Date   

Re: Fuel Polishing

Germain Jean-Pierre
 

Hi Danny,

Agree with you as well. Before setting off on my RTW, I had the residual fuel polished. Absolutely no CARP in my fuel 7 years later. I also use biocide religiously and keep my fuel tank topped up.  

It is surprising the total amount of fuel the diesel motors pump out of your tank and The percentage returned to the tank. Most people don’t realise it!!

Cheers, we should be out of lockdown at midnight tonight

Jean-Pierre Germain, Eleuthera, FM007, OPUA New Zealand


On 2 Sep 2021, at 07:35, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS <simms@...> wrote:



Hi JP, I agree with you on the fuel polishing. But I have something to share as to the amount of fuel being pumped and returning to the fuel tank. Some years ago I was trouble shooting a fuel problem. To eliminate all the fuel delivery I got a 5 litre can filled with fuel and put a short suction pipe into it. I was startled at how quickly it emptied, in minutes. I know the question will come, how many minutes. I don't remember but perhaps 10, certainly not as many as 20.

There is a massive fuel circulation going on constantly. Good installed filtration is very important, I have double racors. However filth still accumulates in the fuel and tank.  I got a dock side trailer mounted fuel polishing service to do mine. I was utterly startled at how much filth he got out of the fuel. He had three grades of filter, he said if he began with the fine one it would have clogged in minutes. So the process was coarse, medium, fine and there was buckets of filth brought out by each grade. Looking into the tank there was visible muck around the bottom but the fuel as a whole looked clear. I had no accumulation of sediment in the racor sight bowls and there were no engine issues.

I think periodic fuel cleaning with a dockside system makes sense, but having said that, in the absence of any fuel issues I have only done it once about five years ago.

Kind Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 01 September 2021 at 17:09 Germain Jean-Pierre <jp.germain45@...> wrote:

Hello Mike,

I have experience with fuel filtration systems and fuel polishing systems. The main issue with fuel in this day and age is the quality of the fuel itself; It ain’t what it used to be!!! The problem also extends to the aviation industry and whilst flying airliners, we never had a problem; the reason is simple, airliners flew 400 hours per month and used a lot of fuel. However, when I started flying corporate jets the situation was different. Typically these aircraft fly less than 500 hours per year and are parked for long periods with near empty tanks … sometimes in moist areas. The bacteria that causes diesel fuel bug is always present in the atmosphere and cannot be avoided. 

Fuel polishing is one means of minimising the possibility of diesel bug contamination and the other is to install a high quality fuel filtration system. Personally I favour basic precautions, a diesel fuel biocide of some sort, full fuel tanks and dual Racor 7550 filters. The diesel fuel pumps on the Genset and the main engine typically feed double the volume needed for operation of the engine. Meaning that 50% of the fuel drawn from the tank is returned to the tank. This is sufficient movement  to ensure that the fuel in your tank is clean. 

The standard precautions are as follows:
-   Keep your tanks full. Always filter the fuel with a good funnel if you have any doubts about its quality. 
-   Add a biocide as directed by the manufacturer. (Biobor or Grotamar are two of them)
-   Relax probably nothing will happen from then on. Of course change the filters when required and verify the sight bowls to guarantee no deposit. 

Installation of a fuel polishing system involves quite a bit of work and sizable quantities of cash. A friend of mine, now stuck in France due to international travel restrictions, asked me to oversee the installation of a fuel polishing system on his boat this year. The installation is successful however his case was different; he had a COVID 19 sized diesel fuel bug problem in his tanks. His boat has large capacity fuel exceeding 1500 L and had been on the hard in Tahiti for an extended period of time due to an unfortunate incident at sea. .. with tanks having a remaining quantity of about 300 liters each. These are perfect conditions for the development of diesel fuel bug. 

System description: consists of Racor fuel polishing pump, a separate Racor 7550 Fuel filter as the pump does not have a sight bowl (although depicted as having a sight bowl on the Racor website, this is not the case ) and you will never be certain of your fuel unless you can visually check from time to time. It also required the design and installation of a cross feeding manifold and distribution valves. This allowed for fuel transfer; a situation which was impossible with the original design. 

On my SM, I opted for the dual Racor filters and I feed through only one of the filters at a time and switch over after each filter change. There is a lot more faffing with the fuel polishing system than with a good fuel filtration system. 

Good luck with your decision and if you require, I’d be glad to talk to you over the Internet. 

Kind regards


Jean-Pierre Germain, Eleuthera , SM007, Opua NZ

 

On 1 Sep 2021, at 15:54, Bill Kinney <cruisingconsulting@...> wrote:

Mike,

Many people have installed, such a system, and I'll let them tell you the how's and why's.  

