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Fw: [Amel Yacht Owners] Prop Shaft Electrolysis
Anne and John Hollamby <annejohnholl@...>
Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2014 4:06 PM
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Prop Shaft
Electrolysis
Hi Kent,
I cannot even imagine the problems and expense of changing the
propshaft. The pic that you have shown us looks horrendous but hopefully that is
the whole extent of the damage and if so the reduction in strength should
perhaps be relatively unimportant. Just in case the damage is more extensive I
suggest that you have someone put the engine in gear and turn it over by hand
using a lever between the bolt heads on the pulley for the fan belt and listen
to find out if the bearings/gears in the unit have seized up. This is unlikely
as presumably the engine was used recently to get the boat ashore.
If you examine the wearing out bush you will find that there
is an O ring inside it and this is what keeps the oil in whilst the bush turns
with the prop shaft and the three oil seals on the outside of the bush keep the
oil in when the shaft and bush is turning. Now you need to give the shaft a
‘colonoscopy’ to see how far the shaft is damaged. Car part vendors sell an
endoscope that is small enough to fit down the dip stick tube for about €80
euros and this should do the job. If you are unlucky and the shaft is pitted
further in than the existing O ring position look further on and you may find
that there are positions where an O ring could make a seal and if so then when
you get a new bush you can have a new
groove cut for a second O ring to do the job. If you sleeve
the old wearing out bush as I have done on mine your shaft problem may be
solved without even getting a new bush.
There is clearly an electrolysis problem either arising from
your boat or the marina,neighbours and this must be resolved. You certainly need
to get a really good marine electrician to check your wiring and to install a
galvanic isolator.
I look forward to hearing the result of your endoscopy
examination! Meanwhile I suggest that you get a copy of Nigel Calders book on
boat maintenance, It should become your bible.
Now I must go down to the yard to remove my prop (with
trembling hands).
Best wishes, Anne and John, Bali Hai, SM319,
Malta
Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2014 4:29 AM
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Prop Shaft
Electrolysis
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On Mar 28, 2014, at 11:21 PM, sailormon < kimberlite@...>
wrote:
Kent,
If I recall
correctly, it is not in the books with all the manuals it is (I believe) in
the owners manual with all the colored photos.
Sorry—but I
am not on the boat.
Eric
I looked through everything I have , Eric. I would swear
I've seen that drawing, but I can't find it.
Kent, In
the back of the owners manual there are pages that fold out with plumbing
diagrams, etc and also drawings of the bow thruster, sail drive and many
other drawings.
Do you have
an owners manual?
Fair
Winds
Eric
Kimberlite
SM 376
I don't have it aboard, Eric. If anyone had it I'd
appreciate it if you'd email me a copy . Karkauai at yahoo dot
com.
Kent,
I just
looked for a drawing of the C drive. It must be in the books on
Kimberlite.
From
memory I believe it will be a big job.
Sorry,
Eric
Thanks Eric. Yeah, it's pretty scary. Lucky we
didn't lose the prop. I just discovered it and haven't talked to the
marina yet. I'll have to find out more about the galvanic
isolator...good idea about just turning on shore power once in a
while.
Any idea how to remove the prop shaft?
I'm going to have an electrician go over the boat
looking for stray currents...any suggestions about that
process?
Wow
!!
That
looks awful.
I use a
galvanic isolator on my AC circuit and also have the pedestal turned on
only one day a week. So far in 3 months in the marina in the Caribbean I
have used one kilowatt of electric.
There
is a small zinc on the line cutter, and of course the 2 big ones on the
rudder.
I am
very sorry for the condition of your prop shaft. I believe there should
be a drawing of your c drive in the owners manual . I believe replacing
the shaft is a big project. It is also possible that a neighbor is
putting AC into the water.
Did you
have the marina check your AC outlet on the pedestal and the water
around your boat?
Fair
Winds
Eric
Kimberlite SM
376
I have just hauled Kristy out to repaint the bottom after 2 1/2
years. She's been sitting in the water in a marina at Brunswick GA
for the last 2 years where I've hired a diver to clean the bottom and
replace the zincs as needed every 4-6 weeks. I was surprised to
see no zinc on the prop when we hauled out, and dismayed to see severe
electrolytic corrosion of the prop shaft when I started changing the
seals. I posted a pic at the KristySM243 folder https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/photos/albums/948071197/lightbox/1877878820
I
need advice on what is involved in removing the prop shaft. Is it
necessary to remove the bottom of the drive aft of the keel?
I guess
I'm going to look into isolating the boat
electrically.
Sigh,
Kent
SM243
Currently Tiger Point Marina,
Fernandina Beach,
FL
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
karkauai
Hi John, I hear ya! Just plain dumb neglect. It'll be a long time before I forget about my chain again. Hi to Ruth, looking forward to seeing you this summer. Kent
On Mar 29, 2014, at 9:06 AM, john martin < symoondog@...> wrote:
Kent, I know it won't help you now, but in the future when you get the chain out and problem solved, you should wash the chain with fresh water a couple of times a year. Always when you winterize the boat. I take a hose and open up the access hole and spray fresh water all over the chain and locker compartment and let it air out. In the yard, find a wooden pallet or a piece of plywood and drop the entire chain on it. I hired a small worker one time to actually climb into the locker and scrub out the walls and floor of the locker. Being out of sight, out of mind, not good for anchor chain. JOHN "Moon Dog" SM248
To: amelyachtowners@...From: karkauai@...Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2014 12:03:37 -0700 Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
I've also discovered that the last 100ft or so of my anchor chain is rusted into a huge solid mass in the chain locker. I've sprayed a ton of PB Blaster on it and beat it with a hammer without much success. Right now I'm soaking it in Vinegar.
Any ideas?
Thanks,
Kent
SM 243 Kristy
Currently Tiger Point Marina Fernandina Beach, FL
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
karkauai
Hi Pat, I can't get both arms into the locker thru that small access port. Can't hold the chisel and hammer with one hand. If I had a long enough chisel I could work on the starbord side but not the port side with the center divider in the way. K
On Mar 29, 2014, at 7:34 AM, Patrick Mcaneny < sailw32@...> wrote:
Kent , How about a long chisel and a 3lb. sledge hammer a have at it. Pat
-----Original Message-----
From: Kent Robertson < karkauai@...>
To: amelyachtowners < amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Fri, Mar 28, 2014 6:50 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Never heard of that product Mark, but I'll see if I can find it. Soda blasting would only hot the surface, but maybe could help a bit at a time.
Keep those ideas coming!
Thanks,
Kent
On Mar 28, 2014, at 6:21 PM, Mark Erdos < mcerdos@...> wrote:
Another thought. Since you are in a yard - soda blasting? It would be a mess to clean up but it would probably do the trick.
