Date   

Hull wear from swim ladder

svcharisma <svcharisma@...>
 

On our Mango, we use the pivoting swim ladder extensively as we are almost always at anchor. There is a significant groove now in the hull where the folding support from the ladder holds the ladder off the hull. This does not apply to Super Maramus, as their ladders do not swing, but would apply to Mangos and Maramus, maybe some others. I'm wondering if anyone has done a retrofit to reinforce the hull where the ladder rubs?

Alan
Mango #62 "Charisma"
Savusavu, Fiji


FW: [Amel] Use of Micro with 220v 60 Hz?

Jean Boucharlat
 

Let me contribute one more piece of experience to this great debate about
Volts and Hertz:



When my SM 232 was built, I asked Amel to install an onboard shore input
transformer with various possibilities (100V for Japan etc., 110V for US,
etc. and 200V for some other weird places). I had only the original 240V
50Hz charger and it worked just fine with 240V 60Hz provided by my onboard
transformer.



Concerning appliances:

Microwave: I was told by Mr. Carteau (who is my God in these matters!) not
to ever use the Microwave oven with anything other than 240V 50Hz which I
did by using my inboard inverter or the generator when in 60Hz lands.

Washing machine: when in Hawaï (60Hz) I ran the machine with 240V/60Hz and
blew the electronic control card. The motor, electro-valves, etc. were all
fine but nothing would happen as the control card was very very dead.

Dish washer: worked fine even with 240V/60Hz

VCR, TV, Radio, CD, DVD etc.: after having blown the power supplies of one
TV and one VCR , I made it my own rule, and had the boat wired by Amel
appropriately, never to use them with any other current than the one
provided by the inverter. This was as much out of concern for voltage or
frequency as for a well documented concern for current spikes when changing
from one source of current to another (Shore, generator or inverter). Those
spikes can be deadly to some electronics and it’s very easy (my experience)
to forget turning off sensitive equipment when changing current source.



Jean Boucharlat
(Formerly SM 232)



From: amelyachtowners@...
[mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of Jose
Sent: mercredi 25 novembre 2009 21:50
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel] Use of Micro with 220v 60 Hz?






Miles, I completly agree with your statement. In fact my boat has also an
alternative 110 V input that goes to a transformer to 220V and can be used
to run most of the house appliances.

The previous owner, and me up to now, have also been using the american 220
inlet in the form described by several people, that is witout a ground. I
will be changing things based on your suggestion.

Still, anybody has experience using the Micro, and two washers with 220V at
60Hz?

--- In <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>
amelyachtowners@..., "Miles Bidwell" <mbidwell@...> wrote:

I have been following the discussion of wiring and I think that my
experience with this may be of interest to the group.

In Europe the three wires are one hot, one return, and one ground. The one
hot line carries the 240. In the US it is possible to get 220 by
connecting
two 110 wires and ignoring the ground and many (lucky?) people do this
without problems. When my boat was being built, I asked Amel about doing
this. Amel said that it should never be done because there would be no
ground wire. They even sent M. Carteau over to my boat to explain in great
detail why the US approach should never be attempted. As part of Carteau's
design, Amels have very sensitive ground fault sensors which depend on
having a ground wire.

To solve the current problem, Amel built my boat with two independent
electrical systems. The one for the US is 110 volts (with a ground wire)
that goes to a Hart charger and a 60 cycle 110 inverter. The European 220
50 cycle circuit with its ground wire has a separate charger. For the
appliances and European wall outlets, transformers convert 110 to 220 when
plugged in to US shore current. I know that this is much more complex than
simply connecting two hot wires in the US but the potential damage from a
fault and no ground wire could be even more complex to repair.



Miles Bidwell

SM 216 LADYBUG



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


MMSI

Mr D
 

Wondering if anyone has had an issue with having multiple DSC-capable VHF stations (such as a handheld and a stationary). Option 1 is to assign different MMSI's to each station, in example, one MMSI to main vessel and another for the tender. Option 2 is to keep the same MMSI for all stations. Difference is in ability to track them. Can one "buddy-track" her own MMSI? I would want to be able to track the handheld in case of the MOB situation, for example. Thanks in advance.


Re: [Amel] the art of "hoving to"

Anne and John Hollamby <annejohnholl@...>
 

Hello All, Just a word of warning about heaving to until daylight. There are ocean currents which run with the trade winds often in excess of a knot. When we crossed the Pacific in the nineties we heard of two yachts that were wrecked whilst waiting for daylight. One of them was on one of the semi submerged Minerva Reefs halfway between Fiji and NZ. There was another loss when a boat from Boston,Mass. dragged anchor in Fiji.The owners stripped a lot of gear off it and advertised a forthcoming sale to reduce the loss to insurers.It did not happen because they were then told by Fiji Customs that they would have to pay import duty on the new cost!
Safe sailing, Anne and John, SM 319

----- Original Message -----
From: john martin
To: Amel YAHOO GROUP
Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 2:03 AM
Subject: [Amel] the art of "hoving to"




There has been alot of discussion about this recently, so I thought I'd offer some suggestions on how to do it on a SM.

