Date   

Re: [Amel] Connecting battery cables

amelforme
 

While on the subject of batteries, be sure to make a cover for at least one
of and preferably both of the threaded "posts" that the main positive and
negative battery cables are connected to inside the battery containment on
the Super Maramu and later boats that have the fiberglass tub battery
containment under the passageway berth. If you accidentally drop a metallic
tool across these posts, it will immediately fuse and glow red hot and you
will have your own little Chernobyl/China Syndrome. It happened on a client
of mine's boat. It was not pretty.

As a point of interest, the 30 amp charger was selected by Amel to properly
charge the batteries when at the dock when living aboard. My Amel 54, which
sadly spends more time being washed and coddled while being tied to a dock
as I can't run away from home in it yet and use it for what it was designed
for, has the original batteries which are six years old and about 90% as
good as the day I first stepped aboard according to the load test I do
annually. They seldom see the 100 amp charger and the 30 amp treats them
just fine.

Now that I have bragged about how good these old batteries are, they are
certain to go into failure mode tomorrow.

Have fun with your Amel.

All the best,
Joel


Joel F. Potter - Cruising Yacht Specialist, LLC
Amel's Sole Associate for the Americas
Mailing Address: 401 East Las Olas Boulevard #130-126
Fort Lauderdale, Florida 33301
Phone: (954) 462-5869
Email: jfpottercys@att.net
www.yachtworld.com/jfpottercys


Re: [Amel] Connecting battery cables

ianjenkins1946 <ianjudyjenkins@hotmail.com>
 

Thanks, Craig and Katherine, I will reread my Calder bible! Cheers, Ian and Judy, Pen Azen, SM 302, Spain

To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
From: sangaris@aol.com
Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2011 15:20:47 +0000
Subject: [Amel] Connecting battery cables

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, Ian & Judy Jenkins <ianjudyjenkins@...> wrote:
Thanks, JeanLuc. ... the good Sergio ... sticks to a pretty basic rule which I have not seen written anywhere else--he always disconnects the negative wire first. Similarly, when connecting he always connects the positive wire first. Is this the correct sequence? it seems such an elementary point that I would have expected it to appear in any handbook on electricity. Cheers, Ian and Judy, Pen Azen, SM 302, Spain
===========================
Ian & Judy,
This is all about eliminating sparks near the battery that could ignite hydrogen and cause an explosion. The rule comes from working with cars where the body and frame act as the negative wire (rare exceptions use positive "ground").
By removing the negative wire from the battery first you eliminate the risk of accidentally touching the positive wire to the frame when you remove it and causing a spark. Also elimiates risk of damage to electronics.
Much less of an issue on the boat, especially Amels because they use double pole disconnect battery switches (both the pos and neg wires are disconnected when you open (turn off) the battery switch.
Of course, if there's any load "on" there will be a spark when you connect the last wire to the battery, be it pos or neg, so be sure to turn off all breakers & battery switches beforehand.
A good practice, of course, is to be sure your battery area is well ventilated before working there.
Btw, you'll see this in Nigel Calder's books, in Xantrex inverter/charger instructions, etc.
Cheers, Craig & Katherine SN#68 "SANGARIS" in Mesolonghi, GR



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links



Re: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

ianjenkins1946 <ianjudyjenkins@hotmail.com>
 

Hi Richard, I have to say that my 30 Ah charger worked perfectly for 10 years before the surge in the marina took it out. In case it proves entirely beyond repair I have been looking at the Sterling ProCharge Ultra, 2430, ( 24v, 30Ah) a newish charger which has recently won a number of awards--smaller and lighter than its Reya Dolphin equivalent and at about 725 Euros coming in at about 100 euros cheaper. The manufacturers are confident that it can handle a 420ah bank.If I do have to replace my charger I think that's the one I will choose. Thankfully, my original 50 Ah charger is still fine.
Cheers, Ian and Judy, Pen Azen, SM 302, Spain

To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
From: richard03801@yahoo.com
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2011 08:16:12 -0400
Subject: Re: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

Not to drag this on to long however when you speak to battery people you may very well find that none will suggest a 30 amp charger for the size battery banks we feed. We have for the last 5 years used as suggested an 80 amp smart Delphine with complete success both on the hook/Gen set or dock side with 50 or 60 cyc. A 30 amp charger will continue to cause issues.

Regards
Richard Piller

On Mar 19, 2011, at 19:58, kimberlite <kimberlite@optonline.net> wrote:

Gary,

My 30 amp charger did the same thing,

It burned up my whole bank.

I returned it to reya and for about 125 US they repaired it.

I also replaced my batteries with group 31 sealed lead acid batteries.

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite

_____

From: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of gtesta23@tin.it
Sent: Saturday, March 19, 2011 12:42 PM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

Hi Garry,
we are now in Panama, Colon. With us an other SM ABORA with the same
problem.
But we don't have the solution.
I'll ask directly to REYA FR.
all the best
Gianni
EUTIKIA

----Messaggio originale----
Da: no_reply@yahoogroups.com <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com>
Data: 19-mar-2011 17.19
A: <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> >
Ogg: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

----Messaggio originale----
Da: no_reply@yahoogroups.com <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com>
Data: 19-mar-2011 17.19
A: <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> >
Ogg: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

Hi Gianni:

I installed 12 new Trojan SCS225 deep cycle batteries about 9 months ago.
They are flooded lead acid batteries.
I chose to have these since I had understood that absorbed gas matt (aka gel
cell) batteries didn't tolerate
the heat of the Caribbean well. My engine starting battery is a Deka and is
a high cranking power battery. Not
sure of it's number but it was a group 31 battery and I considered buying 12
more to serve as my house
batteries because they were compatible with the existing Amel copper bar
connecting plates. The supplier
didn't have 12 more available and I further researched the one I had and
found that it was not a deep cycle
battery and thus decided on the Trojans.

At any rate, we were in a marina for a few days after having been charging
on the generator for a few weeks,
and I had the 30 amp Dolphin charger on to "top up the batteries" One
morning I came from the aft cabin
and while walking through quarter-berth companionway, placed my hand on the
berth mattress and noticed
that it was very very warm. I opened the battery compartment and found all
the batteries actively gassing
and bubbling to overflowing electrolyte. Using an infrared thermometer I
measured the temp of the batteries
at 135-145 deg F. The voltage was about 28.3 volts. As I recall they were
still having 18 amps pumped into
them even after 36 hrs on the charger. It seemed that the 30 amp Dolphin
charger had failed to switch from
"bulk" charge to float charge. Fortunately the batteries didn't have the
plates exposed and hopefully they do
not have warped plates from the excessive heat.

I called the Dophin charger people in the US and spoke to them. They
suggested re-setting the charger
by disconnecting the voltage to the charger, letting it sit for 30 minutes
and then reconnecting to the
batteries. I did this by "turning off the main battery switches" assuming
that I was indeed disconnecting
the charger from the batteries. When I didn't see any change in the behavior
of the charger I assumed that
the charger was faulty. As we were leaving the boat I didn't take any
further action to trouble-shoot the issue.

