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Re: Limiting group members to Amel Owners
Courtney and Porter,
Agreed 100%. I could not have said it better.
Almost a year ago, when we moved to the groups,io platform, we made it clear that our group included Amel owners and those interested in the Amel brand. Since then about half of the new members have been those interested in the Amel brand. A significant number of those new members interested in the Amel brand have bought either a new or used Amel. Of course, we all understand the benefits to Amel, Amel owners, and interested parties.
We are working on a unique solution to the "commercial posting" issue which will satisfy both sides with a bonus for every member. Some of the details need some work before it is presented to the moderators for their consideration, but I am certain it will satisfy everyone.
On Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 9:51 AM Courtney Gorman via Groups.Io <Itsfun1= aol.com@groups.io> wrote: I agree with Porter But let’s self limit some of the strong opinions that get expressed especially those new non owners Sincerely Courtney svTrippin 54 #101 Grenada 🇬🇩 On Jan 24, 2020, at 11:34 AM, Porter McRoberts via Groups.Io <portermcroberts=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
It was being a lurker on this forum years ago which confirmed, for me, that an Amel was the right boat for our family. Now 3 years in and 20,000 miles later I’m so thankful, not only for the fine vessel (A54-152) we own but also this incredible group of thoughtful and intelligent members. My vote is to keep it open to those with Amel interests, not just owners. Porter McRoberts A54-152 IBIS. Excuse the errors. Sent from my IPhone On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 04:50 PM, David Cummane wrote:
Quite galling also to read non-amel owners inappropriately throwing their weight around. Should the forum be restricted to owners only?
There isn't so much traffic on it that it bothers me. And any on here are probably looking to buy an amel, and as some of us are selling their amels, maybe allowing amel owners and serious wannabes is not such a bad thing.
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Re: Limiting group members to Amel Owners
Courtney Gorman
I agree with Porter But let’s self limit some of the strong opinions that get expressed especially those new non owners Sincerely Courtney svTrippin 54 #101
On Jan 24, 2020, at 11:34 AM, Porter McRoberts via Groups.Io <portermcroberts@...> wrote:
It was being a lurker on this forum years ago which confirmed, for me, that an Amel was the right boat for our family. Now 3 years in and 20,000 miles later I’m so thankful, not only for the fine vessel (A54-152) we own but also this incredible group of thoughtful and intelligent members. My vote is to keep it open to those with Amel interests, not just owners. Porter McRoberts A54-152 IBIS. Excuse the errors. Sent from my IPhone Www.fouribis.com On Jan 24, 2020, at 7:40 AM, Davi Rozgonyi <davi.rozgonyi@...> wrote:
On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 04:50 PM, David Cummane wrote:
Quite galling also to read non-amel owners inappropriately throwing their weight around. Should the forum be restricted to owners only?
There isn't so much traffic on it that it bothers me. And any on here are probably looking to buy an amel, and as some of us are selling their amels, maybe allowing amel owners and serious wannabes is not such a bad thing.
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Limiting group members to Amel Owners
It was being a lurker on this forum years ago which confirmed, for me, that an Amel was the right boat for our family. Now 3 years in and 20,000 miles later I’m so thankful, not only for the fine vessel (A54-152) we own but also this incredible group of thoughtful and intelligent members. My vote is to keep it open to those with Amel interests, not just owners. Porter McRoberts A54-152 IBIS. Excuse the errors. Sent from my IPhone Www.fouribis.com
On Jan 24, 2020, at 7:40 AM, Davi Rozgonyi <davi.rozgonyi@...> wrote:
On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 04:50 PM, David Cummane wrote:
Quite galling also to read non-amel owners inappropriately throwing their weight around. Should the forum be restricted to owners only?
There isn't so much traffic on it that it bothers me. And any on here are probably looking to buy an amel, and as some of us are selling their amels, maybe allowing amel owners and serious wannabes is not such a bad thing.
