Date   

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] PredictWind

Brent Cameron
 


Re: PredictWind

svperegrinus@yahoo.com
 

There is a setting that you can use instead of actual polars where you more or less tell it how fast your boat goes under certain conditions.  Sort of the kid's version of the polars.  It's called "Sail", as opposed to "Predefined," which is where you find the '54.  We use "Sail".  It is what PW recommends for "cruising boats."

Since PW is not very accurate at all in the Med, what we do is we simply re-run and re-download the Weather Routing every few hours.  It's only usually like a 10K download: almost nothing.  Evidently you need to be under cellular range, or to have SSB or sat.  We have Iridium GO!

Peregrinus
SM2K #350 (2002)
Underway, Crete to Sicily



---In amelyachtowners@..., <sailw32@...> wrote :

I know many owners have PredictWind, a couple questions. Have you made passages following their routes, have they proved accurate. They  suggested using the 54's polars as they do not have it for the SM . Would they be similar enough to use for polars for the SM ? 

Thanks,

Pat SM#123


Re: PredictWind

Paul Osterberg
 

We use PW together with IGo very user friendly and good service. The problem I have is that you get 4 different forecasts, if I ask someone for an advice or opinion I want a straight answer, not four different. One can argue if three out of four show similar result thrust the three. I have at several occasions found that not to be true. Often when looking around you it does not blow as the PW routing forecast, then trusting the routing to send you to another point where the wind most likely is not what it is forecasted we tried but stoped very quick with that. When we make a longer crossing we set course so that our boat sails well and comfortable if the course is 20 or even 25 degree of corse we do not bother to much, sooner or later condition will give oss a cource that take us comfortable towards our destination. the forecast  we take for what it is an forecast, it gives the main direction and an aproximation of wind strength certainly very valuable and important for avoiding bad weather.

Paul on SY Kerpa SM 259


Costa Rica

JEFFREY KRAUS
 

Good Morning Amelians,

I was wondering if anyone has run up the Pacific coast up to Costa Rica after transiting the PC?

Jeff Spirit Amel 54 #14


PredictWind

Patrick McAneny
 

I know many owners have PredictWind, a couple questions. Have you made passages following their routes, have they proved accurate. They  suggested using the 54's polars as they do not have it for the SM . Would they be similar enough to use for polars for the SM ? 

Thanks,

Pat SM#123


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel 50 review

svperegrinus@yahoo.com
 

Thank you Ian and Judy for the heads up about the review.

I read Hare's article and appreciated her point of view.  She mentions the weaknesses of the design: high windage, required reliance on the bowthruster, defective passageway to the forward cabins while underway (which the company claims to have addressed in builds posterior to the hull sailed), and incomplete views of the sails, despite the pillarless windshield design and supplied cockpit roof hatches.

All boats are an exercise in compromises.

She also goes over the joys of it all:  the superior performance under all wind conditions, the riches of sailplan options, the joys of the enclosed cockpit, the ease of maintenance, the design details so the kitchen can be used in either tack, the trademark 5-star hotel experience, etc.

We haven't yet sailed the 50, though we did sail the 55 a few years ago.  My take is that these boats are what an updated Amel is supposed to look, perform, and work like.  Put another way: the 64, 55, and 50 are modern versions of what the Santorin Ketch and other Amels once were, decades ago.

Cheers,

Peregrinus
SM2K Nr. 350 (2002)
Underway, Crete to Sicily


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Oceanair Skyscreen

Paul Osterberg
 

This is the products we use keep mosquitoes out, it have even keep  some rats to stay In the cockpit, a few times we have found droppings from rats in the cockpit.


It is mesh fabric kept in place by lead weights type shotguns less

Paul on SY Kerpa SM 259


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Galapagos and Marquesas out of season. Pluses and minuses.

Porter McRoberts
 

Thank you Steve. All excellent points. 
I think we’ll know if we get the visa while in Panama, If not. We’ll then delay on the American continent. 
We’ve also considered the gambier islands for part of the time as well. Less rolly. Further south and outside the cyclone belt. Less heat. 
So it seems. 

Thanks for your thoughtful reply!

Porter


Excuse the errors.  
Sent from my IPhone 

On Mar 30, 2018, at 11:16 AM, Stephen Davis flyboyscd@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Porter,

I wish I had good answers, but instead have some questions. 