Now, with the information that the battery switches don't disconnect the
batteries from the charger (at least
on SN 318, and will shortly be determined if that is the same on my boat),
perhaps my old Dolphin 30 amp
charger can be made to behave. At any rate, I will no longer take the
automatic functioning of my charger
for granted, and I am considering installing a temperature alarm on my
battery bank so I won't risk
destroying $3,000 US worth of batteries due to a faulty charger. Watch your
battery temperatures, and the
amperage going into the battery bank carefully as it sounds like your
charger is doing the same thing
mine was.

Just my thoughts,

Gary Silver

Amel SM 2000 #335
s/v Liahona

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , "gtesta23@..." <gtesta23@...>
wrote:

Hi Chris,
Thanks for your suggestions
I have 12 new DEKA lead acid deep cycle batteries. About 630 Ah.
My Dolphin 30 A charger works slowly up to 28.1,2 v. Than, I suppose, it
should go down to about 27 /26.5 v in stand by. ( no boost).
The my one seems to remain at 28.1 for long time boosting few amperes.
Is the charger to little for my 630 Ah ?
thanks in advance
All the best
Gianni Testa
sv EUTIKIA SM 428
-->










------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links



Re: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

Richard03801 <richard03801@...>
 

Not to drag this on to long however when you speak to battery people you may very well find that none will suggest a 30 amp charger for the size battery banks we feed. We have for the last 5 years used as suggested an 80 amp smart Delphine with complete success both on the hook/Gen set or dock side with 50 or 60 cyc. A 30 amp charger will continue to cause issues.

Regards
Richard Piller

On Mar 19, 2011, at 19:58, kimberlite <kimberlite@optonline.net> wrote:

Gary,

My 30 amp charger did the same thing,

It burned up my whole bank.

I returned it to reya and for about 125 US they repaired it.

I also replaced my batteries with group 31 sealed lead acid batteries.

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite

_____

From: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of gtesta23@tin.it
Sent: Saturday, March 19, 2011 12:42 PM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

Hi Garry,
we are now in Panama, Colon. With us an other SM ABORA with the same
problem.
But we don't have the solution.
I'll ask directly to REYA FR.
all the best
Gianni
EUTIKIA

----Messaggio originale----
Da: no_reply@yahoogroups.com <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com>
Data: 19-mar-2011 17.19
A: <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> >
Ogg: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

----Messaggio originale----
Da: no_reply@yahoogroups.com <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com>
Data: 19-mar-2011 17.19
A: <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> >
Ogg: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

Hi Gianni:

I installed 12 new Trojan SCS225 deep cycle batteries about 9 months ago.
They are flooded lead acid batteries.
I chose to have these since I had understood that absorbed gas matt (aka gel
cell) batteries didn't tolerate
the heat of the Caribbean well. My engine starting battery is a Deka and is
a high cranking power battery. Not
sure of it's number but it was a group 31 battery and I considered buying 12
more to serve as my house
batteries because they were compatible with the existing Amel copper bar
connecting plates. The supplier
didn't have 12 more available and I further researched the one I had and
found that it was not a deep cycle
battery and thus decided on the Trojans.

At any rate, we were in a marina for a few days after having been charging
on the generator for a few weeks,
and I had the 30 amp Dolphin charger on to "top up the batteries" One
morning I came from the aft cabin
and while walking through quarter-berth companionway, placed my hand on the
berth mattress and noticed
that it was very very warm. I opened the battery compartment and found all
the batteries actively gassing
and bubbling to overflowing electrolyte. Using an infrared thermometer I
measured the temp of the batteries
at 135-145 deg F. The voltage was about 28.3 volts. As I recall they were
still having 18 amps pumped into
them even after 36 hrs on the charger. It seemed that the 30 amp Dolphin
charger had failed to switch from
"bulk" charge to float charge. Fortunately the batteries didn't have the
plates exposed and hopefully they do
not have warped plates from the excessive heat.

I called the Dophin charger people in the US and spoke to them. They
suggested re-setting the charger
by disconnecting the voltage to the charger, letting it sit for 30 minutes
and then reconnecting to the
batteries. I did this by "turning off the main battery switches" assuming
that I was indeed disconnecting
the charger from the batteries. When I didn't see any change in the behavior
of the charger I assumed that
the charger was faulty. As we were leaving the boat I didn't take any
further action to trouble-shoot the issue.

Now, with the information that the battery switches don't disconnect the
batteries from the charger (at least
on SN 318, and will shortly be determined if that is the same on my boat),
perhaps my old Dolphin 30 amp
charger can be made to behave. At any rate, I will no longer take the
automatic functioning of my charger
for granted, and I am considering installing a temperature alarm on my
battery bank so I won't risk
destroying $3,000 US worth of batteries due to a faulty charger. Watch your
battery temperatures, and the
amperage going into the battery bank carefully as it sounds like your
charger is doing the same thing
mine was.

Just my thoughts,

Gary Silver

Amel SM 2000 #335
s/v Liahona

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , "gtesta23@..." <gtesta23@...>
wrote:

Hi Chris,
Thanks for your suggestions
I have 12 new DEKA lead acid deep cycle batteries. About 630 Ah.
My Dolphin 30 A charger works slowly up to 28.1,2 v. Than, I suppose, it
should go down to about 27 /26.5 v in stand by. ( no boost).
The my one seems to remain at 28.1 for long time boosting few amperes.
Is the charger to little for my 630 Ah ?
thanks in advance
All the best
Gianni Testa
sv EUTIKIA SM 428
-->

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


[Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

drew_gaffney <drew.gaffney@...>
 

We had the same experience when we bought Revelation. The previous owner had Reya repair his 30A charger. A few months later, when we met to inspect Revelation prior to purchase, the Dolphin had stayed in bulk mode, boiled a fairly new set of Trojan T-105's totally dry and ruined them!
We installed a Xantrex Freedom inverter/charger, which replaces the Dolphin 30A unit and gives us the capability of getting 220V 50Hz AC from 60Hz shore power. It's also sometimes handy to be able to run the microwave for a minute without having to start the generator.
Our 100A Dolphin also failed. The fan stopped (it was fine, the PCB was not...) We managed by opening the charger and using an external fan while charging until the end of the season. As long as the charger was cooled, it charged.
We replaced it with a Victron 100A charger, which fits nicely in the same space and has worked well for the past year. It was half the price of a Dolphin replacement.
We have found that we do need to equalize periodically. The charge rate declines and a full charge takes longer and longer. The Xantrex will do equaliazation, but ONLY if you purchase the external control device, approximately $125 USD. The 24V controllers are not available, but Xantrex says the 12V units can be kluged to work. We typically use our Balmar alternator to equalize, getting our SpGr back into the 1.250-1.285 range.
Finally, some have questioned the need for the 30A charger. I think the 100A charger will pop most marina shore-power breakers...
Cheers,
Drew
S/Y Revelation SM390
Lying Coffs Harbour, AU

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, kimberlite <kimberlite@...> wrote:

Gary,

My 30 amp charger did the same thing,

It burned up my whole bank.

I returned it to reya and for about 125 US they repaired it.

I also replaced my batteries with group 31 sealed lead acid batteries.

