Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker and transmission fluid
Bill,
Thanks for the explanation - makes sense. Given the membrane is fouled, I would guess the danger may be that, even though you might be able to run the system and produce fresh water, that will be contaminated no matter how long you run it. Sound right? Wonder if fresh pickling would destroy the old fouling. (Or maybe just bite the bullet and buy new membranes to stay on the safe side.) Craig SN68 ---In amelyachtowners@..., <greatketch@...> wrote : If the membrane is pickled with sodium metabisufite (also called sodium pyrosufite) the issue with long term storage (beyond about 1 year) is not damage to the membranes from the pickling solution, but rather that the pickling solution losses its biostatic properties and the membranes foul from biological growth. When dissolved in water sodium metabisufite gradually hydrolyses to release sulfur dioxide leaving a solution of sodium sulfite. Sulfur dioxide is a strong reducing agent, and a very effective microbiocide. Once all of the sodium metabisulfite hydrolyses, and the resulting sulfur dioxide reacts and dissipates, there is nothing left to protect the membranes from biological growth. The usual recommendation is that the membranes should be re-pickled after a year to keep them safe. I would guess that timeframe is actually highly variable depending on initial water quality, pH, bioburden, temperature, and other variables. This is the same reason that membranes sold "wet" have a relatively short shelf life. It is not the membranes that "go bad" rather it is the pickling solution. Bill Kinney SM160, Harmonie Annapolis, MD, USA
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Helm Seat
Patrick McAneny
Bill, That is why I posted my question, and stated that my main concern is that it would be a stable seat. While I know it would be more comfortable 100% of the time ,I am concerned about the stability in that .01% of time when conditions are at its worse. I would not want any sense of movement in a helm seat.
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Thanks,
Pat
SM123
-----Original Message----- From: Bill Rouse brouse@... [amelyachtowners] To: amelyachtowners Sent: Thu, Aug 23, 2018 10:44 am Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Helm Seat Pat,
All I am saying is, until you experience the security of that helm seat design in heavy conditions, I believe you would not change it. I believe that after you experience those conditions, your understanding of the design will change.
Best,
CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy Commander Emeritus Amel School http://www.amelschool.com 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970 Any opinions and conclusions expressed in this message are solely those of the author and should not be construed as representing the opinion of an expert. Manufacturers' and Expert's precautions must be considered when dealing with mechanical and/or electrical systems to ensure that you are NOT harmed, and/or the device and/or system is NOT ruined. If in doubt, do not touch any mechanical and/or electrical device or system referred to above.
On Thu, Aug 23, 2018 at 8:38 AM Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Easy and novel way to remove membrane end caps.
Ian, Yes, I did mix up the solutions...I like yours a lot, but would like Eric's if he included the beer. Eric, if you have compressed air on board, it isn't as messy. Best, CW Bill Rouse Admiral, Texas Navy Commander Emeritus Amel School http://www.amelschool.com 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970 Any opinions and conclusions expressed in this message are solely those of the author and should not be construed as representing the opinion of an expert. Manufacturers' and Expert's precautions must be considered when dealing with mechanical and/or electrical systems to ensure that you are NOT harmed, and/or the device and/or system is NOT ruined. If in doubt, do not touch any mechanical and/or electrical device or system referred to above.
On Thu, Aug 23, 2018 at 9:52 AM Ian & Judy ianjudyjenkins@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Easy and novel way to remove membrane end caps.
ianjenkins1946 <ianjudyjenkins@hotmail.com>
Bill,
I think you've mixed us up--mine is the solution with the beer; Eric's is strictly teetotal ( I know, it's hard to believe he's a real sailor!)
Ian
From: amelyachtowners@... on behalf of Bill Rouse brouse@... [amelyachtowners]
Sent: 23 August 2018 14:41:39 To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Easy and novel way to remove membrane end caps. Ian,
You could improve on your method by adding one of Eric's steps...the beer.
Best,
CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy Commander Emeritus Amel School http://www.amelschool.com 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970 Any opinions and conclusions expressed in this message are solely those of the author and should not be construed as representing the opinion of an expert. Manufacturers' and Expert's precautions must be considered
when dealing with mechanical and/or electrical systems to ensure that you are NOT harmed, and/or the device and/or system is NOT ruined. If in doubt, do not touch any mechanical and/or electrical device or system referred
to above.
On Thu, Aug 23, 2018 at 6:47 AM Ian & Judy
ianjudyjenkins@hotmail..com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Santorin spinnaker question [1 Attachment]
Herbert: Put the above through the existing hole at the masthead and attach your shackle to the 2 loops. Best, CW Bill Rouse Admiral, Texas Navy Commander Emeritus Amel School http://www.amelschool.com 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970 Any opinions and conclusions expressed in this message are solely those of the author and should not be construed as representing the opinion of an expert. Manufacturers' and Expert's precautions must be considered when dealing with mechanical and/or electrical systems to ensure that you are NOT harmed, and/or the device and/or system is NOT ruined. If in doubt, do not touch any mechanical and/or electrical device or system referred to above.
