Date   

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Upgrade to Raymarine ES97 MFD

Ric Gottschalk <ric@...>
 

Barry,

Unless you need a fishfinder, you are better off with the E series. I have the E120 at the helm and even though it is large, I find it much easier to see, can use the split screen for the new raymarine radar or many other functions. All my systems are Raymarine. You will like the ability to upgrade the Lighthouse program and works well with my IPad.  I have zero electronic/electrical skills, so had everything done by Pros. No problem, Mon!

Ric

Bali Hai SN 24

Annapolis

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Friday, June 17, 2016 12:00 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Upgrade to Raymarine ES97 MFD

 

 

I am interested in upgrading my existing chart plotter to a Raymarine ES97 Multifunction Display System. Has anyone else done this?

 

If Possible, I would be looking at integrating existing B&G instrument system, Autohelm ST7000, Autohelm 300 course computer and if possible, AIRMAR B44-TH Transducer installed in a wetbox.

 

Any comments/suggestions welcome.

 

Thank you.

 

Kind Regards

Barry & Robyn

Tradewinds III SM 171

 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Upgrade to Raymarine ES97 MFD

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Colin

We have "steer-to-the-wind" function on the 7001+ control head with a 400G course computer and also a S3G course computer. The 400G was our original equipment on #387, and is now our spare. There is a significant difference in the smoothness of steering between these two, with the S3G being superior.

To get depth on the 7001+, I had to connect NMEA from B&G FFD to the 7001+ control head which will read depth sentences. I actually went through a multiplexer because I needed to send the B&G Data to several places.  Unfortunately, the S3G NMEA "input" will not read depth and distribute it over Raymarine SeaTalk. There is a NMEA "input" connection on the back of the 7001+ control head. I am not sure about the 7000 control head.

Later today I will post in the files section the schematic of the connections on BeBe 387. However, I use a PC for navigation, so it may confuse you, more than help. But, the principles are the same.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail

On Jun 17, 2016 9:35 AM, "Colin Streeter colin.d.streeter@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Hi Barry & Robyn

We passed through Bundaberg Port last week and noticed your lovely boat there, but unfortunately did not see you around. As it turns out we are currently doing precisely what you are wanting to do, so will let you know how we go. 

We also purchased a 2nd depth transducer (smaller Raymarine P79 - in-hull model - $265 AUD) and are adding that as a 2nd depth sounder 2 meters forward of the existing B&G one (which still works fine) under the forward cabin floor. 

Our B&G sonar speed/log unit has become a little unreliable (works perfectly accurately some days then not on others so we are hoping that it is simply a calibration issue and that we can still fix it since it has been such a tremendous and accurate system till now. Unfortunately B&G no longer make these. We dive on the B&G depth transducer & auto-prop regularly and clean them clean with a sponge but the transducer has always worked accurately even when it has been covered with growth.

We are not prepared to put a second hole in the hull for a paddle wheel speed/depth/temp system as have had them on previous boats and just don't like having to pull it out for cleaning/storing with such a nice dry and clean hull.

Our intentions are to do exactly what Bill has done after seeing a similar set up on another SM2000 which passed through Brisbane recently. That boat used a Brookhouse multiplexer (similar to the one in Bill's link) and we currently have our electronics guy looking for something similar locally. 

We hope to take the NMEA0183 wind, depth, speed info from the B&G HS2000 unit through a multiplexer, and then into our new Raymarine ES97 as well as the ST7000 Autopilot head and our 2nd (2012) Raymarine autopilot unit which we know will certainly be compatible. We do hope this will work on the ST7000 autopilot as that is our favourite one plus as Bill says it has nice large numbers and we want to be able to use the "steer to wind" function that it has but which Amel never connected. Unfortunately we read somewhere that it could possibly only be done from the ST7002 units onwards? 

Get in touch with us directly if you want to compare prices locally. Our email is colin dot cruisingpoint at gmail dot com or mobile is 0411016445.

Cheers

Colin & Lauren Streeter
Island Pearl II, Amel 53 #332
Brisbane

On Fri, Jun 17, 2016 at 8:57 PM, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Barry & Robin

I have not, but this is precisely what NMEA is for.

I have integrated a lot more than your plan, including depth optionally digitally displayed on the 7001 in 2" high numbers. When navigating in shallow depths, the B&G analog display is not adequate.  I even have waypoints displayed on the 1832 Furuno CRT radar. I think that you will also want to integrate AIS to the chart plotter. You may want to consider an upgrade on that Raymarine course computer to a S3G, and/or a 7001+ control head. If so, there is a great source for refurbished Raymarine components as well as the repair of any Raymarine devices. His name is Dan Gerhardt C250"at"mydurango.net. He may even take a trade-in of your 300 & 7001.

Your goal really depends if the ES97 is capable of receiving and outputting NMEA 0183 or 2000. Unfortunately the newest B&G Triton series is only capable of NMEA 3000. But, assuming that the ES97 will receive all information it needs on the SeaTalk bus, and assuming that that bus information does not require NMEA 3000, you can get what you want by connecting several NMEA devices (GPS, Depth Sounder, B&G FFD) to a NMEA multiplexer ( Like a Noland http://www.nolandeng.com/muxpage.php), then connecting NMEA out to the NMEA in of the Raymarine course computer.

Check if the above is possible. You may have to get some sort of Raymarine NMEA multiplexer. If it is possible, let me know, and I will send you some wiring instructions. I prefer integration schemes which allow all other instruments to operate independently if one fails. A GPS failure usually causes a cascade of failures. I like to use two GPS receivers so that if one fails, the system is still receiving vital information.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail

On Jun 17, 2016 12:00 AM, "seagasm@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

I am interested in upgrading my existing chart plotter to a Raymarine ES97 Multifunction Display System. Has anyone else done this?


If Possible, I would be looking at integrating existing B&G instrument system, Autohelm ST7000, Autohelm 300 course computer and if possible, AIRMAR B44-TH Transducer installed in a wetbox.


Any comments/suggestions welcome.


Thank you.


Kind Regards

Barry & Robyn

Tradewinds III SM 171





--
Colin Streeter
0411 016 445


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Upgrade to Raymarine ES97 MFD

Colin - ex SV Island Pearl
 

Hi Barry & Robyn

We passed through Bundaberg Port last week and noticed your lovely boat there, but unfortunately did not see you around. As it turns out we are currently doing precisely what you are wanting to do, so will let you know how we go. 

We also purchased a 2nd depth transducer (smaller Raymarine P79 - in-hull model - $265 AUD) and are adding that as a 2nd depth sounder 2 meters forward of the existing B&G one (which still works fine) under the forward cabin floor. 

Our B&G sonar speed/log unit has become a little unreliable (works perfectly accurately some days then not on others so we are hoping that it is simply a calibration issue and that we can still fix it since it has been such a tremendous and accurate system till now. Unfortunately B&G no longer make these. We dive on the B&G depth transducer & auto-prop regularly and clean them clean with a sponge but the transducer has always worked accurately even when it has been covered with growth.

We are not prepared to put a second hole in the hull for a paddle wheel speed/depth/temp system as have had them on previous boats and just don't like having to pull it out for cleaning/storing with such a nice dry and clean hull.

Our intentions are to do exactly what Bill has done after seeing a similar set up on another SM2000 which passed through Brisbane recently. That boat used a Brookhouse multiplexer (similar to the one in Bill's link) and we currently have our electronics guy looking for something similar locally. 

We hope to take the NMEA0183 wind, depth, speed info from the B&G HS2000 unit through a multiplexer, and then into our new Raymarine ES97 as well as the ST7000 Autopilot head and our 2nd (2012) Raymarine autopilot unit which we know will certainly be compatible. We do hope this will work on the ST7000 autopilot as that is our favourite one plus as Bill says it has nice large numbers and we want to be able to use the "steer to wind" function that it has but which Amel never connected. Unfortunately we read somewhere that it could possibly only be done from the ST7002 units onwards? 

Get in touch with us directly if you want to compare prices locally. Our email is colin dot cruisingpoint at gmail dot com or mobile is 0411016445.

Cheers

Colin & Lauren Streeter
Island Pearl II, Amel 53 #332
Brisbane

On Fri, Jun 17, 2016 at 8:57 PM, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Barry & Robin

I have not, but this is precisely what NMEA is for.

I have integrated a lot more than your plan, including depth optionally digitally displayed on the 7001 in 2" high numbers. When navigating in shallow depths, the B&G analog display is not adequate.  I even have waypoints displayed on the 1832 Furuno CRT radar. I think that you will also want to integrate AIS to the chart plotter. You may want to consider an upgrade on that Raymarine course computer to a S3G, and/or a 7001+ control head. If so, there is a great source for refurbished Raymarine components as well as the repair of any Raymarine devices. His name is Dan Gerhardt C250"at"mydurango.net. He may even take a trade-in of your 300 & 7001.

