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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Hi Dean I was at the Dock with charger and shore power 6 weeks while away from Trippin the charger died and batteries drained so low the alternator couldn’t be excited to start charging them. Got a portable charger to get a smaller charge then alternator fully charged them but they fell below 24 volts within 30 minutes
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Total Bummer expensive lesson learned
On Nov 15, 2020, at 5:05 AM, Dean Gillies <stella@...> wrote:
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
I believe that you need to upgrade your Mastervolt Alpha I regulator to an Alpha III to support LiFePO4 batteries.
Brent
On Nov 15, 2020, 5:00 AM -0500, Dean Gillies <stella@...>, wrote:
Hi Elja, --
Brent Cameron Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Hi Nick,
Sounds like the lead batteries definitely help the list problem! Good analysis, and I tend to agree about it being marginal for part-time cruising. I have a good solar capability, and I'm sure I would get 5 years easily from some good AGM batteries. I don't anticipate a big drop in Generator usage by changing to Lithium, and I like to run it for a reasonable time on a regular basis anyway just for good practice. It looks like I'm getting close to an answer on the cost comparison on a drop-in replacement basis. Its about GBP300 for a new Alpha Series III regulator, and another GBP200 for a USB interface to program the chargers, so that brings the Lithium package to about GBP8500 vs around GBP3000 or maybe a bit less for those Leoch Carbon AGM batteries. So I save a heap of cash and don't list even more to port by sticking with the lead! Who knows what new toys I could buy with that GBP5500. Very interesting exercise, I need to mull over this a little more. Thanks all. Dean SY Stella A54-154
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Hi Scott,
Thanks for that info, very helpful. I was wondering about the alternator... I do have the MV Alpha 24/110 Alternator, but I don't know if I have the original or series II regulator. Best info I can find at the moment says that series II was released around 2013, so most likely I don't have that and will need to upgrade to the Series II or III. I believe HVD is handled best by avoiding it. The chargers must be programmed to shutdown before HVD voltage is reached. For example the Relion RB24V50 HVD is 31.2V, whereas fully charged is 29.2V, so chargers can be programmed to shut down at say 29.5. This can be programmed with the Mastervolt chargers and Series II/III regulators. If a charger fault causes higher voltage, then as you suggest, its possible that a voltage spike on disconnect will result, possible destroying the faulty charger. In theory, the other chargers should be shutdown at that stage, which may limit the damage. When your battery imbalance occurred, did all of your strings disconnect simultaneously? I'm hoping to minimise the chance of battery imbalance by using 24V batteries rather than 2x12V pairs. This also provides 8 batteries in parallel, so I suspect it's less likely that all 8 batteries will disconnect simultaneously. All very difficult to predict of course without a test bench. So the list issue favours AGM's, thanks for that info! Cheers Dean SV Stella A54-154
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Hi Courtney,
Thanks for that info. Its good to hear about the Relion brand. Sorry to hear about the AGM's, what happened to kill those so quickly? Hi Bill, Thanks for the info. Unfortunately, Transporter don't supply the 24V batter. I checked with Justin. Cheers Dean SY Stella A54-154
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Hi Elja,
You are correct, maybe the Lithium batteries will last longer, but maybe not. we don't really know! I know from experience the AGM's should last 5 years. I think its unlikely that the Lithium's would last 12.5 years. I will base my thinking on 7-8 years for the Lithium option which makes them effectively double the cost. Brent, I think I've tracked down my Mastervolt (Chargemaster 24/100-3) chargers and as far as I can ascertain, they are adjustable via MasterBus for a lithium charging profile. Still need to work out about the alternator charging ability. It's all a bit difficult from the other side of the planet! Many thanks Dean SY Stella A54-154
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
He Nick ,
He Dean I think the A2 B charger 24/200 from sterling have a profile for Licium charging from Altinator Elja SM Balu 222 Von meinem iPhone gesendet
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Hi Dean,
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When I bought Amelia in 2017 I replaced the Onan. I spent about two months with no genset and there was no list. As soon as the new genset was installed we listed to port. I also bought new Lifeline AGMs. Still going 100%. I wanted Firefly at the time but availability was the problem. I understand the attractions of Lithium, but carbon foam AGM batteries are also very attractive. Firefly brand is the best but expensive and not available in the U.K. Pure lead carbon AGM by Leoch are available in the U.K. £239 inc delivery. I am sure you could get a discount for 12. I have no personal experience with these batteries. I currently use my boat for about 5 months per year. I have solar and wind. For the other seven months the solar keeps the batteries 100% charged. Whilst cruising I run the genset to make water, do the laundry etc for about 3 hrs per week. Call it 75 hours per year. So about 115 litres of diesel, one oil change and an oil filter pa. I anticipate that my battery bank will last quite a long time...but who knows. Now if I was to do it again now, that is buy a boat with the generator seized and dead. I would not replace the generator. I would go Lithium and big inverter and big solar and big alternator. The boat would have less weight and no list and it would have saved money. The thing is, you: Have a good generator Only use the boat six months pa Not sure Lithium is worth the trouble and expense unless you are cruising full time. If you had solar you would prolong the life of your AGM bank. All the best and looking forward to rolling out effective vaccines so we can get back on track. Nick S/Y Amelia Leros Gr AML54-019
On 15 Nov 2020, at 02:13, Scott SV Tengah <Scott.nguyen@...> wrote:
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Re: Valsat 03 dimesions
Thank you. I purchases Garmin 922 that will fit almost perfectly.
