Date   

New file uploaded to amelyachtowners

amelyachtowners@...
 

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amelyachtowners
group.

File : /ZF 25 Transmission/ZF 25_INSTALLATION DRAWING_3315600010-1.pdf
Uploaded by : mariner62@ymail.com <trifin@soundthinking.com.au>
Description : Installation drawing received from ZF showing correct fluid capacity of 3.0L

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/files/ZF%2025%20Transmission/ZF%2025_INSTALLATION%20DRAWING_3315600010-1.pdf

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398

Regards,

mariner62@ymail.com <trifin@soundthinking.com.au>


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] ZF25 Transmission Dipstick / Fluid Level

Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Thanks so much for the info, which is critical.

That is absolutely crazy a company such as ZF could make such mistake and not (really) address it for so many years…
All manufacturers should have been warn about that with the proper dipstick sent…

Alexandre



--------------------------------------------

On Tue, 7/24/18, trifin@soundthinking.com.au [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] ZF25 Transmission Dipstick / Fluid Level
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, July 24, 2018, 6:38 AM


 









IMPORTANT NOTICE
To all Amel Owners,
I have recently had a failure event with
my ZF25 gearbox. You can read about it further in Topic
#41215 on this forum.  In that failure event, the dipstick
for my ZF25 was damaged, and so I needed some means of
checking fluid level until a new dipstick was
delivered.
I then embarked on
a very confusing 2 week journey of trying to determine
independently where the correct fluid level should be in a
ZF25 gearbox without reference to a dipstick. The results of
this are very significant for Amel owners with ZF25
gearboxes.
Please note the
following:
1. ZF Marine have
informed me that ALL user manuals, parts lists, service
manuals, brochures, marketing specs, website data etc for
the ZF25 gearbox which state that the fluid capacity of the
gearbox is 2.0Litres, are all incorrect.  
2. The correct fluid level for the ZF25
gearbox is 3.0L, but this figure only appears in the
original installation drawing of the ZF25 (in Italian),
which ZF sent to me and I will post on the forum files
archive.  
3. Some owners
will already suspect that it is really a 3L box because they
will add 2.0L as specified in the manual, and then wonder
why they needed to add another full litre to bring it up to
the top of their dipstick. These owners have a
"short" dipstick and can rest easy.
4. However, some owners will add 2.0l
and find that its already close to the full mark on their
dipstick.  If you are one of those owners then this message
is addressed to you.
5. I know
that some Amel 54 models have been supplied with an
incorrect dipstick.  This dipstick is too long and reads
"full" when 2 litres of fluid is present in the
gearbox. These boats have been operating one litre short of
fluid, which equates to a fluid level which is about 20mm
too low.
7. I do not know who
made the change of dipstick in the production process of
these boats, but I can guess why they made the change, that
is to try and match the disptick to the 2litre capacity
widely published by ZF.
I urge
all owners to check your dipstick against the following
information:
If you have a
dipstick with part numbers
3312-301-028 or 3312-201-002 
then you have the wrong dipstick and
your ZF25 is at risk of damage due to low fluid
level.
If you have a dipstick
with part numbers 
3311-301-003 or 3311-201-001
then you have the correct dipstick and
you will have the correct 3.0l of fluid in your
gearbox.
If you have already
experienced the failure and have replaced your gearbox with
a new one from ZF, then you will most likely have the
correct dipstick. 
Finally,
as an absolute measure, the correct fluid level is between
84.5mm and 96.5mm from the mating face of the dipstick
hole. 
I do not know if this
problem ever affected SM production, but I do know that the
documentation error from ZF was present in 2002. 
I am collating a private list of hull
numbers which have been affected by this issue, and I would
really appreciate if owners would email me privately on the
email belowor simply post here on the
forum.
I'd like to know
your hull number and :1. whether you have the long
(incorrect) dipstick and if you've had transmission
troubles,2. If you have the short (correct) dipstick,
have you renewed your transmission (or dipstick) since the
the boat was delivered new.

Thank
youDr Dean GilliesSY STELLAAMEL 54
#154+61 411 967106trifin (at) soundthinking
(dot) com (dot) au


Re: ZF25 Transmission Failure

Duane Siegfri
 

One reason for the transmission heating up "could be" that your transmission oil cooler is compromised.  You said the dipstick was melted and since there was no leakage of fluid, you assumed that it was still full of transmission fluid.

I had a similiar problem with my Amel SM.  The cooler developed a hole in the cooler tubes that permitted the seawater and the transmission fluid to mix.  Eventually the hole in the cooler tubes was big enough, that the suction from the engine seawater pump sucked the fluid out of the transmission.  Prior to the complete failure of the transmission, the seawater mixed with the transmission fluid and rusted the inner workings of the transmission.  So, in my case, the transmission had to be replaced.

