Date   

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Bulge in Engine Hatch Cover and elsewhere.

Ian Shepherd
 


Ian Shepherd SM2K Crusader (2003) Larnaca Cyprus
Thank you Bill and Joel for your input. It would now seem that the cause of the engine room hatch cover bulges is actually caused by corrosion of the steel reinforcement plate which becomes exposed to moisture after cracks appear in the gelcoat around the strut fixing area. It would therefore seem logical that it would be better to cut out the metal altogether and go for the stainless plates on both sides fix. I hope that Rizza will agree to repairing the problem this way. It's a shame that mild steel was chosen in the design. Better still to have used a non ferrous material. There are plenty out there.

Regards

Ian Shepherd SM2K 414 Crusader (2203) Cyprus

On 20/03/2015 22:47, 'Joel Potter' jfpottercys@... [amelyachtowners] wrote:

 

Several years ago, I supervised the repairs to a SM 53, that I had sold, on the bulging bumps on the engine room hatch/cockpit sole.

First, the metal parts laminated into the hatch are simple mild steel and not stainless steel/inox. I am fairly confident that the reason they get wet and expand as they corrode is because the gel coat gets fissure cracks from being loaded/unloaded as the hatch is opened and closed.

When I opened and removed the fiberglass from the area where the plates are on the inside, sure enough, the steel was ’blooming’ as most metals do when they oxidize. I decided to cut the metal and the faux teak covered fiberglass out completely, as the fiberglass was severely weakened by the expanding metal it was unable to contain. I must add that this was an extreme case, much worse than anything I ever saw before or since.

I had two plates made of stainless steel with four vertical fasteners/bolts in the corners for the exterior part of the repair and two matching counterparts for the inside part with appropriate holes drilled to receive the bolts with nut fasteners. I re-laminated a fiberglass ‘plug’ in situ, mainly to fill the hole in the hatch and to insure water tight integrity. The flat plate stainless that were mounted horizontally over the plug/patch extended outboard of the patch by a good margin to acquire structurally sound fiberglass on to which to spread the loads imposed by the strut cylinders. It didn’t look too bad and almost looked like it belonged there from day one. Almost…

The only hair in the pudding is I can’t remember who’s boat I did this on many years ago so I can’t advise on how the repair matured. If you own the boat with this repair, please remind me of who you are and how the repair has done over the years.

My best advice to my Amel Brethren is to monitor the situation. If you notice more cracks in the area of the embedded steel or it you notice more flexing in this area when opening or closing the hatch, take some action based on a good sound repair that I am hopeful I have described.

Now, what did I have for breakfast and where are my reading glasses…

I have been loving everything Amel since 1981.

All The Best, Joel

Joel F. Potter/Cruising Yacht Specialist LLC

THE AMEL GUY

954 462 5869

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Friday, March 20, 2015 11:25 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Bulge in Engine Hatch Cover and elsewhere.

Ian,

Mine started on the port side, followed by the starboard side about a year later.

Bill

BeBe 387

On Fri, Mar 20, 2015 at 1:08 PM, Ian Shepherd sv_freespirit@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@... > wrote:

I too am suffering from the engine room hatch bulge. What I find rather odd is:

1/ The bulge is only on the port side. I believe it was the same on Bill's boat when I met up with him.

2/ Considering that Amel produced nearly 500 SM's, why did this apparent weakness not show up years before? Was there a change in the hatch design/construction method that, it would seem, only affects the later boats?

I replaced both my struts about 5 years ago. I could only find 300 Newton rated struts in Turkey which are weaker than the 400N originals. They hold the hatch open fine but you have to lower the hatch the last couple of feet by the rope handle. Despite the lesser resistance to closing, I still have the problem.

I tend to agree with Eric and Gerhard that it is more than strut pressure that is causing the problem. After all, when the hatch is closed 99.9% of the time, there should be no upward pressure caused by the strut. If it were so, why only on the port side? Maybe others have bulges on both sides?

