Date   

Wiring diagram for propshaft alternator Maramu 1988

Graham Cresswell <grahamjcresswell@...>
 

Can anyone help me to find information about the wiring arrangements for propshaft alternator in the 1988 (1989 model) Maramu? I don't know how to access the files on yahoo groups but I understand that there is a diagram in there.

Many thanks

Graham
SY Jamesby
Maramy 240


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Salt water in the bilge

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Will,

Your anchor chain locker is watertight, draining to the gray water sump any water that enters with the chain retrieval and/or through the chain opening near the windlass. Look at your manual to locate the cut-off valve for this drain...it should be OPEN.

Note that any water entering the area forward of the watertight bulkhead on the aft side of the forward head always settles to the lowest place which is under the cabin floor just outside the forward head.

And, no water cannot enter the area you described from the chain locker unless the watertight bulkhead from the chain locker to the forward V-Berth is breached, or the hose/drain/valve that I discussed above is broken/defective, or possibly changed by someone who did not understand the marvelously simple safety features and watertight system that Amel designed into the Super Maramu. I added that last comment because I saw a Super Maramu that was experiencing the same saltwater issue. The owner did not believe me when I told him that the bow thruster seals were leaking and was certain it was because the chain locker did not have a drain...so he cut a hole in both sides of the hull to drain the water. If you bought that boat from the Kemah area of Texas, you need to send me a private email to svbebe"at"gmail.com

Please believe me when I tell you that the saltwater is entering through the bow thruster tube seals, both the tube foam seals and the tube lip seal because they have not been serviced in two years or because you have not secured the bow thruster UP with the locking pin.

Best,

Bill
BeBe 387

On Mon, Nov 16, 2015 at 12:12 PM, Vladimir Sonsev sonsev52@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Can it get in the bilge through the anchor chain opening in the deck?

On Nov 16, 2015 6:35 AM, "'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

The saltwater is entering through the bow thruster seals.

When was it last serviced?

Do you secure the bow thruster in the UP position with a locking pin?

Bill
BeBe 387

On Mon, Nov 16, 2015 at 11:14 AM, tango708@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

On rough passages I am getting a fair amount of sali water in the bilge which collects by the forward head. Wi have plugged the hause. Where else could water enter?

Will Stout
Anni Bea True
SM180




Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engine Problems Amel 54

James Wendell <ms42phantom54@...>
 

Trevor, nothing is out of line when I cannot solve a most frustrating problem with my engine. I will check my system to rule out that possibility.
Thanks for the tip. Everything is on the table.
Jamie



On Monday, November 16, 2015 7:42 AM, "seafeverofcuan@... [amelyachtowners]"


 
Jamie,
         I appreciate that this is way off line from all the knowledgeable people trying to help with your problem, but I have been following your thread since the beginning and am reminded of a bizarre experience I had.
I picked up a boat that had been left in a Marina by the owner, it had a small Yanmar which the owner told me had been running perfectly.
I wouldn't start, the engine spun freely so I did all the relevant things that you have done, checking fuel,air filters,etc.
Then I got a mechanic, same story over again and eventually "he thought" it was low compression and the valves needed reseated. Removed the head etc, No difference, next up it was supposed to be piston wear.
By this stage two weeks had passed, the owner was furious that her boat hadn't been delivered, so with nothing to lose, we took the exhaust elbow off and it was blocked solid.
Possibly one more long shot to rule out.
Good luck.
Trevor

Seafever of cuan
SM 425 Redline
Mexico
For sale
2004 $295,000




Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Salt water in the bilge

Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Good morning Will,

I had the same problem, it was from the bow thruster.

I serviced it in March, I check every time I go sailing, it doesn't leak in normal condition.
It will still leak in rough water, (locked in up position), and I can see little seepage coming.
I suspect this is because my boat is too heavy.

I put a high water alarm 2 years ago to alert me if it becomes too much.
Also have a small bilge pump to empty if too much to remove manually.
http://nikimat.com/bilge_pump_high_water_alarm_bow_thruster.html

Sincerely, Alexandre

SM2K #289 NIKIMAT
Great Exumas, Bahamas


--------------------------------------------

On Mon, 11/16/15, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Salt water in the bilge
To: "amelyachtowners@..." <amelyachtowners@...>
Date: Monday, November 16, 2015, 5:34 AM


 









The saltwater is entering
through the bow thruster seals.

When was it last serviced?
Do you secure the bow thruster in
the UP position with a locking pin?
BillBeBe
387
On Mon,
Nov 16, 2015 at 11:14 AM, tango708@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
wrote:















 









On rough passages I am getting a fair amount of
sali water in the bilge which collects by the forward head.
Wi have plugged the hause. Where else could water enter?



