Date   

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Anchor and chain

Patrick McAneny
 

Bill, So you are saying DIN 766 refers to link length and lofran is saying it means proof coil, do you suppose it may mean both. The odd thing is that the gypsy is stamped 3/8 , yet I have 5/16 chain, however if the links are the same length ,than I guess 5/16 would work on a 3/8 gypsy, correct? So if I want to upgrade to ht 3/8 , I just need to get the right link length din766. I wonder if 3/8 HT comes in two different links. I would think the longer links would be preferable . How about swivels between chain and anchor, what do you use. I hardly trust the S.S. ones that depend on a pin screwed in with lock tight to ensure it to stay in.  Thanks , Pat


-----Original Message-----
From: yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners]
To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Fri, Sep 26, 2014 1:39 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Anchor and chain

 
Pat,

Whoever you spoke to at Lofrans is wrong, very wrong.  Did you download the Anchor Chain, Galvanized dimensions and calibration.pdf.

Please read it and you will see that 10mm chain is made from 10mm (3/8") stock which is manufactured in what most people refer to as two different "pitches" (pitch is referring to the dimension of the link, not the stock). The DIN766 has links that are 2 mm different than the ISO4565 standard. DIN766 is 28mm long and ISO4565 is 30mm long. These chains will NOT work properly in the same Gypsy...different Gypsies are required for each.

I have found that most people do not get their heads around the difference between ISO4565 and DIN766, m ostly because there is not a common and accepted way to explain the difference...let me try...

ISO4565 and DIN766 each are made with 10mm stock. The difference is that the size of the links are different. Now to really confuse you, if you compare any other size stock, like 8mm, or 12mm, the links are identical sizes with ISO4565 and DIN766.

Your 10mm chain needs a different Gypsy for ISO than DIN...but only if 10mm (3/8").

I really hope this solves your issue and helps you get what you need.

Bill
BeBe 387



Re: Anchor and chain

Ian Park
 

My Santorin had 8mm chain and gypsy when I bought it. I changed both for 100m of 10mm and matching gypsy. I brought my Spade anchor from my last boat, but the shank bent slightly in use (the shank on the Spade is hollow). I have contacted Spade twice about this, including photos and have had no response at all. In Las Palmas, Gran Canaria, I bought a new Rocna 25, €495, and have been absolutely delighted with it. It does not fit on the bow of the Santorin as well as the Spade, it needs assistance in orientation itself and jams well in the bow roller. But I will need to modify the fibreglass housing with a s/s bracket to prevent wear and damage.
The 8mm set up with the Spade did hold well in a 36hour f9 in Sardinia last year, but there was no significant fetch. I just felt that 10mm was better suited to the weight of the boat.

Ian

SN Ocean Hobo


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Maramu Halyard leads

amel46met
 

Hi Andrew
I put main and jib inside with a stopper on the jib , to be able to use the winchs  for spin., staysail and pole topping lifts.
Also added ridged vang, self tailing main halyard winch, self tailing reefing winch. jack lines for main sail,and permanent preventers on main boom. Aphrodite is a 1983 Maramu from Santa Cruz, Ca. USA. now in Fiji. I have lived aboard for 14 years with lots of blue water miles. What ever you do you will love your AMEL .
Tom Deasy   S/V Aphrodite



To: amelyachtowners@...
From: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2014 11:44:31 +0000
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Maramu Halyard leads

 

Thank you, yes all cables are being replaced and the wire halyard is being replaced with Dyneema - which means we also have to replace the original winch - all the best andy


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] A couple questions seasickness and remedies

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Drew,

Too bad...In my "clinical trial" the performance of Scopace was very good. A person could could get relief from nausea by taking one tablet even after initial symptoms of nausea had begun.

Of course, all of my subjects had the benefit of a placebo effect which was enhanced because I told them it worked 100% of the time. Several years ago I met two Canadian women. One was a compounding pharmacist, and her partner a MD. The MD suffered from sea sickness. I gave them several tablets. They emailed me and told me how great it was. They also said that they could not get it in Canada, but were going to try other places. I did not hear back. 

That is an interesting story about NASA, because I think it was a Baylor MD, who part-timed at NASA, that first prescribed Scopace for Judy. It worked for Judy better than the scopolamine patch. Interestingly, Judy once had a side effect with the patch, which was inability to focus and dilated eyes. She mentioned this to the Baylor MD and she prescribed the Scopase tablet. After several years, Judy's body has come accustomed to motion and she does not need medication, even with dramatic motion.