Are you fairly certain a 1 year visa is possible? Rene is Dutch, and his wife is Canadian. I wonder if he was able to get his wife a 1 yr visa due to the fact that he is an EU citizen. I had always heard the long stay visa for Americans was only 6 months instead of the standard 3 we normally get. I’ve also read that after the 2 visits required to the French embassy for the long stay Visa, it is not always granted on the spot, and you may not know if you actually have one until arriving in French Polynesia.  

I’d be a bit hesitant to rely on historic cyclone patterns when on the edge of the cyclone belt, as the weather patterns seem to be changing a bit as the ocean temps are rising. It also seems like a very long time to spend in the Marquesas, and would expect the off season part is going to be seriously hot, humid, and squally. 

We just sailed from Panama to Hawaii instead of our previously planned trip to FP this year to help out with my ill 94 year old father, and hope to Be headed that way via the Line islands in the 2019 season. Good luck with getting it all figured out, and let us all know what you discover. 

Regards,

Steve Davis
Aloha SM 72
KoOlina, Hawaii

On Mar 30, 2018, at 04:30, Porter McRoberts portermcroberts@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

I very much appreciate all the thoughtful insights in every regard, and so I propose these technical questions.

We are heavily considering a transit of the Canal in June.
We've had extensive discussions with Rene of Island Water World in St. Martin (who some may know) and others who argue for the Pacific approach outlined below.

It is based on 3 assumptions:

1. A US citizen can get a 1 year visa for French Polynesia in Panama at the French consulate there.
2. Entering Equador on the mainland, one can get an extended cruising permit with exit through the Galapagos with minimal fees over an extended time-period.
 and the third:

3. The Marquesas are outside the cyclone zone and should be considered a reasonable all weather destination.

Based on the above, and a fair amount of research on the web etc.  We are considering a transit in June, July.
Heading south along the west coast of S America, leaving the boat in Ecuador for an inland experience, then Galapagos and Marquesas late part of this year.  Early start on the westward cruising of the pacific in march/April 2019 toward New Zealand or Torres Straits.

Noting, while the Marquesas are on the cusp of cyclone territory, their location does not completely exclude them from circular storms, what storm options would we have with good intel.  We have and use iridium and predict wind a-lot with excellent outcomes for the past year. 

What thoughts, considerations, concerns and or advice might you have for this concept?

Very much appreciated!


Porter McRoberts
S/V Ibis: Amel 54-#152
Martinique









Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Oceanair Skyscreen

Mark Erdos
 

We were put off by the idea of the fixed screens because of the forward head hatch set up with the support bar. There is no way I could live without all the hatches matching perfectly – it is the OCD in me.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Guadeloupe

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Tuesday, April 3, 2018 7:26 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Oceanair Skyscreen

 

 

Those are great screens. You guys did a fantastic, economical job. 

 

The other reason for our interest in the Oceanair product is to replace our current hatch curtains. We had the Oceanair on our last boat and quite liked the recessed blackout blind feature.

Ian

S/V Loca Lola II 

SM153


On Apr 3, 2018, at 7:09 AM, 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Ian & Duane,

 

Save yourselves $1000 or $270 per hatch and make your own screens. We fabricated these out of starboard and glued mesh onto them with a hot-glue gun. They can be deployed from inside or outside the boat. They drop into and rest in the hatches. Very easy and cheap to make.

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Guadeloupe

www.creampuff.us


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Oceanair Skyscreen

Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Good morning Ian,

Sorry you never heard from the guy…

The only reference to the size is 1080.
Here is the original invoice:
http://www.nikimat.com/factures/2014_12_23_shopepal.jpg
That is for salon and forward cabin.

Therefore I think the newer model are slightly different (nicer) looking.

Sincerely, Alexandre



--------------------------------------------

On Mon, 4/2/18, Ian Townsend @LocaLola [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Oceanair Skyscreen
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Monday, April 2, 2018, 6:21 PM


 









I am interested in these screens as well.
Alexandre, do you remember the sizes you installed? Here is
why I ask...
In October, we had the
Oceanair rep on board in Fort Lauderdale to do the measuring
for these screens and possibly the other portlight curtains.
Once he left we never heard from him again despite several
calls/emails.
Ian
TownsendS/V Loca Lola
II SM153
On Apr 2,
2018, at 7:00 PM, Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
wrote:
















 






Here it is Duane,



http://www.nikimat.com/hatches_screen_oceanair.html



Therefore when I had the rat coming, he (or she) was able to
open the hatch, so I had to use pin to secure it.