Will Stout

Anni Bea True

SM180































#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135 --
#yiv6076577135ygrp-mkp {
border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px
0;padding:0 10px;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-mkp hr {
border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-mkp #yiv6076577135hd {
color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px
0;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-mkp #yiv6076577135ads {
margin-bottom:10px;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-mkp .yiv6076577135ad {
padding:0 0;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-mkp .yiv6076577135ad p {
margin:0;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-mkp .yiv6076577135ad a {
color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}
#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-sponsor
#yiv6076577135ygrp-lc {
font-family:Arial;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-sponsor
#yiv6076577135ygrp-lc #yiv6076577135hd {
margin:10px
0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-sponsor
#yiv6076577135ygrp-lc .yiv6076577135ad {
margin-bottom:10px;padding:0 0;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135actions {
font-family:Verdana;font-size:11px;padding:10px 0;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135activity {
background-color:#e0ecee;float:left;font-family:Verdana;font-size:10px;padding:10px;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135activity span {
font-weight:700;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135activity span:first-child {
text-transform:uppercase;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135activity span a {
color:#5085b6;text-decoration:none;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135activity span span {
color:#ff7900;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135activity span
.yiv6076577135underline {
text-decoration:underline;}

#yiv6076577135 .yiv6076577135attach {
clear:both;display:table;font-family:Arial;font-size:12px;padding:10px
0;width:400px;}

#yiv6076577135 .yiv6076577135attach div a {
text-decoration:none;}

#yiv6076577135 .yiv6076577135attach img {
border:none;padding-right:5px;}

#yiv6076577135 .yiv6076577135attach label {
display:block;margin-bottom:5px;}

#yiv6076577135 .yiv6076577135attach label a {
text-decoration:none;}

#yiv6076577135 blockquote {
margin:0 0 0 4px;}

#yiv6076577135 .yiv6076577135bold {
font-family:Arial;font-size:13px;font-weight:700;}

#yiv6076577135 .yiv6076577135bold a {
text-decoration:none;}

#yiv6076577135 dd.yiv6076577135last p a {
font-family:Verdana;font-weight:700;}

#yiv6076577135 dd.yiv6076577135last p span {
margin-right:10px;font-family:Verdana;font-weight:700;}

#yiv6076577135 dd.yiv6076577135last p
span.yiv6076577135yshortcuts {
margin-right:0;}

#yiv6076577135 div.yiv6076577135attach-table div div a {
text-decoration:none;}

#yiv6076577135 div.yiv6076577135attach-table {
width:400px;}

#yiv6076577135 div.yiv6076577135file-title a, #yiv6076577135
div.yiv6076577135file-title a:active, #yiv6076577135
div.yiv6076577135file-title a:hover, #yiv6076577135
div.yiv6076577135file-title a:visited {
text-decoration:none;}

#yiv6076577135 div.yiv6076577135photo-title a,
#yiv6076577135 div.yiv6076577135photo-title a:active,
#yiv6076577135 div.yiv6076577135photo-title a:hover,
#yiv6076577135 div.yiv6076577135photo-title a:visited {
text-decoration:none;}

#yiv6076577135 div#yiv6076577135ygrp-mlmsg
#yiv6076577135ygrp-msg p a span.yiv6076577135yshortcuts {
font-family:Verdana;font-size:10px;font-weight:normal;}

#yiv6076577135 .yiv6076577135green {
color:#628c2a;}

#yiv6076577135 .yiv6076577135MsoNormal {
margin:0 0 0 0;}

#yiv6076577135 o {
font-size:0;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135photos div {
float:left;width:72px;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135photos div div {
border:1px solid
#666666;height:62px;overflow:hidden;width:62px;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135photos div label {
color:#666666;font-size:10px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;white-space:nowrap;width:64px;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135reco-category {
font-size:77%;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135reco-desc {
font-size:77%;}

#yiv6076577135 .yiv6076577135replbq {
margin:4px;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-actbar div a:first-child {
margin-right:2px;padding-right:5px;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-mlmsg {
font-size:13px;font-family:Arial, helvetica, clean,
sans-serif;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-mlmsg table {
font-size:inherit;font:100%;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-mlmsg select,
#yiv6076577135 input, #yiv6076577135 textarea {
font:99% Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-mlmsg pre, #yiv6076577135
code {
font:115% monospace;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-mlmsg * {
line-height:1.22em;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-mlmsg #yiv6076577135logo {
padding-bottom:10px;}