Our boat did two circumnavigations and accumulated over 8000 engine hours with NO primary fuel filter at all, just a water separator.  Despite the obvious success of that arrangement, I did replace the Amel installed water separator with a standard Racor primary filter because it made me feel better.  

I have had sailboats with diesel engines for over 30 years and have never had a fuel issue that a "fuel polishing" system would have fixed.  To be clear, I have also never had a common rail engine that might require a higher level of fuel filtration.

No matter if you have a fuel polishing system, or not, always be careful where you buy fuel.  If the source is even the least bit dicey, use a good quality filter funnel when filling your tank.  Keep the filter funnel clean and dry, and you're very unlikely to have a problem.

Bill Kinney
SM160,  Harmonie
Annapolis, MD, USA


 


 


locked Engine Room Exhaust Fan / Blower - lessons learnt #lessons

David Vogel
 
Edited

One thing to keep an eye on, is the 220VAC engine room exhaust fan.

This unit sits in series with a 24VDC exhaust fan, which runs when the service (12V) alternator for the main engine is creating output.

The 220VAC exhaust fan runs when the ONAN GenSet is outputting 220V AC.

I recently discovered a failing capacitor on the 220V exhaust fan, revealed by intermittent running – the worst kind of fault, as it is not always obvious you have a problem. Sometimes the fan would run, sometimes not. I only recognised that I first had an issue when I walked past the deck-level exhaust outlet one day while the genset was running, and I didn’t have the usual plume of warm air blowing past my leg. With the genset running and the fan not, the fan could usually be encouraged to spin up if hand-started – useful to know, as I wasn’t anywhere near any kind of shop at the time, didn’t have a spare capacitor on-board, and with no other cruisers either within an island to two to check whether they had a spare on board.

Back in civilisation, capacitor quickly sourced at less than USD15- equivalent, and 10 minutes to wire it in. Problem solved.

But now I wonder about a few other failures I have experienced over recent years. And whether they might be related to the intermittent exhaust fan, which may have been failing for some time longer than I suspected. For example, the prolonged heat-soak of elevated temperatures in the engine room (measured up to and occasionally exceeding 50ºC whilst in the tropics), may have been a contributory factor to …

+ failure of the nitrile seals on the fuel-tank inspection hatches – portably due for replacement anyway, in light of other’s experiences with these at ~ 15 years of age, but is there something more going on here than simple chemical or age-related deterioration;

+ failure of some of the adhesive for the engine room foam sound insulation (top only, not sides);

+ premature failure (3 yrs) of ceramic water-maker membranes – one was cracked; these membranes are rated to 40ºC, but what happens if they are hot-hot-hot, and colder sea-water is pushed through them, perhaps resulting in thermal-shock-cooling;

+ early failure of the water-maker membrane pressure-vessel end-caps: this was due to erosion of the black delrin material around the stainless-steel bobbin (inter-connector). I wonder if differential heating/cooling of the delrin end-caps versus stainless steel, allowed a seeping of the HP-water past the O-rings, which then compromised the seal, creating leakage, leading to corrosion/erosion. Thinking along the lines of the space-shuttle Solid-Rocket-Boosters here, less violent, and over a greater time-frame, but the result is kind of the same. Perhaps not usually a problem when the engine-room temperature is held within normal range, but excessive temperature differentials creates a problem. Anyway, no–one wants HP salt-water spraying over the inverter, battery-chargers, switch-boxes, or other electronic or electrical components situated nearby. (Note: Dessalator is no longer issuing INOX interconnectors; replacements are now plastic.)

+ premature failure of water-maker HP hoses, running near-by to the genset, and showing signs of early degradation at the highest point they run in the engine room (external sheath falling apart, weeping) - after only 18-months installed;

+ early failure in the manual bulge-pump diaphragm – I could never could understand why this should fail after only 18-months, but maybe this too now makes sense;

+ failing seals on the salt-water supply pumps for the heads – portably age-relater, but … ;

+ failure of the ONAN Genset Main Control Board, a component known to fail, but was elevated engine-room temperature over a prolonged period a contributory factor?

There is no confirmed cause-and-effect relationship for any of these, but there does appear to be a pattern here, so food for thought.

In any event, I now mindfully check that there is warm air blowing out of the engine-room fresh-air exhaust outlet. Not every start, but whenever I happen to be on-deck when the genset (or engine) is running. I now also routinely check that the engine room blower is providing a healthy quantity of fresh air.

I am also considering:

+ installing an engine room temperature sensor & alarm (relatively easy to put onto the N2K bus, I hope); and

+ installing a timer circuit for the DC exhaust fan, to maintain air movement through the engine room immediately after machinery shut-down, in order to reduce residual temperatures and consequent heat-soak.

