Date   

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sm fell off cradel

John Clark
 

Jay, that is PAPA II.  She floats.. is about all I can say 

She was reportedly crushed when another boat fell on her in the yard.  Later she got stuck on a rock jetty and had the keel ballast.. along with the bottom of the water talk torn off.  
The repair on the keel left her with a keel 6" shorter than spec.


On Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 5:57 PM Jay Hosford jay.hosford@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@... wrote:
 

Yashar is the current name ,  located in MD


On Dec 15, 2018, at 3:42 PM, John Clark john.biohead@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Jay,
   I would be very very concerned.  Yes the boat could be ok, but if the damage occurred at a sensitive spot is cannot really be brought back to spec.  

Fiberglass repairs can make anything look new again but cannot replace the strength of the original piece....might get close but not equal.

The Amel rig is by design bakery high tension setup.. It applies a lot of tension on to the hull....on purpose mind you, which helps stablize to whole  affair.  If say a bit of the hull near a chain plate were compromised that spot become a weak spot where the rig could fail.  Loosening the rig to compensate ruins the integrity of the rig design setting you up for rig failure.

I suggest you inquire with Olivier Beaute to examine the damage/repair before going forward. 

I hope this is not the Amel formally known as PAPA II?

Regards,. John

SV ANNIE SM 37
Carriacou.

On Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 5:09 PM Jay Hosford jay.hosford@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@... wrote:
 


If it had good repairs and a survey how concerned would you be?



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sm fell off cradel

 

Yashar is absolutely the worst repair of a twice totaled Amel on this planet. It doesn't have Amel masts and the bulkheads are cracked behind the sloppy repair job. 

Survey, Ha!

Forget about it.


Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus
Amel School www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970


On Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 16:57 Jay Hosford jay.hosford@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@... wrote:
 

Yashar is the current name ,  located in MD


On Dec 15, 2018, at 3:42 PM, John Clark john.biohead@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Jay,
   I would be very very concerned.  Yes the boat could be ok, but if the damage occurred at a sensitive spot is cannot really be brought back to spec.  

Fiberglass repairs can make anything look new again but cannot replace the strength of the original piece....might get close but not equal.

The Amel rig is by design bakery high tension setup.. It applies a lot of tension on to the hull....on purpose mind you, which helps stablize to whole  affair.  If say a bit of the hull near a chain plate were compromised that spot become a weak spot where the rig could fail.  Loosening the rig to compensate ruins the integrity of the rig design setting you up for rig failure.

I suggest you inquire with Olivier Beaute to examine the damage/repair before going forward. 

I hope this is not the Amel formally known as PAPA II?

Regards,. John

SV ANNIE SM 37
Carriacou.

On Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 5:09 PM Jay Hosford jay.hosford@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@... wrote:
 


If it had good repairs and a survey how concerned would you be?



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sm fell off cradel

james Hosford
 

Yashar is the current name ,  located in MD


On Dec 15, 2018, at 3:42 PM, John Clark john.biohead@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Jay,
   I would be very very concerned.  Yes the boat could be ok, but if the damage occurred at a sensitive spot is cannot really be brought back to spec.  

Fiberglass repairs can make anything look new again but cannot replace the strength of the original piece....might get close but not equal.

The Amel rig is by design bakery high tension setup.. It applies a lot of tension on to the hull....on purpose mind you, which helps stablize to whole  affair.  If say a bit of the hull near a chain plate were compromised that spot become a weak spot where the rig could fail.  Loosening the rig to compensate ruins the integrity of the rig design setting you up for rig failure.

I suggest you inquire with Olivier Beaute to examine the damage/repair before going forward. 

I hope this is not the Amel formally known as PAPA II?

Regards,. John

SV ANNIE SM 37
Carriacou.

On Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 5:09 PM Jay Hosford jay.hosford@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@... wrote:
 


If it had good repairs and a survey how concerned would you be?