I think the rat would be able to chew through it, as it
later tried to shew through the little mosquitoes mesh of
the small hatches.



For info, I had MRE (military meal ready to eat onboard),
the rat even chew through the heavy duty plastic…



So in short, I doubt the Ocean Skyscreen will prevent rat
invasion.



To reply your 2nd question: Yes I like them, very practical
to open the mosquito mesh in order to close the hatches. I
never used the black out fabric.



Yes I attached them to the wood trim of the salon and
forward cabins, and to close the little gap, I put a little
auto adhesive rubber.



Hope that helps…



Sincerely, Alexandre



--------------------------------------------

On Mon, 4/2/18, sailor63109@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
wrote:



Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Oceanair Skyscreen

To: amelyachtowners@...

Date: Monday, April 2, 2018, 3:08 PM





 



















I'm looking for anyone with

experience with the Oceanair Skyscreen on the

SuperMaramu?

As part of our

vermin-proofing of Wanderer (see previous post on Rats!),
we

want to put a screen on the ports and hatches that will
at

least make intrusion detectable without a making a
project

out of it (I have too many d@!!! projects

now!).  

The Oceanair Skyscreen for

the overhead hatches (excluding the head) seems like a
good

choice.  If you did buy them:- do you

like them?- did you attach them to the

wood trim in the main and forward cabins, or did you
remove

these trim pieces so the Skyscreen flange was flat
agains

the headliner?

Does anyone have another

suggestion for the overhead hatches?

Thanks,Duane


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Oceanair Skyscreen

Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Good morning Ian,

I did not put an Oceanair on the aft cabin as I already had a mosquito net for that hatch.

Sincerely, Alexandre




--------------------------------------------

On Mon, 4/2/18, Ian Townsend @LocaLola [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Oceanair Skyscreen
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Monday, April 2, 2018, 9:48 PM


 









Duane, yes I did look at Alexandre's
but that was sometime ago. I see (and recall) now Alexandre
has the sizes for main and forecabin. Thanks for
that.
Alexandre, did
you also put an Oceanair on the aft cabin hatch? This one is
a different size. Oceanair does make one that is close but
wanted to make sure it actually fits before we
ordered.

IanS/V Loca Lola
II SM153
On Apr 2,
2018, at 9:13 PM, sailor63109@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
wrote:
















 






Ian,
Did you
see Alexandres web site?  Search Defender for 1080
Oceanair, that's the main and forward cabins at
least.
Alexandre,
Thanks for the tip on Defender. 
Man, you must have one heck of a record keeping system!  I
checked Defender and the price is now $272, which is a 19%
increase in only three years!!! 
I know they won't slow a rat
down too much, but at least the little devil has to work a
bit for it.
I'm
still trying to catch mine.  Last night he left a few
little presents outside the aft cabin watertight door.  Peg
almost barfed when I showed her.  She is really viscerally
effected by the idea of a rat on the boat.  If it goes on
much longer I may be alone here.  I'm for putting out
poison and hoping it has a feast.  Peg is worried about the
smell, but if we have to go on for another month, I'm
for the two weeks with the smell of DEAD rat.
DuaneWanderer,
SM#477


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Oceanair Skyscreen

Ian Townsend
 

Those are great screens. You guys did a fantastic, economical job. 

The other reason for our interest in the Oceanair product is to replace our current hatch curtains. We had the Oceanair on our last boat and quite liked the recessed blackout blind feature.

Ian
S/V Loca Lola II 
SM153

On Apr 3, 2018, at 7:09 AM, 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Ian & Duane,

 

Save yourselves $1000 or $270 per hatch and make your own screens. We fabricated these out of starboard and glued mesh onto them with a hot-glue gun. They can be deployed from inside or outside the boat. They drop into and rest in the hatches. Very easy and cheap to make.

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Guadeloupe

www.creampuff.us


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Oceanair Skyscreen

Mark Erdos
 

Here is the pic if it didn't come through


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Oceanair Skyscreen

Mark Erdos
 

Ian & Duane,

 

Save yourselves $1000 or $270 per hatch and make your own screens. We fabricated these out of starboard and glued mesh onto them with a hot-glue gun. They can be deployed from inside or outside the boat. They drop into and rest in the hatches. Very easy and cheap to make.