Ian Shepherd SM2K Crusader (2003) Larnaca Cyprus

On 19/03/2015 10:16, Beaute Olivier atlanticyachtsurvey@... [amelyachtowners] wrote:

Good morning everybody,

Inside the GRP, there is a metal insert (steel). I think the bulge is caused by the force of the strut, that is huge when you start to push the hatch back down. After several hundreds of shut down actions, the bulge appears.

In my opinion, the best way to cure this is to install one stainless steel plate on each side of the GRP, the top one polished with welded screws underneath, the bottom one with holes. Make the bottom one as wide as possible.

Some of you will think that the stainless steel plate is not very nice. I think that a polished plate is not worse than any piece of hardware that you have on the deck...

Olivier

On Wednesday, March 18, 2015 4:03 AM, "sailormon kimberlite@... [amelyachtowners]" wrote:

What I hear here is that even though the plates have been installed the bulge has not gone down. I believe there is something else in play.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2015 2:59 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Bulge in Engine Hatch Cover and elsewhere.

Hello Gerhard,

The repair is well known and you can have it done by Riza Cagdas at Emek Marine in Goček Turkey.

Every report indicates a good repair.

Cheers,

Jean-Pierre Germain

SY Eleuthera, SM 007.

On 17 Mar 2015, at 07:40, pepinoamel <no_reply@... > wrote:

Hi Joel Potter & Olivier Beaute,

Maybe one of you can chime in and explain to us how to properly rectify the problem with the bulge on the engine hatch cover. I also have the bulge and have been considering putting stainless steel plates on the inside as some others have done but I cannot see any compression or stress cracks on the inside where the struts are mounted. That makes me think there might be something else at play and not just the force from the struts pushing it through to the outside. Is there corrosive metal built into the hatch?

Your or anybody elses input would be much appreciated.

Gerhard Hoffmann

SM381, Pepino

Greece

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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Ground Behind Nav Station

karkauai
 

On my Sterling charger/inverter there is an internal connection between the DC neg and the case.  If you connect the grounding post on the case to the bonding system, you have your connection.  I think most charger/inverters are wired this way.  I've removed this piece of equipment from the boat.

Kent
SM243
Kristy




On Apr 13, 2015, at 9:20 AM, 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Alan,

 

Thanks for the response. I have a couple of issues going on here. Connected to this terminal are the yellow/green wires. Because there is  24v between these and the pos(+). I understand now I have a connection somewhere that needs to be looked for and broken.

 

However, when testing the Gnd solid green wire from the Furuno heading sensor (for the Furuno radar unit), I disconnected the green wire from this terminal (behind the nav station) and I get 24v. This is also true for the green wire coming off the 30 amp battery charger. This is telling me that both the battery charger and the heading sensor have internal connections from Neg(-) to the ground wires. This doesn’t seem right?

 

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Super Maramu 2000

Hull #275

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2015 8:37 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Ground Behind Nav Station

 

 

Hi Mark,

Somewhere you have a device that has an internal connection between 24V -ve and ground.

Suspects are inverters, DC-DC converters, alternators, radios....

I would suggest disconnecting the ground wires of these one by one until you find the culprit.

No DC -ve should be connected to ground anywhere on an Amel  

Cheers

Alan

Elyse SM437

 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Ground Behind Nav Station

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Mark,

I see that you are getting a lot of good help. I will try to answer your question anyway.

I am not so sure that the Furuno Heading sensor was original. It was not something Amel installed on BeBe. I have seen it installed on 54's, but I have not see one on SM's. I installed one on BeBe and it definitely is not connected to the bonding system.

As I understand the bonding system, it connects all metal objects that can come in contact with sea water together then connects those items to sacrificial zincs. There is no reason that I can imagine to have anything else connected. 

BILL
BeBe

On Mon, Apr 13, 2015 at 2:22 PM, 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Bill,

 

Thank you as always for taking the time. Am I correct in that the Green/Yellow wires should NOT have any connection to the battery neg(-)?

 

I really wish I understood this better. But no time like the present to learn. The part that makes me scratch my head on this is the Furuno heading sensor (which I am assuming is original)

 

Yes, please photo the original terminal for me. Thanks again.

