Date   

Re: Shore power, small battery charger, genset, inverter.

 

Chris,

It is impossible for me to know what has been changed since 433 was built. 

You should not switch power sources with any load. The SM2k originally had an automated relay switch that gave the generator preference and would switch the main AC distribution panel from shore power to generator power. Although it was not the right thing to do, the original battery chargers would be unaffected when this happened. You do not have either of the original chargers. I am not sure that you have the relay switch above, or if the relay switch is working correctly. Your SM did not have a "standard inverter." The comfort pack did not include an inverter. There was a small inverter installed with the TV option. Are you beginning to see that there is almost no way any of us can directly help you with the known information?

As Ryan pointed out, if the Main 220 breaker is opening immediately when the smaller charger is turned ON, the fault is most likely a ground fault. That ground fault is likely an issue with the internal electronics of that charger or the wiring to that charger. There is no way that I can foresee anyone being able to give you specific instructions to a solution. Additionally, I have no technician to recommend in Grand Cayman.

To further confuse the issue, you say, "The large charger is a (Mastervolt) Chargemaster 24/40-3" AND "The small charger is a Victron Skylla-TG 24 100" AND  If this is correct, it totally confuses me because you must have them reversed...the Victron is 100 amps and the Mastervolt is 40 amps. I am not sure which charger is working.

My best recommendation is to temporarily use only the charger that works and to find an experienced and certified marine electrician. 

When you SM was new and assuming it was sold with either the Comfort Pack or the original buyer invested in two chargers, they were: Dolphin 100 amp charger and a Dolphin 30 amp charger.  During most of the SM production, Amel did not have an inverter option but installed an inverter that the owner would provide. They installed it in the engine room and with separate circuits and receptacles for the inverter output. The AC panel and the Inverter circuit was totally separate. Amel also installed a small inverter with the TV option. That was located under the nav table. Many owners have since installed Victron Inverter Chargers rewiring the AC panel to give the Microwave and outlets direct "inverter only" power from the inverter charger. The Victron Skylla-TG 24 100 is a charger only, without the inverter capabilities.

I hope this helps you. If you would care to call me, maybe I can provide more help...number below...WhatsApp is fine.
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Wed, Jul 22, 2020 at 5:23 PM Christopher Bromley <bromleyc@...> wrote:

Hello Bill,

              Thank you very much for responding so swiftly.

   I am with my boat in Grand Cayman, Cayman Islands. I had assumed the small charger and the 24V to 220V inverter were part of Pure Magic's comfort package, but other than the manufacturers' operating manuals - which I have read - I am not aware of installation documentation specific to my boat. Pure Magic had one previous owner and it may help if I contact him to see if he can fill in the information. If the problem with switching on the small charger and immediately  tripping  the main 220V breaker in the autopilot compartment (and this developed only after mistakenly starting the genset with the small charger still switched on - which the SM manual expressly advises against) does not sound familar to any one, then I should probably choose between looking behind the 220V switch panel or inside the small charger for a short ( after isolating the boat from mains power) or involving a specialist electrician. I am curious to know what type of damage risk the SM manual is cautioning against when it stresses the importance of not starting the genset when there are appliances still switched on at the 220 V switch panel.Is it damage to the genset or damage to the appliances?

  If there is any other approach you would recommend I'd be grateful for your advice..

          Thanks again for your help,

             Chris Bromley

            


On July 22, 2020 at 12:35 PM CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:

Chris,

I am not sure that anyone can help you here with confidence. Almost everything you listed is not original equipment. For instance a big question for me would be: Who added this equipment and is the installation documented?

Maybe we could suggest some help if you would state where you are. 


Best,

CW Bill Rouse 
Amel Owners Yacht School
+1 832-380-4970 | brouse@...
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com 
Yacht School Calendar: www.preparetocastoff.blogspot.com/p/calendar.html


   

