Date   

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Aluminum Filler for Intercooler?

eric freedman
 

Duane,

There are a lot of used and broken 4jh3hte’s. I don’t know where you are located but in the us I would try Oldport Marine in Newport or St Marten yanmar in St Maarten, they had a brand new engine that was run without Oil. I am sure you could find a used intercooler and use just the endcaps.

If it were mine, I would just have a good machine shop weld metal back on the eroded intercooler and then machine them again milled flat and then machine a groove for the O ring.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2017 8:07 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Aluminum Filler for Intercooler?

 

 

I have the Yanmar 4JH3-HTE, which has an Intercooler/Air Cooler to cool the pressurized air from the turbo prior to going to the cylinders.

 

It developed a leak between the end cap (part 2 or Box A) and the body of the heat exchanger, which led me to disassemble it.  .  The part I'm writing about now is the body of the intercooler.  The end surface of the intercooler that the O-Ring seats against has eroded from about 45 degrees off vertical on both sides all the way around, apparently due to exposure to salt water.  

 

At the worst the loss of material on the face is 1.1mm, which leads me to doubt the O-Ring that seals the joint between the end cap and the Intercooler/heat exchanger body will be water-tight (I mean, it was already leaking!) . The End Cap has a 45degree bevel that the O-Ring contacts.  The O-Ring is then sandwiched between the intercooler end face and the end cap 45degree bevel.

 

OPTION 1: I was thinking about trying to create a smooth surface using something like an aluminum filled epoxy putty (e.g. Hy-Poxy Alumfast Rapid Cure Aluminum Filled Epoxy Putty).  Any thoughts on a material? It would have to be workable enough to file and sand.

 

OPTION 2:  The other thought I had was to cut a thick gasket and glue it to the body of the intercooler to fill some of the eroded areas.  The problem with this solution is that the End Cap will be able to compress the O-Ring less than before, likely leading to a leak.  So really, this solution would "effectively" eliminate the O-Ring and depend on the gasket.

 

OPTION 3:   Using a file, create a level surface by removing 1.1mm from the upper non-eroded area and flatten the rest to match.

 

OPTION 4:  Buy a new Intercooler Assembly (Part 1 on the attachment) for $1,800.

 

OPTION 5:  Your thoughts?

 

Thanks,

Duane

Wanderer, SM#477

 


Re: Mizzen Staysail setup, aka foc d'artimon, aka "Little Artie"

greatketch@...
 

The mizzen certainly can add more drag up wind than lift ("be a brake") but...it depends on the boat and details of the sail plan if that drag is worth it or not.

I find our SM with main and jib alone tends to have a bit of leehelm when close hauled.  Putting out the mizzen adds nothing in terms of boat speed, but... it changes the balance of the boat to add a bit of weather helm, which reduces leeway and we get up wind faster as a result.

But, we are talking little, tiny, fussy changes here.  I tend to fuss a lot more with boat balance than most people do.  If I see my autopilot holding the rudder to windward to hold a straight course, I am going to do something to fix that.

I was taught, by people who know more about sailing than I ever will, to never sail upwind with leehelm if I could possibly avoid it.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Harris Creek, Eastern Shore, MD


Re: Aluminum Filler for Intercooler?

Craig Briggs
 

Duane,
Option 1 sounds splendiferous but probably will not last more than 50 years. Shaping the material after it cures is easy. Alternatively try JB Weld - similar stuff. Forget the $1800 option, but then I am an unrepentant CARB (Cheap Ass Rag Bagger).
Good luck with it,
Craig Briggs, SN#68


---In amelyachtowners@..., <sailor63109@...> wrote :

I have the Yanmar 4JH3-HTE, which has an Intercooler/Air Cooler to cool the pressurized air from the turbo prior to going to the cylinders.


It developed a leak between the end cap (part 2 or Box A) and the body of the heat exchanger, which led me to disassemble it.  .  The part I'm writing about now is the body of the intercooler.  The end surface of the intercooler that the O-Ring seats against has eroded from about 45 degrees off vertical on both sides all the way around, apparently due to exposure to salt water.  


