Date   

Re: Victron Quattro charger/inverter installation

Oliver Henrichsen, SV Vela Nautica
 

Hello,

There are several reasons why I did not install the charger inverter in the old engine room location.

I did not like that computerised device in a hot and humid environment, special beside the watermaker. I experianced a spray from a hose right into old charger... 

Victron advices installation in cool and dry place and the engine room is the opposite. Additional there is the bilge and whem someone takes a hot shower lots of steam whoop around..

With the ventilation arangement inside the multi plus its intended to be mounted vertical for best cooling. Thats not possible at the old place. Its also possible to mount it horizontal but u will not get best cooling. 

I like to have short charging wires for best efficency and less losses, I would have needed to route additional wires for 120A charging. In the new location wires are short.

Now living with this upgrade more than 1.5 years full time anchored I would do it this way again. Its not that much trouble to rewire as you will need to change wires to larger sizes anyway. 

Oliver from Vela Nautica Amel54#39 
Martinique 

On Wed, May 20, 2020, 09:54 Lior Keydar <lior246@...> wrote:
Dear Oliver

I still have on SHARONA (A54) the original installation of the inverter and the two charger (30, 100) with 12 lead acid batteries.  I think as a first step just to replace the old inverter and charger with Victron MultiPlus or Quattro and keep the old batteries for a few more month. 

I saw that you installed your MultiPlus inverter near the batteries. Can I ask, why did you not installed it instead of the old inverter behind the generator? Would it be also easy to install it behind the generator?

Thanks
Lior SHARONA, A54 #18


Re: Identifing parts for Onan water flange

 

Olaf,

Assuming that your Onan is the same that Amel installed and has not been modified, Amel ordered the 12 volt isolated ground version. If your current sensors have 2 wires, that are for the isolated ground version.

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Tue, May 19, 2020 at 7:56 PM Olaf Bauer <olaf.bauer@...> wrote:

Hello AMELians,

 

When ordering parts for the Onan generator some questions were coming up:

 - Which ground I required? The negative ground or isolated ground (PN# 300-5040 or 300-5041)?

 - The 12V and  24V Negative ground or 12V isolated ground (PN# 193-0318 or 193-0457-01)?

 

The Onan generator is Type 7MDKAV-2317 MDKAV 7 kW 50 Hz Diesel

 

Could someone help me on that or tell me how I could find that out?

 

Thanks in advance.

Fair winds

Olaf

 

S/V Katchopine, SM2K 392

currently in Trinidad

 


Re: Victron Quattro charger/inverter installation

Lior Keydar
 

Dear Oliver

I still have on SHARONA (A54) the original installation of the inverter and the two charger (30, 100) with 12 lead acid batteries.  I think as a first step just to replace the old inverter and charger with Victron MultiPlus or Quattro and keep the old batteries for a few more month. 

I saw that you installed your MultiPlus inverter near the batteries. Can I ask, why did you not installed it instead of the old inverter behind the generator? Would it be also easy to install it behind the generator?

Thanks
Lior SHARONA, A54 #18


Re: A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

ESTELLER
 

I change the mine some months ago, and it was provided by AMEL SAV

 

José ORION 54 118

 

 

 


Identifing parts for Onan water flange

Olaf Bauer
 

Hello AMELians,

 

When ordering parts for the Onan generator some questions were coming up:

 - Which ground I required? The negative ground or isolated ground (PN# 300-5040 or 300-5041)?

 - The 12V and  24V Negative ground or 12V isolated ground (PN# 193-0318 or 193-0457-01)?

 

The Onan generator is Type 7MDKAV-2317 MDKAV 7 kW 50 Hz Diesel

 

Could someone help me on that or tell me how I could find that out?

 

Thanks in advance.

Fair winds

Olaf

 

S/V Katchopine, SM2K 392

currently in Trinidad

 


Re: Self Insurance

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

This sounds a bit like a mini lloyds syndicate

On 20 May 2020 at 08:45 "Patrick McAneny via groups.io" <sailw32@...> wrote:

Teun,
To address your input in order.

1. I agree we  don't want to get involved in managing this self insurance. That is why I said from the start, that there would need to be a paid administrator ,and I suggested an annual fee of perhaps .20% of boat value to cover expenses.Kent suggested a voluntary board to provide guidance .

2. 1.5 million in a reserve fund would seem adequate to cover three boats lost in a single year,which is very unlikely. The fund could be replenished by an assessment to all members to bring the fund back up to the prior balance. Keep in mind this is only meant to share the risk of a total lose ,not if you run into a piling and scratch your hull. So if a boat was a total  lose and the payout was $250,000. and assuming we had 200 members ,each member would pay into the fund $1,250, their share of the lose.

3. I don't even know what a synthetic structure is,so don't have much to say about that, I read that and just throw up my hands ,you win ! I do agree with you, that many may not realize the changes in the insurance industry until its time to renew their policy. I also agree that we need to determine the level of interest, and many with a policy in force at this time may not be,understandable. Brent has made up a survey ,very well done and it will be presented to the group to determine interest. It may be ahead of its time ,but I think its time will come. if we lack interest at this time ,we will put it on the back burner for now and revisit when things in  the industry get worse. We don't want to spin wheels and write emails for nothing, at least I don't,my two fingers get sore !

Be Safe,
Pat
SM Shenanigans






-----Original Message-----
From: Teun BAAS <teun@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Tue, May 19, 2020 4:03 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

Below from Mark’s friend reflects exactly what I mentioned last week. It is no longer a matter of cost but “can I get it”.
 
On Pat and Ken’s Emails:
 
  1. I don’t think we want to get involved in managing this “self-insurance”.
 
  1. USD1.5 Million is no way enough but can be a reasonable buffer to start discussing a “synthetic” or “derivative” structure with a professional carrier such as LLOYD’s.
 
  1. Let’s first see if we really can come up with 200 interested owners; without any solid group of owners we will be nowhere in a discussion with a professional organization.
 
