Date   

Re: coupling bolts

seafeverofcuan@...
 

Dear Dave,
               Your engine is mounted on an angle iron frame to allow the engine to slide forward using the mizzen halyard to take some, but not all of the weight. From memory you do not need to disconnect hoses or wiring and the engine will slide about four inches to allow you to slip the bolts and split the Vetus coupler. It is very very simple and easy to do.
If you have sheared a bolt I would think it is time to replace all four bolts and the  new rubber bushes that are inside the coupler which are also Vetus parts.
I hope this is of some help.
Regards,
Trevor Lusty

Seafever of Cuan - For sale
SM 425
Mazatlan Mexico 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] coupling bolts

Paul LaFrance <pflafrance@...>
 

Dave
The engine has to be moved back from the transmission. Undo engine mounts and hoist with mizzen halyard . The cockpit cover lifters will have to be removed to allow the cover to open all the way. The flex coupling then can be removed. It is held in place by a shaft key. This may take some effort as it may be frozen on the shaft. Penetrating oil and a steel wedge will help loosen the flex coupling. Once off then a new bolt can be used. I believe the bolts are hardened steel (Black).
Paul & Susan LaFrance
SV NOMAD#362
Currently in the BVI


To: amelyachtowners@...
From: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2014 06:02:47 -0800
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] coupling bolts

 

I have a 1998 Amel 53 Supermaramu and discovered that one of the 4 coupling bolts that attach the engine outdrive to the transmission has broken off.  I believe this was probably caused by engine/transmission malalignment, but not sure.  Meantime, I tried to see if there was an easy way to install a new bolt, but do not see a way to do so.  Any assistance would be appreciated.


coupling bolts

drdavegoodman
 

I have a 1998 Amel 53 Supermaramu and discovered that one of the 4 coupling bolts that attach the engine outdrive to the transmission has broken off.  I believe this was probably caused by engine/transmission malalignment, but not sure.  Meantime, I tried to see if there was an easy way to install a new bolt, but do not see a way to do so.  Any assistance would be appreciated.


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] SM Bilge Pump indicator light

Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Good morning Ian,

I have not, but I suspect the previous owner did.

I added a few pictures at the end of:
http://nikimat.com/diruptor_24_volt_panel.html

I added some note:
Bilge pump ON/OFF Switch (in red in the middle)
Blue and purple electric wires going to the light of the bilge pump (I put a yellow arrow)

Then I posted 3 pictures of the light "Gas/Stove" (propane or butane depending of your countries).
On my boat I know this is the correct light since I replaced it. And it is a bayonet.

Then I put 2 pictures with a "not sure" if this is for the Bilge pump light (these lights were on the boat when I purchased it).
I don't know how you call these.

Wish I could help more, sincerely, Alexandre
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT
Temporary in Fort Lauderdale, Florida, USA for repair & maintenance


--------------------------------------------

On Mon, 12/29/14, Ian Shepherd sv_freespirit@yahoo.co.uk [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] SM Bilge Pump indicator light
To: "amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Monday, December 29, 2014, 7:25 AM


 









Has anyone replaced the bilge pump operating light
on the SM 24V panel?

It looks a little tricky to get out. Does the bulb come out
of it's

holder by twisting or bayonet action, or is it a hard wired
pea bulb?

Any info might save unnecessary trouble before removing the
circuit

breakers nearby to gain access to the back of the lamp. An
LED

replacement would be for the better I think if the whole
lamp unit needs

to be replaced.



Happy New Year to all.



Ian Shepherd SM 2K 414 Crusader (2003) Cyprus


















Posted by: Ian Shepherd
<sv_freespirit@yahoo.co.uk>


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Monel is not stainless steel

karkauai
 

Thanks, Joel,
It sounds to me like either Monel or aluminum would be fine.
Kent



From: "'Joel Potter' jfpottercys@... [amelyachtowners]"
To: amelyachtowners@...
Sent: Monday, December 29, 2014 4:11 PM
Subject: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Monel is not stainless steel

 
I always learn something important from my friend Olivier who has forgotten more about Amel’s than just about anyone else will ever know. I do remember that Herve Bodiger, who was Amel’s service manager in Guadaloupe for many years, gave me a box of genuine monel pop rivets with instruction to use only these rivets as replacements. He also gave me a huge scissors/accordion type rivet puller which I still have. The rivets are long gone as this was during the mid to late 1980’s. My years are showing!

I remember subsequent conversations with Jacques Carteau about these rivets and he said their use was not only for strength but also for monel’s exceptional resistance to salt water corrosion. Although there are several formulations of monel, it is considered a ‘premium’ metal in the marine industry. I have sold boats with monel tanks and straps and keel bolts that are over 50 years old and the monel was the only material on board that still looked like the day it was made. Great stuff.

Happy New Year.