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Guadeloupe

www.creampuff.us


Re: Oceanair Skyscreen

Paul Osterberg
 

Duane
We had mice in our house out on the country side. we put out poison and the numbers was greatly reduced, I do not know how many mice that past away, but all except one choose to pass away outside as they are searching for water. The one who choose to end it's day inside the house made a rather unpleasant smell, but it disappeared after just a few days. If you can't catch in a trapp then I would use poison most likely it will die outside else you will have a smell for probably a few days more than we had as a rat is bigger animal.
Rats do like beer, if you put a sizable amount of bear in a bucket, and then put some items that floats on top of the beer, I have seen it made with ordinary wine corks but anything that floats will work, such as foam from a yoga math. They can't climb out of the bucket if the bucket is high enough and drown rather quickly. It can be worth to offer some beer for a try. You can also put some kling film on top of the bucket with a hole in the middle that would also add to the complexity for the rat to escape.

Good luck

Paul on S/Y Kerpa SM#259


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Oceanair Skyscreen

Ian Townsend
 

Duane, yes I did look at Alexandre's but that was sometime ago. I see (and recall) now Alexandre has the sizes for main and forecabin. Thanks for that.

Alexandre, did you also put an Oceanair on the aft cabin hatch? This one is a different size. Oceanair does make one that is close but wanted to make sure it actually fits before we ordered.


Ian
S/V Loca Lola II 
SM153

On Apr 2, 2018, at 9:13 PM, sailor63109@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Ian,


Did you see Alexandres web site?  Search Defender for 1080 Oceanair, that's the main and forward cabins at least.

Alexandre,

Thanks for the tip on Defender.  Man, you must have one heck of a record keeping system!  I checked Defender and the price is now $272, which is a 19% increase in only three years!!! 

I know they won't slow a rat down too much, but at least the little devil has to work a bit for it.

I'm still trying to catch mine.  Last night he left a few little presents outside the aft cabin watertight door.  Peg almost barfed when I showed her.  She is really viscerally effected by the idea of a rat on the boat.  If it goes on much longer I may be alone here.  I'm for putting out poison and hoping it has a feast.  Peg is worried about the smell, but if we have to go on for another month, I'm for the two weeks with the smell of DEAD rat.

Duane
Wanderer, SM#477


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] BOAT GRAPHICS - FLOTATION LINE COLOR

 

SM Red Line was simply the last Super Maramus trying out the 54 colors. The last 54s tried out the 55 colors.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus
Amel School www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970

On Mon, Apr 2, 2018, 20:04 'sailormon' kimberlite@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Hi,

When Kimberlite was delivered to me the boot stripe was a light orange.

I had Amel outfit the entire electronics suite with Raymarine instruments.

 

I believe that is what the red line boats were all about—the deluxe package and Raymarine instruments.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2018 2:36 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] BOAT GRAPHICS - FLOTATION LINE COLOR

 

 

I think the line on the SM is a color that straddles the line between red and orange, so it's a bit of a matter of opinion.  Though maybe mine has faded.

 

If you go with a vinyl boat name (I would), be sure you get "high performance" vinyl.  I used a local sign shop for the name on my previous boat, and it lasted about 4 years with regular, outdoor-rated vinyl.  I had the same shop make lettering for my dinghy, and they used high performance vinyl because it would be subject to inflating/deflating.  It's still going strong after 7 years, most of that spent in the weather on davits.  I've since received the same advice from a family friend who runs a (different) sign shop -- the high performance stuff should last about 10 years, and isn't much more expensive.

 

Thanks,

Ryan

SM 233 Iteration

Boston, MA, USA

 

 

On Mon, Apr 2, 2018 at 2:02 PM, Bill Rouse brouse@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

I thought the original waterline color on all Maramus was Orange???

 

Best,

 

 

 

On Sun, Apr 1, 2018 at 3:42 PM, alex.paquin@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hello,

Again, in reference to the hull´s refurbishing project, I´d like to hear your thoughts on the following:

 

1. Should we paint the waterline with the traditional/original red stripe? we are going to use gelcoat to apply it. Should we consider any other color?