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Re: Crossing Pirate Waters
Davi Rozgonyi
On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 04:50 PM, David Cummane wrote:
Quite galling also to read non-amel owners inappropriately throwing their weight around. Should the forum be restricted to owners only?
There isn't so much traffic on it that it bothers me. And any on here are probably looking to buy an amel, and as some of us are selling their amels, maybe allowing amel owners and serious wannabes is not such a bad thing.
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Re: Crossing Pirate Waters
Mark and Paul. Spot on. More respect for ‘moderator’ Bill wouldn’t go amiss either. The forum is a non commercial, excellent resource for Amel owners, being information based and apolitical, with clear guidelines for use. Opinions on so called commercial enterprises are irrelevant and should be barred.
Quite galling also to read non-amel owners inappropriately throwing their weight around. Should the forum be restricted to owners only?
David
Ker Marie SM#101
On 23 Jan 2020, at 21:36, Mark Erdos < mcerdos@...> wrote:
My 2 cents on this: I prefer not to have my feed from this group junked up with people selling Amel shirts, books on Amel travels, blogs with Amel owners, video channels featuring Amels etc. While I’m sure Julie is a nice person and is passionate about her book, this is not the forum for self-promotion. She needs to establish a commercial fund to promote her book rather than trying the self promote “free” route at our expense. She can, at no-charge start a fan-club page on FaceBook, promote her page using paid ads and grow her membership. People wishing to follow her awaiting for the trilogy can do so. This is what is stated on the front page of our group: This Group frowns on commercial postings, however we encourage postings which will genuinely help Amel owners source needed parts and services. We encourage you to support the Amel brand and be respectful to the brand in your postings. Care should be taken to not post anything that could be considered offensive or derogatory regarding Amel, any Member, or Sponsor. Please refrain from political issues, rude, or inappropriate language. Please refrain from criticism of persons or businesses which you may have experienced unsatisfactory results, because it would be one-sided, without the ability of the other side to respond. With best regards, Mark Skipper Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275 Currently cruising - Vista Mar, Panama I am with Brian and most of the others in support of Julie's posting. Her book is about sailing an Amel and that makes all of the difference. I too would not have known about it without her first post many months ago. I bought her book and enjoyed reading it in part due to the Amel angle. Mark Pitt Sabbatical III, SM#419 On 1/23/2020 4:48 PM, CW Bill Rouse wrote: I do not think anyone argued the value of Julie's book. Some people wrote to me about it because they felt it was too commercial. "Too" is in the mind of individuals i We are currently working on a solution that will satisfy those for and against promoting commercial interests. We envision creating a sub-group for commercial postings that members would need to opt-in to the group. I may be a few days or a few weeks.
--
| CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School | | | Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 | |
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On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 10:57 AM Brian Riggs < 7briggs@...> wrote: I've got both books in my Amazon cart now, and I'm looking forward to reading them. I would have never known about these two books without the blurb on here. I'm throwing my hand up in support of this type of advertising as well. Everything else has already been said.
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Re: Crossing Pirate Waters
Paul Brown
I too support maintaining focus of this groups postings, the group is undoubtably a great resource and to receive valuable information with every post, however as there is so much email traffic regarding helpful hints and great Amel owner information, commercial and social communication between few members cause email traffic that should not be shared and cloud us as receivers, as there is no way to filter what is regarded as junk to many.