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite





_____

From: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of gtesta23@...
Sent: Saturday, March 19, 2011 12:42 PM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers





Hi Garry,
we are now in Panama, Colon. With us an other SM ABORA with the same
problem.
But we don't have the solution.
I'll ask directly to REYA FR.
all the best
Gianni
EUTIKIA

----Messaggio originale----
Da: no_reply@yahoogroups.com <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com>
Data: 19-mar-2011 17.19
A: <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> >
Ogg: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

----Messaggio originale----
Da: no_reply@yahoogroups.com <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com>
Data: 19-mar-2011 17.19
A: <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> >
Ogg: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

Hi Gianni:

I installed 12 new Trojan SCS225 deep cycle batteries about 9 months ago.
They are flooded lead acid batteries.
I chose to have these since I had understood that absorbed gas matt (aka gel
cell) batteries didn't tolerate
the heat of the Caribbean well. My engine starting battery is a Deka and is
a high cranking power battery. Not
sure of it's number but it was a group 31 battery and I considered buying 12
more to serve as my house
batteries because they were compatible with the existing Amel copper bar
connecting plates. The supplier
didn't have 12 more available and I further researched the one I had and
found that it was not a deep cycle
battery and thus decided on the Trojans.

At any rate, we were in a marina for a few days after having been charging
on the generator for a few weeks,
and I had the 30 amp Dolphin charger on to "top up the batteries" One
morning I came from the aft cabin
and while walking through quarter-berth companionway, placed my hand on the
berth mattress and noticed
that it was very very warm. I opened the battery compartment and found all
the batteries actively gassing
and bubbling to overflowing electrolyte. Using an infrared thermometer I
measured the temp of the batteries
at 135-145 deg F. The voltage was about 28.3 volts. As I recall they were
still having 18 amps pumped into
them even after 36 hrs on the charger. It seemed that the 30 amp Dolphin
charger had failed to switch from
"bulk" charge to float charge. Fortunately the batteries didn't have the
plates exposed and hopefully they do
not have warped plates from the excessive heat.

I called the Dophin charger people in the US and spoke to them. They
suggested re-setting the charger
by disconnecting the voltage to the charger, letting it sit for 30 minutes
and then reconnecting to the
batteries. I did this by "turning off the main battery switches" assuming
that I was indeed disconnecting
the charger from the batteries. When I didn't see any change in the behavior
of the charger I assumed that
the charger was faulty. As we were leaving the boat I didn't take any
further action to trouble-shoot the issue.

Now, with the information that the battery switches don't disconnect the
batteries from the charger (at least
on SN 318, and will shortly be determined if that is the same on my boat),
perhaps my old Dolphin 30 amp
charger can be made to behave. At any rate, I will no longer take the
automatic functioning of my charger
for granted, and I am considering installing a temperature alarm on my
battery bank so I won't risk
destroying $3,000 US worth of batteries due to a faulty charger. Watch your
battery temperatures, and the
amperage going into the battery bank carefully as it sounds like your
charger is doing the same thing
mine was.

Just my thoughts,

Gary Silver

Amel SM 2000 #335
s/v Liahona

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , "gtesta23@" <gtesta23@>
wrote:

Hi Chris,
Thanks for your suggestions
I have 12 new DEKA lead acid deep cycle batteries. About 630 Ah.
My Dolphin 30 A charger works slowly up to 28.1,2 v. Than, I suppose, it
should go down to about 27 /26.5 v in stand by. ( no boost).
The my one seems to remain at 28.1 for long time boosting few amperes.
Is the charger to little for my 630 Ah ?
thanks in advance
All the best
Gianni Testa
sv EUTIKIA SM 428
-->

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: [Amel] Re: Bilge Pump

john martin <symoondog@...>
 

Machine shops make all kinds of parts out of plastic, nylon, etc. I'm not sure they could make this part, but it wouldn't cost anything to ask. I personally have never seen anything they couldn't make. It would probably take 3 or 4 hours to set up the machine to make the part, and would be too pricey to make just one of them, but... if we want 10 of them maybe the cost would be worth it. John "Moon Dog" SM 248



To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
From: yahoogroups@svbebe.com
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2011 07:11:38 +0000
Subject: [Amel] Re: Bilge Pump






Paul,

We are interested. We have a pump with a broken nylon gear also.

Keep us in mind. We will be in Turkey in April. Contact us at svbebe"at"gmail.com.

I have an exploded view of the pump and parts list...the gearbox is item #36, part number 219464. I have copies of this in the photo section of this website titled "Bilge and Bilge Pump: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amelyachtowners/photos/album/1890643196/pic/list

Best,

Bill
s/v BeBe, SM2k, #387
Currently Male, Maldives, Indian Ocean

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "LaFrance" <pflafrance@...> wrote:

Thanks to all who replied to our bilge pump repair inquiry. We were able to find a used pump from another Amel owner who had replaced his. After a day taking their unit apart and rebuilding ours it now works. Returned the old one without the nylon gear ring.
As to the replacement part, we had little luck in tracking it down. When we were at Amel in Martinque they had 2 pumps and the part we needed had been removed. Their only suggestion was to buy a whole new pump. Our pump was manufactured in Italy by A.M.F.A. Pompe s.r.l , Via Grange Palmero,188 10091 Alpingnano (Torino). The new pump gives an address of Reya, 144 Ave De La Roubine, 06156 Cannes, La Bocca, France . The pumps have the same parts and we think Reya is just a wholesaler and not the manufacturer. Reya is a supplier that sources marine items such as the Dolphin charger.
We will be going to France and possibly Italy next month and we will try to source the replacement parts. If there is a desire and we find the parts, could people let us know as we may have them shipped back. We will be flying back to St Martin mid May and then heading to East coast of the USA and Canada the latter part of May.

Paul LaFrance
SV NOMAD SM362 Currently in St Lucia


Re: Bilge Pump

Judy and Bill aboard SV BeBe <yahoogroups@...>
 

Paul,

We are interested. We have a pump with a broken nylon gear also.

Keep us in mind. We will be in Turkey in April. Contact us at svbebe"at"gmail.com.

I have an exploded view of the pump and parts list...the gearbox is item #36, part number 219464. I have copies of this in the photo section of this website titled "Bilge and Bilge Pump: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amelyachtowners/photos/album/1890643196/pic/list


Best,

Bill
s/v BeBe, SM2k, #387
Currently Male, Maldives, Indian Ocean

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "LaFrance" <pflafrance@...> wrote:

Thanks to all who replied to our bilge pump repair inquiry. We were able to find a used pump from another Amel owner who had replaced his. After a day taking their unit apart and rebuilding ours it now works. Returned the old one without the nylon gear ring.
As to the replacement part, we had little luck in tracking it down. When we were at Amel in Martinque they had 2 pumps and the part we needed had been removed. Their only suggestion was to buy a whole new pump. Our pump was manufactured in Italy by A.M.F.A. Pompe s.r.l , Via Grange Palmero,188 10091 Alpingnano (Torino). The new pump gives an address of Reya, 144 Ave De La Roubine, 06156 Cannes, La Bocca, France . The pumps have the same parts and we think Reya is just a wholesaler and not the manufacturer. Reya is a supplier that sources marine items such as the Dolphin charger.
We will be going to France and possibly Italy next month and we will try to source the replacement parts. If there is a desire and we find the parts, could people let us know as we may have them shipped back. We will be flying back to St Martin mid May and then heading to East coast of the USA and Canada the latter part of May.