Joel

Joel F. Potter/Cruising Yacht Specialist LLC

THE AMEL GUY

954 462 5869

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Monday, December 29, 2014 12:49 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Monel is not stainless steel

Good evening,

Concerning Monel rivets, I don't think AMEL ever used Monel or stainless steel rivets for the manual drive pulley/foil connection:

-This would have caused galvanic corrosion to the painted cast aluminum pulley (Monel is almost as bad as stainless steel towards aluminum in a salted environment).

-These materials are tough to drill. When some of you have tried to separate the genoa furler from the foil (trying to separate the furler from the aluminum pulley), this has probably been impossible The only solution then was to drill the rivets and separate the foil from the pulley, then bring the furler with seized pulley to a workshop to hydraulic press the pulley out of the stainless steel hub/shaft.

-In any mechanical system/device there must be a "weak" part, in case of over use or wrong use. The aluminum rivets are the weak part of the system, as there was no electronic device to prevent any over use (like in the BAMAR systems on the 54 or RECKMANN systems on the 55/64). Monel or stainless steel rivets not shearing/breaking would cause early wear of the bronze gear inside the gearbox.

If you need to replace these rivets, just use aluminum rivets. The original diameter is 6 mm, the can be increased to 6.4mm. Length from 18 to 22mm max.

Fill the holes with silicone filler before installing the rivets (the reason is to prevent salt water to reach the steel core pin that would get rusty otherwise).

The only possibility I see for Monel or stainless steel rivets is that the first furlers (there has been several prototypes for Maramus) had a stainless steel hub that connected the (2-groove) foil with an aluminum drive pulley.

Olivier BEAUTE.

On Monday, December 29, 2014 1:35 AM, "Kent Robertson karkauai@... [amelyachtowners]" wrote:

Good idea Gary.

Jib Furler Foil

*Jib Furler Gearbox

*Jib Sailhead Swivel

*Jib Sailhead Whiskers works for me

*Manual Jib Furler

Kent

SM243

Kristy



On Dec 27, 2014, at 11:31 PM, amelliahona <no_reply@... > wrote:

Hi Eric:

Great information on Monel. I had always thought Monel was a type of stainless steel but you are completely correct, it is not (according to wikipedia). Thanks for that contribution. I would guess that Monel would provide medium strength in shear between that of steel and that of aluminum but will have do some more looking. Since there were posts about aluminum rivets failing under normal loads I am going to try and locate the 1/4th inch diameter (6.4 mm) x 19 mm Monel rivets suggested. Also, as I researched this issue on this forum there was a post by Joel Potter stating that Amel used Monel rivets on the foil junction with the grooved manual furling ring (we really need to give a uniform part name to this part of the rig because it has been called so many things on this forum that I don't know what to call it). Nominations for part names for the jib furling apparatus are now open.

I nominate:

1. Foil Extrusion - for the aluminum extrusion with the three grooves for the jib, ballooner, and un-latching mouse.

2. Jib Furling Gear Box is my nomination for the item that attaches to the Jib Furling Motor (Housing).

3. Jib Sail-Head Swivel is my nomination for the rotating assembly that the jib halyard attaches to. We need an official name for the "wiskers" that extend from this device. Suggestions?

What shall we call the grooved manual furling item into which the Foil Extrusion is seated?

Also we need a name for the engaging pin that locks the "manual jib furling casting" to the furling gearbox.

At the top of the Foil Extrusion there is a plastic or other plastic like material cap that is riveted to the foil extrusion. The forestay penetrates this cap and it provides a bushing like effect for the the Foil Extrusion at the masthead.

We probably need a name for the item that supports the jib furling motor-gearbox----- assembly.

Please chime in everyone with suggestions.

Gary Silver

s/v Liahona

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




Re: Left Hand or Right Hand Thread Standing Rigging Turnbuckles

Beaute Olivier
 

Good evening José,

the AMEL 54 standing riggings (from ACMO) all have right hand turnbuckles.

Olivier BEAUTE


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Monel is not stainless steel

amelforme
 

I always learn something important from my friend Olivier who has forgotten more about Amel’s than just about anyone else will ever know. I do remember that Herve Bodiger, who was Amel’s service manager in Guadaloupe for many years, gave me a box of genuine monel pop rivets with instruction to use only these rivets as replacements. He also gave me a huge scissors/accordion type rivet puller which I still have. The rivets are long gone as this was during the mid to late 1980’s. My years are showing!



I remember subsequent conversations with Jacques Carteau about these rivets and he said their use was not only for strength but also for monel’s exceptional resistance to salt water corrosion. Although there are several formulations of monel, it is considered a ‘premium’ metal in the marine industry. I have sold boats with monel tanks and straps and keel bolts that are over 50 years old and the monel was the only material on board that still looked like the day it was made. Great stuff.



Happy New Year.