Have you ever noticed that the engine exhaust/water leaves an oil sheen on the water?

Pull some of the fluid out of the transmission and see if it looks right, or is milky or watery.

Here's the thing, if you have to replace the transmission, be sure to replace the transmission cooler.  I'm not sure of a reasonable interval to replace them, but for $200 or so, it's good insurance.  Mine failed at about 2,000 engine hours.

Duane
Wanderer, SM#477


ZF25 Transmission Dipstick / Fluid Level

Dean Gillies
 

IMPORTANT NOTICE


To all Amel Owners,


I have recently had a failure event with my ZF25 gearbox. You can read about it further in Topic #41215 on this forum.  In that failure event, the dipstick for my ZF25 was damaged, and so I needed some means of checking fluid level until a new dipstick was delivered.


I then embarked on a very confusing 2 week journey of trying to determine independently where the correct fluid level should be in a ZF25 gearbox without reference to a dipstick. The results of this are very significant for Amel owners with ZF25 gearboxes.


Please note the following:


1. ZF Marine have informed me that ALL user manuals, parts lists, service manuals, brochures, marketing specs, website data etc for the ZF25 gearbox which state that the fluid capacity of the gearbox is 2.0Litres, are all incorrect.  


2. The correct fluid level for the ZF25 gearbox is 3.0L, but this figure only appears in the original installation drawing of the ZF25 (in Italian), which ZF sent to me and I will post on the forum files archive.  


3. Some owners will already suspect that it is really a 3L box because they will add 2.0L as specified in the manual, and then wonder why they needed to add another full litre to bring it up to the top of their dipstick. These owners have a "short" dipstick and can rest easy.


4. However, some owners will add 2.0l and find that its already close to the full mark on their dipstick.  If you are one of those owners then this message is addressed to you.


5. I know that some Amel 54 models have been supplied with an incorrect dipstick.  This dipstick is too long and reads "full" when 2 litres of fluid is present in the gearbox. These boats have been operating one litre short of fluid, which equates to a fluid level which is about 20mm too low.


7. I do not know who made the change of dipstick in the production process of these boats, but I can guess why they made the change, that is to try and match the disptick to the 2litre capacity widely published by ZF.


I urge all owners to check your dipstick against the following information:


If you have a dipstick with part numbers


3312-301-028 or 3312-201-002 


then you have the wrong dipstick and your ZF25 is at risk of damage due to low fluid level.


If you have a dipstick with part numbers 


3311-301-003 or 3311-201-001


then you have the correct dipstick and you will have the correct 3.0l of fluid in your gearbox.


If you have already experienced the failure and have replaced your gearbox with a new one from ZF, then you will most likely have the correct dipstick. 


Finally, as an absolute measure, the correct fluid level is between 84.5mm and 96.5mm from the mating face of the dipstick hole. 


I do not know if this problem ever affected SM production, but I do know that the documentation error from ZF was present in 2002. 


I am collating a private list of hull numbers which have been affected by this issue, and I would really appreciate if owners would email me privately on the email below

or simply post here on the forum.


I'd like to know your hull number and :

1. whether you have the long (incorrect) dipstick and if you've had transmission troubles,

2. If you have the short (correct) dipstick, have you renewed your transmission (or dipstick) since the the boat was delivered new.



Thank you

Dr Dean Gillies

SY STELLA

AMEL 54 #154

+61 411 967106

trifin (at) soundthinking (dot) com (dot) au



ZF25 Transmission Failure

Dean Gillies
 

Hi All,

After load testing this morning I am 99% sure my ZF25 transmission has failed.  

I know the root cause of the failure, and I will publish separately on that issue later.


I'm told by the ZF representatives that a new transmission will take at least 3 months to supply.  

I don't want to entertain re-conditioning of this box because I know the root cause of the problem.


Our sailing season is over before it started, the admiral is devastated and has lost all confidence in the boat.  We will most likely winterise the boat and go home soon. 

 

However, before I do that I'd like to convert that 99% to 100%, to be absolutely certain that the problem is the gearbox.  I'm finding it difficult to get the required level of professional support here in Kalamata, so I'm hoping for some sage guidance from the group. 


So, the symptoms...


Two weeks ago we started motoring due to no wind. Flat sea, running about 1700-1800rpm.

I started hearing some "modulation" of the engine tone, like wandering RPM. 


I also noticed the disappearance of a "rattle/chatter" sound which has always come from our Morse Control.  It's not a loud rattle, but is clearly transmitted from the gearbox up the gearshift cable and resonates from the hand control unit. (Is that a standard thing - or an early symptom of a gearbox problem?)