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
karkauai
Hi Bill. I think the problem was just that I'd turned the chain around when the used part was getting a bit rusty, then it sat in the locker for 2 1/2 years. The drain may have been stopped up by debris from the rusty part of the chain, but when I discovered the problem the locker was dry. I've had my hands full with other projects and just neglected the chain...lesson learned.
It really is difficult keeping up with a boat like ours when you don't live aboard. Maybe one day... Kent
On Mar 29, 2014, at 7:01 AM, < yahoogroups@...> wrote:
Kent,
After you have dealt with the chain problem, I would be very interested in what you think the cause is.
For instance, is it possible that the locker drain was partially clogged causing water to pool in the bottom?
I realize that the cause is of no immediate consideration and the removal has the priority, but if you happen to figure things out, I am sure that more people than me are interested.
Good Luck,
Bill BeBe 387
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
karkauai
Steve, that's a great offer. Unfortunately I'll be working until Friday afternoon, then down for the weekend again. My quick haul and paint has turned into a protracted and complicated stay. If you are free next weekend I'd love the company. Thanks again for your generous offer. Kent
On Mar 29, 2014, at 6:44 AM, < flyboyscd@...> wrote:
Hi Kent, I'm the new owner of Leonora of Sark (now renamed to Aloha) which is currently in Rio Dulce, and we will be bringing her to Brunswick in May. I'm not heading to Rio Dulce until mid April, and live in Palm Coast which is not far from Fernandia Beach. I'm out of town this weekend, but have several days available next week if you would like to meet at the yard, and I'll try and help you with getting your chain out of the locker. I've been following the thread, and I think the muriatic acid may be the best solution. If you can get it out in one piece, there is a place in Jacksonville that can re-galvanize it. I wish I could offer some advice on the shaft, but that is way over my head as a new Amel owner.
The only days I'm not available next week are Monday and Thursday. Let me know if you are interested.
Regards, Steve Davis S/V Aloha SM072
510-908-1835
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Prop Shaft Electrolysis
Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
I am fairly sure that the zinc closest to the bonding will go first. This may be the reason that Amel used the plastic cup on the prop. An engineer should verify this as I speak from personal experience rather than technical knowledge.
In my experience, the zinc closest to the bonding on our rudder seems to be 80% gone while the other is 80% there.
When in a marina we have an additional large block zinc in the water, connected with stainless steel wire. The other end connects with an alligator clip to the yellow/green bonding wire to the fuel filler neck which is inside the starboard mizzen-mast locker...the same locker that has the fresh water hose.
Bill BeBe 386
On Mar 29, 2014, at 4:27 PM, < terencesingh@...> wrote:
Kent, I am curious how long a prop Zinc usually lasts you? We have to change Libby's every 3 months. We have seen this rate of burn in 3 marina's over the last 3 years. No one place better than the other.
Knowing that Amel replaced the prop Zinc with a plastic cap and we burn through that particular Zinc every 3 months concerns me. Our rudder Zincs last a lot longer. 6-8 months. Looking for some logic here.
Terry&Dena Libby San Diego
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Prop Shaft Electrolysis
Giovanni TESTA
Hi to all,
the same to me :
I replace the red plastic cap with original prop zinc
the first year (2004) because in doubt, luckly, and I have to change
it every 3, 4 months...snokerling.
The rudder zincs last 6-8 months. The same with the little
rope cutter zinc..
Buon Vento
Gianni
sv EUTIKIA n 428
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2014 2:27
PM
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Prop
Shaft Electrolysis
Kent, I am curious how long a prop Zinc usually lasts you?
We have to change Libby's every 3 months. We have seen this rate of burn
in 3 marina's over the last 3 years. No one place better than the other.
Knowing that Amel replaced the prop Zinc with a plastic cap and we burn
through that particular Zinc every 3 months concerns me.
Our rudder Zincs last a lot longer. 6-8 months.
Looking for some logic here.
Terry&Dena
Libby
San Diego
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Digest Number 3386
karkauai
Thanks Danny, I'm looking for something like that now. Will probably have to use acid and a jack hammer.
Kent
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On Mar 29, 2014, at 3:01 AM, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS <simms@...> wrote:
Hi Kent,
I like the idea of what I call a jack hammer, you see them on road work sites. Not one that big but they come in all sizes. the smallest are electric and then you move up to air operated. I would go for the biggest you could fit through the locker door and use with one arm.
Hope you work it out OK
Regards
Danny
SM 299 Ocean Pearl
From: Kent Robertson <karkauai@...>
To: "amelyachtowners@..." <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Saturday, 29 March 2014 3:02 PM
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Digest Number 3386
I've looked at the local big box stores for a "chipper" or electric chisel, but haven't found anything. I'll look on line when I get home tomorrow.
Thanks again ,
Kent
Sent from my iPhone
On Mar 28, 2014, at 10:48 PM, Dennis Johns <sbmesasailor@...> wrote:
Do you have access to a tool rental shop? You might try to find an electric "chipper". It's a small, hand-held hammer that accepts various bits. Often used to remove tile from counters/floors. I know you said you have limited access but maybe you can use it with one hand and not have to do the swinging action with a mallet. Another idea is to not use your windlass to haul the chain out but use block and tackle back to your winch. Lifting the whole mass to the top of the chain locker and then dropping it a few times might break it up.