Joel





Joel F. Potter/Cruising Yacht Specialist LLC

THE AMEL GUY

954 462 5869





From: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com [mailto:amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Monday, December 29, 2014 12:49 PM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Monel is not stainless steel





Good evening,



Concerning Monel rivets, I don't think AMEL ever used Monel or stainless steel rivets for the manual drive pulley/foil connection:

-This would have caused galvanic corrosion to the painted cast aluminum pulley (Monel is almost as bad as stainless steel towards aluminum in a salted environment).

-These materials are tough to drill. When some of you have tried to separate the genoa furler from the foil (trying to separate the furler from the aluminum pulley), this has probably been impossible The only solution then was to drill the rivets and separate the foil from the pulley, then bring the furler with seized pulley to a workshop to hydraulic press the pulley out of the stainless steel hub/shaft.

-In any mechanical system/device there must be a "weak" part, in case of over use or wrong use. The aluminum rivets are the weak part of the system, as there was no electronic device to prevent any over use (like in the BAMAR systems on the 54 or RECKMANN systems on the 55/64). Monel or stainless steel rivets not shearing/breaking would cause early wear of the bronze gear inside the gearbox.



If you need to replace these rivets, just use aluminum rivets. The original diameter is 6 mm, the can be increased to 6.4mm. Length from 18 to 22mm max.

Fill the holes with silicone filler before installing the rivets (the reason is to prevent salt water to reach the steel core pin that would get rusty otherwise).


The only possibility I see for Monel or stainless steel rivets is that the first furlers (there has been several prototypes for Maramus) had a stainless steel hub that connected the (2-groove) foil with an aluminum drive pulley.



Olivier BEAUTE.



On Monday, December 29, 2014 1:35 AM, "Kent Robertson karkauai@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:





Good idea Gary.

Jib Furler Foil

*Jib Furler Gearbox

*Jib Sailhead Swivel

*Jib Sailhead Whiskers works for me

*Manual Jib Furler



Kent

SM243

Kristy
On Dec 27, 2014, at 11:31 PM, amelliahona <no_reply@yahoogroups.com <mailto:no_reply@yahoogroups.com> > wrote:



Hi Eric:



Great information on Monel. I had always thought Monel was a type of stainless steel but you are completely correct, it is not (according to wikipedia). Thanks for that contribution. I would guess that Monel would provide medium strength in shear between that of steel and that of aluminum but will have do some more looking. Since there were posts about aluminum rivets failing under normal loads I am going to try and locate the 1/4th inch diameter (6.4 mm) x 19 mm Monel rivets suggested. Also, as I researched this issue on this forum there was a post by Joel Potter stating that Amel used Monel rivets on the foil junction with the grooved manual furling ring (we really need to give a uniform part name to this part of the rig because it has been called so many things on this forum that I don't know what to call it). Nominations for part names for the jib furling apparatus are now open.



I nominate:



1. Foil Extrusion - for the aluminum extrusion with the three grooves for the jib, ballooner, and un-latching mouse.



2. Jib Furling Gear Box is my nomination for the item that attaches to the Jib Furling Motor (Housing).





3. Jib Sail-Head Swivel is my nomination for the rotating assembly that the jib halyard attaches to. We need an official name for the "wiskers" that extend from this device. Suggestions?



What shall we call the grooved manual furling item into which the Foil Extrusion is seated?



Also we need a name for the engaging pin that locks the "manual jib furling casting" to the furling gearbox.



At the top of the Foil Extrusion there is a plastic or other plastic like material cap that is riveted to the foil extrusion. The forestay penetrates this cap and it provides a bushing like effect for the the Foil Extrusion at the masthead.





We probably need a name for the item that supports the jib furling motor-gearbox----- assembly.





Please chime in everyone with suggestions.





Gary Silver

s/v Liahona


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Monel is not stainless steel

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi all,
thanks Beaute for the good advice regarding the need for a "low cost repair weak point". Advice well worth following. However your comments regarding corrosion around monel is at variance with my experience. I have used monel rivets on all my boats for more years than I would like to count. The advantages being two fold, sheer strength and the fact that the materiel is to all practical purposes inert, ie does not react with other metals. It is has been a safe but expensive option for keel bolts because it is inert. For example 316 stainless can become weak and porous in a very short time in some keel situations with resulting loss of keel. Monel s very expensive so an alternate stainless known as (if I remember correctly) avistar is an alternative. I don't recall the number. I had a keel replaced on a previous boat. the repairer used 316 and the insurer forced a replacement with avistar.
For what it is worth.
Danny
SM 299 Ocean Pearl
--------------------------------------------

On Tue, 30/12/14, Beaute Olivier atlanticyachtsurvey@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Monel is not stainless steel
To: "amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Received: Tuesday, 30 December, 2014, 5:48 AM


 