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Sm fell off cradel

james Hosford
 

Its on yacht world now for 199.   2001.  I think I've seen it before.   It passed survey after the fact well enough to have a loan grated for it previously.   Maybe if she has bee back to see for a while and passed a few surveys since? 


On Dec 15, 2018, at 3:32 PM, sailor63109@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

I've never had a marine experience like that so I can only fall back on my structural engineering background.  There are a LOT of ways that there could be hidden damage that only surfaces after some hard sailing.


All of the bulkheads and the hull to deck joint are joined by fiberglass.  These joints are not exposed to careful inspection and are the place where you could have damage.  If one or more of these bulkhead/deck to hull joints are damaged but not to the point where there is visible movement, the joint is nonetheless damaged and does not have the same strength or resistance to fatigue it originally had.  The keel is joined to the keel stub by keel bolts.  The keel stub and the hull structure it's attached to took a very heavy hit as the 16 tons of boat landed on it.  How careful, complete and thorough were the inspection and repairs?  After some hard sailing or years of sailing the now over-stressed joints or structure can fail, or result in excessive movement or leaks.

Did they remove everything in the vicinity of the impact (all furniture, cabinets, wall coverings, flooring, etc.) to permit a careful inspection and/or reinforcement?  If so perhaps you might feel you're covered if the people doing the work can be trusted or someone you hired was there inspecting.  Keep in mind it's always easier and cheaper to cover up than to expose and repair, especially if you plan to sell the boat.

Is there a good chance all is well, sure...maybe.  Personally I would not take the chance unless the level of risk (as you view it) is seriously reflected in the sales price and you are willing to take on the risk with eyes wide open.  Maybe if you plan on only coastal sailing?

Duane
Wanderer, SM#477


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sm fell off cradel

John Clark
 

Hi Jay,
   I would be very very concerned.  Yes the boat could be ok, but if the damage occurred at a sensitive spot is cannot really be brought back to spec.  

Fiberglass repairs can make anything look new again but cannot replace the strength of the original piece....might get close but not equal.

The Amel rig is by design bakery high tension setup. It applies a lot of tension on to the hull....on purpose mind you, which helps stablize to whole  affair.  If say a bit of the hull near a chain plate were compromised that spot become a weak spot where the rig could fail.  Loosening the rig to compensate ruins the integrity of the rig design setting you up for rig failure.

I suggest you inquire with Olivier Beaute to examine the damage/repair before going forward. 

I hope this is not the Amel formally known as PAPA II?

Regards,. John

SV ANNIE SM 37
Carriacou.

On Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 5:09 PM Jay Hosford jay.hosford@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@... wrote:
 


If it had good repairs and a survey how concerned would you be?



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sm fell off cradel

amelforme
 

I went through my emails from the Amel Yahoo group and could not find the message describing the Super Maramu that fell off a cradle. Could someone please forward it to me?  Jfpottercys” at” att.net

 

          Thanks, Joel

 

          JOEL F. POTTER-CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST~L.L.C.

                                           THE  EXPERIENCED AMEL GUY

UNSURPASSED AMEL MARKETING EXPERIENCE AND PRODUCT KNOWLEDGE

                                   Office 954-462-5869  Cell 954-812-2485                                                 

From: amelyachtowners@...
Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2018 3:28 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sm fell off cradel

 

 

Very.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Santa Marta, Colombia

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2018 5:09 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sm fell off cradel

 

 


If it had good repairs and a survey how concerned would you be?


Re: Sm fell off cradel

Duane Siegfri
 

I've never had a marine experience like that so I can only fall back on my structural engineering background.  There are a LOT of ways that there could be hidden damage that only surfaces after some hard sailing.

All of the bulkheads and the hull to deck joint are joined by fiberglass.  These joints are not exposed to careful inspection and are the place where you could have damage.  If one or more of these bulkhead/deck to hull joints are damaged but not to the point where there is visible movement, the joint is nonetheless damaged and does not have the same strength or resistance to fatigue it originally had.  The keel is joined to the keel stub by keel bolts.  The keel stub and the hull structure it's attached to took a very heavy hit as the 16 tons of boat landed on it.  How careful, complete and thorough were the inspection and repairs?  After some hard sailing or years of sailing the now over-stressed joints or structure can fail, or result in excessive movement or leaks.

