Date   

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Anchor Locker

James Alton
 

James,

   There are a lot of different kinds of mold, some are just superficial and some indicate that the wood is being consumed.  You can try poking the wood in areas with an ice pick to see if there is any unusual softness which would indicate dry rot..which is actually misnomer since some moisture is required for rot to progress.

   If the wood is dry, it will certainly absorb epoxy regardless of the orientation of the application.   Epoxy can do a great job protecting wood from absorbing moisture but if the wood is already wet (wood can appear dry on the surface but there still be a lot of moisture deeper into the wood) you will be sealing the moisture in which can in some cases accelerate the deterioration.   Think of the way the wood core in a deck with fibreglass on both sides of it will rot if the core gets wet.  The moisture can enter through a small hole but due to the fibreglass it cannot easily dry back out.   Keep in mind that with plywood, any moisture has to cross multiple glue lines to get out so the drying from the bottom could take a long time to complete if you want to go that route.  

  Another option would be to treat the wood with a water borne fungicide which actually works best if the wood is already wet.  The borate products work pretty well in preventing or slowing rot and are used for instance in the cellulose insulation used in attics to keep the paper from rotting or bugs eating it, while still being pretty safe for humans living in the house.  One such product that I have some experience with is called Timbor, which is a white powder that is mixed with water and can then be applied via brush or spray.  The product is essentially odourless and cleans up with water.  It will leave a white residue if allowed to dry on a surface but can be removed with soap and water.  Given time and enough applications the borate can completely penetrate the plywood and should slow  deterioration of the wood.  The anchor locker is a pretty harsh environment for wood due to the continual dampness so if I ever have to rebuild my own locker, I will consider my options to eliminate the wood panels.

   The cleaning that you are doing is certainly going to help.  I try to pull my anchor chain out each time I am in a marina, rinse and dry the locker.   I just lay a couple square rubber pads on the deck and pile it up close to the hawse pipe, I don’t bother stretching it out.  I also keep the chain door open to vent as much as I can so that things can dry inside the locker.  Good ventilation will help more than anything to reduce mildew and rot of the wood.

Best,

James

SV Sueño
Maramu #220

On Feb 21, 2018, at 2:39 PM, James Studdart james.studdart@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Out of curiosity, does penetrating epoxy work on the underside of the plywood (working against gravity). The plywood will draw in some I expect, but is it enough?

Cheers,
James.
SeaBean SM344
Tahiti, FP

On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 05:56 Vladimir Sonsev sonsev52@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Moldy pywood can be saved. Just clean it, dry well and apply penetrating epoxy. Follow instructions. Your can add a layer of fiberglass on top if needed. 

Vladimir 
SM 345 "LIFE IS GOOD"



On Feb 21, 2018 05:01, "greatketch@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Gerhard,


This has been a popular topic recently.  It seems that this year many Super Maramus (mine included) have reached the age where the plywood in the chain locker reached the end of its useful life.  The only reason I can see for not fully encapsulating the plywood in the chain locker is just manufacturing expedience. There are very few places where Amel took shortcuts, so I guess I can forgive them this one.  Where our wood was coated, it was coated with glass and resin, not simply paint.

If the plywood is "moldy" it is almost certainly past the point where it can be saved, although others with more wooden boat experience than I might have some useful suggestions.

We replaced the horizontal plywood in our boat completely, and ground off a layer or two from the vertical bulkhead down to hard, dry wood before covering it with fiberglass and resin.  If you dig back a few months in the forum archives you'll find a lot of discussion about the various approaches to this project.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Freeport, Bahamas



---In amelyachtowners@..., <no_reply@...> wrote :


I take all the chain out every year to clean the anchor locker and as has been noted on previous posts, the plywood ceiling is always mouldy.  Does anybody know why the anchor locker is painted halfway up with white paint and the rest of the fiberglass is left bare and the plywood ceiling is left unpainted?  Has anybody painted the sides and especially the plywood ceiling?  If so, what paint was used?  Does anybody know what the existing white paint is?


Gerhard Hoffmann

Pepino SM381

Greece

 






On Feb 21, 2018 05:01, "greatketch@yahoo..com [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Gerhard,


This has been a popular topic recently.  It seems that this year many Super Maramus (mine included) have reached the age where the plywood in the chain locker reached the end of its useful life.  The only reason I can see for not fully encapsulating the plywood in the chain locker is just manufacturing expedience. There are very few places where Amel took shortcuts, so I guess I can forgive them this one.  Where our wood was coated, it was coated with glass and resin, not simply paint.

If the plywood is "moldy" it is almost certainly past the point where it can be saved, although others with more wooden boat experience than I might have some useful suggestions.

We replaced the horizontal plywood in our boat completely, and ground off a layer or two from the vertical bulkhead down to hard, dry wood before covering it with fiberglass and resin.  If you dig back a few months in the forum archives you'll find a lot of discussion about the various approaches to this project.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Freeport, Bahamas



---In amelyachtowners@..., <no_reply@...> wrote :


I take all the chain out every year to clean the anchor locker and as has been noted on previous posts, the plywood ceiling is always mouldy.  Does anybody know why the anchor locker is painted halfway up with white paint and the rest of the fiberglass is left bare and the plywood ceiling is left unpainted?  Has anybody painted the sides and especially the plywood ceiling?  If so, what paint was used?  Does anybody know what the existing white paint is?


Gerhard Hoffmann

Pepino SM381

Greece

 








Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Raymarine Ray240 VHF

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

I hate to make this comment, but I have always had bad experience with Raymarine VHF - handheld or standard. They make great autopilots.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus
Amel School www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970

On Feb 21, 2018 17:59, "'Miles Bidwell' milesbid@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Hi Duane,

I had a problem like that.  I replaced the wire to the masthead and all was well.  The range is now much bigger.   Maybe that is worth trying for you.

Regards,

Miles

S/Y Ladybug sm 216 , Port du Marin, Martinique


Re: Raymarine Ray240 VHF

Miles
 

Hi Duane,

I had a problem like that.  I replaced the wire to the masthead and all was well.  The range is now much bigger.   Maybe that is worth trying for you.

Regards,

Miles

S/Y Ladybug sm 216 , Port du Marin, Martinique


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Anchor Locker

VLADIMIR SONSEV
 

Yes it will work against gravity because of capillary effect. Water goes up in the trees because of capillary effect. I would roll it with a paint roller. It is very important to dry it well first. 

Vladimir
SM 345 "LIFE IS GOOD"

On Feb 21, 2018 15:40, "James Studdart james.studdart@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Out of curiosity, does penetrating epoxy work on the underside of the plywood (working against gravity). The plywood will draw in some I expect, but is it enough?

Cheers,
James.
SeaBean SM344
Tahiti, FP

On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 05:56 Vladimir Sonsev sonsev52@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

Moldy pywood can be saved. Just clean it, dry well and apply penetrating epoxy. Follow instructions. Your can add a layer of fiberglass on top if needed. 

Vladimir
SM 345 "LIFE IS GOOD"


On Feb 21, 2018 05:01, "greatketch@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

Gerhard,


This has been a popular topic recently.  It seems that this year many Super Maramus (mine included) have reached the age where the plywood in the chain locker reached the end of its useful life.  The only reason I can see for not fully encapsulating the plywood in the chain locker is just manufacturing expedience. There are very few places where Amel took shortcuts, so I guess I can forgive them this one.  Where our wood was coated, it was coated with glass and resin, not simply paint.

If the plywood is "moldy" it is almost certainly past the point where it can be saved, although others with more wooden boat experience than I might have some useful suggestions.

We replaced the horizontal plywood in our boat completely, and ground off a layer or two from the vertical bulkhead down to hard, dry wood before covering it with fiberglass and resin.  If you dig back a few months in the forum archives you'll find a lot of discussion about the various approaches to this project.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Freeport, Bahamas



---In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, <no_reply@...> wrote :


I take all the chain out every year to clean the anchor locker and as has been noted on previous posts, the plywood ceiling is always mouldy.  Does anybody know why the anchor locker is painted halfway up with white paint and the rest of the fiberglass is left bare and the plywood ceiling is left unpainted?  Has anybody painted the sides and especially the plywood ceiling?  If so, what paint was used?  Does anybody know what the existing white paint is?


Gerhard Hoffmann

Pepino SM381

Greece

 




On Feb 21, 2018 05:01, "greatketch@yahoo..com [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

Gerhard,


This has been a popular topic recently.  It seems that this year many Super Maramus (mine included) have reached the age where the plywood in the chain locker reached the end of its useful life.  The only reason I can see for not fully encapsulating the plywood in the chain locker is just manufacturing expedience. There are very few places where Amel took shortcuts, so I guess I can forgive them this one.  Where our wood was coated, it was coated with glass and resin, not simply paint.

If the plywood is "moldy" it is almost certainly past the point where it can be saved, although others with more wooden boat experience than I might have some useful suggestions.

We replaced the horizontal plywood in our boat completely, and ground off a layer or two from the vertical bulkhead down to hard, dry wood before covering it with fiberglass and resin.  If you dig back a few months in the forum archives you'll find a lot of discussion about the various approaches to this project.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Freeport, Bahamas



---In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, <no_reply@...> wrote :


I take all the chain out every year to clean the anchor locker and as has been noted on previous posts, the plywood ceiling is always mouldy.  Does anybody know why the anchor locker is painted halfway up with white paint and the rest of the fiberglass is left bare and the plywood ceiling is left unpainted?  Has anybody painted the sides and especially the plywood ceiling?  If so, what paint was used?  Does anybody know what the existing white paint is?