While you are sailing hard on the wind (with both main and jib, but with no mizzen up), with the mainsail at almost midship, then turn the wheel hard over to tack, but don't release the sheet. When the bow crosses the wind, the jib will back because you didn't release the sheet. Now turn the wheel all the way in the other direction and secure it. You're done, so now go get a beer. It takes less than 10 seconds and only 1 person. The boat will lie quietly and will move between 1 and 2 knots. The jib sheet or the jib itself will lay against the forward shroud but will not rub excessively. If you feel you are sailing too far away from your intended course, or if you get too close to a lee shore, just get the boat sailing again on the "new tack" and then repeat the process and hove to in the other direction. You can tweak the sails a little if you want, but I never have seen the need. You don't have to reef down (any more than you may already be reefed) in order to hove to; I have hove to with a full main and full jib (even a 150).

On a long trip going to weather, it makes sense to hove to now and then so the crew can enjoy a meal in relatively gentle motion and also have a happy cook. We once hove to for 24 straight hours, when we had 30-35 knots dead on the nose, as it just didn't make sense to smash into it. It was better just to wait it out until the wind died a little. We also never make landfall in the dark, both for safety reasons and because it is always so beautiful to make landfall at dawn. So we either control boat speed for the last 24 hours before landfall, to ensure a daylight arrival, or we hove to and wait out the few hours before dawn.

Best regards,

John Martin

SM 248 "MOON DOG"


__________________________________________________________
Bing brings you maps, menus, and reviews organized in one place.
http://www.bing.com/search?q=restaurants&form=MFESRP&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MFESRP_Local_MapsMenu_Resturants_1x1


Re: Use of Micro with 220v 60 Hz?

svbebe <yahoogroups@...>
 

Jose -- we burned up our first microwave by using it a VERY few times for short duration with shore power 220V 60Hz. The microwave would stop if attempted to use longer than 5 minutes. Would strongly recommend not using 60Hz.

Did not use either dishwasher or clothes washer at 220V 60Hz.

Judy Rouse
S/V BeBe
Amel SM2 #387

--- In amelyachtowners@..., "Jose" <jgvenegas@...> wrote:
......
Still, anybody has experience using the Micro, and two washers with 220V at 60Hz?


the art of "hoving to"

john martin <symoondog@...>
 

There has been alot of discussion about this recently, so I thought I'd offer some suggestions on how to do it on a SM.

While you are sailing hard on the wind (with both main and jib, but with no mizzen up), with the mainsail at almost midship, then turn the wheel hard over to tack, but don't release the sheet. When the bow crosses the wind, the jib will back because you didn't release the sheet. Now turn the wheel all the way in the other direction and secure it. You're done, so now go get a beer. It takes less than 10 seconds and only 1 person. The boat will lie quietly and will move between 1 and 2 knots. The jib sheet or the jib itself will lay against the forward shroud but will not rub excessively. If you feel you are sailing too far away from your intended course, or if you get too close to a lee shore, just get the boat sailing again on the "new tack" and then repeat the process and hove to in the other direction. You can tweak the sails a little if you want, but I never have seen the need. You don't have to reef down (any more than you may already be reefed) in order to hove to; I have hove to with a full main and full jib (even a 150).

On a long trip going to weather, it makes sense to hove to now and then so the crew can enjoy a meal in relatively gentle motion and also have a happy cook. We once hove to for 24 straight hours, when we had 30-35 knots dead on the nose, as it just didn't make sense to smash into it. It was better just to wait it out until the wind died a little. We also never make landfall in the dark, both for safety reasons and because it is always so beautiful to make landfall at dawn. So we either control boat speed for the last 24 hours before landfall, to ensure a daylight arrival, or we hove to and wait out the few hours before dawn.



Best regards,

John Martin

SM 248 "MOON DOG"



_________________________________________________________________
Bing brings you maps, menus, and reviews organized in one place.
http://www.bing.com/search?q=restaurants&form=MFESRP&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MFESRP_Local_MapsMenu_Resturants_1x1


Re: [Amel] Re: rpm problems

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Kent The auto prop literature says that if you need a different diameter prop it can be achieved by a blade change using the existing hub with commensurate savings, it may be worth following up. 
Regards
Danny and Yvonne SM 299 Ocean Pearl
 
- On Sat, 28/11/09, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...> wrote:


From: Kent Robertson <karkauai@...>
Subject: [Amel] Re: rpm problems
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Saturday, 28 November, 2009, 3:57 AM


 



Well, here I am again talking about the Volvo TMD 22 and low rpm. You are going to find this very interesting.

After spending over $6K on the engine with a cleaned then new turbo, cleaning and inspection of the injectors and injector pump, polishing the fuel then cleaning the tank and all fittings from the tank to the engine, checking the timing and changing the belt, numerous sea trials & haulings, ??????, we finally decided it could be a prop issue. Even tho the prior owner said he ran the engine at over 3K rpm a couple of times a day. They pulled the autoprop, put the fixed prop on and got her up to 2800. Then got the autoprop s/n and called them...turns out it is the prop rated for the same boat with the 100HP Yanmar. It's 22 1/4" dia., as is the fixed prop. The autoprop rated for the Volvo 78HP is 19" dia. We had the fixed prop repitched as much as possible (2") and can get her up to 2950rpm now, but there is only enough room for one nut on the prop shaft with that prop on. I had them drill a hole thru nut and shaft and install a heavy cotter pin and left
that prop on the boat. The autoprop folks couldn't get me the correct one in time so we're sailing with the fixed one until next Spring.