Good
evening,
Concerning
Monel rivets, I don't think AMEL ever used Monel or
stainless steel rivets for the manual drive pulley/foil
connection:-This
would have caused galvanic corrosion to the painted cast
aluminum pulley (Monel is almost as bad as stainless steel
towards aluminum in a salted environment).-These
materials are tough to drill. When some of you have tried to
separate the genoa furler from the foil (trying to separate
the furler from the aluminum pulley), this has probably been
impossible The only solution then was to drill the rivets
and separate the foil from the pulley, then bring the furler
with seized pulley to a workshop to hydraulic press the
pulley out of the stainless steel
hub/shaft.-In any
mechanical system/device there must be a "weak"
part, in case of over use or wrong use. The aluminum rivets
are the weak part of the system, as there was no electronic
device to prevent any over use (like in the BAMAR systems on
the 54 or RECKMANN systems on the 55/64). Monel or stainless
steel rivets not shearing/breaking would cause early wear
of the bronze gear inside the gearbox.
If you
need to replace these rivets, just use aluminum rivets. The
original diameter is 6 mm, the can be increased to 6.4mm.
Length from 18 to 22mm max.Fill the
holes with silicone filler before installing the rivets (the
reason is to prevent salt water to reach the steel core pin
that would get rusty otherwise).
The only possibility I see for Monel
or stainless steel rivets is that the first furlers (there
has been several prototypes for Maramus) had a stainless
steel hub that connected the (2-groove) foil with an
aluminum drive pulley.
Olivier BEAUTE.


On Monday, December 29, 2014 1:35 AM,
"Kent Robertson karkauai@yahoo.com
[amelyachtowners]"
<amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



 









Good idea Gary.Jib Furler
Foil*Jib Furler Gearbox*Jib Sailhead
Swivel*Jib Sailhead Whiskers works for
me*Manual Jib Furler
KentSM243Kristy
On Dec 27,
2014, at 11:31 PM, amelliahona <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:
















 






Hi Eric:  
Great information on Monel.  I had
always thought Monel was a type of stainless steel but you
are completely correct, it is not (according to wikipedia).
 Thanks for that contribution.  I would guess that Monel
would provide medium strength in shear between that of steel
and that of aluminum but will have do some more looking.
 Since there were posts about aluminum rivets failing under
normal loads I am going to try and locate the 1/4th inch
diameter (6.4 mm) x 19 mm Monel rivets suggested.  Also,
as I researched this
issue on this forum there was a post by Joel Potter stating
that Amel used Monel rivets on the foil junction with the
grooved manual furling ring (we really need to give a
uniform part name to this part of the rig because it has
been called so many things on this forum that I don't
know what to call it).  Nominations for part names for the
jib furling apparatus are now open.
I nominate:
1.  Foil Extrusion - for the
aluminum extrusion with the three grooves for the jib,
ballooner, and un-latching mouse.
2.  Jib Furling Gear Box is my
nomination for the item that attaches to the Jib Furling
Motor (Housing).
3.  Jib Sail-Head Swivel is my
nomination for the rotating assembly that the jib halyard
attaches to.  We need an official name for the
"wiskers" that extend from this device.
 Suggestions?
What shall we call the grooved
manual furling item into which the Foil Extrusion is seated?
 
Also we need a name
for the engaging pin that locks the "manual jib furling
casting" to the furling gearbox.  At the top of the Foil
Extrusion there is a plastic or other plastic like material
cap that is riveted to the foil extrusion.  The forestay
penetrates this cap and it provides a bushing like effect
for the the Foil Extrusion at the masthead.

We probably need a name for the
item that supports the jib furling motor-gearbox-----
assembly. 

Please chime in everyone with
suggestions.
Gary
Silvers/v
Liahona




































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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Amel Shroud Covers

Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

I share stacey and michelle opinions.

These cover will help saving running rigging at the expense of the standing rigging (which is much more expensive to replace).

Sincerely, Alexandre
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT
In repair, Dania Beach, Florida.



--------------------------------------------

On Mon, 12/29/14, staceyatsea@yahoo.co.uk [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Amel Shroud Covers
To: "amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Monday, December 29, 2014, 1:56 PM


 









in my
experience covers are a no go. They tend to hold salt and
water and rust faster then if not covered. my 2 cents
 cheers
stacey and michelle

On Tuesday, 30
December 2014, 6:38, "dave_benjamin@yahoo.com
[amelyachtowners]"
<amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



 









Ian,
Many
riggers recommend against the use of tightly fitting covers
over standing rigging. I agree with them. What I use on the
lower sections to prevent sheets from chafing is some PVC
pipe from the hardware store. If you don't wish to
remove any fittings, you can slit the PVC with a saw and
then use some tie-wraps which can be covered with vinyl
tape. 





