Kind regards, Paul - FORTUNA II Amel 55/#17
On 24 Jan 2020, at 08:36, Mark Erdos < mcerdos@...> wrote:
My 2 cents on this: I prefer not to have my feed from this group junked up with people selling Amel shirts, books on Amel travels, blogs with Amel owners, video channels featuring Amels etc. While I’m sure Julie is a nice person and is passionate about her book, this is not the forum for self-promotion. She needs to establish a commercial fund to promote her book rather than trying the self promote “free” route at our expense. She can, at no-charge start a fan-club page on FaceBook, promote her page using paid ads and grow her membership. People wishing to follow her awaiting for the trilogy can do so. This is what is stated on the front page of our group: This Group frowns on commercial postings, however we encourage postings which will genuinely help Amel owners source needed parts and services. We encourage you to support the Amel brand and be respectful to the brand in your postings. Care should be taken to not post anything that could be considered offensive or derogatory regarding Amel, any Member, or Sponsor. Please refrain from political issues, rude, or inappropriate language. Please refrain from criticism of persons or businesses which you may have experienced unsatisfactory results, because it would be one-sided, without the ability of the other side to respond. With best regards, Mark Skipper Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275 Currently cruising - Vista Mar, Panama I am with Brian and most of the others in support of Julie's posting. Her book is about sailing an Amel and that makes all of the difference. I too would not have known about it without her first post many months ago. I bought her book and enjoyed reading it in part due to the Amel angle. Mark Pitt Sabbatical III, SM#419 On 1/23/2020 4:48 PM, CW Bill Rouse wrote: I do not think anyone argued the value of Julie's book. Some people wrote to me about it because they felt it was too commercial. "Too" is in the mind of individuals i We are currently working on a solution that will satisfy those for and against promoting commercial interests. We envision creating a sub-group for commercial postings that members would need to opt-in to the group. I may be a few days or a few weeks.
--
| CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School | | | Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 | |
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On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 10:57 AM Brian Riggs < 7briggs@...> wrote: I've got both books in my Amazon cart now, and I'm looking forward to reading them. I would have never known about these two books without the blurb on here. I'm throwing my hand up in support of this type of advertising as well. Everything else has already been said.
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I have found many things are just not available from Amel. I have a 54 and it has the Passarella that you put on Manually. The holes and in need of replacing. Amel does not have them.
Also I thought I would get a new main sail halyard. Again no. "The computer says, no" Has anyone else had to source these?
Regards,
Randall
A-54 #56
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Re: Crossing Pirate Waters
Mark Erdos
My 2 cents on this:
I prefer not to
have my feed from this group junked up with people selling Amel shirts, books
on Amel travels, blogs with Amel owners, video channels featuring Amels etc.
While I’m sure
Julie is a nice person and is passionate about her book, this is not the forum
for self-promotion. She needs to establish a commercial fund to promote her
book rather than trying the self promote “free” route at our expense. She can,
at no-charge start a fan-club page on FaceBook, promote her page using paid ads
and grow her membership. People wishing to follow her awaiting for the trilogy
can do so.
This is what is
stated on the front page of our group:
This Group frowns on commercial postings, however we encourage postings which will genuinely help Amel
owners source needed parts and services. We encourage you to support the Amel
brand and be respectful to the brand in your postings. Care should be taken to
not post anything that could be considered offensive or derogatory regarding
Amel, any Member, or Sponsor. Please refrain from political issues, rude, or
inappropriate language. Please refrain from criticism of persons or businesses
which you may have experienced unsatisfactory results, because it would be
one-sided, without the ability of the other side to respond.
With best
regards,
Mark
Skipper
Sailing Vessel
- Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
Currently
cruising - Vista Mar, Panama
www.creampuff.us
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
[mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mark Pitt
Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2020 5:54 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Crossing Pirate Waters
I am with Brian and most of the others in support of Julie's posting.
Her book is about sailing an Amel and that makes all of the difference. I
too would not have known about it without her first post many months ago. I
bought her book and enjoyed reading it in part due to the Amel angle.
Mark Pitt
Sabbatical III, SM#419
On 1/23/2020 4:48 PM, CW Bill Rouse wrote:
I do not
think anyone argued the value of Julie's book. Some people wrote to me about it
because they felt it was too commercial. "Too" is in the mind
of individuals i
We are currently
working on a solution that will satisfy those for and against promoting
commercial interests. We envision creating a sub-group for commercial postings
that members would need to opt-in to the group.
I may be a
few days or a few weeks.
--
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CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
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Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas
77550
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On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 10:57 AM Brian Riggs <7briggs@...> wrote:
I've got both books in my Amazon cart now, and I'm looking
forward to reading them. I would have never known about these two books without
the blurb on here. I'm throwing my hand up in support of this type of
advertising as well. Everything else has already been said.