I thought we had something stuck on the propeller, so we stopped and I checked it. Nothing.

We started again and the boat would not run up to normal speeds for the RPM we were using.


We stopped again, and I checked the engine room once more. Fluids ok, no leaks, nothing looked out of the ordinary.  So  we continued and I increased the RPM to about 2000-2100, and continued on making only about 4 knots.


After 10 minutes or so, I opened the engine room again to check, and was met with an outburst of smoke, burning smell and everything was very hot.  After stopping and investigating further I found the cause of the overheat was that the shaft brake was stuck closed.  The ZF 25 gearbox was also very hot, and when I opened it to check the fluid again the lower part of the dipstick was melted into an elongated blob of plastic.   

There was no fluid leakage, so I assumed that the fluid  level was still ok. 


I found out how to undo the shaft brake, and wedged a spanner in it to make sure it stayed open. By then everything was cooled down and we proceeded to motor slowly to shore at about 1200rpm. Interestingly the "rattle" mentioned above was back.


We flushed and changed fluids and ran the boat gently for a day or two until we got to a marina.  


On testing the boat, we find that all is well until we exceed 2000rpm. Quite quickly after running at 2100rpm our little rattle stops, then the engine noise starts to waver and sounds like it it reducing in rpm, although the digital readout of rpm does not change from 2100rpm. The boat then starts to slow down from the 8.3 knots it was travelling at with 2000rpm. It drops a couple of knots.  On checking the shaft brake at this point it is still open so that is not the reason for slowing.  If I increase the engine power, we get no more thrust from the propeller.


After this happens, I struggle to generate thrust even at lower rpm.  Leaving everything to cool down completely appears to reset the problem. The rattle comes back, low RPM operation is ok, but when loaded up the gearbox seems to be failing.


The one thing which is niggling in my head is that the engine rpm sounds like it momentarily drops down when this problem occurs, although the rpm readout does not change. However, I can easily increase the engine RPM by pushing the lever, it just does not transfer to the prop, which seems to me like gearbox trouble.


All comments/suggestions appreciated.  We don't really want to give up on our summer cruising, and apart from that its cold back in Sydney!


Thanks all.

Dean

SY Stella 

Amel 54#154





   

 


Re: Freshwater Pump - cycles rapidly

Dean Gillies
 

Thanks Alan
Sounds like the Marco pump is the way to go.
I will get to that - at this stage I have bigger problems on my plate ... but that's a whole other topic!
Cheers
Dean


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] SVRascal

Jean-Pierre's MacBook Air <jgermain@...>
 

Hello Rick& Linda,

Hold the sale… turn her around through the Panama Canal and the Pacific.. thats where you belong :-)

But.. again its your decision to swallow the anchor.

Big hugs to both of you.


Jean-Pierre Germain, Eleuthera, SM007

On 23 Jul 2018, at 13:54, 'Rick Grimes' rickgrimes1@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


Hello Amel Forum Friends,

 

We want to let you know that, in the next few weeks, Rascal is going to be listed for sale by a broker.  IN THE INTERIM, we are offering Rascal for sale for a fixed price of $289,000.  Offers less than $289,000 will not be considered.  If you know anyone who may be interested, please ask them to contact me at +1-609-932-2307 and/or visit the link below for more detail.  

Rascal is a 2003 Amel Super Maramu 2000, Hull #404 and is ready to cruise.  See this link: www.svrascal.com/rascal-listing.html

 

Rick and Linda Grimes

 

 




Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] SVRascal

Stephen Davis
 

Seems like a great idea to me...if your steering works, I might buy her. 

Steve

On Jul 23, 2018, at 13:54, 'Rick Grimes' rickgrimes1@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hello Amel Forum Friends,

 

We want to let you know that, in the next few weeks, Rascal is going to be listed for sale by a broker.  IN THE INTERIM, we are offering Rascal for sale for a fixed price of $289,000.  Offers less than $289,000 will not be considered.  If you know anyone who may be interested, please ask them to contact me at +1-609-932-2307 and/or visit the link below for more detail. 

Rascal is a 2003 Amel Super Maramu 2000, Hull #404 and is ready to cruise.  See this link: www.svrascal.com/rascal-listing.html

 

Rick and Linda Grimes

 

 


SVRascal

Rick Grimes
 

Hello Amel Forum Friends,

 

We want to let you know that, in the next few weeks, Rascal is going to be listed for sale by a broker.  IN THE INTERIM, we are offering Rascal for sale for a fixed price of $289,000.  Offers less than $289,000 will not be considered.  If you know anyone who may be interested, please ask them to contact me at +1-609-932-2307 and/or visit the link below for more detail. 