 
So far I have only seen “luke-warm” interest. I believe a lot of owners don’t realize what is really going on until personally confronted with refusal to renew as was my experience.
Q1 this year I was reading the thread on our AYOG Forum about insurance problems but didn’t think it would concern me as I had been with LLOYD’s for 2 years to be renewed every April.
 
January/February 2020 a fellow AMEL 54 owner asked me for the contact info of my South Pacific agent and I knew he was offered in February/March 2020 a similar cover with a similar premium as I had for the last 2 years. Knowing he got LLOYDS to insure him I was pretty certain my renewal would just be a formality UNTILL 1st week of April 2020 I was notified by my agent that LLOYDS no longer was in the sailboat insurance business.
 
That gave me 2 weeks to find an alternative .
 
So let’s first determine if we can come up with 200 really seriously interested AMEL owners; failing that we are just wasting time 😊 .
 
Best Regards Teun
SV AMELIT   A54  #128
 
In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA
May 19, 2020 13:03:09
 
USA cell: +1 832 477 8842
AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909
 
 
 
 
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mark Erdos via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2020 11:08
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance
 
Just as an FYI - An agent I am friendly with who understands and brokers policies for the marine insurance business sent me this:
 
I can tell you that due to the many companies pulling out of the recreational marine insurance market, including the all important reinsurers, that availability will soon be the primary concern as opposed to affordability, especially for two people cruising long distances.
 
Hopefully the pendulum will swing back toward the sailors in the future.
 
He thinks things will get worse before they get better.
 
 
With best regards,
 
Mark
 
Skipper
Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia
 
 
 
 


Re: Self Insurance

Teun BAAS
 

Pat,

 

Apologies: didn’t realize the objective was only cover for TOTAL LOSS and/or possibly lightning damage.

 

Will refrain from commenting as this is not something I am interested in.

 

Again: my apologies for muddying your waters. 😊

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 19, 2020 16:08:35

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2020 15:33
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

 

Teun, I guess I initiated this in a post a couple of days ago ,where I laid out what I envisioned , I won't rehash all the points ,but to keep it simple ,the only coverage was for a total lose minus a 10% deductible and perhaps lightning damage with a 30% deductible. This was not meant to be an insurance policy in the normal sense. Just a group each putting in a one time deposit into a reserve fund to spread the risk in the event of a total lose. I can't afford to lose all my equity in my boat,but if I hit piling ,ding my boat ,I am willing to assume that risk,since I have never damaged any boat in fifty years. I would still need to obtain liability insurance , I could still obtain full coverage ,but at a very low fixed value ,thus as you suggested the premiums should be much less.

 This will probably be my last reply on this subject until Brent's survey determine the interest level .I guess he or Kent will post a link to the survey they have written.

 

Thanks,

Pat

SM#123

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Teun BAAS <teun@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Tue, May 19, 2020 5:06 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

Pat,

 

  1. Nothing to do with winning – we are all looking for a solution for a problem most owners do not realize is coming at them.
  2. Synthetic or derivative concept is being used in financial & commodity (futures) markets. FE: before there were ethanol futures one could work out a balance/ratio between oil and corn futures and minimize risks in ethanol trading by hedging oil & corn. So in my concept we would sit down with a carrier (fe LLOYDS) and discuss a spread of risks between Ken’s AGIC and LLOYDS. If the AGIC group is sizeable I am pretty sure they will be open to a dialogue. .
  3. Sorry I might not have gotten the concept that the self-insurance was for total loss only. That being the case: if indeed a carrier is not on the hook for any total loss that might mitigate premium and/or reluctance to provide regular marine cover. It is a form of “re-insurance”; one of the main assets in Warren BUFFETS portfolio.

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 19, 2020 14:04:44

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2020 13:45
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

 

Teun,

To address your input in order.

 

1. I agree we  don't want to get involved in managing this self insurance. That is why I said from the start, that there would need to be a paid administrator ,and I suggested an annual fee of perhaps .20% of boat value to cover expenses.Kent suggested a voluntary board to provide guidance .

 

2. 1.5 million in a reserve fund would seem adequate to cover three boats lost in a single year,which is very unlikely. The fund could be replenished by an assessment to all members to bring the fund back up to the prior balance. Keep in mind this is only meant to share the risk of a total lose ,not if you run into a piling and scratch your hull. So if a boat was a total  lose and the payout was $250,000. and assuming we had 200 members ,each member would pay into the fund $1,250, their share of the lose.

 

3. I don't even know what a synthetic structure is,so don't have much to say about that, I read that and just throw up my hands ,you win ! I do agree with you, that many may not realize the changes in the insurance industry until its time to renew their policy. I also agree that we need to determine the level of interest, and many with a policy in force at this time may not be,understandable. Brent has made up a survey ,very well done and it will be presented to the group to determine interest. It may be ahead of its time ,but I think its time will come. if we lack interest at this time ,we will put it on the back burner for now and revisit when things in  the industry get worse. We don't want to spin wheels and write emails for nothing, at least I don't,my two fingers get sore !

 

Be Safe,

Pat

SM Shenanigans

 

 

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Teun BAAS <teun@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Tue, May 19, 2020 4:03 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

Below from Mark’s friend reflects exactly what I mentioned last week. It is no longer a matter of cost but “can I get it”.

 

On Pat and Ken’s Emails:

 

  1. I don’t think we want to get involved in managing this “self-insurance”.

 

  1. USD1.5 Million is no way enough but can be a reasonable buffer to start discussing a “synthetic” or “derivative” structure with a professional carrier such as LLOYD’s.

 

  1. Let’s first see if we really can come up with 200 interested owners; without any solid group of owners we will be nowhere in a discussion with a professional organization.

 

 

So far I have only seen “luke-warm” interest. I believe a lot of owners don’t realize what is really going on until personally confronted with refusal to renew as was my experience.

Q1 this year I was reading the thread on our AYOG Forum about insurance problems but didn’t think it would concern me as I had been with LLOYD’s for 2 years to be renewed every April.