Did they remove everything in the vicinity of the impact (all furniture, cabinets, wall coverings, flooring, etc.) to permit a careful inspection and/or reinforcement?  If so perhaps you might feel you're covered if the people doing the work can be trusted or someone you hired was there inspecting.  Keep in mind it's always easier and cheaper to cover up than to expose and repair, especially if you plan to sell the boat.

Is there a good chance all is well, sure...maybe.  Personally I would not take the chance unless the level of risk (as you view it) is seriously reflected in the sales price and you are willing to take on the risk with eyes wide open.  Maybe if you plan on only coastal sailing?

Duane
Wanderer, SM#477


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Yahoo Group Amel Register

Alan Leslie
 

Well, all the information in my sheet was extracted from the messages on the forum
Files and messages on the forum are only available to forum members...
But if folks are that concerned about security, don't do it.
If your list is better than mine, which you say it is, let's use that......put it up so we can see it.

Alan
Elyse SM437


Sm fell off cradel

james Hosford
 

If it had good repairs and a survey how concerned would you be?


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sm fell off cradel

Mark Erdos
 

PM sent

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Santa Marta, Colombia

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2018 5:37 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sm fell off cradel

 

 

I went through my emails from the Amel Yahoo group and could not find the message describing the Super Maramu that fell off a cradle. Could someone please forward it to me?  Jfpottercys” at” att.net

 

          Thanks, Joel

 

          JOEL F. POTTER-CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST~L.L.C.

                                           THE  EXPERIENCED AMEL GUY

UNSURPASSED AMEL MARKETING EXPERIENCE AND PRODUCT KNOWLEDGE

                                   Office 954-462-5869  Cell 954-812-2485                                                 

From: amelyachtowners@...
Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2018 3:28 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sm fell off cradel

 

 

Very.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Santa Marta, Colombia

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2018 5:09 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sm fell off cradel

 

 


If it had good repairs and a survey how concerned would you be?


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Yahoo Group Amel Register

Alin SM 283
 

Hi Alan. Great idea, thank you.
My boat : Wanderer, SM 2k, hull 283, Whangaroa NZ
Owner Alin Misescu
Come for a visit , my number is 0220299786.
Regards
Alin 


On Sat, 15 Dec 2018 at 20:40, pepinoamel
wrote:
 

Hi Alan,

Thanks for starting the list.  I think it's a good idea, in case we meet some Amel owners on the water, we'll know who they are.  I've tried to add my boat to your list but I can only do that in my own file.  You might have to add it on the Forum.  My boat is SM381 Pepino, UK flag, owner Gerhard Hoffmann.


Thanks.


Gerhard Hoffmann

SM381 Pepino

Greece


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sm fell off cradel

Mark Erdos
 

Very.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Santa Marta, Colombia

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2018 5:09 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sm fell off cradel

 

 


If it had good repairs and a survey how concerned would you be?


Re: Toe pulley (headsail)

carcodespam@...
 

Truncated mail address part missed is: kohlhoff-online.de

Gerhard
Sharki #60


Re: Toe pulley (headsail)

carcodespam@...
 

email address truncated part: kohlhoff-online.de


Re: Toe pulley (headsail)

carcodespam@...
 

Hi Steve,

Henrik Rasmussen ( Henrik@... ) , from the german distributor company Kohlhoff of Andersen has offered to me the Line Tender winsch for 543.23 Euro plus shipping some days ago.
You may email Henrik with: Henrik@...