Rascal is a 2003 Amel Super Maramu 2000, Hull #404 and is ready to cruise.  See this link: www.svrascal.com/rascal-listing.html

 

Rick and Linda Grimes

 

 


Re: Freshwater Pump - cycles rapidly

Alan Leslie
 

The bladders in those accumulators are replaceable. We carried spares and changed them twice.
Last year we replaced the original pump with a Marco UP14E which is much smaller than the original contraption and supplies constant high flow. Very happy with it. We too wash decks, dodger, covers etc with the cockpit hose fresh water.
Would definitely recommend changing to a Marco pump.
Cheers
Alan
Elyse SM437 Yasawa-i-rara, Fiji


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Steering Failure on 1992 SM72 "Aloha"

Patrick McAneny
 

No problem Steve, glad to help anyway I can, let me know if you need anything else.
Pat
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Davis flyboyscd@... [amelyachtowners]
To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Mon, Jul 23, 2018 3:59 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Steering Failure on 1992 SM72 "Aloha"

 
Hi Pat,

I just received the template you made, and really appreciate the effort you went to. It will make the job much easier.

Thanks,
Steve
S/V Aloha

On Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 2:25 PM Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 
Steve, I am glad you have the same layout. No worries about the mailing ,my treat. We'll get everything on the way to you asap.
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Davis flyboyscd@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Mon, Jul 16, 2018 7:34 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Steering Failure on 1992 SM72 "Aloha"

 
Thanks Pat...it is greatly appreciated. We have modified our aft stateroom a bit by removing the fiberglass liners on both sides, building the berth on the port side out to King size at the head and queen at the foot, and adding new cabinetry on the stbd side. With that said, the area under the port berth where the drive will go, is not changed in any way that will cause an issue. 

I’ll give you my Hawaii address below, and please let me know if I can send you a check or do a pay pal to reimburse you for mailing cost... 

Aloha,

Steve

Steve Davis
95-464 Kaelo Place
Mililani, Hawaii 96789

Cell: 510-908-1835

Steve Davis
S/V Aloha

On Jul 16, 2018, at 12:33 PM, Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Steve, It is a pretty straight forward solution ,uses no usable space and does not require cutting out any structural components . Remember you need a 24 v linear drive with the long arm. You will also want to buy an A/B switch , in order to switch back and forth between the rotary and linear drive. I will send photo of that as well.I will very soon take many more photos and measurements for you . Do you have the same layout as I do, with the berth to port ? I will try to make a template of the extension arm . Would you have an address , I could mail it to you? By the way, congratulations on making a long passage and dealing well through your steering issue. 
Pat
SM Shenanigans



-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Davis flyboyscd@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Mon, Jul 16, 2018 4:50 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Steering Failure on 1992 SM72 "Aloha"

 
Patrick, I have looked at the photo section, and your technique, seems the most simple of the 2 different methods I’ve seen this done with an older SM. We are definitely going to do the job with your method, but not until we get the steering fixed. Any dimensions or template for the quadrant extension would save me a lot of time and energy trying to re-invent the wheel. Since I have the steering apart now, I may start to do some of the legwork in the near future. Whenever you have to time, I’d greatly appreciate it if you can send me what you have. 

Thanks,

Steve Davis
S/V Aloha

On Jul 16, 2018, at 9:39 AM, Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Steve, Rather than fabricating a new quadrant , which would have been necessary had we attempted to replicate Amels original installation , I only had to fabricate an extension arm and weld it to the existing quadrant .  The design and installation on my boat went very smoothly , easy to do and has proven to work well for thousands of miles . After looking at your options ,if you chose to do an installation such as I did , I will be glad to supply you with more pictures and measurements , perhaps even a template of the extension arm.. Have you looked at the photo section , I just did and there is a couple of pics that shows clearly what I did . Let me know if you go this route, and I will help in any way I can. 
Good Luck,
Pat 
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: flyboyscd@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Mon, Jul 16, 2018 2:14 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Steering Failure on 1992 SM72 "Aloha"

 
 Hi Patrick,

Thanks for your response regarding our steering. We have it on our very long list while in Hawaii this year to add a linear drive. Do you have any specs on how you modified the quadrant on the drive attachment side?  Any info you have on this would be a big help in figuring out how to make the modification.

If you want to email me directly, try flyboyscd at gmail dot com.

Thanks,

Steve
Aloha SM 72


Re: Freshwater Pump - cycles rapidly

Dean Gillies
 

It’ll be interesting to see if mine fails shortly after this event Jean-Pierre. So far so good with the re-inflated bladder.