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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Monel is not stainless steel

karkauai
 

Merci beaucoup once again, Olivier!  This is valuable information for all Amel owners.
I had already decided to use aluminum rivets, but was going to forego the silicone.  I was cussing whomever put in in the last time because it was such a pain to get out of the foil.
Bonnie Annee!!
Kent
SM243
Kristy


On Dec 29, 2014, at 1:00 PM, Richard03801 richard03801@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Thank you. The Alum drills out easy and not to for get there are a number of rivets as some one pointed out each in shear will yield at around 250 US pounds so four would be a 1,000. That's a lot of force to apply better shear a rivet than a gear tooth. 

Fair Winds Smooth Sailing To All
Capt Richard 
RP Yacht Brokerage
Newport RI 
We list sell and service fine yachts including Amel's
Cell 603 767 5330

On Dec 29, 2014, at 12:48, Beaute Olivier atlanticyachtsurvey@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Good evening,

Concerning Monel rivets, I don't think AMEL ever used Monel or stainless steel rivets for the manual drive pulley/foil connection:
-This would have caused galvanic corrosion to the painted cast aluminum pulley (Monel is almost as bad as stainless steel towards aluminum in a salted environment).
-These materials are tough to drill. When some of you have tried to separate the genoa furler from the foil (trying to separate the furler from the aluminum pulley), this has probably been impossible The only solution then was to drill the rivets and separate the foil from the pulley, then bring the furler with seized pulley to a workshop to hydraulic press the pulley out of the stainless steel hub/shaft.
-In any mechanical system/device there must be a "weak" part, in case of over use or wrong use. The aluminum rivets are the weak part of the system, as there was no electronic device to prevent any over use (like in the BAMAR systems on the 54 or RECKMANN systems on the 55/64). Monel or stainless steel rivets not shearing/breaking would cause early wear of the bronze gear inside the gearbox.

If you need to replace these rivets, just use aluminum rivets. The original diameter is 6 mm, the can be increased to 6.4mm. Length from 18 to 22mm max.
Fill the holes with silicone filler before installing the rivets (the reason is to prevent salt water to reach the steel core pin that would get rusty otherwise).

The only possibility I see for Monel or stainless steel rivets is that the first furlers (there has been several prototypes for Maramus) had a stainless steel hub that connected the (2-groove) foil with an aluminum drive pulley.

Olivier BEAUTE.


On Monday, December 29, 2014 1:35 AM, "Kent Robertson karkauai@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


 
Good idea Gary.
Jib Furler Foil
*Jib Furler Gearbox
*Jib Sailhead Swivel
*Jib Sailhead Whiskers works for me
*Manual Jib Furler

Kent
SM243
Kristy




On Dec 27, 2014, at 11:31 PM, amelliahona <no_reply@...> wrote:

 
Hi Eric:  

Great information on Monel.  I had always thought Monel was a type of stainless steel but you are completely correct, it is not (according to wikipedia).  Thanks for that contribution.  I would guess that Monel would provide medium strength in shear between that of steel and that of aluminum but will have do some more looking.  Since there were posts about aluminum rivets failing under normal loads I am going to try and locate the 1/4th inch diameter (6.4 mm) x 19 mm Monel rivets suggested.  Also, as I researched this issue on this forum there was a post by Joel Potter stating that Amel used Monel rivets on the foil junction with the grooved manual furling ring (we really need to give a uniform part name to this part of the rig because it has been called so many things on this forum that I don't know what to call it).  Nominations for part names for the jib furling apparatus are now open.

I nominate:

1.  Foil Extrusion - for the aluminum extrusion with the three grooves for the jib, ballooner, and un-latching mouse.

2.  Jib Furling Gear Box is my nomination for the item that attaches to the Jib Furling Motor (Housing).

3.  Jib Sail-Head Swivel is my nomination for the rotating assembly that the jib halyard attaches to.  We need an official name for the "wiskers" that extend from this device.  Suggestions?

What shall we call the grooved manual furling item into which the Foil Extrusion is seated?  

Also we need a name for the engaging pin that locks the "manual jib furling casting" to the furling gearbox. 
 
At the top of the Foil Extrusion there is a plastic or other plastic like material cap that is riveted to the foil extrusion.  The forestay penetrates this cap and it provides a bushing like effect for the the Foil Extrusion at the masthead.

We probably need a name for the item that supports the jib furling motor-gearbox----- assembly. 

Please chime in everyone with suggestions.

Gary Silver
s/v Liahona






Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Amel Shroud Covers

staceyatsea@...
 

in my experience covers are a no go. They tend to hold salt and water and rust faster then if not covered. my 2 cents
 
cheers stacey and michelle


On Tuesday, 30 December 2014, 6:38, "dave_benjamin@... [amelyachtowners]" wrote:


 
Ian,

Many riggers recommend against the use of tightly fitting covers over standing rigging. I agree with them. What I use on the lower sections to prevent sheets from chafing is some PVC pipe from the hardware store. If you don't wish to remove any fittings, you can slit the PVC with a saw and then use some tie-wraps which can be covered with vinyl tape. 