Your goal really depends if the ES97 is capable of receiving and outputting NMEA 0183 or 2000. Unfortunately the newest B&G Triton series is only capable of NMEA 3000. But, assuming that the ES97 will receive all information it needs on the SeaTalk bus, and assuming that that bus information does not require NMEA 3000, you can get what you want by connecting several NMEA devices (GPS, Depth Sounder, B&G FFD) to a NMEA multiplexer ( Like a Noland http://www.nolandeng.com/muxpage.php), then connecting NMEA out to the NMEA in of the Raymarine course computer.

Check if the above is possible. You may have to get some sort of Raymarine NMEA multiplexer. If it is possible, let me know, and I will send you some wiring instructions. I prefer integration schemes which allow all other instruments to operate independently if one fails. A GPS failure usually causes a cascade of failures. I like to use two GPS receivers so that if one fails, the system is still receiving vital information.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail

On Jun 17, 2016 12:00 AM, "seagasm@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

I am interested in upgrading my existing chart plotter to a Raymarine ES97 Multifunction Display System. Has anyone else done this?


If Possible, I would be looking at integrating existing B&G instrument system, Autohelm ST7000, Autohelm 300 course computer and if possible, AIRMAR B44-TH Transducer installed in a wetbox.


Any comments/suggestions welcome.


Thank you.


Kind Regards

Barry & Robyn

Tradewinds III SM 171





--
Colin Streeter
0411 016 445


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Upgrade to Raymarine ES97 MFD

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Barry & Robin

I have not, but this is precisely what NMEA is for.

I have integrated a lot more than your plan, including depth optionally digitally displayed on the 7001 in 2" high numbers. When navigating in shallow depths, the B&G analog display is not adequate.  I even have waypoints displayed on the 1832 Furuno CRT radar. I think that you will also want to integrate AIS to the chart plotter. You may want to consider an upgrade on that Raymarine course computer to a S3G, and/or a 7001+ control head. If so, there is a great source for refurbished Raymarine components as well as the repair of any Raymarine devices. His name is Dan Gerhardt C250"at"mydurango.net. He may even take a trade-in of your 300 & 7001.

Your goal really depends if the ES97 is capable of receiving and outputting NMEA 0183 or 2000. Unfortunately the newest B&G Triton series is only capable of NMEA 3000. But, assuming that the ES97 will receive all information it needs on the SeaTalk bus, and assuming that that bus information does not require NMEA 3000, you can get what you want by connecting several NMEA devices (GPS, Depth Sounder, B&G FFD) to a NMEA multiplexer ( Like a Noland http://www.nolandeng.com/muxpage.php), then connecting NMEA out to the NMEA in of the Raymarine course computer.

Check if the above is possible. You may have to get some sort of Raymarine NMEA multiplexer. If it is possible, let me know, and I will send you some wiring instructions. I prefer integration schemes which allow all other instruments to operate independently if one fails. A GPS failure usually causes a cascade of failures. I like to use two GPS receivers so that if one fails, the system is still receiving vital information.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail

On Jun 17, 2016 12:00 AM, "seagasm@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

I am interested in upgrading my existing chart plotter to a Raymarine ES97 Multifunction Display System. Has anyone else done this?


If Possible, I would be looking at integrating existing B&G instrument system, Autohelm ST7000, Autohelm 300 course computer and if possible, AIRMAR B44-TH Transducer installed in a wetbox.


Any comments/suggestions welcome.


Thank you.


Kind Regards

Barry & Robyn

Tradewinds III SM 171



Upgrade to Raymarine ES97 MFD

seagasm@...
 

I am interested in upgrading my existing chart plotter to a Raymarine ES97 Multifunction Display System. Has anyone else done this?


If Possible, I would be looking at integrating existing B&G instrument system, Autohelm ST7000, Autohelm 300 course computer and if possible, AIRMAR B44-TH Transducer installed in a wetbox.


Any comments/suggestions welcome.


Thank you.


Kind Regards

Barry & Robyn

Tradewinds III SM 171



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Batteries - What type house batteries to use & what voltage charge from Solar/Wind?

Alan Leslie
 

No, 30 mins wouldn't do anything..but days and hours would.
Good luck
Cheers
alan


Re: Amel surveyor- Florida

jjjk12s@...
 

Doug,

I would say osmosis is not a common problem. Minor osmosis may be present as the boats are old. One factor in causing osmosis is how the lay up was done. If there are more tiny air bubbles in the outer layers of resin (poor workmanship) that can be the areas osmosis starts. Amel are very good at fibreglass, and in that era were well ahead of the fibreglass game compared to most other builders, so you would be hard pressed to find a boat of that age with a lower likelihood of osmosis. 

Obviously a lot more is known since the early 90's about how to minimise osmosis so osmosis on any particular vessel will depend on whether a protective barrier coat was added earlier in it's life.

John Matamu 91, Popeye 1981


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] DC cable sizing for larger charger

Stephen Davis
 

Hi Ben, 

We just arrived at Port Louis Marina a few hours ago after an overnight from Trinidad. We are right next to Rascal and another British owned SM2000, and nobody else near us. Plenty of room to make it a foursome. 

My first impressions of Port Louis is a very high end Marina, well built and protected, and everything you need very close by. It is a bit expensive, but I think it is very survivable here in the event of a hurricane. I'm also heading back to the USA to make some money this summer, but my wife Liz will be here on Aloha most of the time. She will look after Rascal while Rick and Linda are away, and Im sure she would be happy to do the same for you guys if you end up here. 

Hope we get to meet soon. 

Steve
Aloha SM72

On Jun 15, 2016, at 23:13, Ben Driver/YAHOO joedoakes66@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Thanks Steve.  I agree.  Sixty Amps is max with my current DC cabling which would be a lot of work to upgrade.  We too are checking Marinas out in St George as Gayle and I may be going back to California for several months work.

Ben Driver
La Bella Vita
CG #1120066
SM #347

On Jun 14, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Stephen Davis flyboyscd@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Ben,

We have a Mastervolt 100 amp charger on Aloha, but have a different setup than you. We are hull #72, have a shorter cable run, and I went with 1/0 battery cable, which was a bit of an overkill. I think Bill's advice was excellent, and unless you are willing to up your cable size, you should probably stick to a smaller charger. Mastervolt also makes an 80 amp charger, and maybe the numbers would look a bit better with that. 

We are headed from Trinidad to Grenada tomorrow night, and will be at Port Louis Marina next to Rick and Linda on Rascal. Hope we can get together in Grenada. 

Regards,
Steve and Liz
Aloha SM72
Trinidad for not much longer...

On Jun 14, 2016, at 18:53, Ben Driver/YAHOO joedoakes66@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

It seems 100 amps will challenge my existing 25mm sq wiring.  Looks like I will keep it at 60 amp max 

Ben Driver
La Bella Vita
CG #1120066
SM #347

On Jun 14, 2016, at 11:33 AM, Kent Robertson karkauai@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

When I bought a new charger I went with a 60A.  The cables from the charger go through the forward starboard corner of the engine room, then under the raised "step" between the Nav station and passageway to the battery compartment.  In that area under the "step", they are encased in a very hard material and would be very hard to replace.  You would have to look at the specs required for your new charger to see if the existing ones are adequate for the amperage and distance.
Kent
SM243
Kristy


On Jun 14, 2016, at 10:46 AM, joedoakes66@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

I recently replaced my failed Dolhin 30 Amp charger with a Mastervolt 60 Amp charger.  I did not upgrade either th AC or DC wiring.  All seems to work well.  Now I'm considering replacing the 50 Amp charger with a Mastervolt 80 or 100 Amp unit.  I think AC input wire size is OK.   Amel used the same size wire for both 30 and 50 Amp units.  My concern is DC wire size.    Not sure but it appears to be 25mm sq. (3 AWG).  Again Amel used same size for both 30 and 50 Amp chargers.  My question is will this size wire support larger charger?  Or will I need upgrade to 35 or 50mm sq.?  Has anyone done this upgrade without wiring upgrade?


Ben Driver

La Blla Vita

SM 347

Prickly Bay Grenada





Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change

Bill Kinney <greatketch@...>
 

It is entirely possible that my fear of boat fires is making me irrational. So anybody should feel free to come to an alternative conclusion about risks and benefits without me thinking they are crazy.

I have seen four boats on fire. Two I put out, two I watched burn to the waterline. The idea that I could syphon 200 liters (or 100, or 50) of diesel fuel into an engine room fire with no way to stop it, just strikes me as terrifying.

The remote handle for the bottom valve is there to shut the valve in case of fire. It says so right on the handle. That’s the logic Amel used for the design of that valve. It is good logic. It is smart, it is as safe as it can be. I like that approach. Every other boat I have had had a similar arrangement.

If you accept that logic I don’t see how you can avoid thinking the syphoning return line should have the same arrangement. It would feed fuel to a fire also. Why is fuel that syphons out of the tank less hazardous during a fire than fuel from the bottom?

Enough said.

IF I find that the return line DOES syphon on my boat, I will install a remote handled valve to shut it off. Just like Amel did for the main fuel line. If that is the case, I’ll post pictures and a description of what I did.