You guys are right about the Marco pumps, they are good. I’ve been talking with another owner about the UP14E which he really likes on his 54, but it might be overkill. We like Aussie style showers!

Cheers
Dean



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Steering Failure on 1992 SM72 "Aloha"

Stephen Davis
 

Hi Pat,

I just received the template you made, and really appreciate the effort you went to. It will make the job much easier.

Thanks,
Steve
S/V Aloha


On Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 2:25 PM Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Steve, I am glad you have the same layout. No worries about the mailing ,my treat. We'll get everything on the way to you asap.

Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Davis flyboyscd@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Mon, Jul 16, 2018 7:34 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Steering Failure on 1992 SM72 "Aloha"

 
Thanks Pat...it is greatly appreciated. We have modified our aft stateroom a bit by removing the fiberglass liners on both sides, building the berth on the port side out to King size at the head and queen at the foot, and adding new cabinetry on the stbd side. With that said, the area under the port berth where the drive will go, is not changed in any way that will cause an issue. 

I’ll give you my Hawaii address below, and please let me know if I can send you a check or do a pay pal to reimburse you for mailing cost.. 

Aloha,

Steve

Steve Davis
95-464 Kaelo Place
Mililani, Hawaii 96789

Cell: 510-908-1835

Steve Davis
S/V Aloha

On Jul 16, 2018, at 12:33 PM, Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Steve, It is a pretty straight forward solution ,uses no usable space and does not require cutting out any structural components . Remember you need a 24 v linear drive with the long arm. You will also want to buy an A/B switch , in order to switch back and forth between the rotary and linear drive. I will send photo of that as well.I will very soon take many more photos and measurements for you . Do you have the same layout as I do, with the berth to port ? I will try to make a template of the extension arm . Would you have an address , I could mail it to you? By the way, congratulations on making a long passage and dealing well through your steering issue. 
Pat
SM Shenanigans



-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Davis flyboyscd@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Mon, Jul 16, 2018 4:50 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Steering Failure on 1992 SM72 "Aloha"

 
Patrick, I have looked at the photo section, and your technique, seems the most simple of the 2 different methods I’ve seen this done with an older SM. We are definitely going to do the job with your method, but not until we get the steering fixed. Any dimensions or template for the quadrant extension would save me a lot of time and energy trying to re-invent the wheel. Since I have the steering apart now, I may start to do some of the legwork in the near future. Whenever you have to time, I’d greatly appreciate it if you can send me what you have. 

Thanks,

Steve Davis
S/V Aloha

On Jul 16, 2018, at 9:39 AM, Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Steve, Rather than fabricating a new quadrant , which would have been necessary had we attempted to replicate Amels original installation , I only had to fabricate an extension arm and weld it to the existing quadrant .  The design and installation on my boat went very smoothly , easy to do and has proven to work well for thousands of miles . After looking at your options ,if you chose to do an installation such as I did , I will be glad to supply you with more pictures and measurements , perhaps even a template of the extension arm.. Have you looked at the photo section , I just did and there is a couple of pics that shows clearly what I did . Let me know if you go this route, and I will help in any way I can. 
Good Luck,
Pat 
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: flyboyscd@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Mon, Jul 16, 2018 2:14 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Steering Failure on 1992 SM72 "Aloha"

 
 Hi Patrick,

Thanks for your response regarding our steering. We have it on our very long list while in Hawaii this year to add a linear drive. Do you have any specs on how you modified the quadrant on the drive attachment side?  Any info you have on this would be a big help in figuring out how to make the modification.

If you want to email me directly, try flyboyscd at gmail dot com.

Thanks,

Steve
Aloha SM 72


Yanmar Super maramu engine panel

eric freedman
 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Freshwater Pump - cycles rapidly

 

MARCO pumps in the EU and in the US is an Amel School preferred replacement for OEM pumps is an Amel SM and 54. Amel School clients enjoy a 20% discount on MARCO pumps when ordered directly from MARCO or their US distributor MATE-USA.

I like the MARCO and their pumps. Sadly they do not have a replacement for the MARINA ZZ bilge pump, but they have replacements for all of the other pumps.

Cycling on/off when the tap is turned on/off is almost always a defective bladder inside the accumulator. Amel did have stock of bladders for the Amel 54 accumulator.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus

Amel School  http://www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550

+1(832) 380-4970

Any opinions and conclusions expressed in this message are solely those of the author and should not be construed as representing the opinion of an expert. Manufacturers' and Expert's precautions must be taken when dealing with mechanical and/or electrical systems to ensure that you are NOT harmed, and/or the device and/or system is NOT ruined. If in doubt, do not touch any referred to mechanical and/or electrical device or system.