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Super Maramu 2000

Hull #275

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2015 7:55 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Ground Behind Nav Station

 

 

Mark,

I don't have the answers that you are looking for.

If I were to guess, my guess would be that some electric device has been added to the battery bank and its case connected to the bonding system. For example, when I first moved on the boat, I noticed some green/yellow wires that were purposefully terminated near the SSB and GPS. Each of these devices had a ground lug and it appeared to me that the installer forgot to connect the yellow/green wire. This voice inside my head told me, "don't fix what you do not understand." I left them as they were, while another voice was telling me to connect them. It could be something that simple.

The issue is that many device cases are connected (grounded)  to the (-) side of the DC power. In thias situation, when you connect the green/yellow bonding wire to the case, you have also connected the (-) pole of the battery bank to the bonding system.

Hopefully I have given you some places to look.

Also, I looked at that terminal block photo. It appears to me that a lot has been added there.  And it appears that most are unlabeled. I would disconnect all of the leads, check your battery bank (+) to the bonding yellow/green and see if that voltage disappeared. If it did, reconnect 1 set +&- at a time to find the device. Each time you connect one, label it.  If disconnecting all of them did not locate your problem, still reconnect one at a time and label it. You might consider connecting a multiple fused-block to the ori ginal terminal block, then connect each item to its own fuse. Neater and better. Something like this with a negative bus: https://www.bluesea.com/products/5025/ST_Blade_Fuse_Block_-_6_Circuits_with_Negative_Bus_and_Cover

OK, I have filled your available time for a week. If you like, I will take a photo of that terminal block as it came from Amel because I have not added anything. Let me know.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+39 333 121 8115 Italy Mobile
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Ground Behind Nav Station

karkauai
 

Hi Mark,
I have purchased a silver/silver chloride probe (look on boat zincs dot com) which is used with your multimeter to check "hull potential".  It was about $125 U.S. plus shipping, and is the least expensive way to see if you have a current leak.
My understanding is that even if you have some inappropriate connections between battery and bonding systems, you may not have a problem...yet.  It may take a fault in some electrical component to get the destructive current leak.  
If you check hull potential and find a leak, it would be prudent to stop everything and find the problem.
If hull potential is normal you have more time to sort it all out.
It is recommended that I check hull potential every time I add or replace equipment, tie up to a new dock, change anchorage, and once a month even if nothing has changed.  If it shows a problem, investigate further.

I'm still in the process of going through all electrical gear on the boat to check connections.  It's a lot of crawling around, but I'm learning where all the wires run and how things work.  

Since correcting the problems with the charger and bonding of the CDrive and engine, I don't see any  voltage between the batteries (12 or 24V).  It will be interesting to see what I find when we're back in the water and I can use my new  hull potential monitor.

I'm still learning, so if anyone sees something here that doesn't look right, please chime in.
Kent
SM243
Kristy




On Apr 13, 2015, at 8:22 AM, 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Bill,

 

Thank you as always for taking the time. Am I correct in that the Green/Yellow wires should NOT have any connection to the battery neg(-)?

 

I really wish I understood this better. But no time like the present to learn. The part that makes me scratch my head on this is the Furuno heading sensor (which I am assuming is original)

 

Yes, please photo the original terminal for me. Thanks again.

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Super Maramu 2000

Hull #275

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2015 7:55 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Ground Behind Nav Station

 

 

Mark,

I don't have the answers that you are looking for.

If I were to guess, my guess would be that some electric device has been added to the battery bank and its case connected to the bonding system. For example, when I first moved on the boat, I noticed some green/yellow wires that were purposefully terminated near the SSB and GPS. Each of these devices had a ground lug and it appeared to me that the installer forgot to connect the yellow/green wire. This voice inside my head told me, "don't fix what you do not understand." I left them as they were, while another voice was telling me to connect them. It could be something that simple.

The issue is that many device cases are connected (grounded)  to the (-) side of the DC power. In thias situation, when you connect the green/yellow bonding wire to the case, you have also connected the (-) pole of the battery bank to the bonding system.

Hopefully I have given you some places to look.