On Jun 16, 2016, at 09:25, Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@rocketmail.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Hello Bill,

But this is a negative, there was more in the bilge than just what was in the line.
Here is what Olivier wrote on Feb 23, 2016
So may be I had more fuel than I thought… May be I had 3/4 and not half.

Olivier’s message:

the purpose of the shut-off valve at the bottom of the tank is not to be able to stop an engine but to prevent fuel from flowing in case of fire in the engine room (this is why there is a remote control).
Yes, with this valve shut off, the engines go on running for 10 minutes (idling) before they stop. And I'm sure the main engine finally stops because I experienced this once in a windy harbor (because I did not check that this valve was open)...not fun at all.
So, if you notice that the fuel keeps on flowing while you're changing the filters, this means the valve is dead and needs replacement (for safety in case of fire...). In fact there is a plastic housing around the chromed ball inside the valve. This plastic probably deteriorates because of time and wear.

I don't think the engines can run thanks to the fuel coming from the return line (otherwise, the design of these engines would be very poor...).

Bill is right, adding more valves is a source of future leaks, or problems (if you forget to open them all while running). AMEL did not do that to keep it simple, as you rarely change a filter on the genset while motoring (or vice versa).
AMEL put a valve on the fuel heater system (option) as this equipment is more fragile, prone to leaking and should not be able to disable the engines (via air intakes).

What Gary experienced with the fuel coming from the return line while changing the fuel filter on the genset, is because of siphoning when the tank is full. The fuel return line enters the tank with a piece of pipe that is around 20cm long, hence the siphon.




--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 6/16/16, Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change
To: "Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@rocketmail.com [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, June 16, 2016, 8:16 AM












A valve there is not for convenience during
repairs, although it would be that.



There shouldn’t be any way to empty the fuel tank into the
bilge without a positive shut off in case of a broken hose
or other disaster. The reason that Amel has a remote
operated main fuel valve (and every other well designed boat
as well) is so you can positively shut off fuel flow to the
engine room in the event of a fire. Having a return line
that syphon feeds fuel from the tank to a fire would totally
defeat the purpose.



I do not doubt that you had fuel come out of the return
line. I would expect it there. My engineering sense is
that you saw the fuel in the line draining back, and not
coming from the tank. Return lines would be full on the
shutdown of the engine(s) and would likely stay that way.
Draining back down to the fuel level in the tank through the
injection pumps and lift pumps would take a very long time.




I have added a project to my endless list… disconnect the
return line from the generator with a full fuel tank and
closed main valve and see what happens. I expect to get
about a liter of fuel out as the lines drain, and then no
more. At least I hope that’s what happens!



On Jun 16, 2016, at 08:38, Alexandre Uster von Baar
uster@rocketmail.com [amelyachtowners]
<amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Hello Bill (SM#160),
At the time when it happened to me, I didn’t mention
it on the forum as I couldn’t understand it (and kind of
felt stupid to be honest), then others mention the same
thing so I share my experience.

Yes, absolutely positive, it is coming from the
“return” line, there was probably 4 liters of diesel
overnight in the bilge (which I had to empty using cups,
etc.) difficult to estimate because it was mix with the
water in my bilge.

Personally I don’t feel worth the time to install a
valve on the return line, it is much quicker to simply
disconnect the hose that goes to it. In the 3.5 years of
ownership, only needed to disconnect the return line once.


Wish I could help more…
Sincerely, Alexandre
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT
Club Nautico de San Juan, Puerto Rico
--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 6/16/16, Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS
cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change

To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, June 16, 2016, 7:13 AM
Alexandre
I am trying to understand what is
going on here… If it really is possible to syphon
fuel

out of a half full tank via the return line, then
putting a

shut off valve on it would become become a very high
priority safety project for me.
But if the tank is built the
way Amel drew it, then it is not possible for this to
happen

without “magic”, and we are seeing something
else

happening.
You describe a “drop by drop”
leak of fuel. How much total fuel leaked this way
would

you guess? 10 liters? 5? Less than 1?
Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort Canaveral, Florida
On Jun 16, 2016, at 06:44,
Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@rocketmail.com
[amelyachtowners]
<amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>

wrote:
Good morning Bill (SM
#160),
April 28, 2015 in reply to Mike
Ondra’s post, I reply:
my injectors (engine) were
removed to be check/rebuilt
Somehow fuel was still coming
drop by drop in the bilge compartment.
It did not make any
sense to me as the valve was off.
I realize the fuel
was coming from the “return” valve (which still
doesn’t make any sense… may be some type of suction
or

syphon?)
So I
disconnected the return rubber fuel line to the tank,
the

leak stop.
My tank was may be 1/2 full.
It happened to other people as
well.
One of these things hard to
understand but that you have to keep in mind.
Sincerely, Alexandre
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT
Club Nautico de San
Juan, Puerto Rico
--------------------------------------------
On Wed, 6/15/16,
Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners]
<amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:
Subject: Re: Re:
[Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart
after

fuel filter and oil change
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday,
June 15, 2016, 9:21 PM
I am puzzled…
How can the fuel
“syphon”
back
from the tank through the return line? Amel’s
drawing of the tank
does not show a dip tube (and there
certainly shouldn’t be one!) on
the return fitting on the
top of the tank.
It seems that if the
only way
this
could happen is if the tank is filled so full the
level

is up into the fill
line with NO air in the tank at
all.
Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort
Canaveral, Florida
On Jun 15, 2016, at 21:41,
amelliahona <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:
Dominique:
I just replaced my
electric
priming
pump on my SM #335 Onan Genset. I did not have
access at the time
to a proper FLARE NUT WRENCH when I did
this. I ended up distorting the
"B-nut" on the
small copper fuel line that goes
from the fuel pump to the
fuel filter adapter and could NOT
get a proper seal upon
replacing this line (a continuous
small seep of fuel that
was really annoying and messy).
I had to order a
replacement line (not that
expensive) and buy a proper set
of flare nut wrenches to
adequately get a seal. I wish I
could remember the size of the
flare nut but it was SAE (not
metric) sized. Make sure the
fuel tank is low on fuel
(think 250 liter will work)
otherwise a continuous stream of
fuel will flow by syphon from the
fuel tank fuel return line
while you make this plumbing
change. I managed to turn
this otherwise simple replacement
into a major project based
on A) not using the proper tools
to loosen and re-install
the B-nut of the fuel line, B)
not have lowered the fuel in
the tank (mine was full at the
time of my work).
Good luck. The pump was
about
$65 as I
recall (not that expensive in the scheme of things)
and the fuel line
was about $8
Sincerely,
Gary S. Silvers/v LiahonaAmel SM
#335 Puerto
Rico
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<p>Hello Bill (SM#160), <br>
<br>
At the time when it happened to me, I didn’t mention
it on the forum as I couldn’t understand it (and kind of
felt stupid to be honest), then others mention the same
thing so I share my experience. <br>

<br>
Yes, absolutely positive, it is coming from the
“return” line, there was probably 4 liters of diesel
overnight in the bilge (which I had to empty using cups,
etc.) difficult to estimate because it was mix with the
water in my bilge. <br>

<br>
Personally I don’t feel worth the time to install a
valve on the return line, it is much quicker to simply
disconnect the hose that goes to it. In the 3.5 years of
ownership, only needed to disconnect the return line once.
<br>

<br>
Wish I could help more… <br>
<br>
Sincerely, Alexandre<br>
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT<br>
Club Nautico de San Juan, Puerto Rico<br>
<br>
--------------------------------------------<br>

On Thu, 6/16/16, Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:<br>

<br>
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS
cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change<br>

To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com<br>
Date: Thursday, June 16, 2016, 7:13 AM<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Alexandre<br>
I am trying to understand what is<br>
going on here… If it really is possible to syphon
fuel<br>

out of a half full tank via the return line, then
putting a<br>

shut off valve on it would become become a very
high<br>

priority safety project for me.<br>
But if the tank is built the<br>
way Amel drew it, then it is not possible for this to
happen<br>

without “magic”, and we are seeing something
else<br>

happening.<br>
You describe a “drop by drop”<br>
leak of fuel. How much total fuel leaked this way
would<br>

you guess? 10 liters? 5? Less than 1?<br>
Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort Canaveral,
Florida<br>

On Jun 16, 2016, at 06:44,<br>
Alexandre Uster von Baar
uster@rocketmail.com<br>

[amelyachtowners]
<amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com><br>

wrote:<br>
Good morning Bill (SM<br>
#160), <br>
<br>
April 28, 2015 in reply to Mike<br>
Ondra’s post, I reply: <br>
<br>
my injectors (engine) were<br>
removed to be check/rebuilt<br>
Somehow fuel was still coming<br>
drop by drop in the bilge compartment. <br>
It did not make any<br>
sense to me as the valve was off. <br>
I realize the fuel<br>
was coming from the “return” valve (which
still<br>

doesn’t make any sense… may be some type of suction
or<br>

syphon?)<br>
So I<br>
disconnected the return rubber fuel line to the tank,
the<br>

leak stop. <br>
<br>
My tank was may be 1/2 full. <br>
<br>
It happened to other people as<br>
well. <br>
<br>
One of these things hard to<br>
understand but that you have to keep in mind.
<br>