 

2 Boat name on the transom: until now I have used the original Amel plaque used in the 80´s for the boat´s name and port of registration, should we migrate to other type of system? Decals? Printed graphics? Who is a good supplier in the USA.

 

3. By law in Venezuela the boat´s name and registration number must be on the bow, both starboard and port.

 

Alex Paquin

s/v SIMPATICO

Older Maramu hull #94, 1981



 

--

 

 


Re: Airmar P79 Installation

Duane Siegfri
 

Bill,

Thanks.  I would bet it is paint, why brush on gelcoat?  and then it has to come off.

Duane
Wanderer, SM#477

"Everything is harder on a boat" - Noah


Re: Oceanair Skyscreen

Duane Siegfri
 

Ian,

Did you see Alexandres web site?  Search Defender for 1080 Oceanair, that's the main and forward cabins at least.

Alexandre,

Thanks for the tip on Defender.  Man, you must have one heck of a record keeping system!  I checked Defender and the price is now $272, which is a 19% increase in only three years!!! 

I know they won't slow a rat down too much, but at least the little devil has to work a bit for it.

I'm still trying to catch mine.  Last night he left a few little presents outside the aft cabin watertight door.  Peg almost barfed when I showed her.  She is really viscerally effected by the idea of a rat on the boat.  If it goes on much longer I may be alone here.  I'm for putting out poison and hoping it has a feast.  Peg is worried about the smell, but if we have to go on for another month, I'm for the two weeks with the smell of DEAD rat.

Duane
Wanderer, SM#477


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Rescueing method of casualty (Person Over Board)

eric freedman
 

Thank you James,

I always felt the bringing the MOB on board as quickly as possible was the thing to do.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2018 3:29 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Rescueing method of casualty (Person Over Board)

 

 

I would like to add to this discussion with respect strictly to medical management and considerations. 

The vast majority of you have far greater sailing experience than me, and I think this is an engaging discussion. 

 

 

In the case of severe hypothermia (below 30 C core temp), the primary risk of death is from cardiac dysrhythmia, and specifically ventricular fibrillation. 

The risk of this is particularly high when actively rewarming the patient from an even lower temperature through that critical range around 25 a 30 centigrade. 

Another risk of causing cardiac dysrhythmia is from excessive manipulation of the patient - that is, moving the patient. 

 

The idea that placing the patient vertically predisposes to dysrhythmia is not accurate. Indeed, placing a hypotensive patient in a head up position may cause loss of consciousness, but not cardiac arrest necessarily. 

 

The act of extricating a severely hypothermic patient from immersion - in any manner - may trigger a dysrhythmia. Position is not a primary concern. In fact, there is higher likelihood of addition trauma in a horizontal position. 

 

The fundamental principles, therefore, should still be performing the most expeditious method of extrication with the least amount of trauma or jostling, maintaining safety of the other crew, and immediate attempts at rewarming.  

 

For those who have experience, bretyllium given intravenously can possibly help control a possible dysrhythmia. However, this is no longer available in the US.  And only a physician should administer this. In that case,  prolonged CPR is your only option for salvage in the field. You do not stop until body temp is normalized or you meet exhaustion. 

 

As we say in medicine, “you’re not dead until you’re WARM and dead.” 

 

 

James

Soteria SM 347


On Apr 2, 2018, at 11:07 AM, 'Jean Boucharlat' jean.boucharlat@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Bill,

 

I must say that I support entirely your thinking.

In my case this is based upon a very limited experience (once only) retrieving a windsurfer who had drifted away in a squall and be separated from his board. The water was relatively warm, probably around 18° C, and the man had been drifting for 20 to 30 minutes. He was already starting to suffer from hypothermia and our only objective (3 on board) was to get him out of the water as soon as possible and down below to warm him up. Very fortunately we succeeded without even giving a thought to the lifting position.

 

Last year in its September issue, Yachting Monthly had a very informative article, based upon actual MOB retrieval exercises in calm waters. Their objective was to debunk various myths propagated by well intentioned souls. I am quoting here directly from this article:

 

Quote

MYTH 14: The MOB has to be lifted in the horizontal position...There is no increased risk of heart attack if the MOB is lifted vertically. ln most waters of the world, death from hypothermia occurs long before any dangerous peripheral vascular bed failure develops. The whole concept of peripheral vascular failure being caused by surface-type immersion is a myth. At the surface, it would take days to develop.