#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-msg p a {
font-family:Verdana;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-msg
p#yiv6076577135attach-count span {
color:#1E66AE;font-weight:700;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-reco
#yiv6076577135reco-head {
color:#ff7900;font-weight:700;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-reco {
margin-bottom:20px;padding:0px;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-sponsor #yiv6076577135ov
li a {
font-size:130%;text-decoration:none;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-sponsor #yiv6076577135ov
li {
font-size:77%;list-style-type:square;padding:6px 0;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-sponsor #yiv6076577135ov
ul {
margin:0;padding:0 0 0 8px;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-text {
font-family:Georgia;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-text p {
margin:0 0 1em 0;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-text tt {
font-size:120%;}

#yiv6076577135 #yiv6076577135ygrp-vital ul li:last-child {
border-right:none !important;
}
#yiv6076577135


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Salt water in the bilge

Mark Erdos
 

Will,



Look around the bow thruster while underway. The seals most likely need to be replaced. We had a similar issue when we were pounded in the Florida Straits. Water will accumulate in the compartment below the floor outside of the forward head. We have an alarm fitted there and it triggered the sensor (in the middle of the night). The water seeped in at the thruster and we could see the wetness around the shaft. We service the thruster while in the water per the instructions on this site. No problems since.



I’m not sure how long the seals are suppose to last. Ours lasted about 18 months. Just for safe measure we replace the seals again when we service the bow thruster at our haul out about 4 months later.







With best regards,



Mark



Super Maramu 2000

Hull #275

www.creampuff.us

Currently cruising: St Augustine FL



From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Monday, November 16, 2015 6:15 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Salt water in the bilge





On rough passages I am getting a fair amount of sali water in the bilge which collects by the forward head. Wi have plugged the hause. Where else could water enter?

Will Stout
Anni Bea True
SM180


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engine Problems Amel 54

seafeverofcuan@...
 

Jamie,
         I appreciate that this is way off line from all the knowledgeable people trying to help with your problem, but I have been following your thread since the beginning and am reminded of a bizarre experience I had.
I picked up a boat that had been left in a Marina by the owner, it had a small Yanmar which the owner told me had been running perfectly.
I wouldn't start, the engine spun freely so I did all the relevant things that you have done, checking fuel,air filters,etc.
Then I got a mechanic, same story over again and eventually "he thought" it was low compression and the valves needed reseated. Removed the head etc, No difference, next up it was supposed to be piston wear.
By this stage two weeks had passed, the owner was furious that her boat hadn't been delivered, so with nothing to lose, we took the exhaust elbow off and it was blocked solid.
Possibly one more long shot to rule out.
Good luck.
Trevor

Seafever of cuan
SM 425 Redline
Mexico
For sale
2004 $295,000


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Shore Power Configuration

James Wendell <ms42phantom54@...>
 

Thanks for the advice Kent. I understand the ABYC standards but have yet to fully understand the Amel installation. Your advice is helpful.
Hopefully, I will get it as I upgrade over the winter.
Jamie
s/v Phantom



On Sunday, November 15, 2015 7:57 PM, "Kent Robertson karkauai@... [amelyachtowners]" wrote:


 
Many (?most) charger/inverter combination units have the AC and DC grounds connected to the case which is (by ABYC standards) connected to the bonding system.  This is contrary to the Amel system in which DC grounded to the negative battery pole, AC is grounded back to the boat's AC ground, and the bonding system is kept isolated from the electrical systems.
Before I understood this, I added a Sterling charger/inverter which was grounded to the bonding system.  A fault in the inverter occurred and a current leak destroyed the zincs and the prop shaft.

Someone posted here that Amel doesn't put combination charger/Inverters in their boats for this reason.

Be very sure you understand the Amel grounding and bonding systems before you add a charger/inverter.

Kent
SM 243
Kristy


On Nov 15, 2015, at 6:22 PM, ms42phantom54@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
I have the same charger configuration, but one is a Dolphin and the other a Charles. Have you tried to use 120V/60 Hz shore power?

Great idea on the charger and inverter setup. I am assuming you will have the charger in line prior to the inverter, as I do not think the combi unit will allow for frequency conversion in a single unit. How do you plan to connect?

What is the rating of your circuit breaker in the lazarette?

Thanks,
Jamie Wendell
s/v Phantom



Re: Salt water in the bilge

joseph mc donnell
 

The only other access for the salt water is the toilet. If on a starboard tack, any water that slops out of the toilet will stay up in that area and may get past the stainless steel plate situated beside the toilet base. Does the head fill up when on that tack? If so I would check to see if the plate seal is broken.
Joe   


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Salt water in the bilge

Richard03801 <richard03801@...>
 

I agree with Bill that it's probably coming from the bow thruster and you need to service the seals to be sure you have Pin In. 