On Wed, Jul 22, 2020, 10:40 AM Christopher Bromley < bromleyc@...> wrote:
My SM Pure Magic, hull no. 433, is presently connected to shorepower @ 220V, 60 Hz. During a recent inspection I was asked to operate the Onan genset, but overlooked switching off the small battery charger on the 220V switchboard before running the genset for a few minutes. Everything controlled from the 220V swichboard is working normally except the small battery charger which usually starts off at about 35A. Now the main 220V breaker inside the rotary autopilot compartment trips off immediately if I switch on the small circuit breaker. Resetting this trip and leaving  the small charger off restores 220v & everything else on the 220V switchboard works as before. There is no sign or smell of overheated circuitry, but I think there must be a short circuit somewhere. I'd really appreciate advice on how to troubleshoot this problem or could the small charger be fried beyond repair? The small charger is a Victron Skylla-TG 24 100, if I'm looking at the right unit.
 Another couple of electrical  questions while on the forum: the large charger I only use with the genset. Typically the charger starts at about 80 - 90 A, but soon - within a minute or two - falls to 20- 30 A and tails off at less than 10A even though the battery bank is short of a full charge, perhaps down at 70%. Is there a simple adjustment I can make to the large charger to keep up its output until closer to a full charge or does the charger need a specialist electrician's attention? The large charger has operated in this way for at least a couple of years. It is a Chargemaster 24/40-3.
 Lastly, I'd like to be sure of correctly identifying the 24V to 220V inverter, the one described in the owner's manual as being capable of running the microwave long enough from the 24 V battery bank to make a cup of coffee, after which it shuts down. Where is it in the boat and how do I get the microwave to run off it rather than from shorepower or the genset? 
   Thank you for your advice,
      Chris Bromley

 

 


Fuel tank inspection

Patrick McAneny
 

I want to clean my fuel tank, I can only see one small cap that I assume is for the sending unit. Before I tear off the foam cover glued to the tank looking for a larger inspection port, I thought I would ask if one exists on the top of the tank.
 Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


Re: Shore power, small battery charger, genset, inverter.

Christopher Bromley
 

Hello Bill,

              Thank you very much for responding so swiftly.

   I am with my boat in Grand Cayman, Cayman Islands. I had assumed the small charger and the 24V to 220V inverter were part of Pure Magic's comfort package, but other than the manufacturers' operating manuals - which I have read - I am not aware of installation documentation specific to my boat. Pure Magic had one previous owner and it may help if I contact him to see if he can fill in the information. If the problem with switching on the small charger and immediately  tripping  the main 220V breaker in the autopilot compartment (and this developed only after mistakenly starting the genset with the small charger still switched on - which the SM manual expressly advises against) does not sound familar to any one, then I should probably choose between looking behind the 220V switch panel or inside the small charger for a short ( after isolating the boat from mains power) or involving a specialist electrician. I am curious to know what type of damage risk the SM manual is cautioning against when it stresses the importance of not starting the genset when there are appliances still switched on at the 220 V switch panel.Is it damage to the genset or damage to the appliances?

  If there is any other approach you would recommend I'd be grateful for your advice..

          Thanks again for your help,

             Chris Bromley

            


On July 22, 2020 at 12:35 PM CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:

Chris,

I am not sure that anyone can help you here with confidence. Almost everything you listed is not original equipment. For instance a big question for me would be: Who added this equipment and is the installation documented?

Maybe we could suggest some help if you would state where you are. 


Best,

CW Bill Rouse 
Amel Owners Yacht School
+1 832-380-4970 | brouse@...
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com 
Yacht School Calendar: www.preparetocastoff.blogspot.com/p/calendar.html


   

On Wed, Jul 22, 2020, 10:40 AM Christopher Bromley < bromleyc@...> wrote:
My SM Pure Magic, hull no. 433, is presently connected to shorepower @ 220V, 60 Hz. During a recent inspection I was asked to operate the Onan genset, but overlooked switching off the small battery charger on the 220V switchboard before running the genset for a few minutes. Everything controlled from the 220V swichboard is working normally except the small battery charger which usually starts off at about 35A. Now the main 220V breaker inside the rotary autopilot compartment trips off immediately if I switch on the small circuit breaker. Resetting this trip and leaving  the small charger off restores 220v & everything else on the 220V switchboard works as before. There is no sign or smell of overheated circuitry, but I think there must be a short circuit somewhere. I'd really appreciate advice on how to troubleshoot this problem or could the small charger be fried beyond repair? The small charger is a Victron Skylla-TG 24 100, if I'm looking at the right unit.
 Another couple of electrical  questions while on the forum: the large charger I only use with the genset. Typically the charger starts at about 80 - 90 A, but soon - within a minute or two - falls to 20- 30 A and tails off at less than 10A even though the battery bank is short of a full charge, perhaps down at 70%. Is there a simple adjustment I can make to the large charger to keep up its output until closer to a full charge or does the charger need a specialist electrician's attention? The large charger has operated in this way for at least a couple of years. It is a Chargemaster 24/40-3.
 Lastly, I'd like to be sure of correctly identifying the 24V to 220V inverter, the one described in the owner's manual as being capable of running the microwave long enough from the 24 V battery bank to make a cup of coffee, after which it shuts down. Where is it in the boat and how do I get the microwave to run off it rather than from shorepower or the genset? 
   Thank you for your advice,
      Chris Bromley

 

 


A55 # 003- MERIT Angelo Gandola gangaway problem

Jose Alegria
 

Dear amelians

Today de Angelo Gandola gangaway   suffered a very slight touch against the rock pier.
It does not respond to wireless, nor to wired remote control.
The circuit breakers are operational and apparently the entire electronic circuit is working.
All suggestions are welcome to put manually the gangay inside to avoid touching the dock again and how to find the cause of the gangaway not working.