Gerhard Hoffmann

Pepino SM381

Greece

 




Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Change of seals for gearbox oil change

Peter Forbes
 

Judy,

How nice to hear from you and thank you - do you have his direct e- mail?

How is living on land.

Peter

Do

Peter Forbes
00447836 209730

On 21 Feb 2018, at 19:25, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Peter,

Amel owner Gian Piero Staffa lives in Antigua.  He is a member of the Facebook Amel Group and could be contacted there.  Maybe he would know someone locally who can help you with this project.

Judy Rouse


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Anchor Locker

James Studdart
 

Out of curiosity, does penetrating epoxy work on the underside of the plywood (working against gravity). The plywood will draw in some I expect, but is it enough?

Cheers,
James.
SeaBean SM344
Tahiti, FP

On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 05:56 Vladimir Sonsev sonsev52@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Moldy pywood can be saved. Just clean it, dry well and apply penetrating epoxy. Follow instructions. Your can add a layer of fiberglass on top if needed. 

Vladimir
SM 345 "LIFE IS GOOD"


On Feb 21, 2018 05:01, "greatketch@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Gerhard,


This has been a popular topic recently.  It seems that this year many Super Maramus (mine included) have reached the age where the plywood in the chain locker reached the end of its useful life.  The only reason I can see for not fully encapsulating the plywood in the chain locker is just manufacturing expedience. There are very few places where Amel took shortcuts, so I guess I can forgive them this one.  Where our wood was coated, it was coated with glass and resin, not simply paint.

If the plywood is "moldy" it is almost certainly past the point where it can be saved, although others with more wooden boat experience than I might have some useful suggestions.

We replaced the horizontal plywood in our boat completely, and ground off a layer or two from the vertical bulkhead down to hard, dry wood before covering it with fiberglass and resin.  If you dig back a few months in the forum archives you'll find a lot of discussion about the various approaches to this project.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Freeport, Bahamas



---In amelyachtowners@..., <no_reply@...> wrote :


I take all the chain out every year to clean the anchor locker and as has been noted on previous posts, the plywood ceiling is always mouldy.  Does anybody know why the anchor locker is painted halfway up with white paint and the rest of the fiberglass is left bare and the plywood ceiling is left unpainted?  Has anybody painted the sides and especially the plywood ceiling?  If so, what paint was used?  Does anybody know what the existing white paint is?


Gerhard Hoffmann

Pepino SM381

Greece

 




On Feb 21, 2018 05:01, "greatketch@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Gerhard,


This has been a popular topic recently.  It seems that this year many Super Maramus (mine included) have reached the age where the plywood in the chain locker reached the end of its useful life.  The only reason I can see for not fully encapsulating the plywood in the chain locker is just manufacturing expedience. There are very few places where Amel took shortcuts, so I guess I can forgive them this one.  Where our wood was coated, it was coated with glass and resin, not simply paint.

If the plywood is "moldy" it is almost certainly past the point where it can be saved, although others with more wooden boat experience than I might have some useful suggestions.

We replaced the horizontal plywood in our boat completely, and ground off a layer or two from the vertical bulkhead down to hard, dry wood before covering it with fiberglass and resin.  If you dig back a few months in the forum archives you'll find a lot of discussion about the various approaches to this project.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Freeport, Bahamas



---In amelyachtowners@..., <no_reply@...> wrote :


I take all the chain out every year to clean the anchor locker and as has been noted on previous posts, the plywood ceiling is always mouldy.  Does anybody know why the anchor locker is painted halfway up with white paint and the rest of the fiberglass is left bare and the plywood ceiling is left unpainted?  Has anybody painted the sides and especially the plywood ceiling?  If so, what paint was used?  Does anybody know what the existing white paint is?


Gerhard Hoffmann

Pepino SM381

Greece

 



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Change of seals for gearbox oil change

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Peter,

Amel owner Gian Piero Staffa lives in Antigua.  He is a member of the Facebook Amel Group and could be contacted there.  Maybe he would know someone locally who can help you with this project.

Judy Rouse


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Puerto Rico Marina DEAL!

John Clark
 

Thanks Mark. 

By the way Browns at Bimini was great!

    Regards, John

SV Annie. SM 37

On Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 10:40 AM Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Nice!

How much do they charge weekly or monthly?

Sincerely, Alexandre

--------------------------------------------
On Sat, 2/17/18, 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Puerto Rico Marina DEAL!
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Saturday, February 17, 2018, 3:38 PM


 

















If you are in the SE side
of Puerto Rico and need a nice
place to stay at a great price, then check out this special
at the Palmas Del Mar
Yacht Club:

 

Our first program is our Extended
Stay Program. For any vessel
booking transient dockage, we will provide a complimentary
stay of equal
duration. For example, if you book a one week stay we will
give you an
additional week free of charge. We hope you will take
advantage of this offer
to spend more time with us and discover new places or
revisit your favorites.
We're confident you will enjoy your time with us so
we're offering a
satisfaction guaranty: if for any reason within the first
week of your stay
you're unsatisfied, we will cancel your stay and issue
you a full refund (net
of any utility charges). 

 

We have stayed here and it
is VERY nice. There are
restaurants within walking distance and a small market. The
marina and staff
are super. There is Target Car Rental on site and it is
about 15 minutes to
Costco and 10 minutes to Wal-Mart.

 

If you go, please tell
Glenda (who speaks English) in the
office hi from Mark and Cindy – Cream Puff

 

Here is a link to their
page: http://www.theyachtclubmarina.com/


 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream
Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising -
Guadeloupe

www.creampuff.us

 
















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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

eric freedman
 

DITTO,

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2018 7:39 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

 

 

Hanspeter, I have owned my Amel and been a member of this group for 11 years and never realized that this group was strictly a "technical exchange platform" thanks for enlightening me and the rest of the group  . OOPS , I guess technically , this was was a technical post. Please disregard , Sorry !

Pat

SM#123

-----Original Message-----
From: 'hanspeter.baettig@...' hanspeter.baettig@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Feb 20, 2018 11:45 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

 

Dear Mr.  Baileys and Danny

I don't like that you use this forum as an add and marketing platform. Insurance are different by countries. 

Mr. Baileys; you mentioned that we need an avocate at claim? My question ? who is paying the avocate ?

Looking forward that this platform remains as a technical exchange platform 

PS: there are lots of other social platforms to share individuels needs.

kr

Hanspeter

Tamango 2

SM16; Las Palmas



Von meinem iPhone gesendet


Am 19.02.2018 um 20:49 schrieb Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>:

 

Hi All,

I received a personal email asking the name of the insurance company that disappointed us. It was Haven Knox Johnson, a Lloyds of London Company. The broker was The Marina Shop of Opua NZ and the Assessor was Steve Lott of New Zealand.

We have a new Broker, Baileys Insurance brokers of Auckland NZ, and a new insurer recommended by them. QBE Marine insurers. Steve Bailey the principal of the company is a sailor himself. As always until you have a claim you don't know the quality of the insurer and we have yet to have a claim under this cover.(and hope we never will) However we have confidence in our broker.

Regards

Danny 

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 17 February 2018 at 07:24 "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Hi all,

Further to my below, no one said no so I copy here an email from my new broker sent after he read some of the posts.

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

Hi all,

I’ve been reading some of the comments posted by many of you about pleasure craft insurance policies.

I feel very sorry for you, and agreed it is not a good situation at all – but it shouldn’t be that way, and sounds like you’ve not been getting the right advice or support here.  We always use “agreed value” policies and they have worked for us and our clients as they should, many, many times.  One just less than a week ago in fact.

What you need is an advocate at claim time to ensure the claims process goes as it should – in addition t o ensuring your policy is set up correctly.  This is where an experienced Marine Insurance Broker comes in – well, a good one anyway!

There are also certain Insurance Companies to avoid out there.  Their policies aren’t worth the paper they are written on.

Sincere regards,

Neil Bailey

Director

Bailey Insurance Brokers

Auckland

New Zealand

On 16 February 2018 at 14:27 "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

60;

 

Hi all,

As I said before I was burned badly by an insurance company. I changed brokers and have a "agreed value" policy with my new broker.

I forwarded him some of the correspondence because, firstly I wanted him to know what was going on and secondly to see what he said regarding my "agreed Value" policy. He has sent me a response which is helpful. He does have a good name. Is it OK for me to share his reply with the group. I'm not trying to promote him, just to add something that may be helpful.

Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

Mangonui 
New Zealand

 

On 16 February 2018 at 06:42 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Alexandre, Trust me, I for one will reread my policy with a more critical eye. Its disgusting how an insurance company would look for any excuse , even an invalid one to escape their responsibly .. I will guarantee that the vast majority of boaters are not aware of these practices, and believe that they have an umbrella of protection , that in reality does not exist. I urge you guys to find a way to tell your story to a wider audience. 

Pat 

SM Shenanigans

-----Original Message-----
From: Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Thu, Feb 15, 2018 9:11 a m
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying goodbye

 

Hello Pat,

I totally agree with you Danny.

This is why my lawyer said it was a rip off to start with.
You are paying in good faith a higher premium thinking you are covered, but you are not.

I URGE everybody to read their insurance policies.
Most of you probably never even receive it (I had to ask for mine).

I think as a boating community, if we group ourselves we have a way to make things better.

