Date   

Re: Bow thruster tube anomaly

Dave Ritten
 

I have had a problem removing a pinch bolt on a motorcycle and was worried that the head of the bolt was getting rounded. One of the suggestions was to put coarse grinding paste on a hex point socket to increase the coefficient of friction. Apparently this works well in cases where a tool is slipping. Maybe worth a try?
--
Dave Ritten
Auckland
Prospective SM Owner


Re: Bow thruster tube anomaly

 

Even though it was Amel about 12 years ago that told me about the "drop method," I do not recommend it, and, in fairness, it was before they developed the tool. 

Maybe you can fold 200 grit wet/dry sandpaper several times where the grit is outside on both sides and insert it around the tube, increasing the friction between the tool and the tube.

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Sat, Feb 6, 2021 at 1:40 PM Davi Rozgonyi <davi.rozgonyi@...> wrote:
Believe it or not, I have been tapping, oiling, twisting this thing for several weeks... I am definitely sleeping on it. Do you think trying to do the Amel suggested lift and drop on the hard is a good next step? I have a scheduled lift in a few weeks but was hoping to have this done by then.

What is the tube composition? How would you repair gouges in it?

So those 8 screws do nothing to hold the thruster shaft in place? 


Re: Bow thruster tube anomaly

Davi Rozgonyi
 

Hey all, I did buy the tool. It didn't work, kept sliding incrementally down the tube no matter how tight I tightened it... Can I put something under the metal to improve the grip?? 


Re: Bow thruster tube anomaly

Juan de Zulueta
 

Davi,

Don t do the lift and drop, I did it some years ago and damaged the polyester cage.
Use the amel tool or similar to extract it.

Juan de Zulueta
+33680895892
sent from my Ipad.

Le 6 févr. 2021 à 15:40, Davi Rozgonyi <davi.rozgonyi@...> a écrit :

Believe it or not, I have been tapping, oiling, twisting this thing for several weeks... I am definitely sleeping on it. Do you think trying to do the Amel suggested lift and drop on the hard is a good next step? I have a scheduled lift in a few weeks but was hoping to have this done by then.

What is the tube composition? How would you repair gouges in it?

So those 8 screws do nothing to hold the thruster shaft in place? 


Re: Bow thruster tube anomaly

Juan de Zulueta
 

Hi All,
I had similar problem. Rust over the motor is creating that problem.
There is a special extractor tool sold by amel which is holding gently on the tube and extracting by moving screws pushing on the motor.
I am removing the tube every year and put a fair amount of grease on the motor connection to the tube.


Juan de Zulueta
+33680895892
sent from my Ipad.

Le 6 févr. 2021 à 13:06, Davi Rozgonyi <davi.rozgonyi@...> a écrit :

Hey all... So I've had a terrible time trying to remove my bow thruster foot for service (super maramu #56 1991). I inadvertently damaged the fiberglass tube, which is another question : how do I repair it? Is it a glass job?

But it is still stuck. Tried the usual things (penetrant over weeks, chain wrench, amel tool, tapping, banging, etc). There are these little screws I've never seen before on anyone's bt or in photos. Could they somehow be holding it on? The foot was removed and greased 3.5 years ago with no problem, and barely used, so rust alone seems like a stretch...there is some but doesn't look drastic. I'm afraid to remove all of these screws because of something messes up, I'll have a hard time taking her out to a yard with no bowthruster.

Anyone know what these screws do? Any ideas on how to repair a gouge in the tube?

Thanks, y'all 
<IMG_20210206_175033-01.jpeg>
<IMG_20210206_184809-01.jpeg>
<IMG_20210206_185334-01.jpeg>


Re: Bow thruster tube anomaly

Davi Rozgonyi
 

Believe it or not, I have been tapping, oiling, twisting this thing for several weeks... I am definitely sleeping on it. Do you think trying to do the Amel suggested lift and drop on the hard is a good next step? I have a scheduled lift in a few weeks but was hoping to have this done by then.

What is the tube composition? How would you repair gouges in it?

So those 8 screws do nothing to hold the thruster shaft in place? 