Kindest regards

José Alegria
A55#003MERIT
josealegr@...
Mobile: + 351 91 866 30 37



Re: Shore power, small battery charger, genset, inverter.

 

Good catch Ryan. I thought he was talking about the Diruptor breaker. 

Best,

CW Bill Rouse 
Amel Owners Yacht School
+1 832-380-4970 | brouse@...
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com 
Yacht School Calendar: www.preparetocastoff.blogspot.com/p/calendar.html


   

On Wed, Jul 22, 2020, 2:15 PM Ryan Meador <ryan.d.meador@...> wrote:
Chris,

On our SM, the main circuit breaker is also a GFCI.  On mine, this is indicated by a label reading "I∆n = 0.03A" on the circuit breaker, which means it has a 30mA ground fault limit.  Given that your breaker is tripping instantly and there is no sign of overcurrent (presumably the branch breaker for the charger is of a lower rating than the main one, so it should trip first), I bet you're seeing a ground fault.  This could be due to a failure inside the charger or something entirely unrelated.  Is the charger specified to accept both 50Hz and 60Hz AC?

Ryan and Kelly
SM 233 Iteration
Boston, MA, USA


On Wed, Jul 22, 2020 at 1:49 PM Craig & Katherine Briggs SN 68 Sangaris Tropic Isle Harbor, FL via groups.io <sangaris=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Chris,
I agree with Bill, although I would note the Victron is the large 100amp charger and the Chargemaster is the small 40amp one - you may have reversed that in your post. A starting point may be to check the connections at the circuit breaker of whichever unit it is that's tripping the mains and at the unit itself. 
Both units are 3 stage chargers and the step down points are controlled by the battery voltage, not by the % charge, so, no, you can't adjust for that. There are some adjustments you can make that are covered in your instruction manuals, but it's unlikely any are needed.
Sorry, but can't help with where your inverter is.
Assume you're in the US with 60Hz - where?
Craig 


Re: Shore power, small battery charger, genset, inverter.

Ryan Meador
 

Chris,

On our SM, the main circuit breaker is also a GFCI.  On mine, this is indicated by a label reading "I∆n = 0.03A" on the circuit breaker, which means it has a 30mA ground fault limit.  Given that your breaker is tripping instantly and there is no sign of overcurrent (presumably the branch breaker for the charger is of a lower rating than the main one, so it should trip first), I bet you're seeing a ground fault.  This could be due to a failure inside the charger or something entirely unrelated.  Is the charger specified to accept both 50Hz and 60Hz AC?

Ryan and Kelly
SM 233 Iteration
Boston, MA, USA


On Wed, Jul 22, 2020 at 1:49 PM Craig & Katherine Briggs SN 68 Sangaris Tropic Isle Harbor, FL via groups.io <sangaris=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Chris,
I agree with Bill, although I would note the Victron is the large 100amp charger and the Chargemaster is the small 40amp one - you may have reversed that in your post. A starting point may be to check the connections at the circuit breaker of whichever unit it is that's tripping the mains and at the unit itself. 
Both units are 3 stage chargers and the step down points are controlled by the battery voltage, not by the % charge, so, no, you can't adjust for that. There are some adjustments you can make that are covered in your instruction manuals, but it's unlikely any are needed.
Sorry, but can't help with where your inverter is.
Assume you're in the US with 60Hz - where?
Craig 


Re: Shore power, small battery charger, genset, inverter.

Craig Briggs
 

Chris,
I agree with Bill, although I would note the Victron is the large 100amp charger and the Chargemaster is the small 40amp one - you may have reversed that in your post. A starting point may be to check the connections at the circuit breaker of whichever unit it is that's tripping the mains and at the unit itself. 
Both units are 3 stage chargers and the step down points are controlled by the battery voltage, not by the % charge, so, no, you can't adjust for that. There are some adjustments you can make that are covered in your instruction manuals, but it's unlikely any are needed.
Sorry, but can't help with where your inverter is.
Assume you're in the US with 60Hz - where?
Craig 


Re: Shore power, small battery charger, genset, inverter.

 

Chris,

I am not sure that anyone can help you here with confidence. Almost everything you listed is not original equipment. For instance a big question for me would be: Who added this equipment and is the installation documented?