How is our friend Jessie James?

Bill
BeBe 387

On Sat, Sep 27, 2014 at 4:01 AM, drew.gaffney@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Bill,
Scopace tablets (hyoscamime 0.4mg) are no longer available in the US.  The pills were manufactured in the US only and I am not aware of any other source.  The injectable form is sold in the UK, but not pills, as far as I can tell.  
The scopolamine patch is available.  When NASA tested it in normal subjects during KC-135 0-g flights, they found almost 10-fold variations in plasma levels of the active drug.  It works well as an anti-nausea medicine for many people, but causes a number of side-effects; inability to focus, inability to initiate unination, and hallucinations.  There is at least a theoretical argument that it interferes with adaptation and actually prolongs motion sickness symptoms.
At one point, NASA used it in combination with dextroamphetamine, due to the former's causing drowsiness and the latter's improving alertness.  In general, "ScopDex" as it was called, has been supplan ted by promethazine (Pherergan), an old, but more potent anti-nausea drug.  It does cause significant drowsiness, but works very well.  
Odansetron (Zofran) is another widely used anti-nausea medication.  It, like promethazine, requires a prescription, but is available generically at very low cost.
Stugeron is widely used outside the US, but not available here, nor in a number of European countries. It is used by many cruisers with benefit, but published clinical data are minimal.

Drew
SY Revelation SM#390
Chaguaramas, Trinidad



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] A couple questions

drew.gaffney@...
 

Bill,
Scopace tablets (hyoscamime 0.4mg) are no longer available in the US.  The pills were manufactured in the US only and I am not aware of any other source.  The injectable form is sold in the UK, but not pills, as far as I can tell.  
The scopolamine patch is available.  When NASA tested it in normal subjects during KC-135 0-g flights, they found almost 10-fold variations in plasma levels of the active drug.  It works well as an anti-nausea medicine for many people, but causes a number of side-effects; inability to focus, inability to initiate unination, and hallucinations.  There is at least a theoretical argument that it interferes with adaptation and actually prolongs motion sickness symptoms.
At one point, NASA used it in combination with dextroamphetamine, due to the former's causing drowsiness and the latter's improving alertness.  In general, "ScopDex" as it was called, has been supplanted by promethazine (Pherergan), an old, but more potent anti-nausea drug.  It does cause significant drowsiness, but works very well.  
Odansetron (Zofran) is another widely used anti-nausea medication.  It, like promethazine, requires a prescription, but is available generically at very low cost.
Stugeron is widely used outside the US, but not available here, nor in a number of European countries. It is used by many cruisers with benefit, but published clinical data are minimal.

Drew
SY Revelation SM#390
Chaguaramas, Trinidad


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Propshaft wearing ring

karkauai
 

Hi Drew,
On KRISTY, the first two times I changed the seals I put them in per the drawings from Amel...two keeping oil in and one keeping water out.  Both times I got water in the oil before it was time to repaint the bottom.  The last two times I oriented them with the forward one keeping oil in and the two aft ones keeping water out.  I haven't had water in the oil or lost oil since making the change.
Kent
SM243


On Sep 26, 2014, at 4:32 PM, drew.gaffney@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

The grooves on the WOB with steel sleeve on Kali Mera seem much deeper than I've seen.  I wonder there was a seal-size mismatch?

How many engine hours since the last seal change?
Was there enough seawater in the oil to have decreased its lubricity?
In South Africa, I had stainless steel WOB's made using new, Amel-supplied bronze WOB's as a "pattern"..  The machinist commented that these bronze WOB's  were considerably "out of round".  
The cost of the new S/S WOB's was less than 1/3rd the price of the bronze WOB's.
I would be curious to know whether owners are putting 2 of 3 seals inward to keep the oil in (per Amel) or outward to keep sea water out?

Drew and Lili
SY Revelation SM#390
Chaguaramas, Trinidad


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Propshaft wearing ring

Eric Freedman
 

Hi do you have a link ?