I haven't contacted Amel yet, but will be interested to hear what they say.....I feel certain that they fitted the boat with the wrong props from the beginning. I'm sure that's why the boat has needed the turbo replaced twice already. It's cost me $6K so far and will now cost me the price of another autoprop ($4,500 + shipping).

There are a couple other boats that say they never got more than 2600rpms out of their Volvos either. I would check your prop serial number. If it's 22 1/4" in diameter, I'd bet it's propped for a Yanmar 100HP.

At least I've got an engine that's been checked out from top to bottom and stem to stern and looks good for a lot of sea miles.

Do you think that Amel should buy me a new auto prop, or should I just inform them and let it go?

In Bermuda now, on to St. Thomas when the low clears out.

Have a great winter season,
Kent
S/V Kristy
SM 243

--- In amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com, "Kent Robertson" <karkauai@.. .> wrote:

Hi again all,
I tried to post this on my previous thread, but I couldn't find it using the search engine and just going back thru the topics??? I thought I had the rpm problem figured out, but alas, after all that was done it still won't get over 2400 under load. The mechanic who's looking at it now is convinced it's a timing belt problem and is working on that as we speak. I wrote to Amel and got this reply:

"Dear Mr ROBERTSON,
It looks like it does not come from the prop.
After reading your email, we know that some type of injectors can not be cleaned, and must be changed.
unfortunately, we are not able to say which type are fitted on your engine.
We also think that may come from the connection between the turbo and the injection pump.
When turbo turns, there is a low pressure pump asking to the injectors to supply more diesel.
This may be the reason.
Anyhow, the max rpm in load is 2800-3000 and not 3500 as mentionned.
Hope this helps.
Maud TOUILLET"

I think everyone on this forum has suggested that the Volvo TMD22 should get ~3500 rpm under load. What should I be shooting for in terms of rpm under load with a clean AutoProp?

Thanks, as usual, for your replies,
Kent
Kristy SM243







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Rép. : [Amel] Re: 110v ac connection

john martin <symoondog@...>
 

I also have the same system on my boat and its great. I have the big yellow line for use in the U.S. and the small black line for the rest of the world. The heart inverter charger,( Zantrex) is the european model that is 220 volt 50 hertz. I can run everything on the boat at 50 hertz even in the U.S. I also can run the micro/wave at anchorage without turning on the generator via the heart charger. I was not the original owner but I believe Amel installed it. I also have the original Amel charger that was put on the boat. Its 220, 50 hertz. I can't say how these systems work ,but I have a bag full of different plugs and can hook up any where in the world even on a household extension cord. I think the 110 volt comes into the boat and goes to a transformer that has the 110 to 220 volt switch that probably then goes to the heart charger and comes out as 220volt/50hertz. Zantrexi is still selling this unit if any one is interested. They can probably tell you how it works. I've been using this system for over 6 years and no problem. When I go into a slip I just ask them if they are 110 or 220 and let me see the plug. Thank you Amel. John "Moon Dog" SM 248



To: amelyachtowners@...
From: mbidwell@...
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 2009 19:57:21 -0500
Subject: Re:Rép. : [Amel] Re: 110v ac connection





M. Tremblay,

I have two shore wires and a big switch in the engine room. When I plug in
the 110 US wire, I set the switch for 110 at the dock. This line goes to
the transformer that energizes the 220 outlets and appliances and to the
Hart charger and to the US 110 outlets. When I plug in the European 220
wire, I set the switch to 220 and this goes to the 220 battery charger and
directly to the European outlets and appliances. For the 110 60 cycle
outlets, I turn on the Hart Inverter. I do have a wiring diagram but it is
on the boat which I have just put to bed for the winter (its first time out
of the water and first time in a cold climate). If I have a chance to
retrieve the diagram, I will copy and post it.

Eric,

I think that you are mistaken in your understanding of the European
electricity. If you use a tester to probe an outlet, you will find that
there is one hot wire. The other two are a return and a ground. Connecting
the hot to either of these will show 220+ volts. Connecting the return and
the ground will show nothing (unless something is seriously amiss). This
is how one checks the polarity. As in the US, if the polarity is reversed,
the battery charger will blow its fuses (or worse).

Regards to all,

Miles Bidwell

Sm216 LADYBUG on the hard in Rhode Island







_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection.
http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/177141665/direct/01/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: [Amel] Re: rpm problems

Richard Piller <richard03801@...>
 

Kent, Glad to see you got the the bottom of the problem must be a hell of a relief for you.. so, when you pined the prop net did you use the same metal as the nut/prop shaft? IF not you need to change the pin or the you will have set up the perfect eletrolysis condition to have one of the elements be eaten by the other?
Good luck save travels and fairwinds. Remember to stay east of the rumb line going south... or the wind and current will get you.. Richard and Joan on Challenge SM 209




________________________________
From: Kent Robertson <karkauai@...>
To: amelyachtowners@...
Sent: Fri, November 27, 2009 9:57:29 AM
Subject: [Amel] Re: rpm problems


Well, here I am again talking about the Volvo TMD 22 and low rpm. You are going to find this very interesting.