Maybe we could suggest some help if you would state where you are. 


Best,

CW Bill Rouse 
Amel Owners Yacht School
+1 832-380-4970 | brouse@...
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com 
Yacht School Calendar: www.preparetocastoff.blogspot.com/p/calendar.html


   

On Wed, Jul 22, 2020, 10:40 AM Christopher Bromley <bromleyc@...> wrote:
My SM Pure Magic, hull no. 433, is presently connected to shorepower @ 220V, 60 Hz. During a recent inspection I was asked to operate the Onan genset, but overlooked switching off the small battery charger on the 220V switchboard before running the genset for a few minutes. Everything controlled from the 220V swichboard is working normally except the small battery charger which usually starts off at about 35A. Now the main 220V breaker inside the rotary autopilot compartment trips off immediately if I switch on the small circuit breaker. Resetting this trip and leaving  the small charger off restores 220v & everything else on the 220V switchboard works as before. There is no sign or smell of overheated circuitry, but I think there must be a short circuit somewhere. I'd really appreciate advice on how to troubleshoot this problem or could the small charger be fried beyond repair? The small charger is a Victron Skylla-TG 24 100, if I'm looking at the right unit.
 Another couple of electrical  questions while on the forum: the large charger I only use with the genset. Typically the charger starts at about 80 - 90 A, but soon - within a minute or two - falls to 20- 30 A and tails off at less than 10A even though the battery bank is short of a full charge, perhaps down at 70%. Is there a simple adjustment I can make to the large charger to keep up its output until closer to a full charge or does the charger need a specialist electrician's attention? The large charger has operated in this way for at least a couple of years. It is a Chargemaster 24/40-3.
 Lastly, I'd like to be sure of correctly identifying the 24V to 220V inverter, the one described in the owner's manual as being capable of running the microwave long enough from the 24 V battery bank to make a cup of coffee, after which it shuts down. Where is it in the boat and how do I get the microwave to run off it rather than from shorepower or the genset? 
   Thank you for your advice,
      Chris Bromley


Re: Masse negative leak

 

Good luck. Let me know how it goes. Sometimes the cause is evasive. I should have also said the most probable suspect after the macerator pumps is anything that you have added or changed AC or DC since the MASSE last reported no negative fault. 

Best,

CW Bill Rouse 
Amel Owners Yacht School
+1 832-380-4970 | brouse@...
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com 
Yacht School Calendar: www.preparetocastoff.blogspot.com/p/calendar.html


   

On Wed, Jul 22, 2020, 12:09 PM ngtnewington Newington via groups.io <ngtnewington=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
I have been playing around at trying to identify the leak to no avail. So the next step will be as you suggest. I will disconnect the battery positive cables and the remove all the negative cables from the big switch and reconnect one by one to identify the circuit at fault.

Nick 
Amelia
AML54-0197


On 22 Jul 2020, at 17:46, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:


Nick,

I did it by unbolting at least one of the main switches and pulling it aside. 

You can also remove the positive wire from the battery bank to the switch by unbolting it at the junction block inside the battery compartment and also remove the positive wire on the starter battery. An alternative in the battery bank which may be easier is to remove the positive wire from the battery post each of your 6 pairs of batteries (the one to the junction block).


Best,

CW Bill Rouse 
Amel Owners Yacht School
+1 832-380-4970 | brouse@...
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com 
Yacht School Calendar: www.preparetocastoff.blogspot.com/p/calendar.html


   

On Tue, Jul 21, 2020, 11:23 PM ngtnewington Newington via groups.io <ngtnewington=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Thanks Bill,

Alas it is not the Macerators. I hate working in the space for the main battery on/off as it is so easy to short out the positive to negative with a ratchet handle... maybe I can cover the positive with plastic sheet or something...
Nick 
Stern to in Finikas Syros waiting for the Meltemi to ease just a tad...
Amelia AML54-019


On 22 Jul 2020, at 00:43, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:


Ofer & Nick,

Remember, the minus Masse Light means there is a connection between 24-volts negative to the Amel bonding system. The most common issue is a Jabsco Macerator pump that has developed a leak at the seal, causing a connection to the Amel Bonding. Start by disconnecting the green/yellow wire from each macerator pump. If the light no longer comes ON, you have found it. Replace that macerator pump and reconnect the green/yellow wires.

If it was not the macerator pump and the light is ON for the (-) side, it is more difficult because the individual 24-volt breakers only turn OFF the positive side (+). For a negative side (-) Masse fault, you will need to disconnect the negative wires from the negative main battery switch. On most Amels, this is the lower switch. When the light goes out, you have narrowed your search to one main circuit.

