On 24 Jan 2020, at 08:36, Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote:

My 2 cents on this:

 

I prefer not to have my feed from this group junked up with people selling Amel shirts, books on Amel travels, blogs with Amel owners, video channels featuring Amels etc. 

 

While I’m sure Julie is a nice person and is passionate about her book, this is not the forum for self-promotion. She needs to establish a commercial fund to promote her book rather than trying the self promote “free” route at our expense. She can, at no-charge start a fan-club page on FaceBook, promote her page using paid ads and grow her membership. People wishing to follow her awaiting for the trilogy can do so. 

 

This is what is stated on the front page of our group:

This Group frowns on commercial postings, however we encourage postings which will genuinely help Amel owners source needed parts and services. We encourage you to support the Amel brand and be respectful to the brand in your postings. Care should be taken to not post anything that could be considered offensive or derogatory regarding Amel, any Member, or Sponsor. Please refrain from political issues, rude, or inappropriate language. Please refrain from criticism of persons or businesses which you may have experienced unsatisfactory results, because it would be one-sided, without the ability of the other side to respond.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Vista Mar, Panama

www.creampuff.us

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mark Pitt
Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2020 5:54 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Crossing Pirate Waters

 

I am with Brian and most of the others in support of Julie's posting.  Her book is about sailing an Amel and that makes all of the difference.  I too would not have known about it without her first post many months ago. I bought her book and enjoyed reading it in part due to the Amel angle.

   Mark Pitt

Sabbatical III, SM#419

On 1/23/2020 4:48 PM, CW Bill Rouse wrote:

I do not think anyone argued the value of Julie's book. Some people wrote to me about it because they felt it was too commercial.  "Too" is in the mind of individuals i

 

We are currently working on a solution that will satisfy those for and against promoting commercial interests. We envision creating a sub-group for commercial postings that members would need to opt-in to the group.

 

I may be a few days or a few weeks.

--

<image001.jpg>	CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School  +1 832-380-4970 | brouse@... Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550   Website: www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com  <image002.jpg> <image002.jpg> <image002.jpg>

View My Training Calendar <image003.jpg>

 

 

On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 10:57 AM Brian Riggs <7briggs@...> wrote:

I've got both books in my Amazon cart now, and I'm looking forward to reading them. I would have never known about these two books without the blurb on here. I'm throwing my hand up in support of this type of advertising as well. Everything else has already been said.

 

Cheer!

Brian Riggs

Future SM Owner

Hampton Roads Area

I am with Brian and most of the others in support of Julie's posting.  Her book is about sailing an Amel and that makes all of the difference.  I too would not have known about it without her first post many months ago. I bought her book and enjoyed reading it in part due to the Amel angle.

   Mark Pitt

Sabbatical III, SM#419

I do not think anyone argued the value of Julie's book. Some people wrote to me about it because they felt it was too commercial.  "Too" is in the mind of individuals i

 

We are currently working on a solution that will satisfy those for and against promoting commercial interests. We envision creating a sub-group for commercial postings that members would need to opt-in to the group.

 

I may be a few days or a few weeks.

--

	CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School +1 832-380-4970 | brouse@... Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550  Website: www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com

 

View My Training Calendar

 

 

On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 10:57 AM Brian Riggs <7briggs@...> wrote:

I've got both books in my Amazon cart now, and I'm looking forward to reading them. I would have never known about these two books without the blurb on here. I'm throwing my hand up in support of this type of advertising as well. Everything else has already been said.

 

Cheer!

Brian Riggs

Future SM Owner

Hampton Roads Area

I do not think anyone argued the value of Julie's book. Some people wrote to me about it because they felt it was too commercial.  "Too" is in the mind of individuals i

We are currently working on a solution that will satisfy those for and against promoting commercial interests. We envision creating a sub-group for commercial postings that members would need to opt-in to the group.

I may be a few days or a few weeks.

--

	CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School +1 832-380-4970 | brouse@... Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550  Website: www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com

View My Training Calendar

On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 10:57 AM Brian Riggs <7briggs@...> wrote:

I've got both books in my Amazon cart now, and I'm looking forward to reading them. I would have never known about these two books without the blurb on here. I'm throwing my hand up in support of this type of advertising as well. Everything else has already been said.

Cheer!

Brian Riggs

Future SM Owner

Hampton Roads Area

Hi Matt , Thanks for letting us know what Amel have fitted to your boat , could you comment on how effective it is and in what situations you use it , ie berthed in  home  marina , visiting other marinas ,, in Europe or Elsewhere , Many Thanks ,  Micky Ball (Future Amel SM owner )

FWIW I appreciated the original post. I bought Julie's first book and will consider buying the sequel. I had some minor quibbles with the first book, but in general, it was a pleasant read. I should think it pertains to all of our interests (and benefits us by raising Amel's profile).

Not sure how this is any different from others advertising their Amel-adjacent pursuits.

Thanks all!

kelly + ryan

SM233 Iteration

Boston

On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 9:33 AM CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:

The posting was removed, the person posting was talked to and their status set to "moderated."