Unquote

 

My halfpenny worth,

 

Jean Boucharlat

Formerly SM 232

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: lundi 2 avril 2018 15:55
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups..com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Rescueing method of casualty (Person Over Board)

 

 

Phillipe,

 

I stand by my thinking that the horizontal lift is impractical recommendation for a shorthanded cruising boat.  For demonstrating in a class with 5 or 6 students and an instructor, that's a different story.  There are not very many places where I disagree with the smart and thoughtful people of the RYA, and this is the only one I can think of that is of real importance.

 

Any person at REAL risk of cardiac arrest in cold water will be totally unable to help with rigging anything themselves.  Putting another person in the water is VERY dangerous in and of itself, and would require a yacht crewed by at least 4 or, more likely, 5 people to justify the increased risks. As the captain of a boat, I would be very, very reluctant to put a second crew member in the water.  I might do it...but only as a last possible resort.

 

If the person in the water is coordinated enough to rig their own horizontal lifting harness they are not yet hypothermic and do not need it.  Get them out of the water NOW before they do!

 

Rigging a leg lifting strap as shown in that video when you are in the water is a LOT harder if you are not in a full survival suit, with your legs floating at the surface. If you ARE in a full survival suit, you are (most likely) not hypothermic, and do not need it...

 

When we did our testing, I was in a wetsuit.  It was important for us to keep in mind that some things were much easier in a wetsuit because of the buoyancy, and others were more difficult.

 

Even for a victim who is fully conscious, if they are lifted horizontally they are now unable to usefully fend off from the rolling hull themselves, and you need another crew member dedicated to that task.  A person lifted vertically, with a halyard (not a boom!) between hull and face will not hit the hull in a dangerous way short of extreme rolling conditions.

 

I do understand the rational for the RYA's suggestion, and I still think it is unrealistically complicated for use in the real world on a yacht with sailing with only 2 or 3 people.  The extra time required for it in most cases I believe INCREASES risks of all kinds to both victim and crew.

 

That's all I have to say on the matter, except for...  whatever you plan on doing, you should try it in warm calm water first. In the testing we did we found LOTS of suggestions including many that have been widely published were marginally practical--at best.

 

Bill Kinney

SM160, Harmonie

Moraine Cay, Abacos, Bahamas.

 

 

 

 

 

 



---In amelyachtowners@..., <philipp.sollberger@....> wrote :

Dear Amel Yacht Owners,

 

Many thanks to all for your clear answers and experience.

 

For me it is still important to precise, that a horizontal lift up of an unconsious person from the water is better than a vertical one. The risk of a heart stop is bigger, if the warm blood circulates down to the extremities as legs and the cold flows back to heart. This can end in a cardiatic arrest.

The method to do a horizontal lift up is not so complicated as mentioned. I have learnt it at the UKSA in Cowes. Use the lifeline of the person in the water and put it under his or her bottom and clip it either to the lifesling hook or to the halyard directly.

With big waves you have to protect the casualty that he or she is not bashing to the hull and for this reason you lower a crew member which is fixed to the yacht by lifeline and halyard. Afterwards you can lift them up both. The casualty in a horizontal way and the crew member vertically. With this method you have the most possible protecting method to get both back on deck..

 

The lifeline method you can test yourself very easily and with no risk. lie down on deck with your lifewest on and your lifeline.. Take the halyard, fix it on the hook of the lifewest and take the lifeline, put it under the bottom through and take it and fix it to the halyard shakle or the lifewest hook. If all is fix, then lift up for half to one meter and you will get the proof, that you are hanging quite horizontally on the halyard.

 

Thank you very much Bill Rouse for your confirmation about the strength of the halyards.

 

Person over board is a subject, that nobody wants to happen. But unfortunately it happens on the rally round the world race as VOR and Clipper Race last time.

 

There are different videos on youtube which show, that you should lower a rescuer for getting the casualty fixed to the yacht.

Here is a link from RNLI Lifeboat UK with a demonstration of lifting up horizontally with the lifeline as second strope: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4q1-Qb-6bBw&t=13s 

Here is the link to the latest person overboard during Clipper Race: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufvGp3c7vuA 

 

Try to avoid such situations with being attached to the boat if you a leaving the central cockpit area in foul weather or night. Clip you on as early as possible.

 

Fair winds and never an overboard case.

 

Philipp

Félicie, SM #124