If the (+) side is ON, try turning OFF each breaker throughout the boat one at a time. Don't forget breakers for the windlass, winches, and breakers in the engine room. Do this with all breakers.

I hope this helps you.

CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Tue, Jul 21, 2020 at 12:32 PM ofer magen <ofermagen@...> wrote:
Hi Nick,
We had the same problem.
It took long time to solve , because the light was not always ON.

The way to find where  a bad contact between the minus and the grounding system is, is to start from the main switches near the batteries, disconnect each of the cables while checking the light. Ones you find a cable that if  disconnected the is OFF, look for the equipment down the cable and check the contacts and put corrosion x.
We found the problem in the forward locker . We had a leak of water from the new Bad! installed windlass rubber deck switches that created humidity on all electrical motors in the locker.

Good luck with the challenge.
You can call me if you want more info.



Ofer Magen
A 54 160 2010
Cyprus.
+972528795540


Re: Masse negative leak

ngtnewington Newington
 

I have been playing around at trying to identify the leak to no avail. So the next step will be as you suggest. I will disconnect the battery positive cables and the remove all the negative cables from the big switch and reconnect one by one to identify the circuit at fault.

Nick 
Amelia
AML54-0197


On 22 Jul 2020, at 17:46, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:


Nick,

I did it by unbolting at least one of the main switches and pulling it aside. 

You can also remove the positive wire from the battery bank to the switch by unbolting it at the junction block inside the battery compartment and also remove the positive wire on the starter battery. An alternative in the battery bank which may be easier is to remove the positive wire from the battery post each of your 6 pairs of batteries (the one to the junction block).


Best,

CW Bill Rouse 
Amel Owners Yacht School
+1 832-380-4970 | brouse@...
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com 
Yacht School Calendar: www.preparetocastoff.blogspot.com/p/calendar.html


   

On Tue, Jul 21, 2020, 11:23 PM ngtnewington Newington via groups.io <ngtnewington=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Thanks Bill,

Alas it is not the Macerators. I hate working in the space for the main battery on/off as it is so easy to short out the positive to negative with a ratchet handle... maybe I can cover the positive with plastic sheet or something...
Nick 
Stern to in Finikas Syros waiting for the Meltemi to ease just a tad...
Amelia AML54-019


On 22 Jul 2020, at 00:43, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:


Ofer & Nick,

Remember, the minus Masse Light means there is a connection between 24-volts negative to the Amel bonding system. The most common issue is a Jabsco Macerator pump that has developed a leak at the seal, causing a connection to the Amel Bonding. Start by disconnecting the green/yellow wire from each macerator pump. If the light no longer comes ON, you have found it. Replace that macerator pump and reconnect the green/yellow wires.

If it was not the macerator pump and the light is ON for the (-) side, it is more difficult because the individual 24-volt breakers only turn OFF the positive side (+). For a negative side (-) Masse fault, you will need to disconnect the negative wires from the negative main battery switch. On most Amels, this is the lower switch. When the light goes out, you have narrowed your search to one main circuit.

If the (+) side is ON, try turning OFF each breaker throughout the boat one at a time. Don't forget breakers for the windlass, winches, and breakers in the engine room. Do this with all breakers.

I hope this helps you.

CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Tue, Jul 21, 2020 at 12:32 PM ofer magen <ofermagen@...> wrote:
Hi Nick,
We had the same problem.
It took long time to solve , because the light was not always ON.

The way to find where  a bad contact between the minus and the grounding system is, is to start from the main switches near the batteries, disconnect each of the cables while checking the light. Ones you find a cable that if  disconnected the is OFF, look for the equipment down the cable and check the contacts and put corrosion x.
We found the problem in the forward locker . We had a leak of water from the new Bad! installed windlass rubber deck switches that created humidity on all electrical motors in the locker.

Good luck with the challenge.
You can call me if you want more info.



Ofer Magen
A 54 160 2010
Cyprus.
+972528795540


Shore power, small battery charger, genset, inverter.