Re: Bow thruster tube anomaly

 

Davi,

I know that this is hard to believe, but I can remember at least 6 owners who experienced the same thing. I told them the most important thing you can do is be patient. In all of those cases, with all of the things you are doing, they were eventually successful without damaging the bow thruster. In my opinion, this will never happen if the bow thruster is serviced every 2 years and the bow thruster is not in use, it is locked up with the locking pin inserted. 

Were you able to apply a little twisting motion? In the hardest case, it was a very slight twisting motion (back and forth) and some vibration added to the cast iron base of the motor.

The reason the tube is stuck is saltwater entered the joint between the motor base and the tube. Rust on the cast iron base was the result of the saltwater and the rust filled the close fit between the tube and the cast iron motor base causing a very tight fit. The tube and the motor base are not rusted together because the tube is not metal. I understand that the tube is now very tight in the motor base.

Your bow thruster may be irreplaceable. I am not sure, but if not, one day soon that will be the case. It is important to take care of it like everything else I know that you do on your Amel.

I suggest that you walk away from this for a day or two.

Best,

Bill


CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Sat, Feb 6, 2021 at 12:53 PM Davi Rozgonyi <davi.rozgonyi@...> wrote:
Yup, removed 4 bolts. I checked about six times over the past week to make sure there wasn't a 5th... 


Re: Bow thruster tube anomaly

Davi Rozgonyi
 

Yup, removed 4 bolts. I checked about six times over the past week to make sure there wasn't a 5th... 


Re: Secondary Saltwater Manifold SMs & 54s, and possibly some Santorins, Mangos, and Maramus

Jim Anderson
 

Interested.
Thank you.
SM384
Sirena Azul


Re: How much Solar?

Ken Powers SV Aquarius
 
Edited

Regarding spike back protection, I think it best to explain why.....  Everyone should understand the protection parameters of their battery's BMS.  The BMS is there to protect your batteries, from High Voltage, Low Voltage, Over Current, Low Temperature, and High Temperature.  The BMS protections vary greatly between brands , but that should do it for most.  So, lets say your Alternator is charging at 28.4V,  that's great if the BMS's High Voltage shut of is at 29.2V.  But, what if you have a spike in the alternator's charging voltage (above 29.2V), or some type of failure in the battery's BMS...... your BMS will turn the battery off, and then your Alternator is instantaneously looking into an open circuit.  AND, You just smoked your Alternator.  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03SQMDnY6O0

This device should help anytime BMS shuts down your batteries, including your Victron Charger would feel less stress when the BMS does it's job.

In theory the $99 device Bill mentioned should save the alternator in this scenario.  I didn't think about this, but this device makes a lot of sense.  

Thanks Bill!

Ken Powers
Aquarius
SM2K262


Re: Bow thruster tube anomaly

 

Sometimes, I forget to start with a simple solution. 

How many Allen bolts did you remove from the base of the motor? It should have been 4.

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Sat, Feb 6, 2021 at 11:04 AM Davi Rozgonyi <davi.rozgonyi@...> wrote:
Hey all... So I've had a terrible time trying to remove my bow thruster foot for service (super maramu #56 1991). I inadvertently damaged the fiberglass tube, which is another question : how do I repair it? Is it a glass job?

But it is still stuck. Tried the usual things (penetrant over weeks, chain wrench, amel tool, tapping, banging, etc). There are these little screws I've never seen before on anyone's bt or in photos. Could they somehow be holding it on? The foot was removed and greased 3.5 years ago with no problem, and barely used, so rust alone seems like a stretch...there is some but doesn't look drastic. I'm afraid to remove all of these screws because of something messes up, I'll have a hard time taking her out to a yard with no bowthruster.

Anyone know what these screws do? Any ideas on how to repair a gouge in the tube?

Thanks, y'all 


Re: I got tired of the rusty rudder quadrant

Karen Smith
 

Eric,

I'd love to see/read more about how Amel altered the stuffing box...