Re: Amel Shroud Covers

Dave_Benjamin
 

Ian,

Many riggers recommend against the use of tightly fitting covers over standing rigging. I agree with them. What I use on the lower sections to prevent sheets from chafing is some PVC pipe from the hardware store. If you don't wish to remove any fittings, you can slit the PVC with a saw and then use some tie-wraps which can be covered with vinyl tape. 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Monel is not stainless steel

Richard03801 <richard03801@...>
 

Thank you. The Alum drills out easy and not to for get there are a number of rivets as some one pointed out each in shear will yield at around 250 US pounds so four would be a 1,000. That's a lot of force to apply better shear a rivet than a gear tooth. 

Fair Winds Smooth Sailing To All
Capt Richard 
RP Yacht Brokerage
Newport RI 
We list sell and service fine yachts including Amel's
Cell 603 767 5330

On Dec 29, 2014, at 12:48, Beaute Olivier atlanticyachtsurvey@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Good evening,

Concerning Monel rivets, I don't think AMEL ever used Monel or stainless steel rivets for the manual drive pulley/foil connection:
-This would have caused galvanic corrosion to the painted cast aluminum pulley (Monel is almost as bad as stainless steel towards aluminum in a salted environment).
-These materials are tough to drill. When some of you have tried to separate the genoa furler from the foil (trying to separate the furler from the aluminum pulley), this has probably been impossible The only solution then was to drill the rivets and separate the foil from the pulley, then bring the furler with seized pulley to a workshop to hydraulic press the pulley out of the stainless steel hub/shaft.
-In any mechanical system/device there must be a "weak" part, in case of over use or wrong use. The aluminum rivets are the weak part of the system, as there was no electronic device to prevent any over use (like in the BAMAR systems on the 54 or RECKMANN systems on the 55/64). Monel or stainless steel rivets not shearing/breaking would cause early wear of the bronze gear inside the gearbox.

If you need to replace these rivets, just use aluminum rivets. The original diameter is 6 mm, the can be increased to 6.4mm. Length from 18 to 22mm max.
Fill the holes with silicone filler before installing the rivets (the reason is to prevent salt water to reach the steel core pin that would get rusty otherwise).

The only possibility I see for Monel or stainless steel rivets is that the first furlers (there has been several prototypes for Maramus) had a stainless steel hub that connected the (2-groove) foil with an aluminum drive pulley.

Olivier BEAUTE.


On Monday, December 29, 2014 1:35 AM, "Kent Robertson karkauai@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


 
Good idea Gary.
Jib Furler Foil
*Jib Furler Gearbox
*Jib Sailhead Swivel
*Jib Sailhead Whiskers works for me
*Manual Jib Furler

Kent
SM243
Kristy




On Dec 27, 2014, at 11:31 PM, amelliahona <no_reply@...> wrote:

 
Hi Eric:  

Great information on Monel.  I had always thought Monel was a type of stainless steel but you are completely correct, it is not (according to wikipedia).  Thanks for that contribution.  I would guess that Monel would provide medium strength in shear between that of steel and that of aluminum but will have do some more looking.  Since there were posts about aluminum rivets failing under normal loads I am going to try and locate the 1/4th inch diameter (6.4 mm) x 19 mm Monel rivets suggested.  Also, as I researched this issue on this forum there was a post by Joel Potter stating that Amel used Monel rivets on the foil junction with the grooved manual furling ring (we really need to give a uniform part name to this part of the rig because it has been called so many things on this forum that I don't know what to call it).  Nominations for part names for the jib furling apparatus are now open.

I nominate:

1.  Foil Extrusion - for the aluminum extrusion with the three grooves for the jib, ballooner, and un-latching mouse.

2.  Jib Furling Gear Box is my nomination for the item that attaches to the Jib Furling Motor (Housing).

3.  Jib Sail-Head Swivel is my nomination for the rotating assembly that the jib halyard attaches to.  We need an official name for the "wiskers" that extend from this device.  Suggestions?

What shall we call the grooved manual furling item into which the Foil Extrusion is seated?  

Also we need a name for the engaging pin that locks the "manual jib furling casting" to the furling gearbox. 
 
At the top of the Foil Extrusion there is a plastic or other plastic like material cap that is riveted to the foil extrusion.  The forestay penetrates this cap and it provides a bushing like effect for the the Foil Extrusion at the masthead.

We probably need a name for the item that supports the jib furling motor-gearbox----- assembly. 

Please chime in everyone with suggestions.