 

January/February 2020 a fellow AMEL 54 owner asked me for the contact info of my South Pacific agent and I knew he was offered in February/March 2020 a similar cover with a similar premium as I had for the last 2 years. Knowing he got LLOYDS to insure him I was pretty certain my renewal would just be a formality UNTILL 1st week of April 2020 I was notified by my agent that LLOYDS no longer was in the sailboat insurance business.

 

That gave me 2 weeks to find an alternative .

 

So let’s first determine if we can come up with 200 really seriously interested AMEL owners; failing that we are just wasting time 😊.

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 19, 2020 13:03:09

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mark Erdos via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2020 11:08
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

 

Just as an FYI - An agent I am friendly with who understands and brokers policies for the marine insurance business sent me this:

 

I can tell you that due to the many companies pulling out of the recreational marine insurance market, including the all important reinsurers, that availability will soon be the primary concern as opposed to affordability, especially for two people cruising long distances.

 

Hopefully the pendulum will swing back toward the sailors in the future.

 

He thinks things will get worse before they get better.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

 

 


Re: Self Insurance

Patrick McAneny
 

Teun, I guess I initiated this in a post a couple of days ago ,where I laid out what I envisioned , I won't rehash all the points ,but to keep it simple ,the only coverage was for a total lose minus a 10% deductible and perhaps lightning damage with a 30% deductible. This was not meant to be an insurance policy in the normal sense. Just a group each putting in a one time deposit into a reserve fund to spread the risk in the event of a total lose. I can't afford to lose all my equity in my boat,but if I hit piling ,ding my boat ,I am willing to assume that risk,since I have never damaged any boat in fifty years. I would still need to obtain liability insurance , I could still obtain full coverage ,but at a very low fixed value ,thus as you suggested the premiums should be much less.
 This will probably be my last reply on this subject until Brent's survey determine the interest level .I guess he or Kent will post a link to the survey they have written.

Thanks,
Pat
SM#123


-----Original Message-----
From: Teun BAAS <teun@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Tue, May 19, 2020 5:06 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

Pat,
 
  1. Nothing to do with winning – we are all looking for a solution for a problem most owners do not realize is coming at them.
  2. Synthetic or derivative concept is being used in financial & commodity (futures) markets. FE: before there were ethanol futures one could work out a balance/ratio between oil and corn futures and minimize risks in ethanol trading by hedging oil & corn. So in my concept we would sit down with a carrier (fe LLOYDS) and discuss a spread of risks between Ken’s AGIC and LLOYDS. If the AGIC group is sizeable I am pretty sure they will be open to a dialogue. .
  3. Sorry I might not have gotten the concept that the self-insurance was for total loss only. That being the case: if indeed a carrier is not on the hook for any total loss that might mitigate premium and/or reluctance to provide regular marine cover. It is a form of “re-insurance”; one of the main assets in Warren BUFFETS portfolio.
 
Best Regards Teun
SV AMELIT  A54  #128
 
In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA
May 19, 2020 14:04:44
 
USA cell: +1 832 477 8842
AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909
 
 
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2020 13:45
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance
 
Teun,
To address your input in order.
 
1. I agree we  don't want to get involved in managing this self insurance. That is why I said from the start, that there would need to be a paid administrator ,and I suggested an annual fee of perhaps .20% of boat value to cover expenses.Kent suggested a voluntary board to provide guidance .
 
2. 1.5 million in a reserve fund would seem adequate to cover three boats lost in a single year,which is very unlikely. The fund could be replenished by an assessment to all members to bring the fund back up to the prior balance. Keep in mind this is only meant to share the risk of a total lose ,not if you run into a piling and scratch your hull. So if a boat was a total  lose and the payout was $250,000. and assuming we had 200 members ,each member would pay into the fund $1,250, their share of the lose.
 
3. I don't even know what a synthetic structure is,so don't have much to say about that, I read that and just throw up my hands ,you win ! I do agree with you, that many may not realize the changes in the insurance industry until its time to renew their policy. I also agree that we need to determine the level of interest, and many with a policy in force at this time may not be,understandable. Brent has made up a survey ,very well done and it will be presented to the group to determine interest. It may be ahead of its time ,but I think its time will come. if we lack interest at this time ,we will put it on the back burner for now and revisit when things in  the industry get worse. We don't want to spin wheels and write emails for nothing, at least I don't,my two fingers get sore !
 
Be Safe,
Pat
SM Shenanigans
 
 
 


-----Original Message-----
From: Teun BAAS <
teun@...>
To:
main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Tue, May 19, 2020 4:03 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance
Below from Mark’s friend reflects exactly what I mentioned last week. It is no longer a matter of cost but “can I get it”.
 
On Pat and Ken’s Emails:
 
  1. I don’t think we want to get involved in managing this “self-insurance”.
 
  1. USD1.5 Million is no way enough but can be a reasonable buffer to start discussing a “synthetic” or “derivative” structure with a professional carrier such as LLOYD’s.
 
  1. Let’s first see if we really can come up with 200 interested owners; without any solid group of owners we will be nowhere in a discussion with a professional organization.
 
 
So far I have only seen “luke-warm” interest. I believe a lot of owners don’t realize what is really going on until personally confronted with refusal to renew as was my experience.
Q1 this year I was reading the thread on our AYOG Forum about insurance problems but didn’t think it would concern me as I had been with LLOYD’s for 2 years to be renewed every April.
 
January/February 2020 a fellow AMEL 54 owner asked me for the contact info of my South Pacific agent and I knew he was offered in February/March 2020 a similar cover with a similar premium as I had for the last 2 years. Knowing he got LLOYDS to insure him I was pretty certain my renewal would just be a formality UNTILL 1st week of April 2020 I was notified by my agent that LLOYDS no longer was in the sailboat insurance business.
 
That gave me 2 weeks to find an alternative .
 
So let’s first determine if we can come up with 200 really seriously interested AMEL owners; failing that we are just wasting time 😊.
 