On Mon, Jul 23, 2018 at 12:47 PM Jean-Pierre's MacBook Air jgermain@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Hi Dean,


Had this problem recently.  In my case, it was a burst line in the engine bay.

The pump also failed shortly thereafter and was replaced by a constant pressure Marco 12E.  This is an awesome pump giving 3 bars pressure and negates the installation of an accumulator. I can now wash my decks with fresh water :-)


Jean-Pierre Germain
SY Eleuthera, SM007, Raiatea, Society Islands.

On 23 Jul 2018, at 07:39, trifin@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Hi folks,

While on the subject of freshwater pumps, we had an issue recently whereby our pump rapidly cycled on-off every time a tap was opened.  This is symptomatic of a discharged (or broken) accumulator.

If the accumulator is simply discharged then it can be recharged with a bicycle pump or similar via the Schrader? valve at the forward facing end of the tank.  It’s under a plastic cap which can be unscrewed.

The process I used was to turn off the pump at the board, then drain a tap slowly until the pressure on the gauge at the pump just approaches zero. Then use the bicycle pump to pressurise the accumulator up to the desired working pressure, in my case around 1.5 - 2..0Bar.  Turn on the pump at the board and it should go back to a normal cycle again.

If you can’t pressurise the accumulator then it may need replacing. If it returns back to rapid cycling quickly, then maybe it has a leak. Not sure if it can be serviced.

Cheers
Dean

SY Stella
Amel 54#154
 





Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Freshwater Pump - cycles rapidly

Jean-Pierre's MacBook Air <jgermain@...>
 

Hi Dean,

Had this problem recently.  In my case, it was a burst line in the engine bay.

The pump also failed shortly thereafter and was replaced by a constant pressure Marco 12E.  This is an awesome pump giving 3 bars pressure and negates the installation of an accumulator. I can now wash my decks with fresh water :-)


Jean-Pierre Germain
SY Eleuthera, SM007, Raiatea, Society Islands.

On 23 Jul 2018, at 07:39, trifin@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Hi folks,

While on the subject of freshwater pumps, we had an issue recently whereby our pump rapidly cycled on-off every time a tap was opened.  This is symptomatic of a discharged (or broken) accumulator.

If the accumulator is simply discharged then it can be recharged with a bicycle pump or similar via the Schrader? valve at the forward facing end of the tank.  It’s under a plastic cap which can be unscrewed.

The process I used was to turn off the pump at the board, then drain a tap slowly until the pressure on the gauge at the pump just approaches zero. Then use the bicycle pump to pressurise the accumulator up to the desired working pressure, in my case around 1.5 - 2.0Bar.  Turn on the pump at the board and it should go back to a normal cycle again.

If you can’t pressurise the accumulator then it may need replacing. If it returns back to rapid cycling quickly, then maybe it has a leak. Not sure if it can be serviced.

Cheers
Dean

SY Stella
Amel 54#154
 





Re: Freshwater Pump - cycles rapidly

Dean Gillies
 

Hi folks,
While on the subject of freshwater pumps, we had an issue recently whereby our pump rapidly cycled on-off every time a tap was opened.  This is symptomatic of a discharged (or broken) accumulator.

If the accumulator is simply discharged then it can be recharged with a bicycle pump or similar via the Schrader? valve at the forward facing end of the tank.  It’s under a plastic cap which can be unscrewed.

The process I used was to turn off the pump at the board, then drain a tap slowly until the pressure on the gauge at the pump just approaches zero. Then use the bicycle pump to pressurise the accumulator up to the desired working pressure, in my case around 1.5 - 2.0Bar.  Turn on the pump at the board and it should go back to a normal cycle again.

If you can’t pressurise the accumulator then it may need replacing. If it returns back to rapid cycling quickly, then maybe it has a leak. Not sure if it can be serviced.

Cheers
Dean

SY Stella
Amel 54#154
 



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] My batteries are dying.

Steve Bode
 

Thanks, Eric. I'm looking into that water temp alarm.
-Capt Bode

Steve Bode
Sailing Vessel Intention
Amel Super Maramu 1994 #117
Facebook.com/svIntention
+1 415-710-6659

On Sun, Jul 22, 2018 at 10:03 PM, 'sailormon' kimberlite@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Ps,

The photo of the melted Vetus muffler on the Borel site was my muffler.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com [mailto:amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Sunday, July 22, 2018 7:37 AM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] My batteries are dying.

 

 

Hi Steve;

 

Glad you figured out your issue and it was a simple solution.

 

Olivier did  recommended not to use both chargers together when he did our survey. I know some do use both together, but we do not. We do have have a 100 A and a 40 A and we find the 100A sufficient for charging. My recommendation would be to select the biggest charger that your generator can handle. Use this for when you are on the generator and the smaller one when plugged in. With 400A 24V bank you could use 60-80A charger,if your generator and wiring allows.