<br>
Sincerely, Alexandre<br>
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT<br>
Club Nautico de San<br>
Juan, Puerto Rico<br>
<br>
--------------------------------------------<br>

On Wed, 6/15/16,<br>
Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com
[amelyachtowners]<br>

<amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com><br>
wrote:<br>
<br>
Subject: Re: Re:<br>
[Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart
after<br>

fuel filter and oil change<br>
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com<br>
Date: Wednesday,<br>
June 15, 2016, 9:21 PM<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
I am puzzled… <br>
How can the fuel<br>
“syphon”<br>
back<br>
from the tank through the return line?
Amel’s<br>

drawing of the tank<br>
does not show a dip tube (and there<br>
certainly shouldn’t be one!) on<br>
the return fitting on the<br>
top of the tank. <br>
It seems that if the<br>
only way<br>
this<br>
could happen is if the tank is filled so full the
level<br>

is up into the fill<br>
line with NO air in the tank at<br>
all.<br>
Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort<br>
Canaveral, Florida<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On Jun 15, 2016, at 21:41,<br>
amelliahona
<no_reply@yahoogroups.com><br>

wrote:<br>
Dominique:<br>
I just replaced my<br>
electric<br>
priming<br>
pump on my SM #335 Onan Genset. I did not
have<br>

access at the time<br>
to a proper FLARE NUT WRENCH when I did<br>
this. I ended up distorting the<br>
"B-nut" on the<br>
small copper fuel line that goes<br>
from the fuel pump to the<br>
fuel filter adapter and could NOT<br>
get a proper seal upon<br>
replacing this line (a continuous<br>
small seep of fuel that<br>
was really annoying and messy).<br>
I had to order a<br>
replacement line (not that<br>
expensive) and buy a proper set<br>
of flare nut wrenches to<br>
adequately get a seal. I wish I<br>
could remember the size of the<br>
flare nut but it was SAE (not<br>
metric) sized. Make sure the<br>
fuel tank is low on fuel<br>
(think 250 liter will work)<br>
otherwise a continuous stream of<br>
fuel will flow by syphon from the<br>
fuel tank fuel return line<br>
while you make this plumbing<br>
change. I managed to turn<br>
this otherwise simple replacement<br>
into a major project based<br>
on A) not using the proper tools<br>
to loosen and re-install<br>
the B-nut of the fuel line, B)<br>
not have lowered the fuel in<br>
the tank (mine was full at the<br>
time of my work).<br>
<br>
Good luck. The pump was<br>
about<br>
$65 as I<br>
recall (not that expensive in the scheme of
things)<br>

and the fuel line<br>
was about $8<br>
Sincerely, <br>
Gary S. Silvers/v LiahonaAmel SM<br>
#335 Puerto<br>
Rico <br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change

Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Hello Bill,

But this is a negative, there was more in the bilge than just what was in the line.
Here is what Olivier wrote on Feb 23, 2016
So may be I had more fuel than I thought… May be I had 3/4 and not half.

Olivier’s message:

the purpose of the shut-off valve at the bottom of the tank is not to be able to stop an engine but to prevent fuel from flowing in case of fire in the engine room (this is why there is a remote control).
Yes, with this valve shut off, the engines go on running for 10 minutes (idling) before they stop. And I'm sure the main engine finally stops because I experienced this once in a windy harbor (because I did not check that this valve was open)...not fun at all.
So, if you notice that the fuel keeps on flowing while you're changing the filters, this means the valve is dead and needs replacement (for safety in case of fire...). In fact there is a plastic housing around the chromed ball inside the valve. This plastic probably deteriorates because of time and wear.

I don't think the engines can run thanks to the fuel coming from the return line (otherwise, the design of these engines would be very poor...).

Bill is right, adding more valves is a source of future leaks, or problems (if you forget to open them all while running). AMEL did not do that to keep it simple, as you rarely change a filter on the genset while motoring (or vice versa).
AMEL put a valve on the fuel heater system (option) as this equipment is more fragile, prone to leaking and should not be able to disable the engines (via air intakes).

What Gary experienced with the fuel coming from the return line while changing the fuel filter on the genset, is because of siphoning when the tank is full. The fuel return line enters the tank with a piece of pipe that is around 20cm long, hence the siphon.




--------------------------------------------

On Thu, 6/16/16, Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change
To: "Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@rocketmail.com [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, June 16, 2016, 8:16 AM


 









A valve there is not for convenience during
repairs, although it would be that.



There shouldn’t be any way to empty the fuel tank into the
bilge without a positive shut off in case of a broken hose
or other disaster. The reason that Amel has a remote
operated main fuel valve (and every other well designed boat
as well) is so you can positively shut off fuel flow to the
engine room in the event of a fire. Having a return line
that syphon feeds fuel from the tank to a fire would totally
defeat the purpose.



I do not doubt that you had fuel come out of the return
line. I would expect it there. My engineering sense is
that you saw the fuel in the line draining back, and not
coming from the tank. Return lines would be full on the
shutdown of the engine(s) and would likely stay that way.
Draining back down to the fuel level in the tank through the
injection pumps and lift pumps would take a very long time.




I have added a project to my endless list… disconnect the
return line from the generator with a full fuel tank and
closed main valve and see what happens. I expect to get
about a liter of fuel out as the lines drain, and then no
more. At least I hope that’s what happens!



> On Jun 16, 2016, at 08:38, Alexandre Uster von Baar
uster@rocketmail.com [amelyachtowners]
<amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

>

> Hello Bill (SM#160),

>

> At the time when it happened to me, I didn’t mention
it on the forum as I couldn’t understand it (and kind of
felt stupid to be honest), then others mention the same
thing so I share my experience.

>

> Yes, absolutely positive, it is coming from the
“return” line, there was probably 4 liters of diesel
overnight in the bilge (which I had to empty using cups,
etc.) difficult to estimate because it was mix with the
water in my bilge.

>

> Personally I don’t feel worth the time to install a
valve on the return line, it is much quicker to simply
disconnect the hose that goes to it. In the 3.5 years of
ownership, only needed to disconnect the return line once.


>

> Wish I could help more…

>

> Sincerely, Alexandre

> SM2K #289 NIKIMAT

> Club Nautico de San Juan, Puerto Rico

>

>

>

>

> --------------------------------------------

> On Thu, 6/16/16, Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:

>

> Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS
cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change

> To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com

> Date: Thursday, June 16, 2016, 7:13 AM

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Alexandre

> I am trying to understand what is

> going on here… If it really is possible to syphon
fuel

> out of a half full tank via the return line, then
putting a

> shut off valve on it would become become a very high

> priority safety project for me.

> But if the tank is built the

> way Amel drew it, then it is not possible for this to
happen

> without “magic”, and we are seeing something
else

> happening.

> You describe a “drop by drop”

> leak of fuel. How much total fuel leaked this way
would

> you guess? 10 liters? 5? Less than 1?

> Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort Canaveral, Florida

> On Jun 16, 2016, at 06:44,

> Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@rocketmail.com

> [amelyachtowners]
<amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>

> wrote:

> Good morning Bill (SM

> #160),

>

> April 28, 2015 in reply to Mike

> Ondra’s post, I reply:

>

> my injectors (engine) were

> removed to be check/rebuilt

> Somehow fuel was still coming

> drop by drop in the bilge compartment.

> It did not make any

> sense to me as the valve was off.

> I realize the fuel

> was coming from the “return” valve (which still

> doesn’t make any sense… may be some type of suction
or

> syphon?)

> So I

> disconnected the return rubber fuel line to the tank,
the

> leak stop.

>

> My tank was may be 1/2 full.

>

> It happened to other people as

> well.

>

> One of these things hard to

> understand but that you have to keep in mind.

>

> Sincerely, Alexandre

> SM2K #289 NIKIMAT

> Club Nautico de San

> Juan, Puerto Rico

>

> --------------------------------------------

> On Wed, 6/15/16,

> Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners]

> <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>

> wrote:

>

> Subject: Re: Re:

> [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart
after

> fuel filter and oil change

> To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com

> Date: Wednesday,

> June 15, 2016, 9:21 PM

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> I am puzzled…

> How can the fuel

> “syphon”

> back

> from the tank through the return line? Amel’s

> drawing of the tank

> does not show a dip tube (and there

> certainly shouldn’t be one!) on

> the return fitting on the

> top of the tank.

> It seems that if the

> only way

> this

> could happen is if the tank is filled so full the
level

> is up into the fill

> line with NO air in the tank at

> all.

> Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort

> Canaveral, Florida

>

>

>

>

>

>

> On Jun 15, 2016, at 21:41,

> amelliahona <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>

> wrote:

> Dominique:

> I just replaced my

> electric

> priming

> pump on my SM #335 Onan Genset. I did not have

> access at the time

> to a proper FLARE NUT WRENCH when I did

> this. I ended up distorting the

> "B-nut" on the

> small copper fuel line that goes

> from the fuel pump to the

> fuel filter adapter and could NOT

> get a proper seal upon

> replacing this line (a continuous

> small seep of fuel that

> was really annoying and messy).

> I had to order a

> replacement line (not that

> expensive) and buy a proper set

> of flare nut wrenches to

> adequately get a seal. I wish I

> could remember the size of the

> flare nut but it was SAE (not

> metric) sized. Make sure the

> fuel tank is low on fuel

> (think 250 liter will work)

> otherwise a continuous stream of

> fuel will flow by syphon from the

> fuel tank fuel return line

> while you make this plumbing

> change. I managed to turn

> this otherwise simple replacement

> into a major project based

> on A) not using the proper tools

> to loosen and re-install

> the B-nut of the fuel line, B)

> not have lowered the fuel in

> the tank (mine was full at the

> time of my work).

>

> Good luck. The pump was

> about

> $65 as I

> recall (not that expensive in the scheme of things)

> and the fuel line

> was about $8

> Sincerely,

> Gary S. Silvers/v LiahonaAmel SM

> #335 Puerto

> Rico

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

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>

> <p>Hello Bill (SM#160), <br>

> <br>

> At the time when it happened to me, I didn’t mention
it on the forum as I couldn’t understand it (and kind of
felt stupid to be honest), then others mention the same
thing so I share my experience. <br>

> <br>

> Yes, absolutely positive, it is coming from the
“return” line, there was probably 4 liters of diesel
overnight in the bilge (which I had to empty using cups,
etc.) difficult to estimate because it was mix with the
water in my bilge. <br>

> <br>

> Personally I don’t feel worth the time to install a
valve on the return line, it is much quicker to simply
disconnect the hose that goes to it. In the 3.5 years of
ownership, only needed to disconnect the return line once.
<br>

> <br>

> Wish I could help more… <br>

> <br>

> Sincerely, Alexandre<br>

> SM2K #289 NIKIMAT<br>

> Club Nautico de San Juan, Puerto Rico<br>

> <br>

>
--------------------------------------------<br>

> On Thu, 6/16/16, Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:<br>

> <br>

> Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS
cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change<br>

> To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com<br>

> Date: Thursday, June 16, 2016, 7:13 AM<br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> Alexandre<br>

> I am trying to understand what is<br>

> going on here… If it really is possible to syphon
fuel<br>

> out of a half full tank via the return line, then
putting a<br>

> shut off valve on it would become become a very
high<br>

> priority safety project for me.<br>

> But if the tank is built the<br>

> way Amel drew it, then it is not possible for this to
happen<br>

> without “magic”, and we are seeing something
else<br>

> happening.<br>

> You describe a “drop by drop”<br>

> leak of fuel. How much total fuel leaked this way
would<br>

> you guess? 10 liters? 5? Less than 1?<br>

> Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort Canaveral,
Florida<br>

> On Jun 16, 2016, at 06:44,<br>

> Alexandre Uster von Baar
uster@rocketmail.com<br>

> [amelyachtowners]
<amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com><br>

> wrote:<br>

> Good morning Bill (SM<br>

> #160), <br>

> <br>

> April 28, 2015 in reply to Mike<br>

> Ondra’s post, I reply: <br>

> <br>

> my injectors (engine) were<br>

> removed to be check/rebuilt<br>

> Somehow fuel was still coming<br>

> drop by drop in the bilge compartment. <br>

> It did not make any<br>

> sense to me as the valve was off. <br>

> I realize the fuel<br>

> was coming from the “return” valve (which
still<br>

> doesn’t make any sense… may be some type of suction
or<br>

> syphon?)<br>

> So I<br>

> disconnected the return rubber fuel line to the tank,
the<br>

> leak stop. <br>

> <br>

> My tank was may be 1/2 full. <br>

> <br>

> It happened to other people as<br>

> well. <br>

> <br>

> One of these things hard to<br>

> understand but that you have to keep in mind.
<br>

> <br>

> Sincerely, Alexandre<br>

> SM2K #289 NIKIMAT<br>

> Club Nautico de San<br>

> Juan, Puerto Rico<br>

> <br>

>
--------------------------------------------<br>

> On Wed, 6/15/16,<br>

> Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com
[amelyachtowners]<br>

> <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com><br>

> wrote:<br>

> <br>

> Subject: Re: Re:<br>

> [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart
after<br>

> fuel filter and oil change<br>

> To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com<br>

> Date: Wednesday,<br>

> June 15, 2016, 9:21 PM<br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> I am puzzled… <br>

> How can the fuel<br>

> “syphon”<br>

> back<br>

> from the tank through the return line?
Amel’s<br>

> drawing of the tank<br>

> does not show a dip tube (and there<br>

> certainly shouldn’t be one!) on<br>

> the return fitting on the<br>

> top of the tank. <br>

> It seems that if the<br>

> only way<br>

> this<br>

> could happen is if the tank is filled so full the
level<br>

> is up into the fill<br>

> line with NO air in the tank at<br>

> all.<br>

> Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort<br>

> Canaveral, Florida<br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> On Jun 15, 2016, at 21:41,<br>

> amelliahona
<no_reply@yahoogroups.com><br>

> wrote:<br>

> Dominique:<br>

> I just replaced my<br>

> electric<br>

> priming<br>

> pump on my SM #335 Onan Genset. I did not
have<br>

> access at the time<br>

> to a proper FLARE NUT WRENCH when I did<br>

> this. I ended up distorting the<br>

> "B-nut" on the<br>

> small copper fuel line that goes<br>

> from the fuel pump to the<br>

> fuel filter adapter and could NOT<br>

> get a proper seal upon<br>

> replacing this line (a continuous<br>

> small seep of fuel that<br>

> was really annoying and messy).<br>

> I had to order a<br>

> replacement line (not that<br>

> expensive) and buy a proper set<br>

> of flare nut wrenches to<br>

> adequately get a seal. I wish I<br>

> could remember the size of the<br>

> flare nut but it was SAE (not<br>

> metric) sized. Make sure the<br>

> fuel tank is low on fuel<br>

> (think 250 liter will work)<br>

> otherwise a continuous stream of<br>

> fuel will flow by syphon from the<br>

> fuel tank fuel return line<br>

> while you make this plumbing<br>

> change. I managed to turn<br>

> this otherwise simple replacement<br>

> into a major project based<br>

> on A) not using the proper tools<br>

> to loosen and re-install<br>

> the B-nut of the fuel line, B)<br>

> not have lowered the fuel in<br>

> the tank (mine was full at the<br>

> time of my work).<br>

> <br>

> Good luck. The pump was<br>

> about<br>

> $65 as I<br>

> recall (not that expensive in the scheme of
things)<br>

> and the fuel line<br>

> was about $8<br>

> Sincerely, <br>

> Gary S. Silvers/v LiahonaAmel SM<br>

> #335 Puerto<br>

> Rico <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

> <br>

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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change

Bill Kinney <greatketch@...>
 

A valve there is not for convenience during repairs, although it would be that.

There shouldn’t be any way to empty the fuel tank into the bilge without a positive shut off in case of a broken hose or other disaster. The reason that Amel has a remote operated main fuel valve (and every other well designed boat as well) is so you can positively shut off fuel flow to the engine room in the event of a fire. Having a return line that syphon feeds fuel from the tank to a fire would totally defeat the purpose.

I do not doubt that you had fuel come out of the return line. I would expect it there. My engineering sense is that you saw the fuel in the line draining back, and not coming from the tank. Return lines would be full on the shutdown of the engine(s) and would likely stay that way. Draining back down to the fuel level in the tank through the injection pumps and lift pumps would take a very long time.

I have added a project to my endless list… disconnect the return line from the generator with a full fuel tank and closed main valve and see what happens. I expect to get about a liter of fuel out as the lines drain, and then no more. At least I hope that’s what happens!

On Jun 16, 2016, at 08:38, Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@rocketmail.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Hello Bill (SM#160),

At the time when it happened to me, I didn’t mention it on the forum as I couldn’t understand it (and kind of felt stupid to be honest), then others mention the same thing so I share my experience.

Yes, absolutely positive, it is coming from the “return” line, there was probably 4 liters of diesel overnight in the bilge (which I had to empty using cups, etc.) difficult to estimate because it was mix with the water in my bilge.

Personally I don’t feel worth the time to install a valve on the return line, it is much quicker to simply disconnect the hose that goes to it. In the 3.5 years of ownership, only needed to disconnect the return line once.