Gary Silver
s/v Liahona






Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Monel is not stainless steel

Beaute Olivier
 

Good evening,

Concerning Monel rivets, I don't think AMEL ever used Monel or stainless steel rivets for the manual drive pulley/foil connection:
-This would have caused galvanic corrosion to the painted cast aluminum pulley (Monel is almost as bad as stainless steel towards aluminum in a salted environment).
-These materials are tough to drill. When some of you have tried to separate the genoa furler from the foil (trying to separate the furler from the aluminum pulley), this has probably been impossible The only solution then was to drill the rivets and separate the foil from the pulley, then bring the furler with seized pulley to a workshop to hydraulic press the pulley out of the stainless steel hub/shaft.
-In any mechanical system/device there must be a "weak" part, in case of over use or wrong use. The aluminum rivets are the weak part of the system, as there was no electronic device to prevent any over use (like in the BAMAR systems on the 54 or RECKMANN systems on the 55/64). Monel or stainless steel rivets not shearing/breaking would cause early wear of the bronze gear inside the gearbox.

If you need to replace these rivets, just use aluminum rivets. The original diameter is 6 mm, the can be increased to 6.4mm. Length from 18 to 22mm max.
Fill the holes with silicone filler before installing the rivets (the reason is to prevent salt water to reach the steel core pin that would get rusty otherwise).

The only possibility I see for Monel or stainless steel rivets is that the first furlers (there has been several prototypes for Maramus) had a stainless steel hub that connected the (2-groove) foil with an aluminum drive pulley.

Olivier BEAUTE.


On Monday, December 29, 2014 1:35 AM, "Kent Robertson karkauai@... [amelyachtowners]" wrote:


 
Good idea Gary.
Jib Furler Foil
*Jib Furler Gearbox
*Jib Sailhead Swivel
*Jib Sailhead Whiskers works for me
*Manual Jib Furler

Kent
SM243
Kristy




On Dec 27, 2014, at 11:31 PM, amelliahona <no_reply@...> wrote:

 
Hi Eric:  

Great information on Monel.  I had always thought Monel was a type of stainless steel but you are completely correct, it is not (according to wikipedia).  Thanks for that contribution.  I would guess that Monel would provide medium strength in shear between that of steel and that of aluminum but will have do some more looking.  Since there were posts about aluminum rivets failing under normal loads I am going to try and locate the 1/4th inch diameter (6.4 mm) x 19 mm Monel rivets suggested.  Also, as I researched this issue on this forum there was a post by Joel Potter stating that Amel used Monel rivets on the foil junction with the grooved manual furling ring (we really need to give a uniform part name to this part of the rig because it has been called so many things on this forum that I don't know what to call it).  Nominations for part names for the jib furling apparatus are now open.

I nominate:

1.  Foil Extrusion - for the aluminum extrusion with the three grooves for the jib, ballooner, and un-latching mouse.

2.  Jib Furling Gear Box is my nomination for the item that attaches to the Jib Furling Motor (Housing).

3.  Jib Sail-Head Swivel is my nomination for the rotating assembly that the jib halyard attaches to.  We need an official name for the "wiskers" that extend from this device.  Suggestions?

What shall we call the grooved manual furling item into which the Foil Extrusion is seated?  

Also we need a name for the engaging pin that locks the "manual jib furling casting" to the furling gearbox. 
 
At the top of the Foil Extrusion there is a plastic or other plastic like material cap that is riveted to the foil extrusion.  The forestay penetrates this cap and it provides a bushing like effect for the the Foil Extrusion at the masthead.

We probably need a name for the item that supports the jib furling motor-gearbox----- assembly. 

Please chime in everyone with suggestions.

Gary Silver
s/v Liahona






Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel Shroud Covers

Richard03801 <richard03801@...>
 

Hi Mark when we removed ours the wire was full of salt and dirt. It took a while to gently flushed the stuff off with Joy dish soap and water.  Never! Will we cover them again.
Hey HAPPY HOLIDAYS TO ALL !!!!

Fair Winds Smooth Sailing To All
Capt Richard 
RP Yacht Brokerage
Newport RI 
We list sell and service fine yachts including Amel's
Cell 603 767 5330

On Dec 29, 2014, at 10:57, 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Not wishing to open a can of worms here but, I was recently at a workshop on rigging. I was told, one of the worst things to do on stainless steel rigging was to cover it (especially with plastic). This traps salt water in the porous stainless metal and accelerates corrosion.

With best regards,

Mark

Super Maramu 2000

Hull #275

www.creampuff.us

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Monday, December 29, 2014 8:37 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel Shroud Covers

I have found a source of split plastic shroud covers in the UK.
http://www.piplers.co.uk/chandlery/rope-and-rigging/wire-rigging/stainless-steel-carbine-hooks-with-key-lock

They are drainpipe white in colour and cost €2 each. They will deliver
outside the UK to Europe for an approximate cost of £6 fixed charge up
to 10 kgs in weight.

The length is 1.8 metres which is the same as the originals from Amel.

I hope that this of use.