I could not fiend it.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite SM 376

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 1:34 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Propshaft wearing ring

 

 

I was able to find the LRT 455030 in stock at Capital Area Technology, an Austin TX based company with an on-line store.  They show the part for USD 10.00, which compared to buying a new wearing-out sleeve from Amel is the bargain of the year (or, perhaps, the bargain of the haul out).  

 

Stephan

S/V Hanalei (nee Delos), an SMM2K


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Anchor and chain

svsunnyside
 

Hi all,
if the confusion of 10mm size was insufficient the GRADE 40 TABLE of pdf. seams to contain a misprinting.
The loads of 10mm DIN 766 should be SWL :15.5 kN (1.55tons) , UTS : 62 kN (6.2tons) .
Luckily dimensions are correct .
Gabriele
S/V Sunny Side



On Friday, 26 September 2014, 13:09, "yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners]" wrote:


 
Pat,

Whoever you spoke to at Lofrans is wrong, very wrong.  Did you download the Anchor Chain, Galvanized dimensions and calibration.pdf.

Please read it and you will see that 10mm chain is made from 10mm (3/8") stock which is manufactured in what most people refer to as two different "pitches" (pitch is referring to the dimension of the link, not the stock). The DIN766 has links that are 2 mm different than the ISO4565 standard. DIN766 is 28mm long and ISO4565 is 30mm long. These chains will NOT work properly in the same Gypsy...different Gypsies are required for each.

I have found that most people do not get their heads around the difference between ISO4565 and DIN766, mostly because there is not a common and accepted way to explain the difference...let me try...

ISO4565 and DIN766 each are made with 10mm stock. The difference is that the size of the links are different. Now to really confuse you, if you compare any other size stock, like 8mm, or 12mm, the links are identical sizes with ISO4565 and DIN766.

Your 10mm chain needs a different Gypsy for ISO than DIN...but only if 10mm (3/8").

I really hope this solves your issue and helps you get what you need.

Bill
BeBe 387





Re: Propshaft wearing ring

drew.gaffney@...
 

The grooves on the WOB with steel sleeve on Kali Mera seem much deeper than I've seen.  I wonder there was a seal-size mismatch?
How many engine hours since the last seal change?
Was there enough seawater in the oil to have decreased its lubricity?
In South Africa, I had stainless steel WOB's made using new, Amel-supplied bronze WOB's as a "pattern"..  The machinist commented that these bronze WOB's  were considerably "out of round".  
The cost of the new S/S WOB's was less than 1/3rd the price of the bronze WOB's.
I would be curious to know whether owners are putting 2 of 3 seals inward to keep the oil in (per Amel) or outward to keep sea water out?

Drew and Lili
SY Revelation SM#390
Chaguaramas, Trinidad


Re: Propshaft wearing ring

Craig Briggs
 

Hi Derick,
To add to Bill's reply, no, the WOB does not stay static relative to the seals.  The seals are fixed in the outer housing and the WOB, which is fixed to the shaft, turns with the shaft, keeping contact with the seals.  The WOB wears out as the seals make a groove in it's outer surface.  The pictures that Herb posted of Kali Mera's WOB show the grooves amazingly well.  

Herb - per the engineer from SKF I reported on in an earlier post, 316 Stainless is not hard enough - he recommended harder types or adding Speedi-Seals, which you could do on either the Amel supplied bronze WOB or a fabricated SS version.  I wonder what type was used on your old WOB - that's one seriously grooved WOB.

Finally, Derick, you really can't tell by inspection that the WOB is worn out - that is, grooved, without removing it. The tell-tale "chocolate milk" oil in the reservoir is the signal that the WOB is, well, worn out.  

Cheers,
Craig - SN#68 - Sangaris


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Rust on keel

Germain Jean-Pierre <jgermain@...>
 

Hello Tadeja and Herbert,

I had such a problem on Eleuthera.  The fix is simple and relatively inexpensive.  Sandblast the keel area ensuring you get to real metal... no rust at all left.  Then epoxy prime, light sand and apply some epoxy paint X as many coats as you wish.

Cheers,


Jean-Pierre Germain
SY Eleuthera, SM 007


On 26 Sep 2014, at 18:57, herbert@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

dear group,

When we hauled out to change the shaft-seals I found out (after cleaning the bottom) that there are many small (and some bigger) rust-stains on the keel.

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/photos/albums/1059967243

I uploaded a foto "rust on keel" and circled the area. 