At the worst the loss of material on the face is 1.1mm, which leads me to doubt the O-Ring that seals the joint between the end cap and the Intercooler/heat exchanger body will be water-tight (I mean, it was already leaking!) . The End Cap has a 45degree bevel that the O-Ring contacts.  The O-Ring is then sandwiched between the intercooler end face and the end cap 45degree bevel.


OPTION 1: I was thinking about trying to create a smooth surface using something like an aluminum filled epoxy putty (e.g. Hy-Poxy Alumfast Rapid Cure Aluminum Filled Epoxy Putty).  Any thoughts on a material? It would have to be workable enough to file and sand.


OPTION 2:  The other thought I had was to cut a thick gasket and glue it to the body of the intercooler to fill some of the eroded areas.  The problem with this solution is that the End Cap will be able to compress the O-Ring less than before, likely leading to a leak.  So really, this solution would "effectively" eliminate the O-Ring and depend on the gasket.


OPTION 3:   Using a file, create a level surface by removing 1.1mm from the upper non-eroded area and flatten the rest to match.

 

OPTION 4:  Buy a new Intercooler Assembly (Part 1 on the attachment) for $1,800.


OPTION 5:  Your thoughts?


Thanks,

Duane

Wanderer, SM#477



Re: Mizzen Staysail setup, aka foc d'artimon, aka "Little Artie"

Craig Briggs
 


Hey Ian,
Sounds like you've got it sorted very well, indeed. Btw, it was Joel Potter who gave me the tip that the mizzen is a brake upwind. One other point is that Little Artie's sheet, if it's snatched to the stern cleat, is inside the life line railing, so it really doesn't hang up on the swim ladder. The pennant does help. As for the genny collapsing, it probably needs to be poled out and the main needs to be furled up - or it needs to be furled and the "iron genny" hoisted :-)  When you're back in Grenada look up Maxwell Selwyn, one of the "cognoscenti" taxi drivers / yacht tenders who's a great guy and give him our best.
Best, Craig Briggs, SN68

---In amelyachtowners@..., <parkianj@...> wrote :

Craig
I hadn’t thought of running the ballooner sheet through the unused Genoa roller! Nice one. The two large blocks are attached to the rear cleats. As Bill points out Staysail starboard sheet does catch a bit in the swim ladder, and I will test out both your 1m extension line and the boom end.
I have come to the same conclusion about using the mizzen upwind. It gets back winded from the main and hauling it in does nothing for the speed.
One thing I have done down wind in light airs when the weight of the Genoa collapses the sail from time to time is to take an extra line and put a rolling hitch on the genoa sheet and lead it back through the stern block and back to the winch. The extra length of sheet keeps the sail flying better.
There hasn’t been any conversations on the forum for newbies about changing from sloop to ketch. Most welcome!

Ian
Ocean Hobo SN96
(11 more days and back to the boat in Grenada after 18 months away,)


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Distributed vs. Conventional Electrical Systems

greatketch@...
 

500 amp DC breakers are hard to find (although they do exist--at a price), 

500 amp DC fuses are readily available.  

Breaking high current DC is hard, because the arc formed by ionized air carries the current.  With AC the arc collapses at each zero voltage crossing, so it's easier to interrupt a high current flow.

I know the thruster on the SM is a potent machine.  If you are on the bow and not holding on when it is run you might end up on your butt--or in the water.  I see SO many boats with thrusters that seem to not actually DO anything other than make noise, it is really nice having one that actually WORKS!

I am not sure the logic that Amel applied to not put circuit protection in the wiring.  As Bill R has said, it is not really fair to second guess decisions made 25 years ago or more.  But it is also not unreasonable to revisit those decisions with modern equipment and tools.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Harris Creek, Eastern Shore, MD


Aluminum Filler for Intercooler?

Duane Siegfri
 

I have the Yanmar 4JH3-HTE, which has an Intercooler/Air Cooler to cool the pressurized air from the turbo prior to going to the cylinders.


It developed a leak between the end cap (part 2 or Box A) and the body of the heat exchanger, which led me to disassemble it.  .  The part I'm writing about now is the body of the intercooler.  The end surface of the intercooler that the O-Ring seats against has eroded from about 45 degrees off vertical on both sides all the way around, apparently due to exposure to salt water.  