Dennis
sv Libertad
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 7:24 AM, "amelyachtowners@..." <amelyachtowners@...> wrote: Amel Yacht Owners - Forum for owners of Amel sailboats Group
15 Messages Digest #3386
1a Feeling secure by gegcarter
1b Re: Feeling secure by "Kent Robertson" karkauai
1c Re: Feeling secure by "Ann-Sofie Svanberg" ladyannila
2a Prop Shaft Electrolysis by karkauai
2b Re: Prop Shaft Electrolysis by "sailormon" kimberlite1212
3a Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker by karkauai
3b Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker by "haspeter.baettig" hanspeterbaettig
3c Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker by "Kent Robertson" karkauai
3d Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker by "Mark Erdos" captain_cucumber_head
3e Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker by "Mark Erdos" captain_cucumber_head
3f Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker by "Kent Robertson" karkauai
3g Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker by "Ann-Sofie Svanberg" ladyannila
3h Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker by "Kent Robertson" karkauai
3i Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker by "Roque"
3j Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker by "Kent Robertson" karkauai
Messages
1a Feeling secure
Fri Mar 28, 2014 7:42 am (PDT) . Posted by: gegcarter
I have just posted photos of our new security system for the companionway. As you can see the feature can be used both when leaving the boat as a extra strength to locking the companionway and when inside the boat if you want air and wish to leave the companionway open but feel you are staying in perhaps a potentially unsafe anchorage. Arcglow in Almerimar (Spain) can be contacted by email, arcglow@..., if anyone is interested. Keith on Guma
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1b Re: Feeling secure
Fri Mar 28, 2014 2:44 pm (PDT) . Posted by: "Kent Robertson" karkauai
That's a very creative way of solving that issue Keith. I'm impressed. Kent Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 28, 2014, at 10:42 AM, <gegcarter@...> wrote: > > I have just posted photos of our new security system for the companionway. As you can see the feature can be used both when leaving the boat as a extra strength to locking the companionway and when inside the boat if you want air and wish to leave the companionway open but feel you are staying in perhaps a potentially unsafe anchorage. > Arcglow in Almerimar (Spain) can be contacted by email, arcglow@..., if anyone is interested. > > Keith > on Guma > >
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1c Re: Feeling secure
Fri Mar 28, 2014 3:40 pm (PDT) . Posted by: "Ann-Sofie Svanberg" ladyannila
Very nice done! What a good idea! But we can't figure out the lock solution. Can you post a better picture on that? Regards Annsofie & Jonas S/Y Lady Annila. SM 232 Skickat från min iPad > 28 mar 2014 kl. 10:42 skrev gegcarter@...: > > I have just posted photos of our new security system for the companionway. As you can see the feature can be used both when leaving the boat as a extra strength to locking the companionway and when inside the boat if you want air and wish to leave the companionway open but feel you are staying in perhaps a potentially unsafe anchorage. > Arcglow in Almerimar (Spain) can be contacted by email, arcglow@..., if anyone is interested. > > Keith > on Guma > >
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2a Prop Shaft Electrolysis
Fri Mar 28, 2014 12:00 pm (PDT) . Posted by: karkauai
I have just hauled Kristy out to repaint the bottom after 2 1/2 years. She's been sitting in the water in a marina at Brunswick GA for the last 2 years where I've hired a diver to clean the bottom and replace the zincs as needed every 4-6 weeks. I was surprised to see no zinc on the prop when we hauled out, and dismayed to see severe electrolytic corrosion of the prop shaft when I started changing the seals. I posted a pic at the KristySM243 folder https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/photos/albums/948071197/lightbox/1877878820 https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/photos/albums/948071197/lightbox/1877878820 I need advice on what is involved in removing the prop shaft. Is it necessary to remove the bottom of the drive aft of the keel? I guess I'm going to look into isolating the boat electrically. Sigh, Kent SM243 Currently Tiger Point Marina, Fernandina Beach, FL
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2b Re: Prop Shaft Electrolysis
Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:24 pm (PDT) . Posted by: "sailormon" kimberlite1212
Wow !! That looks awful. I use a galvanic isolator on my AC circuit and also have the pedestal turned on only one day a week. So far in 3 months in the marina in the Caribbean I have used one kilowatt of electric. There is a small zinc on the line cutter, and of course the 2 big ones on the rudder. I am very sorry for the condition of your prop shaft. I believe there should be a drawing of your c drive in the owners manual . I believe replacing the shaft is a big project. It is also possible that a neighbor is putting AC into the water. Did you have the marina check your AC outlet on the pedestal and the water around your boat? Fair Winds Eric Kimberlite SM 376 From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of karkauai@... Sent: Friday, March 28, 2014 3:01 PM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Prop Shaft Electrolysis I have just hauled Kristy out to repaint the bottom after 2 1/2 years. She's been sitting in the water in a marina at Brunswick GA for the last 2 years where I've hired a diver to clean the bottom and replace the zincs as needed every 4-6 weeks. I was surprised to see no zinc on the prop when we hauled out, and dismayed to see severe electrolytic corrosion of the prop shaft when I started changing the seals. I posted a pic at the KristySM243 folder https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/photos/albums/948071197/lightbox/1877878820 I need advice on what is involved in removing the prop shaft. Is it necessary to remove the bottom of the drive aft of the keel? I guess I'm going to look into isolating the boat electrically. Sigh, Kent SM243 Currently Tiger Point Marina, Fernandina Beach, FL
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3a Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Fri Mar 28, 2014 12:03 pm (PDT) . Posted by: karkauai
I've also discovered that the last 100ft or so of my anchor chain is rusted into a huge solid mass in the chain locker. I've sprayed a ton of PB Blaster on it and beat it with a hammer without much success. Right now I'm soaking it in Vinegar. Any ideas? Thanks, Kent SM 243 Kristy Currently Tiger Point Marina Fernandina Beach, FL
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3b Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Fri Mar 28, 2014 12:30 pm (PDT) . Posted by: "haspeter.baettig" hanspeterbaettig
Hi Kent buy a new one, safety first best regards Hanspeter Tamango 2 , SM #16 Krusadasi, Turkey (actual with out twitter and youtube, mr erdogan, Prminister of Tukey is a littel bit angry :-) I think to leave Turkey, Greek is only a few miles away Von meinem iPhone gesendet > Am 28.03.2014 um 20:03 schrieb <karkauai@...>: > > I've also discovered that the last 100ft or so of my anchor chain is rusted into a huge solid mass in the chain locker. I've sprayed a ton of PB Blaster on it and beat it with a hammer without much success. Right now I'm soaking it in Vinegar. > Any ideas? > Thanks, > Kent > SM 243 Kristy > Currently Tiger Point Marina Fernandina Beach, FL > >