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Charleston, SC, USA


Re: Bow thruster tube anomaly

Pietro Zaccari
 

Davi, 
the small screws are to keep in place an internal metal ring that is where the 4 allen screws are screwed. Did you remove all 4 alle , some year ago I forgot one and I try to pull hard with no results, of course. 
I rem6in a previous post that someone build a tool to extract the bowthruster leg from the motor 
Good luck

Pietro 
SM 364 Bolero 
.



Inviato dal mio Galaxy


-------- Messaggio originale --------
Da: Davi Rozgonyi <davi.rozgonyi@...>
Data: 06/02/21 18:04 (GMT+01:00)
A: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Oggetto: [AmelYachtOwners] Bow thruster tube anomaly

Hey all... So I've had a terrible time trying to remove my bow thruster foot for service (super maramu #56 1991). I inadvertently damaged the fiberglass tube, which is another question : how do I repair it? Is it a glass job?

But it is still stuck. Tried the usual things (penetrant over weeks, chain wrench, amel tool, tapping, banging, etc). There are these little screws I've never seen before on anyone's bt or in photos. Could they somehow be holding it on? The foot was removed and greased 3.5 years ago with no problem, and barely used, so rust alone seems like a stretch...there is some but doesn't look drastic. I'm afraid to remove all of these screws because of something messes up, I'll have a hard time taking her out to a yard with no bowthruster.

Anyone know what these screws do? Any ideas on how to repair a gouge in the tube?

Thanks, y'all 


Bow thruster tube anomaly

Davi Rozgonyi
 

Hey all... So I've had a terrible time trying to remove my bow thruster foot for service (super maramu #56 1991). I inadvertently damaged the fiberglass tube, which is another question : how do I repair it? Is it a glass job?

But it is still stuck. Tried the usual things (penetrant over weeks, chain wrench, amel tool, tapping, banging, etc). There are these little screws I've never seen before on anyone's bt or in photos. Could they somehow be holding it on? The foot was removed and greased 3.5 years ago with no problem, and barely used, so rust alone seems like a stretch...there is some but doesn't look drastic. I'm afraid to remove all of these screws because of something messes up, I'll have a hard time taking her out to a yard with no bowthruster.

Anyone know what these screws do? Any ideas on how to repair a gouge in the tube?

Thanks, y'all 


Re: Secondary Saltwater Manifold SMs & 54s, and possibly some Santorins, Mangos, and Maramus

 

A US Amel 54 owner has ordered and will install the PVC Secondary Saltwater Manifold. The 54 Secondary Saltwater Manifold is much more complicated than the SM2k. The SM2k Secondary Saltwater Manifold prototype is completed and ready to order. I negotiated a 15% discount for all Amel owners from SOTOMARIN, France. They are the supplier to Amel for the PVC manifolds beginning with the 55 and including the 50 & 60. 

The Amel 54 Secondary Saltwater Manifold kit is 457.18 ‎€ less15% Discount of 68.58 ‎€ = 388.60 ‎€ (Net XVAT + shipping)
Unless you need it immediately, I suggest we wait until I have a report from the first installation.
The Amel Super Maramu 2000 Secondary Saltwater Manifold kit is 437.36 ‎€ less 15% Discount of 65.60 ‎€ = 371.76 ‎€ (Net XVAT + shipping)
This is a simple installation and very straight forward. It is ready to order...see below 
Amel Super Maramu 2000 Secondary Saltwater Manifold Kit...
To order, contact Laura at contact"at"sofomarin.fr

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Sat, Feb 6, 2021 at 8:20 AM Vladan Bojic <vladan.bojic@...> wrote:
Interested

Vladan
A54 #157 PAME


Re: Secondary Saltwater Manifold SMs & 54s, and possibly some Santorins, Mangos, and Maramus

Vladan SV PAME
 

Interested

Vladan
A54 #157 PAME


Re: How much Solar?

Chantal & Alain sv Makemo
 

Thank you so much 


Re: How much Solar?