At the worst the loss of material on the face is 1.1mm, which leads me to doubt the O-Ring that seals the joint between the end cap and the Intercooler/heat exchanger body will be water-tight (I mean, it was already leaking!) . The End Cap has a 45degree bevel that the O-Ring contacts.  The O-Ring is then sandwiched between the intercooler end face and the end cap 45degree bevel.


OPTION 1: I was thinking about trying to create a smooth surface using something like an aluminum filled epoxy putty (e.g. Hy-Poxy Alumfast Rapid Cure Aluminum Filled Epoxy Putty).  Any thoughts on a material? It would have to be workable enough to file and sand.


OPTION 2:  The other thought I had was to cut a thick gasket and glue it to the body of the intercooler to fill some of the eroded areas.  The problem with this solution is that the End Cap will be able to compress the O-Ring less than before, likely leading to a leak.  So really, this solution would "effectively" eliminate the O-Ring and depend on the gasket.


OPTION 3:   Using a file, create a level surface by removing 1.1mm from the upper non-eroded area and flatten the rest to match.

 

OPTION 4:  Buy a new Intercooler Assembly (Part 1 on the attachment) for $1,800.


OPTION 5:  Your thoughts?


Thanks,

Duane

Wanderer, SM#477



Re: Mizzen Staysail setup, aka foc d'artimon, aka "Little Artie"

Ian Park
 

Craig
I hadn’t thought of running the ballooner sheet through the unused Genoa roller! Nice one. The two large blocks are attached to the rear cleats. As Bill points out Staysail starboard sheet does catch a bit in the swim ladder, and I will test out both your 1m extension line and the boom end.
I have come to the same conclusion about using the mizzen upwind. It gets back winded from the main and hauling it in does nothing for the speed.
One thing I have done down wind in light airs when the weight of the Genoa collapses the sail from time to time is to take an extra line and put a rolling hitch on the genoa sheet and lead it back through the stern block and back to the winch. The extra length of sheet keeps the sail flying better.
There hasn’t been any conversations on the forum for newbies about changing from sloop to ketch. Most welcome!

Ian
Ocean Hobo SN96
(11 more days and back to the boat in Grenada after 18 months away,)


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Whisker Pole

karkauai
 

I'm reticent to do that, Courtney, as the collar is a composite material of some kind.

Kent Robertson
S/V Kristy
Panama cell: +507-61171896
USA cell: 828-234-6819

On Oct 22, 2017, at 1:12 PM, Courtney Gorman Itsfun1@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

kent could you heat up the pole to allow for som expansion to remove it?

Courtney



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] staysail mizzen setup

James Alton
 

Bill,

   Sueno came with a Dacron mizzen staysail that looks almost unused.     The sail is a little unusual in that it is cut pretty flat and when properly trimmed has similar depth to my genoa so it is actually a pretty nice shape for upwind reaching.  Being Dacron and also filled, it holds it’s shape unlike a nylon sail so it is efficient enough to add some boat speed at 60 degrees apparent and will trim to 50 degrees but I doubt it is adding any speed and is likely slowing the boat at that angle.  If you think about it, there is a big open triangle between the mizzen mast and the Main and the Mizzen Staysail is filling part of that unused space.  My other boat is a yawl and the mizzen staysail is 3/4 ounce Nylon,  (the wife built this sail from a Sailrite kit BTW, came out really well) and it works well on a beam reach or further aft but is almost useless with the wind forward of the beam due to the sail shape.  That nylon staysail weighs almost nothing, can be bag stuffed so is super easy to set.  So I really like the Mizzen Staysail that came with Sueno and use it a lot but I would also like to have a light Nylon Mizzen Staysail for easier handling and off wind sailing.   All of my previous boats (5)  were sloops so my first split rig was the yawl and the Maramu is my first Ketch.  Despite a bit more complexity I will never go back to the sloop for cruising,  there are so many advantages to a split rig IMO.  I think that Henri was very wise to select the Ketch rig for these boats, a good match.