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Amel Owners Yacht School - www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970

On Thu, Jan 23, 2020, 1:33 AM Dave Ritten <daveritten@...> wrote:

I hate this spam advertising. It feels bad.

--
Dave Ritten
Auckland
Prospective SM Owner

Ryan, I fully agree with you on this.  I also read her first book and found it quite interesting… especially the parts about buying the Amel  at the factory in La Rochelle and their very first experience in a Bay of Biscay storm taking it away and then learning more as they went on.  I don’t see any difference either with some of the other posts here as you suggest.  If it was a book about just sailing or something else and had no ties to Amel, then that would be different but, in my mind at least, it isn’t any different than other posters who loosely (in context) advertise their services or YouTube channels (which very often contain exactly the same kind of helpful advice as is found on these forums).  I do very much appreciate that we aren’t subjected to a lot of advertising here but a single post taking about a new book about a trip doing what many of us buy Amel’s for that took place on an Amel is not out of place and I think people were too quick to shut it down without also looking at all of the other similar posts that others have no issue with.   I think that anything that contributes to the brand or to our further understanding of the boats is fair game on these forums.    I like the posts talking about the surveys, sails, schools, brokerages, maintenance and even just sailing places videos.  Frankly, far more has already been written on this than the original post even took up.  Anyway, that’s my two cents.  For those who are triggered by these discussions, there is a link you can click when you first see the topic to “mute this topic” and you will never see anything on it (or Antennas if you like!) ever again.  LOL 

Brent Cameron, Future Amel owner & Amel Owner's Registry Moderator

--
Brent Cameron

Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator

Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada

Since my original post I have read the responses (thank you all) and trawled the web.  There maybe others like me treading this path so I thought I’d share what I’ve learned/concluded so far.  One caveat, I’m a very modestly technically literate sailor, definitely not an RF, electronics or networking engineer. If I have made any silly errors please let me know, I’m keen to learn.

 

I’m not currently aboard so doing much of my layout thinking from memory.

 

To recap the requirement: I’m going to be cruising the Mediterranean and want to be able to access the internet. Ideally, I’d like to able to get weather forecasts whilst coastal sailing offshore/between islands, subject to the limits of 4G coverage of course. Budget: Conscious that cheapest isn’t always the best, I’d rather spend a bit more to get performance and quality than save a bit but regret it later.

 

 

(a) Prioritise 4G/LTE over Wi-Fi. A number of people have commented how Wi-Fi systems are often overloaded and slow, that 4G provides better data rates.

 

(b) It’s more cost effective (and satisfying) to assemble my own system than buying a turnkey setup (e.g. DigitalYacht, Red Box etc). I’ve found a couple of exceptions to this but they have a major downside with the SIM card being badly located – more on this later.

 

(c) Antenna

Use an external omni-directional antenna (vs. one down below).

 

Keep the cable run from antenna to modem/router as short as possible to minimise losses. Mounting the antenna high up is less important than keeping the cable run short. This leads me to thinking possible locations for the antenna are: mizzen spreader / aft rail or arch / between the backstays. Least attractive is on top of the mizzen mast due to the distance.

 

Use LMR-400 coax cable if the cable routing permits.

 

To get the benefit of 4G/LTE a MIMO antenna is needed. The Poynting OMNI-402 gets very good reviews on build quality  but it’s expensive at UK£290 (https://www.solwise.co.uk/4g-antenna-omni-402). One or two articles seem to challenge the benefit of a MIMO antenna https://seabits.com/poynting-omni-antenna-testing/ and https://novaroundbritain.home.blog/2019/10/18/internet/ and maybe a simpler OMNI-291 (UK£144) SISO antenna would deliver pretty much the same performance (still very good build quality) but at half the cost.

 

I have looked at a couple of integrated solutions such as the WEBBOAT 4G LITE from Glomex (€609) https://shop.glomex.it/en/webboat-coastal-internet/660-it1104-webboat-coastal-internet-4g-wi-fi.html and Solwise QuSpot omni LTE/4G (UK£452) https://www.solwise.co.uk/WI-AX11S which have the antenna, 4G modem (SIM card) and router all integrated into the antenna dome. These look cost effective, eliminate antenna cable losses and look simpler to install however it means regular access to the SIM card is a problem if installed on a spreader or between the backstays. Why the need for SIM card access? From what I can understand there’s a need to either return to the UK with my UK SIM card every few months to maintain the EU roaming or to buy a SIM card in each country as the EU roaming expires. Either way regular access to the SIM card is needed.

 

(d) 4G Modem/Router

The Teltonika RUT 240 (UK£124) https://www.solwise.co.uk/4g-routers-rut240.html looks like it’ll do the job. The LAN port means I can one day connect an NMEA bridge should I want to. One could spend a little more and get the Teltonika  950 (UK£166) https://www.solwise.co.uk/4g-routers-rut950.html as this has 3 LAN ports which leave room for more expansion.

