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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Lofrans Tigres windlass turns itself on
christian alby <calbyy@...>
I met the same problem of the rubber cover on the switch being 'cooked' by sun & water, & made a windlass cover to keep protected. makes a difference to extend life of rubber parts. christian alby - Désirade VIII maramu 1982 now in Canet en Roussillon
De : "greatketch@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> À : amelyachtowners@... Envoyé le : Jeudi 6 juillet 2017 15h43 Objet : Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Lofrans Tigres windlass turns itself on Something I haven't seen mentioned here before, is that the switches for the winches are specified by Lewmar as having only a 3 to 5 year life span before they need to be replaced. I am sure that is conservative, but remember they are not forever! Once that rubber cover starts to get dull and "grainy" from sun exposure it's time to swap them out--before it fails. Its an easy job, and prevents dangerous problems. I remember seeing a photo in a SM sales listing with one of the winch switches having an obvious hole in the rubber cover. That gave me a very good idea of the attention to maintenance on that boat! Bill Kinney SM160, Harmonie Boston, Mass
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Re: Mizzem mast radar cable
greatketch@...
Good for Furuno! I guess it makes good business sense to make it as easy as possible for the customer to stay "in the family".
We went with a Navico 3G radar mainly because it is fully integrated with our existing instrument suite, uses very little power, and it is a system I with which have pervious experience with and have been very happy. It doesn't have the long range punch of some, but I really do not worry too much about targets 30 miles away. On the other hand, its close in performance is nothing short of amazing. Coming into a crowded mooring field at oh-dark-hundred and being able to see separate boats and mooring balls 50 feet away is a delight, especially since that presentation is on my chart plotter right at the helm station where I need it most. Bill Kinney SM160, Harmonie Boston, Mass
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Lofrans Tigres windlass turns itself on
Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
Duane, You stated that you had checked the activation switches and they were fine. The most common cause of your issue is a crack in the rubber cover for the activation switches. Saltwater enters and closes (shorts) the activation switch. Since you said you eliminated the activation switches, it is most likely the control box. I opened a control box that had a sticking solenoid. There was enough burnt contact material on the solenoids to possibly randomly close the circuit and activate the windlass, but I have never seen this happen. When diagnosing something via email, I have to rely on the observations made by the owner. That is the reason for different conclusions in this thread. I trust that you understand. CW Bill Rouse Admiral, Texas Navy Commander Emeritus Amel School www.amelschool.com 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550
On Thu, Jul 6, 2017 at 9:02 AM, sailor63109@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
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Re: Mizzem mast radar cable
greatketch@...
Thanks much Bill!
I have always found the search tools on this site primitive, and hard to be sure I found everything, Thanks for the summary! For pulling wires I have found the best line for me has been 2mm Spectra cord. It is flexible, thin, very strong (500 lbs), and very slippery compared to most alternatives. I always have a spool or two on the boat for emergency lash-ups. The downsides are: it is expensive, and because it is so slippery you have to be really careful with your knots. There is marginally better stuff that electricians use, but is has no other use on a boat so hasn't earned a place in our lockers. Since the wires do not bang around inside the mast, I knew they had to be secured somehow. I hadn't anticipated the foam. It's not really there to prevent the cables wrapping around each other. Without a free end inside the conduit the cables can not wrap around each other in a serious way. Rather it is to prevent the cables from banging against the side of the mast as the boat rolls. Pulling the foam out--and not replacing it--will result in significantly reduced levels of sleep by the occupants of the boat! Having unsecured wires inside a mast makes some of the most sleep disturbing noises I know of. Some things are best NOT learned by experience! Bill Kinney SM160, Harmonie Boston, Mass
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Re: Lofrans Tigres windlass turns itself on
Duane Siegfri
I'll check that Trevor.
Thanks, Duane
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Mizzem mast radar cable
greatketch@...
Thanks, I have always used cable lube, or soap in a pinch. It really can be amazing the difference.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Bill Kinney SM160, Harmonie Boston, Mass ---In amelyachtowners@..., <simms@...> wrote : Hi Bill, Just to offer that if you get a product called cable lube and lather the cable with it before you pull it. It doesn't leave residual mess and it is incredible how much easier it is to lull the cable. I have been told, in the absence of cable lube KY jelly works. Haven't tried it myself
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Lofrans Tigres windlass turns itself on
greatketch@...
Something I haven't seen mentioned here before, is that the switches for the winches are specified by Lewmar as having only a 3 to 5 year life span before they need to be replaced. I am sure that is conservative, but remember they are not forever!