Paul LaFrance
SV NOMAD SM362 Currently in St Lucia


Re: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

Eric Freedman
 

Gary,

My 30 amp charger did the same thing,

It burned up my whole bank.

I returned it to reya and for about 125 US they repaired it.

I also replaced my batteries with group 31 sealed lead acid batteries.

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite





_____

From: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of gtesta23@tin.it
Sent: Saturday, March 19, 2011 12:42 PM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers





Hi Garry,
we are now in Panama, Colon. With us an other SM ABORA with the same
problem.
But we don't have the solution.
I'll ask directly to REYA FR.
all the best
Gianni
EUTIKIA

----Messaggio originale----
Da: no_reply@yahoogroups.com <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com>
Data: 19-mar-2011 17.19
A: <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> >
Ogg: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

----Messaggio originale----
Da: no_reply@yahoogroups.com <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com>
Data: 19-mar-2011 17.19
A: <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> >
Ogg: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

Hi Gianni:

I installed 12 new Trojan SCS225 deep cycle batteries about 9 months ago.
They are flooded lead acid batteries.
I chose to have these since I had understood that absorbed gas matt (aka gel
cell) batteries didn't tolerate
the heat of the Caribbean well. My engine starting battery is a Deka and is
a high cranking power battery. Not
sure of it's number but it was a group 31 battery and I considered buying 12
more to serve as my house
batteries because they were compatible with the existing Amel copper bar
connecting plates. The supplier
didn't have 12 more available and I further researched the one I had and
found that it was not a deep cycle
battery and thus decided on the Trojans.

At any rate, we were in a marina for a few days after having been charging
on the generator for a few weeks,
and I had the 30 amp Dolphin charger on to "top up the batteries" One
morning I came from the aft cabin
and while walking through quarter-berth companionway, placed my hand on the
berth mattress and noticed
that it was very very warm. I opened the battery compartment and found all
the batteries actively gassing
and bubbling to overflowing electrolyte. Using an infrared thermometer I
measured the temp of the batteries
at 135-145 deg F. The voltage was about 28.3 volts. As I recall they were
still having 18 amps pumped into
them even after 36 hrs on the charger. It seemed that the 30 amp Dolphin
charger had failed to switch from
"bulk" charge to float charge. Fortunately the batteries didn't have the
plates exposed and hopefully they do
not have warped plates from the excessive heat.

I called the Dophin charger people in the US and spoke to them. They
suggested re-setting the charger
by disconnecting the voltage to the charger, letting it sit for 30 minutes
and then reconnecting to the
batteries. I did this by "turning off the main battery switches" assuming
that I was indeed disconnecting
the charger from the batteries. When I didn't see any change in the behavior
of the charger I assumed that
the charger was faulty. As we were leaving the boat I didn't take any
further action to trouble-shoot the issue.

Now, with the information that the battery switches don't disconnect the
batteries from the charger (at least
on SN 318, and will shortly be determined if that is the same on my boat),
perhaps my old Dolphin 30 amp
charger can be made to behave. At any rate, I will no longer take the
automatic functioning of my charger
for granted, and I am considering installing a temperature alarm on my
battery bank so I won't risk
destroying $3,000 US worth of batteries due to a faulty charger. Watch your
battery temperatures, and the
amperage going into the battery bank carefully as it sounds like your
charger is doing the same thing
mine was.

Just my thoughts,

Gary Silver

Amel SM 2000 #335
s/v Liahona

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , "gtesta23@..." <gtesta23@...>
wrote:

Hi Chris,
Thanks for your suggestions
I have 12 new DEKA lead acid deep cycle batteries. About 630 Ah.
My Dolphin 30 A charger works slowly up to 28.1,2 v. Than, I suppose, it
should go down to about 27 /26.5 v in stand by. ( no boost).
The my one seems to remain at 28.1 for long time boosting few amperes.
Is the charger to little for my 630 Ah ?
thanks in advance
All the best
Gianni Testa
sv EUTIKIA SM 428
-->


Re: [Amel] Further VAT liability on vessels returning to UK from outside EU

bootlegger@...
 

Good thanks; great to hear from you. Where are you?

Andy Roy the boat VAT expert also told me he thought liable for further payment. However since sending just found out on a boat related website VAT is only ever paid once !!

Planning to return to Europe in May. Home waters initially then. Slow cruise down to Med and over to eastern Med.

Look forward to hearing what you're up to.

Frank

------Original Message------
From: Horst Pause
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
ReplyTo: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Amel] Further VAT liability on vessels returning to UK from outside EU
Sent: 19 Mar 2011 17:07

Hi Frank,

Why don't you ask Customs and Excise? They were very helpful during the
re-importation of one of my boats.

Also, as far as I know, there are some islands in the Caribbean that are part of
the EU - St Martin? + others.

Hope you are well,

Horst





________________________________
From: "bootlegger@mailasail.com" <bootlegger@mailasail.com>
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sat, 19 March, 2011 16:57:17
Subject: Re: [Amel] Further VAT liability on vessels returning to UK from
outside EU


Many thanks for your detailed response.

I wonder whether anyone else can add to your comments on this apparent double
VAT hit on EU registered and VAT paid boats that have spent three years outside
the EU VAT area?

Frank Newton

Bootlegger of Mann
SM2K 321
Nanny Cay Marina
Tortola
BVI

Bootlegger@mailasail.com
------Original Message------
From: rxc
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
ReplyTo: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Amel] Further VAT liability on vessels returning to UK from
outside EU
Sent: 15 Mar 2011 15:04

I believe that this is true here in France. When I first read it, I was a bit
shocked, but I think it may be an EU-wide issue. I wonder if you could avoid
this by a change of residence. There is another provision in EU law that
exempts boats that accompany someone in a change of residence from outside the
EU to inside, from VAT and customs duty. I used this provision to avoid VAT on
my boat when we came here to France, and we have not had any problems to date,
even with customs inspections in France and Spain.


On Mar 14, 2011, at 17:29, bootlegger@... wrote:


An accountant here mentioned to me the other day that he understood if a
UK registered vessel was taken out of UK (or EU) waters for a period in
excess of three years from the date of its departure, the owner was liable
to pay full VAT on the vessel upon its return to the UK. That such a
requirement applied irrespective of the fact that full VAT had previously
been paid on the vessel at the time of its purchase.

This is news to me if true. Has anyone any knowledge on the subject to be
able to advise as to whether or not there is any substance to this
assertion?

Frank Newton
Bootlegger of Mann
Nanny Cay Marina
Tortola
BVI

[e] bootlegger@...

[t] + 44 7624 263263


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



Sent from my BlackBerry® device from Cable & Wireless

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



Sent from my BlackBerry® device from Cable & Wireless


Splitting The Battery Bank

LaFrance <pflafrance@...>
 

We recently split our battery bank into 2 separate units mainly for charging purposes.