David
SM#396, Perigee
Savusavu, Fiji


Re: Deck gel coat or paint

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Mike and Pat, I saw one SM, Brown Eyed Girl,  that had painted the deck white. I thought it very ugly. I too have a few areas where the tan is wearing off but the overall effect is still good.

Kind Regards

Danny

SM 299

Ocean Pearl 

On 02 September 2021 at 05:02 "Patrick McAneny via groups.io" <sailw32@...> wrote:

Mike, I have seen a deck done in white ,probably an off white and it looked good, I have also seen the tan deck with white stripe and that looked real good. We would probably go with a lighter tan and maybe a white stripe ,but for now I just want to determine if the tan is paint . I never did see your boat in Haven Harbor south ,over there a lot this spring/summer.
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Ondra via groups.io <mdondra@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Sep 1, 2021 12:27 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint

Hi Pat,
We have thought about painting/striping the deck.
One consideration is the temperature the tan deck reaches in the sun compared to the white deck areas…tough on bare feet and a contributor to interior temperatures.
Thinking that maybe striping in white would help reduce deck temp.
If painting the tan portion, maybe a lighter color would also help to reduce surface temps.
Just a thought, and wondering if anyone has tried lighter colors to reduce temps.
Mike Ondra
Aletes SM#240 Rock Hall, MD
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, September 1, 2021 11:20 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint
 
Looking at Danny's deck has gotten us thinking about tackling this job again,we quickly gave up once before. However before I would do the striping I would have to address all the white areas  on my deck . Is the tan color of the deck, paint or gel coat ? I know the deck is gel coat ,but is the tan color paint? If not why in so many areas has the gel coat worn away ,and why is what is under it white. Would Amel first apply tan gel coat to the mold and then a layer of white , that would not make sense. The tan is wearing off in many low traffic areas, so it is not wear ,I don't think. The tan surface appears to be very thin ,like paint. 
My point is that I would need to first paint my deck and then stripe it ,if I want the entire deck to look good and I would like to determine if I am dealing with a gel coat or painted surface.
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans
 
 


Re: Fuel Polishing

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi JP, I agree with you on the fuel polishing. But I have something to share as to the amount of fuel being pumped and returning to the fuel tank. Some years ago I was trouble shooting a fuel problem. To eliminate all the fuel delivery I got a 5 litre can filled with fuel and put a short suction pipe into it. I was startled at how quickly it emptied, in minutes. I know the question will come, how many minutes. I don't remember but perhaps 10, certainly not as many as 20.

There is a massive fuel circulation going on constantly. Good installed filtration is very important, I have double racors. However filth still accumulates in the fuel and tank.  I got a dock side trailer mounted fuel polishing service to do mine. I was utterly startled at how much filth he got out of the fuel. He had three grades of filter, he said if he began with the fine one it would have clogged in minutes. So the process was coarse, medium, fine and there was buckets of filth brought out by each grade. Looking into the tank there was visible muck around the bottom but the fuel as a whole looked clear. I had no accumulation of sediment in the racor sight bowls and there were no engine issues.

I think periodic fuel cleaning with a dockside system makes sense, but having said that, in the absence of any fuel issues I have only done it once about five years ago.

Kind Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 01 September 2021 at 17:09 Germain Jean-Pierre <jp.germain45@...> wrote:

Hello Mike,

I have experience with fuel filtration systems and fuel polishing systems. The main issue with fuel in this day and age is the quality of the fuel itself; It ain’t what it used to be!!! The problem also extends to the aviation industry and whilst flying airliners, we never had a problem; the reason is simple, airliners flew 400 hours per month and used a lot of fuel. However, when I started flying corporate jets the situation was different. Typically these aircraft fly less than 500 hours per year and are parked for long periods with near empty tanks … sometimes in moist areas. The bacteria that causes diesel fuel bug is always present in the atmosphere and cannot be avoided. 

Fuel polishing is one means of minimising the possibility of diesel bug contamination and the other is to install a high quality fuel filtration system. Personally I favour basic precautions, a diesel fuel biocide of some sort, full fuel tanks and dual Racor 7550 filters. The diesel fuel pumps on the Genset and the main engine typically feed double the volume needed for operation of the engine. Meaning that 50% of the fuel drawn from the tank is returned to the tank. This is sufficient movement  to ensure that the fuel in your tank is clean. 

The standard precautions are as follows:
-   Keep your tanks full. Always filter the fuel with a good funnel if you have any doubts about its quality. 
-   Add a biocide as directed by the manufacturer. (Biobor or Grotamar are two of them)
-   Relax probably nothing will happen from then on. Of course change the filters when required and verify the sight bowls to guarantee no deposit. 