Also, I looked at that terminal block photo. It appears to me that a lot has been added there.  And it appears that most are unlabeled. I would disconnect all of the leads, check your battery bank (+) to the bonding yellow/green and see if that voltage disappeared. If it did, reconnect 1 set +&- at a time to find the device. Each time you connect one, label it.  If disconnecting all of them did not locate your problem, still reconnect one at a time and label it. You might consider connecting a multiple fused-block to the original terminal block, then connect each item to its own fuse. Neater and better. Something like this with a negative bus: https://www.bluesea.com/products/5025/ST_Blade_Fuse_Block_-_6_Circuits_with_Negative_Bus_and_Cover

OK, I have filled your available time for a week. If you like, I will take a photo of that terminal block as it came from Amel because I have not added anything. Let me know.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+39 333 121 8115 Italy Mobile
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail


Re: Ground Behind Nav Station

amelliahona <no_reply@...>
 

Hi Mark:

I visited your boat web site, very cool.  Reading the "Frustration" post made me laugh out loud.  Sooooo… familiar.

As to the bonding system and seeing voltage on the green wires, I will offer an opinion.  The bonding system on our Amel's is there to protect various metal parts that are (or may be in some way) in contact with seawater from stray current.  The theory is that IF all metal objects are "bonded" (i.e. connected together with a wire) there will be no difference in voltage between any of the items.  Where there is no difference in voltage there can be no current flow (voltage is EMF or electromotive force and it takes a force to move something, in this case it takes a force to move electrons thru a wire. Electrons moving thru the wire is the definition of current (measured in amperes miliamperes).  So with all metal objects that are in contact with seawater "equipotential" due to bonding then no current will flow.  In actuality there is always small amounts of current flowing just due to leakage current and also to galvanic cell current due to dissimilar metals etc.  That is why the bonding system is tied to a sacrificial anode, so that any stray current is conducted to the anode and it corrodes (sacrificially) and prevents more nobel metals from corroding.  The bonding wire provides a low resistance path for the stray current to reach the anodes rather than finding a pathway to the seawater via other metals, for example Kent's C-drive prop shaft.  

Generally there should not be voltage measurable on the case of an electrical appliance (Furuno Radar or other). 

To check this, 
1.  disconnect the green wire from the case (stud) of the Furuno and other item (I can't remember what it was), 
2.  then, with power disconnected from the appliance measure the continuity (ohms set on a low ohm setting) between the grounding stud and the negative pin of the power cord (AGAIN, WITH THE POWER REMOVED FROM THE APPLIANCE).  
3.  then, with the appliance ON measure for significant voltage between the power supply positive and the ground stud of the appliance (WITH THE GREEN WIRE DISCONNECTED, SO YOU ARE JUST LOOKING AT THE CASE OF THE APPLIANCE and not some other sneak circuit) 

There should be high resistance (nearly infinite) between the power supply ground and the grounding stud.  If there is low resistance OR if there is voltage measured between the stud and the positive power lead,  then the appliance ground stud SHOULD NOT be connected to the bonding system (in my opinion).  The above finding would indicate that the grounding stud is connected to the appliance power ground (perhaps intentionally by the manufacturer perhaps for electrical hazard or lightning damage protection) or there is a faulty connection within the appliance.  Either way, it is my opinion, that you do not want line voltage (24 VDC in this case) to be present on the bonding system.  That would create an EMF on the bonding circuit, causing current to flow, and at the very least, depleting your sacrificial anodes. 

Every time I launch into one of these explanations I fear that I will create more confusion than I solve, so if something isn't clear here let me know. 

Sincerely, 

Gary Silver
s/v Liahona  - USVI



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Ground Behind Nav Station

Mark Erdos
 

Hi Alan,

 

Thanks for the response. I have a couple of issues going on here. Connected to this terminal are the yellow/green wires. Because there is  24v between these and the pos(+). I understand now I have a connection somewhere that needs to be looked for and broken.