After spending over $6K on the engine with a cleaned then new turbo, cleaning and inspection of the injectors and injector pump, polishing the fuel then cleaning the tank and all fittings from the tank to the engine, checking the timing and changing the belt, numerous sea trials & haulings, ??????, we finally decided it could be a prop issue. Even tho the prior owner said he ran the engine at over 3K rpm a couple of times a day. They pulled the autoprop, put the fixed prop on and got her up to 2800. Then got the autoprop s/n and called them...turns out it is the prop rated for the same boat with the 100HP Yanmar. It's 22 1/4" dia., as is the fixed prop. The autoprop rated for the Volvo 78HP is 19" dia. We had the fixed prop repitched as much as possible (2") and can get her up to 2950rpm now, but there is only enough room for one nut on the prop shaft with that prop on. I had them drill a hole thru nut and shaft and install a heavy cotter pin and
left that prop on the boat. The autoprop folks couldn't get me the correct one in time so we're sailing with the fixed one until next Spring.

I haven't contacted Amel yet, but will be interested to hear what they say...I feel certain that they fitted the boat with the wrong props from the beginning. I'm sure that's why the boat has needed the turbo replaced twice already. It's cost me $6K so far and will now cost me the price of another autoprop ($4,500 + shipping).

There are a couple other boats that say they never got more than 2600rpms out of their Volvos either. I would check your prop serial number. If it's 22 1/4" in diameter, I'd bet it's propped for a Yanmar 100HP.

At least I've got an engine that's been checked out from top to bottom and stem to stern and looks good for a lot of sea miles.

Do you think that Amel should buy me a new auto prop, or should I just inform them and let it go?

In Bermuda now, on to St. Thomas when the low clears out.

Have a great winter season,
Kent
S/V Kristy
SM 243

--- In amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com, "Kent Robertson" <karkauai@.. .> wrote:

Hi again all,
I tried to post this on my previous thread, but I couldn't find it using the search engine and just going back thru the topics??? I thought I had the rpm problem figured out, but alas, after all that was done it still won't get over 2400 under load. The mechanic who's looking at it now is convinced it's a timing belt problem and is working on that as we speak. I wrote to Amel and got this reply:

"Dear Mr ROBERTSON,
It looks like it does not come from the prop.
After reading your email, we know that some type of injectors can not be cleaned, and must be changed.
unfortunately, we are not able to say which type are fitted on your engine.
We also think that may come from the connection between the turbo and the injection pump.
When turbo turns, there is a low pressure pump asking to the injectors to supply more diesel.
This may be the reason.
Anyhow, the max rpm in load is 2800-3000 and not 3500 as mentionned.
Hope this helps.
Maud TOUILLET"

I think everyone on this forum has suggested that the Volvo TMD22 should get ~3500 rpm under load. What should I be shooting for in terms of rpm under load with a clean AutoProp?

Thanks, as usual, for your replies,
Kent
Kristy SM243


Re: [Amel] Downwind sailing with a 54

kimberlite <kimberlite@...>
 

The sail is 1 ½ ounce made by Doyle sailmakers. About 1500 square feet.

I also had a bow sprit made to put the tack of the headsail about 18 inches
forward of the forward rail.



Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite





_____

From: amelyachtowners@...
[mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of Martin
Sent: Friday, November 27, 2009 11:51 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel] Downwind sailing with a 54





Thank you for your reply. This sounds just what we are looking for. Can you
help with a specification of what you have and the maker that you used? Alos
is this a furlable sail?

Regards,
Martin Bevan
Caduceus - Amel 54 No 56 2007

--- In amelyachtowners@ <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>
yahoogroups.com, kimberlite <kimberlite@...> wrote:

Martin,

We purchased a heavy gennaker and sail it in 30 knots true down wind.

On crossing we had it up for 7 days straight.

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite







_____

From: amelyachtowners@ <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>
yahoogroups.com
[mailto:amelyachtowners@ <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>
yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin
Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2009 11:35 AM
To: amelyachtowners@ <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>
yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel] Downwind sailing with a 54





I would be interested to receive feedback from other 54 owners in
particular, and other Amel owners in general, as to your experience with
trade wind, downwind, sailing and what other sail plan options that you
may
have tried.

Unlike earlier Amel yachts the 54 does not have the Amel twin headsail
option, relying on the genoa, a single bearing out pole and a light weight
(15kts max) genaker.

We are usually sailing with only the two of us aboard and our options are
limited in respect of spinakers and the like, given the problems and risks
involved in handling in rising winds.

Regards,
Martin Bevan
Caduceus - Amel 54 No 56 2007





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: [Amel] Downwind sailing with a 54

Martin <yachtcaduceus@...>
 

Thank you for your reply. This sounds just what we are looking for. Can you help with a specification of what you have and the maker that you used? Alos is this a furlable sail?

Regards,
Martin Bevan
Caduceus - Amel 54 No 56 2007

--- In amelyachtowners@..., kimberlite <kimberlite@...> wrote:

Martin,

We purchased a heavy gennaker and sail it in 30 knots true down wind.

On crossing we had it up for 7 days straight.

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite







_____

From: amelyachtowners@...
[mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of Martin
Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2009 11:35 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel] Downwind sailing with a 54





I would be interested to receive feedback from other 54 owners in
particular, and other Amel owners in general, as to your experience with
trade wind, downwind, sailing and what other sail plan options that you may
have tried.

Unlike earlier Amel yachts the 54 does not have the Amel twin headsail
option, relying on the genoa, a single bearing out pole and a light weight
(15kts max) genaker.