Our vessel is used 12 months of the year and is rarely on shore power. Amel provided the vessel with 12-12V lead acid house batteries with a Dolphin 100 Amp charger and a 30 Amp Dolphin charger. The 30 Amp charger is used for when connected to shore. Our research indicated that a 100 Amp charger is good for charging a battery bank of up to 400 Amp/Hrs. We currently consume 130 amp/hrs per day

The Dolphin charger was not of sufficient capacity to maintain the battery bank at the levels for charging. As per the Trojan Battery Company's charging and maintenance guide the charging voltage daily during absorption should be between 29.2V – 29.6V.(http://www.trojanbattery.com/pdf/UsersGuide_English.pdf) To accomplish this on the Dolphin, the #2 setting (which gives 29.6V) was selected. Due to line loss, the voltage to the batteries is 29.2V. We confirmed this with the USA representative in Florida. There are no settings available on the Dolphin 30 Amp charger to provide this voltage.

Our current Amp/Hr capacity is 1,290 Amp/Hrs (12 X 215 Amp/Hrs divided by 2) The batteries are type 31 made by UltraPower.

As we saw it the 100Amp charger was not sufficient to do the job hence splitting the batteries into 2 banks to 645 Amp/Hrs in each bank. The 100 Amp Dolphin charger still would not do the job as there are more than 400 Amp/Hrs. We then decided to install another battery charger with inverter capabilities. We chose a Magnum MS-E Series Pure Sine Wave Inverter/ Charger Model # MS4124E. This charger provides 105 Amps of charging power. We note that we get 114 Amps when charging (Bonus) The inverter provides us with 220V 50 Hz power to run the appliances on board without having to start the Genset. Cost of unit with remote control, temperature sensor & shipping $2,066.41 USD.

Now we can charge each bank with sufficient Voltage and Amps and it takes half the time when using both chargers. Other stand alone marine chargers were much more expensive and did not have the inverter function. Magnum chargers are mainly made for the trucking industry and do not carry the marine markup that we often see in place. The Magnum charger is a much smarter unit than the Dolpin in that it allows adjustments and tapers off when charging with Dolphin charger. When the Genset output is done to 14 Amps we turn off the Dolphin and leave the Magnum on as it is smarter and charges the batteries properly after the bulk charge.

As a result of the split we installed a Link 20 monitoring system to check the banks. The old Link 10 monitor now does the 12V starting battery. We also had designed another monitoring system by Blue Sea to monitor the output from the genset which has a 30 Amp breaker. When running both chargers the genset is putting out 29 Amps. As you may be aware a fully loaded and working diesel engine likes to be loaded up and will last longer. When charger is half done then we can turn on other 220V systems. This unit also tells us how the genset is working and when it may need repairs to the electrical part of the genset. It also allows us to monitor the draw from individual units on board and we can fix if we see a drop or increase in what the particular system is drawing.

This project took over 3 years to design and understand the Amel systems with a lot of input from people far more knowledgeable than us.

We now use one battery bank every 24 Hrs and then switch to the other bank ( bank 1 on odd days and bank 2 on even days)


BENEFITS
Less time charging the battery banks saving genset hours, fuel and maintenance
Inverter can supply power to 220V/50Hz systems without genset having to be run
When hooked up to shore power either 110V or 220V 50 or 60 hz the charge is run through the Dolphin 30 Amp charger and we then use the inverter to obtain 220V/50hz for our power needs on board. As a note the Air conditioning units require 50hz contrary to what Amel says. We checked with Clima on this and they stated on numerous occasions from different technicians that the capacitors will blow out. (As a side note when we were on shore power in the US we ran the Air Conditioning units and as a result had to replace 12 of the 15 AC capacitors as they were blown and not functioning) As we normally only have 110V/60hz or 220/60hz available we took this route. The added benefit of the Blue Sea unit is that it tells us what type of power is coming on board either 110/220V & 50/60hz
We can monitor what each unit is drawing on both the 24 V and 220V systems IE: Washer/Dryer, AC units, Bow thruster, Winches, Furlers etc

We now have the capability to know what is going into and out of the batteries. With the batteries being able to rest for 24 Hrs, we feel they will last longer and will not require equalization. We did not keep track of all the costs but installation took approx. 20 hours along with a lot of wire.
Magnum Charger $2,066.41, Link 20 $375.15, Blue Sea Monitor $875, 12 Batteries $1,285.48

As a side note the Dolphin 100Amp charger has an equalization setting. When we asked the Florida technician, he then inquired to France and they stated in no uncertain terms by email to not use it. We are on our 3rd Dolphin charger replaced 2 under warranty and 1 due to water damage when the water maker high pressure hose blew. It appears that the charger is set up for charging 2 separate banks but the divider breaks down over time. This was even before we installed the additional charger. Warranty work is dismal as they had to send units to France then on to the manufacturer. Our last warranty unit took over a year to be returned and we currently have one in for warranty since October 2010 and they don't know when we will get it back. The company is owned by REYA and they have some one else build them in Europe we think but can't confirm who. The USA representative is looking for another source to provide warranty work as REYA's contract expired in December 2010. The Florida representative, Steve, has been more than helpful. His hands are tide and the company has tried on our behalf and numerous others to get info which is not coming back to them. When they ship the units back they go on a pallet as there are so many. No wonder they are looking for a new warranty provider. Who needs this type of customer service.

Paul LaFrance
SV NOMAD SM 362 Currently in St Lucia


Re: [Amel] Dolphin Battery Chargers

jlm@jlmertz.fr
 

1- Why AMEL do that, I don't know perhaps it was no space enough on the
switch to make a good work !
2- on the charge I had a few mili-volts between the diodesand their
radiators (I cleaned the pcb and change the pop rivers with screws)
jluc


Le 19/03/2011 15:40, amelliahona a écrit :



Jean Luc:

Regarding your post:

"If you send it to the manufacturer*be VERY careful on my SM316 if you
disconnect the battery with the 2 switches placed in the corridor the
battery voltage is NOT DISCONNECTED from the charger => BIG DANGER* ! ."
My boat is SM335 so I am assuming that it is wired the same as yours. If I
understand correctly your statement, the chargers are wired directly
to the
batteries and DO NOT CONNECT VIA THE SHUT OFF SWITCHES in the quarter
berth companionway? That seems very strange. Any idea why Amel would
do that? You mentioned that you changed your wiring. Specifically what did
you do?

Gary Silver
s/v Liahona
Amel SM 2000 # 335 Delivered July 1, 2001


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Bilge Pump

LaFrance <pflafrance@...>
 

Thanks to all who replied to our bilge pump repair inquiry. We were able to find a used pump from another Amel owner who had replaced his. After a day taking their unit apart and rebuilding ours it now works. Returned the old one without the nylon gear ring.
As to the replacement part, we had little luck in tracking it down. When we were at Amel in Martinque they had 2 pumps and the part we needed had been removed. Their only suggestion was to buy a whole new pump. Our pump was manufactured in Italy by A.M.F.A. Pompe s.r.l , Via Grange Palmero,188 10091 Alpingnano (Torino). The new pump gives an address of Reya, 144 Ave De La Roubine, 06156 Cannes, La Bocca, France . The pumps have the same parts and we think Reya is just a wholesaler and not the manufacturer. Reya is a supplier that sources marine items such as the Dolphin charger.
We will be going to France and possibly Italy next month and we will try to source the replacement parts. If there is a desire and we find the parts, could people let us know as we may have them shipped back. We will be flying back to St Martin mid May and then heading to East coast of the USA and Canada the latter part of May.