Fair Winds Smooth Sailing To All
Capt Richard 
RP Yacht Brokerage
Newport RI 
We list sell and service fine yachts including Amel's
Cell 603 767 5330

On Nov 16, 2015, at 06:14, tango708@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

On rough passages I am getting a fair amount of sali water in the bilge which collects by the forward head. Wi have plugged the hause. Where else could water enter?

Will Stout
Anni Bea True
SM180


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Salt water in the bilge

VLADIMIR SONSEV
 

Can it get in the bilge through the anchor chain opening in the deck?

On Nov 16, 2015 6:35 AM, "'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

The saltwater is entering through the bow thruster seals.

When was it last serviced?

Do you secure the bow thruster in the UP position with a locking pin?

Bill
BeBe 387

On Mon, Nov 16, 2015 at 11:14 AM, tango708@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

On rough passages I am getting a fair amount of sali water in the bilge which collects by the forward head. Wi have plugged the hause. Where else could water enter?

Will Stout
Anni Bea True
SM180



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Salt water in the bilge

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

The saltwater is entering through the bow thruster seals.

When was it last serviced?

Do you secure the bow thruster in the UP position with a locking pin?

Bill
BeBe 387

On Mon, Nov 16, 2015 at 11:14 AM, tango708@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

On rough passages I am getting a fair amount of sali water in the bilge which collects by the forward head. Wi have plugged the hause. Where else could water enter?

Will Stout
Anni Bea True
SM180



Salt water in the bilge

tango708@...
 

On rough passages I am getting a fair amount of sali water in the bilge which collects by the forward head. Wi have plugged the hause. Where else could water enter?

Will Stout
Anni Bea True
SM180


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Northrop & Johnson is Amel's Exclusive Representative for Asia!

trailz@...
 

Hi Mawgan. We are in Phuket. What is the address and contact number of your office in Phuket?
Thanks,
Warren
Manon 2

Sent from Windows Mail

From: divanz620@... [amelyachtowners]
Sent: ‎Friday‎, ‎13‎ ‎November‎ ‎2015 ‎10‎:‎43‎ ‎a.m.
To: divanz620@... [amelyachtowners]

 

Dear fellow Amel yacht owners and future owners,

I'm proud to announce that Northrop & Johnson is now the exclusive Amel representative and dealer for Asia. If you are sailing in Asia and have any questions, queries, servicing/ maintenance issues or want to purchase or sell an Amel please contact us. We have offices in Hong Kong, Thailand, Singapore, Indonesia and the Philippines.

We will be at the Singapore Yacht show 7-10th April 2016 with an Amel 64 if you want to come and say hi. Our website is www.northropandjohnson-asia.com however please contact me personally, Mawgan Grace on +852 2815 7712 / mawgan.grace@...

Happy Sailing!

Mawgan Grace
SM Jovic #310
Gold Coast Marina Hong Kong



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Shore Power Configuration

karkauai
 

Many (?most) charger/inverter combination units have the AC and DC grounds connected to the case which is (by ABYC standards) connected to the bonding system.  This is contrary to the Amel system in which DC grounded to the negative battery pole, AC is grounded back to the boat's AC ground, and the bonding system is kept isolated from the electrical systems.
Before I understood this, I added a Sterling charger/inverter which was grounded to the bonding system.  A fault in the inverter occurred and a current leak destroyed the zincs and the prop shaft.

Someone posted here that Amel doesn't put combination charger/Inverters in their boats for this reason.

Be very sure you understand the Amel grounding and bonding systems before you add a charger/inverter.

Kent
SM 243
Kristy


On Nov 15, 2015, at 6:22 PM, ms42phantom54@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

I have the same charger configuration, but one is a Dolphin and the other a Charles. Have you tried to use 120V/60 Hz shore power?


Great idea on the charger and inverter setup. I am assuming you will have the charger in line prior to the inverter, as I do not think the combi unit will allow for frequency conversion in a single unit. How do you plan to connect?

What is the rating of your circuit breaker in the lazarette?

Thanks,
Jamie Wendell
s/v Phantom


Re: Shore Power Configuration

svperegrinus@yahoo.com
 

Peregrinus' 30A and 100A Mastervolt chargers can take 120V or 230V and 60Hz or 50Hz.

I think most modern brands can, too.

At any rate, yes, we plugged into 120V/60Hz a couple of times without issue, except we had to monitor the MasterView Easy to ensure we did not exceed the outlet's amperage, which was modest.


Re: Shore Power Configuration

ms42phantom54@...
 

I have the same charger configuration, but one is a Dolphin and the other a Charles. Have you tried to use 120V/60 Hz shore power?