 

However, when testing the Gnd solid green wire from the Furuno heading sensor (for the Furuno radar unit), I disconnected the green wire from this terminal (behind the nav station) and I get 24v. This is also true for the green wire coming off the 30 amp battery charger. This is telling me that both the battery charger and the heading sensor have internal connections from Neg(-) to the ground wires. This doesn’t seem right?

 

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Super Maramu 2000

Hull #275

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2015 8:37 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Ground Behind Nav Station

 

 

Hi Mark,

Somewhere you have a device that has an internal connection between 24V -ve and ground.

Suspects are inverters, DC-DC converters, alternators, radios....

I would suggest disconnecting the ground wires of these one by one until you find the culprit.

No DC -ve should be connected to ground anywhere on an Amel  

Cheers

Alan

Elyse SM437

 


aft bulk head leak

zetta.traill@...
 

Hi. We have a water problem on our '80 Sharki. When it rains there is water pouring onto the aft bulk head.

We presume it is water running down the mizzen mast and somehow getting onto the bulkhead.

Does anyone have any experience with this.

Thankyou,

Warren and Zetta

Manon2

Sharki 15


Re: Ground Behind Nav Station

Alan Leslie
 

Sorry Mark / Bill

I've just seen Bill's posts...good advice...

Cheers
Alan


Re: Ground Behind Nav Station

Alan Leslie
 

Hi Mark,
Somewhere you have a device that has an internal connection between 24V -ve and ground.
Suspects are inverters, DC-DC converters, alternators, radios....
I would suggest disconnecting the ground wires of these one by one until you find the culprit.
No DC -ve should be connected to ground anywhere on an Amel  
Cheers
Alan
Elyse SM437


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Ground Behind Nav Station

Mark Erdos
 

Bill,

 

Thank you as always for taking the time. Am I correct in that the Green/Yellow wires should NOT have any connection to the battery neg(-)?

 

I really wish I understood this better. But no time like the present to learn. The part that makes me scratch my head on this is the Furuno heading sensor (which I am assuming is original)

 

Yes, please photo the original terminal for me. Thanks again.

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Super Maramu 2000

Hull #275

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2015 7:55 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Ground Behind Nav Station

 

 

Mark,

I don't have the answers that you are looking for.

If I were to guess, my guess would be that some electric device has been added to the battery bank and its case connected to the bonding system. For example, when I first moved on the boat, I noticed some green/yellow wires that were purposefully terminated near the SSB and GPS. Each of these devices had a ground lug and it appeared to me that the installer forgot to connect the yellow/green wire. This voice inside my head told me, "don't fix what you do not understand." I left them as they were, while another voice was telling me to connect them. It could be something that simple.

The issue is that many device cases are connected (grounded)  to the (-) side of the DC power. In thias situation, when you connect the green/yellow bonding wire to the case, you have also connected the (-) pole of the battery bank to the bonding system.

Hopefully I have given you some places to look.

Also, I looked at that terminal block photo. It appears to me that a lot has been added there.  And it appears that most are unlabeled. I would disconnect all of the leads, check your battery bank (+) to the bonding yellow/green and see if that voltage disappeared. If it did, reconnect 1 set +&- at a time to find the device. Each time you connect one, label it.  If disconnecting all of them did not locate your problem, still reconnect one at a time and label it. You might consider connecting a multiple fused-block to the original terminal block, then connect each item to its own fuse. Neater and better. Something like this with a negative bus: https://www.bluesea.com/products/5025/ST_Blade_Fuse_Block_-_6_Circuits_with_Negative_Bus_and_Cover

OK, I have filled your available time for a week. If you like, I will take a photo of that terminal block as it came from Amel because I have not added anything. Let me know.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+39 333 121 8115 Italy Mobile
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Ground Behind Nav Station

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Mark,

And look close at that inverter. There is no reason for it to be connected to the bonding system.  Disconnect it completely and see if your problem with the voltage you described goes away.

A suspect place for crossing the bonding to the 24 volt (-) may be at the 24V alternator. Best way I can think of is to disconnect it completely and check.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+39 333 121 8115 Italy Mobile
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail

On Apr 13, 2015 1:54 PM, "Bill & Judy Rouse" <yahoogroups@...> wrote:

Mark,

I don't have the answers that you are looking for.