Gerhard
Sharki #60


Re: Toe pulley (headsail)

Steven Bode - SV Intention 1994-SM#117
 

Andersen Line Tender Availability Update: Just came from the Salon Nautic Paris Boat Show and inquired at the Ronstan booth (Ronstan bought Andersen) and they did called their HQ to see about getting me one and they do not have any availability of these or ANY Andersen Line Tenders. The word I got from a seemingly very knowledgable guy in the booth was "no more line tenders left, with no expectation that there ever will be. 
I have been therefore searching online for a used one to use for my new mizzen traveller setup with no luck. 
I talked to Antal who makes a line tender (they call it a line driver) for about €500. They also have an electric one. I did not inquire into the price of that lovely. I may suck it up and use that one when I give up on finding a used Andersen.
FYI, I was educated my Ronstan that there are three different versions of the Andersen Line Tender on my '94 SM (#117); 1. Main Traveller winch, 2, electric Mainsail outhaul winch and 3. Genoa Sheet fairlead adjuster winch.
Does anyone know what Amel is using in their new boats?

If anyone has a used Andersen Winch or a line on one, please let me know.

Capt. Steve Bode
SV Intention
1994 Amel Super Maramu #117



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel 55 Kincsem

Joerg Esdorn
 

First of all sorry for the message which was intended for the administrator only. Im learning how the Forum works. But yes, my boat is named after the most successful race horse of all time, The Hungarian mare Kincsem which won all 54 races it entered. But the name has nothing to do with the build number or length of my boat or those 54 races. Rather, I used to have a couple of race boats by that name and we just kept the name for the Amel. I still like to go fast.....


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] more insurance games for the Caribbean

Ryan Meador
 

My policy is through Pantaenius America, and I have that same restrictive language in it. I quizzed the rep about it when I renewed, and she said most companies will only offer "North/south" coverage, where you can be in the Caribbean for the winter only. She said for boats valued over $300k, you can still get year-round Caribbean coverage, but few if any carriers offer it for lower-value boats.

Ryan & Kelly
SM 233 Iteration
Le Marin, Martinique

On Wed, Dec 12, 2018, 8:02 PM Kent Robertson karkauai@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@... wrote:
 

I have Jackline Policy with the Gowrie Group.  It’s expensive, but few companies are willing to cover now.
Here’s the contact info:

Rachel Sloan

Jackline Account Manager

International Marine Insurance Services by Gowrie Group

522 Chesapeake Ave, Annapolis, MD 21403

p: 410.364.7707  f: 410.827.3758

rachel.imis@...

www.gowrie.com/imis


Kent & Iris
Kristy
SM 243

On Dec 11, 2018, at 2:12 PM, john.biohead@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

My current insurer (TopSail UK) informed me, shortly after their invitation to renew by the way,  that they will not be able to renew my policy due to changes in the underwriters requirements.  


I followed the advice on the forum checking with a few other providers, including Y-Yacht and Pantaenius US.  Both reported that they could not provide coverage.  That left me a bit unnerved...I have been with the same company for years without issue, have no claims, keep the insured amount reasonable, and have not changed the use or location of the vessel. 


Y-yacht reported that they were not allowed to provide coverage to a US vessel due to licensing.  It was not clear if that is due to the homeport location or flag)


I pressed Pantaenius US  for a reason and their response it that it is the vessel location in the Caribbean.  Their exact response is that no coverage is provided:  "South of 30.5 degrees north latitude in the Atlantic Ocean, inland waters, Caribbean Sea, Gulf of Mexico, and the Panama Canal, between July 15th and November 1st,"

That seems to be an awfully large area with zero yacht insurance?  I asked about the southern limit, IE is Grenada OK...nope there is no southern limit.  

Can this be correct?

Regards,  John

SV Annie SM 37

Carriacou


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Yahoo Group Amel Register

Brent Cameron
 


Re: Yahoo Group Amel Register

Alan Leslie
 

Thanks Gerhard,

Yes it's a bit clumsy, I thought people would be able to edit it, but it seems only the document owner can do that.

But that's OK, I don't mind..
Cheers
Alan
Elyse SM437