Example on my insurance policy it says in case of a name storm approaching you have to:
remove anything that offers wind resistance which is: bimini, sails, lazy bags, blade of wind turbine, dinghy, etc. these items must be removed and store inside the boat. As Rafael tragically find out, this also include barbecues. That is why they say “anything” even if not listed....
Then it says the boom must be attached to the deck.
Then you have to close all unnecessary sea cock.
Valuable objects such as electronics must be disassembled and store on land...
Then you have to “triple” the number of normal fenders, dock lines, etc.
IF YOU FAIL TO DO ANY OF THESE, the policy is canceled.

I really implore Rafael to tell his story…

Last week I met a french guy, so we chat, he used to be hired by insurance adjuster to find “anything” on a boat. He said, if there was a fire, the insurance adjuster would hire him to find any electrical welding (if I u nderstood properly), as soon as they find 1, even if it is at the top of the mast, the policy is void and they don’t reimburse.
He said he was disgusted and like many sailor I met now simply has liability.

Alexandre

--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 2/15/18, Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying goodbye
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Thursday, February 15, 2018, 7:15 AM


 









The
insurance company based the premiums on the Agreed value ,
and then only will pay out based on what they determine the
market value is, because they don't want you to be
enriched ! Did they not e nrich themselves by charging
excessive premiums for coverage they probably never intended
to honor ? This kind of information needs to get out to the
entire boating community through the internet and sailing
magazines . I encourage anyone treated unfairly to relate
their story , if  it results in lost business maybe they
will get the message. If 10% of those covered by a company
cancelled and took their business elsewhere and gave the
reason why , it would get their attention. Its sad to lose a
dream .
Pat 

SM Shenanigans






-----Original
Message-----

From: Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>

To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Thu, Feb 15, 2018 6:34 am

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owne rs] Amel owner saying
goodbye








 













Good morning Danny,





I also have an “agreed” policy (from Helvetia through de
Lassee), BUT as my lawyer told me, this is a rip off as, it
is written on the contrat that the insurance has the right
to challenge the “agreed value” and pay only the market
value because the owner would “enrich” himself if case
of a total loss. (meaning that: if you are reimburse the
agreed value, you would “enrich” yourself getting more
than the market value).


That is what my insurance is doing, so my lawyer ask me to
compile all the invoices for the last 5 years to prove that
1) vessel was better equipped justifying the agreed value,
2) vessel was better maintained (justifying the higher
agreed value) 3) that my expens es were higher than the
average, etc...


So now I have my own adjuster writing a full report with all
the details.


We have been working since November on this.





So for anyone thinking they are safely covered with an
“agreed” value, please read your entire policy. If you
want I can show the specific section where what I just
explained is written. That will be in french in my case.





Sincerely, Alexandre





--------------------------------------------


On Wed, 2/14/18, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
wrote:





Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying
goodbye


To: amely achtowners@...


Date: Wednesday, February 14, 2018, 10:51 PM








 
































I too have been raped by insurers in the past. I now


have a policy with an "agreed Value" . I hope
that


would help in the case of a write off.DannySM


299 Ocean PearlOn 15 February 2018 at 11:19


"Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@...


[amelyachtowners]"


<amelyachtowners@...>
wrote:





  Dear Rafael,








I think you need to tell


the Group “your” story about the insu rance.





We have the same insurance


Helvetia contracted through de Lassee and I really think


every Amel owner should know the ridiculous excuses they


used to remove 30% of the value of your boat.





It is not “my” place to


tell everybody the way they treated “you”, but I
will


write mine with all the details when it will be settled.






I am definitely sorry that


your vessel was destroy soon after you purchased her and
did


not had the joy of sailing her.





Sincerely, Alexandre








--------------------------------------------


On Wed, 2/14/18, rcavie


<no_reply@...>
wrote:





Subject: [Am el Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying


goodbye


To:


amelyachtowners@...


Date:


Wednesday, February 14, 2018, 1:57 PM








 





























Dear


friends AMEL ownersProbably this


will be


the last email that I send and I will withdraw from


the group. The reason is that Hurricane


Irma


destroyed my Amel SM2k and it will be


impossible for me to


recover it.The


insurance will only pay a fraction of


what


it would cost me to buy an equal one. Deductibles and


other reasons.This situation not only


destroyed my< br>

ship but my dreams. My dreams


of living on board with my


wife, my dreams


of crossing the Atlantic to the East, my





dreams of sailing the Mediterranean and perhaps other


seas


and finally returning to the beautiful


South of


Chile.


In this


group I gained friends


and knowledge and


for that, I thank each and every one of





you, especially Eric and Alexandre who from the
beginning


helped me with their advice.





If


you sail to Chile you will have a


friend


here.Greetings to





all


Fair


windsRafaelSM2k


246










 
< /div>

 


 

 


 

 


 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Raymarine Ray240 VHF

John Clark
 

Could the issue be the cable running up the mast.  A fatigue point might be where it is suspended at the mazt head.

We "lost" our primary VHF antenna after it was dinged by a bridge and subject to some agressive beating into the wind.  The antenna broke free leaving a stub of wire at mast head but still transmitted and recieved consistantly,  just not as good.  We switched to the antenna on the mizzen untill we get to Martinique.

Erratic performance sounds like something different.  

 Regards,  John
SV Annie. SM 37
Marsh Harbor BA.

On Wed, Feb 21, 2018, 1:51 AM 'Mohammad Shirloo' mshirloo@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Hi Duane;
 
We are also experiencing intermittent issues with the VHF. Our issue is reception, we seem to be transmitting fine. So when we have issue we transmit on the main VHF with the mast mounted antenna and receive on the handheld.
 
We have done numerous power and transmission tests and get intermittent results. We are going to replace the antenna at this year's haul out.
 
Does any one have a good recommendation for an antenna for a 54?
 
Respectfully;
Mohammad and Aty
B&B Kokomo
Amel 54 #099
 


From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2018 2:59 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Raymarine Ray240 VHF

 

Our VHF has a history of not working for completely inexplicable reasons.  It will receive but will not send, even at very close ranges.  It will work for a time and then not work for a time.  Thank goodness I bought a handheld for a backup.


It doesn't seem like it could be the antenna.  We listened to the USCG Charleston SC when we were at the FL/GA border, almost two hundred miles away (they must have a very tall antenna)


I'm planning on replacing it (after all, it's 12 years old), but thought I would see if there was a simple repair answer.


If you replaced it, what did you pick? 


Thanks,

Duane

Wanderer, SM#477


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

JEFFREY KRAUS
 

Joel with a classic!



Sent from my Sprint Samsung Galaxy S7.

-------- Original message --------
From: "Joel Potter jfpottercys@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...>
Date: 2/21/18 10:38 AM (GMT-04:00)
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

 

Hanspeter, you can quit taking those crabby pills. They obviously work.

JOEL F. POTTER
CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST LLC
THE EXPERIENCED AMEL GUY
Office 954-462-5869 

On Feb 21, 2018, at 8:26 AM, 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

LOL

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Guadeloupe

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2018 8:39 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

 

 

Hanspeter, I have owned my Amel and been a member of this group for 11 years and never realized that this group was strictly a "technical exchange platform" thanks for enlightening me and the rest of the group  . OOPS , I guess technically , this was was a technical post. Please disregard , Sorry !

Pat

SM#123

-----Original Message-----
From: 'hanspeter.baettig@...' hanspeter.baettig@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Feb 20, 2018 11:45 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

 

Dear Mr.  Baileys and Danny

I don't like that you use this forum as an add and marketing platform. Insurance are different by countries. 

Mr. Baileys; you mentioned that we need an avocate at claim? My question ? who is paying the avocate ?

Looking forward that this platform remains as a technical exchange platform 

PS: there are lots of other social platforms to share individuels needs.

kr

Hanspeter

Tamango 2

SM16; Las Palmas



Von meinem iPhone gesendet


Am 19.02.2018 um 20:49 schrieb Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>:

 

Hi All,

I received a personal email asking the name of the insurance company that disappointed us. It was Haven Knox Johnson, a Lloyds of London Company. The broker was The Marina Shop of Opua NZ and the Assessor was Steve Lott of New Zealand.

We have a new Broker, Baileys Insurance brokers of Auckland NZ, and a new insurer recommended by them. QBE Marine insurers. Steve Bailey the principal of the company is a sailor himself. As always until you have a claim you don't know the quality of the insurer and we have yet to have a claim under this cover.(and hope we never will) However we have confidence in our broker.

Regards

Danny 

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 17 February 2018 at 07:24 "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Hi all,

Further to my below, no one said no so I copy here an email from my new broker sent after he read some of the posts.

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

Hi all,

I’ve been reading some of the comments posted by many of you about pleasure craft insurance policies.

I feel very sorry for you, and agreed it is not a good situation at all – but it shouldn’t be that way, and sounds like you’ve not been getting the right advice or support here.  We always use “agreed value” policies and they have worked for us and our clients as they should, many, many times.  One just less than a week ago in fact.

What you need is an advocate at claim time to ensure the claims process goes as it should – in addition t o ensuring your policy is set up correctly.  This is where an experienced Marine Insurance Broker comes in – well, a good one anyway!

There are also certain Insurance Companies to avoid out there.  Their policies aren’t worth the paper they are written on.

Sincere regards,

Neil Bailey

Director

Bailey Insurance Brokers

Auckland

New Zealand

On 16 February 2018 at 14:27 "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 60;

 

Hi all,

As I said before I was burned badly by an insurance company. I changed brokers and have a "agreed value" policy with my new broker.

I forwarded him some of the correspondence because, firstly I wanted him to know what was going on and secondly to see what he said regarding my "agreed Value" policy. He has sent me a response which is helpful. He does have a good name. Is it OK for me to share his reply with the group. I'm not trying to promote him, just to add something that may be helpful.

Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

Mangonui 
New Zealand

 

On 16 February 2018 at 06:42 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Alexandre, Trust me, I for one will reread my policy with a more critical eye. Its disgusting how an insurance company would look for any excuse , even an invalid one to escape their responsibly .. I will guarantee that the vast majority of boaters are not aware of these practices, and believe that they have an umbrella of protection , that in reality does not exist. I urge you guys to find a way to tell your story to a wider audience. 

Pat 

SM Shenanigans

-----Original Message-----
From: Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Thu, Feb 15, 2018 9:11 a m
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying goodbye

 

Hello Pat,

I totally agree with you Danny.

This is why my lawyer said it was a rip off to start with.
You are paying in good faith a higher premium thinking you are covered, but you are not.

I URGE everybody to read their insurance policies.
Most of you probably never even receive it (I had to ask for mine).

I think as a boating community, if we group ourselves we have a way to make things better.

Example on my insurance policy it says in case of a name storm approaching you have to:
remove anything that offers wind resistance which is: bimini, sails, lazy bags, blade of wind turbine, dinghy, etc. these items must be removed and store inside the boat. As Rafael tragically find out, this also include barbecues... That is why they say “anything” even if not listed....
Then it says the boom must be attached to the deck.
Then you have to close all unnecessary sea cock.
Valuable objects such as electronics must be disassembled and store on land.....
Then you have to “triple” the number of normal fenders, dock lines, etc.
IF YOU FAIL TO DO ANY OF THESE, the policy is canceled.

I really implore Rafael to tell his story…

Last week I met a french guy, so we chat, he used to be hired by insurance adjuster to find “anything” on a boat. He said, if there was a fire, the insurance adjuster would hire him to find any electrical welding (if I u nderstood properly), as soon as they find 1, even if it is at the top of the mast, the policy is void and they don’t reimburse.
He said he was disgusted and like many sailor I met now simply has liability.

Alexandre

--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 2/15/18, Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups...com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying goodbye
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Thursday, February 15, 2018, 7:15 AM


 









The
insurance company based the premiums on the Agreed value ,
and then only will pay out based on what they determine the
market value is, because they don't want you to be
enriched ! Did they not e nrich themselves by charging
excessive premiums for coverage they probably never intended
to honor ? This kind of information needs to get out to the
entire boating community through the internet and sailing
magazines . I encourage anyone treated unfairly to relate
their story , if  it results in lost business maybe they
will get the message. If 10% of those covered by a company
cancelled and took their business elsewhere and gave the
reason why , it would get their attention. Its sad to lose a
dream .
Pat 

SM Shenanigans






-----Original
Message-----

From: Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>

To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtown

Sent: Thu, Feb 15, 2018 6:34 am

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owne rs] Amel owner saying
goodbye








 













Good morning Danny,





I also have an “agreed” policy (from Helvetia through de
Lassee), BUT as my lawyer told me, this is a rip off as, it
is written on the contrat that the insurance has the right
to challenge the “agreed value” and pay only the market
value because the owner would “enrich” himself if case
of a total loss. (meaning that: if you are reimburse the
agreed value, you would “enrich” yourself getting more
than the market value).


That is what my insurance is doing, so my lawyer ask me to
compile all the invoices for the last 5 years to prove that
1) vessel was better equipped justifying the agreed value,
2) vessel was better maintained (justifying the higher
agreed value) 3) that my expens es were higher than the
average, etc...


So now I have my own adjuster writing a full report with all
the details.


We have been working since November on this.





So for anyone thinking they are safely covered with an
“agreed” value, please read your entire policy. If you
want I can show the specific section where what I just
explained is written. That will be in french in my case.





Sincerely, Alexandre





--------------------------------------------


On Wed, 2/14/18, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
wrote:





Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying
goodbye


To: amely achtowners@...


Date: Wednesday, February 14, 2018, 10:51 PM








 
































I too have been raped by insurers in the past. I now


have a policy with an "agreed Value" . I hope
that


would help in the case of a write off.DannySM


299 Ocean PearlOn 15 February 2018 at 11:19


"Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@...


[amelyachtowners]"


<amelyachtowners@...>
wrote:





  Dear Rafael,








I think you need to tell


the Group “your” story about the insu rance.





We have the same insurance


Helvetia contracted through de Lassee and I really think


every Amel owner should know the ridiculous excuses they


used to remove 30% of the value of your boat.





It is not “my” place to


tell everybody the way they treated “you”, but I
will


write mine with all the details when it will be settled.






I am definitely sorry that


your vessel was destroy soon after you purchased her and
did


not had the joy of sailing her.





Sincerely, Alexandre








--------------------------------------------


On Wed, 2/14/18, rcavie


<no_reply@...>
wrote:





Subject: [Am el Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying


goodbye


To:


amelyachtowners@...


Date:


Wednesday, February 14, 2018, 1:57 PM








 





























Dear


friends AMEL ownersProbably this


will be


the last email that I send and I will withdraw from


the group. The reason is that Hurricane


Irma


destroyed my Amel SM2k and it will be


impossible for me to


recover it.The


insurance will only pay a fraction of


what


it would cost me to buy an equal one. Deductibles and


other reasons.This situation not only


destroyed my< br>

ship but my dreams. My dreams


of living on board with my


wife, my dreams


of crossing the Atlantic to the East, my





dreams of sailing the Mediterranean and perhaps other


seas


and finally returning to the beautiful


South of


Chile.


In this


group I gained friends


and knowledge and


for that, I thank each and every one of





you, especially Eric and Alexandre who from the
beginning


helped me with their advice.





If


you sail to Chile you will have a


friend


here.Greetings to





all


Fair


windsRafaelSM2k


246










 
< /div>

 


 

 


 

 


 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Change of seals for gearbox oil change

Jean-Pierre's MacBook Air <jgermain@...>
 

Hello Peter,

Gian Piero Staffa lives in Antigua and has a ’54.  If you need his email, I’ll send you his perso email addy.

Tell him I sent you…

Kind regards 

Jean-Pierre Germain
SY ELEUTHERA, SM 007

On 21 Feb 2018, at 10:47, Peter Forbes ppsforbes@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Fellow Amelians,

Does any one know of a mechanic experienced enough to undertake change of prop gearbox seals on Amel 54 in Antigua. 

Peter Forbes
00447836 209730
Carango
Amel 54 
St Lucia en route to Antigua 



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Copper-Coat AntiFouling

Rudolf Waldispuehl
 

Thank you Mark

You’re right C-Drive Maintenance needs to be done anyhow all 2-3 years; … and bottom cleaning every 1-2 month in all cases, (with copper as well).
I have not discovered a qualified yard nearby by now. I have searched the Web and it seems that there are more arguments against. 

With best regards
Ruedi

Von: <amelyachtowners@...> on behalf of "'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...>
Antworten an: <amelyachtowners@...>
Datum: Donnerstag, 15. Februar 2018 um 23:56
An: <amelyachtowners@...>
Betreff: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Copper-Coat AntiFouling

 

Ruedi, if you search here you will find many opinions for and against. Perhaps less for Copper-Coat. My question to you is, where are the savings if you need to haul your Amel every couple of years anyway for prop and c-drive maintenance? A big factor in the savings talked about in the Copper-Coat literature is not having to haul the boat and the boat yard savings. This is not the case with Amels.

 

You don’t say where you are located. Is there a qualified yard that knows how to mix and apply Copper-Coat near you. I was told by Copper-Coat there was are yard near me when I was in Florida. I asked the yard how many boats they had done. The answer was only one.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Dominica

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2018 6:09 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Copper-Coat AntiFouling

 

 

Dear Amel'ies 

 

Maybe you had an earlier conversation on this topic already? I'm new here so I don't know.

 

Copper-coat AF seems to be attractive if it lasts 10 and more years, despite the fact of the high price. 

But I'm not sure all is right what I have read in the Internet.I have seen many articles and different opinions about copper-coat antifouling, some of them are very controversial. 



So I would like to know from this group your experience with it, if someone have done this. 

 

Thanks and best regards

Ruedi


Change of seals for gearbox oil change

Peter Forbes
 

Fellow Amelians,

Does any one know of a mechanic experienced enough to undertake change of prop gearbox seals on Amel 54 in Antigua.

Peter Forbes
00447836 209730
Carango
Amel 54
St Lucia en route to Antigua


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Boat Insurance///transmission Amel 54 IBIS

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Porter,

Yes, taking into consideration all of the history, I agree you only have 1 realistic and dependable choice. Do you plan to do it in St. Thomas?

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus

Amel School  http://www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550

+1(832) 380-4970


On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 6:54 AM, Porter McRoberts portermcroberts@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Thanks Bill. Appreciated. 


Had a guy come out to the boat. We took the old filter back to his shop. Cut it open. Lots of metal inside. I am going to get a new transmission unless you argue against it. It solves both problems. Mystery air ( transmission guy here was also scratching his head as to a solution, and no he doesn’t sell tranny’s,) and metal loss on gears. 
I spoke to the ZF dealer in Florida. He said on all ZFs older than 4-5 years they would routinely machine off 10/1000” to make the cup fit into the cylinder. This was a common problem. 

Problem is I am dead in the water without a good tranny. 

Any guidance is always appreciated. 

Thanks
Porter. 




Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Anchor Locker

VLADIMIR SONSEV
 

Moldy pywood can be saved. Just clean it, dry well and apply penetrating epoxy. Follow instructions. Your can add a layer of fiberglass on top if needed. 