Best Regards Teun
SV AMELIT  A54  #128
 
In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA
May 19, 2020 13:03:09
 
USA cell: +1 832 477 8842
AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909
 
 
 
 
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mark Erdos via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2020 11:08
To:
main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance
 
Just as an FYI - An agent I am friendly with who understands and brokers policies for the marine insurance business sent me this:
 
I can tell you that due to the many companies pulling out of the recreational marine insurance market, including the all important reinsurers, that availability will soon be the primary concern as opposed to affordability, especially for two people cruising long distances.
 
Hopefully the pendulum will swing back toward the sailors in the future.
 
He thinks things will get worse before they get better.
 
 
With best regards,
 
Mark
 
Skipper
Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia
 
 


Re: Self Insurance

Teun BAAS
 

Pat,

 

  1. Nothing to do with winning – we are all looking for a solution for a problem most owners do not realize is coming at them.
  2. Synthetic or derivative concept is being used in financial & commodity (futures) markets. FE: before there were ethanol futures one could work out a balance/ratio between oil and corn futures and minimize risks in ethanol trading by hedging oil & corn. So in my concept we would sit down with a carrier (fe LLOYDS) and discuss a spread of risks between Ken’s AGIC and LLOYDS. If the AGIC group is sizeable I am pretty sure they will be open to a dialogue. .
  3. Sorry I might not have gotten the concept that the self-insurance was for total loss only. That being the case: if indeed a carrier is not on the hook for any total loss that might mitigate premium and/or reluctance to provide regular marine cover. It is a form of “re-insurance”; one of the main assets in Warren BUFFETS portfolio.

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 19, 2020 14:04:44

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2020 13:45
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

 

Teun,

To address your input in order.

 

1. I agree we  don't want to get involved in managing this self insurance. That is why I said from the start, that there would need to be a paid administrator ,and I suggested an annual fee of perhaps .20% of boat value to cover expenses.Kent suggested a voluntary board to provide guidance .

 

2. 1.5 million in a reserve fund would seem adequate to cover three boats lost in a single year,which is very unlikely. The fund could be replenished by an assessment to all members to bring the fund back up to the prior balance. Keep in mind this is only meant to share the risk of a total lose ,not if you run into a piling and scratch your hull. So if a boat was a total  lose and the payout was $250,000. and assuming we had 200 members ,each member would pay into the fund $1,250, their share of the lose.

 

3. I don't even know what a synthetic structure is,so don't have much to say about that, I read that and just throw up my hands ,you win ! I do agree with you, that many may not realize the changes in the insurance industry until its time to renew their policy. I also agree that we need to determine the level of interest, and many with a policy in force at this time may not be,understandable. Brent has made up a survey ,very well done and it will be presented to the group to determine interest. It may be ahead of its time ,but I think its time will come. if we lack interest at this time ,we will put it on the back burner for now and revisit when things in  the industry get worse. We don't want to spin wheels and write emails for nothing, at least I don't,my two fingers get sore !

 

Be Safe,

Pat

SM Shenanigans

 

 

 



-----Original Message-----
From: Teun BAAS <
teun@...>
To:
main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Tue, May 19, 2020 4:03 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

Below from Mark’s friend reflects exactly what I mentioned last week. It is no longer a matter of cost but “can I get it”.

 

On Pat and Ken’s Emails:

 

  1. I don’t think we want to get involved in managing this “self-insurance”.

 

  1. USD1.5 Million is no way enough but can be a reasonable buffer to start discussing a “synthetic” or “derivative” structure with a professional carrier such as LLOYD’s.

 

  1. Let’s first see if we really can come up with 200 interested owners; without any solid group of owners we will be nowhere in a discussion with a professional organization.

 

 

So far I have only seen “luke-warm” interest. I believe a lot of owners don’t realize what is really going on until personally confronted with refusal to renew as was my experience.

Q1 this year I was reading the thread on our AYOG Forum about insurance problems but didn’t think it would concern me as I had been with LLOYD’s for 2 years to be renewed every April.

 

January/February 2020 a fellow AMEL 54 owner asked me for the contact info of my South Pacific agent and I knew he was offered in February/March 2020 a similar cover with a similar premium as I had for the last 2 years. Knowing he got LLOYDS to insure him I was pretty certain my renewal would just be a formality UNTILL 1st week of April 2020 I was notified by my agent that LLOYDS no longer was in the sailboat insurance business.

 

That gave me 2 weeks to find an alternative .

 

So let’s first determine if we can come up with 200 really seriously interested AMEL owners; failing that we are just wasting time 😊.

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 19, 2020 13:03:09

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mark Erdos via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2020 11:08
To:
main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

 

Just as an FYI - An agent I am friendly with who understands and brokers policies for the marine insurance business sent me this:

 

I can tell you that due to the many companies pulling out of the recreational marine insurance market, including the all important reinsurers, that availability will soon be the primary concern as opposed to affordability, especially for two people cruising long distances.

 

Hopefully the pendulum will swing back toward the sailors in the future.

 

He thinks things will get worse before they get better.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

 

 


Re: Self Insurance

Patrick McAneny
 

Teun,
To address your input in order.

1. I agree we  don't want to get involved in managing this self insurance. That is why I said from the start, that there would need to be a paid administrator ,and I suggested an annual fee of perhaps .20% of boat value to cover expenses.Kent suggested a voluntary board to provide guidance .

2. 1.5 million in a reserve fund would seem adequate to cover three boats lost in a single year,which is very unlikely. The fund could be replenished by an assessment to all members to bring the fund back up to the prior balance. Keep in mind this is only meant to share the risk of a total lose ,not if you run into a piling and scratch your hull. So if a boat was a total  lose and the payout was $250,000. and assuming we had 200 members ,each member would pay into the fund $1,250, their share of the lose.

3. I don't even know what a synthetic structure is,so don't have much to say about that, I read that and just throw up my hands ,you win ! I do agree with you, that many may not realize the changes in the insurance industry until its time to renew their policy. I also agree that we need to determine the level of interest, and many with a policy in force at this time may not be,understandable. Brent has made up a survey ,very well done and it will be presented to the group to determine interest. It may be ahead of its time ,but I think its time will come. if we lack interest at this time ,we will put it on the back burner for now and revisit when things in  the industry get worse. We don't want to spin wheels and write emails for nothing, at least I don't,my two fingers get sore !