Paul LaFrance
SV NOMAD SM362 Currently in St Lucia


Re: [Amel] Further VAT liability on vessels returning to UK from outside EU

Horst Pause <horst.puddleduck@...>
 

Hi Frank,

Why don't you ask Customs and Excise? They were very helpful during the
re-importation of one of my boats.

Also, as far as I know, there are some islands in the Caribbean that are part of
the EU - St Martin? + others.

Hope you are well,

Horst





________________________________
From: "bootlegger@mailasail.com" <bootlegger@mailasail.com>
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sat, 19 March, 2011 16:57:17
Subject: Re: [Amel] Further VAT liability on vessels returning to UK from
outside EU


Many thanks for your detailed response.

I wonder whether anyone else can add to your comments on this apparent double
VAT hit on EU registered and VAT paid boats that have spent three years outside
the EU VAT area?

Frank Newton

Bootlegger of Mann
SM2K 321
Nanny Cay Marina
Tortola
BVI

Bootlegger@mailasail.com
------Original Message------
From: rxc
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
ReplyTo: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Amel] Further VAT liability on vessels returning to UK from
outside EU
Sent: 15 Mar 2011 15:04

I believe that this is true here in France. When I first read it, I was a bit
shocked, but I think it may be an EU-wide issue. I wonder if you could avoid
this by a change of residence. There is another provision in EU law that
exempts boats that accompany someone in a change of residence from outside the
EU to inside, from VAT and customs duty. I used this provision to avoid VAT on
my boat when we came here to France, and we have not had any problems to date,
even with customs inspections in France and Spain.


On Mar 14, 2011, at 17:29, bootlegger@... wrote:


An accountant here mentioned to me the other day that he understood if a
UK registered vessel was taken out of UK (or EU) waters for a period in
excess of three years from the date of its departure, the owner was liable
to pay full VAT on the vessel upon its return to the UK. That such a
requirement applied irrespective of the fact that full VAT had previously
been paid on the vessel at the time of its purchase.

This is news to me if true. Has anyone any knowledge on the subject to be
able to advise as to whether or not there is any substance to this
assertion?

Frank Newton
Bootlegger of Mann
Nanny Cay Marina
Tortola
BVI

[e] bootlegger@...

[t] + 44 7624 263263


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



Sent from my BlackBerry® device from Cable & Wireless

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: [Amel] Further VAT liability on vessels returning to UK from outside EU

bootlegger@...
 

Many thanks for your detailed response.

I wonder whether anyone else can add to your comments on this apparent double VAT hit on EU registered and VAT paid boats that have spent three years outside the EU VAT area?

Frank Newton

Bootlegger of Mann
SM2K 321
Nanny Cay Marina
Tortola
BVI

Bootlegger@mailasail.com

------Original Message------
From: rxc
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
ReplyTo: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Amel] Further VAT liability on vessels returning to UK from outside EU
Sent: 15 Mar 2011 15:04

I believe that this is true here in France. When I first read it, I was a bit shocked, but I think it may be an EU-wide issue. I wonder if you could avoid this by a change of residence. There is another provision in EU law that exempts boats that accompany someone in a change of residence from outside the EU to inside, from VAT and customs duty. I used this provision to avoid VAT on my boat when we came here to France, and we have not had any problems to date, even with customs inspections in France and Spain.


On Mar 14, 2011, at 17:29, bootlegger@... wrote:


An accountant here mentioned to me the other day that he understood if a
UK registered vessel was taken out of UK (or EU) waters for a period in
excess of three years from the date of its departure, the owner was liable
to pay full VAT on the vessel upon its return to the UK. That such a
requirement applied irrespective of the fact that full VAT had previously
been paid on the vessel at the time of its purchase.

This is news to me if true. Has anyone any knowledge on the subject to be
able to advise as to whether or not there is any substance to this
assertion?

Frank Newton
Bootlegger of Mann
Nanny Cay Marina
Tortola
BVI

[e] bootlegger@...

[t] + 44 7624 263263


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



Sent from my BlackBerry® device from Cable & Wireless


R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

Giovanni TESTA
 

Hi Garry,
we are now in Panama, Colon. With us an other SM ABORA with the same problem.
But we don't have the solution.
I'll ask directly to REYA FR.
all the best
Gianni
EUTIKIA

----Messaggio originale----
Da: no_reply@yahoogroups.com
Data: 19-mar-2011 17.19
A: <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Ogg: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers



----Messaggio originale----
Da: no_reply@yahoogroups.com
Data: 19-mar-2011 17.19
A: <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Ogg: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers






Hi Gianni:

I installed 12 new Trojan SCS225 deep cycle batteries about 9 months ago. They are flooded lead acid batteries.
I chose to have these since I had understood that absorbed gas matt (aka gel cell) batteries didn't tolerate
the heat of the Caribbean well. My engine starting battery is a Deka and is a high cranking power battery. Not
sure of it's number but it was a group 31 battery and I considered buying 12 more to serve as my house
batteries because they were compatible with the existing Amel copper bar connecting plates. The supplier
didn't have 12 more available and I further researched the one I had and found that it was not a deep cycle
battery and thus decided on the Trojans.

At any rate, we were in a marina for a few days after having been charging on the generator for a few weeks,
and I had the 30 amp Dolphin charger on to "top up the batteries" One morning I came from the aft cabin
and while walking through quarter-berth companionway, placed my hand on the berth mattress and noticed
that it was very very warm. I opened the battery compartment and found all the batteries actively gassing
and bubbling to overflowing electrolyte. Using an infrared thermometer I measured the temp of the batteries
at 135-145 deg F. The voltage was about 28.3 volts. As I recall they were still having 18 amps pumped into
them even after 36 hrs on the charger. It seemed that the 30 amp Dolphin charger had failed to switch from
"bulk" charge to float charge. Fortunately the batteries didn't have the plates exposed and hopefully they do
not have warped plates from the excessive heat.

I called the Dophin charger people in the US and spoke to them. They suggested re-setting the charger
by disconnecting the voltage to the charger, letting it sit for 30 minutes and then reconnecting to the
batteries. I did this by "turning off the main battery switches" assuming that I was indeed disconnecting
the charger from the batteries. When I didn't see any change in the behavior of the charger I assumed that
the charger was faulty. As we were leaving the boat I didn't take any further action to trouble-shoot the issue.

Now, with the information that the battery switches don't disconnect the batteries from the charger (at least
on SN 318, and will shortly be determined if that is the same on my boat), perhaps my old Dolphin 30 amp
charger can be made to behave. At any rate, I will no longer take the automatic functioning of my charger
for granted, and I am considering installing a temperature alarm on my battery bank so I won't risk
destroying $3,000 US worth of batteries due to a faulty charger. Watch your battery temperatures, and the
amperage going into the battery bank carefully as it sounds like your charger is doing the same thing
mine was.