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Re: Crossing Pirate Waters
I am with Brian and most of the others in support of Julie's
posting. Her book is about sailing an Amel and that makes all of
the difference. I too would not have known about it without her
first post many months ago. I bought her book and enjoyed reading
it in part due to the Amel angle.
Mark Pitt
Sabbatical III, SM#419
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On 1/23/2020 4:48 PM, CW Bill Rouse
wrote:
I do not
think anyone argued the value of Julie's book. Some people
wrote to me about it because they felt it was too commercial.
"Too" is in the mind of individuals i
We are
currently working on a solution that will satisfy those for
and against promoting commercial interests. We envision
creating a sub-group for commercial postings that members
would need to opt-in to the group.
I may be
a few days or a few weeks.
--
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| CW
Bill Rouse Amel
Owners Yacht School |
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Address:
720
Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550
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On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 10:57
AM Brian Riggs < 7briggs@...> wrote:
I've got both books in my Amazon cart now, and I'm
looking forward to reading them. I would have never known
about these two books without the blurb on here. I'm
throwing my hand up in support of this type of advertising
as well. Everything else has already been said.
Cheer!
Brian Riggs
Future SM Owner
Hampton Roads Area
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Re: Crossing Pirate Waters
I do not think anyone argued the value of Julie's book. Some people wrote to me about it because they felt it was too commercial. "Too" is in the mind of individuals i
We are currently working on a solution that will satisfy those for and against promoting commercial interests. We envision creating a sub-group for commercial postings that members would need to opt-in to the group.
I may be a few days or a few weeks.
--
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CW Bill Rouse
Amel Owners Yacht School
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Address:
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550
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On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 10:57 AM Brian Riggs < 7briggs@...> wrote: I've got both books in my Amazon cart now, and I'm looking forward to reading them. I would have never known about these two books without the blurb on here. I'm throwing my hand up in support of this type of advertising as well. Everything else has already been said.
Cheer! Brian Riggs Future SM Owner Hampton Roads Area
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Re: Mobile communications - 4G, WiFi
Matt Salatino
Hi Micky, I would love to give you that feedback, but we don’t step aboard until mid March. I would give a full report after that, though..... ~~~⛵️~~~Matt
On Jan 23, 2020, at 4:23 PM, mik-ball Ball < mik-ball@...> wrote: Hi Matt , Thanks for letting us know what Amel have fitted to your boat , could you comment on how effective it is and in what situations you use it , ie berthed in home marina , visiting other marinas ,, in Europe or Elsewhere , Many Thanks , Micky Ball (Future Amel SM owner )
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Re: Mobile communications - 4G, WiFi
Micky Ball
Hi Matt , Thanks for letting us know what Amel have fitted to your boat , could you comment on how effective it is and in what situations you use it , ie berthed in home marina , visiting other marinas ,, in Europe or Elsewhere , Many Thanks , Micky Ball (Future Amel SM owner )
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Re: Crossing Pirate Waters
Ian Townsend
Hi Kelly. Sorry we missed you guys in the Boston area this summer.
Not quite sure what is meant by other AMEL-adjacent pursuits. I have seen several forum members who are quite active, who provide much-needed free and timely guidance to others, often help out when we need parts custom manufactured (and always provide this service at cost) or mention their relevant support services (after giving free advice). However, the post we are debating is form a source that is quite different. This was someone, not active on the forum, not an owner, who posted purely for selling reasons. This is what I take umbrage with.
Apologies if I have missed or misinterpreted something
Ian & Margaret S/V Loca Lola II SM153 Bahamas
On Jan 23, 2020, at 10:21 AM, Kelly Ran < naryllek@...> wrote: FWIW I appreciated the original post. I bought Julie's first book and will consider buying the sequel. I had some minor quibbles with the first book, but in general, it was a pleasant read. I should think it pertains to all of our interests (and benefits us by raising Amel's profile). Not sure how this is any different from others advertising their Amel-adjacent pursuits. Thanks all!
kelly + ryan SM233 Iteration Boston On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 9:33 AM CW Bill Rouse < brouse@...> wrote: The posting was removed, the person posting was talked to and their status set to "moderated."