Be Safe,
Pat
SM Shenanigans






-----Original Message-----
From: Teun BAAS <teun@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Tue, May 19, 2020 4:03 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

Below from Mark’s friend reflects exactly what I mentioned last week. It is no longer a matter of cost but “can I get it”.
 
On Pat and Ken’s Emails:
 
  1. I don’t think we want to get involved in managing this “self-insurance”.
 
  1. USD1.5 Million is no way enough but can be a reasonable buffer to start discussing a “synthetic” or “derivative” structure with a professional carrier such as LLOYD’s.
 
  1. Let’s first see if we really can come up with 200 interested owners; without any solid group of owners we will be nowhere in a discussion with a professional organization.
 
 
So far I have only seen “luke-warm” interest. I believe a lot of owners don’t realize what is really going on until personally confronted with refusal to renew as was my experience.
Q1 this year I was reading the thread on our AYOG Forum about insurance problems but didn’t think it would concern me as I had been with LLOYD’s for 2 years to be renewed every April.
 
January/February 2020 a fellow AMEL 54 owner asked me for the contact info of my South Pacific agent and I knew he was offered in February/March 2020 a similar cover with a similar premium as I had for the last 2 years. Knowing he got LLOYDS to insure him I was pretty certain my renewal would just be a formality UNTILL 1st week of April 2020 I was notified by my agent that LLOYDS no longer was in the sailboat insurance business.
 
That gave me 2 weeks to find an alternative .
 
So let’s first determine if we can come up with 200 really seriously interested AMEL owners; failing that we are just wasting time 😊.
 
Best Regards Teun
SV AMELIT  A54  #128
 
In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA
May 19, 2020 13:03:09
 
USA cell: +1 832 477 8842
AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909
 
 
 
 
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mark Erdos via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2020 11:08
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance
 
Just as an FYI - An agent I am friendly with who understands and brokers policies for the marine insurance business sent me this:
 
I can tell you that due to the many companies pulling out of the recreational marine insurance market, including the all important reinsurers, that availability will soon be the primary concern as opposed to affordability, especially for two people cruising long distances.
 
Hopefully the pendulum will swing back toward the sailors in the future.
 
He thinks things will get worse before they get better.
 
 
With best regards,
 
Mark
 
Skipper
Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia
 
 


Re: Self Insurance

Teun BAAS
 

Dealt with Elliott GOLDEN; nice guy. Came with similar proposal also from ERGO GERMANY but with a lower agreed value (USD530K).

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 19, 2020 13:36:02

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Matt Salatino via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2020 13:14
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

 

Gary Golden, Manifest Marine.

I’m a longtime customer and friend, who I met through the Moody Owners’ Association (previous boat)