If I were to guess, my guess would be that some electric device has been added to the battery bank and its case connected to the bonding system. For example, when I first moved on the boat, I noticed some green/yellow wires that were purposefully terminated near the SSB and GPS. Each of these devices had a ground lug and it appeared to me that the installer forgot to connect the yellow/green wire. This voice inside my head told me, "don't fix what you do not understand." I left them as they were, while another voice was telling me to connect them. It could be something that simple.

The issue is that many device cases are connected (grounded)  to the (-) side of the DC power. In thias situation, when you connect the green/yellow bonding wire to the case, you have also connected the (-) pole of the battery bank to the bonding system.

Hopefully I have given you some places to look.

Also, I looked at that terminal block photo. It appears to me that a lot has been added there.  And it appears that most are unlabeled. I would disconnect all of the leads, check your battery bank (+) to the bonding yellow/green and see if that voltage disappeared. If it did, reconnect 1 set +&- at a time to find the device. Each time you connect one, label it.  If disconnecting all of them did not locate your problem, still reconnect one at a time and label it. You might consider connecting a multiple fused-block to the original terminal block, then connect each item to its own fuse. Neater and better. Something like this with a negative bus: https://www.bluesea.com/products/5025/ST_Blade_Fuse_Block_-_6_Circuits_with_Negative_Bus_and_Cover

OK, I have filled your available time for a week. If you like, I will take a photo of that terminal block as it came from Amel because I have not added anything. Let me know.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+39 333 121 8115 Italy Mobile
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail


Tecpro 24v 50A Battery Charger

marmitage73@...
 

Hi

 

I have  a SM with a Tecpro 24v 50A battery charger. If the battery is low and this charger is switched on, initially the charge current is quite high but very quickly reduces to a trickle.

I wonder if anyone has experience of this? I think it maybe the 'sense' voltage adjustment but I've had a look inside - there are 3 potentiometers but they re nit marked and I don't want to risk damaging the batteries.

Does anyone have any ideas or diagrams please?

 

Regards

 

Malcolm

SM117


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Ground Behind Nav Station

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Mark,

I don't have the answers that you are looking for.

If I were to guess, my guess would be that some electric device has been added to the battery bank and its case connected to the bonding system. For example, when I first moved on the boat, I noticed some green/yellow wires that were purposefully terminated near the SSB and GPS. Each of these devices had a ground lug and it appeared to me that the installer forgot to connect the yellow/green wire. This voice inside my head told me, "don't fix what you do not understand." I left them as they were, while another voice was telling me to connect them. It could be something that simple.

The issue is that many device cases are connected (grounded)  to the (-) side of the DC power. In thias situation, when you connect the green/yellow bonding wire to the case, you have also connected the (-) pole of the battery bank to the bonding system.

Hopefully I have given you some places to look.

Also, I looked at that terminal block photo. It appears to me that a lot has been added there.  And it appears that most are unlabeled. I would disconnect all of the leads, check your battery bank (+) to the bonding yellow/green and see if that voltage disappeared. If it did, reconnect 1 set +&- at a time to find the device. Each time you connect one, label it.  If disconnecting all of them did not locate your problem, still reconnect one at a time and label it. You might consider connecting a multiple fused-block to the original terminal block, then connect each item to its own fuse. Neater and better. Something like this with a negative bus: https://www.bluesea.com/products/5025/ST_Blade_Fuse_Block_-_6_Circuits_with_Negative_Bus_and_Cover

OK, I have filled your available time for a week. If you like, I will take a photo of that terminal block as it came from Amel because I have not added anything. Let me know.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+39 333 121 8115 Italy Mobile
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Sonic Speed transducer repair/replacement - how?

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

I have mentioned this before, but for the sake of those who did not see it, there is an alternative to drilling for a paddlewheel.