Just my thoughts,

Gary Silver

Amel SM 2000 #335
s/v Liahona

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "gtesta23@..." <gtesta23@...> wrote:

Hi Chris,
Thanks for your suggestions
I have 12 new DEKA lead acid deep cycle batteries. About 630 Ah.
My Dolphin 30 A charger works slowly up to 28.1,2 v. Than, I suppose, it should go down to about 27 /26.5 v in stand by. ( no boost).
The my one seems to remain at 28.1 for long time boosting few amperes.
Is the charger to little for my 630 Ah ?
thanks in advance
All the best
Gianni Testa
sv EUTIKIA SM 428




-->



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

amelliahona <no_reply@...>
 

Hi Gianni:

I installed 12 new Trojan SCS225 deep cycle batteries about 9 months ago. They are flooded lead acid batteries.
I chose to have these since I had understood that absorbed gas matt (aka gel cell) batteries didn't tolerate
the heat of the Caribbean well. My engine starting battery is a Deka and is a high cranking power battery. Not
sure of it's number but it was a group 31 battery and I considered buying 12 more to serve as my house
batteries because they were compatible with the existing Amel copper bar connecting plates. The supplier
didn't have 12 more available and I further researched the one I had and found that it was not a deep cycle
battery and thus decided on the Trojans.

At any rate, we were in a marina for a few days after having been charging on the generator for a few weeks,
and I had the 30 amp Dolphin charger on to "top up the batteries" One morning I came from the aft cabin
and while walking through quarter-berth companionway, placed my hand on the berth mattress and noticed
that it was very very warm. I opened the battery compartment and found all the batteries actively gassing
and bubbling to overflowing electrolyte. Using an infrared thermometer I measured the temp of the batteries
at 135-145 deg F. The voltage was about 28.3 volts. As I recall they were still having 18 amps pumped into
them even after 36 hrs on the charger. It seemed that the 30 amp Dolphin charger had failed to switch from
"bulk" charge to float charge. Fortunately the batteries didn't have the plates exposed and hopefully they do
not have warped plates from the excessive heat.

I called the Dophin charger people in the US and spoke to them. They suggested re-setting the charger
by disconnecting the voltage to the charger, letting it sit for 30 minutes and then reconnecting to the
batteries. I did this by "turning off the main battery switches" assuming that I was indeed disconnecting
the charger from the batteries. When I didn't see any change in the behavior of the charger I assumed that
the charger was faulty. As we were leaving the boat I didn't take any further action to trouble-shoot the issue.

Now, with the information that the battery switches don't disconnect the batteries from the charger (at least
on SN 318, and will shortly be determined if that is the same on my boat), perhaps my old Dolphin 30 amp
charger can be made to behave. At any rate, I will no longer take the automatic functioning of my charger
for granted, and I am considering installing a temperature alarm on my battery bank so I won't risk
destroying $3,000 US worth of batteries due to a faulty charger. Watch your battery temperatures, and the
amperage going into the battery bank carefully as it sounds like your charger is doing the same thing
mine was.

Just my thoughts,

Gary Silver

Amel SM 2000 #335
s/v Liahona

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "gtesta23@..." <gtesta23@...> wrote:

Hi Chris,
Thanks for your suggestions
I have 12 new DEKA lead acid deep cycle batteries. About 630 Ah.
My Dolphin 30 A charger works slowly up to 28.1,2 v. Than, I suppose, it should go down to about 27 /26.5 v in stand by. ( no boost).
The my one seems to remain at 28.1 for long time boosting few amperes.
Is the charger to little for my 630 Ah ?
thanks in advance
All the best
Gianni Testa
sv EUTIKIA SM 428


Connecting battery cables

Craig Briggs
 

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, Ian & Judy Jenkins <ianjudyjenkins@...> wrote:
Thanks, JeanLuc. ... the good Sergio ... sticks to a pretty basic rule which I have not seen written anywhere else--he always disconnects the negative wire first. Similarly, when connecting he always connects the positive wire first. Is this the correct sequence? it seems such an elementary point that I would have expected it to appear in any handbook on electricity. Cheers, Ian and Judy, Pen Azen, SM 302, Spain
===========================
Ian & Judy,
This is all about eliminating sparks near the battery that could ignite hydrogen and cause an explosion. The rule comes from working with cars where the body and frame act as the negative wire (rare exceptions use positive "ground").
By removing the negative wire from the battery first you eliminate the risk of accidentally touching the positive wire to the frame when you remove it and causing a spark. Also elimiates risk of damage to electronics.
Much less of an issue on the boat, especially Amels because they use double pole disconnect battery switches (both the pos and neg wires are disconnected when you open (turn off) the battery switch.
Of course, if there's any load "on" there will be a spark when you connect the last wire to the battery, be it pos or neg, so be sure to turn off all breakers & battery switches beforehand.
A good practice, of course, is to be sure your battery area is well ventilated before working there.
Btw, you'll see this in Nigel Calder's books, in Xantrex inverter/charger instructions, etc.
Cheers, Craig & Katherine SN#68 "SANGARIS" in Mesolonghi, GR


Re: [Amel] Dolphin Battery Chargers

amelliahona <no_reply@...>
 

Jean Luc:

Regarding your post:

"If you send it to the manufacturer*be VERY careful on my SM316 if you
disconnect the battery with the 2 switches placed in the corridor the
battery voltage is NOT DISCONNECTED from the charger => BIG DANGER* ! ."

My boat is SM335 so I am assuming that it is wired the same as yours. If I
understand correctly your statement, the chargers are wired directly to the
batteries and DO NOT CONNECT VIA THE SHUT OFF SWITCHES in the quarter
berth companionway? That seems very strange. Any idea why Amel would
do that? You mentioned that you changed your wiring. Specifically what did
you do?

Gary Silver
s/v Liahona
Amel SM 2000 # 335 Delivered July 1, 2001


Re: R: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

Richard03801 <richard03801@...>
 

Chris If you are at 28.1 volts for a long time check you charger that is to high. Also keep an eye on battery heat as well as the condition of the acid. It should be around 1250.

Regards
Richard sm 209

On Mar 18, 2011, at 14:39, "gtesta23@tin.it" <gtesta23@tin.it> wrote:

Hi Chris,
Thanks for your suggestions
I have 12 new DEKA lead acid deep cycle batteries. About 630 Ah.
My Dolphin 30 A charger works slowly up to 28.1,2 v. Than, I suppose, it should go down to about 27 /26.5 v in stand by. ( no boost).
The my one seems to remain at 28.1 for long time boosting few amperes.
Is the charger to little for my 630 Ah ?
thanks in advance
All the best
Gianni Testa
sv EUTIKIA SM 428

----Messaggio originale----
Da: yachtakwaaba@yahoo.com
Data: 18-mar-2011 17.15
A: <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Ogg: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

----Messaggio originale----
Da: yachtakwaaba@yahoo.com
Data: 18-mar-2011 17.15
A: <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Ogg: [Amel] Re: All Battery Chargers