Once that rubber cover starts to get dull and "grainy" from sun exposure it's time to swap them out--before it fails. Its an easy job, and prevents dangerous problems. I remember seeing a photo in a SM sales listing with one of the winch switches having an obvious hole in the rubber cover. That gave me a very good idea of the attention to maintenance on that boat! Bill Kinney SM160, Harmonie Boston, Mass
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Mizzem mast radar cable
Bill,
When we replace one of our radar cables, we had to remove the cover plate on the port side of the mast at the base. As the cable makes it way down the mast, there is a tube it has to align with that leads to the aft head compartment. The plug on the cable can hang on the upper lip of this tube. We used a wire hook to guide the cable plug and ensure the plug was not damaged during the pulling of the cable.
Hope this helps.
With best regards,
Mark
Skipper Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275 Currently cruising – Guadeloupe - Îles des Saintes www.creampuff.us
From: amelyachtowners@...
[mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 5, 2017 9:00 PM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Mizzem mast radar cable
Hello All,
After 20 years of service our venerable Furuno 1831 has gone to the great boatyard in the sky, and it is time to install our new radar.
I am just about ready to climb the mast and change out the scanner, and am hoping someone here can prevent any unpleasant surprises when it is time to pull the new cable. I found where the cable goes into the base of the mast step in the aft head. I have found the access plate and cable at the base of the mast.
Is the cable secured in any way inside the mast? Can I just attach the new cable and use the old one to pull it up the mast? I know others have done this job, any suggestions to make it go smoothly would be greatly appreciated!
Bill Kinney SM160, Harmonie Boston, Mass
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Mizzem mast radar cable
Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
I believe everything is covered in the prior total of posts on this subject:
CW Bill Rouse Admiral, Texas Navy Commander Emeritus Amel School www.amelschool.com 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550
On Thu, Jul 6, 2017 at 2:03 AM, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
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Re: Lofrans Tigres windlass turns itself on
seafeverofcuan
Duane,
If you haven't already done so, pull the rear casing off your windlass. Due to age of your boat you will likely find a neat pile of carbon dust from the brushes right underneath the terminals which can make a short and engage the windlass. How do I know this???? Best Regards, Trevor Lusty Ireland
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Roller Furling Questions
Beaute Olivier
Hello everybody, a few words about the genoa furler. I'm using shorcuts, so, feel free for more questions. There has been several kinds of genoa furlers installed on the Maramus, Sharkis, Mangos, Santorins and Super Maramus, and until roughly 2002, their manual furling sheave was attached to the foil with aluminum rivets covered with silicone filler (mainly to avoid the possibly reamaining steel part inside the rivet to become rusty). The reason was first that it was an easy way to do it (rather than screws and inserts). The second reason is that it had to be easily replaceable and AMEL did not change it for a long time because it was just working fine like this. Then came the questions (from the clients) of replacing the forestay (which did not come for the first 20 years...) and yes the sheaves were very often found to be very hard to pull out the stainless steel shaft. These rivets were not meant to be taken down as long as the sheave could be pulled out of the stainless steel shaft of the furler. But after 5 years, both parts were seized and the only way to take down the furler was to drill the rivets, and then take the furler to a machine shop to hydraulicly press the sheave out of the shaft. So, many people drilled the rivets if they wanted to service the furler or replace the forestay. Some have replaced the rivets with alu rivets, or with monel rivets (which creates a galvanic couple with the sheave/foil made of aluminum) or with stainless steel screws, installed in stainless steel tapped inserts. This last solution was also developped by AMEL to strengthen the connection between the foil and the sheave, (to avoid the foil to shear, but at that time, using a new kind of sheave (split in two halves). However, I'm still convinced that the aluminum rivets are strong enough for a regular use of the furler. Of course, if you overload the furler (like furling without easing the sheets), or, even worse, if you sail without enough halyard tension, then you will overload this connection. Sometimes, because the aluminum of the foil is too much damaged (the holes being wider) you just can't put new rivets and you need to find another solution (stainless steel inserts or shortening the tube). In that case, stainless steel screws in stainless steel inserts (inside the foil's channels) is a good solution but needs grease in order they can be easily taken down. Hoping this will not add more confusion to this (rather) simple topic... Have a good day. Olivier.
On Wednesday, July 5, 2017 6:23 PM, "'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote: FYI, I don't see the need for shear at this point in the design and suspect that was the reason given originally for the choice of rivets. CW Bill Rouse Admiral, Texas Navy Commander Emeritus Amel School www.amelschool.com 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970 On Jul 5, 2017 03:20, "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
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Re: Mizzem mast radar cable
calbyy@...