Great idea on the charger and inverter setup. I am assuming you will have the charger in line prior to the inverter, as I do not think the combi unit will allow for frequency conversion in a single unit. How do you plan to connect?

What is the rating of your circuit breaker in the lazarette?

Thanks,
Jamie Wendell
s/v Phantom


Re: Shore Power Configuration

Wolfgang Weber <webercardio@...>
 

Jamie,
On my Amel 54 we have the Mastervolt charger 100A and 40A. The Mastervolt 100A works with 50Hz and 60Hz, all 100 - 240 Volt. I will add next Year the Mastervolt combi charger and inverter ( Ultra combi 100A/3500 Watt ) - this includes also the solarcharger and I can connect all with the LAN (MasterView Easy). For 60 Hz countries I will use the charger and inverter in line to get 50 Hz. I use a galvanic separator for shorepower - just behind the shorepower-inlet.
Wolfgang Weber SY ELISE AMEL 54 # 162

Von meinem iPad gesendet


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engine Problems Amel 54

Jeff Wingfield <ki4jde@...>
 

James:

It still sounds to me as a failed sensor for the common rail. 

Jeff
LAST TANGO


On Nov 15, 2015, at 10:06, James Wendell ms42phantom54@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 
Mark, thanks for the suggestions. As you can see this is a perplexing problem and I still do not know the culprit, but I have systematically ruled out many things. We isolated the fuel system by providing an independent day tank, eliminating the boat fuel tank and filters. I am not sure what else external to the engine could be studied. The battery is fine and the ECM is getting good voltage. As you know we replaced the ECM and then returned it.

The Volvo Tech did nothing except sit in the cockpit and watch the Seven Seas mechanic do a couple of tests. I am going to ask for a quote on doing a compression check test. Getting the injectors out does take some time as I have already done that once, and the mounting parts would have to be replaced again. Those parts alone are several hundred dollars. When you figure the labor a compression check will likely cost about $500 to $600. I have already spent nearly $4,000 replacing fuel pumps, high-pressure lines, and servicing the injectors. Maybe the added expense is worth the knowledge, and I concur that a compression check is in order.
Also, we have not cranked the engine with the fuel line to the injectors loosened. That is very risky at the high pressures generated, but we do know that fuel is returning from the injectors? Why do you think WD40 alone would not be enough to cause the engine to cough? If the engine has sufficient compression it should at least try to fire. Continuous spraying into the air intake while cranking did not do anything, and we tried it a couple times.
Jamie



On Saturday, November 14, 2015 9:28 PM, "'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


 
I have to agree with Bill regarding the fact: What if the issue is external to the engine. Personally I would like to know for certain if the engine is shot, or not.

As for the compression check. I cannot believe the Volvo Tech did not perform this. It is not hard to do and requires only mildly expensive equipment that any good mechanic would regularly carry in their tools. The compression check test each cylinder by removing the injector, attaching the gauge and cranking the engine for about 15 secs per cylinder. It should take less than an hour to test all cylinders. For a problem such as yours it would be very insightful to know if compression, or lack of it, is the issue. If the results confirm you thoughts, you may well be better replacing the engine. But what if you have good compression? If could mean you are on the wrong path of diagnosis. I have read this thread since the first post and have thought this is more likely a fuel problem. Also, you shouldn’t need a Volvo mechanic to do a compression check. Any capable diesel mechanic can do this test.

I asked these questions before but did not see a response. Has the engine been cranked with the fuel line to the injectors loosened and fuel observed leaking out of the end? Are you absolutely certain you have fuel entering the cylinders? I do not think WD40 alone would be enough to cause the engine to cough.

With best regards,

Mark

Super Maramu 2000

Hull #275

www.creampuff.us

Currently cruising: St Augustine, FL

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Saturday, November 14, 2015 2:22 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engine Problems Amel 54

James,

My take away from all of your posts is that the mechanics and other experts that you have hired have done nothing except throw parts at your engine hoping that the part dejour will solve the problem.

Also, it seems to me that most of the diagnoses that you have written about has come from you and not the people you hired to diagnose the engine non-starting problem.

If you are replacing the engine because you have had a series of people do nothing toward identifying the problem, you could be making another mistake. What if the problem is external of your engine?

I would raise all sorts of hell with Volvo Penta and demand that they identify someone who can give you a diagnoses and a recommended solution. I would also insist on some sort of compensation for parts replaced in error. I am not sure that I would get anywhere with these things, but I would work at it very hard.

If you are not going to do this, do you plan to buy and install a Volvo? And, if you are going to change that engine to Yanmar, you may be looking at all sorts of other issues...the house 24VDC alternator, motor mounts, Vetus coupling, etc.