Christopher Bromley
 

My SM Pure Magic, hull no. 433, is presently connected to shorepower @ 220V, 60 Hz. During a recent inspection I was asked to operate the Onan genset, but overlooked switching off the small battery charger on the 220V switchboard before running the genset for a few minutes. Everything controlled from the 220V swichboard is working normally except the small battery charger which usually starts off at about 35A. Now the main 220V breaker inside the rotary autopilot compartment trips off immediately if I switch on the small circuit breaker. Resetting this trip and leaving  the small charger off restores 220v & everything else on the 220V switchboard works as before. There is no sign or smell of overheated circuitry, but I think there must be a short circuit somewhere. I'd really appreciate advice on how to troubleshoot this problem or could the small charger be fried beyond repair? The small charger is a Victron Skylla-TG 24 100, if I'm looking at the right unit.
 Another couple of electrical  questions while on the forum: the large charger I only use with the genset. Typically the charger starts at about 80 - 90 A, but soon - within a minute or two - falls to 20- 30 A and tails off at less than 10A even though the battery bank is short of a full charge, perhaps down at 70%. Is there a simple adjustment I can make to the large charger to keep up its output until closer to a full charge or does the charger need a specialist electrician's attention? The large charger has operated in this way for at least a couple of years. It is a Chargemaster 24/40-3.
 Lastly, I'd like to be sure of correctly identifying the 24V to 220V inverter, the one described in the owner's manual as being capable of running the microwave long enough from the 24 V battery bank to make a cup of coffee, after which it shuts down. Where is it in the boat and how do I get the microwave to run off it rather than from shorepower or the genset? 
   Thank you for your advice,
      Chris Bromley


Re: A 55 # 9 : Chargeing and mastershunts

Craig Briggs
 

hi Bill, Glad it doesn't apply to the SN ;-)
Cheers


Re: A 55 # 9 : Chargeing and mastershunts

John Clanton
 

Craig,

 

You are exactly right about leaving the helm for this exercise.  I was single handed for a good portion of my 2018 season and got caught more than once not starting the genset in time.  It created unnecessary excitement.  Now, when going into a new harbor, I begin the process before getting to the first marker to allow enough time.  It is much easier with crew on board as that is a top training activity, and they are responsible for setting it up.

 

 

John W. Clanton

S/V Devereux

A55, No. 65

Antibes, France



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Re: Any data on B&G displays

Stefan and Anne Deerberg
 

Hi Bill, 
Yes that looks similar to my board

Stefan 


On 21. Jul 2020, at 16:46, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:


Stefan,

I had it all this time but had forgotten about the fuse & the battery on the mainboard in the Hydra 2000. I suspect something similar in the H3000.

Does this look like what you saw?

<image.png>

CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Tue, Jul 21, 2020 at 3:40 PM CW Bill Rouse via groups.io <brouse=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Stefan,

Perfect. If you ever are able to take a photo, I really need one for my book. 

CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Tue, Jul 21, 2020 at 10:19 AM Stefan and Anne Deerberg <stefan.deerberg@...> wrote:
Bill, 
It’s the Hydra 2000 from 2002. 
I have also missed the fuse in my technical data.

Stefan 


On 21. Jul 2020, at 09:34, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:


Stefan,

Can you tell me what model B&G Hydra you have i.e. Hercules, Hydra, Hydra 2000, etc? Or what year? The reason I ask is the technical information I have on the Hydra 2000 does not show a fuse. 

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Tue, Jul 21, 2020 at 7:42 AM Stefan and Anne Deerberg <stefan.deerberg@...> wrote:
Sorry Bill,
everything is already reassembled but I think about to take photos next time.
I opened  the processor box, wich is right behind the B&G Hydra 2000 MFD, with the 4 screws and there you can see the little 1 amp glass fuse easily. This fuse protects all 4 display devices and the masthead unit as well.

Stefan 


Mobil: +49 172 7757444




On 20. Jul 2020, at 18:17, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:


Stephan,

Can you take a photo of the fuse location?

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 4:01 PM Stefan and Anne Deerberg <stefan.deerberg@...> wrote:
Hi Elja!

Today we checked the processor Blackbox. There we found a 50 cent blowing out fuse.
That’s it. 
The system is working probably and we placed a spare fuse for the next failure with tape outside on the processor box.
If you got some of these problems with your new old system again, just check the fuse. After 18 years they are allowed to blow away sometimes.

Good luck 

Stefan 

SM OYA, 
373, lonesome in the Tobago Cays 

Mobil: +49 172 7757444

On 18. Jul 2020, at 09:40, Elja Röllinghoff Balu SM 222 <Bijorka@...> wrote:

He Stefan last week i have the same problem , i maild and fone some houers  with B&g  on the end is the processor takes the data in give it to the digital unit but not to the analog units . The think like bill the processor is after 22 jaers on the end .
I make a post in the facebook groop , i am lucky and one menber sell me his old one compleat sythem
Try it also

Best Elja
SM Balu 222


Von meinem iPhone gesendet




Re: A 55 # 9 : Chargeing and mastershunts

 

Craig, I have known Amel to "learn" and add recommendations that did not exist 30 years ago. I don't know when the generator recommendation started, but it in fact does exist.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse 
Amel Owners Yacht School
+1 832-380-4970 | brouse@...
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com 
Yacht School Calendar: www.preparetocastoff.blogspot.com/p/calendar.html


   

On Wed, Jul 22, 2020, 9:15 AM Craig & Katherine Briggs SN 68 Sangaris Tropic Isle Harbor, FL via groups.io <sangaris=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hi John,
I stand corrected, thanks.