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Helm Seat
Pat, All I am saying is, until you experience the security of that helm seat design in heavy conditions, I believe you would not change it. I believe that after you experience those conditions, your understanding of the design will change. Best, CW Bill Rouse Admiral, Texas Navy Commander Emeritus Amel School http://www.amelschool.com 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970 Any opinions and conclusions expressed in this message are solely those of the author and should not be construed as representing the opinion of an expert. Manufacturers' and Expert's precautions must be considered when dealing with mechanical and/or electrical systems to ensure that you are NOT harmed, and/or the device and/or system is NOT ruined. If in doubt, do not touch any mechanical and/or electrical device or system referred to above.
On Thu, Aug 23, 2018 at 8:38 AM Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Easy and novel way to remove membrane end caps.
Ian, You could improve on your method by adding one of Eric's steps...the beer. Best, CW Bill Rouse Admiral, Texas Navy Commander Emeritus Amel School http://www.amelschool.com 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970 Any opinions and conclusions expressed in this message are solely those of the author and should not be construed as representing the opinion of an expert. Manufacturers' and Expert's precautions must be considered when dealing with mechanical and/or electrical systems to ensure that you are NOT harmed, and/or the device and/or system is NOT ruined. If in doubt, do not touch any mechanical and/or electrical device or system referred to above.
On Thu, Aug 23, 2018 at 6:47 AM Ian & Judy ianjudyjenkins@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Raymarine ACU 400 AP
Paul, The Response is set in the setup and I think the default is 5, but you can change the response at the control head while sailing...refer to your manual. I think you need a Response of 2 or 3 in those downwind situations...try it the next time. Best, CW Bill Rouse Admiral, Texas Navy Commander Emeritus Amel School http://www.amelschool.com 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970 Any opinions and conclusions expressed in this message are solely those of the author and should not be construed as representing the opinion of an expert. Manufacturers' and Expert's precautions must be considered when dealing with mechanical and/or electrical systems to ensure that you are NOT harmed, and/or the device and/or system is NOT ruined. If in doubt, do not touch any mechanical and/or electrical device or system referred to above.
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker and transmission fluid
greatketch@...
If the membrane is pickled with sodium metabisufite (also called sodium pyrosufite) the issue with long term storage (beyond about 1 year) is not damage to the membranes from the pickling solution, but rather that the pickling solution losses its biostatic properties and the membranes foul from biological growth.
When dissolved in water sodium metabisufite gradually hydrolyses to release sulfur dioxide leaving a solution of sodium sulfite. Sulfur dioxide is a strong reducing agent, and a very effective microbiocide. Once all of the sodium metabisulfite hydrolyses, and the resulting sulfur dioxide reacts and dissipates, there is nothing left to protect the membranes from biological growth. The usual recommendation is that the membranes should be re-pickled after a year to keep them safe. I would guess that timeframe is actually highly variable depending on initial water quality, pH, bioburden, temperature, and other variables. This is the same reason that membranes sold "wet" have a relatively short shelf life. It is not the membranes that "go bad" rather it is the pickling solution. Bill Kinney SM160, Harmonie Annapolis, MD, USA
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Re: Santorin spinnaker question
Herbert Lackner
thanks Alan! that seems to be a strong Aluminium extension to the Mast-Head, professional solution. Cannot do that now, but maybe a stainless steel plate, screwed on the masthead, with rubber between the aluminium and the steel, would do the job also. Currently there is a hole at the masthead-plate where a shackle was installed, I did not like the solution with the steel-shackle going through the aluminum plate (hard steel chaving against soft aluminium) and therefore removed the shackle, but maybe a strong dyneema line attached to the masthead-plate would also do it as a very simple solution. any recommendations are welcome the foto attached shows the "old configuration" with the shackle where the block was fixed (next to the old B&G masthead unit, foto was made looking down at the top of the mast), I removed it when we serviced and repainted the mast. The hole is still there and could be used to attach a dyneema line with a block... thx again, herbert
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Helm Seat
Patrick McAneny
Bill, Yea, I knew what you would say. In fact, Diane and I were kidding this morning ,that you would yell at me when you came aboard in St. Michaels. I said I might as well put it out there now, and face the music. I figure at least from this distance ,you can't hit me. Your boat was newer and had a better seat than we have, and no doubt more comfortable. I know its a departure ,but also would be unquestionably much more comfortable. I am still debating and would like to hear from people that have such a seat.