Just my two cents worth.

One last comment: That boat does not appear to have been maintained properly...probably not neglect, but likely some things were not completely understood by the owner...like the barnacle and marine growth...possibly there was an engine overheating issue...a proper compression test would give you a strong indication of damage. That boat spent a lot of time in Curacao where the barnacles breed like few other places. Gary left most things up to mechanics in marinas rather than being hands-on...and you know the quality of mechanics in marinas...I think you have met some recently.

Bill

BeBe #387

On Sat, Nov 14, 2015 at 6:07 PM, James Wendell ms42phantom54@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Kent, I certainly appreciate the input, and I have to agree with you in principle. The engine seems to have expired prematurely, but that 10,000 hours is only realistic if properly maintained. But I have no other explanation, as we have tried almost every possible "solution" to no avail. Many folks have tested, diagnosed, and assessed the engine. I have listened to the engine spin and everyone (including myself) feels that it spins too easily. Spraying WD40 into the air intake should have at least allowed the engine to "cough" or "kick." It did not, and this is not the first time we have tried to inject "fuel" directly into the combustion chambers. I do not know how to explain that except with low compression in at least 2 or more cylinders. Plus, the suction at the intake during cranking seems quite weak.

We have not tried a compression check at this point, since that in itself is a fairly involved process. If we discover anything other than adequate compression, then I am faced with further engine tear down. Even if the compression is good, what then? We have tried almost everything else we could try. The technician did not actually volunteer the possibility that fuel starvation could have caused the problem, but when I explained to him that the engine stopped and failed to restart during sea trial (filters were solid black with contamination), he concluded that lack of fuel "lubrication" could have at least contributed to engine failure. He could not positively identify the problem without further investigation.

At this point I am becoming more and more convinced that there is internal engine damage. Again, I feel that chasing the problem will be quite costly unless I undertake that expedition on my own. I am most weary of fighting with this engine, as it has not run for the last 4 months, and I have already replaced a bunch of parts that have not allowed it to start.

If you do get an opinion from your contacts, I would sure welcome additional inputs.

Thanks, and I do agree with your opinion on Yanmars.............

Jamie Wendell

On Saturday, November 14, 2015 11:56 AM, "Kent Robertson karkauai@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

He "thinks"??? Has he actually checked compression? I'm skeptical. I wrote to Danny Ramos but he didn't reply, sorry.

If it really is a low compression problem, how does he's explain that fuel starvation caused the problem? Does he explain what he thinks is the problem? Bad rings? Bad valves?

I would guess that engine should be good for 10000 hrs. I'd contact Danny Ramos at Marine Mechanical in Fajardo, PR before I bought a new engine.

If you're set on re powering, look at a new Yanmar. Much easier to work on, get parts, etc.

Kent

SM 243

Kristy



On Nov 14, 2015, at 11:35 AM, ms42phantom54@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

I want to thank everyone for the great advice and suggestions regarding my Amel 54 (Phantom) engine "no-start" issue. Since no one has been able to pinpoint the problem, I just had a Volvo Penta factory technician out to survey the situation. He thinks the compression is low on the engine, as it would not fire even as we sprayed WD40 into the intake. Although he had no specific rationale as to the possible cause of this conclusion, he did suggest that earlier fuel-starvation could have caused the problem, stressing the importance of maintaining a clean fuel supply at all times.

I have decided to replace the engine. That will restart the clock with zero hours and a 5-year warranty. The alternative would be to start tearing down the engine to determine the problem. Even if we do find something (blown head gasket, stuck valves, scored cylinders, etc.), chasing this "rebuild" tactic would be a very expensive and time-consuming operation - and it will still be a 9-year-old engine with 2500 hours. Although hugely expensive, a new engine is the only rational option. I do not want to continue chasing "ghosts."

Thanks again for the support.

Jamie Wendell

s/v Phantom

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




Re: Base for Tricolor & Anchor light Legrand 55152 55632

sbmesasailor
 

I own an ATN Topclimber.  I'm 64 years old and have had the unlucky occasion to go to the top of my mast 4-5 times in a single day (in a marina).  I don't quite understand why others feel it is difficult to use or requiring considerable strength.  Each leg extension draws me up about 18 - 20 inches and I can complete the climb in less than five minutes if I don't stop to inspect things on the way up.  I use one halyard as the climbing halyard and another as a safety line which is controlled by someone on deck.  When I get to the top, I have two permanent mast steps installed which lift me above the masthead (two steps at the top don't seem to get in the way of anything).  I cinch a belt around the mast and my waist and that frees up both my hands.  My wife appreciates it as much as I do (she doesn't have to winch me up or use the windless -which scared her sh*tless when it was suggested).