Wish I could help more…

Sincerely, Alexandre
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT
Club Nautico de San Juan, Puerto Rico




--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 6/16/16, Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, June 16, 2016, 7:13 AM












Alexandre
I am trying to understand what is
going on here… If it really is possible to syphon fuel
out of a half full tank via the return line, then putting a
shut off valve on it would become become a very high
priority safety project for me.
But if the tank is built the
way Amel drew it, then it is not possible for this to happen
without “magic”, and we are seeing something else
happening.
You describe a “drop by drop”
leak of fuel. How much total fuel leaked this way would
you guess? 10 liters? 5? Less than 1?
Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort Canaveral, Florida
On Jun 16, 2016, at 06:44,
Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@rocketmail.com
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:
Good morning Bill (SM
#160),

April 28, 2015 in reply to Mike
Ondra’s post, I reply:

my injectors (engine) were
removed to be check/rebuilt
Somehow fuel was still coming
drop by drop in the bilge compartment.
It did not make any
sense to me as the valve was off.
I realize the fuel
was coming from the “return” valve (which still
doesn’t make any sense… may be some type of suction or
syphon?)
So I
disconnected the return rubber fuel line to the tank, the
leak stop.

My tank was may be 1/2 full.

It happened to other people as
well.

One of these things hard to
understand but that you have to keep in mind.

Sincerely, Alexandre
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT
Club Nautico de San
Juan, Puerto Rico

--------------------------------------------
On Wed, 6/15/16,
Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners]
<amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:

Subject: Re: Re:
[Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after
fuel filter and oil change
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday,
June 15, 2016, 9:21 PM












I am puzzled…
How can the fuel
“syphon”
back
from the tank through the return line? Amel’s
drawing of the tank
does not show a dip tube (and there
certainly shouldn’t be one!) on
the return fitting on the
top of the tank.
It seems that if the
only way
this
could happen is if the tank is filled so full the level
is up into the fill
line with NO air in the tank at
all.
Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort
Canaveral, Florida






On Jun 15, 2016, at 21:41,
amelliahona <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:
Dominique:
I just replaced my
electric
priming
pump on my SM #335 Onan Genset. I did not have
access at the time
to a proper FLARE NUT WRENCH when I did
this. I ended up distorting the
"B-nut" on the
small copper fuel line that goes
from the fuel pump to the
fuel filter adapter and could NOT
get a proper seal upon
replacing this line (a continuous
small seep of fuel that
was really annoying and messy).
I had to order a
replacement line (not that
expensive) and buy a proper set
of flare nut wrenches to
adequately get a seal. I wish I
could remember the size of the
flare nut but it was SAE (not
metric) sized. Make sure the
fuel tank is low on fuel
(think 250 liter will work)
otherwise a continuous stream of
fuel will flow by syphon from the
fuel tank fuel return line
while you make this plumbing
change. I managed to turn
this otherwise simple replacement
into a major project based
on A) not using the proper tools
to loosen and re-install
the B-nut of the fuel line, B)
not have lowered the fuel in
the tank (mine was full at the
time of my work).

Good luck. The pump was
about
$65 as I
recall (not that expensive in the scheme of things)
and the fuel line
was about $8
Sincerely,
Gary S. Silvers/v LiahonaAmel SM
#335 Puerto
Rico











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<p>Hello Bill (SM#160), <br>
<br>
At the time when it happened to me, I didn’t mention it on the forum as I couldn’t understand it (and kind of felt stupid to be honest), then others mention the same thing so I share my experience. <br>
<br>
Yes, absolutely positive, it is coming from the “return” line, there was probably 4 liters of diesel overnight in the bilge (which I had to empty using cups, etc.) difficult to estimate because it was mix with the water in my bilge. <br>
<br>
Personally I don’t feel worth the time to install a valve on the return line, it is much quicker to simply disconnect the hose that goes to it. In the 3.5 years of ownership, only needed to disconnect the return line once. <br>
<br>
Wish I could help more… <br>
<br>
Sincerely, Alexandre<br>
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT<br>
Club Nautico de San Juan, Puerto Rico<br>
<br>
--------------------------------------------<br>
On Thu, 6/16/16, Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:<br>
<br>
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change<br>
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com<br>
Date: Thursday, June 16, 2016, 7:13 AM<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Alexandre<br>
I am trying to understand what is<br>
going on here… If it really is possible to syphon fuel<br>
out of a half full tank via the return line, then putting a<br>
shut off valve on it would become become a very high<br>
priority safety project for me.<br>
But if the tank is built the<br>
way Amel drew it, then it is not possible for this to happen<br>
without “magic”, and we are seeing something else<br>
happening.<br>
You describe a “drop by drop”<br>
leak of fuel. How much total fuel leaked this way would<br>
you guess? 10 liters? 5? Less than 1?<br>
Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort Canaveral, Florida<br>
On Jun 16, 2016, at 06:44,<br>
Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@rocketmail.com<br>
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com><br>
wrote:<br>
Good morning Bill (SM<br>
#160), <br>
<br>
April 28, 2015 in reply to Mike<br>
Ondra’s post, I reply: <br>
<br>
my injectors (engine) were<br>
removed to be check/rebuilt<br>
Somehow fuel was still coming<br>
drop by drop in the bilge compartment. <br>
It did not make any<br>
sense to me as the valve was off. <br>
I realize the fuel<br>
was coming from the “return” valve (which still<br>
doesn’t make any sense… may be some type of suction or<br>
syphon?)<br>
So I<br>
disconnected the return rubber fuel line to the tank, the<br>
leak stop. <br>
<br>
My tank was may be 1/2 full. <br>
<br>
It happened to other people as<br>
well. <br>
<br>
One of these things hard to<br>
understand but that you have to keep in mind. <br>
<br>
Sincerely, Alexandre<br>
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT<br>
Club Nautico de San<br>
Juan, Puerto Rico<br>
<br>
--------------------------------------------<br>
On Wed, 6/15/16,<br>
Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners]<br>
<amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com><br>
wrote:<br>
<br>
Subject: Re: Re:<br>
[Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after<br>
fuel filter and oil change<br>
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com<br>
Date: Wednesday,<br>
June 15, 2016, 9:21 PM<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
I am puzzled… <br>
How can the fuel<br>
“syphon”<br>
back<br>
from the tank through the return line? Amel’s<br>
drawing of the tank<br>
does not show a dip tube (and there<br>
certainly shouldn’t be one!) on<br>
the return fitting on the<br>
top of the tank. <br>
It seems that if the<br>
only way<br>
this<br>
could happen is if the tank is filled so full the level<br>
is up into the fill<br>
line with NO air in the tank at<br>
all.<br>
Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort<br>
Canaveral, Florida<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On Jun 15, 2016, at 21:41,<br>
amelliahona <no_reply@yahoogroups.com><br>
wrote:<br>
Dominique:<br>
I just replaced my<br>
electric<br>
priming<br>
pump on my SM #335 Onan Genset. I did not have<br>
access at the time<br>
to a proper FLARE NUT WRENCH when I did<br>
this. I ended up distorting the<br>
"B-nut" on the<br>
small copper fuel line that goes<br>
from the fuel pump to the<br>
fuel filter adapter and could NOT<br>
get a proper seal upon<br>
replacing this line (a continuous<br>
small seep of fuel that<br>
was really annoying and messy).<br>
I had to order a<br>
replacement line (not that<br>
expensive) and buy a proper set<br>
of flare nut wrenches to<br>
adequately get a seal. I wish I<br>
could remember the size of the<br>
flare nut but it was SAE (not<br>
metric) sized. Make sure the<br>
fuel tank is low on fuel<br>
(think 250 liter will work)<br>
otherwise a continuous stream of<br>
fuel will flow by syphon from the<br>
fuel tank fuel return line<br>
while you make this plumbing<br>
change. I managed to turn<br>
this otherwise simple replacement<br>
into a major project based<br>
on A) not using the proper tools<br>
to loosen and re-install<br>
the B-nut of the fuel line, B)<br>
not have lowered the fuel in<br>
the tank (mine was full at the<br>
time of my work).<br>
<br>
Good luck. The pump was<br>
about<br>
$65 as I<br>
recall (not that expensive in the scheme of things)<br>
and the fuel line<br>
was about $8<br>
Sincerely, <br>
Gary S. Silvers/v LiahonaAmel SM<br>
#335 Puerto<br>
Rico <br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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--zdrbemG7jDjPmN0qMjWyt2LsOBXHvF8st-UXkle--


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change

Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Hello Bill (SM#160),

At the time when it happened to me, I didn’t mention it on the forum as I couldn’t understand it (and kind of felt stupid to be honest), then others mention the same thing so I share my experience.

Yes, absolutely positive, it is coming from the “return” line, there was probably 4 liters of diesel overnight in the bilge (which I had to empty using cups, etc.) difficult to estimate because it was mix with the water in my bilge.

Personally I don’t feel worth the time to install a valve on the return line, it is much quicker to simply disconnect the hose that goes to it. In the 3.5 years of ownership, only needed to disconnect the return line once.