That you must leave the helm, go below and take, what?, 2-3 minutes to fire everything up, then return to begin docking strikes me as a procedure destined to be ignored.

Be that as it may, I can say with absolute certainty that Amel never gave that instruction for the SN ;-)
Cheers, Craig


Re: Masse negative leak

 

Nick,

I did it by unbolting at least one of the main switches and pulling it aside. 

You can also remove the positive wire from the battery bank to the switch by unbolting it at the junction block inside the battery compartment and also remove the positive wire on the starter battery. An alternative in the battery bank which may be easier is to remove the positive wire from the battery post each of your 6 pairs of batteries (the one to the junction block).


Best,

CW Bill Rouse 
Amel Owners Yacht School
+1 832-380-4970 | brouse@...
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com 
Yacht School Calendar: www.preparetocastoff.blogspot.com/p/calendar.html


   


On Tue, Jul 21, 2020, 11:23 PM ngtnewington Newington via groups.io <ngtnewington=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Thanks Bill,

Alas it is not the Macerators. I hate working in the space for the main battery on/off as it is so easy to short out the positive to negative with a ratchet handle... maybe I can cover the positive with plastic sheet or something...
Nick 
Stern to in Finikas Syros waiting for the Meltemi to ease just a tad...
Amelia AML54-019


On 22 Jul 2020, at 00:43, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:


Ofer & Nick,

Remember, the minus Masse Light means there is a connection between 24-volts negative to the Amel bonding system. The most common issue is a Jabsco Macerator pump that has developed a leak at the seal, causing a connection to the Amel Bonding. Start by disconnecting the green/yellow wire from each macerator pump. If the light no longer comes ON, you have found it. Replace that macerator pump and reconnect the green/yellow wires.

If it was not the macerator pump and the light is ON for the (-) side, it is more difficult because the individual 24-volt breakers only turn OFF the positive side (+). For a negative side (-) Masse fault, you will need to disconnect the negative wires from the negative main battery switch. On most Amels, this is the lower switch. When the light goes out, you have narrowed your search to one main circuit.

If the (+) side is ON, try turning OFF each breaker throughout the boat one at a time. Don't forget breakers for the windlass, winches, and breakers in the engine room. Do this with all breakers.

I hope this helps you.

CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Tue, Jul 21, 2020 at 12:32 PM ofer magen <ofermagen@...> wrote:
Hi Nick,
We had the same problem.
It took long time to solve , because the light was not always ON.

The way to find where  a bad contact between the minus and the grounding system is, is to start from the main switches near the batteries, disconnect each of the cables while checking the light. Ones you find a cable that if  disconnected the is OFF, look for the equipment down the cable and check the contacts and put corrosion x.
We found the problem in the forward locker . We had a leak of water from the new Bad! installed windlass rubber deck switches that created humidity on all electrical motors in the locker.

Good luck with the challenge.
You can call me if you want more info.



Ofer Magen
A 54 160 2010
Cyprus.
+972528795540


Re: A 55 # 9 : Chargeing and mastershunts

Craig Briggs
 

Hi John,
I stand corrected, thanks.

That you must leave the helm, go below and take, what?, 2-3 minutes to fire everything up, then return to begin docking strikes me as a procedure destined to be ignored.

Be that as it may, I can say with absolute certainty that Amel never gave that instruction for the SN ;-)
Cheers, Craig


Re: A 55 # 9 : Chargeing and mastershunts

John Clanton
 

Craig,

 

I cannot speak to other models, but in the factory handover of the 55, they made it clear to fire the genset and both chargers prior to starting docking maneuvers.  I am not on the boat now, but believe I have also seen that instruction in the owners manual.

 

 

John W. Clanton

S/V Devereux

A55, No. 65

Antibes, France



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Re: A 55 # 9 : Chargeing and mastershunts

Billy Newport
 

I just looked on my 55 and there is a 675A master fuse under the nav seat. I used my Fluke to measure the current coming out of that fuse and the bow thruster doesn't draw power from there when I ran it which surprises me but the Fluke doesn't lie. So, there must be another 24V run to the sail locker. I'll try again tonight and measure the current up there instead.