We are usually sailing with only the two of us aboard and our options are
limited in respect of spinakers and the like, given the problems and risks
involved in handling in rising winds.

Regards,
Martin Bevan
Caduceus - Amel 54 No 56 2007





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: rpm problems

karkauai
 

Well, here I am again talking about the Volvo TMD 22 and low rpm. You are going to find this very interesting.

After spending over $6K on the engine with a cleaned then new turbo, cleaning and inspection of the injectors and injector pump, polishing the fuel then cleaning the tank and all fittings from the tank to the engine, checking the timing and changing the belt, numerous sea trials & haulings, ??????, we finally decided it could be a prop issue. Even tho the prior owner said he ran the engine at over 3K rpm a couple of times a day. They pulled the autoprop, put the fixed prop on and got her up to 2800. Then got the autoprop s/n and called them...turns out it is the prop rated for the same boat with the 100HP Yanmar. It's 22 1/4" dia., as is the fixed prop. The autoprop rated for the Volvo 78HP is 19" dia. We had the fixed prop repitched as much as possible (2") and can get her up to 2950rpm now, but there is only enough room for one nut on the prop shaft with that prop on. I had them drill a hole thru nut and shaft and install a heavy cotter pin and left that prop on the boat. The autoprop folks couldn't get me the correct one in time so we're sailing with the fixed one until next Spring.

I haven't contacted Amel yet, but will be interested to hear what they say...I feel certain that they fitted the boat with the wrong props from the beginning. I'm sure that's why the boat has needed the turbo replaced twice already. It's cost me $6K so far and will now cost me the price of another autoprop ($4,500 + shipping).

There are a couple other boats that say they never got more than 2600rpms out of their Volvos either. I would check your prop serial number. If it's 22 1/4" in diameter, I'd bet it's propped for a Yanmar 100HP.

At least I've got an engine that's been checked out from top to bottom and stem to stern and looks good for a lot of sea miles.

Do you think that Amel should buy me a new auto prop, or should I just inform them and let it go?

In Bermuda now, on to St. Thomas when the low clears out.

Have a great winter season,
Kent
S/V Kristy
SM 243

--- In amelyachtowners@..., "Kent Robertson" <karkauai@...> wrote:

Hi again all,
I tried to post this on my previous thread, but I couldn't find it using the search engine and just going back thru the topics??? I thought I had the rpm problem figured out, but alas, after all that was done it still won't get over 2400 under load. The mechanic who's looking at it now is convinced it's a timing belt problem and is working on that as we speak. I wrote to Amel and got this reply:

"Dear Mr ROBERTSON,
It looks like it does not come from the prop.
After reading your email, we know that some type of injectors can not be cleaned, and must be changed.
unfortunately, we are not able to say which type are fitted on your engine.
We also think that may come from the connection between the turbo and the injection pump.
When turbo turns, there is a low pressure pump asking to the injectors to supply more diesel.
This may be the reason.
Anyhow, the max rpm in load is 2800-3000 and not 3500 as mentionned.
Hope this helps.
Maud TOUILLET"

I think everyone on this forum has suggested that the Volvo TMD22 should get ~3500 rpm under load. What should I be shooting for in terms of rpm under load with a clean AutoProp?

Thanks, as usual, for your replies,
Kent
Kristy SM243


Re: Shore power supplies - 220v and 110v

svbebe <yahoogroups@...>
 

All,

Shortly after buying BeBe, we fried our original microwave by using 220 volt 60htz.

The following is our guide to EU/US shore power. It is based on what we have done and experienced. It may not be the correct answer, but thus far has worked for us. I placed a photo in the photo section of this website at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amelyachtowners/photos/album/1949812811/pic/989268970/view?picmode=&mode=tn&order=ordinal&start=1&count=20&dir=asc

Comments or thoughts? I would be most interested in any reply.

Best,

Bill
s/v BeBe, SM2, #387

Wiring colors and schemes:
EUROPEAN & most of the world except USA 230-250 Volt AC has 3 wires with color codes as follows:
1. Brown = European Hot or Live
2. Blue = European Return
3. Green/Yellow Stripe = Earth or Safety Ground

USA 220 Volt AC typically has 4 wires with color codes as follows:
1. Red = USA Hot
2. Black = USA Hot
3. White = USA Neutral
4. Green = Earth or Safety Ground

Voltage measurements:
EUROPEAN & most of the world except USA:
Between the Brown and Blue Reads 230-250 Volts AC
Between the Blue and the Green with Yellow Stripe Reads Zero Volts AC
Between the Brown and the Green/Yellow Stripe Reads 230-250 Volts AC
USA:
Between the Red and Black Reads 220 Volts AC
Between the Red and White Reads 110 Volts AC
Between the Black and White Reads 110 Volts AC
Between the White and Green Reads Zero Volts AC

When wiring the Amel cable from the boat to USA power, we do the following:
1. The Brown Wire (Hot) should go to either the USA Red or Black Hot wire
2. The Blue Wire (Return) should go to the USA Red or Black Hot wire (whichever the Brown wire isn't connected to. My understanding, and please correct me if I am wrong, is that the polarity of these two connections (red and/or black to blue and/or brown makes no difference).
3. The Green with Yellow Stripe wire should go to the USA Green wire.
4. The USA white wire has nothing connected to it from the European cable.