Wish I could help more…

Sincerely, Alexandre
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT
Club Nautico de San Juan, Puerto Rico




--------------------------------------------

On Thu, 6/16/16, Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, June 16, 2016, 7:13 AM


 









Alexandre
I am trying to understand what is
going on here…  If it really is possible to syphon fuel
out of a half full tank via the return line, then putting a
shut off valve on it would become become a very high
priority safety project for me.
 But if the tank is built the
way Amel drew it, then it is not possible for this to happen
without “magic”, and we are seeing something else
happening.
You describe a “drop by drop”
leak of fuel.  How much total fuel leaked this way would
you guess?  10 liters?  5?  Less than 1?
Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort Canaveral, Florida
On Jun 16, 2016, at 06:44,
Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@rocketmail.com
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:
Good morning Bill (SM
#160), 

April 28, 2015 in reply to Mike
Ondra’s post, I reply: 

my injectors (engine) were
removed to be check/rebuilt
Somehow fuel was still coming
drop by drop in the bilge compartment. 
It did not make any
sense to me as the valve was off.  
I realize the fuel
was coming from the “return” valve (which still
doesn’t make any sense… may be some type of suction or
syphon?)
So I
disconnected the return rubber fuel line to the tank, the
leak stop.  

My tank was may be 1/2 full.  

It happened to other people as
well.  

One of these things hard to
understand but that you have to keep in mind.  

Sincerely, Alexandre
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT
Club Nautico de San
Juan, Puerto Rico

--------------------------------------------
On Wed, 6/15/16,
Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners]
<amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:

Subject: Re: Re:
[Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after
fuel filter and oil change
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday,
June 15, 2016, 9:21 PM


 









I am puzzled…  
How can the fuel
“syphon”
back
from the tank through the return line?  Amel’s
drawing of the tank
does not show a dip tube (and there
certainly shouldn’t be one!) on
the return fitting on the
top of the tank.  
It seems that if the
only way
this
could happen is if the tank is filled so full the level
is up into the fill
line with NO air in the tank at
all.
Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort
Canaveral, Florida



  


On Jun 15, 2016, at 21:41,
amelliahona <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:
Dominique:
I just replaced my
electric
priming
pump on my SM #335 Onan Genset.  I did not have
access at the time
to a proper FLARE NUT WRENCH when I did
this.  I ended up distorting the
"B-nut" on the
small copper fuel line that goes
from the fuel pump to the
fuel filter adapter and could NOT
get a proper seal upon
replacing this line (a continuous
small seep of fuel that
was really annoying and messy).
  I had to order a
replacement line (not that
expensive) and buy a proper set
of flare nut wrenches to
adequately get a seal.   I wish I
could remember the size of the
flare nut but it was SAE (not
metric) sized.    Make sure the
fuel tank is low on fuel
(think 250 liter will work)
otherwise a continuous stream of
fuel will flow by syphon from the
fuel tank fuel return line
while you make this plumbing
change.  I managed to turn
this otherwise simple replacement
into a major project based
on A) not using the proper tools
to loosen and re-install
the B-nut of the fuel line, B)
not have lowered the fuel in
the tank (mine was full at the
time of my work).
 
Good luck.  The pump was
about
$65 as I
recall (not that expensive in the scheme of things)
and the fuel line
was about $8
Sincerely, 
Gary S. Silvers/v LiahonaAmel SM
#335    Puerto
Rico 











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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change

Bill Kinney <greatketch@...>
 

Alexandre

I am trying to understand what is going on here…  If it really is possible to syphon fuel out of a half full tank via the return line, then putting a shut off valve on it would become become a very high priority safety project for me.

 But if the tank is built the way Amel drew it, then it is not possible for this to happen without “magic”, and we are seeing something else happening.

You describe a “drop by drop” leak of fuel.  How much total fuel leaked this way would you guess?  10 liters?  5?  Less than 1?

Bill Kinney
SM#160 Harmonie
Port Canaveral, Florida

On Jun 16, 2016, at 06:44, Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Good morning Bill (SM #160), 

April 28, 2015 in reply to Mike Ondra’s post, I reply: 

my injectors (engine) were removed to be check/rebuilt
Somehow fuel was still coming drop by drop in the bilge compartment. 
It did not make any sense to me as the valve was off.  
I realize the fuel was coming from the “return” valve (which still doesn’t make any sense… may be some type of suction or syphon?)
So I disconnected the return rubber fuel line to the tank, the leak stop.  

My tank was may be 1/2 full.  

It happened to other people as well.  

One of these things hard to understand but that you have to keep in mind.  

Sincerely, Alexandre
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT
Club Nautico de San Juan, Puerto Rico

--------------------------------------------
On Wed, 6/15/16, Bill Kinney greatketch@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Wednesday, June 15, 2016, 9:21 PM


 









I am puzzled…  
How can the fuel “syphon”
back from the tank through the return line?  Amel’s
drawing of the tank does not show a dip tube (and there
certainly shouldn’t be one!) on the return fitting on the
top of the tank.  
It seems that if the only way
this could happen is if the tank is filled so full the level
is up into the fill line with NO air in the tank at
all.
Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort Canaveral, Florida



  


On Jun 15, 2016, at 21:41,
amelliahona <no_reply@...>
wrote:
Dominique:
I just replaced my electric
priming pump on my SM #335 Onan Genset.  I did not have
access at the time to a proper FLARE NUT WRENCH when I did
this.  I ended up distorting the "B-nut" on the
small copper fuel line that goes from the fuel pump to the
fuel filter adapter and could NOT get a proper seal upon
replacing this line (a continuous small seep of fuel that
was really annoying and messy).   I had to order a
replacement line (not that expensive) and buy a proper set
of flare nut wrenches to adequately get a seal.   I wish I
could remember the size of the flare nut but it was SAE (not
metric) sized.    Make sure the fuel tank is low on fuel
(think 250 liter will work) otherwise a continuous stream of
fuel will flow by syphon from the fuel tank fuel return line
while you make this plumbing change.  I managed to turn
this otherwise simple replacement into a major project based
on A) not using the proper tools to loosen and re-install
the B-nut of the fuel line, B) not have lowered the fuel in
the tank (mine was full at the time of my work).
 
Good luck.  The pump was about
$65 as I recall (not that expensive in the scheme of things)
and the fuel line was about $8
Sincerely, 
Gary S. Silvers/v LiahonaAmel SM #335    Puerto
Rico 











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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change

Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Good morning Bill (SM #160),

April 28, 2015 in reply to Mike Ondra’s post, I reply:

my injectors (engine) were removed to be check/rebuilt
Somehow fuel was still coming drop by drop in the bilge compartment.
It did not make any sense to me as the valve was off. 
I realize the fuel was coming from the “return” valve (which still doesn’t make any sense… may be some type of suction or syphon?)
So I disconnected the return rubber fuel line to the tank, the leak stop. 

My tank was may be 1/2 full.

It happened to other people as well.

One of these things hard to understand but that you have to keep in mind.

Sincerely, Alexandre
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT
Club Nautico de San Juan, Puerto Rico




--------------------------------------------

On Wed, 6/15/16, Bill Kinney greatketch@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, June 15, 2016, 9:21 PM


 









I am puzzled…  
How can the fuel “syphon”
back from the tank through the return line?  Amel’s
drawing of the tank does not show a dip tube (and there
certainly shouldn’t be one!) on the return fitting on the
top of the tank.  
It seems that if the only way
this could happen is if the tank is filled so full the level
is up into the fill line with NO air in the tank at
all.
Bill KinneySM#160 HarmoniePort Canaveral, Florida



  


On Jun 15, 2016, at 21:41,
amelliahona <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:
Dominique:
I just replaced my electric
priming pump on my SM #335 Onan Genset.  I did not have
access at the time to a proper FLARE NUT WRENCH when I did
this.  I ended up distorting the "B-nut" on the
small copper fuel line that goes from the fuel pump to the
fuel filter adapter and could NOT get a proper seal upon
replacing this line (a continuous small seep of fuel that
was really annoying and messy).   I had to order a
replacement line (not that expensive) and buy a proper set
of flare nut wrenches to adequately get a seal.   I wish I
could remember the size of the flare nut but it was SAE (not
metric) sized.    Make sure the fuel tank is low on fuel
(think 250 liter will work) otherwise a continuous stream of
fuel will flow by syphon from the fuel tank fuel return line
while you make this plumbing change.  I managed to turn
this otherwise simple replacement into a major project based
on A) not using the proper tools to loosen and re-install
the B-nut of the fuel line, B) not have lowered the fuel in
the tank (mine was full at the time of my work).
 
Good luck.  The pump was about
$65 as I recall (not that expensive in the scheme of things)
and the fuel line was about $8
Sincerely, 
Gary S. Silvers/v LiahonaAmel SM #335    Puerto
Rico 











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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Marina for wintering Greece

Ann-Sofie Svanberg <kanalmamman@...>
 

We have spent 2 winters in Aghios Nikolaos on Crete. A very nice place and with haul out possibilities. When hard weather from the north it gets bumby in the marina, but with a thourough mooring that is not a big issue. The staff patrols the pontoons several times a day, and is happy to check your boat. There is a rather big community in the marina during the winter.