I hate this spam advertising. It feels bad.
--
Dave Ritten
Auckland
Prospective SM Owner
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Re: Crossing Pirate Waters
Brent Cameron
I’m sorry Kelly. I did mean you then! I guess I’m used to seeing Ryan and made the leap. Nice to meet you! Great minds and all that.....
Brent Cameron, Future Amel owner & Amel Owner's Registry Moderator
-- Brent Cameron
Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator
Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada
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Re: Crossing Pirate Waters
I've got both books in my Amazon cart now, and I'm looking forward to reading them. I would have never known about these two books without the blurb on here. I'm throwing my hand up in support of this type of advertising as well. Everything else has already been said.
Cheer! Brian Riggs Future SM Owner Hampton Roads Area
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Re: Crossing Pirate Waters
Hi Brent,
I believe you were responding to me (Kelly), not my husband Ryan. We're both active on this list. Glad to hear we're in agreement, though. LOL!
kelly (and ryan)
SM233 Iteration
Boston
Ryan, I fully agree with you on this. I also read her first book and found it quite interesting… especially the parts about buying the Amel at the factory in La Rochelle and their very first experience in a Bay of Biscay storm taking it away and then learning more as they went on. I don’t see any difference either with some of the other posts here as you suggest. If it was a book about just sailing or something else and had no ties to Amel, then that would be different but, in my mind at least, it isn’t any different than other posters who loosely (in context) advertise their services or YouTube channels (which very often contain exactly the same kind of helpful advice as is found on these forums). I do very much appreciate that we aren’t subjected to a lot of advertising here but a single post taking about a new book about a trip doing what many of us buy Amel’s for that took place on an Amel is not out of place and I think people were too quick to shut it down without also looking at all of the other similar posts that others have no issue with. I think that anything that contributes to the brand or to our further understanding of the boats is fair game on these forums. I like the posts talking about the surveys, sails, schools, brokerages, maintenance and even just sailing places videos. Frankly, far more has already been written on this than the original post even took up. Anyway, that’s my two cents. For those who are triggered by these discussions, there is a link you can click when you first see the topic to “mute this topic” and you will never see anything on it (or Antennas if you like!) ever again. LOL
Brent Cameron, Future Amel owner & Amel Owner's Registry Moderator
--
Brent Cameron
Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator
Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada
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Re: Crossing Pirate Waters
Ross Hickey & Donna Hammond
I also bought both books after seeing them advertised through this forum. Reading of another couple who sailed their Amel SM around the world is both informative and inspiring. After all this forum is about learning from other people’s experience and sharing information.
I support this form of advertisement.