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3c Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Fri Mar 28, 2014 2:38 pm (PDT) . Posted by: "Kent Robertson" karkauai
Problem is getting the old one out of the chain locker. It won't budge because it's all rusted together. The limited access to the locker means the fix has to be chemical rather than mechanical. Acid would probably do it but fumes from muriatic acid would every toxic. I soaked it vinegar for 24 hrs and no improvement. Need some other suggestions. Kent SM243 Kristy Tiger Point Boat Yard Fernandina Beach FL Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 28, 2014, at 3:30 PM, "haspeter.baettig" <hanspeter.baettig@...> wrote: > > Hi Kent > buy a new one, safety first > best regards > Hanspeter > Tamango 2 , SM #16 > Krusadasi, Turkey > (actual with out twitter and youtube, mr erdogan, Prminister of Tukey is a littel bit angry :-) > I think to leave Turkey, Greek is only a few miles away > > Von meinem iPhone gesendet > >> Am 28.03.2014 um 20:03 schrieb <karkauai@...>: >> >> >> I've also discovered that the last 100ft or so of my anchor chain is rusted into a huge solid mass in the chain locker. I've sprayed a ton of PB Blaster on it and beat it with a hammer without much success. Right now I'm soaking it in Vinegar. >> Any ideas? >> Thanks, >> Kent >> SM 243 Kristy >> Currently Tiger Point Marina Fernandina Beach, FL >> > >
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3d Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Fri Mar 28, 2014 3:18 pm (PDT) . Posted by: "Mark Erdos" captain_cucumber_head
Kent, What about something like Boeshield RustFree Rust and Stain Remover? Perhaps a multiple application to a specific area will give you the break you need to get the ball small enough. Mark SM2K #275 http://www.creampuff.us/ On Fri, Mar 28, 2014 at 5:36 PM, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...> wrote: > > > Problem is getting the old one out of the chain locker. It won't budge > because it's all rusted together. The limited access to the locker means > the fix has to be chemical rather than mechanical. Acid would probably do > it but fumes from muriatic acid would every toxic. I soaked it vinegar for > 24 hrs and no improvement. > Need some other suggestions. > Kent > SM243 Kristy > Tiger Point Boat Yard > Fernandina Beach FL > > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 28, 2014, at 3:30 PM, "haspeter.baettig" < > hanspeter.baettig@...> wrote: > > > > Hi Kent > buy a new one, safety first > best regards > Hanspeter > Tamango 2 , SM #16 > Krusadasi, Turkey > (actual with out twitter and youtube, mr erdogan, Prminister of Tukey is a > littel bit angry :-) > I think to leave Turkey, Greek is only a few miles away > > Von meinem iPhone gesendet > > Am 28.03.2014 um 20:03 schrieb <karkauai@...>: > > > > I've also discovered that the last 100ft or so of my anchor chain is > rusted into a huge solid mass in the chain locker. I've sprayed a ton of > PB Blaster on it and beat it with a hammer without much success. Right now > I'm soaking it in Vinegar. > Any ideas? > Thanks, > Kent > SM 243 Kristy > Currently Tiger Point Marina Fernandina Beach, FL > > >
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3e Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Fri Mar 28, 2014 3:21 pm (PDT) . Posted by: "Mark Erdos" captain_cucumber_head
Another thought. Since you are in a yard - soda blasting? It would be a mess to clean up but it would probably do the trick. Mark SM2K #275 http://www.creampuff.us/ On Fri, Mar 28, 2014 at 5:36 PM, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...> wrote: > > > Problem is getting the old one out of the chain locker. It won't budge > because it's all rusted together. The limited access to the locker means > the fix has to be chemical rather than mechanical. Acid would probably do > it but fumes from muriatic acid would every toxic. I soaked it vinegar for > 24 hrs and no improvement. > Need some other suggestions. > Kent > SM243 Kristy > Tiger Point Boat Yard > Fernandina Beach FL > > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 28, 2014, at 3:30 PM, "haspeter.baettig" < > hanspeter.baettig@...> wrote: > > > > Hi Kent > buy a new one, safety first > best regards > Hanspeter > Tamango 2 , SM #16 > Krusadasi, Turkey > (actual with out twitter and youtube, mr erdogan, Prminister of Tukey is a > littel bit angry :-) > I think to leave Turkey, Greek is only a few miles away > > Von meinem iPhone gesendet > > Am 28.03.2014 um 20:03 schrieb <karkauai@...>: > > > > I've also discovered that the last 100ft or so of my anchor chain is > rusted into a huge solid mass in the chain locker. I've sprayed a ton of > PB Blaster on it and beat it with a hammer without much success. Right now > I'm soaking it in Vinegar. > Any ideas? > Thanks, > Kent > SM 243 Kristy > Currently Tiger Point Marina Fernandina Beach, FL > > >
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3f Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Fri Mar 28, 2014 3:50 pm (PDT) . Posted by: "Kent Robertson" karkauai
Never heard of that product Mark, but I'll see if I can find it. Soda blasting would only hot the surface, but maybe could help a bit at a time. Keep those ideas coming! Thanks, Kent Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 28, 2014, at 6:21 PM, Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote: > > Another thought. Since you are in a yard - soda blasting? It would be a mess to clean up but it would probably do the trick. > > Mark > SM2K #275 > > http://www.creampuff.us/ > > >> On Fri, Mar 28, 2014 at 5:36 PM, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...> wrote: >> >> Problem is getting the old one out of the chain locker. It won't budge because it's all rusted together. The limited access to the locker means the fix has to be chemical rather than mechanical.. Acid would probably do it but fumes from muriatic acid would every toxic. I soaked it vinegar for 24 hrs and no improvement. >> Need some other suggestions. >> Kent >> SM243 Kristy >> Tiger Point Boat Yard >> Fernandina Beach FL >> >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Mar 28, 2014, at 3:30 PM, "haspeter.baettig" <hanspeter.baettig@...> wrote: >>> >>> >>> Hi Kent >>> buy a new one, safety first >>> best regards >>> Hanspeter >>> Tamango 2 , SM #16 >>> Krusadasi, Turkey >>> (actual with out twitter and youtube, mr erdogan, Prminister of Tukey is a littel bit angry :-) >>> I think to leave Turkey, Greek is only a few miles away >>> >>> Von meinem iPhone gesendet >>> >>>> Am 28.03.2014 um 20:03 schrieb <karkauai@...>: >>> > >>> > >>> > I've also discovered that the last 100ft or so of my anchor chain is rusted into a huge solid mass in the chain locker. I've sprayed a ton of PB Blaster on it and beat it with a hammer without much success. Right now I'm soaking it in Vinegar.. >>> > Any ideas? >>> > Thanks, >>> > Kent >>> > SM 243 Kristy >>> > Currently Tiger Point Marina Fernandina Beach, FL >>> > >> > >
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3g Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Fri Mar 28, 2014 4:16 pm (PDT) . Posted by: "Ann-Sofie Svanberg" ladyannila