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Scott SV Tengah
Ah yes and we listed to port prior to lithium. Even more so now. Full diesel tank helps though.
-- Scott 2007 A54 #69 SV Tengah http://www.svtengah.com
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Scott SV Tengah
Dean,
If you have the master volt 110/24 alternator you'll need the alpha pro 2 or later regulator. You'll also need the masterbus-usb interface to pick the lithium profile. No way to do it otherwise. If you have a bms that can send a signal out to indicate over or under voltage, it's possible to setup the alpha pro 2 to safely stop charging. Took me a while (and included the help of an engineer who used to break into car ecus for fun and profit) to figure it out but it's relatively simple at the end of the day. My victron mains and solar chargers are turned off by an external bms signal too, so no worries about high voltage disconnect. I'm curious how it's done with these drop in batteries - I simply don't know how they protect against hvd without destroying the alternator, mains charger and solar charger. Further if the battery is disconnected from the circuit, wouldn't you have a voltage spike, damaging your electronics? Hvd has happened to me on more than one occasion due to high charging currents on batteries that went slightly out of balance. Didn't happen until after the first year, so don't be overconfident if it doesn't happen right away. For long term storage if you're storing on the hard, just disconnect everything at 40-50%soc and the self discharge is negligible. With master volt I believe you can set a charging limit based on soc. With my victron I did a workaround where I have the programmable relay within the bmv712 battery monitor turn on the inverter at say 75% and run a 230v load (dehumidifer) until it drops to 45% or so. Dries the boat and keeps it from keeping the battery overcharged when I leave the boat for extended periods Hope this helps. -- Scott 2007 A54 #69 SV Tengah http://www.svtengah.com
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Re: 𝗭𝗼𝗼𝗺 𝗠𝗲𝗲𝘁𝗶𝗻𝗴𝘀
Great idea. I know Chris. I will contact him. Best, CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School +1 832-380-4970 | brouse@... 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com Yacht School Calendar: www.preparetocastoff.blogspot.com/p/calendar.html
On Sat, Nov 14, 2020, 12:29 PM Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote:
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Re: 𝗭𝗼𝗼𝗺 𝗠𝗲𝗲𝘁𝗶𝗻𝗴𝘀
Perhaps some stuff related to weather forecasting and weather services? Chris Parker and Met Bob have always seemed very approachable.
I attended a free Chris Parker seminar at the St Pete boat show. About 50 others joined. He did a great job of explaining weather in layman’s terms (and of course promoted his book – very softly). He also tells some great stories of his cruising days and how he got into the business of weather.
With best regards,
Mark
Skipper Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275 Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia www.creampuff.us
From:
main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On
Behalf Of CW Bill Rouse
I have had difficulty scheduling someone to speak at our Zoom meetings for November and December.
Hopefully, we will be able to resume these meetings next year.
I am always open to suggestions.
Bill
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𝗭𝗼𝗼𝗺 𝗠𝗲𝗲𝘁𝗶𝗻𝗴𝘀
I have had difficulty scheduling someone to speak at our Zoom meetings for November and December. Hopefully, we will be able to resume these meetings next year. I am always open to suggestions. Bill
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Transporter Energy distributes the Battle Born batteries in Europe under the brand Transporter Fact Sheet For more information or a Custom Bundle Quote contact: Tell him that I referred you for an Amel Discount Bill
On Fri, Nov 13, 2020 at 7:57 PM Dean Gillies <stella@...> wrote: Hi all,
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
I just installed 12 12v Relion batteries and 2 40v chargers everything was a straight swap
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Batteries 900$ each Chose the 40v because they can use any shore voltage and can run at the same time if wanted like with the Generator Obviously no long term experience but my failed chargers killed a 1 year old bank of AGMs so easy decision Cheers Courtney Trippin 54 #101 Brunswick
On Nov 13, 2020, at 8:57 PM, Dean Gillies <stella@...> wrote:
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
He Dean
By the calkulation for the price by AH you have to think abaut the time foe working in good contitione the AGM batteries maybe 5-8 years Li maybe 10-12 years ( we dont now realy ) I think two month agow to change to LI in this winter but it seams to dificult for my an now i thange by a new charge system victron multiplus , victron solar charger , and new agm Batteries an then i can change in 5 yaers by LI Batteries Elja SM Balu 222 Von meinem iPhone gesendet
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Re: Rudder Stuffing Box Packing Material
James Alton
Paul,
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I wonder if you might have had a deteriorated old style flax packing in your stuffing box? That material will break down and become weak over time so does tend to break into pcs. If you use a modern fiber packing I think that you will find that the packing rings will come out in one pc. as it is quite strong. I am glad to hear that the specialty tool worked better for you. James SV Sueno Maramu #220
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Thanks Brent, Good point about the profiles. I have circa 2010 Mastervolt mains chargers which I believe have lithium profiles, and a Victron solar controller which I know definitely does have the lithium profile. I'll check up on the Mastervolt products, and also that the Alternator external regulator is compatible.
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Dean, Battle Born is the US distributor for Dragon Fly Energy. In the UK, the same batteries are sold as Transporter Energy. This is what Brian on Delos installed. In addition to the alternator regulators you will need to ensure your chargers support a Lithium profile as well.
Brent
On Nov 13, 2020, 8:58 PM -0500, Dean Gillies <stella@...>, wrote:
--
Brent Cameron Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada
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