 

The temperature sensors for the battery bank is a great safety item and also a worth while investment to maximize the life of your batteries. We see fluctuations of up to 0.4V during the different charging cycles depending on the battery compartment temperature.

 

As far as audible alarms check out Borel manufacturing. http://www.borelmfg.com.

Respectfully;

 

 

Mohammad And Aty

B&B KOKOMO

AMEL 54 #099


On Jul 22, 2018, at 3:32 AM, Steve Bode stevenmbode@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 

Thank you Amelians!

I believe that the problem was that the monitor lost its programming of max capacity. 

 

What I did: 

1. Batteries have been on charger for days so I assumed that they were fully charged as charger is in float.

2. Turn off charger

3. Turn of house batteries (big red handles)

4. Take picture of battery voltage on monitor -- 27..08 volts

3. Program the Magnetronic DCC4000 Battery Monitor to set capacity to 100% and total Ah to 400

4. Leave batteries to see how fast the voltage drops (remember, batteries are disconnected so there is no drain on them)

5. 2 hours later, check battery voltage - exactly the same 27.08

6. Open battery case and measure voltage on each battery. All were (almost) exactly the same - 13.52

7. Measured the voltage of each battery set -- nearly exactly the same -- 27.02 (slightly different than the battery monitor, but okay.

8. Check the charging profile of my Sterling 30A battery charger - AGM, charge=28.6, float=26.6

 

Now I guess buying AGMs put me in a spot to need a new alternator voltage regulator. Looking at the Sterling Alternator Regulator Damn, they're proud of that unit at 221 pounds! 

 

Also, I think that the 30A Sterling charger is too small. I have another 30A charger that I'm going to look into putting on line. That would be 60A charging and redundancy.

 

Lastly, want to find out if I can use the sterling regulator as my solar panel regulator (they aren't installed yet). Probably better than the cheapy regulator that I bought with the panel and could give nice uniform monitoring capability.

 

No wait, lastly. I want to hook up temperature sensors to my battery and alternator. Does everyone else use these? One thing I'm really big on is getting more audible alarms on the boat. I want to build an alarm system that I can connect various inputs into. Anyone know of a good system?


Steve Bode

Sailing Vessel Intention

Amel Super Maramu 1994 #117

 

On Sat, Jul 21, 2018 at 11:27 PM, divanz620@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 

You should also disconnect the batteries (just one terminal) and test them individually..assuming they are 12V, if any battery shows substantially less than 12.8V then that could be the cause of your issue.

 

Why has it happened?

Could be just a bad battery, or it could be, if you have the standard alternator without a 3 step regulator, many long periods of motoring will eventually kill your batteries.

Cheers

Alan

Elyse SM437

 



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] My batteries are dying.

eric freedman
 

Ps,

The photo of the melted Vetus muffler on the Borel site was my muffler.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Sunday, July 22, 2018 7:37 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] My batteries are dying.

 

 

Hi Steve;

 

Glad you figured out your issue and it was a simple solution.

 

Olivier did  recommended not to use both chargers together when he did our survey. I know some do use both together, but we do not. We do have have a 100 A and a 40 A and we find the 100A sufficient for charging. My recommendation would be to select the biggest charger that your generator can handle. Use this for when you are on the generator and the smaller one when plugged in. With 400A 24V bank you could use 60-80A charger,if your generator and wiring allows.

 

The temperature sensors for the battery bank is a great safety item and also a worth while investment to maximize the life of your batteries. We see fluctuations of up to 0.4V during the different charging cycles depending on the battery compartment temperature.

 

As far as audible alarms check out Borel manufacturing. http://www.borelmfg.com.

Respectfully;

 

 

Mohammad And Aty

B&B KOKOMO

AMEL 54 #099


On Jul 22, 2018, at 3:32 AM, Steve Bode stevenmbode@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Thank you Amelians!

I believe that the problem was that the monitor lost its programming of max capacity. 

 

What I did: 

1. Batteries have been on charger for days so I assumed that they were fully charged as charger is in float.

2. Turn off charger

3. Turn of house batteries (big red handles)

4. Take picture of battery voltage on monitor -- 27..08 volts

3. Program the Magnetronic DCC4000 Battery Monitor to set capacity to 100% and total Ah to 400

4. Leave batteries to see how fast the voltage drops (remember, batteries are disconnected so there is no drain on them)

5. 2 hours later, check battery voltage - exactly the same 27.08

6. Open battery case and measure voltage on each battery. All were (almost) exactly the same - 13.52

7. Measured the voltage of each battery set -- nearly exactly the same -- 27.02 (slightly different than the battery monitor, but okay.