Sledge hammer??? /Annsofie Lady Annila SM 232 Skickat från min iPad > 28 mar 2014 kl. 18:50 skrev "Kent Robertson" <karkauai@...>: > > Never heard of that product Mark, but I'll see if I can find it. Soda blasting would only hot the surface, but maybe could help a bit at a time. > Keep those ideas coming! > Thanks, > Kent > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 28, 2014, at 6:21 PM, Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote: >> >> >> Another thought. Since you are in a yard - soda blasting? It would be a mess to clean up but it would probably do the trick. >> >> Mark >> SM2K #275 >> >> http://www.creampuff.us/ >> >> >>> On Fri, Mar 28, 2014 at 5:36 PM, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...> wrote: >>> >>> Problem is getting the old one out of the chain locker. It won't budge because it's all rusted together. The limited access to the locker means the fix has to be chemical rather than mechanical. Acid would probably do it but fumes from muriatic acid would every toxic. I soaked it vinegar for 24 hrs and no improvement. >>> Need some other suggestions. >>> Kent >>> SM243 Kristy >>> Tiger Point Boat Yard >>> Fernandina Beach FL >>> >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>>> On Mar 28, 2014, at 3:30 PM, "haspeter.baettig" <hanspeter.baettig@...> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> Hi Kent >>>> buy a new one, safety first >>>> best regards >>>> Hanspeter >>>> Tamango 2 , SM #16 >>>> Krusadasi, Turkey >>>> (actual with out twitter and youtube, mr erdogan, Prminister of Tukey is a littel bit angry :-) >>>> I think to leave Turkey, Greek is only a few miles away >>>> >>>> Von meinem iPhone gesendet >>>> >>>>> Am 28.03.2014 um 20:03 schrieb <karkauai@...>: >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> I've also discovered that the last 100ft or so of my anchor chain is rusted into a huge solid mass in the chain locker. I've sprayed a ton of PB Blaster on it and beat it with a hammer without much success. Right now I'm soaking it in Vinegar. >>> >> Any ideas? >>> >> Thanks, >>> >> Kent >>> >> SM 243 Kristy >>> >> Currently Tiger Point Marina Fernandina Beach, FL >>> >> > >
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3h Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Fri Mar 28, 2014 4:21 pm (PDT) . Posted by: "Kent Robertson" karkauai
Been there and done that. Such a small access that I'm bruised on the arm and ribs from squeezing in there. I hit the mass with a 5 lb hammer and nothing budges! Keep em coming! Kent Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 28, 2014, at 7:16 PM, Ann-Sofie Svanberg <kanalmamman@...> wrote: > > Sledge hammer??? > > /Annsofie > Lady Annila SM 232 > > Skickat från min iPad > >> 28 mar 2014 kl. 18:50 skrev "Kent Robertson" <karkauai@...>: >> >> >> Never heard of that product Mark, but I'll see if I can find it.. Soda blasting would only hot the surface, but maybe could help a bit at a time. >> Keep those ideas coming! >> Thanks, >> Kent >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Mar 28, 2014, at 6:21 PM, Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote: >>> >>> >>> Another thought. Since you are in a yard - soda blasting? It would be a mess to clean up but it would probably do the trick. >>> >>> Mark >>> SM2K #275 >>> >>> http://www.creampuff.us/ >>> >>> >>>> On Fri, Mar 28, 2014 at 5:36 PM, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...> wrote: >>>> >>>> Problem is getting the old one out of the chain locker. It won't budge because it's all rusted together. The limited access to the locker means the fix has to be chemical rather than mechanical. Acid would probably do it but fumes from muriatic acid would every toxic. I soaked it vinegar for 24 hrs and no improvement. >>>> Need some other suggestions. >>>> Kent >>>> SM243 Kristy >>>> Tiger Point Boat Yard >>>> Fernandina Beach FL >>>> >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>>> On Mar 28, 2014, at 3:30 PM, "haspeter.baettig" <hanspeter..baettig@...> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Hi Kent >>>>> buy a new one, safety first >>>>> best regards >>>>> Hanspeter >>>>> Tamango 2 , SM #16 >>>>> Krusadasi, Turkey >>>>> (actual with out twitter and youtube, mr erdogan, Prminister of Tukey is a littel bit angry :-) >>>>> I think to leave Turkey, Greek is only a few miles away >>>>> >>>>> Von meinem iPhone gesendet >>>>> >>>>>> Am 28.03.2014 um 20:03 schrieb <karkauai@...>: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> I've also discovered that the last 100ft or so of my anchor chain is rusted into a huge solid mass in the chain locker. I've sprayed a ton of PB Blaster on it and beat it with a hammer without much success. Right now I'm soaking it in Vinegar. >>> >>> Any ideas? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Kent >>> >>> SM 243 Kristy >>> >>> Currently Tiger Point Marina Fernandina Beach, FL >>> >>> > >
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3i Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:17 pm (PDT) . Posted by: "Roque"
Alternatives to think about: 1. Hydrochloric acid; 2. Heat gun; 3. Electrolysis (maybe you won't have enough room for this) Roque S/Y Atica Amel 54 Em sexta-feira, 28 de março de 2014, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...> escreveu: > > > Been there and done that. Such a small access that I'm bruised on the arm > and ribs from squeezing in there. > I hit the mass with a 5 lb hammer and nothing budges! > Keep em coming! > Kent > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 28, 2014, at 7:16 PM, Ann-Sofie Svanberg <kanalmamman@...<javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','kanalmamman@...');>> > wrote: > > > > Sledge hammer??? > > /Annsofie > Lady Annila SM 232 > > Skickat från min iPad > > 28 mar 2014 kl. 18:50 skrev "Kent Robertson" <karkauai@...<javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','karkauai@...');> > >: > > > > Never heard of that product Mark, but I'll see if I can find it. Soda > blasting would only hot the surface, but maybe could help a bit at a time. > Keep those ideas coming! > Thanks, > Kent > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 28, 2014, at 6:21 PM, Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...<javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','mcerdos@...');>> > wrote: > > > > Another thought. Since you are in a yard - soda blasting? It would be a > mess to clean up but it would probably do the trick. > > Mark > SM2K #275 > > http://www.creampuff.us/ > > > On Fri, Mar 28, 2014 at 5:36 PM, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...<javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','karkauai@...');> > > wrote: > >> >> >> Problem is getting the old one out of the chain locker. It won't budge >> because it's all rusted together. The limited access to the locker means >> the fix has to be chemical rather than mechanical. Acid would probably do >> it but fumes from muriatic acid would every toxic. I soaked it vinegar for >> 24 hrs and no improvement. >> Need some other suggestions. >> Kent >> SM243 Kristy >> Tiger Point Boat Yard >> Fernandina Beach FL >> >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 28, 2014, at 3:30 PM, "haspeter.baettig" < >> hanspeter.baettig@...<javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','hanspeter.baettig@...');>> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> Hi Kent >> buy a new one, safety first >> best regards >> Hanspeter >> Tamango 2 , SM #16 >> Krusadasi, Turkey >> (actual with out twitter and youtube, mr erdogan, Prminister of Tukey is >> a littel bit angry :-) >> I think to leave Turkey, Greek is only a few miles away >> >> Von meinem iPhone gesendet >> >> Am 28.03.2014 um 20:03 schrieb <karkauai@...<javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','karkauai@...');> >> >: >> >> >> >> I've also discovered that the last 100ft or so of my anchor chain is >> rusted into a huge solid mass in the chain locker. I've sprayed a ton of >> PB Blaster on it and beat it with a hammer without much success. Right now >> I'm soaking it in Vinegar. >> Any ideas? >> Thanks, >> Kent >> SM 243 Kristy >> Currently Tiger Point Marina Fernandina Beach, FL >> >> > >