 

Paul,

I believe that you should research spike back voltage to the alternator protection from Lithium Batteries. Every Preferred Vendor of Lithium/LiFePO4 batteries recommends the same Sterling Power Alternator Protection Device 24v. This is less than 100 euro. Maybe they could be wrong, but I don't think so.
image.png
Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Sat, Feb 6, 2021 at 3:47 AM Paul Osterberg <osterberg.paul.l@...> wrote:
Alain!
We did not changed anything in our charging system, I had a 5 year old Victron Multiplus charger/inverter works great with Li, My very old Dolphine charger works great as well. My old alternator had before an external Balmar regulator, the only thing I did was to add a temp sensor for the alternator, must admit still on the hard so have not yet started the engine, but see no reason why it should not work. The BMS opens the field winding, when battery "fully" charged. For solar I have 4 Victron MPPT works great so far
Can now run all 220 v gadgets on my 540 Ah LiFePO4, including AC, and hot-water. The issue of course is how to recharge? We have 1,4 kw of solar and Swi-Tec hydrogenerator. Plan not to use the Onan. Yesterday it was raining most of the day and clouds close to 100% of the time still got in 60 Ah from the 1,1 Kw solar currently active. That is in the beginning of Feb when the sun is very low on the sky. Place Lagos Portugal. Solar is fantastic.
Paul on SY Kerpa SM#259


Re: How much Solar?

Paul Osterberg
 

Alain!
We did not changed anything in our charging system, I had a 5 year old Victron Multiplus charger/inverter works great with Li, My very old Dolphine charger works great as well. My old alternator had before an external Balmar regulator, the only thing I did was to add a temp sensor for the alternator, must admit still on the hard so have not yet started the engine, but see no reason why it should not work. The BMS opens the field winding, when battery "fully" charged. For solar I have 4 Victron MPPT works great so far
Can now run all 220 v gadgets on my 540 Ah LiFePO4, including AC, and hot-water. The issue of course is how to recharge? We have 1,4 kw of solar and Swi-Tec hydrogenerator. Plan not to use the Onan. Yesterday it was raining most of the day and clouds close to 100% of the time still got in 60 Ah from the 1,1 Kw solar currently active. That is in the beginning of Feb when the sun is very low on the sky. Place Lagos Portugal. Solar is fantastic.
Paul on SY Kerpa SM#259


Re: Yanmar no start.

eric freedman
 

Hi Dan

Inside the tank there is a screen that in my case got full of silicone that Amel used to seal the inspection ports.

The engine would run fine for days and then suddenly stop. After crossing the Atlantic I was 5 miles from home and the crew said call for a tow—the hell I will. I finally realized that there was a blockage inside the tank. I disconnected the fuel line and put the bell of an air horn over the hose and when I heard bubbling, problem solved. When I got home I drained the tank and took the bottom valve apart and found the “filter” like is used in the shower drains, full of gunk.

 

Next fuel filter change ditch the filter and sensor and get the regular Yanmar filter.  I only know of this as I am installing a new Yanmar 4jh4hte and I traced the wire back as I was rewiring the new engine for an isolated ground . The wire goes into the harness and ends not connected in the control panel. I am using my existing “b” panel .Possibly it is connected in another panel. You can check the harness wiring diagram to see if is doing anything in your unit.

 

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dan Carlson
Sent: Friday, February 05, 2021 8:27 PM
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Yanmar no start.

 

Hello Eric, 

 

Several times when I've had less than 200 liters of fuel in the tank I've removed the inspection port  covers to look inside the tank.  I've never emptied the tank completely. 

 

What I can also say is that when I changed the racor filters and opened the valve to refill the bowls on each side that the fuel flowed very freely from the tank to the racors. So I don't think that there was any obstruction there. 

 

I do have the wiring for the water detector on the Yanmar fuel filter, but I've never drained any water from that fuel filter, or from the simple drain on the bottom of the Onan fuel filter, or seen any water in the Racor bowls (which is the first place that I'd expect to find water, and I inspect pretty regularly).

 

Thanks for the extra recco's.

 

 Best regards, Daniel Carlson, on sv BeBe, SM #387

 

On Fri, Feb 5, 2021, 8:14 PM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

Hi Dan,

Did you ever check the filter inside the fuel tank?

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dan Carlson
Sent: Friday, February 05, 2021 1:52 PM
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Yanmar no start.