I did replace radar & cables inside mast last april; did it whilst masts were laying flat on supports (replaced standing rigging). The radar cable on the Maramu goes into one pvc guide tube running from mast step up to spreaders; connection from below deck is thru a gooseneck on the mast support plate, going thru hull to allow pulling cables through. Trying to pull one new cable with old cable is tricky as cables can have kinks & buckles & get stuck in awkward locations (check for Amel leaders remaining in tube as they are fastened to foam rings at even intervals to avoid cables getting tangled in tube).. One easy safe way is to use a leader nylon line (fishing gear), fastened safely on old cable; pull cable down to junction box with leader line following track. Cut off & at bottom & secure as pulling end. Once new scanner is fitted on support with cable plugged on, fasten end of cable to leader line & start pulling (use of talcum powder helps without leaving greasy residues); Pulling on cable coming down with own weight should prove easier (less friction) than horizontally. Use of old cable for new radar will work only if signals wires are sufficient in number & size, & clearly identified; Best to change all for new, as you will be always in doubt about compatibility if any fault on system later (matter of warranty also). happy days to you.
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Mizzem mast radar cable
Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
Hi all, I accidently sent the below unfinished, big fingers, small phone key pad. See finished post below. Danny ---------- Original Message ---------- Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Mizzem mast radar cable
Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
Hi Bill, Just to offer that if you get a product called cable lube and lather the cable with it before you pull it. It doesn't leave residual mess and it is incredible how much easier it is to lull the cable. I have been told, in the absence of cable lube KY jelly works. Haven't tried it myself
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Lofrans Tigres windlass turns itself on
Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
Hi all, surely you have all heard of the horror story about a sheet winch on a 54 continuing to run after the operator released it. Being used to haul the male partner up the mast. The female partner and winch operator was severely injured as was a next door helper. Subsequent to that Joel posted how he witnessed a sheet winch on a 54 self start. Caused, I am told by a fault in the push switch. Amel have moved to Haarken as a result of a messy legal issue. So these things. can happen. I have heard of a boat that had a halyard left on an electric winch. It was tied off to the pulpit. It self started in the owners absence and did major damage to the pulpit. So folks, it happens, so we need to be aware and take precautions. Dont leave sheets or halyards loaded on live winches and turn off power to the windlass before leaving he boat. I don't believe it is a brand issue, it is electrical contacts in a challenging marine enviroment Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl
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Re: Mizzem mast radar cable
Ian Park
Bill
I know this job is imminent for me too. I recall a post just a couple of months back where someone replaced with a new Furuno system and was able to use the existing cabling. Furuno had adapter plugs to fit each end so it was just plug and play! Ian. Ocean Hobo SN96
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Re: Lofrans Tigres windlass turns itself on
Duane, it will be that up button switch no doubt.
The fact that you say the rubber boot is broken and that you get fluky readings on the multimeter almost guarantees that its the switch. Cheers Alan Elyse SM437
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Mizzem mast radar cable
greatketch@...
Hello All, After 20 years of service our venerable Furuno 1831 has gone to the great boatyard in the sky, and it is time to install our new radar. I am just about ready to climb the mast and change out the scanner, and am hoping someone here can prevent any unpleasant surprises when it is time to pull the new cable. I found where the cable goes into the base of the mast step in the aft head. I have found the access plate and cable at the base of the mast. Is the cable secured in any way inside the mast? Can I just attach the new cable and use the old one to pull it up the mast? I know others have done this job, any suggestions to make it go smoothly would be greatly appreciated! Bill Kinney SM160, Harmonie Boston, Mass
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Lofrans Tigres windlass turns itself on
greatketch@...
Duane,
Unless the control box has gotten wet inside (which given its location is very unlikely) I can not imagine a realistic scenario that would cause its relays to change state without power being applied to the coils. Granted, I am not always as imaginative as I should be! If you described a case where the windlass would not shut off after running, the control box is one of the first places I would look, but you said the windlass started up on its own hours (at least) after being used. That's not a symptom of a "sticking" relay. Bill Kinney SM160, Harmonie Boston, Mass
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Lofrans Tigres windlass turns itself on
Patrick McAneny
We were anchored next to a boat in Martinique ( fortunately on the far leeward end of the anchorage ). While ashore his windlass came alive and hauled all his chain and anchor aboard . The wind pushed the boat aground , no damage , fellow sailors pulled the boat back out and re anchored it. I guess there is a lesson to be learned , it can happen .
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Pat
SM #123
-----Original Message-----
From: sailor63109@... [amelyachtowners] To: amelyachtowners Sent: Wed, Jul 5, 2017 12:52 pm Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Lofrans Tigres windlass turns itself on Bill,
Would a sticking solenoid cause it to activate when nobody has used it recently? The second time was in the middle of the night, so high cabin temperature would be unlikely.
Do you know if the box is sealed? If I can open it up maybe it's repairable?
On the other hand, I probably should replace it from an abundance of caution.
Thanks,
Duane
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