Ross and Donna SV INTREPID KIWI SM2K #356
On Thursday, January 23, 2020, 5:26 pm, Brent Cameron <brentcameron61@...> wrote:
Ryan, I fully agree with you on this. I also read her first book and found it quite interesting… especially the parts about buying the Amel at the factory in La Rochelle and their very first experience in a Bay of Biscay storm taking it away and then learning more as they went on. I don’t see any difference either with some of the other posts here as you suggest. If it was a book about just sailing or something else and had no ties to Amel, then that would be different but, in my mind at least, it isn’t any different than other posters who loosely (in context) advertise their services or YouTube channels (which very often contain exactly the same kind of helpful advice as is found on these forums). I do very much appreciate that we aren’t subjected to a lot of advertising here but a single post taking about a new book about a trip doing what many of us buy Amel’s for that took place on an Amel is not out of place and I think people were too quick to shut it down without also looking at all of the other similar posts that others have no issue with. I think that anything that contributes to the brand or to our further understanding of the boats is fair game on these forums. I like the posts talking about the surveys, sails, schools, brokerages, maintenance and even just sailing places videos. Frankly, far more has already been written on this than the original post even took up. Anyway, that’s my two cents. For those who are triggered by these discussions, there is a link you can click when you first see the topic to “mute this topic” and you will never see anything on it (or Antennas if you like!) ever again. LOL
Brent Cameron, Future Amel owner & Amel Owner's Registry Moderator
-- Brent Cameron
Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator
Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada
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Re: Mobile communications - 4G, WiFi
Matt Salatino
Amel currently installs the World Pepwave, combined WiFi, 3g, 4g system. At least that is what they installed on our boat, completed last September. ~~~⛵️~~~Matt
On Jan 23, 2020, at 6:25 AM, David Crisp < david@...> wrote: Since my original post I have read the responses (thank you all) and trawled the web. There maybe others like me treading this path so I thought I’d share what I’ve learned/concluded so far. One caveat, I’m a very modestly technically literate sailor, definitely not an RF, electronics or networking engineer. If I have made any silly errors please let me know, I’m keen to learn.
I’m not currently aboard so doing much of my layout thinking from memory.
To recap the requirement: I’m going to be cruising the Mediterranean and want to be able to access the internet. Ideally, I’d like to able to get weather forecasts whilst coastal sailing offshore/between islands, subject to the limits of 4G coverage of course. Budget: Conscious that cheapest isn’t always the best, I’d rather spend a bit more to get performance and quality than save a bit but regret it later.
(a) Prioritise 4G/LTE over Wi-Fi. A number of people have commented how Wi-Fi systems are often overloaded and slow, that 4G provides better data rates.
(b) It’s more cost effective (and satisfying) to assemble my own system than buying a turnkey setup (e.g. DigitalYacht, Red Box etc). I’ve found a couple of exceptions to this but they have a major downside with the SIM card being badly located – more on this later.
(c) Antenna
Use an external omni-directional antenna (vs. one down below).
Keep the cable run from antenna to modem/router as short as possible to minimise losses. Mounting the antenna high up is less important than keeping the cable run short. This leads me to thinking possible locations for the antenna are: mizzen spreader / aft rail or arch / between the backstays. Least attractive is on top of the mizzen mast due to the distance.
Use LMR-400 coax cable if the cable routing permits.
To get the benefit of 4G/LTE a MIMO antenna is needed. The Poynting OMNI-402 gets very good reviews on build quality but it’s expensive at UK£290 (https://www.solwise.co.uk/4g-antenna-omni-402). One or two articles seem to challenge the benefit of a MIMO antenna https://seabits.com/poynting-omni-antenna-testing/ and https://novaroundbritain.home.blog/2019/10/18/internet/ and maybe a simpler OMNI-291 (UK£144) SISO antenna would deliver pretty much the same performance (still very good build quality) but at half the cost.
I have looked at a couple of integrated solutions such as the WEBBOAT 4G LITE from Glomex (€609) https://shop.glomex.it/en/webboat-coastal-internet/660-it1104-webboat-coastal-internet-4g-wi-fi.html and Solwise QuSpot omni LTE/4G (UK£452) https://www.solwise.co.uk/WI-AX11S which have the antenna, 4G modem (SIM card) and router all integrated into the antenna dome. These look cost effective, eliminate antenna cable losses and look simpler to install however it means regular access to the SIM card is a problem if installed on a spreader or between the backstays. Why the need for SIM card access? From what I can understand there’s a need to either return to the UK with my UK SIM card every few months to maintain the EU roaming or to buy a SIM card in each country as the EU roaming expires. Either way regular access to the SIM card is needed.
(d) 4G Modem/Router
The Teltonika RUT 240 (UK£124) https://www.solwise.co.uk/4g-routers-rut240.html looks like it’ll do the job. The LAN port means I can one day connect an NMEA bridge should I want to. One could spend a little more and get the Teltonika 950 (UK£166) https://www.solwise.co.uk/4g-routers-rut950.html as this has 3 LAN ports which leave room for more expansion.