Dennis Johns
s/v Libertad
Maramu #121


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engine Problems Amel 54

Mark Erdos
 

James,

 

DO NOT try to start a diesel engine with starting ether. This will cause serious damage to the engine. Ether’s lower flash point will force the cylinder back before it has reached the full upward motion causing massive internal damage. WD40 is okay but the engine will not “cough” or run unless at full throttle.

 

Jeff is absolutely correct about the injector tips. If you have had bad fuel, this could be an area of concern.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Yacht: Cream Puff

 

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Sunday, November 15, 2015 12:14 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engine Problems Amel 54

 

 

James,

You mentioned servicing your injectors.

If there was any chance of water in your fuel line, and the water came in contact with the injector tips while running, water is an injector tip destroyer. Doesn't take much.

If the tips are compromised, the only way to start the motor is with starting either, and if it starts, it will barely run, and definitely not under a load.

Water will also destroy (again, you don't need much) your high pressure fuel pump.

At 2500hrs, compression shouldn't be an issue. If you have the 110, it is a low rpm motor (relatively speaking, the 90hp yanmar in Kimberlite (Eric Super Maramu) would generally run around 2000rpms or so. I run my 110 at 1400-1550 for the same performance.

I find it hard to believe you have a compression issue. Even if you did, it wouldn't keep the engine from starting. As Mark pointed out, possibly smoke and rough performance would indicate a possible compression issue. Again, only possibly a compression problem.

Blown injector tips would explain your situation.

Generally electronic motors with an ecm allow for a tech to run injector tests. Easy. Can't say for sure on the Volvo, but it is an electronic Diesel.

I have encountered this exact problem in the past involving a QSL9 electronic diesel aboard another vessel.

Just my 2 cents.

Good luck.

Jeff Spirit 54 #14

 

 

 

On Sun, Nov 15, 2015 at 10:06 AM, James Wendell ms42phantom54@... [amelyachtowners] wrote:

 

 

 

 

Mark, thanks for the suggestions. As you can see this is a perplexing problem and I still do not know the culprit, but I have systematically ruled out many things. We isolated the fuel system by providing an independent day tank, eliminating the boat fuel tank and filters. I am not sure what else external to the engine could be studied. The battery is fine and the ECM is getting good voltage. As you know we replaced the ECM and then returned it.

The Volvo Tech did nothing except sit in the cockpit and watch the Seven Seas mechanic do a couple of tests. I am going to ask for a quote on doing a compression check test. Getting the injectors out does take some time as I have already done that once, and the mounting parts would have to be replaced again. Those parts alone are several hundred dollars. When you figure the labor a compression check will likely cost about $500 to $600. I have already spent nearly $4,000 replacing fuel pumps, high-pressure lines, and servicing the injectors. Maybe the added expense is worth the knowledge, and I concur that a compression check is in order.

Also, we have not cranked the engine with the fuel line to the injectors loosened. That is very risky at the high pressures generated, but we do know that fuel is returning from the injectors? Why do you think WD40 alone would not be enough to cause the engine to cough? If the engine has sufficient compression it should at least try to fire. Continuous spraying into the air intake while cranking did not do anything, and we tried it a couple times.

Jamie

 

 

On Saturday, November 14, 2015 9:28 PM, "'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

I have to agree with Bill regarding the fact: What if the issue is external to the engine. Personally I would like to know for certain if the engine is shot, or not.

As for the compression check. I cannot believe the Volvo Tech did not perform this. It is not hard to do and requires only mildly expensive equipment that any good mechanic would regularly carry in their tools. The compression check test each cylinder by removing the injector, attaching the gauge and cranking the engine for about 15 secs per cylinder. It should take less than an hour to test all cylinders. For a problem such as yours it would be very insightful to know if compression, or lack of it, is the issue. If the results confirm you thoughts, you may well be better replacing the engine. But what if you have good compression? If could mean you are on the wrong path of diagnosis. I have read this thread since the first post and have thought this is more likely a fuel problem. Also, you shouldn’t need a Volvo mechanic to do a compression check. Any capable diesel mechanic can do this test.

I asked these questions before but did not see a response. Has the engine been cranked with the fuel line to the injectors loosened and fuel observed leaking out of the end? Are you absolutely certain you have fuel entering the cylinders? I do not think WD40 alone would be enough to cause the engine to cough.

With best regards,

Mark

Super Maramu 2000

Hull #275

www.creampuff.us

Currently cruising: St Augustine, FL

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Saturday, November 14, 2015 2:22 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engine Problems Amel 54

James,

My take away from all of your posts is that the mechanics and other experts that you have hired have done nothing except throw parts at your engine hoping that the part dejour will solve the problem.