Vladimir
SM 345 "LIFE IS GOOD"

On Feb 21, 2018 05:01, "greatketch@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Gerhard,


This has been a popular topic recently.  It seems that this year many Super Maramus (mine included) have reached the age where the plywood in the chain locker reached the end of its useful life.  The only reason I can see for not fully encapsulating the plywood in the chain locker is just manufacturing expedience. There are very few places where Amel took shortcuts, so I guess I can forgive them this one.  Where our wood was coated, it was coated with glass and resin, not simply paint.

If the plywood is "moldy" it is almost certainly past the point where it can be saved, although others with more wooden boat experience than I might have some useful suggestions.

We replaced the horizontal plywood in our boat completely, and ground off a layer or two from the vertical bulkhead down to hard, dry wood before covering it with fiberglass and resin.  If you dig back a few months in the forum archives you'll find a lot of discussion about the various approaches to this project.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Freeport, Bahamas



---In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, <no_reply@...> wrote :


I take all the chain out every year to clean the anchor locker and as has been noted on previous posts, the plywood ceiling is always mouldy.  Does anybody know why the anchor locker is painted halfway up with white paint and the rest of the fiberglass is left bare and the plywood ceiling is left unpainted?  Has anybody painted the sides and especially the plywood ceiling?  If so, what paint was used?  Does anybody know what the existing white paint is?


Gerhard Hoffmann

Pepino SM381

Greece

 




On Feb 21, 2018 05:01, "greatketch@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Gerhard,


This has been a popular topic recently.  It seems that this year many Super Maramus (mine included) have reached the age where the plywood in the chain locker reached the end of its useful life.  The only reason I can see for not fully encapsulating the plywood in the chain locker is just manufacturing expedience. There are very few places where Amel took shortcuts, so I guess I can forgive them this one.  Where our wood was coated, it was coated with glass and resin, not simply paint.

If the plywood is "moldy" it is almost certainly past the point where it can be saved, although others with more wooden boat experience than I might have some useful suggestions.

We replaced the horizontal plywood in our boat completely, and ground off a layer or two from the vertical bulkhead down to hard, dry wood before covering it with fiberglass and resin.  If you dig back a few months in the forum archives you'll find a lot of discussion about the various approaches to this project.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Freeport, Bahamas



---In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, <no_reply@...> wrote :


I take all the chain out every year to clean the anchor locker and as has been noted on previous posts, the plywood ceiling is always mouldy.  Does anybody know why the anchor locker is painted halfway up with white paint and the rest of the fiberglass is left bare and the plywood ceiling is left unpainted?  Has anybody painted the sides and especially the plywood ceiling?  If so, what paint was used?  Does anybody know what the existing white paint is?


Gerhard Hoffmann

Pepino SM381

Greece

 



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

amelforme
 

Hanspeter, you can quit taking those crabby pills. They obviously work.

JOEL F. POTTER
CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST LLC
THE EXPERIENCED AMEL GUY
Office 954-462-5869 

On Feb 21, 2018, at 8:26 AM, 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

LOL

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Guadeloupe

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2018 8:39 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

 

 

Hanspeter, I have owned my Amel and been a member of this group for 11 years and never realized that this group was strictly a "technical exchange platform" thanks for enlightening me and the rest of the group  . OOPS , I guess technically , this was was a technical post. Please disregard , Sorry !

Pat

SM#123

-----Original Message-----
From: 'hanspeter.baettig@...' hanspeter.baettig@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Feb 20, 2018 11:45 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

 

Dear Mr.  Baileys and Danny

I don't like that you use this forum as an add and marketing platform. Insurance are different by countries. 

Mr. Baileys; you mentioned that we need an avocate at claim? My question ? who is paying the avocate ?

Looking forward that this platform remains as a technical exchange platform 

PS: there are lots of other social platforms to share individuels needs.

kr

Hanspeter

Tamango 2

SM16; Las Palmas



Von meinem iPhone gesendet


Am 19.02.2018 um 20:49 schrieb Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>:

 

Hi All,

I received a personal email asking the name of the insurance company that disappointed us. It was Haven Knox Johnson, a Lloyds of London Company. The broker was The Marina Shop of Opua NZ and the Assessor was Steve Lott of New Zealand.

We have a new Broker, Baileys Insurance brokers of Auckland NZ, and a new insurer recommended by them. QBE Marine insurers. Steve Bailey the principal of the company is a sailor himself. As always until you have a claim you don't know the quality of the insurer and we have yet to have a claim under this cover.(and hope we never will) However we have confidence in our broker.

Regards

Danny 

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 17 February 2018 at 07:24 "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Hi all,

Further to my below, no one said no so I copy here an email from my new broker sent after he read some of the posts.

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

Hi all,

I’ve been reading some of the comments posted by many of you about pleasure craft insurance policies.

I feel very sorry for you, and agreed it is not a good situation at all – but it shouldn’t be that way, and sounds like you’ve not been getting the right advice or support here.  We always use “agreed value” policies and they have worked for us and our clients as they should, many, many times.  One just less than a week ago in fact.

What you need is an advocate at claim time to ensure the claims process goes as it should – in addition t o ensuring your policy is set up correctly.  This is where an experienced Marine Insurance Broker comes in – well, a good one anyway!

There are also certain Insurance Companies to avoid out there.  Their policies aren’t worth the paper they are written on.

Sincere regards,

Neil Bailey

Director

Bailey Insurance Brokers

Auckland

New Zealand

On 16 February 2018 at 14:27 "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 60;

 

Hi all,

As I said before I was burned badly by an insurance company. I changed brokers and have a "agreed value" policy with my new broker.

I forwarded him some of the correspondence because, firstly I wanted him to know what was going on and secondly to see what he said regarding my "agreed Value" policy. He has sent me a response which is helpful. He does have a good name. Is it OK for me to share his reply with the group. I'm not trying to promote him, just to add something that may be helpful.

Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

Mangonui 
New Zealand

 

On 16 February 2018 at 06:42 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Alexandre, Trust me, I for one will reread my policy with a more critical eye. Its disgusting how an insurance company would look for any excuse , even an invalid one to escape their responsibly .. I will guarantee that the vast majority of boaters are not aware of these practices, and believe that they have an umbrella of protection , that in reality does not exist. I urge you guys to find a way to tell your story to a wider audience. 

Pat 

SM Shenanigans

-----Original Message-----
From: Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Thu, Feb 15, 2018 9:11 a m
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying goodbye

 

Hello Pat,

I totally agree with you Danny.

This is why my lawyer said it was a rip off to start with.
You are paying in good faith a higher premium thinking you are covered, but you are not.

I URGE everybody to read their insurance policies.
Most of you probably never even receive it (I had to ask for mine).

I think as a boating community, if we group ourselves we have a way to make things better.

Example on my insurance policy it says in case of a name storm approaching you have to:
remove anything that offers wind resistance which is: bimini, sails, lazy bags, blade of wind turbine, dinghy, etc. these items must be removed and store inside the boat. As Rafael tragically find out, this also include barbecues.. That is why they say “anything” even if not listed....
Then it says the boom must be attached to the deck.
Then you have to close all unnecessary sea cock.
Valuable objects such as electronics must be disassembled and store on land....
Then you have to “triple” the number of normal fenders, dock lines, etc.
IF YOU FAIL TO DO ANY OF THESE, the policy is canceled.

I really implore Rafael to tell his story…

Last week I met a french guy, so we chat, he used to be hired by insurance adjuster to find “anything” on a boat. He said, if there was a fire, the insurance adjuster would hire him to find any electrical welding (if I u nderstood properly), as soon as they find 1, even if it is at the top of the mast, the policy is void and they don’t reimburse.
He said he was disgusted and like many sailor I met now simply has liability.

Alexandre

--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 2/15/18, Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups..com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying goodbye
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Thursday, February 15, 2018, 7:15 AM


 









The
insurance company based the premiums on the Agreed value ,
and then only will pay out based on what they determine the
market value is, because they don't want you to be
enriched ! Did they not e nrich themselves by charging
excessive premiums for coverage they probably never intended
to honor ? This kind of information needs to get out to the
entire boating community through the internet and sailing
magazines . I encourage anyone treated unfairly to relate
their story , if  it results in lost business maybe they
will get the message. If 10% of those covered by a company
cancelled and took their business elsewhere and gave the
reason why , it would get their attention. Its sad to lose a
dream .
Pat 

SM Shenanigans






-----Original
Message-----

From: Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>

To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Thu, Feb 15, 2018 6:34 am

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owne rs] Amel owner saying
goodbye








 













Good morning Danny,





I also have an “agreed” policy (from Helvetia through de
Lassee), BUT as my lawyer told me, this is a rip off as, it
is written on the contrat that the insurance has the right
to challenge the “agreed value” and pay only the market
value because the owner would “enrich” himself if case
of a total loss. (meaning that: if you are reimburse the
agreed value, you would “enrich” yourself getting more
than the market value).


That is what my insurance is doing, so my lawyer ask me to
compile all the invoices for the last 5 years to prove that
1) vessel was better equipped justifying the agreed value,
2) vessel was better maintained (justifying the higher
agreed value) 3) that my expens es were higher than the
average, etc...


So now I have my own adjuster writing a full report with all
the details.


We have been working since November on this.





So for anyone thinking they are safely covered with an
“agreed” value, please read your entire policy. If you
want I can show the specific section where what I just
explained is written. That will be in french in my case.





Sincerely, Alexandre





--------------------------------------------


On Wed, 2/14/18, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
wrote:





Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying
goodbye


To: amely achtowners@...