Special Note: When connected to US power, we do not run the washer, dishwasher, watermaker, or microwave…

--- In amelyachtowners@..., Jose Venegas <jgvenegas@...> wrote:

I have not tested it but I have been told that the Microwave, the Dish
Washer or the cloth washing drier SHOULD NOT be connected to shore power at
60 Hz even if it is 220V. The pervious owner told me his Microwave was
fried when a guest started it when connected to shore power!

All the rest, water heater, AC, and battery chargers work fine at 60 Hz.

Now, I am still puzzled about one detail that someone in this forum may have
an answer.
The european 240V and the power produced by the generator on board have 3
cables: one live, one neutral and one ground. When you measure the voltages
between them you have Live-neutral and Life to ground =240V, and
neutral-ground =0 volts.
In contrast, when connected to 220V us shore power, the readings from the
same terminals are: Live-neutral:220V, Life to ground 110V and neutral to
ground= 110V. This is because in the US we take the 220V shore power from a
3-phase AC supply where both Live and neutral have voltage relative to
ground.
My question is: does this difference and the fact that one does not have a
true neutral affect stray currents and electrolysis on the boat.

Jose

Ipanema SM2K 278
Hybernating at Constitution Marina
Charles Town, Massachusetts


Rép.110v ac connection

Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...>
 

Thanks Miles,
 
Your description makes sense while leaving minor unanswered questions!
 
Look forward to viewing your diagram.
 
Serge


--- En date de : Jeu, 26.11.09, Miles Bidwell <mbidwell@...> a écrit :


De: Miles Bidwell <mbidwell@...>
Objet: Re:Rép. : [Amel] Re: 110v ac connection
À: amelyachtowners@...
Date: jeudi 26 Novembre 2009, 19 h 57


 



M. Tremblay,

I have two shore wires and a big switch in the engine room. When I plug in
the 110 US wire, I set the switch for 110 at the dock. This line goes to
the transformer that energizes the 220 outlets and appliances and to the
Hart charger and to the US 110 outlets. When I plug in the European 220
wire, I set the switch to 220 and this goes to the 220 battery charger and
directly to the European outlets and appliances. For the 110 60 cycle
outlets, I turn on the Hart Inverter. I do have a wiring diagram but it is
on the boat which I have just put to bed for the winter (its first time out
of the water and first time in a cold climate). If I have a chance to
retrieve the diagram, I will copy and post it.

Eric,

I think that you are mistaken in your understanding of the European
electricity. If you use a tester to probe an outlet, you will find that
there is one hot wire. The other two are a return and a ground. Connecting
the hot to either of these will show 220+ volts. Connecting the return and
the ground will show nothing (unless something is seriously amiss). This
is how one checks the polarity. As in the US, if the polarity is reversed,
the battery charger will blow its fuses (or worse).

Regards to all,

Miles Bidwell

Sm216 LADYBUG on the hard in Rhode Island











Découvrez les photos les plus intéressantes du jour.
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Re: Rép. : [Amel] Re: 110v ac connection

Miles Bidwell <mbidwell@...>
 

M. Tremblay,



I have two shore wires and a big switch in the engine room. When I plug in
the 110 US wire, I set the switch for 110 at the dock. This line goes to
the transformer that energizes the 220 outlets and appliances and to the
Hart charger and to the US 110 outlets. When I plug in the European 220
wire, I set the switch to 220 and this goes to the 220 battery charger and
directly to the European outlets and appliances. For the 110 60 cycle
outlets, I turn on the Hart Inverter. I do have a wiring diagram but it is
on the boat which I have just put to bed for the winter (its first time out
of the water and first time in a cold climate). If I have a chance to
retrieve the diagram, I will copy and post it.



Eric,



I think that you are mistaken in your understanding of the European
electricity. If you use a tester to probe an outlet, you will find that
there is one hot wire. The other two are a return and a ground. Connecting
the hot to either of these will show 220+ volts. Connecting the return and
the ground will show nothing (unless something is seriously amiss). This
is how one checks the polarity. As in the US, if the polarity is reversed,
the battery charger will blow its fuses (or worse).



Regards to all,



Miles Bidwell

Sm216 LADYBUG on the hard in Rhode Island


Re: Use of Micro with 220v 60 Hz?

Miles Bidwell <mbidwell@...>
 

Jose,



I know of two SMs that tried using the micro at 60 cycles. Both micros
quickly self destructed. I have heard different views about the washer,
but 20% faster is surely not conducive to long life so I have never tried
it.



Are you living on the boat in Boston for the winter?



Miles

Sm216 LADYBUG


Re: [Amel] Use of Micro with 220v 60 Hz?

Richard Piller <richard03801@...>
 

I tend to agree with Eric. We have been using 220 volts 50 amp 60 cyc here in the US and 50 cyc in Europe. What we did to solve many of the issues is to install a Dolphin 50/60 cyc 90-260 volt battery charger and took OUT the Amel installed transformer and installed a 1800 watt inverter to go from 24 volts to 110 volts and that has worked out just fine. Amel 209 came with a 110 set of plugs installed by Amel. We simply took the 110 V output from the inverter to the 110 box in the engine room and all is well. As for the Microwave and the clothes washer they were and still are 220 v 50 cyc and we DO NOT use them here in the US. We use the marina washer and the stove for cooking. We are not much for microwaves even when we are on 50 cyc.
It is a very simple system. And yes we change the input/dock side plugs to suit the marina we are in that includes both here in and in Europe. We have made up "pig" tails for some applications just to make it faster and easier..
Hope all have a great holiday season. We are here in Annapolis for the winter any and all are welcome to visit.
Richard and Joan on Challenge SM 209




________________________________
From: kimberlite <kimberlite@...>
To: amelyachtowners@...
Sent: Wed, November 25, 2009 8:06:05 PM
Subject: RE: [Amel] Use of Micro with 220v 60 Hz?