Re: SM 1990 drive unit seals

Helen and Kostas Yuvanidi
 

Hi Mitchell,

Thanks!!
We never had the oil seal...we have taken it apart many times in the 20 years we have her...that is unless it was removed before we bought her....:/
It would be a great help though if you could point it out for us on the plans.
We always managed to make the seal with just the gasket maker.... the fibreglass trumpet is not in a good condition anymore, perhaps that’s the problem!
Did you make any repairs to that?

Best regards,
Helen and Kostas SM 29 of 1990

Sent from my 

On 22 Jul 2020, at 9:13 AM, Mitchell Petersen <Mitchell.j.petersen@...> wrote:


Hi Helen,

I miss read what you were doing. I thought you were referring to the lower unit.

As far as your oil leak goes. There is a 85x110x12mm oil seal with stainless steel spring at the top of the lower unit where the trumpet looking fibreglass thing marries with the lower unit. I believe this oil seal is designed to retain the oil, should this leak as a backup you have the silicone gasket you are using where the upper unit is bolted to the fibreglass trumpet looking thing. I would guess this oil seal has been dislodged or damaged when the upper unit was repaired/ reinstalled.

The lower unit needs to be removed to replace this seal. This is not a difficult task once you have the upper unit off but the boat obviously has to be out of the water.

For economy I just replaced the oil with engine oil as originally recommend by Amel. When examined all gears top and bottom had very little where so I believe engine oil is sufficient to use in this light application. It is my opinion damage caused to these units is most likely often from miss aligned engines rather then anything to do with oil grade.


Let me know if it is unclear where the oil seal is located and I will mark it up on the plan.

Mitchell


On Mon., 20 Jul. 2020, 5:17 pm Helen and Kostas Yuvanidi, <helenmi57@...> wrote:
Hi Mitchell,

Thanks!!
Our fibreglass did not have the aluminium part, at least not since we have the boat, we have taken it apart many times in the 20 years we have her, probably Amel made the change after our hull.
We changed all the bearings and gears in the upper part, but didn’t touch the lower.
Have you changed the viscosity of the oil you use or do you still use the 15W 40?
All the best,
Helen and Kostas on Meditation SM 29 of 1990


On 20 Jul 2020, at 12:03 AM, Mitchell Petersen <Mitchell.j.petersen@...> wrote:


I have the aluminium one which I recently fully rebuilt with all new bearings on both the upper and lower unit which requires cutting through the fibreglass and glassing back to original shape.

There is meant to be a small (approx. 2-3 inches) section of aluminium tubing glassed into the lower unit where the propelled shaft exits the until / where the fibreglass tapers which sounds like is no longer there since your service.

Mitchell 
SN33 1993

On Sat., 18 Jul. 2020, 1:11 am Helen and Kostas Yuvanidi, <helenmi57@...> wrote:
I’m sending the plans Maud sent me. It’s not exactly like any of them.
We’ve measured the difference between the aluminum and the fibreglass and it’s 3mm, but again there is nothing to hold an O-ring in place.

Many thanks,
Helen and Kostas Meditation SM 29 in 1990


On 17 Jul 2020, at 6:04 PM, Helen and Kostas Yuvanidi via groups.io <helenmi57=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:

Hi Bill,

Thanks for the prompt reply!
Unfortunately ours is different and doesn’t have the O rings , or any likely place to put one. I’m sending you photos to see what ours is like. On looking at the plans Amel sent us our set up is not exactly those either. We have bolts to fix it in place which are inserted from under the fibreglass part, shown in one of the photos. 
It might be possible to put an O-Ring around the aluminum part which inserts slightly into the fibreglass, only there is nothing there to hold it in place, any ideas will be very much appreciated!!
Thanks again 
Helen and Kostas on Meditation SM 29 of 1990

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On 17 Jul 2020, at 4:54 PM, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:


The drawing shows 2 each "Joint Toriques" which is an O-Ring. Follow this link.


CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Fri, Jul 17, 2020 at 8:31 AM Helen and Kostas Yuvanidi <helenmi57@...> wrote:

We are having trouble with the seal between the transmission and the rest of the drive unit after having it serviced. The oil leaked out between the transmission box and the fibreglass part of the drive unit. The machine shop had used a paper gasket and some sort of red sealant. We are on anchor so are trying to do it ourselves.
We took it apart and resealed it , it leaked again after about 4 hrs motoring. We had used a high Temperature RTV gasket maker but no paper gasket because we thought that that was the way it was originally.
We have the plans from Amel, but it is not clear if there should be a paper gasket.
Should we try to find card to cut a gasket or try again with the RTV gasket maker? The fibreglass part is not in a very good condition.

Helen and Kostas on Meditation SM 29 of 1990