Date: Wednesday, February 14, 2018, 10:51 PM








 
































I too have been raped by insurers in the past. I now


have a policy with an "agreed Value" . I hope
that


would help in the case of a write off.DannySM


299 Ocean PearlOn 15 February 2018 at 11:19


"Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@...


[amelyachtowners]"


<amelyachtowners@...>
wrote:





  Dear Rafael,








I think you need to tell


the Group “your” story about the insu rance.





We have the same insurance


Helvetia contracted through de Lassee and I really think


every Amel owner should know the ridiculous excuses they


used to remove 30% of the value of your boat.





It is not “my” place to


tell everybody the way they treated “you”, but I
will


write mine with all the details when it will be settled.






I am definitely sorry that


your vessel was destroy soon after you purchased her and
did


not had the joy of sailing her.





Sincerely, Alexandre








--------------------------------------------


On Wed, 2/14/18, rcavie


<no_reply@...>
wrote:





Subject: [Am el Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying


goodbye


To:


amelyachtowners@...


Date:


Wednesday, February 14, 2018, 1:57 PM








 





























Dear


friends AMEL ownersProbably this


will be


the last email that I send and I will withdraw from


the group. The reason is that Hurricane


Irma


destroyed my Amel SM2k and it will be


impossible for me to


recover it.The


insurance will only pay a fraction of


what


it would cost me to buy an equal one. Deductibles and


other reasons.This situation not only


destroyed my< br>

ship but my dreams. My dreams


of living on board with my


wife, my dreams


of crossing the Atlantic to the East, my





dreams of sailing the Mediterranean and perhaps other


seas


and finally returning to the beautiful


South of


Chile.


In this


group I gained friends


and knowledge and


for that, I thank each and every one of





you, especially Eric and Alexandre who from the
beginning


helped me with their advice.





If


you sail to Chile you will have a


friend


here.Greetings to





all


Fair


windsRafaelSM2k


246










 
< /div>

 


 

 


 

 


 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Hanspeter, 

When I read your email regarding "marketing," I again read the thread. I can see no direct marketing by anyone.

Our group does not have published rules, but we have evolved with some unwritten rules of etiquette that have made this group one of the best available. The owner of the group is the only moderator, and I can think of only 2 times in 10 years that he moderated a discussion thread.

Many of us freely share successes and failures. These can involve parts, materials, vendors, and anything else involved with owning and maintaining or Amel. I believe that at least a few owners benefit with the shared information.

I urge you to re-read the post. I believe you will agree.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus
Amel School www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970

On Feb 21, 2018 08:04, "simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Dear Hanspeter,
I am sorry you see my contributions as 'marketing'. It is not. It is no more or less than sharing information and experience to the benefit of everyone. In this case it is regarding insurance experience, A very troubled area. No different to sharing where to source a hard to find part. It is to the benefit of all. As with all sharing it is up to individual members to make their own judgement.
Kind regards
Danny

Sent from my Vodafone Smart

On 21 Feb 2018 1:46 p.m., "'hanspeter.baettig@bluemail.ch' hanspeter.baettig@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

Dear Mr.  Baileys and Danny
I don't like that you use this forum as an add and marketing platform. Insurance are different by countries. 
Mr. Baileys; you mentioned that we need an avocate at claim? My question ? who is paying the avocate ?
Looking forward that this platform remains as a technical exchange platform 
PS: there are lots of other social platforms to share individuels needs.
kr
Hanspeter
Tamango 2
SM16; Las Palmas


Von meinem iPhone gesendet

Am 19.02.2018 um 20:49 schrieb Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>:

 

Hi All,

I received a personal email asking the name of the insurance company that disappointed us. It was Haven Knox Johnson, a Lloyds of London Company. The broker was The Marina Shop of Opua NZ and the Assessor was Steve Lott of New Zealand.

We have a new Broker, Baileys Insurance brokers of Auckland NZ, and a new insurer recommended by them. QBE Marine insurers. Steve Bailey the principal of the company is a sailor himself. As always until you have a claim you don't know the quality of the insurer and we have yet to have a claim under this cover.(and hope we never will) However we have confidence in our broker.

Regards

Danny 

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 17 February 2018 at 07:24 "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 

 

Hi all,

Further to my below, no one said no so I copy here an email from my new broker sent after he read some of the posts.

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

Hi all,

I’ve been reading some of the comments posted by many of you about pleasure craft insurance policies.

I feel very sorry for you, and agreed it is not a good situation at all – but it shouldn’t be that way, and sounds like you’ve not been getting the right advice or support here.  We always use “agreed value” policies and they have worked for us and our clients as they should, many, many times.  One just less than a week ago in fact.

What you need is an advocate at claim time to ensure the claims process goes as it should – in addition t o ensuring your policy is set up correctly.  This is where an experienced Marine Insurance Broker comes in – well, a good one anyway!

There are also certain Insurance Companies to avoid out there.  Their policies aren’t worth the paper they are written on.

Sincere regards,

Neil Bailey

Director

Bailey Insurance Brokers

Auckland

New Zealand

On 16 February 2018 at 14:27 "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

60;

 

Hi all,

As I said before I was burned badly by an insurance company. I changed brokers and have a "agreed value" policy with my new broker.

I forwarded him some of the correspondence because, firstly I wanted him to know what was going on and secondly to see what he said regarding my "agreed Value" policy. He has sent me a response which is helpful. He does have a good name. Is it OK for me to share his reply with the group. I'm not trying to promote him, just to add something that may be helpful.

Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

Mangonui 
New Zealand


On 16 February 2018 at 06:42 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 

Alexandre, Trust me, I for one will reread my policy with a more critical eye. Its disgusting how an insurance company would look for any excuse , even an invalid one to escape their responsibly .. I will guarantee that the vast majority of boaters are not aware of these practices, and believe that they have an umbrella of protection , that in reality does not exist. I urge you guys to find a way to tell your story to a wider audience. 

Pat 
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thu, Feb 15, 2018 9:11 a m
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying goodbye

 
Hello Pat,

I totally agree with you Danny.

This is why my lawyer said it was a rip off to start with.
You are paying in good faith a higher premium thinking you are covered, but you are not.

I URGE everybody to read their insurance policies.
Most of you probably never even receive it (I had to ask for mine).

I think as a boating community, if we group ourselves we have a way to make things better.

Example on my insurance policy it says in case of a name storm approaching you have to:
remove anything that offers wind resistance which is: bimini, sails, lazy bags, blade of wind turbine, dinghy, etc. these items must be removed and store inside the boat. As Rafael tragically find out, this also include barbecues. That is why they say “anything” even if not listed...
Then it says the boom must be attached to the deck.
Then you have to close all unnecessary sea cock.
Valuable objects such as electronics must be disassembled and store on land...
Then you have to “triple” the number of normal fenders, dock lines, etc.
IF YOU FAIL TO DO ANY OF THESE, the policy is canceled.

I really implore Rafael to tell his story…

Last week I met a french guy, so we chat, he used to be hired by insurance adjuster to find “anything” on a boat. He said, if there was a fire, the insurance adjuster would hire him to find any electrical welding (if I u nderstood properly), as soon as they find 1, even if it is at the top of the mast, the policy is void and they don’t reimburse.
He said he was disgusted and like many sailor I met now simply has liability.

Alexandre

--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 2/15/18, Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying goodbye
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, February 15, 2018, 7:15 AM


 









The
insurance company based the premiums on the Agreed value ,
and then only will pay out based on what they determine the
market value is, because they don't want you to be
enriched ! Did they not e nrich themselves by charging
excessive premiums for coverage they probably never intended
to honor ? This kind of information needs to get out to the
entire boating community through the internet and sailing
magazines . I encourage anyone treated unfairly to relate
their story , if  it results in lost business maybe they
will get the message. If 10% of those covered by a company
cancelled and took their business elsewhere and gave the
reason why , it would get their attention. Its sad to lose a
dream .
Pat 

SM Shenanigans






-----Original
Message-----

From: Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>

To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Thu, Feb 15, 2018 6:34 am

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owne rs] Amel owner saying
goodbye








 













Good morning Danny,





I also have an “agreed” policy (from Helvetia through de
Lassee), BUT as my lawyer told me, this is a rip off as, it
is written on the contrat that the insurance has the right
to challenge the “agreed value” and pay only the market
value because the owner would “enrich” himself if case
of a total loss. (meaning that: if you are reimburse the
agreed value, you would “enrich” yourself getting more
than the market value).


That is what my insurance is doing, so my lawyer ask me to
compile all the invoices for the last 5 years to prove that
1) vessel was better equipped justifying the agreed value,
2) vessel was better maintained (justifying the higher
agreed value) 3) that my expens es were higher than the
average, etc...


So now I have my own adjuster writing a full report with all
the details.


We have been working since November on this.





So for anyone thinking they are safely covered with an
“agreed” value, please read your entire policy. If you
want I can show the specific section where what I just
explained is written. That will be in french in my case.





Sincerely, Alexandre





--------------------------------------------


On Wed, 2/14/18, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:





Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying
goodbye


To: amely achtowners@...


Date: Wednesday, February 14, 2018, 10:51 PM








 
































I too have been raped by insurers in the past. I now


have a policy with an "agreed Value" . I hope
that


would help in the case of a write off.DannySM


299 Ocean PearlOn 15 February 2018 at 11:19


"Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@...


[amelyachtowners]"


<amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:





  Dear Rafael,








I think you need to tell


the Group “your” story about the insu rance.





We have the same insurance


Helvetia contracted through de Lassee and I really think


every Amel owner should know the ridiculous excuses they


used to remove 30% of the value of your boat.





It is not “my” place to


tell everybody the way they treated “you”, but I
will


write mine with all the details when it will be settled.