Installation of a fuel polishing system involves quite a bit of work and sizable quantities of cash. A friend of mine, now stuck in France due to international travel restrictions, asked me to oversee the installation of a fuel polishing system on his boat this year. The installation is successful however his case was different; he had a COVID 19 sized diesel fuel bug problem in his tanks. His boat has large capacity fuel exceeding 1500 L and had been on the hard in Tahiti for an extended period of time due to an unfortunate incident at sea. .. with tanks having a remaining quantity of about 300 liters each. These are perfect conditions for the development of diesel fuel bug. 

System description: consists of Racor fuel polishing pump, a separate Racor 7550 Fuel filter as the pump does not have a sight bowl (although depicted as having a sight bowl on the Racor website, this is not the case ) and you will never be certain of your fuel unless you can visually check from time to time. It also required the design and installation of a cross feeding manifold and distribution valves. This allowed for fuel transfer; a situation which was impossible with the original design. 

On my SM, I opted for the dual Racor filters and I feed through only one of the filters at a time and switch over after each filter change. There is a lot more faffing with the fuel polishing system than with a good fuel filtration system. 

Good luck with your decision and if you require, I’d be glad to talk to you over the Internet. 

Kind regards


Jean-Pierre Germain, Eleuthera , SM007, Opua NZ

 

On 1 Sep 2021, at 15:54, Bill Kinney <cruisingconsulting@...> wrote:

Mike,

Many people have installed, such a system, and I'll let them tell you the how's and why's.  

Our boat did two circumnavigations and accumulated over 8000 engine hours with NO primary fuel filter at all, just a water separator.  Despite the obvious success of that arrangement, I did replace the Amel installed water separator with a standard Racor primary filter because it made me feel better.  

I have had sailboats with diesel engines for over 30 years and have never had a fuel issue that a "fuel polishing" system would have fixed.  To be clear, I have also never had a common rail engine that might require a higher level of fuel filtration.

No matter if you have a fuel polishing system, or not, always be careful where you buy fuel.  If the source is even the least bit dicey, use a good quality filter funnel when filling your tank.  Keep the filter funnel clean and dry, and you're very unlikely to have a problem.

Bill Kinney
SM160,  Harmonie
Annapolis, MD, USA


 


 


Re: Deck gel coat or paint

Mike Ondra
 

The dark striping is virtually gone from the tan deck areas. But the tan is still pretty much in place. Even so, it is rather hot underfoot.

Mike


Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails.

Explore. Dream. Discover.

- Mark Twain

On Sep 1, 2021, at 1:35 PM, Patrick McAneny via groups.io <sailw32@...> wrote:


Mike, I finally goth the boat back to my mooring in early July and have been working down the list since then. The hot ,humid weather has slowed my progress ,but the weather is changing tomorrow ,going to be in the seventies for the next week. We do plan on attending the show ,maybe do a shake down cruise to make sure the boat is ready to go this fall. Do you have any white areas in your tan deck?
Pat
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Ondra via groups.io <mdondra@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Sep 1, 2021 1:12 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint

Hi Pat.
Just got back from a month cruising in Maine. We are back at Northpoint and hope to get over to the Annapolis Boat Show in October. Will you be in the water then?
Mike
Aletes
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, September 1, 2021 1:02 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint
 
Mike, I have seen a deck done in white ,probably an off white and it looked good, I have also seen the tan deck with white stripe and that looked real good. We would probably go with a lighter tan and maybe a white stripe ,but for now I just want to determine if the tan is paint . I never did see your boat in Haven Harbor south ,over there a lot this spring/summer.
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Ondra via groups.io <mdondra@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Sep 1, 2021 12:27 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint
Hi Pat,
We have thought about painting/striping the deck.
One consideration is the temperature the tan deck reaches in the sun compared to the white deck areas…tough on bare feet and a contributor to interior temperatures.
Thinking that maybe striping in white would help reduce deck temp.
If painting the tan portion, maybe a lighter color would also help to reduce surface temps.
Just a thought, and wondering if anyone has tried lighter colors to reduce temps.
Mike Ondra
Aletes SM#240 Rock Hall, MD
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, September 1, 2021 11:20 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint
 
Looking at Danny's deck has gotten us thinking about tackling this job again,we quickly gave up once before. However before I would do the striping I would have to address all the white areas  on my deck . Is the tan color of the deck, paint or gel coat ? I know the deck is gel coat ,but is the tan color paint? If not why in so many areas has the gel coat worn away ,and why is what is under it white. Would Amel first apply tan gel coat to the mold and then a layer of white , that would not make sense. The tan is wearing off in many low traffic areas, so it is not wear ,I don't think. The tan surface appears to be very thin ,like paint. 
My point is that I would need to first paint my deck and then stripe it ,if I want the entire deck to look good and I would like to determine if I am dealing with a gel coat or painted surface.
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