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3j Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:24 pm (PDT) . Posted by: "Kent Robertson" karkauai
What does everyone think about Hydrochloric acid? No damage to the hull? Fumes? How to get rid of it afterward? Not sure what the heat gun would do??? I don't understand what you're talking about with electrolysis? Thanks, Roque, Kent Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 28, 2014, at 8:17 PM, Roque <ediroque@...> wrote: > > Alternatives to think about: > > > 1. Hydrochloric acid; > > 2. Heat gun; > > 3. Electrolysis (maybe you won't have enough room for this) > > Roque > S/Y Atica Amel 54 > > Em sexta-feira, 28 de março de 2014, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...> escreveu: >> >> Been there and done that. Such a small access that I'm bruised on the arm and ribs from squeezing in there. >> I hit the mass with a 5 lb hammer and nothing budges! >> Keep em coming! >> Kent >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Mar 28, 2014, at 7:16 PM, Ann-Sofie Svanberg <kanalmamman@...> wrote: >>> >>> >>> Sledge hammer??? >>> >>> /Annsofie >>> Lady Annila SM 232 >>> >>> Skickat från min iPad >>> >>>> 28 mar 2014 kl. 18:50 skrev "Kent Robertson" <karkauai@...>: >>>> >>>> >>>> Never heard of that product Mark, but I'll see if I can find it. Soda blasting would only hot the surface, but maybe could help a bit at a time. >>>> Keep those ideas coming! >>>> Thanks, >>>> Kent >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>>> On Mar 28, 2014, at 6:21 PM, Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Another thought. Since you are in a yard - soda blasting? It would be a mess to clean up but it would probably do the trick. >>>>> >>>>> Mark >>>>> SM2K #275 >>>>> >>>>> http://www.creampuff.us/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, Mar 28, 2014 at 5:36 PM, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Problem is getting the old one out of the chain locker. It won't budge because it's all rusted together. The limited access to the locker means the fix has to be chemical rather than mechanical. Acid would probably do it but fumes from muriatic acid would every toxic. I soaked it vinegar for 24 hrs and no improvement. >>>>>> Need some other suggestions. >>>>>> Kent >>>>>> SM243 Kristy >>>>>> Tiger Point Boat Yard >>>>>> Fernandina Beach FL >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 28, 2014, at 3:30 PM, "haspeter.baettig" <hanspeter.baettig@...> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi Kent >>>>>>> buy a new one, safety first >>>>>>> best regards >>>>>>> Hanspeter >>>>>>> Tamango 2 , SM #16 >>>>>>> Krusadasi, Turkey >>>>>>> (actual with out twitter and youtube, mr erdogan, Prminister of Tukey is a littel bit angry :-) >>>>>>> I think to leave Turkey, Greek is only a few miles away >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Von meinem iPhone gesendet >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Am 28.03.2014 um 20:03 schrieb <karkauai@...>: >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> I've also discovered that the last 100ft or so of my anchor chain is rusted into a huge solid mass in the chain locker. I've sprayed a ton of PB Blaster on it and beat it with a hammer without much success.. Right now I'm soaking it in Vinegar. >>> >>> >> Any ideas? >>> >>> >> Thanks, >>> >>> >> Kent >>> >>> >> SM 243 Kristy >>> >>> >> Currently Tiger Point Marina Fernandina Beach, FL >>> >>> >> > >
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Prop Shaft Electrolysis
Anne and John Hollamby <annejohnholl@...>
Hi Kent,
I cannot even imagine the problems and expense of changing the
propshaft. The pic that you have shown us looks horrendous but hopefully that is
the whole extent of the damage and if so the reduction in strength should
perhaps be relatively unimportant. Just in case the damage is more extensive I
suggest that you have someone put the engine in gear and turn it over by hand
using a lever between the bolt heads on the pulley for the fan belt and listen
to find out if the bearings/gears in the unit have seized up. This is unlikely
as presumably the engine was used recently to get the boat ashore.
If you examine the wearing out bush you will find that there
is an O ring inside it and this is what keeps the oil in whilst the bush turns
with the prop shaft and the three oil seals on the outside of the bush keep the
oil in when the shaft and bush is turning. Now you need to give the shaft a
‘colonoscopy’ to see how far the shaft is damaged. Car part vendors sell an
endoscope that is small enough to fit down the dip stick tube for about €80
euros and this should do the job. If you are unlucky and the shaft is pitted
further in than the existing O ring position look further on and you may find
that there are positions where an O ring could make a seal and if so then when
you get a new bush you can have a new
groove cut for a second O ring to do the job. If you sleeve
the old wearing out bush as I have done on mine your shaft problem may be
solved without even getting a new bush.
There is clearly an electrolysis problem either arising from
your boat or the marina,neighbours and this must be resolved. You certainly need
to get a really good marine electrician to check your wiring and to install a
galvanic isolator.
I look forward to hearing the result of your endoscopy
examination! Meanwhile I suggest that you get a copy of Nigel Calders book on
boat maintenance, It should become your bible.
Now I must go down to the yard to remove my prop (with
trembling hands).
Best wishes, Anne and John, Bali Hai, SM319,
Malta
Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2014 4:29 AM
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Prop Shaft
Electrolysis
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On Mar 28, 2014, at 11:21 PM, sailormon < kimberlite@...>
wrote:
Kent,
If I recall
correctly, it is not in the books with all the manuals it is (I believe) in
the owners manual with all the colored photos.
Sorry—but I
am not on the boat.
Eric
I looked through everything I have , Eric. I would swear
I've seen that drawing, but I can't find it.
Kent, In
the back of the owners manual there are pages that fold out with plumbing
diagrams, etc and also drawings of the bow thruster, sail drive and many
other drawings.
Do you have
an owners manual?
Fair
Winds
Eric
Kimberlite
SM 376
I don't have it aboard, Eric. If anyone had it I'd
appreciate it if you'd email me a copy . Karkauai at yahoo dot
com.
Kent,
I just
looked for a drawing of the C drive. It must be in the books on
Kimberlite.
From
memory I believe it will be a big job.
Sorry,
Eric
Thanks Eric. Yeah, it's pretty scary. Lucky we
didn't lose the prop. I just discovered it and haven't talked to the
marina yet. I'll have to find out more about the galvanic
isolator...good idea about just turning on shore power once in a
while.
Any idea how to remove the prop shaft?
I'm going to have an electrician go over the boat
looking for stray currents...any suggestions about that
process?
Wow
!!
That
looks awful.
I use a
galvanic isolator on my AC circuit and also have the pedestal turned on
only one day a week. So far in 3 months in the marina in the Caribbean I
have used one kilowatt of electric.