Has anyone experience how to handle this? Is it necessary to "sand-blast" the complete keel and put new epoxy on it? Any hints?

thank you


tadeja and herbert

KALI MERA, SN120, Kusadasi




Posted by: herbert@...
Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (1)


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: [Amel] rust on keel

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Herbert,

I used International 2-part epoxy paint/primer...about 3 or 4 coats. It is very important to do this in dry weather and to not leave the steel exposed longer than a few minutes...get the steel shiny, then paint it with epoxy.

I am sure there are other epoxy paints that will work.

Bill
BeBe

On Fri, Sep 26, 2014 at 6:27 PM, herbert@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Thanks Bill !

we will do this this winter, revewing everything, together with scraping down all the old antifouling.

Any recommendation for the material?

Tadeja and Herbert
KALI MERA, SN120



Re: [Amel] rust on keel

Herbert Lackner
 

Thanks Bill !

we will do this this winter, revewing everything, together with scraping down all the old antifouling.

Any recommendation for the material?

Tadeja and Herbert
KALI MERA, SN120


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Propshaft wearing ring

yahoogroups@...
 

Herbert,

Looking at that photo, I am thinking that the steel wear bushing has been in place for 2 or 3 sets of seals. A single seal will wear a single groove in the wear bushing...the old bushing you removed looks like that bushing has seen multiple seals.

I always, always change the bushing and the seals and I do it every two years when we renew anti fouling. I believe that 800 engine hours is the limit for the bushing and the seals. I have changed them at 400 hours because I was hauling the boat and had only put 400 hours on the bushing and the seals since the last haul out.


Bill
BeBe 387


Re: [Amel] rust on keel

yahoogroups@...
 

Herbert,

Read this written by Joel Potter:


It is not urgent that you do this, but if I were you, I would do it on your next scheduled haulout.

Bill
387




Prop shaft wear bushing alternatives and seals and sourcing alternatives

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

I know that some very experienced people have suggested changing the prop shaft wear bushings to stainless, or using a stainless sleeve, and/or some other method. There are probably 6 unproven theories on this issue. I think it all started because some of us believe that Amel overcharges for the wear bushing (and they probably do). Then, of course, the theories about changing the Amel-suggested orientation of the oil/water seals that fit on the wear bushing. Then, additionally, various other sources of the seals, and O rings in the place of springs...yada, yada, yada...I am getting a headache remembering all of this stuff.

For what it is worth, I think that Amel has much more experience with this than any one Amel owner, and certainly more than me. 

I am sorry if I disagree with some of you, who, by the way, I respect immensely...BUT, haulouts and C Drives are for too expensive for me to start diddling with the small stuff. I am sticking with Amel for these parts. I could not sleep at night if I started playing Russian Roulette.

 I hope I haven't ruffled too many feathers, but I just had to say this...I promise, I will not say it again.

Bill
BeBe 387

On Fri, Sep 26, 2014 at 5:51 PM, herbert@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 


This summer we had water in the drive-oil (milky) so we hauled and changed the sealings.  We found out that there was a steel wearing ring and not the brass ring from Amel.  When the seals have been changed last haul-out only the sealings have been changed, according to the "professional" there is nothing else to do. Now I learned that the wearing ring should be changed always when the seals are changed, it is an inexpensive item from Amel (compared to an extra haul-out)

I uploaded some fotos to show how the (steel) wearing ring looks at end of life...

Th wearing ring is fixed to the shaft and the outer surface is next to the three seals.

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/photos/albums/1059967243

fair winds,

tadeja and herbert,
KALI MERA, SN 120, Kusadasi



Rust on keel

Herbert Lackner
 

dear group,

When we hauled out to change the shaft-seals I found out (after cleaning the bottom) that there are many small (and some bigger) rust-stains on the keel.

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/photos/albums/1059967243

I uploaded a foto "rust on keel" and circled the area. 

Has anyone experience how to handle this? Is it necessary to "sand-blast" the complete keel and put new epoxy on it? Any hints?

thank you


tadeja and herbert

KALI MERA, SN120, Kusadasi



Amel lost because of broken anchor chain

yahoogroups@...
 

Pat requested more detail on the Amel lost in the Pacific because of a broken anchor chain.


The following was posted by Alan Leslie on the Amel Facebook page:

"Update on Amiable

SM Amiable was lost in Suvarov atoll.