Best,

James Alton
SV Sueno,  Maramu #220

On Oct 22, 2017, at 11:57 AM, greatketch@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

James,


Interesting....  I have never seen or heard of a dacron mizzen staysail--on an Amel or any other  ketch.  It seems to me like it would be an odd beast.  I would think if the wind was far enough forward to make it worth it, the main would be a more efficient use of that space.  The closest thing I can think of is the main staysail on a staysail schooner, but on that rig there is no boomed sail on the foremast to interfere.

On my old boat I always rigged my mizzen staysail to the mizzen boom.  On my Super Maramu I started doing that when I realized it was a way to keep the sheet from tangling with the swimladder.  With the mizzen furled, and the staysail sheeted to the mizzen boom, and the boom eased all the way out, you can sail quite a bit further off the wind.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Harris Creek, Eastern Shore, MD




Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] staysail mizzen setup

greatketch@...
 

I am not sure what the sock-less "workout" is.  

To douse the staysail on Harmonie, Karen sits on deck at the staysail's tack, we blow the sheet, and as the halyard is eased, she gathers the sail right into the bag.  

If the wind had picked up suddenly, we might need to head down a bit to put the sail in the lee of the mizzen. If the mizzen is not up, we'll head up to 70 degrees AWA, and let the sail luff.  

Either way, it easily fits within Amel's design standard of "doable by crew who can lift no more than 50 lbs".  We find it easier to get this smaller sail down and stuffed in the bag than the ballooner, and even that is not hard enough to call a "workout."

Of course, dropping this sail with just one person on deck, now THAT might officially qualify as a workout--or at least a runaround! I've done it, and the key is to be sure the sail is luffing, or blanketed, before you ease the halyard.

I find the sail very easy to set single handed.  Tack is attached to the deck, and head to the halyard and the sheet lead to the winch while most of the sail is still in the cockpit, where we launch the sail from. After hauling the halyard, the sheet is trimmed. Never had a problem with this setup--unless I get the leads wrong way around the shrouds. (Have I ever done that? "No comment!")

I have used socks on asymmetrical spinnakers, and love them, so I certainly see the advantages.  I guess the staysail just hasn't seemed big enough to justify the added complexity over the original Amel design--for us.

No matter if you use a sock or not, the mizzen staysail is one of the real advantages of a ketch rig for passagemaking.  You'll go faster and have more fun if you use it.  It is a real mule of a sail, pulling hard when the wind angle suits it.  All that and it is darn good looking to boot!

Some trimming tricks (if you are experienced with spinnaker trimming, you likely already know these)...  

The smaller the wind angle, the tighter the halyard.  Easing the halyard a bit as you head down wind, lets the sail rotate to windward, getting more of the sail out of the wind shadow of the mizzen.  

Like any sail, don't over sheet it.  If the sheet is too tight, the sail will pull sideways more than forward.  If you want to be really fussy, ease the sheet until the luff just starts to curl a little.  Most cruisers will then pull it a little bit tighter so they don't have to fuss with it for every tiny little change in AWA.

Experiment!  The pretty pictures always have the staysail flying with the main and mizzen.  It might make sense to furl one, or both, of the boomed white sails. You might find the boat balances better and sails faster or easier.  We have had some fast, fun, and easy, sailing with just genoa and staysail flying.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Harris Creek, Eastern Shore, MD


---In amelyachtowners@..., <yahoogroups@...> wrote :

Just a short comment here.

Judy and I always answered the question, "What is that sail" with this answer: "Secret Sail."

And if you try to set and retrieve this sail without a Sock, you are in for a workout. With a Sock, you can simply ease the sheet and then "blow the tack," then "sock-it." Use a shackle that can be opened under load at the tack. The Secret Sail is perfect for wind at 90-100 degrees and a lot of fun...if it is in a Sock. That Sock will cost between $150-$200.

BTW, the Secret Sail on the 54s I have sailed on looks like a lightweight solid white dacron, but it may be nylon...I am not sure.