Also, it seems to me that most of the diagnoses that you have written about has come from you and not the people you hired to diagnose the engine non-starting problem.

If you are replacing the engine because you have had a series of people do nothing toward identifying the problem, you could be making another mistake. What if the problem is external of your engine?

I would raise all sorts of hell with Volvo Penta and demand that they identify someone who can give you a diagnoses and a recommended solution. I would also insist on some sort of compensation for parts replaced in error. I am not sure that I would get anywhere with these things, but I would work at it very hard.

If you are not going to do this, do you plan to buy and install a Volvo? And, if you are going to change that engine to Yanmar, you may be looking at all sorts of other issues...the house 24VDC alternator, motor mounts, Vetus coupling, etc.

Just my two cents worth.

One last comment: That boat does not appear to have been maintained properly...probably not neglect, but likely some things were not completely understood by the owner...like the barnacle and marine growth...possibly there was an engine overheating issue...a proper compression test would give you a strong indication of damage. That boat spent a lot of time in Curacao where the barnacles breed like few other places. Gary left most things up to mechanics in marinas rather than being hands-on...and you know the quality of mechanics in marinas...I think you have met some recently.

Bill

BeBe #387

On Sat, Nov 14, 2015 at 6:07 PM, James Wendell ms42phantom54@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Kent, I certainly appreciate the input, and I have to agree with you in principle. The engine seems to have expired prematurely, but that 10,000 hours is only realistic if properly maintained. But I have no other explanation, as we have tried almost every possible "solution" to no avail. Many folks have tested, diagnosed, and assessed the engine. I have listened to the engine spin and everyone (including myself) feels that it spins too easily. Spraying WD40 into the air intake should have at least allowed the engine to "cough" or "kick." It did not, and this is not the first time we have tried to inject "fuel" directly into the combustion chambers. I do not know how to explain that except with low compression in at least 2 or more cylinders. Plus, the suction at the intake during cranking seems quite weak.

We have not tried a compression check at this point, since that in itself is a fairly involved process. If we discover anything other than adequate compression, then I am faced with further engine tear down. Even if the compression is good, what then? We have tried almost everything else we could try. The technician did not actually volunteer the possibility that fuel starvation could have caused the problem, but when I explained to him that the engine stopped and failed to restart during sea trial (filters were solid black with contamination), he concluded that lack of fuel "lubrication" could have at least contributed to engine failure. He could not positively identify the problem without further investigation.

At this point I am becoming more and more convinced that there is internal engine damage. Again, I feel that chasing the problem will be quite costly unless I undertake that expedition on my own. I am most weary of fighting with this engine, as it has not run for the last 4 months, and I have already replaced a bunch of parts that have not allowed it to start.

If you do get an opinion from your contacts, I would sure welcome additional inputs.

Thanks, and I do agree with your opinion on Yanmars.............

Jamie Wendell

On Saturday, November 14, 2015 11:56 AM, "Kent Robertson karkauai@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

He "thinks"??? Has he actually checked compression? I'm skeptical. I wrote to Danny Ramos but he didn't reply, sorry.

If it really is a low compression problem, how does he's explain that fuel starvation caused the problem? Does he explain what he thinks is the problem? Bad rings? Bad valves?

I would guess that engine should be good for 10000 hrs. I'd contact Danny Ramos at Marine Mechanical in Fajardo, PR before I bought a new engine.

If you're set on re powering, look at a new Yanmar. Much easier to work on, get parts, etc.

Kent

SM 243

Kristy



On Nov 14, 2015, at 11:35 AM, ms42phantom54@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

I want to thank everyone for the great advice and suggestions regarding my Amel 54 (Phantom) engine "no-start" issue. Since no one has been able to pinpoint the problem, I just had a Volvo Penta factory technician out to survey the situation. He thinks the compression is low on the engine, as it would not fire even as we sprayed WD40 into the intake. Although he had no specific rationale as to the possible cause of this conclusion, he did suggest that earlier fuel-starvation could have caused the problem, stressing the importance of maintaining a clean fuel supply at all times.

I have decided to replace the engine. That will restart the clock with zero hours and a 5-year warranty. The alternative would be to start tearing down the engine to determine the problem. Even if we do find something (blown head gasket, stuck valves, scored cylinders, etc.), chasing this "rebuild" tactic would be a very expensive and time-consuming operation - and it will still be a 9-year-old engine with 2500 hours. Although hugely expensive, a new engine is the only rational option. I do not want to continue chasing "ghosts."

Thanks again for the support.

Jamie Wendell

s/v Phantom

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]