In 40+ knots the anchor chain broke and they decided to go out of the atoll following the GPS track that brought them in. Unfortunately they were not able to counter the strong westerly current flowing across the pass and were swept on to the reef. The boat is total loss. The captain and crew survived without injury."

 

Bill 

BeBe 387


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Propshaft wearing ring

Herbert Lackner
 


This summer we had water in the drive-oil (milky) so we hauled and changed the sealings.  We found out that there was a steel wearing ring and not the brass ring from Amel.  When the seals have been changed last haul-out only the sealings have been changed, according to the "professional" there is nothing else to do. Now I learned that the wearing ring should be changed always when the seals are changed, it is an inexpensive item from Amel (compared to an extra haul-out)

I uploaded some fotos to show how the (steel) wearing ring looks at end of life...

Th wearing ring is fixed to the shaft and the outer surface is next to the three seals.

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/photos/albums/1059967243

fair winds,

tadeja and herbert,
KALI MERA, SN 120, Kusadasi


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Transmission oil cooler

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Eric,

That is really cool, but could you give us a little more detail as to where you bought it...who the USA distributor is, etc.?

Bill
BeBe 387

On Fri, Sep 26, 2014 at 6:35 AM, kimberlite@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

I was worried about the tranny oil cooler wearing out and perforating .
I did some research and Amel wanted $600 to replace it Mack boring wanted about the same. I found the USA distributor for the DC60 model transmission oil cooler it cost me $137- in the USA.
Eric
Sm 376 Kimberlite
 
 

----- Original Message -----
From: "'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners]"
Date: Friday, September 26, 2014 12:33 am
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Fwd: Onan Training Option
To: "amelyachtowners@..."

> Derick,
>
> There are some photos of the transmission cooler and the
> trash/barnaclepieces I removed from it posted here:
>
> https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/photos/albums/1228643648
>
> There is a rubber boot on each side of the cooler. With the sea
> cock closed
> and the sea chest empty (if possible use a wet vac to empty it)
> open the
> sea chest side of the cooler by loosening the clamp on the
> larger end of
> the boot. You will want to have your wet vac ready to suck the
> remainingwater when you pull the boot off of the cooler. The wet
> vac is the best
> thing I have found to clean the cooler and the boot area...just
> suck all of
> the trash out. There is no need to do the aft side of the cooler.
>
> There are pieces of trash that can get past the strainer, but
> are stopped
> by the small pipes in the cooler. This will happen to you in the
> tropicswhen small mussels and barnacles like to breed in the sea
> chest. If you are
> at a marina and running A/C weekly inspection of the sea chest
> is very
> important...maybe 2 times a week.
>
> The Mack Boring Diesel class I attended did not cover
> transmissions or its
> cooler. They had 5 different models of engines for the class. I
> was lucky
> that there was one 100hp turbo for the class and I was the only
> one out of
> 20 that had that engine. There were 4 or 5 guys working on each
> of the
> other engines. I do not think they got as much out of the class
> as I did.
>
> Bill
> BeBe 387
>
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 25, 2014 at 10:07 PM, derickgates@...
> [amelyachtowners] wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Kent,
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks for researching this. I would prefer meeting during
> the summer,
> > when Brava will be on the hard in the Caribbean for hurricane
> season,> rather than during the winter/spring, when I would
> rather be sailing!
> > However, I will be flexible as the group decides.
> >
> >
> >
> > My email address is: derickgates "at" comcast "dot" net
> >
> >
> >
> > Brava has a 100 HP Yanmar Model 4JH3-HTE with ~3700 hours on it.
> >
> >
> >
> > I recen tly had the salt water cooling pump replaced because it
> was leaking
> > water from the seal. As you know, this is on the inaccessible
> side of the
> > engine, and I would love to see better what I did, as well as
> how to
> > efficiently replace the associated impeller.
> >
> >
> > I would also like to see how to dismantle the seawater cooling
> for the
> > transmission oil cooling.
> >
> >
> >
> > Add to that everything to do with the replacement of the oil
> filte r (on
> > the engine), changing the oil, and trouble shooting all
> electrical systems
> > on the engine (shut-off and starter solenoids, alternators, etc.)
> >
> >
> >
> > Derick
> >
> >
> >
> > SM2K #400 Brava
> >
> >
> >
>