I am definitely sorry that


your vessel was destroy soon after you purchased her and
did


not had the joy of sailing her.





Sincerely, Alexandre








--------------------------------------------


On Wed, 2/14/18, rcavie


<no_reply@...>
wrote:





Subject: [Am el Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying


goodbye


To:


amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com


Date:


Wednesday, February 14, 2018, 1:57 PM








 





























Dear


friends AMEL ownersProbably this


will be


the last email that I send and I will withdraw from


the group. The reason is that Hurricane


Irma


destroyed my Amel SM2k and it will be


impossible for me to


recover it.The


insurance will only pay a fraction of


what


it would cost me to buy an equal one. Deductibles and


other reasons.This situation not only


destroyed my< br>

ship but my dreams. My dreams


of living on board with my


wife, my dreams


of crossing the Atlantic to the East, my





dreams of sailing the Mediterranean and perhaps other


seas


and finally returning to the beautiful


South of


Chile.


In this


group I gained friends


and knowledge and


for that, I thank each and every one of





you, especially Eric and Alexandre who from the
beginning


helped me with their advice.





If


you sail to Chile you will have a


friend


here.Greetings to





all


Fair


windsRafaelSM2k


246











 
< /div>

 


 

 


 

 


 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

Ian Townsend
 

I agree with Danny and would like to see this conversation continue as may be relevant to us. Given what we, general Caribbean boaters and AMEL owners, have experienced this season, it is particularly relevant this year. Perhaps not as much if you are in other areas of the world. I use the last conversation string about Pantaenius as an example. No boats below 31. Saved me time from applying. Our insurer is/was Falvey who announced their exit from the yacht insurance business leaving us adrift so to speak. Now we are scrambling and trying to adjust our cruising plans for this summer. It's a big deal to us. So we appreciate all the advice given by our fellow AMEL owners.

Last thought, you don't have to read it if you don't want.

Ian Townsend
S/V Loca Lola II 
SM153
George Town, Exuma, Bahamas

On Feb 21, 2018, at 4:01 AM, simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Dear Hanspeter,
I am sorry you see my contributions as 'marketing'. It is not. It is no more or less than sharing information and experience to the benefit of everyone. In this case it is regarding insurance experience, A very troubled area. No different to sharing where to source a hard to find part. It is to the benefit of all. As with all sharing it is up to individual members to make their own judgement.
Kind regards
Danny

Sent from my Vodafone Smart

On 21 Feb 2018 1:46 p.m., "'hanspeter.baettig@...' hanspeter.baettig@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Dear Mr.  Baileys and Danny
I don't like that you use this forum as an add and marketing platform. Insurance are different by countries. 
Mr. Baileys; you mentioned that we need an avocate at claim? My question ? who is paying the avocate ?
Looking forward that this platform remains as a technical exchange platform 
PS: there are lots of other social platforms to share individuels needs.
kr
Hanspeter
Tamango 2
SM16; Las Palmas


Von meinem iPhone gesendet

Am 19.02.2018 um 20:49 schrieb Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>:

 

Hi All,

I received a personal email asking the name of the insurance company that disappointed us. It was Haven Knox Johnson, a Lloyds of London Company. The broker was The Marina Shop of Opua NZ and the Assessor was Steve Lott of New Zealand.

We have a new Broker, Baileys Insurance brokers of Auckland NZ, and a new insurer recommended by them. QBE Marine insurers. Steve Bailey the principal of the company is a sailor himself. As always until you have a claim you don't know the quality of the insurer and we have yet to have a claim under this cover.(and hope we never will) However we have confidence in our broker.

Regards

Danny 

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 17 February 2018 at 07:24 "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Hi all,

Further to my below, no one said no so I copy here an email from my new broker sent after he read some of the posts.

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

Hi all,

I’ve been reading some of the comments posted by many of you about pleasure craft insurance policies.

I feel very sorry for you, and agreed it is not a good situation at all – but it shouldn’t be that way, and sounds like you’ve not been getting the right advice or support here.  We always use “agreed value” policies and they have worked for us and our clients as they should, many, many times.  One just less than a week ago in fact.

What you need is an advocate at claim time to ensure the claims process goes as it should – in addition t o ensuring your policy is set up correctly.  This is where an experienced Marine Insurance Broker comes in – well, a good one anyway!

There are also certain Insurance Companies to avoid out there.  Their policies aren’t worth the paper they are written on.

Sincere regards,

Neil Bailey

Director

Bailey Insurance Brokers

Auckland

New Zealand

On 16 February 2018 at 14:27 "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 60;

 

Hi all,

As I said before I was burned badly by an insurance company. I changed brokers and have a "agreed value" policy with my new broker.

I forwarded him some of the correspondence because, firstly I wanted him to know what was going on and secondly to see what he said regarding my "agreed Value" policy. He has sent me a response which is helpful. He does have a good name. Is it OK for me to share his reply with the group. I'm not trying to promote him, just to add something that may be helpful.

Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

Mangonui 
New Zealand


On 16 February 2018 at 06:42 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Alexandre, Trust me, I for one will reread my policy with a more critical eye. Its disgusting how an insurance company would look for any excuse , even an invalid one to escape their responsibly .. I will guarantee that the vast majority of boaters are not aware of these practices, and believe that they have an umbrella of protection , that in reality does not exist. I urge you guys to find a way to tell your story to a wider audience. 

Pat 
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Thu, Feb 15, 2018 9:11 a m
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying goodbye

 
Hello Pat,

I totally agree with you Danny.

This is why my lawyer said it was a rip off to start with.
You are paying in good faith a higher premium thinking you are covered, but you are not.

I URGE everybody to read their insurance policies.
Most of you probably never even receive it (I had to ask for mine).

I think as a boating community, if we group ourselves we have a way to make things better.

Example on my insurance policy it says in case of a name storm approaching you have to:
remove anything that offers wind resistance which is: bimini, sails, lazy bags, blade of wind turbine, dinghy, etc. these items must be removed and store inside the boat. As Rafael tragically find out, this also include barbecues. That is why they say “anything” even if not listed...
Then it says the boom must be attached to the deck.
Then you have to close all unnecessary sea cock.
Valuable objects such as electronics must be disassembled and store on land...
Then you have to “triple” the number of normal fenders, dock lines, etc.
IF YOU FAIL TO DO ANY OF THESE, the policy is canceled.

I really implore Rafael to tell his story…

Last week I met a french guy, so we chat, he used to be hired by insurance adjuster to find “anything” on a boat. He said, if there was a fire, the insurance adjuster would hire him to find any electrical welding (if I u nderstood properly), as soon as they find 1, even if it is at the top of the mast, the policy is void and they don’t reimburse.
He said he was disgusted and like many sailor I met now simply has liability.

Alexandre

--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 2/15/18, Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying goodbye
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Thursday, February 15, 2018, 7:15 AM


 









The
insurance company based the premiums on the Agreed value ,
and then only will pay out based on what they determine the
market value is, because they don't want you to be
enriched ! Did they not e nrich themselves by charging
excessive premiums for coverage they probably never intended
to honor ? This kind of information needs to get out to the
entire boating community through the internet and sailing
magazines . I encourage anyone treated unfairly to relate
their story , if  it results in lost business maybe they
will get the message. If 10% of those covered by a company
cancelled and took their business elsewhere and gave the
reason why , it would get their attention. Its sad to lose a
dream .
Pat 

SM Shenanigans






-----Original
Message-----

From: Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>

To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Thu, Feb 15, 2018 6:34 am

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owne rs] Amel owner saying
goodbye








 













Good morning Danny,





I also have an “agreed” policy (from Helvetia through de
Lassee), BUT as my lawyer told me, this is a rip off as, it
is written on the contrat that the insurance has the right
to challenge the “agreed value” and pay only the market
value because the owner would “enrich” himself if case
of a total loss. (meaning that: if you are reimburse the
agreed value, you would “enrich” yourself getting more
than the market value).


That is what my insurance is doing, so my lawyer ask me to
compile all the invoices for the last 5 years to prove that
1) vessel was better equipped justifying the agreed value,
2) vessel was better maintained (justifying the higher
agreed value) 3) that my expens es were higher than the
average, etc...


So now I have my own adjuster writing a full report with all
the details.


We have been working since November on this.





So for anyone thinking they are safely covered with an
“agreed” value, please read your entire policy. If you
want I can show the specific section where what I just
explained is written. That will be in french in my case.





Sincerely, Alexandre





--------------------------------------------


On Wed, 2/14/18, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
wrote:





Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying
goodbye


To: amely achtowners@...


Date: Wednesday, February 14, 2018, 10:51 PM








 
































I too have been raped by insurers in the past. I now


have a policy with an "agreed Value" . I hope
that


would help in the case of a write off.DannySM


299 Ocean PearlOn 15 February 2018 at 11:19


"Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@...


[amelyachtowners]"


<amelyachtowners@...>
wrote:





  Dear Rafael,








I think you need to tell


the Group “your” story about the insu rance.





We have the same insurance


Helvetia contracted through de Lassee and I really think


every Amel owner should know the ridiculous excuses they


used to remove 30% of the value of your boat.





It is not “my” place to


tell everybody the way they treated “you”, but I
will


write mine with all the details when it will be settled.






I am definitely sorry that


your vessel was destroy soon after you purchased her and
did


not had the joy of sailing her.





Sincerely, Alexandre








--------------------------------------------


On Wed, 2/14/18, rcavie


<no_reply@...>
wrote:





Subject: [Am el Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying


goodbye


To:


amelyachtowners@...