I really do not understand what seems to be the problem with using a 50 amp
plug versus a European plug.

The European plug has a potential of 220 volts between the two hot legs
blue-brown. Since both plugs are alternating current there is NO return leg
on either plug as that only occurs on a DC installation.

I have been using my 50 amp plug as many other Amel users have for 7 years
without any problems or electrolysis.

If you use the Red and Black wires on a USA 50 amp socket you also get 220
volts. Both the USA and European plugs have a ground.

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite

_____

From: amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com
[mailto:amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Jose
Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2009 3:50 PM
To: amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: [Amel] Use of Micro with 220v 60 Hz?

Miles, I completly agree with your statement. In fact my boat has also an
alternative 110 V input that goes to a transformer to 220V and can be used
to run most of the house appliances.

The previous owner, and me up to now, have also been using the american 220
inlet in the form described by several people, that is witout a ground. I
will be changing things based on your suggestion.

Still, anybody has experience using the Micro, and two washers with 220V at
60Hz?

--- In amelyachtowners@ <mailto:amelyachtow ners%40yahoogrou ps.com>
yahoogroups. com, "Miles Bidwell" <mbidwell@.. .> wrote:

I have been following the discussion of wiring and I think that my
experience with this may be of interest to the group.

In Europe the three wires are one hot, one return, and one ground. The one
hot line carries the 240. In the US it is possible to get 220 by
connecting
two 110 wires and ignoring the ground and many (lucky?) people do this
without problems. When my boat was being built, I asked Amel about doing
this. Amel said that it should never be done because there would be no
ground wire. They even sent M. Carteau over to my boat to explain in great
detail why the US approach should never be attempted. As part of Carteau's
design, Amels have very sensitive ground fault sensors which depend on
having a ground wire.

To solve the current problem, Amel built my boat with two independent
electrical systems. The one for the US is 110 volts (with a ground wire)
that goes to a Hart charger and a 60 cycle 110 inverter. The European 220
50 cycle circuit with its ground wire has a separate charger. For the
appliances and European wall outlets, transformers convert 110 to 220 when
plugged in to US shore current. I know that this is much more complex than
simply connecting two hot wires in the US but the potential damage from a
fault and no ground wire could be even more complex to repair.



Miles Bidwell

SM 216 LADYBUG



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: [Amel] Use of Micro with 220v 60 Hz?

kimberlite <kimberlite@...>
 

I really do not understand what seems to be the problem with using a 50 amp
plug versus a European plug.

The European plug has a potential of 220 volts between the two hot legs
blue-brown. Since both plugs are alternating current there is NO return leg
on either plug as that only occurs on a DC installation.

I have been using my 50 amp plug as many other Amel users have for 7 years
without any problems or electrolysis.



If you use the Red and Black wires on a USA 50 amp socket you also get 220
volts. Both the USA and European plugs have a ground.

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite





_____

From: amelyachtowners@...
[mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of Jose
Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2009 3:50 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel] Use of Micro with 220v 60 Hz?






Miles, I completly agree with your statement. In fact my boat has also an
alternative 110 V input that goes to a transformer to 220V and can be used
to run most of the house appliances.

The previous owner, and me up to now, have also been using the american 220
inlet in the form described by several people, that is witout a ground. I
will be changing things based on your suggestion.

Still, anybody has experience using the Micro, and two washers with 220V at
60Hz?

--- In amelyachtowners@ <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>
yahoogroups.com, "Miles Bidwell" <mbidwell@...> wrote:

I have been following the discussion of wiring and I think that my
experience with this may be of interest to the group.

In Europe the three wires are one hot, one return, and one ground. The one
hot line carries the 240. In the US it is possible to get 220 by
connecting
two 110 wires and ignoring the ground and many (lucky?) people do this
without problems. When my boat was being built, I asked Amel about doing
this. Amel said that it should never be done because there would be no
ground wire. They even sent M. Carteau over to my boat to explain in great
detail why the US approach should never be attempted. As part of Carteau's
design, Amels have very sensitive ground fault sensors which depend on
having a ground wire.

To solve the current problem, Amel built my boat with two independent
electrical systems. The one for the US is 110 volts (with a ground wire)
that goes to a Hart charger and a 60 cycle 110 inverter. The European 220
50 cycle circuit with its ground wire has a separate charger. For the
appliances and European wall outlets, transformers convert 110 to 220 when
plugged in to US shore current. I know that this is much more complex than
simply connecting two hot wires in the US but the potential damage from a
fault and no ground wire could be even more complex to repair.



Miles Bidwell

SM 216 LADYBUG





Rép. : [Amel] Use of Micro with 220v 60 Hz?

Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...>
 

Jose,
 
I have used  my Siemens 220vac dishwasher on a 220vac 60Hz circuit generated by my transformer, as stated earlier, i only had a problem with the 220 avc 50Hz water pump, which i replaced with a 12vdc pump triggered by a 220 vac relay.
 