Tinley Electronics in the UK manufactures a black box that coverts NMEA GPS SOG to B&G paddlewheel SOW. All of the functions, instruments, and logs will work perfectly. The only downside is that your speed will be true speed and you will not see any Drift, or difference between SOW & SOG. However, we all know that when you arrive at your destination is based on SOG, and knowing the SOW and the Drift/Current only enables frustration, or, in the case of positive current, it enables false joy of false speed. This Tinley black box is a standard stocked item and is referred to as NMEA GPS to B&G. It connects to the B&G computer at the nav station where the paddle wheel would connect, connects to 12VDC at the same place the B&G instrument connects, and connects to NMEA OUT from any GPS.

Contact Sarah Pidgley at Sarah"at" Tinley.net and tell her hello from Bill BeBe.

Oh, and BTW, Tinley will repair unrepairable B&G instruments and has an inventory of used instruments and parts. They will also build custom black boxes that will do almost anything.

I hope this will helpsome of you.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+39 333 121 8115 Italy Mobile
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail

On Apr 13, 2015 6:11 AM, "sangaris@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

At the last Miami and Ft Lauderdale boat shows I spent a good deal of time with the B&G folks - both a product development engineer and sales team managers - all asserted that the Sonic Speed is no longer a supported product and is not offered as a current product. They also stated it is not compatible with the new H5000 system.  Don't know if the UK scene is different, but suspect not. A shame as my Sonic Speed was always bullet proof and after recent lightning damage I'm having to switch to the paddlewheel version.

Craig Briggs
SN#68, Sangaris, Ft Lauderdale


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: SSB HF Antenna

Peter Forbes
 

Thanks Gary - very helpful.

Best wishes

Peter Forbes
00447836 209730

On 12 Apr 2015, at 17:23, amelliahona <no_reply@...> wrote:

 

Hi Peter:  


I just saw your post on the SSB whip antenna.  The plastic mounting ball at the base of my original Amel fitted SSB antenna failed and was un-repairable.  I was in St. Thomas, USVI at the time and ordered a replacement Shakespeare 23 ft, Series 390, SSB antenna through Island Marine Outfitters, http://shakespeare-marine.com/390

 

The antenna comes with a 1 inch threaded base that screws onto this base fitting http://shakespeare-marine.com/410-r-swivel-mount  .  So as not to have to drill new holes in the deck, I used the existing aluminum 4 screw base mount and with an appropriate sized washer and nut, the 1 inch threaded antenna swivel base mount attached to the existing Amel deck fitting.  Everything else remained the same and the reception/transmission, if anything is improved.

I remove the antenna and stow it belowdecks during hurricane season and the threaded base makes this a very quick and easy task compared to the fiddly pin mount of the original antenna.

All the best, 

Gary Silver
s/v Liahona   Amel SM #335


 


Re: Sonic Speed transducer repair/replacement - how?

Craig Briggs
 

At the last Miami and Ft Lauderdale boat shows I spent a good deal of time with the B&G folks - both a product development engineer and sales team managers - all asserted that the Sonic Speed is no longer a supported product and is not offered as a current product. They also stated it is not compatible with the new H5000 system.  Don't know if the UK scene is different, but suspect not. A shame as my Sonic Speed was always bullet proof and after recent lightning damage I'm having to switch to the paddlewheel version.
Craig Briggs
SN#68, Sangaris, Ft Lauderdale


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Hi Ross

sailormon <kimberlite@...>
 

Should be back in Huntington end of June early July.

Lets hook up.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Thursday, April 09, 2015 5:39 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Hi Ross

 

 

Yes Eric, double yuk...moving to a mooring in bayside for the summer.


Sonic Speed transducer repair/replacement - how?

Colin - ex SV Island Pearl
 

We have moved Gary's comment into a new topic so we can track this thread in future.


On #332 our B&G Sonic speed has recently started playing up with readings either too high or too low randomly. We assume that this would also impact our log distance readings too. We think this problem started after we last slipped the boat because, if you position the front boat lift strap exactly in line with the recommended lift points/large stainless/rigging boat lift hook position, then unfortunately that has the boatyard lift machine strap wrapped over the forward sonic transducer!! Unfortunately we only realised this too late when lowering the hull on the hard. Whilst we could see no damage, we now have unreliable boat speed readings.