Date:


Wednesday, February 14, 2018, 1:57 PM








 





























Dear


friends AMEL ownersProbably this


will be


the last email that I send and I will withdraw from


the group. The reason is that Hurricane


Irma


destroyed my Amel SM2k and it will be


impossible for me to


recover it.The


insurance will only pay a fraction of


what


it would cost me to buy an equal one. Deductibles and


other reasons.This situation not only


destroyed my< br>

ship but my dreams. My dreams


of living on board with my


wife, my dreams


of crossing the Atlantic to the East, my





dreams of sailing the Mediterranean and perhaps other


seas


and finally returning to the beautiful


South of


Chile.


In this


group I gained friends


and knowledge and


for that, I thank each and every one of





you, especially Eric and Alexandre who from the
beginning


helped me with their advice.





If


you sail to Chile you will have a


friend


here.Greetings to





all


Fair


windsRafaelSM2k


246











 
< /div>

 


 

 


 

 


 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

Mark Erdos
 

LOL

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Guadeloupe

www.creampuff.us

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2018 8:39 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

 

 

Hanspeter, I have owned my Amel and been a member of this group for 11 years and never realized that this group was strictly a "technical exchange platform" thanks for enlightening me and the rest of the group  . OOPS , I guess technically , this was was a technical post. Please disregard , Sorry !

Pat

SM#123

-----Original Message-----
From: 'hanspeter.baettig@...' hanspeter.baettig@... [amelyachtowners]
To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Tue, Feb 20, 2018 11:45 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Insurance. Does it deliver

 

Dear Mr.  Baileys and Danny

I don't like that you use this forum as an add and marketing platform. Insurance are different by countries. 

Mr. Baileys; you mentioned that we need an avocate at claim? My question ? who is paying the avocate ?

Looking forward that this platform remains as a technical exchange platform 

PS: there are lots of other social platforms to share individuels needs.

kr

Hanspeter

Tamango 2

SM16; Las Palmas



Von meinem iPhone gesendet


Am 19.02.2018 um 20:49 schrieb Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>:

 

Hi All,

I received a personal email asking the name of the insurance company that disappointed us. It was Haven Knox Johnson, a Lloyds of London Company. The broker was The Marina Shop of Opua NZ and the Assessor was Steve Lott of New Zealand.

We have a new Broker, Baileys Insurance brokers of Auckland NZ, and a new insurer recommended by them. QBE Marine insurers. Steve Bailey the principal of the company is a sailor himself. As always until you have a claim you don't know the quality of the insurer and we have yet to have a claim under this cover.(and hope we never will) However we have confidence in our broker.

Regards

Danny 

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 17 February 2018 at 07:24 "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Hi all,

Further to my below, no one said no so I copy here an email from my new broker sent after he read some of the posts.

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

Hi all,

I’ve been reading some of the comments posted by many of you about pleasure craft insurance policies.

I feel very sorry for you, and agreed it is not a good situation at all – but it shouldn’t be that way, and sounds like you’ve not been getting the right advice or support here.  We always use “agreed value” policies and they have worked for us and our clients as they should, many, many times.  One just less than a week ago in fact.

What you need is an advocate at claim time to ensure the claims process goes as it should – in addition t o ensuring your policy is set up correctly.  This is where an experienced Marine Insurance Broker comes in – well, a good one anyway!

There are also certain Insurance Companies to avoid out there.  Their policies aren’t worth the paper they are written on.

Sincere regards,

Neil Bailey

Director

Bailey Insurance Brokers

Auckland

New Zealand

On 16 February 2018 at 14:27 "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 60;

 

Hi all,

As I said before I was burned badly by an insurance company. I changed brokers and have a "agreed value" policy with my new broker.

I forwarded him some of the correspondence because, firstly I wanted him to know what was going on and secondly to see what he said regarding my "agreed Value" policy. He has sent me a response which is helpful. He does have a good name. Is it OK for me to share his reply with the group. I'm not trying to promote him, just to add something that may be helpful.

Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

Mangonui 
New Zealand

 

On 16 February 2018 at 06:42 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Alexandre, Trust me, I for one will reread my policy with a more critical eye. Its disgusting how an insurance company would look for any excuse , even an invalid one to escape their responsibly .. I will guarantee that the vast majority of boaters are not aware of these practices, and believe that they have an umbrella of protection , that in reality does not exist. I urge you guys to find a way to tell your story to a wider audience. 

Pat 

SM Shenanigans

-----Original Message-----
From: Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Thu, Feb 15, 2018 9:11 a m
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying goodbye

 

Hello Pat,

I totally agree with you Danny.

This is why my lawyer said it was a rip off to start with.
You are paying in good faith a higher premium thinking you are covered, but you are not.

I URGE everybody to read their insurance policies.
Most of you probably never even receive it (I had to ask for mine).

I think as a boating community, if we group ourselves we have a way to make things better.

Example on my insurance policy it says in case of a name storm approaching you have to:
remove anything that offers wind resistance which is: bimini, sails, lazy bags, blade of wind turbine, dinghy, etc. these items must be removed and store inside the boat. As Rafael tragically find out, this also include barbecues. That is why they say “anything” even if not listed....
Then it says the boom must be attached to the deck.
Then you have to close all unnecessary sea cock.
Valuable objects such as electronics must be disassembled and store on land...
Then you have to “triple” the number of normal fenders, dock lines, etc.
IF YOU FAIL TO DO ANY OF THESE, the policy is canceled.

I really implore Rafael to tell his story…

Last week I met a french guy, so we chat, he used to be hired by insurance adjuster to find “anything” on a boat. He said, if there was a fire, the insurance adjuster would hire him to find any electrical welding (if I u nderstood properly), as soon as they find 1, even if it is at the top of the mast, the policy is void and they don’t reimburse.
He said he was disgusted and like many sailor I met now simply has liability.

Alexandre

--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 2/15/18, Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying goodbye
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Thursday, February 15, 2018, 7:15 AM


 









The
insurance company based the premiums on the Agreed value ,
and then only will pay out based on what they determine the
market value is, because they don't want you to be
enriched ! Did they not e nrich themselves by charging
excessive premiums for coverage they probably never intended
to honor ? This kind of information needs to get out to the
entire boating community through the internet and sailing
magazines . I encourage anyone treated unfairly to relate
their story , if  it results in lost business maybe they
will get the message. If 10% of those covered by a company
cancelled and took their business elsewhere and gave the
reason why , it would get their attention. Its sad to lose a
dream .
Pat 

SM Shenanigans






-----Original
Message-----

From: Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>

To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Thu, Feb 15, 2018 6:34 am

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owne rs] Amel owner saying
goodbye








 













Good morning Danny,





I also have an “agreed” policy (from Helvetia through de
Lassee), BUT as my lawyer told me, this is a rip off as, it
is written on the contrat that the insurance has the right
to challenge the “agreed value” and pay only the market
value because the owner would “enrich” himself if case
of a total loss. (meaning that: if you are reimburse the
agreed value, you would “enrich” yourself getting more
than the market value).


That is what my insurance is doing, so my lawyer ask me to
compile all the invoices for the last 5 years to prove that
1) vessel was better equipped justifying the agreed value,
2) vessel was better maintained (justifying the higher
agreed value) 3) that my expens es were higher than the
average, etc...


So now I have my own adjuster writing a full report with all
the details.


We have been working since November on this.





So for anyone thinking they are safely covered with an
“agreed” value, please read your entire policy. If you
want I can show the specific section where what I just
explained is written. That will be in french in my case.





Sincerely, Alexandre





--------------------------------------------


On Wed, 2/14/18, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@...
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
wrote:





Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying
goodbye


To: amely achtowners@...


Date: Wednesday, February 14, 2018, 10:51 PM








 
































I too have been raped by insurers in the past. I now


have a policy with an "agreed Value" . I hope
that


would help in the case of a write off.DannySM


299 Ocean PearlOn 15 February 2018 at 11:19


"Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@...


[amelyachtowners]"


<amelyachtowners@...>
wrote:





  Dear Rafael,








I think you need to tell


the Group “your” story about the insu rance.





We have the same insurance


Helvetia contracted through de Lassee and I really think


every Amel owner should know the ridiculous excuses they


used to remove 30% of the value of your boat.





It is not “my” place to


tell everybody the way they treated “you”, but I
will


write mine with all the details when it will be settled.






I am definitely sorry that


your vessel was destroy soon after you purchased her and
did


not had the joy of sailing her.





Sincerely, Alexandre








--------------------------------------------


On Wed, 2/14/18, rcavie


<no_reply@...>
wrote:





Subject: [Am el Yacht Owners] Amel owner saying


goodbye


To:


amelyachtowners@...


Date:


Wednesday, February 14, 2018, 1:57 PM








 





























Dear


friends AMEL ownersProbably this


will be


the last email that I send and I will withdraw from


the group. The reason is that Hurricane


Irma


destroyed my Amel SM2k and it will be


impossible for me to


recover it.The


insurance will only pay a fraction of


what


it would cost me to buy an equal one. Deductibles and


other reasons.This situation not only


destroyed my< br>

ship but my dreams. My dreams


of living on board with my


wife, my dreams


of crossing the Atlantic to the East, my





dreams of sailing the Mediterranean and perhaps other


seas


and finally returning to the beautiful


South of


Chile.


In this


group I gained friends


and knowledge and


for that, I thank each and every one of





you, especially Eric and Alexandre who from the
beginning


helped me with their advice.





If


you sail to Chile you will have a


friend


here.Greetings to





all


Fair


windsRafaelSM2k


246










 
< /div>