There
is a small zinc on the line cutter, and of course the 2 big ones on the
rudder.
I am
very sorry for the condition of your prop shaft. I believe there should
be a drawing of your c drive in the owners manual . I believe replacing
the shaft is a big project. It is also possible that a neighbor is
putting AC into the water.
Did you
have the marina check your AC outlet on the pedestal and the water
around your boat?
Fair
Winds
Eric
Kimberlite SM
376
I have just hauled Kristy out to repaint the bottom after 2 1/2
years. She's been sitting in the water in a marina at Brunswick GA
for the last 2 years where I've hired a diver to clean the bottom and
replace the zincs as needed every 4-6 weeks. I was surprised to
see no zinc on the prop when we hauled out, and dismayed to see severe
electrolytic corrosion of the prop shaft when I started changing the
seals. I posted a pic at the KristySM243 folder https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/photos/albums/948071197/lightbox/1877878820
I
need advice on what is involved in removing the prop shaft. Is it
necessary to remove the bottom of the drive aft of the keel?
I guess
I'm going to look into isolating the boat
electrically.
Sigh,
Kent
SM243
Currently Tiger Point Marina,
Fernandina Beach,
FL
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Re: Prop Shaft Electrolysis
amelliahona <no_reply@...>
Kent: I think I found the diagram of the C-drive you were referring to. It is in the Files section of this site posted by BeBe under the topic C-drive
Also, as related to your anchor chain issue, I just read about your back surgery etc, so sorry if my suggestion seemed insensitive.
Best of luck,
Gary Silver s/v Liahona
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
I have also replaced the lazarette floors on both sides due to plywood delamination (had a spongy feel) I made a smaller access hole leaving about a 2-3” perimeter
, then laid marine grade ply sealed both sides then fiberglass over. Bottom line, it was easy access to the chain lockeraand an easy fix.
Ric
Bali Hai SN24
From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
On Behalf Of Patrick Mcaneny
Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2014 10:17 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Kent, If nothing else works, Craig's idea would make it easy to get the chain out of the locker. Two years ago I saw that the plywood floor of the forward lockers
which is the ceiling of the anchor locker was delaminating. Looking into it ,I found the floors on both sides rotten about to cave in. I assumed the floors had a fiberglass coating, they did not. They only had a coat of white resin , which cracks and allows
water to migrate into the wood. I cut out both floors following the tabbing to the hull, leaving the tabbing attached to the hull. I then made a template and cut new plywood wide enough to rest on top of the tabbing. I then glassed in new tabbing plywood
to hull and then applied two layers of fiberglass to entire floor. You may want to poke your ceiling to see if you have rot, if you do, you may want to cut out rotten section and get your chain out ,killing two birds with one stone. Good Luck, Pat #123
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
-----Original Message-----
From: sangaris <sangaris@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Fri, Mar 28, 2014 11:48 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Kent,
Sorry I wasn't clear enough - NO, Don't cut through the bulkhead in your forward cabin! Cut an access panel in the floor of one of
your forward bow deck lockers - starboard may be best because you've got an access panel into the starboard one down below.
I did hire an 8 year old boy in Sicily to climb into the chain locker and hose it out, but their child labor laws are pretty loose :-)
(and he was from a cruising boat).
Can you stick a funnel down the hawse hole next to the chain and pour in about 10 gallons of HCl? Might just work!
Btw, making an access panel in the floor of the forward deck locker may be a good improvement because it will let you really clean out
the chain locker periodically.
Cheers, Craig
---In ame lyachtowners@..., <karkauai@...> wrote :
Thanks for the input. I hate the idea of cutting into the bulkhead, but at least it sounds doable.
So you think the HCl might do the job without hurting anything as long as I ventilate well? I've closed the drain valve, but can't get
to the opening due to the chain.
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
amelliahona <no_reply@...>
As to the cause of the rusty ball of chain, I think I may have an answer. I "end for end" ed my anchor chain a season ago due to the working end (that part that always lays on the seabed) becoming quite rusty. At the time I did this, I treated the rusty end with an entire can of Boeshield. About a month later I was hauling the boat for hurricane storage and decided for the first time in 12 years to play out the chain onto a wooden pallet as I had seen others doing. As I did this I found that many links of the rusty portion of the chain were partially seized together in multiple places and required running the windlass in and out to break them free. This happened in one month despite the Boeshield treatment. I scooped about a half gallon of iron flakes out of the chain locker at the end of this process. When I returned to the boat about six months later, the chain on the pallet was so rusty that I cut it off. By this sad experience I believe I just barely avoided having the state that Kent finds himself in. From now on, when I notice the chain getting rusty I will replace it rather than trying to stretch its useful life. Kent, seeing as the rust is a weak "weld" I would think that by placing traction on the free end with the halyard above decks and beating with a hammer at the intersecting point of the chain end and the pile you should slowly be able to break free a section at a time. I know that access is for a small Frenchman and not you and I, but I placed padding on the access hole edges and wiggled myself into the locker such that I had both arms in. I needed help to pull me back out though. With both arms inside I was able to work better in the locker. I have taken to wasting the locker from top to bottom with fresh water via the chain locker access hatch at each hurricane haul-out and I long ago ditched the sea water anchor wash-down and changed it to a fresh water wash-down. Not helpful for you now, but perhaps others might be forewarned that this area needs frequent attention and is often neglected as it is out of sight and out of mind. Wish I had a better chemical answer for you. Best of luck. Gary Silver s/v Liahona Hull # 335
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Re: Prop Shaft Electrolysis
Kent, I am curious how long a prop Zinc usually lasts you? We have to change Libby's every 3 months. We have seen this rate of burn in 3 marina's over the last 3 years. No one place better than the other. Knowing that Amel replaced the prop Zinc with a plastic cap and we burn through that particular Zinc every 3 months concerns me. Our rudder Zincs last a lot longer. 6-8 months. Looking for some logic here.
Terry&Dena Libby San Diego
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Anne and John Hollamby <annejohnholl@...>
HI Kent,
Sorry to read of all your problems, not least the bad back, it
seems to me that you should not be banging around in the chain locker and you
should get someone else to do the dirty work. I am astonished that the chain has
apparently fused itself together and have to wonder whether it is electrolysis
affected. What I would do is to Google phosphoric acid to see what the
breathing hazards are. There are some clues under the headings CDC.NIOSH-hazards
and under nj,gov/health as well as many others. I have recently been using
a “strong rust remover to unfreeze a ball race. It was only less than 12% and
really not what you need as it was very expensive per fluid oz.The adverts on
Google offered five litre cans of concentrate for £25. It should be much
more effective than Hydrochloric acid and hopefully not so hugely dangerous.A
plumber died after using strong HCL to clear the lime scale deposits in the
pipes in the mens urinal in my office years ago. I would hope to get
professional advice on the best percentage of phosphoric to use.