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Mea Culpa,
Pat
SM Shenanigans
-----Original Message----- From: Bill Rouse brouse@... [amelyachtowners] To: amelyachtowners Sent: Thu, Aug 23, 2018 9:21 am Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Helm Seat Pat,
You know what I am going to say...yada, yada, don't change it because...yada, yada.
But, FYI, Judy and I sat in that seat in a cyclone in the middle of the IO. It is perfect! Don't change it.
Best,
CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy Commander Emeritus Amel School http://www.amelschool.com 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970 Any opinions and conclusions expressed in this message are solely those of the author and should not be construed as representing the opinion of an expert. Manufacturers' and Expert's precautions must be considered when dealing with mechanical and/or electrical systems to ensure that you are NOT harmed, and/or the device and/or system is NOT ruined. If in doubt, do not touch any mechanical and/or electrical device or system referred to above.
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Easy and novel way to remove membrane end caps.
eric freedman
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Helm Seat
Patrick McAneny
Bill, I would install a metal backing plate under the deck , so structurally I am not too concerned. It is that the tube is sleeved (allowing for height adjustment)and attachment points under the seat may combine to allow a degree of movement that concerns me. My seat now only has a slight curvature built in for adjusting to heel ,you may have the same seat. The chair I am looking at has side bolsters that mimics that somewhat. Since we are generally on auto pilot , I could swivel the seat seat towards windward and have a 15 degree recline,might be pretty comfortable while still be able to monitor gauges. My main concern is that it may look a bit big and movement,that would bother me.
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Thanks,
Pat
SM123
-----Original Message----- From: greatketch@... [amelyachtowners] To: amelyachtowners Sent: Thu, Aug 23, 2018 9:01 am Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Helm Seat Pat,
The concern I’d have about sitting in a typical pedestal seat is not rough seas, but rather heeling. There are many very comfortable helm seat built for high end motor yachts, but they all assume that the boat is basically flat. I have not yet seen a pedestal seat I’d want to sit in when heeled at 15 degrees. The other issue around a pedestal is structural. The deck in that area might need strengthening to support a single point of attachment of a pedestal. Note for example, the way the nav station seat pedestal is built into the boat. Bill Kinney SM160, Harmonie Annapolis, MD, USA
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Installing diesel heating on a Super Maramu
Alexandre Uster von Baar
My pleasure Terry,
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Yes it was factory (Amel) installed! --------------------------------------------
On Thu, 8/23/18, singh_terence@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Installing diesel heating on a Super Maramu To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, August 23, 2018, 7:42 AM Hi Alex, it's be a while. I hope you are well!This is the level of detail I was hoping for. Thank you very much. I assume this was a factory install? Terry
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Helm Seat
Pat, You know what I am going to say...yada, yada, don't change it because...yada, yada. But, FYI, Judy and I sat in that seat in a cyclone in the middle of the IO. It is perfect! Don't change it. Best, CW Bill Rouse Admiral, Texas Navy Commander Emeritus Amel School http://www.amelschool.com 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970 Any opinions and conclusions expressed in this message are solely those of the author and should not be construed as representing the opinion of an expert. Manufacturers' and Expert's precautions must be considered when dealing with mechanical and/or electrical systems to ensure that you are NOT harmed, and/or the device and/or system is NOT ruined. If in doubt, do not touch any mechanical and/or electrical device or system referred to above.
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Re: Helm Seat
greatketch@...