I used to operate my 110vac 60hz microwave oven connected to my transformer energized by either 220acv 50Hz or 60Hz, after 5 years it broke down and, as at the time i was in Spain, in 2007, i replaced it with a 220acv 50Hz which i have not yet used with a 110vac 60Hz shore supply. I did not check the cause of the old microwave brakedown because it originally cost less than 100$... and the new microwave is also a very usefull convection oven.

I intended to replace my 110acv 60Hz clothewasher with a new 220 acv 50hz machine, but this forum might change this intent.
 
Serge, Mango 51
 

Note: À VENDRE - FOR SALE
LAETITIA II
info: www.columbia37.com & www.laetitia-l.com

--- En date de : Mer, 25.11.09, Jose <jgvenegas@...> a écrit :


De: Jose <jgvenegas@...>
Objet: [Amel] Use of Micro with 220v 60 Hz?
À: amelyachtowners@...
Date: mercredi 25 Novembre 2009, 15 h 50


 




Miles, I completly agree with your statement. In fact my boat has also an alternative 110 V input that goes to a transformer to 220V and can be used to run most of the house appliances.

The previous owner, and me up to now, have also been using the american 220 inlet in the form described by several people, that is witout a ground. I will be changing things based on your suggestion.

Still, anybody has experience using the Micro, and two washers with 220V at 60Hz?

--- In amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com, "Miles Bidwell" <mbidwell@.. .> wrote:

I have been following the discussion of wiring and I think that my
experience with this may be of interest to the group.

In Europe the three wires are one hot, one return, and one ground. The one
hot line carries the 240. In the US it is possible to get 220 by connecting
two 110 wires and ignoring the ground and many (lucky?) people do this
without problems. When my boat was being built, I asked Amel about doing
this. Amel said that it should never be done because there would be no
ground wire. They even sent M. Carteau over to my boat to explain in great
detail why the US approach should never be attempted. As part of Carteau's
design, Amels have very sensitive ground fault sensors which depend on
having a ground wire.

To solve the current problem, Amel built my boat with two independent
electrical systems. The one for the US is 110 volts (with a ground wire)
that goes to a Hart charger and a 60 cycle 110 inverter. The European 220
50 cycle circuit with its ground wire has a separate charger. For the
appliances and European wall outlets, transformers convert 110 to 220 when
plugged in to US shore current. I know that this is much more complex than
simply connecting two hot wires in the US but the potential damage from a
fault and no ground wire could be even more complex to repair.



Miles Bidwell

SM 216 LADYBUG



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]








Découvrez les photos les plus intéressantes du jour.
http://www.flickr.com/explore/interesting/7days/


Rép. : [Amel] Re: 110v ac connection

Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...>
 

Mr Bidwell,
 
I do not understand what you mean when you write:
<...transformers convert 110 to 220>
 
How many transformers are installed?
 
Are the transformers connected to the 110 acv 60 Hz line from shore or-and to the 'Hart' charger-inverter?
 
Are the 110 to 220 transformers then connected to the vessel's circuit? If so how are the transformers prevented from being energised when the boat is plugged to 220 acv 50Hz?
 
Did Amel provide you with a diagram of your electrical installation, as they normally do. If so it would be very interesting to for those living in 110 vac 60 hz look at it and, it would be most helpfull if you could post same on this forum.
 
Otherwise, i agree that wether 220  50Hz or 110 60Hz, the ground nust be connected to the boat's circuit, but preferably through a galvanic isolator, sometimes refered to as zinc savers.
 
On the other hand,  as for the 220 acv  50Hz faulty ground sensor i have seen on Amels, it is placed immediately after the main switch for the entry of the 220 acv, therefore does not affect circuits energised after the sensor. A faulty ground sensor is also par of the generator set, and a faulty ground only disconnects and stops the genset. 
 
Serge D. T. Mango 51


--- En date de : Mer, 25.11.09, Miles Bidwell <mbidwell@...> a écrit :


De: Miles Bidwell <mbidwell@...>
Objet: [Amel] Re: SHOWER HOSE
À: amelyachtowners@...
Date: mercredi 25 Novembre 2009, 15 h 15


 



I have been following the discussion of wiring and I think that my
experience with this may be of interest to the group.

In Europe the three wires are one hot, one return, and one ground. The one
hot line carries the 240. In the US it is possible to get 220 by connecting
two 110 wires and ignoring the ground and many (lucky?) people do this
without problems. When my boat was being built, I asked Amel about doing
this. Amel said that it should never be done because there would be no
ground wire. They even sent M. Carteau over to my boat to explain in great
detail why the US approach should never be attempted. As part of Carteau's
design, Amels have very sensitive ground fault sensors which depend on
having a ground wire.

To solve the current problem, Amel built my boat with two independent
electrical systems. The one for the US is 110 volts (with a ground wire)
that goes to a Hart charger and a 60 cycle 110 inverter. The European 220
50 cycle circuit with its ground wire has a separate charger. For the
appliances and European wall outlets, transformers convert 110 to 220 when
plugged in to US shore current. I know that this is much more complex than
simply connecting two hot wires in the US but the potential damage from a
fault and no ground wire could be even more complex to repair.

Miles Bidwell

SM 216 LADYBUG











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