Last winter we spent in Licata. If you are spending time on the boat during the winter months, I would recommend Licata before Ragusa. Licata doesn't close down during the winter, you have only a few minutes walk to supermarket and a few more to the city center. 

/Annsofie
S/Y Lady Annila, SM232, present in Portimao, Portugal

Skickat från min iPad

14 juni 2016 kl. 08:55 skrev mshirloo@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>:

 

Hello every one;


We are looking to winter somewhere in Greece for the 2016 season, probably from November 2016 to May 2017. We will be cruising the southern Aegean and possibly Crete. We have to haul out so we would need somewhere with reliable lifting capability. Availability of local services and supplies would be a plus. We will not be on board so would prefer to have a local person/company that can look after the boat and periodically turn on the engine, generator and other systems. Therefore we would prefer to be in the water.


I would appreciate recommendations for marinas you have used or have personal knowledge to be safe and reliable to winter in. Also I would like to hear pinions on pros and cons of leaving the boat in the water or on the hard. 


Thank you 


Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo 

Amel 54 #099


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel surveyor- Florida /osmosis

Germain Jean-Pierre <jgermain@...>
 

Hello Calby,

I’ve not seen earlier posts from you.  SOOOO welcome here.  It is an amazing resource!

Just a friendly reminder, no one knows who you are etc.. also this is a closed forum and registry is mandatory before posting is enabled.

Typically, everyone signs their posts with….

Their name, boat name and hull type and number.  This helps the other members determine if they can help.

Fair winds,


Jean-Pierre Germain
SY Eleuthera, SM 007


On 16 Jun 2016, at 07:47, 'calbyy@...' calbyy@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Just bought a Maramu nr 116 46' built 1982 ... boat had been afloat sin april 2014, moored idle since jan-2015. Fairly good condition on top, hull under covered in marine growth. Came our of water april 20, cleaned sanded showed numerous bubbles (1" dia average) which started bleeding. Measured humidity at 18% below water line 22% deeper down on hull, well above acceptable values. Surveyor confirmed heavy osmosis.
Kept boat on shore to dry until now june 2016, boat dried up (current values 15% humidity.
Results
1) amel boat are well built, humidity keeps on surface, does not creep under outside layers.
2) best way to reduce humidity is to keep boat in dry storage when not used for extended period.
3) osmosis on our boat was due to poor maintenance cheap (material work) antifouligs.
4) osmosis will not sink our boats.
Fair winds

Envoyé depuis Yahoo Mail pour Android



From: tdbladin@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>;
To: <amelyachtowners@...>;
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel surveyor- Florida
Sent: Wed, Jun 15, 2016 2:00:23 PM

 

Hi,

Our family is looking at the Amel 46' for sale in Stuart, Fl (SV Pura Vida).  Can anyone recommend a good Amel surveyor in the region?

Also, are hull blisters a common problem on this boat (1983 build).

It sure is an awesome boat!!

Thanks!
Doug
Melbourne Beach, FL




Jean-Pierre Germain,
SY Eleuthera, Amel Super Maramu 007
Porto Turistico Marina di Ragusa, Pontoon M15,
97100 Ragusa, Sicily, Italy
+44 7551 211 511
jp.germain@...


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change

Paul Osterberg
 

We have also experience the siphoned effect, next time the level is down we will install a close off valve on the return line 
It got rather messy last time we. Had to prime The Onan 
Paul on SYKerpa SM 259 


Re : [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel surveyor- Florida /osmosis

calbyy@yahoo.fr <calbyy@...>
 

Just bought a Maramu nr 116 46' built 1982 ... boat had been afloat sin april 2014, moored idle since jan-2015. Fairly good condition on top, hull under covered in marine growth. Came our of water april 20, cleaned & sanded showed numerous bubbles (1" dia average) which started bleeding. Measured humidity at 18% below water line & 22% deeper down on hull, well above acceptable values. Surveyor confirmed heavy osmosis.
Kept boat on shore to dry until now june 2016, & boat dried up (current values < 15% humidity.
Results
1) amel boat are well built, & humidity keeps on surface, does not creep under outside layers.
2) best way to reduce humidity is to keep boat in dry storage when not used for extended period.
3) osmosis on our boat was due to poor maintenance & cheap (material & work) antifouligs.
4) osmosis will not sink our boats.
Fair winds

Envoyé depuis Yahoo Mail pour Android



From: tdbladin@... [amelyachtowners] ;
To: ;
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel surveyor- Florida
Sent: Wed, Jun 15, 2016 2:00:23 PM

 

Hi,

Our family is looking at the Amel 46' for sale in Stuart, Fl (SV Pura Vida).  Can anyone recommend a good Amel surveyor in the region?

Also, are hull blisters a common problem on this boat (1983 build).

It sure is an awesome boat!!

Thanks!
Doug
Melbourne Beach, FL



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] DC cable sizing for larger charger

Ben and Gayle Super Maramu #347
 

Thanks Steve.  I agree.  Sixty Amps is max with my current DC cabling which would be a lot of work to upgrade.  We too are checking Marinas out in St George as Gayle and I may be going back to California for several months work.

Ben Driver
La Bella Vita
CG #1120066
SM #347

On Jun 14, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Stephen Davis flyboyscd@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Ben,

We have a Mastervolt 100 amp charger on Aloha, but have a different setup than you. We are hull #72, have a shorter cable run, and I went with 1/0 battery cable, which was a bit of an overkill. I think Bill's advice was excellent, and unless you are willing to up your cable size, you should probably stick to a smaller charger. Mastervolt also makes an 80 amp charger, and maybe the numbers would look a bit better with that. 

We are headed from Trinidad to Grenada tomorrow night, and will be at Port Louis Marina next to Rick and Linda on Rascal. Hope we can get together in Grenada. 

Regards,
Steve and Liz
Aloha SM72
Trinidad for not much longer...

On Jun 14, 2016, at 18:53, Ben Driver/YAHOO joedoakes66@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

It seems 100 amps will challenge my existing 25mm sq wiring.  Looks like I will keep it at 60 amp max 

Ben Driver
La Bella Vita
CG #1120066
SM #347

On Jun 14, 2016, at 11:33 AM, Kent Robertson karkauai@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

When I bought a new charger I went with a 60A.  The cables from the charger go through the forward starboard corner of the engine room, then under the raised "step" between the Nav station and passageway to the battery compartment.  In that area under the "step", they are encased in a very hard material and would be very hard to replace.  You would have to look at the specs required for your new charger to see if the existing ones are adequate for the amperage and distance.
Kent
SM243
Kristy


On Jun 14, 2016, at 10:46 AM, joedoakes66@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

I recently replaced my failed Dolhin 30 Amp charger with a Mastervolt 60 Amp charger.  I did not upgrade either th AC or DC wiring.  All seems to work well.  Now I'm considering replacing the 50 Amp charger with a Mastervolt 80 or 100 Amp unit.  I think AC input wire size is OK.   Amel used the same size wire for both 30 and 50 Amp units.  My concern is DC wire size.    Not sure but it appears to be 25mm sq. (3 AWG).  Again Amel used same size for both 30 and 50 Amp chargers.  My question is will this size wire support larger charger?  Or will I need upgrade to 35 or 50mm sq.?  Has anyone done this upgrade without wiring upgrade?


Ben Driver

La Blla Vita

SM 347

Prickly Bay Grenada





Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] GENSET ONAN CUMMINS cannot restart after fuel filter and oil change

Bill Kinney <greatketch@...>
 

I am puzzled…  

How can the fuel “syphon” back from the tank through the return line?  Amel’s drawing of the tank does not show a dip tube (and there certainly shouldn’t be one!) on the return fitting on the top of the tank.  

It seems that if the only way this could happen is if the tank is filled so full the level is up into the fill line with NO air in the tank at all.

Bill Kinney
SM#160 Harmonie
Port Canaveral, Florida




  



On Jun 15, 2016, at 21:41, amelliahona <no_reply@...> wrote:

Dominique:


I just replaced my electric priming pump on my SM #335 Onan Genset.  I did not have access at the time to a proper FLARE NUT WRENCH when I did this.  I ended up distorting the "B-nut" on the small copper fuel line that goes from the fuel pump to the fuel filter adapter and could NOT get a proper seal upon replacing this line (a continuous small seep of fuel that was really annoying and messy).   I had to order a replacement line (not that expensive) and buy a proper set of flare nut wrenches to adequately get a seal.   I wish I could remember the size of the flare nut but it was SAE (not metric) sized.    Make sure the fuel tank is low on fuel (think 250 liter will work) otherwise a continuous stream of fuel will flow by syphon from the fuel tank fuel return line while you make this plumbing change.  I managed to turn this otherwise simple replacement into a major project based on A) not using the proper tools to loosen and re-install the B-nut of the fuel line, B) not have lowered the fuel in the tank (mine was full at the time of my work).  

Good luck.  The pump was about $65 as I recall (not that expensive in the scheme of things) and the fuel line was about $8

Sincerely, 

Gary S. Silver
s/v Liahona
Amel SM #335    Puerto Rico