He’s a good guy, and an advocate for his clients.

~~~⛵️~~~Matt


On May 19, 2020, at 2:44 PM, Craig & Katherine Briggs SN 68 Sangaris Tropic Isle Harbor, FL via groups.io <sangaris@...> wrote:

[Edited Message Follows]

Ken Powers mentions the Jackline Policy he has. That product was started by Al Golden and his son Gary at their (at the time) brokerage company called IMIS, now bought out by Gowrie. Al's retired and his son Gary, as some posts in this thread note, is now on his own and expanding his offerings of cruiser's coverage. The Golden's have always been staunch supporters of the Seven Seas Cruising Association - SSCA and marketed to that group as an excellent base of customers who were cruising savvy which gave the underwriters (Markel) a desirable low-risk group to insure - quite similar to what Amel owners could do. 

Interestingly, back in the 90's another broker offered a substantial discount to sailors who were members of SSCA. Lo and behold, the membership rolls of the organization zoomed from about 2000 boats to 5000 by the late 90's as membership was never contingent on sailing experience (anyone could join SSCA as an associate and get the discount, then could become a voting "commodore" after demonstrating live-aboard and passagemaking experience). That diluted the insurance underwriting appeal and the product was dropped after a few years (there was also some other drama going on with the broker).

I'd recommend a chat with Gary which could be very instructive at least, or even present him with an opportunity he could pursue as a professional in the business to offer an AGIC policy.
Food for thought.

Craig


Re: Zink Anode for SPURS Line Cutter

Teun BAAS
 

Eric,

 

Thanks – will look into this.

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 19, 2020 13:29:53

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of eric freedman via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 16:06
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Zink Anode for SPURS Line Cutter

 

Teun,

You can buy a regular pencil zinc and shorten it . It is much cheaper than the Onan factory zinc.

Save the brass cap fitting that the zinc fits into . You can then reuse the cap and buy zincs without the brass cap.

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of CW Bill Rouse
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 6:51 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io Notification
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Zink Anode for SPURS Line Cutter

 

Teun,

 

To the back of the Onan heat exchanger

image.png

Image removed by sender.

CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School

Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 

Image removed by sender.Image removed by sender.Image removed by sender.

 

View My Training Calendar

Image removed by sender.

 

 

On Mon, May 18, 2020 at 11:19 AM Teun BAAS <teun@...> wrote:

Hi Alexander,

 

I am aware of all the anodes you mention but, maybe a dumb question, where is the anode on the ONAN Generator?

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 18, 2020 09:18:17

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Alexander Hofmann via groups.io
Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2020 23:57
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Zink Anode for SPURS Line Cutter

 

Bonjour Olivier, hello Rudi and Scott,

I want to add my observations of some years: The zinc anode of the Spurs line cutter is completely away after a year, if you do not have the zinc anode on the nose of (in my case folding) propeller. This means, the protection of the big 2 anodes on the rudder blade is most seemingly not enough to protect the line cutter (and the propeller I believe) from corrosion.
After installing the zinc anode on the propeller (instead of the 'red nose plastic' - as Olivier says), which by the way is quite easy also in diving, I detect no corrosion anymore at the zinc anode of the Spurs line cutter.
I am happy now with a full set of zinc anodes from bow to aft, on (1) the bow thruster, (2) the Onan Generator, (3) the spurs line cutter, (4) the nose of the Propeller and (5) the 2 big ones at the rudder blade.

This should last and avoid any corrosion easily a year!

Best regards
Alexander Hofmann, SY Oceanica I, Amel 54#156


Re: Self Insurance

Teun BAAS
 

Below in blue next to Ken’s my current coverage; in red the last 2 years LLOYDS

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 19, 2020 13:07:00

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ken Powers SV Aquarius via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2020 00:35
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

 

Though I think it would be a great idea to start the "Amel Group Insurance Company" AGIC, it's a lot more than just opening a bank account and filling it with our $6000 each month.  Insurance companies are Bankers first, and Offer insurance second.  Once you get the first $1.2M in the bank it has to be invested, and everyone will have different ideas of where to invest it.  Well hedged is probably best, but these days I have been a very unsuccessful investor!  

On the questionnaire - Ask about Auto, Motorcycle, Airplane Insurance - Any tickets past 10 years, and any claims?  People are the same on the water as they are on land or in the air.  Careful drivers on land and in the air, will be careful captains on the water.   

I also think that the owners that will be insured by AGIC should be required to have three owners confirm that the owner is worthy of getting insurance through AGIC.  The first 200 owners insured also need to be well vetted be part of the group.  All you need is a few bad actors to bankrupt an insurance company.  Everyone has different ideas of what the appropriate level of experience should be required to sail an Amel off shore.  What would be the level of instruction/experience required for new owners, and who would be capable of imparting that knowledge and signing off for a new owner to be insured.  Bill's class would be a good one, but should Bill alone be able to sign off for a new member?  No one person should.  

There's a lot of benefits we could gain by starting this venture.  For one, it would make the AMEL brand more valuable if the insurance was transferrable to a new owner given a mandatory level of experience, no claims (any insurance), and an AMEL offshore sailing course.  Just like a check ride by the FAA.  

To do this right we need a village, and I think the AMEL Owners are the right village.  If we start now, we could draft a document and get this started by the end of the year.

First get interest level.  200 boats would probably be a good start.
Draft a Document how the company would operate.
  1.  Investments
  2.  Personal requirements to be insured
  3.  What/Where will the insurance cover
  4.  How/who will manage the claims
  5.  Define a bad risk owner, and how will a bad risk owner be deleted from the insurance group.
  6.  Insurance claims - I have never had a claim on my Car Insurance, Motorcycle Insurance, Boat Insurance, or Airplane Insurance.  Yup, I HAVE NEVER MADE A CLAIM IN 40 years of driving several types of vehicles.
  7.  Tickets in the last 10 years - Yup, I received 1 speeding ticket between San Diego and Vegas.  Just moving with traffic.  Safer to move at the same speed as traffic even though I was Breaking the Law.



So the first think would be to find out who is interested in the insurance, and each should answer the following questions.  If there is interest we need to get everyone into a spreadsheet and when we get to 200 people we can move forward to the next step.
HERE IS MINE
1.  Current Insurance Company:  JACKLINE POLICY[TDB]    ERGO GERMANY via POEMA in SOUTH PACIFIC Thailand office but premium paid to NOUMEA NEW CALEDONIA.  LLOYDS syndicate
2.  Cost yearly: $5700[TDB]   USD7,108.75 BUT this includes USD1,233.75 Dutch Insurance Tax because my boat is registered in THE NETHERLANDS PLUS USD350 for increased 3rd party liability from USD3Million to USD6 Million (AUSTRALIAN $10,000,000) Between USD4,900 and USD5,200