Pat,
The concern I’d have about sitting in a typical pedestal seat is not rough seas, but rather heeling. There are many very comfortable helm seat built for high end motor yachts, but they all assume that the boat is basically flat. I have not yet seen a pedestal seat I’d want to sit in when heeled at 15 degrees. The other issue around a pedestal is structural. The deck in that area might need strengthening to support a single point of attachment of a pedestal. Note for example, the way the nav station seat pedestal is built into the boat. Bill Kinney SM160, Harmonie Annapolis, MD, USA
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker and transmission fluid
Pat,
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I see that Yahoo did garble that link, so just search it directly. And, yes, keep the fresh water flow normal and you should be ok. I think the issue with long term pickling may be damage to the membrane rather than just needing a "cleaning", but you should be able to tell - if your TDS is low after firing it up you may have dodged the bullet. Cheers, Craig ---In amelyachtowners@..., <sailw32@...> wrote : Craig , I will watch the video, I would really like to run it now before I leave, so that I can replace/repair here before departure. The membranes have only been used for six months , then pickled for 31/2 years . I don't know what that does to them , it seems if you ran them for awhile they would clean themselves ,who knows ,I don't. So you are saying as long as I don't turn the pressure up beyond the green zone , it would be OK .See ya in ST. Michaels. Thanks, Pat SM123
-----Original Message----- From: sangaris@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...> Sent: Thu, Aug 23, 2018 7:52 am Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker and transmission fluid Hi Pat, You definitely can run your watermaker in fresh water without ruining the membrane(s). The only caveat is that you must not exceed your fresh water output rating. Start your unit up with, as Alan says, the pressure knob fully closed (which you normally do). Then bring the pressure up slowly and monitor the fresh water output flow. In sea water, where you might need 800 psi to get your rated output (mine is 20 gph), in brackish it's maybe 400 or so and only 200ish in fresh water. For a good video on this by Rich Boren, who owns the CruiseRO company, check out http://blog.cruiserowaterandpower.com/can-i-run-a-marine-water-maker-in-fresh-or-brackish-water/ If the link on the last line gets garbled by yahoo, it is http colon slash slash blog dot cruiserowaterandpower dot com slash can-i-run-a-marine-water-maker-in-fresh-or-brackish-water slash I used to do this all the time on Sangaris, so I know it works. Cheers, Craig SN68 ---In amelyachtowners@..., <sailw32@...> wrote : Alan, I am concerned about that , leaving them pickled so long and they were new four years ago. So it sounds like there is no way to fully test the system until I get to salt water. If I could find a way to make up some salt
water and recirculate it ,that would work. I would like to put it through a stress test prior to heading for the Caribbean. Thanks, Pat SM Shenanigans
-----Original Message----- From: divanz620@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...> Sent: Wed, Aug 22, 2018 4:33 pm Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker and transmission fluid Hi Pat, ATF 90 - Automatic Transmission Fluid SAE 90 You can rinse the membranes with fresh water with the pressure knob fully anti clockwise i.e. no pressure. If you pressurise the membranes with fresh water you will ruin them - if they are not already ruined from sitting pickled for that length of time. Cheers Alan Elyse SM437
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Re: Installing diesel heating on a Super Maramu
Terence Singh
Hi Alex, it's be a while. I hope you are well!
This is the level of detail I was hoping for. Thank you very much. I assume this was a factory install? Terry
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Helm Seat
Patrick McAneny
We have never found our helm seat comfortable,even though I added higher back support and larger teak armrest , it is an earlier model .We have been considering installing a hi back helm seat on a pedestal .I have only seen one, on the SM Nomad in St. Martins . It looked very comfortable ,yet a bit big. Size concerns me a little , but my real concern is stability . Sitting on top of a pedestal in rough seas concerns me. Can anyone with experience with a pedestal seat, tell me if it felt stable. Thanks, Pat SM123
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker and transmission fluid
Patrick McAneny
Craig , I will watch the video, I would really like to run it now before I leave, so that I can replace/repair here before departure. The membranes have only been used for six months , then pickled for 31/2 years . I don't know what that does to them , it seems if you ran them for awhile they would clean themselves ,who knows ,I don't. So you are saying as long as I don't turn the pressure up beyond the green zone , it would be OK .See ya in ST. Michaels.
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Thanks,
Pat
SM123
-----Original Message----- From: sangaris@... [amelyachtowners] To: amelyachtowners Sent: Thu, Aug 23, 2018 7:52 am Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker and transmission fluid Hi Pat,
You definitely can run your watermaker in fresh water without ruining the membrane(s). The only caveat is that you must not exceed your fresh water output rating.
Start your unit up with, as Alan says, the pressure knob fully closed (which you normally do). Then bring the pressure up slowly and monitor the fresh water output flow. In sea water, where you might need 800 psi to get your rated output (mine is 20 gph), in brackish it's maybe 400 or so and only 200ish in fresh water.
For a good video on this by Rich Boren, who owns the CruiseRO company, check out http://blog.cruiserowaterandpower.com/can-i-run-a-marine-water-maker-in-fresh-or-brackish-water/
If the link on the last line gets garbled by yahoo, it is http colon slash slash blog dot cruiserowaterandpower dot com slash can-i-run-a-marine-water-maker-in-fresh-or-brackish-water slash
I used to do this all the time on Sangaris, so I know it works.
Cheers, Craig SN68
---In amelyachtowners@..., wrote : Alan, I am concerned about that , leaving them pickled so long and they were new four years ago. So it sounds like there is no way to fully test the system until I get to salt water. If I could find a way to make up some salt
water and recirculate it ,that would work. I would like to put it through a stress test prior to heading for the Caribbean.
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans
-----Original Message-----
From: divanz620@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...> Sent: Wed, Aug 22, 2018 4:33 pm Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker and transmission fluid Hi Pat,
ATF 90 - Automatic Transmission Fluid SAE 90
You can rinse the membranes with fresh water with the pressure knob fully anti clockwise i.e. no pressure.
If you pressurise the membranes with fresh water you will ruin them - if they are not already ruined from sitting pickled for that length of time.
Cheers
Alan
Elyse SM437
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