Location of the router will be determined by where the antenna cable enters from above (I’m not aboard at present). I’m assuming with a GRP structure WiFi propagation from the pilot berth or aft cabin (likely router locations) throughout the boat should be adequate, certainly to the saloon and aft cabin.
(e) WiFi
Assuming marina/cafe provided WiFi data capacity will be usually poor I may still buy a WL-Patriot-DB (UK£87) https://www.solwise.co.uk/wireless-Patriot-DB to at least try in each location. This would plug into the WAN port of the router. It’s powered over ethernet which simplifies matters. I’d either locate it somewhere inside or stick it outside temporarily via a porthole maybe. It’s IP65 rated so if its outside in a rain shower it should be okay, but I’d be reluctant to mount it permanently outside.
Comments and suggestions encouraged.
-- David Crisp SV Wilna Grace Amel 54 #58
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Re: Crossing Pirate Waters
Brent Cameron
Ryan, I fully agree with you on this. I also read her first book and found it quite interesting… especially the parts about buying the Amel at the factory in La Rochelle and their very first experience in a Bay of Biscay storm taking it away and then learning more as they went on. I don’t see any difference either with some of the other posts here as you suggest. If it was a book about just sailing or something else and had no ties to Amel, then that would be different but, in my mind at least, it isn’t any different than other posters who loosely (in context) advertise their services or YouTube channels (which very often contain exactly the same kind of helpful advice as is found on these forums). I do very much appreciate that we aren’t subjected to a lot of advertising here but a single post taking about a new book about a trip doing what many of us buy Amel’s for that took place on an Amel is not out of place and I think people were too quick to shut it down without also looking at all of the other similar posts that others have no issue with. I think that anything that contributes to the brand or to our further understanding of the boats is fair game on these forums. I like the posts talking about the surveys, sails, schools, brokerages, maintenance and even just sailing places videos. Frankly, far more has already been written on this than the original post even took up. Anyway, that’s my two cents. For those who are triggered by these discussions, there is a link you can click when you first see the topic to “mute this topic” and you will never see anything on it (or Antennas if you like!) ever again. LOL
Brent Cameron, Future Amel owner & Amel Owner's Registry Moderator
-- Brent Cameron
Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator
Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada
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Re: Mobile communications - 4G, WiFi
David, since you seem to be so interested in having an external LTE antenna (which I've never found the need for), might I suggest you get one of those hockey-puck portable hotspots? I've had good luck putting it in a waterproof bag and sending it up the mast on a halyard when I want to use it and bringing it back down to charge. That would also give you easy access to the SIM card. I stand by my original recommendation as a better, permanent solution.
Ryan and Kelly SM 233 Iteration Boston, MA, USA
On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 8:29 AM Paul Dowd and Sharon Brown < paul.dowd@...> wrote: David, In my experiences, in the Med 3/4G has worked well, in the Caribbean wifi has given me a better service. If you do use wifi be aware that systems that use a USBL cable to connect to a receiver integrated in the base of an antenna, such as Redbox, will not work very well if the cable is too long. I have used Digital Yacht (coax to the antenna) and Bullet, also known as Webcatcher, and currently in use (RJ45 cable with PoE to the antenna) without problems but had no end of trouble with Redbox (USBL). I have never used a directional antenna. When I bought the Webcatcher in Martinique (Diginav in Le Marin) it came with a choice of three antenna sizes, and I took the middle one which was a good compromise between vertical beam width and range. Note that in rolly bays vertical beam width does become significant. This system has not failed me in four years. Note that my priority has always been reliability, then cost. Cheers, Paul S/Y Ya Fohi - Amel 54 #98 From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of David Crisp
Sent: 23 January 2020 07:25