8. Check the charging profile of my Sterling 30A battery charger - AGM, charge=28.6, float=26.6

 

Now I guess buying AGMs put me in a spot to need a new alternator voltage regulator. Looking at the Sterling Alternator Regulator Damn, they're proud of that unit at 221 pounds! 

 

Also, I think that the 30A Sterling charger is too small. I have another 30A charger that I'm going to look into putting on line. That would be 60A charging and redundancy.

 

Lastly, want to find out if I can use the sterling regulator as my solar panel regulator (they aren't installed yet). Probably better than the cheapy regulator that I bought with the panel and could give nice uniform monitoring capability.

 

No wait, lastly. I want to hook up temperature sensors to my battery and alternator. Does everyone else use these? One thing I'm really big on is getting more audible alarms on the boat. I want to build an alarm system that I can connect various inputs into. Anyone know of a good system?


Steve Bode

Sailing Vessel Intention

Amel Super Maramu 1994 #117

 

On Sat, Jul 21, 2018 at 11:27 PM, divanz620@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

You should also disconnect the batteries (just one terminal) and test them individually..assuming they are 12V, if any battery shows substantially less than 12.8V then that could be the cause of your issue.

 

Why has it happened?

Could be just a bad battery, or it could be, if you have the standard alternator without a 3 step regulator, many long periods of motoring will eventually kill your batteries.

Cheers

Alan

Elyse SM437

 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] My batteries are dying.

Mohammad Shirloo
 

Hi Steve;

Glad you figured out your issue and it was a simple solution.

Olivier did  recommended not to use both chargers together when he did our survey. I know some do use both together, but we do not. We do have have a 100 A and a 40 A and we find the 100A sufficient for charging. My recommendation would be to select the biggest charger that your generator can handle. Use this for when you are on the generator and the smaller one when plugged in. With 400A 24V bank you could use 60-80A charger,if your generator and wiring allows.

The temperature sensors for the battery bank is a great safety item and also a worth while investment to maximize the life of your batteries. We see fluctuations of up to 0.4V during the different charging cycles depending on the battery compartment temperature.

As far as audible alarms check out Borel manufacturing. http://www.borelmfg.com.

Respectfully;


Mohammad And Aty
B&B KOKOMO
AMEL 54 #099

On Jul 22, 2018, at 3:32 AM, Steve Bode stevenmbode@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Thank you Amelians!
I believe that the problem was that the monitor lost its programming of max capacity. 

What I did: 
1. Batteries have been on charger for days so I assumed that they were fully charged as charger is in float.
2. Turn off charger
3. Turn of house batteries (big red handles)
4. Take picture of battery voltage on monitor -- 27..08 volts
3. Program the Magnetronic DCC4000 Battery Monitor to set capacity to 100% and total Ah to 400
4. Leave batteries to see how fast the voltage drops (remember, batteries are disconnected so there is no drain on them)
5. 2 hours later, check battery voltage - exactly the same 27.08
6. Open battery case and measure voltage on each battery. All were (almost) exactly the same - 13.52
7. Measured the voltage of each battery set -- nearly exactly the same -- 27.02 (slightly different than the battery monitor, but okay.
8. Check the charging profile of my Sterling 30A battery charger - AGM, charge=28.6, float=26.6

Now I guess buying AGMs put me in a spot to need a new alternator voltage regulator. Looking at the Sterling Alternator Regulator Damn, they're proud of that unit at 221 pounds! 

Also, I think that the 30A Sterling charger is too small. I have another 30A charger that I'm going to look into putting on line. That would be 60A charging and redundancy.

Lastly, want to find out if I can use the sterling regulator as my solar panel regulator (they aren't installed yet). Probably better than the cheapy regulator that I bought with the panel and could give nice uniform monitoring capability.

No wait, lastly. I want to hook up temperature sensors to my battery and alternator. Does everyone else use these? One thing I'm really big on is getting more audible alarms on the boat. I want to build an alarm system that I can connect various inputs into. Anyone know of a good system?

Steve Bode
Sailing Vessel Intention
Amel Super Maramu 1994 #117

On Sat, Jul 21, 2018 at 11:27 PM, divanz620@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

You should also disconnect the batteries (just one terminal) and test them individually..assuming they are 12V, if any battery shows substantially less than 12.8V then that could be the cause of your issue.


Why has it happened?
Could be just a bad battery, or it could be, if you have the standard alternator without a 3 step regulator, many long periods of motoring will eventually kill your batteries.
Cheers
Alan
Elyse SM437


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