Have fun flying your Secret Sail.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus

Amel School  http://www.amelschool. com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550

+1(832) 380-4970



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] staysail mizzen setup

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi,

I find the mizzen ballooner  incredibly easy to handle. Mine has a permanent extension to the tack attached to get it above the dodger. To hoist I pull an amount of the clew out of the bag with the sheet before hoisting. Then leaving the sheet loose I haul the halyard up, fast. Once its fully up I sheet in. To drop, one person on the deck at the tack the other  lets the halyard fly, no restriction, totally free run. Person on deck gathers and person in cockpit releases the sheet, sweet. Two critical things. Don't release the sheet before the halyard, second don't restrict the halyard drop, it must go out totally free other wise the gatherer is fighting the wind. . Leaving it sheeted on and letting the halyard fly was a technique I learned years ago watching the americas cup racing when they had the big mono hulls with spinnakers. They would get to the bottom mark, and as they rounded let the spinnaker down as I described. It would lie out over the water fluttering and the crew gathered it in under the Genoa. I adopted the technique on my 42 foot race boat and most of the spinnaker drop disasters stopped.

Regards

Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 23 October 2017 at 05:36 "'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Just a short comment here.

Judy and I always answered the question, "What is that sail" with this answer: "Secret Sail."

And if you try to set and retrieve this sail without a Sock, you are in for a workout. With a Sock, you can simply ease the sheet and then "blow the tack," then "sock-it." Use a shackle that can be opened under load at the tack. The Secret Sail is perfect for wind at 90-100 degrees and a lot of fun...if it is in a Sock. That Sock will cost between $150-$200.

BTW, the Secret Sail on the 54s I have sailed on looks like a lightweight solid white dacron, but it may be nylon...I am not sure.

Have fun flying your Secret Sail.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus

Amel School  http://www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550

+1(832) 380-4970

On Sun, Oct 22, 2017 at 9:57 AM, greatketch@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

James,


Interesting....  I have never seen or heard of a dacron mizzen staysail--on an Amel or any other  ketch.  It seems to me like it would be an odd beast.  I would think if the wind was far enough forward to make it worth it, the main would be a more efficient use of that space.  The closest thing I can think of is the main staysail on a staysail schooner, but on that rig there is no boomed sail on the foremast to interfere.

On my old boat I always rigged my mizzen staysail to the mizzen boom.  On my Super Maramu I started doing that when I realized it was a way to keep the sheet from tangling with the swimladder.  With the mizzen furled, and the staysail sheeted to the mizzen boom, and the boom eased all the way out, you can sail quite a bit further off the wind.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Harris Creek, Eastern Shore, MD
< div>

 

 

 


 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Distributed vs. Conventional Electrical Systems

James Alton
 

Craig,

   Many thanks for posting the information from the motor on your bow thruster,  this is very helpful to me.  I am pretty sure that the Classe F refers the class of insulation used on the motor windings.  The range seems to be from Class A-H with the most common class of insulation used being B which has a maximum temperature rating of 130C.  The  Class F can go up to 155C  and the H to 180C.  Your other guesses look pretty good to me,  maybe one of the electrical gurus could comment?   I guess we cannot tell for sure how many amps your motor draws under load and also what voltage your motor is seeing to determine the actual electrical horsepower.   I have considered getting a clamp meter to measure large DC loads but that tool is pretty pricey.   Can you give me a sense of how powerful your bow thruster seems in actual use?  In my case, I seem to be unable to hold the bow up in winds above 16-17 knots on the beam.  I have read that the bow thruster on the Santorin is more powerful than the ones installed on the later Maramu’s but I don’t have any other information so far on that.  I will get all of the motor specs. off of my bow thruster when I return to the boat next season.   

Best,

James Alton
SV Sueno,  Maramu #220

On Oct 22, 2017, at 10:53 AM, sangaris@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


Per James' question, on my Santorin the bow thruster motor is a Leroy Somers Type TF15.
The  name plate shows:
- PkW 6.3, which I take to mean kiloWatts (don't know P in french, but likely Puissance or Power), which would be 8.5 horsepower.
- 12V - it's a 12 volt motor
- 815 A - which may be a peak amperage or something, as it's different than the calculated 525 amps you get from dividing 6300 watts by 12 v above.
-  Cmkg of 2.3, which I'd guess measure of torque (couple in French, I believe) in meter/kilograms.
- Vtr/mn of 2650, which I'd guess is revolutions per minute,
- IP 20 which I think is some kind of degree of protection, although I don't know the specifics
- S 2-1 MN which I think is a duty type of how long to run and rest the motor, although I can't make sense of it.
- Classe F - which may be some EU rating system, I'd guess.
- The nameplate also says: "Important: couple de serrage des tiges d'assemblage" and 0.35 mkg., which my computer translates as "tightening torque of the assembly rods" .If the units meter/kg's that would be 30 lb/in..