Ian Shepherd SM2K 414 Crusader (2003) Cyprus




Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel Shroud Covers

Mark Erdos
 

Not wishing to open a can of worms here but, I was recently at a workshop on rigging. I was told, one of the worst things to do on stainless steel rigging was to cover it (especially with plastic). This traps salt water in the porous stainless metal and accelerates corrosion.







With best regards,



Mark



Super Maramu 2000

Hull #275

www.creampuff.us



From: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com [mailto:amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Monday, December 29, 2014 8:37 AM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel Shroud Covers





I have found a source of split plastic shroud covers in the UK.
http://www.piplers.co.uk/chandlery/rope-and-rigging/wire-rigging/stainless-steel-carbine-hooks-with-key-lock

They are drainpipe white in colour and cost €2 each. They will deliver
outside the UK to Europe for an approximate cost of £6 fixed charge up
to 10 kgs in weight.

The length is 1.8 metres which is the same as the originals from Amel.

I hope that this of use.

Ian Shepherd SM2K 414 Crusader (2003) Cyprus





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Amel Shroud Covers

Ian Shepherd
 

I have found a source of split plastic shroud covers in the UK. http://www.piplers.co.uk/chandlery/rope-and-rigging/wire-rigging/stainless-steel-carbine-hooks-with-key-lock

They are drainpipe white in colour and cost €2 each. They will deliver outside the UK to Europe for an approximate cost of £6 fixed charge up to 10 kgs in weight.

The length is 1.8 metres which is the same as the originals from Amel.

I hope that this of use.

Ian Shepherd SM2K 414 Crusader (2003) Cyprus


SM Bilge Pump indicator light

Ian Shepherd
 

Has anyone replaced the bilge pump operating light on the SM 24V panel? It looks a little tricky to get out. Does the bulb come out of it's holder by twisting or bayonet action, or is it a hard wired pea bulb? Any info might save unnecessary trouble before removing the circuit breakers nearby to gain access to the back of the lamp. An LED replacement would be for the better I think if the whole lamp unit needs to be replaced.

Happy New Year to all.

Ian Shepherd SM 2K 414 Crusader (2003) Cyprus


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Super Maramu Jib Furling Specs Summary:

Colin - ex SV Island Pearl
 

Hi Gary

Our boat #332 was on the production line just 3 ahead of yours in 2001 so we would be most appreciative to get the final detailed list of all rigging parts to order for complete replacement too once you have it done and your new rigging is successfully installed. We will probably use it to place precisely the same order in to re-rig Island Pearl II and would be most interested to hear how you went about it as we are hoping to be able to replace all rigging without dropping the masts but rather replacing one part at a time if that were possible.

We have used some of your past information posted on this site in the past and found it beautifully detailed, accurate and easy to follow so thank you very much for helping others on this site out in this way again. It has been greatly appreciated.

Fair winds
Colin & Lauren Streeter
Island Pearl II, SM#332
Brisbane, Australia

On Sun, Dec 28, 2014 at 8:19 AM, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Gary,

Did you get left hand or right hand thread turnbuckles?

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
sent from my tablet

On Dec 27, 2014 12:34 PM, "amelliahona" <no_reply@...> wrote:
 

Hello to all contributors to this forum:


I am headed to Antigua in a few days to install all new standing rigging on my Hulll #335 SM, built 2001.  I purchased the entire replacement rigging, right down to the clevis pins, from ACMO (Sylvie was extremely helpful) and it was air freighted from France to Antigua (3 days enroute, a week to clear customs and make its way to my boat).


I have been pursuing this forum for specifications on items I will need and thus far find the following:


Top Swivel Specifications: Torlon 10 mm ball bearings. (actual diameter on the Harken web site of 9.5 mm)  - Quantity:  26 balls per row, times two rows (total 52 balls) for the swivel at the head of jib sail foil.


Rivets for jib foil extrusion to furling motor swivel (the grooved cast swivel that engages the furling motor gearbox via a latching pin):  As I have searched this site I see that Joel Potter ind icates that Amel used Monel (also known as stainless steel) rivets.  I could not find that anyone posted the size of these rivets (both diameter and length).  Quantity required:  8


NEED TO KNOW:  Diameter and Length of these Monel rivets


If there are other specifications related to this job please chime in and I will compile them into a document that can be placed in the files section.  This hopefully will save members having to endure the cumbersome search that I just went through. 


Best to all, 


Gary Silver

s/v Liahona




--
Colin Streeter
0411 016 445


Re: Left Hand or Right Hand Thread Standing Rigging Turnbuckles

ESTELLER
 

Olivier, thanks a lot for your exposure, very interesting!

 

What is about the AMEL 54?

 

Cordialement

 

José Esteller

Expert près la Cour d'Appel de Montpellier (H)

Expert près la Cour Administrative d'Appel de Marseille

Professeur à l'Institut de la Construction et l'Habitat (ICH)

Tel +33467844519 Fax +33467844521

jose.esteller@...