 

Location of the router will be determined by where the antenna cable enters from above (I’m not aboard at present). I’m assuming with a GRP structure WiFi propagation from the pilot berth or aft cabin (likely router locations) throughout the boat should be adequate, certainly to the saloon and aft cabin.

 

(e) WiFi

Assuming marina/cafe provided WiFi data capacity will be usually poor I may still buy a WL-Patriot-DB (UK£87) https://www.solwise.co.uk/wireless-Patriot-DB to at least try in each location. This would plug into the WAN port of the router. It’s powered over ethernet which simplifies matters. I’d either locate it somewhere inside or stick it outside temporarily via a porthole maybe.  It’s IP65 rated so if its outside in a rain shower it should be okay, but I’d be reluctant to mount it permanently outside.

 

 

Comments and suggestions encouraged.

--
David Crisp
SV Wilna Grace
Amel 54 #58

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of David Crisp
Sent: 23 January 2020 07:25
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Mobile communications - 4G, WiFi

Since my original post I have read the responses (thank you all) and trawled the web.  There maybe others like me treading this path so I thought I’d share what I’ve learned/concluded so far.  One caveat, I’m a very modestly technically literate sailor, definitely not an RF, electronics or networking engineer. If I have made any silly errors please let me know, I’m keen to learn.

I’m not currently aboard so doing much of my layout thinking from memory.

To recap the requirement: I’m going to be cruising the Mediterranean and want to be able to access the internet. Ideally, I’d like to able to get weather forecasts whilst coastal sailing offshore/between islands, subject to the limits of 4G coverage of course. Budget: Conscious that cheapest isn’t always the best, I’d rather spend a bit more to get performance and quality than save a bit but regret it later.

(a) Prioritise 4G/LTE over Wi-Fi. A number of people have commented how Wi-Fi systems are often overloaded and slow, that 4G provides better data rates.

(b) It’s more cost effective (and satisfying) to assemble my own system than buying a turnkey setup (e.g. DigitalYacht, Red Box etc). I’ve found a couple of exceptions to this but they have a major downside with the SIM card being badly located – more on this later.

(c) Antenna

Use an external omni-directional antenna (vs. one down below).

Keep the cable run from antenna to modem/router as short as possible to minimise losses. Mounting the antenna high up is less important than keeping the cable run short. This leads me to thinking possible locations for the antenna are: mizzen spreader / aft rail or arch / between the backstays. Least attractive is on top of the mizzen mast due to the distance.

Use LMR-400 coax cable if the cable routing permits.

To get the benefit of 4G/LTE a MIMO antenna is needed. The Poynting OMNI-402 gets very good reviews on build quality  but it’s expensive at UK£290 (https://www.solwise.co.uk/4g-antenna-omni-402). One or two articles seem to challenge the benefit of a MIMO antenna https://seabits.com/poynting-omni-antenna-testing/ and https://novaroundbritain.home.blog/2019/10/18/internet/ and maybe a simpler OMNI-291 (UK£144) SISO antenna would deliver pretty much the same performance (still very good build quality) but at half the cost.

I have looked at a couple of integrated solutions such as the WEBBOAT 4G LITE from Glomex (€609) https://shop.glomex.it/en/webboat-coastal-internet/660-it1104-webboat-coastal-internet-4g-wi-fi.html and Solwise QuSpot omni LTE/4G (UK£452) https://www.solwise.co.uk/WI-AX11S which have the antenna, 4G modem (SIM card) and router all integrated into the antenna dome. These look cost effective, eliminate antenna cable losses and look simpler to install however it means regular access to the SIM card is a problem if installed on a spreader or between the backstays. Why the need for SIM card access? From what I can understand there’s a need to either return to the UK with my UK SIM card every few months to maintain the EU roaming or to buy a SIM card in each country as the EU roaming expires. Either way regular access to the SIM card is needed.

(d) 4G Modem/Router

The Teltonika RUT 240 (UK£124) https://www.solwise.co.uk/4g-routers-rut240.html looks like it’ll do the job. The LAN port means I can one day connect an NMEA bridge should I want to. One could spend a little more and get the Teltonika  950 (UK£166) https://www.solwise.co.uk/4g-routers-rut950.html as this has 3 LAN ports which leave room for more expansion.

Location of the router will be determined by where the antenna cable enters from above (I’m not aboard at present). I’m assuming with a GRP structure WiFi propagation from the pilot berth or aft cabin (likely router locations) throughout the boat should be adequate, certainly to the saloon and aft cabin.

(e) WiFi

Assuming marina/cafe provided WiFi data capacity will be usually poor I may still buy a WL-Patriot-DB (UK£87) https://www.solwise.co.uk/wireless-Patriot-DB to at least try in each location. This would plug into the WAN port of the router. It’s powered over ethernet which simplifies matters. I’d either locate it somewhere inside or stick it outside temporarily via a porthole maybe.  It’s IP65 rated so if its outside in a rain shower it should be okay, but I’d be reluctant to mount it permanently outside.

Comments and suggestions encouraged.

--
David Crisp
SV Wilna Grace
Amel 54 #58