3.  Coverage amount: $280K[TDB]  USD607,000 of which USD575,000 for the hull, machinery & equipment  USD595K - also USD575K for the hull
4.  Coverage location: Worldwide except weather zones[TDB]  AUSTRALIA – in case I go to NEW ZEALAND we will get amendment; cyclone clause – 20% deductible . NEW CALEDONIA and VANUATU between North -  5 S, South - 40 S; East – 180 East; West – 150 East. South East ASIA: North – 25N; South - 15 S; East – 130E; West – 75 E. Policy mentions specifically that cyclone etc. are covered with 5% deductible.
5.  3rd party Liability: $1M[TDB]  USD3M  plus see above USD3Million
6.  Solo Sailor: ?[TDB]  Yes NO
7.  Insurance claims - I have never had a claim on my Car Insurance, Motorcycle Insurance, Boat Insurance, or Airplane Insurance.  Yup, I HAVE NEVER MADE A CLAIM IN 40 years of driving several types of vehicles.[TDB]  Never any Marine claim
8.  Tickets in the last 10 years - Yup, I received 1 speeding ticket between San Diego and Vegas.  Just moving with traffic.  Safer to move at the same speed as traffic even though I was Breaking the Law.[TDB]  I think there was no such question or maybe for the last 3 or 5 years: NO tickets in the last 3 or 5 years.
9.  ??  Any other questions we need to ask to get the first 220 or more first responders?  Some people will not meet the standards of the majority, so we will need to get more than the number required for critical mass.  Even I may not meet the standards of some.  
 
Done rambling....

Ken Powers
Aquarius SM2K #262
Currently in Phuket Thailand


Re: Self Insurance

Matt Salatino
 

Gary Golden, Manifest Marine.
I’m a longtime customer and friend, who I met through the Moody Owners’ Association (previous boat)
He’s a good guy, and an advocate for his clients.

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On May 19, 2020, at 2:44 PM, Craig & Katherine Briggs SN 68 Sangaris Tropic Isle Harbor, FL via groups.io <sangaris@...> wrote:

[Edited Message Follows]

Ken Powers mentions the Jackline Policy he has. That product was started by Al Golden and his son Gary at their (at the time) brokerage company called IMIS, now bought out by Gowrie. Al's retired and his son Gary, as some posts in this thread note, is now on his own and expanding his offerings of cruiser's coverage. The Golden's have always been staunch supporters of the Seven Seas Cruising Association - SSCA and marketed to that group as an excellent base of customers who were cruising savvy which gave the underwriters (Markel) a desirable low-risk group to insure - quite similar to what Amel owners could do. 

Interestingly, back in the 90's another broker offered a substantial discount to sailors who were members of SSCA. Lo and behold, the membership rolls of the organization zoomed from about 2000 boats to 5000 by the late 90's as membership was never contingent on sailing experience (anyone could join SSCA as an associate and get the discount, then could become a voting "commodore" after demonstrating live-aboard and passagemaking experience). That diluted the insurance underwriting appeal and the product was dropped after a few years (there was also some other drama going on with the broker).

I'd recommend a chat with Gary which could be very instructive at least, or even present him with an opportunity he could pursue as a professional in the business to offer an AGIC policy.
Food for thought.

Craig


Re: Self Insurance

Teun BAAS
 

Below from Mark’s friend reflects exactly what I mentioned last week. It is no longer a matter of cost but “can I get it”.

 

On Pat and Ken’s Emails:

 

  1. I don’t think we want to get involved in managing this “self-insurance”.

 

  1. USD1.5 Million is no way enough but can be a reasonable buffer to start discussing a “synthetic” or “derivative” structure with a professional carrier such as LLOYD’s.

 

  1. Let’s first see if we really can come up with 200 interested owners; without any solid group of owners we will be nowhere in a discussion with a professional organization.

 

 

So far I have only seen “luke-warm” interest. I believe a lot of owners don’t realize what is really going on until personally confronted with refusal to renew as was my experience.

Q1 this year I was reading the thread on our AYOG Forum about insurance problems but didn’t think it would concern me as I had been with LLOYD’s for 2 years to be renewed every April.

 

January/February 2020 a fellow AMEL 54 owner asked me for the contact info of my South Pacific agent and I knew he was offered in February/March 2020 a similar cover with a similar premium as I had for the last 2 years. Knowing he got LLOYDS to insure him I was pretty certain my renewal would just be a formality UNTILL 1st week of April 2020 I was notified by my agent that LLOYDS no longer was in the sailboat insurance business.

 

That gave me 2 weeks to find an alternative .

 

So let’s first determine if we can come up with 200 really seriously interested AMEL owners; failing that we are just wasting time 😊.

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 19, 2020 13:03:09

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mark Erdos via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2020 11:08
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

 

Just as an FYI - An agent I am friendly with who understands and brokers policies for the marine insurance business sent me this:

 

I can tell you that due to the many companies pulling out of the recreational marine insurance market, including the all important reinsurers, that availability will soon be the primary concern as opposed to affordability, especially for two people cruising long distances.

 

Hopefully the pendulum will swing back toward the sailors in the future.

 

He thinks things will get worse before they get better.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 

 


Re: Self Insurance

Patrick McAneny
 

Mark, I think your friends assessment is right on. I am fielding quotes ,two just today. They are full of restrictions , exclusions and wording that left me wondering if ever needed, would I have coverage at all. Not to mention the premiums more than twice what I was paying with Pantaenius, with deductibles 5 times as much.  This is what prompted me to think ,it may be time to think about self insuring .
Stay Safe,
Pat
SM #123


-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Tue, May 19, 2020 2:08 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

Just as an FYI - An agent I am friendly with who understands and brokers policies for the marine insurance business sent me this:
 
I can tell you that due to the many companies pulling out of the recreational marine insurance market, including the all important reinsurers, that availability will soon be the primary concern as opposed to affordability, especially for two people cruising long distances.
 
Hopefully the pendulum will swing back toward the sailors in the future.
 
He thinks things will get worse before they get better.
 
 
With best regards,
 
Mark
 
Skipper
Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia
www.creampuff.us
 
 


Re: Main sail outhaul Motorspor

Kaplan,Andre
 

Thanks John
Interesting suggestion... I’m off the boat this week but I’ll follow up with some strong taps to the motor when I return next week.. but I think a rebuild of the motor will likely be needed if the circuitry is OK.

Andre



On May 19, 2020, at 2:57 PM, John Clark <john.biohead@...> wrote:


*** Attention: This is an external email. Use caution responding, opening attachments or clicking on links. ***
Also an SM owner, older SM though...assuming that all the breakers are turned on (control power too)  I found when the brushes in the motor are near the end of life the motor will sometimes work sometimes not.  A tap on the side would make it go for a while.  I replaced the brushes and have not had an issue in years.  
Annie SM 37
WI USVI

On Sun, May 17, 2020 at 3:23 PM Kaplan,Andre <kaplan@...> wrote:
Mark
Thanks for your reply. Yes, I did check the breaker.. it was not tripped, but it may be suspect since it had been replaced...