 

Thanks all for the helpful tips which also provides great emotional support :-) Nothing like a hick-up with your main engine out at anchor to get a little anxiety up.

 

All appears good now.

 

I changed both racor filters which had both been used since last changed. The in-use racor had noticably more dirt on it.  I also changed the fuel filters on both the Yanmar and Onan as they were right at a year since last change and the Yanmar had over 400 hrs due to above normal use on the long haul from the Caribbean to Chesapeake Bay in May and back after hurricane season this November. 

 

Both engines started and ran fine. 

 

I can suspect that a lot of extra motoring/motor-sailing, often when beating to the windward could have contributed to added gunk load on the fuel filters.  Also, in the last couple months we have had six rollicking reaches back and forth between Antigua and Barbuda with only about 200 liters sloshing around in the fuel tank. They were all sailing except the final 45 min to an hour using stirred up fuel to get into the anchorage. And the we just refueled last week as well, immediately motor-sailing for over a hour around to our anchorage.  Plenty of reasons to stir up the tank and add load to the fuel filters.

 

A few additional points:

- there were no issues with the Onan (but now with the LiFePo batteries it only had 100 hours over the last year and I'm sure that will go down more with my added solar capacity)

- no signs of water in the Racor bowls, or fuel drained from either the Yanmar or Onan fuel filters. 

- Fuel filters are Racor, Yanmar and Onan OEM parts.

- last month when I was down to about 180 liters in the tank, I opened the rear tank inspection port and could clearly see to the bottom of the tank and it was clean stainless steel. Could still be a little gunk in the corners or far forward. 

- I have been using Howes fuel treatment the last due refuelings, as well as a Valvetech biocide since Cartegena in Jan of 2020 (due to concerns with the hot humid environments we we're sailing in and also concerns about potentially having to purchase fuel with some bio-diesel in it)

- changing the Yanmar fuel filter is one of my less favorite maintenance tasks. Yes it's pretty straight forward and thanks for Bill Rouse simple instructions, but it's always a bit messy and I don't like the smell of diesel in the engine room.

- right now I'm chalking it up to restricted fuel flow due to dirty filters, but I guess that I was surprised to see it show up suddenly at idle.

 

Fair winds to all, 

 

Daniel and Lori Carlson on sv BeBe, SM #387, currently in Antigua

 

 

 

On Fri, Feb 5, 2021, 11:18 AM Karen Smith via groups.io <karenharmonie=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

Daniel,

I don't have any amazing magic things to add to what others have said, but I would STRONGLY discourage you from fiddling with the idle speed adjustment on the injection pump.  The inability to run stably at normal idle speed is a symptom, not the first cause of a failure.

This is not like the mixture adjustment on your outboard carburetor. It does not control the fuel flow itself, rather it controls the set point of a speed governor than then in turn adjusts the fuel rack.  Adjusting the idle speed adjustment is not typically done as part of a repair, but is part of the set up of the injection pump.

If you can get the engine running at a stable speed (slower is easier for this test) it might be worth opening the nut on the injectors, one at a time.  When disconnected, each injector should have a similar effect on the speed/smoothness of operation.  If one has little or no effect, then that injector is likely bad or clogged.

Another trick that can help sort out things, put a piece of clear plastic tubing into the system just before the lift pump.  If you see bubbles flowing by when running then you know you have an air leak that needs fixing.  If you see only clear fuel flow, then you can check off everything upstream of this as OK.  With your fuel tank nearly full, I doubt this is the problem, but it helps to be sure.

Last thing, I might have missed this, but if not yet done, changing the secondary fuel filter on the engine would be a good idea.  Again, not a likely, but a possible, cause of this kind of problem. For this filter, I would recommend (if possible) using a Yanmar OEM filter.  Some of the aftermarket filters have smaller elements and add excess restriction to fuel flow, especially after then get a bit of dirt in them. Normally problems with this filter are seen at high speed, not idle, but you have checked most all the easy boxes, so the less likely ones are what is left.

Tracking down fuel system issues like this can be a pain, but it will work out.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Charleston, SC

2261 - 2280 of 58608