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Mobile communications - 4G, WiFi Since my original post I have read the responses (thank you all) and trawled the web. There maybe others like me treading this path so I thought I’d share what I’ve learned/concluded so far. One caveat, I’m a very modestly technically literate sailor, definitely not an RF, electronics or networking engineer. If I have made any silly errors please let me know, I’m keen to learn. I’m not currently aboard so doing much of my layout thinking from memory. To recap the requirement: I’m going to be cruising the Mediterranean and want to be able to access the internet. Ideally, I’d like to able to get weather forecasts whilst coastal sailing offshore/between islands, subject to the limits of 4G coverage of course. Budget: Conscious that cheapest isn’t always the best, I’d rather spend a bit more to get performance and quality than save a bit but regret it later. (a) Prioritise 4G/LTE over Wi-Fi. A number of people have commented how Wi-Fi systems are often overloaded and slow, that 4G provides better data rates. (b) It’s more cost effective (and satisfying) to assemble my own system than buying a turnkey setup (e.g. DigitalYacht, Red Box etc). I’ve found a couple of exceptions to this but they have a major downside with the SIM card being badly located – more on this later. (c) Antenna Use an external omni-directional antenna (vs. one down below). Keep the cable run from antenna to modem/router as short as possible to minimise losses. Mounting the antenna high up is less important than keeping the cable run short. This leads me to thinking possible locations for the antenna are: mizzen spreader / aft rail or arch / between the backstays. Least attractive is on top of the mizzen mast due to the distance. Use LMR-400 coax cable if the cable routing permits. To get the benefit of 4G/LTE a MIMO antenna is needed. The Poynting OMNI-402 gets very good reviews on build quality but it’s expensive at UK£290 (https://www.solwise.co.uk/4g-antenna-omni-402). One or two articles seem to challenge the benefit of a MIMO antenna https://seabits.com/poynting-omni-antenna-testing/ and https://novaroundbritain.home.blog/2019/10/18/internet/ and maybe a simpler OMNI-291 (UK£144) SISO antenna would deliver pretty much the same performance (still very good build quality) but at half the cost. I have looked at a couple of integrated solutions such as the WEBBOAT 4G LITE from Glomex (€609) https://shop.glomex.it/en/webboat-coastal-internet/660-it1104-webboat-coastal-internet-4g-wi-fi.html and Solwise QuSpot omni LTE/4G (UK£452) https://www.solwise.co.uk/WI-AX11S which have the antenna, 4G modem (SIM card) and router all integrated into the antenna dome. These look cost effective, eliminate antenna cable losses and look simpler to install however it means regular access to the SIM card is a problem if installed on a spreader or between the backstays. Why the need for SIM card access? From what I can understand there’s a need to either return to the UK with my UK SIM card every few months to maintain the EU roaming or to buy a SIM card in each country as the EU roaming expires. Either way regular access to the SIM card is needed. (d) 4G Modem/Router The Teltonika RUT 240 (UK£124) https://www.solwise.co.uk/4g-routers-rut240.html looks like it’ll do the job. The LAN port means I can one day connect an NMEA bridge should I want to. One could spend a little more and get the Teltonika 950 (UK£166) https://www.solwise.co.uk/4g-routers-rut950.html as this has 3 LAN ports which leave room for more expansion. Location of the router will be determined by where the antenna cable enters from above (I’m not aboard at present). I’m assuming with a GRP structure WiFi propagation from the pilot berth or aft cabin (likely router locations) throughout the boat should be adequate, certainly to the saloon and aft cabin. (e) WiFi Assuming marina/cafe provided WiFi data capacity will be usually poor I may still buy a WL-Patriot-DB (UK£87) https://www.solwise.co.uk/wireless-Patriot-DB to at least try in each location. This would plug into the WAN port of the router. It’s powered over ethernet which simplifies matters. I’d either locate it somewhere inside or stick it outside temporarily via a porthole maybe. It’s IP65 rated so if its outside in a rain shower it should be okay, but I’d be reluctant to mount it permanently outside. Comments and suggestions encouraged. --
David Crisp
SV Wilna Grace
Amel 54 #58
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Cheers
Paul
Ya Fohi - Amel 54 #98
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