I’m not on the boat today, but I will take photos next week. Unfortunately, I can hear a click when I throw the switch... by your assessment, it may be the motor... if so, does anyone know where and how to get a replacement motor? Must it come from Amel or is there a standard motor that can be used as replacement.

BTW, I always try to limit strain on motor by heading into the wind during furling or unfurling mainsail.

Thanks for any suggestions on motor replacement.

Boat lies in Westbrook, CT

Andre
Renaissance 2000
Mango 71, 1988
> On May 17, 2020, at 2:21 PM, Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote:
>
> *** Attention: This is an external email. Use caution responding, opening attachments or clicking on links. ***

> Andre,
>
> I am unsure if the solenoid is the same on the Mango as the SM. If it is, it
> is a product used in forklift trucks. This should help you find one (not
> sure where you are located). Perhaps you can post a picture.
>
> That said, it is not usually the solenoid that fails. They are extremely
> heavy duty. More often the motor burns out due to the operator putting too
> much strain on it. If you hear a click as you work the outhaul switch on the
> control panel, it is not the solenoid.
>
> Stating the obvious, have you checked the breaker?
>
>
> With best regards,
>
> Mark
>
> Skipper
> Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
> Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.creampuff.us__;!!N0rdg9Wr!_jfC8TlOKSYZuv_1Syg0ZKXhUrJXC8xanwngc1sf7FudMOEIRLMZFtx284jF3o8$
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io]
> On Behalf Of Kaplan,Andre
> Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2020 4:43 AM
> To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
> Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Main sail outhaul motor
>
> I have a 1988 Mango no.71. On recommissioning this spring, the electric
> outhaul for the mainsail is not working. A quick look by a yard worker
> suggested the solenoid might be bad. Can someone give me advice on how to
> approach this problem? If the solenoid is bad, how can I replace it? Is
> there a standard solenoid that can replace the original? If so, what is the
> model that I need? Must I get the replacement from Amel? If the outhaul
> motor is bad, how and where can I get a replacement?
> Thanks for any advice.
>
> Andre Kaplan
> Renaissance 2000
> Mango 71 88
>
>
>
>
>
>




Re: Zink Anode for SPURS Line Cutter

ULRICH DANGELMEYER
 

Hi Ameliens,

I´m interested to have a closer view on my spurs cutter anode as soon as possible, may be in August, hopefully.
Is anybody from you experts are able to call me the right size for our 54´s spurs cutter zinc.
There are a lot in variety at boatzincs.com.
Currently I´m not able to make a measure. Boat in Greece, I´m Germany. Not so fine.

THX a lot in advance and: still take care

Best wishes to all are locked down remote. from home or boat.

Ulrich Michael.
„Soleil Bleu“ /A54 #088.
<>


Re: Main sail outhaul Motorspor

John Clark
 

Also an SM owner, older SM though...assuming that all the breakers are turned on (control power too)  I found when the brushes in the motor are near the end of life the motor will sometimes work sometimes not.  A tap on the side would make it go for a while.  I replaced the brushes and have not had an issue in years.  
Annie SM 37
WI USVI

On Sun, May 17, 2020 at 3:23 PM Kaplan,Andre <kaplan@...> wrote:
Mark
Thanks for your reply. Yes, I did check the breaker.. it was not tripped, but it may be suspect since it had been replaced...
I’m not on the boat today, but I will take photos next week. Unfortunately, I can hear a click when I throw the switch... by your assessment, it may be the motor... if so, does anyone know where and how to get a replacement motor? Must it come from Amel or is there a standard motor that can be used as replacement.

BTW, I always try to limit strain on motor by heading into the wind during furling or unfurling mainsail.

Thanks for any suggestions on motor replacement.

Boat lies in Westbrook, CT

Andre
Renaissance 2000
Mango 71, 1988
> On May 17, 2020, at 2:21 PM, Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote:
>
> *** Attention: This is an external email. Use caution responding, opening attachments or clicking on links. ***

> Andre,
>
> I am unsure if the solenoid is the same on the Mango as the SM. If it is, it
> is a product used in forklift trucks. This should help you find one (not
> sure where you are located). Perhaps you can post a picture.
>
> That said, it is not usually the solenoid that fails. They are extremely
> heavy duty. More often the motor burns out due to the operator putting too
> much strain on it. If you hear a click as you work the outhaul switch on the
> control panel, it is not the solenoid.
>
> Stating the obvious, have you checked the breaker?
>
>
> With best regards,
>
> Mark
>
> Skipper
> Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
> Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.creampuff.us__;!!N0rdg9Wr!_jfC8TlOKSYZuv_1Syg0ZKXhUrJXC8xanwngc1sf7FudMOEIRLMZFtx284jF3o8$
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io]
> On Behalf Of Kaplan,Andre
> Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2020 4:43 AM
> To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
> Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Main sail outhaul motor
>
> I have a 1988 Mango no.71. On recommissioning this spring, the electric
> outhaul for the mainsail is not working. A quick look by a yard worker
> suggested the solenoid might be bad. Can someone give me advice on how to
> approach this problem? If the solenoid is bad, how can I replace it? Is
> there a standard solenoid that can replace the original? If so, what is the
> model that I need? Must I get the replacement from Amel? If the outhaul
> motor is bad, how and where can I get a replacement?
> Thanks for any advice.
>
> Andre Kaplan
> Renaissance 2000
> Mango 71 88
>
>
>
>
>
>




Re: SM Turnbuckle

John Clark
 

Thanks guys.  I wrote to ACMO a few days ago.  They replied today requesting a photo.  We'll see what they say.  

Regards,  John

SV Annie SM37
Water Island USVI

On Sun, May 17, 2020 at 10:26 AM Kaplan,Andre <kaplan@...> wrote:



On May 17, 2020, at 8:51 AM, karkauai via groups.io <karkauai=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:


*** Attention: This is an external email. Use caution responding, opening attachments or clicking on links. ***
Hi John,
Like Gary, the chrome on my original rigging looked like new when I had her re-rigged at 13 years old. The new rigging  was from a well-respected company in England (sorry, I don't remember the name) that builds rigging for megayachts. When the chrome started failing on the turnbuckles after 3 years, I had it inspected by Annapolis rigging. They confirmed that it was only cosmetic. They also contacted the supplier who confirmed that they had had a bad batch of chrome that year. Unfortunately, it was out of warranty and they weren't willing to do any kind of refund.
I had a bronze turnbuckle machined locally which was not chromed. It actually looks better than the chromed turnbuckles.

Things are beginning to open up in Maryland now and Iris is starting her charter season next weekend ..with masks and as much "distancing" as possible. If all goes well with her new captains and crew, we hope to e sailing up to Maiy for July and Aug.  I hope you will be able to start moving again soon. What are your plans?
Kent & Iris
Kristy
SM243
St Michaels, MD
On May 16, 2020 9:55 AM, John Clark <john.biohead@...> wrote:
While this is a tad late to the discussion, yes the ACMO turnbuckles are chrome plated bronze....and that chrome plating is my concern.  I had Caribe Greement in Martinique replace Annie's rigging in 2017.  Shortly afterward the chrome on the turnbuckles began to look weathered even though we rinsed them and kept them clean.  Here is a picture of the main mast backstay turnbuckle, the one in the cockpit.  This one is out of the weather and the chrome is pretty much done.  Has anyone else had this issue?  


John Clark
SV Annie SM 37
Water Island USVI