Hi every body,
I've been reading all the posts about battery chargers and sizes etc etc with interest, and hark back to the "old days" when there was only one type of battery and one type, (usually from the local garage), of charger, which you temporarily rigged to your battery,(ies), if you had a "big boat"!
I've spent some time giving briefings to fellow cruisers on battery management....it's a subject my wife says she's heard so often........why don't yacht builders do it she asks!
With modern smart mains driven chargers, the charging profile is set by the selection of "battery type" on the charger. This is important as gel cell, lead acid, alkaline and others have different charging regimes. Some take a high initial charge, tapering off with rising battery voltage, others need a constant current charge, whilst others need a dwell period with no charge, before restarting the charge cycle etc etc..
Most modern "smart chargers" can cope with this, and with a shore powered system you are less concerned about time to full charge, so a 30 or 40A charger is OK for about 300-500AH of installed capacity. (remember to include your engine start battery if it's separate)
Running on generator you want a faster charge, so a 50A (or higher) charger to speed up the recharge cycle - 50A at 24V is a little over 6A at 220v depending on charger efficiency. But on engine alternator the ideal alternator size is between 1/3 to 1/5 of your installed capacity.
I still run on 6v lead acid (golf cart) batteries ganged to give me 350AH, supported by a 70A 12v engine alternator, and a 45A shaft alternator. (balanced so it runs with engine on)
For those with lead acid batteries, I can post notes on what I regard as the critical aspect of battery management - namely equalization, which if your smart charger supports it is the way to prolong battery life. Early Amels, like my Santorin, live or die on the effeciency of their batteries, as they are things that cope with the sudden high demands of furling motors or bow thrusters.
More later - if anybody wishes - sorry if I am preaching to the converted

Mike &amp; (long suffering wife Chris)
Akwaaba SN 27

--- On Fri, 3/18/11, Anne and John Hollamby <annejohnholl@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Anne and John Hollamby <annejohnholl@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Amel] Dolphin Battery Chargers
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Friday, March 18, 2011, 11:32 AM

Hi Ian and Judy, I would take their advice. Just make sure that the internal charge control switch is set for your type of batteries. Good Luck with it. Anne and John, SM 319.

----- Original Message -----

From: Ian &amp; Judy Jenkins

To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2011 6:22 PM

Subject: RE: [Amel] Dolphin Battery Chargers

Hi Anne and John, Thanks for that. I suspect that the Spanish distributor had his eye on the main chance--I have since found out that the modern replacement sold by Reya is priced by them at 851 Euros ( much the same price as in 2003). As a matter of interest why would you prefer the 100 Ah version? The Reya website recommends their Model 30, Code 299712, as being appropriate for a battery capacity of 500AH, 24 volt. " Model 30" seems to be based on the fact that the maximum output on the DC side is 30A. Ah, the black art of marine electrics... Cheers, Ian and Judy, Pen Azen, SM 302, Spain

To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
From: annejohnholl@gmail.com
Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2011 15:21:27 +0000
Subject: [Amel] Dolphin Battery Chargers
Hi Ian and Judy, My boat is only a few weeks older than yours and has two chargers,30 and 50 amp.I had a problem with one and sent it back to Reya who repaired it and sent it back promptly and so far as I recall it was not very expensive.I removed the circuit board and only sent that to reduce weight. The company is in the S of France and the web site is Reya. com. Email export at reya.com but my contact was an Irish girl lucy.kelly at reya.com The phone no is 0033 0493904700.
The man who had his electronics destroyed by a lightning strike got new ones at the expense of his insurers and perhaps you could do the same as you have an agents report that yours is irrepairable. From memory the standard SM only had a 30amp charger and the 50 was an extra. I have little doubt that if I had to replace my chargers I would go for the 100 amp version The modern versions are a bit different and and have an adjustment for the type of battery with a choice of about 6 or 7 types.The instruction manuals for the current models is on the Reya web site. Incidentally when I had mine repaired I asked them to make it as their standard model as I had little faith that the Amel version was as good as the Reya version.
Happy charging, Anne and John, Bali Hai, SM 319
------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

-->

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: [Amel] Dolphin Battery Chargers

jlm@jlmertz.fr
 

*The best is to disconnect one or best the 2 poles direct in the battery
box.
*
1- I found my electrical installation is to dangerous (If I go away and
switch the battery to off there was power in the boat !!! ) and I
changed it definitely.
2- On this occasion I took the opportunity to leave only the bilge pump
powered at all times (which wasn't the case on CottonBay ! )

JLuc
------------------------------------------------------------------------


Le 18/03/2011 08:54, Ian & Judy Jenkins a écrit :


Thanks, JeanLuc. I shall bear that in mind, though on this occasion,
as I am away from the boat, the good Sergio is sorting it out for me.
Incidentally, he sticks to a pretty basic rule which I have not seen
written anywhere else--whenever he disconnects wires he always
disconnects the negative wire first. Similarly, when connecting he
always connects the positive wire first. Is this the correct sequence?
it seems such an elementary point that I would have expected it to
appear in any handbook on electricity. Cheers, Ian and Judy, Pen Azen,
SM 302, Spain

To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>
From: jlm@jlmertz.fr <mailto:jlm%40jlmertz.fr>
Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2011 07:46:38 +0100
Subject: Re: [Amel] Dolphin Battery Chargers

I had on my 50A charger some problems,
if you are able to repair electronic you can do,
if not send it to the manufacturer.

If you send it to the manufacturer*be VERY careful on my SM316 if you
disconnect the battery with the 2 switches placed in the corridor the
battery voltage is NOT DISCONNECTED from the charger => BIG DANGER* ! .

JLuc
----------------------------------------------------------

Le 17/03/2011 18:22, Ian & Judy Jenkins a écrit :


Hi Anne and John, Thanks for that. I suspect that the Spanish
distributor had his eye on the main chance--I have since found out
that the modern replacement sold by Reya is priced by them at 851
Euros ( much the same price as in 2003). As a matter of interest why
would you prefer the 100 Ah version? The Reya website recommends
their
Model 30, Code 299712, as being appropriate for a battery capacity of
500AH, 24 volt. " Model 30" seems to be based on the fact that the
maximum output on the DC side is 30A. Ah, the black art of marine
electrics... Cheers, Ian and Judy, Pen Azen, SM 302, Spain


To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>
From: annejohnholl@gmail.com <mailto:annejohnholl%40gmail.com>
<mailto:annejohnholl%40gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2011 15:21:27 +0000
Subject: [Amel] Dolphin Battery Chargers

Hi Ian and Judy, My boat is only a few weeks older than yours and
has two chargers,30 and 50 amp.I had a problem with one and sent it
back to Reya who repaired it and sent it back promptly and so far
as I
recall it was not very expensive.I removed the circuit board and only
sent that to reduce weight. The company is in the S of France and the
web site is Reya. com. Email export at reya.com but my contact was an
Irish girl lucy.kelly at reya.com The phone no is 0033 0493904700.
The man who had his electronics destroyed by a lightning strike got
new ones at the expense of his insurers and perhaps you could do the
same as you have an agents report that yours is irrepairable. From
memory the standard SM only had a 30amp charger and the 50 was an
extra. I have little doubt that if I had to replace my chargers I
would go for the 100 amp version The modern versions are a bit
different and and have an adjustment for the type of battery with a
choice of about 6 or 7 types.The instruction manuals for the current
models is on the Reya web site. Incidentally when I had mine repaired
I asked them to make it as their standard model as I had little faith
that the Amel version was as good as the Reya version.
Happy charging, Anne and John, Bali Hai, SM 319



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]