Re: Deck gel coat or paint

Patrick McAneny
 

Mike, I finally goth the boat back to my mooring in early July and have been working down the list since then. The hot ,humid weather has slowed my progress ,but the weather is changing tomorrow ,going to be in the seventies for the next week. We do plan on attending the show ,maybe do a shake down cruise to make sure the boat is ready to go this fall. Do you have any white areas in your tan deck?
Pat
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Ondra via groups.io <mdondra@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Sep 1, 2021 1:12 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint

Hi Pat.
Just got back from a month cruising in Maine. We are back at Northpoint and hope to get over to the Annapolis Boat Show in October. Will you be in the water then?
Mike
Aletes
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, September 1, 2021 1:02 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint
 
Mike, I have seen a deck done in white ,probably an off white and it looked good, I have also seen the tan deck with white stripe and that looked real good. We would probably go with a lighter tan and maybe a white stripe ,but for now I just want to determine if the tan is paint . I never did see your boat in Haven Harbor south ,over there a lot this spring/summer.
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Ondra via groups.io <mdondra@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Sep 1, 2021 12:27 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint
Hi Pat,
We have thought about painting/striping the deck.
One consideration is the temperature the tan deck reaches in the sun compared to the white deck areas…tough on bare feet and a contributor to interior temperatures.
Thinking that maybe striping in white would help reduce deck temp.
If painting the tan portion, maybe a lighter color would also help to reduce surface temps.
Just a thought, and wondering if anyone has tried lighter colors to reduce temps.
Mike Ondra
Aletes SM#240 Rock Hall, MD
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, September 1, 2021 11:20 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint
 
Looking at Danny's deck has gotten us thinking about tackling this job again,we quickly gave up once before. However before I would do the striping I would have to address all the white areas  on my deck . Is the tan color of the deck, paint or gel coat ? I know the deck is gel coat ,but is the tan color paint? If not why in so many areas has the gel coat worn away ,and why is what is under it white. Would Amel first apply tan gel coat to the mold and then a layer of white , that would not make sense. The tan is wearing off in many low traffic areas, so it is not wear ,I don't think. The tan surface appears to be very thin ,like paint. 
My point is that I would need to first paint my deck and then stripe it ,if I want the entire deck to look good and I would like to determine if I am dealing with a gel coat or painted surface.
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


Re: Deck gel coat or paint

Mike Ondra
 

Hi Pat.

Just got back from a month cruising in Maine. We are back at Northpoint and hope to get over to the Annapolis Boat Show in October. Will you be in the water then?

Mike

Aletes

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, September 1, 2021 1:02 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint

 

Mike, I have seen a deck done in white ,probably an off white and it looked good, I have also seen the tan deck with white stripe and that looked real good. We would probably go with a lighter tan and maybe a white stripe ,but for now I just want to determine if the tan is paint . I never did see your boat in Haven Harbor south ,over there a lot this spring/summer.

Thanks,

Pat

SM Shenanigans

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Ondra via groups.io <mdondra@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Sep 1, 2021 12:27 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint

Hi Pat,

We have thought about painting/striping the deck.

One consideration is the temperature the tan deck reaches in the sun compared to the white deck areas…tough on bare feet and a contributor to interior temperatures.

Thinking that maybe striping in white would help reduce deck temp.

If painting the tan portion, maybe a lighter color would also help to reduce surface temps.

Just a thought, and wondering if anyone has tried lighter colors to reduce temps.

Mike Ondra

Aletes SM#240 Rock Hall, MD

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, September 1, 2021 11:20 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint

 

Looking at Danny's deck has gotten us thinking about tackling this job again,we quickly gave up once before. However before I would do the striping I would have to address all the white areas  on my deck . Is the tan color of the deck, paint or gel coat ? I know the deck is gel coat ,but is the tan color paint? If not why in so many areas has the gel coat worn away ,and why is what is under it white. Would Amel first apply tan gel coat to the mold and then a layer of white , that would not make sense. The tan is wearing off in many low traffic areas, so it is not wear ,I don't think. The tan surface appears to be very thin ,like paint. 
My point is that I would need to first paint my deck and then stripe it ,if I want the entire deck to look good and I would like to determine if I am dealing with a gel coat or painted surface.
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


Re: Deck gel coat or paint

Patrick McAneny
 

Mike, I have seen a deck done in white ,probably an off white and it looked good, I have also seen the tan deck with white stripe and that looked real good. We would probably go with a lighter tan and maybe a white stripe ,but for now I just want to determine if the tan is paint . I never did see your boat in Haven Harbor south ,over there a lot this spring/summer.
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Ondra via groups.io <mdondra@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Sep 1, 2021 12:27 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint

Hi Pat,
We have thought about painting/striping the deck.
One consideration is the temperature the tan deck reaches in the sun compared to the white deck areas…tough on bare feet and a contributor to interior temperatures.
Thinking that maybe striping in white would help reduce deck temp.
If painting the tan portion, maybe a lighter color would also help to reduce surface temps.
Just a thought, and wondering if anyone has tried lighter colors to reduce temps.
Mike Ondra
Aletes SM#240 Rock Hall, MD
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, September 1, 2021 11:20 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint
 
Looking at Danny's deck has gotten us thinking about tackling this job again,we quickly gave up once before. However before I would do the striping I would have to address all the white areas  on my deck . Is the tan color of the deck, paint or gel coat ? I know the deck is gel coat ,but is the tan color paint? If not why in so many areas has the gel coat worn away ,and why is what is under it white. Would Amel first apply tan gel coat to the mold and then a layer of white , that would not make sense. The tan is wearing off in many low traffic areas, so it is not wear ,I don't think. The tan surface appears to be very thin ,like paint. 
My point is that I would need to first paint my deck and then stripe it ,if I want the entire deck to look good and I would like to determine if I am dealing with a gel coat or painted surface.
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


Re: Deck gel coat or paint

Mike Ondra
 

Hi Pat,

We have thought about painting/striping the deck.

One consideration is the temperature the tan deck reaches in the sun compared to the white deck areas…tough on bare feet and a contributor to interior temperatures.

Thinking that maybe striping in white would help reduce deck temp.

If painting the tan portion, maybe a lighter color would also help to reduce surface temps.

Just a thought, and wondering if anyone has tried lighter colors to reduce temps.

Mike Ondra

Aletes SM#240 Rock Hall, MD

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, September 1, 2021 11:20 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Deck gel coat or paint

 

Looking at Danny's deck has gotten us thinking about tackling this job again,we quickly gave up once before. However before I would do the striping I would have to address all the white areas  on my deck . Is the tan color of the deck, paint or gel coat ? I know the deck is gel coat ,but is the tan color paint? If not why in so many areas has the gel coat worn away ,and why is what is under it white. Would Amel first apply tan gel coat to the mold and then a layer of white , that would not make sense. The tan is wearing off in many low traffic areas, so it is not wear ,I don't think. The tan surface appears to be very thin ,like paint. 
My point is that I would need to first paint my deck and then stripe it ,if I want the entire deck to look good and I would like to determine if I am dealing with a gel coat or painted surface.
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


Deck gel coat or paint

Patrick McAneny
 

Looking at Danny's deck has gotten us thinking about tackling this job again,we quickly gave up once before. However before I would do the striping I would have to address all the white areas  on my deck . Is the tan color of the deck, paint or gel coat ? I know the deck is gel coat ,but is the tan color paint? If not why in so many areas has the gel coat worn away ,and why is what is under it white. Would Amel first apply tan gel coat to the mold and then a layer of white , that would not make sense. The tan is wearing off in many low traffic areas, so it is not wear ,I don't think. The tan surface appears to be very thin ,like paint. 
My point is that I would need to first paint my deck and then stripe it ,if I want the entire deck to look good and I would like to determine if I am dealing with a gel coat or painted surface.
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


Re: Solar panels stainless steel mounted vs soft panels

Stefan Jeukendrup
 

Hi Kent& Iris,


See pictures of solar panels above the cockpit, they are hardly visible from the side...


These show 4 Solar panel Suntech STP190S24Ad plus. 3 years old now and they cannot withstand the tropical  temperatures: the backsheet melts and salt does the rest...

I will replacle with 3 Trina Solar vertex S  TSM-DE09.08_405W, slightly longer but almost the same total width.


Of cause you have shading issues so all panels are in parallel.


Hope this helpfull in some way,



Stefan Jeukendrup

sv Malaka Queen

SM2k #348 @ Northern Ireland


Op 01-09-2021 om 03:19 schreef karkauai via groups.io:

I have 600 watts (two series pairs) in hard panels on the stern arch that give a maximum of 16A at 24v on sunny days.  I also have 250W of soft panels on the Bimini which produce a maximum of 3A in bright sun (in Maine now),but in less than ideal conditions, they hardly produce anything.  I recommend that you stick with hard panels.  I'm thinking of replacing them with more hard panels if I can figure out how to mount them above the Bimini.
Kent
SM 243
Kristy

--
Kent & Iris
KRISTY
SM243


Re: Solar panels stainless steel mounted vs soft panels

 

Amel 50 custom very thin panels from Solbian - 575 watts on the hardtop. These were custom-made by Solbian. 
More here about this Amel 50, which will be at the Anappolis Boat Show in October: 

Solbian offers these panels in standard sizes with a zipper attached to the panel to aid in the ease of a soft-top install
image.png
image.png

CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar

On Wed, Sep 1, 2021 at 2:36 AM Paul Osterberg <osterberg.paul.l@...> wrote:
Alan
I havet Victron MPPT controllers, currently 4 of Them so havet hade good opportunity's to compare the differens between serie and parallel. Where I saw the smallest difference was on the stern arc which is less prone to shadow. When changing the rail mounted from serie to parallel the difference in production was very substantial.
Very often there are at least partly shadow on one of the rail mounted panels. For panels on the Bimini shadow will always be a big issue
Paul


Re: Amel plastic dishes and cups

Karl & Deborah Windahl
 

Good morning,
   I'm sure that you will be receiving many similar requests to purchase your set and would like to add our names to the list. While we can't afford to beat the million dollars we'll do the best we can. 
   Have a good day, Karl
Maramu 258 "Have Fun"

On Wed, Sep 1, 2021, 7:49 AM Ken Smith <ken363184@...> wrote:
Bill,

If you make the dishes available for sale, please consider us. New owners on Bon Edda, M202.

Thanks,
Ken & Renee
M202 Bon Edda


On Aug 31, 2021, at 10:11 PM, william reynolds <sail23692@...> wrote:

I just located a new in the box set of Amel logoed cups and dishes. Anyone have have any idea what they are worth?
Bill Reynolds
Cloudstreet


Re: WaterLift Muffler for Volvo

Bill Kinney
 

Thanks Olivier,

The leak in our metal unit is from the middle of the transverse hole.  While it might be technically repairable, to do so would require cutting the entire unit apart and welding new seams all round.  While not exactly cheap, the Vetus units are inexpensive enough that they seem to make this process uneconomical.  We have an exhaust high temperature alarm already in place.  I have seen what happens to this type of muffler when water flow is lost, and the engine continues to run.  It is not pretty!

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Annapolis, MD 


Re: Amel plastic dishes and cups

Ken Smith
 

Bill,

If you make the dishes available for sale, please consider us. New owners on Bon Edda, M202.

Thanks,
Ken & Renee
M202 Bon Edda


On Aug 31, 2021, at 10:11 PM, william reynolds <sail23692@...> wrote:

I just located a new in the box set of Amel logoed cups and dishes. Anyone have have any idea what they are worth?
Bill Reynolds
Cloudstreet


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Tonnage

Eamonn Washington
 

Hi

I am now also looking for the linesplan, to be able to register Travel Bug in Ireland.  Did anyone ever get them?

Thanks

Eamonn Washington
Travel Bug
Super Maramu #151
New Ross Boat Yard, Ireland.


Re: Solar panels stainless steel mounted vs soft panels

Paul Osterberg
 

Alan
I havet Victron MPPT controllers, currently 4 of Them so havet hade good opportunity's to compare the differens between serie and parallel. Where I saw the smallest difference was on the stern arc which is less prone to shadow. When changing the rail mounted from serie to parallel the difference in production was very substantial.
Very often there are at least partly shadow on one of the rail mounted panels. For panels on the Bimini shadow will always be a big issue
Paul


Re: Fuel Polishing

Mike Johnson
 

Hi Bill,

Thank you for the comments and advice.  We also have never had a problem but in recent years have been collecting increasing amounts of debri in the filters especially following bad weather passages.

Our thoughts were to install a polishing system to ensure the fuel was clean especially when agitated and the accumulated detritus at the bottom of the tank mixes with the fuel.

Very best wishes

Mike & Peta

Solitude
SM2K 461

On 1 Sep 2021, at 04:54, Bill Kinney <cruisingconsulting@...> wrote:

Mike,

Many people have installed, such a system, and I'll let them tell you the how's and why's.  

Our boat did two circumnavigations and accumulated over 8000 engine hours with NO primary fuel filter at all, just a water separator.  Despite the obvious success of that arrangement, I did replace the Amel installed water separator with a standard Racor primary filter because it made me feel better.  

I have had sailboats with diesel engines for over 30 years and have never had a fuel issue that a "fuel polishing" system would have fixed.  To be clear, I have also never had a common rail engine that might require a higher level of fuel filtration.

No matter if you have a fuel polishing system, or not, always be careful where you buy fuel.  If the source is even the least bit dicey, use a good quality filter funnel when filling your tank.  Keep the filter funnel clean and dry, and you're very unlikely to have a problem.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Annapolis, MD, USA


Re: WaterLift Muffler for Volvo

Olivier Beaute
 

Good morning Bill,

the muffler on Harmonie is most probably made of stainless steel, not aluminum (unless it has been replaced since new).
It may probably be repaired unless the leak is in a difficult place.
However, VETUS plastic mufflers are also good products as long as you make sure the sea-water flow is always strong.

Good luck for this job.