Like Gary on #335, this is the only current problem with out boat and we would like to get it resolved as we found this sonic speed and log extremely accurate on the Atlantic and Pacific crossings, and therefore do not want to go to the paddle wheel option if at all possible.


Has anyone replaced these with new B&G sonic equipment or managed to fix a similar problem with the sonic speed/log equipment? 


Colin & Lauren Streeter

Island Pearl II, SM#332

Newport, QLD, Australia 

  



From: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups. com [mailto:amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups.comOn Behalf Of amelliahona
Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2015 7:19 PM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups. com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Bill- water tank vent

 

 

Hi all:

 

The hose in photo number 4 (labeled tank vent), is NOT a tank vent. It is a hose that exits at the inboard edge of the the aft locker under the table in the saloon.  

 

If you look closely in the picture, and you can check this on your own boat, you can make out that there is an electrical cable inside the hose.  I asked Olivier about this hose when we took deliver y of the boat and he indicated that the hose was there to protect the cable inside, and that cable is the sonic speed indicator sensor/transmitter that is imbedded in the leading edge of the stub keel (i.e. the lower aft transducer of the two sonic speed transducers). At the forward end of the hose the cable exits and traversed starboard to route to the sonic speed computer that is strapped under the shelf in the forward lower cupboard beside the starboard side saloon seat.

 

Olivier, if you see this, can you shed some light on how it might be possible (or not possible) to replace the sonic speed sensors (both in the stub-keel and the forward hull).  It seems many of us have had failure of the transducers.  Are the sensors in some sort of conduit that allow them to be pulled and replaced?  

 

All the best, 

 

Gary Silver

s/v Liahona  

lying Sapphire Bay Marina, St. Thomas,  USVI



Ground Behind Nav Station

Mark Erdos
 

Hi all,

 

I need a little help please from the electrical minded people please. I’ll be the first to admit most of what was posted regarding Ground and bond circuits on this forum is over my head (for now).

 

After reading Kent’s issue’s I am concerned since Cream Puff was also repowered with a Yanmar 4JH4-HTE and also has an 220v inverter installed. I am not sure if the inverter was factory installed or after market. While I hope the previous owner hired a mechanic/electrician that was schooled on Amel, I do not know for sure this was the case. Kent’s phrase “It is almost certain that my problem was caused by a combination of very poorly installed charger/inverter by a marine electrician and improperly bonded CDrive by the people who installed my new Yanmar.” has made me worry a little.

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/pkpzhtr8y7riyvb/DSCN1123.JPG?dl=0

 

I recently found a circuit that doesn’t seem quite right. Behind the nav desk are the terminals controlled by the VHF/instrument breaker in the hanging locker. See picture by clicking above link. When I test for voltage between the pos(+) and neg(-), I get 24 vdc as expected. But, when I test voltage between the middle ground terminal and pos(+), I still get 24vdc. On the ground terminal is a green wire that goes to a Gnd on a 30 battery charger (exit bottom of pic), a green wire that goes to the Gnd on the Furuno heading sensor (exit top of pc) and 2 green/yellow wires (not sure where these go yet) connected to the terminal.

 

I was under the understanding the green/yellow wires were all part of the bonding system and not connected to the boat ground or neg(-) system. I removed the solid green wires and tested everything individually.

 

Terminal (+) and both green/yellow wires = 24 vdc

Terminal (+) green wire coming from battery charger (disconnected from terminal) = 24 vdc

Terminal (+) green wire coming from Furuno heading sensor (disconnected from terminal) = 24 vdc

 

Since my understanding that I stated above regarding green/yellow wires, I am seriously confused why I have a connection somewhere between the 24vdc neg(-) and these green/yellow wires. Any enlightenment would be greatly appreciated.

 

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Super Maramu 2000

Hull #275

www.creampuff.us

 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Bill- water tank vent

Derick Gates SM2K #400 Brava
 

Gary,

I will be back on Brava June 2nd. Will you still be in St. Thomas then? I would love to meet up if we overlap.

Derick
SM2K #400 Brava
Currently in Sapphire Beach Marina