I would start on the problem by getting a length of steel rod
of the right diameter that when the end had been reduced in diameter so that it
would just fit through a link and long enough that the other end can be easily
hammered in the cabin. I would then winch the chain by hand so that it is taut
in the locker and then I would see whether the links can be separated one by
one. If not I would apply phosphoric to the relevant links, wait a while and
then start banging again.
Good luck, you need some after these problems, John Bali
Hai, Sm319 in Malta
Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2014 12:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain
Locker
Kent , How about a long chisel and a 3lb.
sledge hammer a have at it. Pat
-----Original
Message----- From: Kent Robertson To:
amelyachtowners Sent: Fri, Mar 28,
2014 6:50 pm Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Rusted Ball of Chain in the
Chain Locker
Never heard of that product Mark, but I'll see if I can find it. Soda
blasting would only hot the surface, but maybe could help a bit at a time.
Keep those ideas coming!
Thanks,
Kent
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On Mar 28, 2014, at 6:21 PM, Mark Erdos < mcerdos@...> wrote:
Another thought. Since you are in a yard - soda blasting? It
would be a mess to clean up but it would probably do the trick.
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Kent, If nothing else works, Craig's idea would make it easy to get the chain out of the locker. Two years ago I saw that the plywood floor of the forward lockers which is the ceiling of the anchor locker was delaminating. Looking into it ,I found the floors on both sides rotten about to cave in. I assumed the floors had a fiberglass coating, they did not. They only had a coat of white resin , which cracks and allows water to migrate into the wood. I cut out both floors following the tabbing to the hull, leaving the tabbing attached to the hull. I then made a template and cut new plywood wide enough to rest on top of the tabbing. I then glassed in new tabbing plywood to hull and then applied two layers of fiberglass to entire floor. You may want to poke your ceiling to see if you have rot, if you do, you may want to cut out rotten section and get your chain out ,killing two birds with one stone. Good Luck, Pat #123
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
-----Original Message-----
From: sangaris
To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Fri, Mar 28, 2014 11:48 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Kent,
Hi Kent,
Sorry I wasn't clear enough - NO, Don't cut through the bulkhead in your forward cabin! Cut an access panel in the floor of one of your forward bow deck lockers - starboard may be best because you've got an access panel into the starboard one down below.
I did hire an 8 year old boy in Sicily to climb into the chain locker and hose it out, but their child labor laws are pretty loose :-) (and he was from a cruising boat).
Can you stick a funnel down the hawse hole next to the chain and pour in about 10 gallons of HCl? Might just work!
Btw, making an access panel in the floor of the forward deck locker may be a good improvement because it will let you really clean out the chain locker periodically.
Cheers, Craig
---In ame
lyachtowners@..., wrote :
Hi Craig,
Thanks for the input. I hate the idea of cutting into the bulkhead, but at least it sounds doable.
So you think the HCl might do the job without hurting anything as long as I ventilate well? I've closed the drain valve, but can't get to the opening due to the chain.
K
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Re: Prop Shaft Electrolysis
amelliahona <no_reply@...>
Dear Kent: I too am shocked at the state of your prop shaft. I looked for the diagram of the C-drive in my files, as I too have seen a drawing of it recently, but I can't find it. Here is a link to a photo of the C-drive (I think you may have posted it) if that will help. It appears there is access to the shaft and bearings of the C-drive from the forward end but probably this is glassed in and I am not sure how you remove the C-drive housing. I think you are going to need to have a serious discussion with Amel as to how to proceed. I will continue to look thru the photos and files sections of this forum as I am pretty sure the diagram is on this forum somewhere.
As for zincs, mine last about two seasons (only in the water for 6 months at a time due to hurricane haul out annually. Whenever I leave the boat in a marina I DO NOT leave it plugged in to shore power. I have the caretaker plug it in once a month for 6 hours to really top up the batteries, but otherwise depend on some small solar panels to keep the batteries trickle charged.
One time I asked Amel why they used the red plastic cap on the auto prop rather than placing a zinc there. Their reply was that it was un-necessary and that you can "over-zinc" the boat. I wasn't really sure as to the logic behind either of those answers but seeing as they were the experts and I was the novice I didn't press for more details.
I wish you the best.
Gary Silver s/v Liahona currently at Jolly Harbor
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Just wanted to inform you all that I have put the Bozo Cinq - 2007 AMEL 54 #44 up for sale. It is presently located at the AMEL service centre in Martinique. Information and pictures can be seen on the AMEL web site: http://www.amel.fr/occasions .
Thank you all for the tremendous information and activity on AMEL Yacht Owners/Yahoo web sited. It has been an invaluable source of help and information!!
Best Regards,
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
john martin <symoondog@...>
Kent, I know it won't help you now, but in the future when you get the chain out and problem solved, you should wash the chain with fresh water a couple of times a year. Always when you winterize the boat. I take a hose and open up the access hole and spray fresh water all over the chain and locker compartment and let it air out. In the yard, find a wooden pallet or a piece of plywood and drop the entire chain on it. I hired a small worker one time to actually climb into the locker and scrub out the walls and floor of the locker. Being out of sight, out of mind, not good for anchor chain. JOHN "Moon Dog" SM248
To: amelyachtowners@... From: karkauai@... Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2014 12:03:37 -0700 Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
I've also discovered that the last 100ft or so of my anchor chain is rusted into a huge solid mass in the chain locker. I've sprayed a ton of PB Blaster on it and beat it with a hammer without much success. Right now I'm soaking it in Vinegar.
Any ideas?
Thanks,
Kent
SM 243 Kristy
Currently Tiger Point Marina Fernandina Beach, FL
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Kent , How about a long chisel and a 3lb. sledge hammer a have at it. Pat
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
-----Original Message-----
From: Kent Robertson
To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Fri, Mar 28, 2014 6:50 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Never heard of that product Mark, but I'll see if I can find it. Soda blasting would only hot the surface, but maybe could help a bit at a time.
Keep those ideas coming!
Thanks,
Kent
On Mar 28, 2014, at 6:21 PM, Mark Erdos < mcerdos@...> wrote:
Another thought. Since you are in a yard - soda blasting? It would be a mess to clean up but it would probably do the trick.
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Rusted Ball of Chain in the Chain Locker
Kent,
After you have dealt with the chain problem, I would be very interested in what you think the cause is.
For instance, is it possible that the locker drain was partially clogged causing water to pool in the bottom?
I realize that the cause is of no immediate consideration and the removal has the priority, but if you happen to figure things out, I am sure that more people than me are interested.
Good Luck,
Bill BeBe 387
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