Olivier

On Wednesday, September 1, 2021, 02:57:42 AM GMT+2, michael winand via groups.io <mfw642000@...> wrote:


We installed the LSG Vetas waterlock, part of the repower, happy with the performance. You can have different diameter on the entry/exit. Moved to the fuel tank side,  removed a little bit of foam around the lsg for a nice fit between the engine frame.
Michael Nebo sm251 


On Wed, 1 Sep 2021 at 10:05 am, CW Bill Rouse
<brouse@...> wrote:
That was Amel's choice on the exYanmar SMs. 

Best,

CW Bill Rouse 
Amel Owners Yacht School
+1 832-380-4970 | brouse@...sg
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com 
Yacht School Calendar: www.preparetocastoff.blogspot.com/p/calendar.html


   

On Tue, Aug 31, 2021, 6:59 PM Bill Kinney <cruisingconsulting@...> wrote:
Our Amel made aluminum waterlift muffler has started a slow leak, that will not get better by itself.  It has had a long and happy life, but now a replacement is needed.

My inclination is to go with a Vetus LSG75 because it fits the existing hoses, has a large capacity, and the extra flapper valve is attractive at keeping the water where it belongs.

I know others have had to replace these units, and I'd be interested in hearing what model water lift you chose, whey, and if it has been successful for you.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Annapolis, MD


Re: Fuel Polishing

Germain Jean-Pierre
 

Hello Mike,

I have experience with fuel filtration systems and fuel polishing systems. The main issue with fuel in this day and age is the quality of the fuel itself; It ain’t what it used to be!!! The problem also extends to the aviation industry and whilst flying airliners, we never had a problem; the reason is simple, airliners flew 400 hours per month and used a lot of fuel. However, when I started flying corporate jets the situation was different. Typically these aircraft fly less than 500 hours per year and are parked for long periods with near empty tanks … sometimes in moist areas. The bacteria that causes diesel fuel bug is always present in the atmosphere and cannot be avoided. 

Fuel polishing is one means of minimising the possibility of diesel bug contamination and the other is to install a high quality fuel filtration system. Personally I favour basic precautions, a diesel fuel biocide of some sort, full fuel tanks and dual Racor 7550 filters. The diesel fuel pumps on the Genset and the main engine typically feed double the volume needed for operation of the engine. Meaning that 50% of the fuel drawn from the tank is returned to the tank. This is sufficient movement  to ensure that the fuel in your tank is clean. 

The standard precautions are as follows:
-   Keep your tanks full. Always filter the fuel with a good funnel if you have any doubts about its quality. 
-   Add a biocide as directed by the manufacturer. (Biobor or Grotamar are two of them)
-   Relax probably nothing will happen from then on. Of course change the filters when required and verify the sight bowls to guarantee no deposit. 

Installation of a fuel polishing system involves quite a bit of work and sizable quantities of cash. A friend of mine, now stuck in France due to international travel restrictions, asked me to oversee the installation of a fuel polishing system on his boat this year. The installation is successful however his case was different; he had a COVID 19 sized diesel fuel bug problem in his tanks. His boat has large capacity fuel exceeding 1500 L and had been on the hard in Tahiti for an extended period of time due to an unfortunate incident at sea. .. with tanks having a remaining quantity of about 300 liters each. These are perfect conditions for the development of diesel fuel bug. 

System description: consists of Racor fuel polishing pump, a separate Racor 7550 Fuel filter as the pump does not have a sight bowl (although depicted as having a sight bowl on the Racor website, this is not the case ) and you will never be certain of your fuel unless you can visually check from time to time. It also required the design and installation of a cross feeding manifold and distribution valves. This allowed for fuel transfer; a situation which was impossible with the original design. 

On my SM, I opted for the dual Racor filters and I feed through only one of the filters at a time and switch over after each filter change. There is a lot more faffing with the fuel polishing system than with a good fuel filtration system. 

Good luck with your decision and if you require, I’d be glad to talk to you over the Internet. 

Kind regards


Jean-Pierre Germain, Eleuthera , SM007, Opua NZ


On 1 Sep 2021, at 15:54, Bill Kinney <cruisingconsulting@...> wrote:

Mike,

Many people have installed, such a system, and I'll let them tell you the how's and why's.  

Our boat did two circumnavigations and accumulated over 8000 engine hours with NO primary fuel filter at all, just a water separator.  Despite the obvious success of that arrangement, I did replace the Amel installed water separator with a standard Racor primary filter because it made me feel better.  

I have had sailboats with diesel engines for over 30 years and have never had a fuel issue that a "fuel polishing" system would have fixed.  To be clear, I have also never had a common rail engine that might require a higher level of fuel filtration.

No matter if you have a fuel polishing system, or not, always be careful where you buy fuel.  If the source is even the least bit dicey, use a good quality filter funnel when filling your tank.  Keep the filter funnel clean and dry, and you're very unlikely to have a problem.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Annapolis, MD, USA

2021 - 2040 of 61793