems
countermanded.) On my old Maramu I used to get 5 years
from batteries. I don't know the answer.
Claude Roessiger

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search - Find what you're looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com

THANKS FOR THE INFORMATION. I HAVE BEEN RUNNING BOTH CHARGERS. IS
THIS WRONG?
JOHN FOLINO SM #347, SULAJON

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, Claude Roessiger
<nearlynothing@y...> wrote:

I have SM#308 and we are now on the third set of
batteries. (Incidentally, we were told that one could
run both chargers together, but that now seems
countermanded.) On my old Maramu I used to get 5 years
from batteries. I don't know the answer.
Claude Roessiger

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search - Find what you're looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com

THANKS FOR THE INFORMATION. I HAVE BEEN RUNNING BOTH CHARGERS. IS
THIS WRONG?
JOHN FOLINO SM #347, SULAJON

does anyone have an espar heater installed on their Super Maramu?
i am looking for pictures of the installation.
thanks
eric
sm 376 kimberlite