If anyone knows the exact translations it would be interesting, although the key elements are 8.5 HP and 525 amps. There is no protection in the wiring.

Craig Briggs, SN#68

---In amelyachtowners@..., <lokiyawl2@...> wrote :

Bill Kinney,

   Thanks for doing the testing and providing the results.  I knew that the SM bow thruster was more powerful than the earlier Amel bow thrusters but the upgrade in power is far more than I realized.    From your measurements,  if my math is correct, 420 x 24.1 = 10,122 watts/ 750 = almost 13.5 HP electric as compared to the unit on my boat having around 1.6 HP.  In the case of your voltage measurement, can I assume that the 24.1 volts being measured at the battery terminals rather than the thruster motor terminals?  

   I have never seen a 500 AMP or larger DC breaker so perhaps the lack of availability is this is the reason Amel did not install that form of protection?  Clearly the system has worked well for a lot of boats over a long period of time, but the fuses you mentioned do seem like a good idea in case a short ever developed.

   With the SM motor rated for 6.3 KW and actually being hit with 10KW+ I can now understand the reason that it is important on the SM to limit the burst time to 30 seconds to control motor heating.   With the thruster on my Maramu, a run of 2 minutes results in very very minor heating  (Maybe a 10C rise at most)  but then a thruster is generally only needed for short bursts so I think that the path Amel took to push the motor harder for a short duration was a good choice.  I am wondering if it might be possible for me to increase the power on my thruster by changing to to a different motor?  A doubling in power would be nice to have for higher winds,  perhaps someone else has already looked into this?      The lower unit of the thruster shares many of the same parts with the SM based on the bow thruster items I have ordered so far from Maude and I think even turns the same size prop as some of the SM's.  

   Would you know  (or anyone else reading this)  if the Santorin uses 12 or 24V on it’s bow thruster?

Best,

James Alton
SV Sueno,  Maramu #220

On Oct 18, 2017, at 8:52 PM, greatketch@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

James,


The SM does not have any factory installed protection for the bow thruster circuit.  On my boat the fuses on the battery terminals have a total rated load of 500 Amps, which is reasonable based on the ampacity of the wire used, and has never blown while in use.

And... since I am on the boat, rather than calculating, or looking up, or guessing...  I figured a bit of measurement is in order.  With fully charged batteries (and charger off) using the Magnetronic Amp meter to measure the current draw, and my Smartguage to simultaneously display voltage,  here is what I find:

The bow thruster draws 420 Amps at 24.1 volts.  That's where it stabilized after about 5 seconds.  That's with the boat tied tightly in a slip, so any movement of the hull would (slightly) reduce the load on the prop.

It figures...  almost exactly splitting the difference between what Amel has in the manual, and what the motor nameplate says.  If it matters, this motor was just professionally overhauled last year with new brushes, windings, etc.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Back Creek Annapolis, MD

---In amelyachtowners@..., wrote :

Bill Kinney,

   Good point about the voltage drop. I measured mine as dropping from 13.5 (charger was on so this was not an accurate test) to about 11.75 after a 5 second burst. 

   Does the SM have a breaker for the bow thruster and if so can you tell me the amperage?   I guess that the 6.3KW rating doesn’t tell us much since we don’t know how loaded the motor is.  

   Also, can someone tell me about how much free play is normal for a bow thruster?  I can rock the prop on my thruster back and forth about 3/16” without any resistance as measured from the tips of the blades.  The output shaft does not seem to have any play in it’s bearing so I assume that what I am feeling is the gear lash plus any play in the shaft to motor splines.

James Alton
SV Sueno,  Maramu #220






Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Whisker Pole

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Sounds good

On 23 October 2017 at 03:03 "Kent Robertson karkauai@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

I don't think that's necessary, Danny.  Actually, the composite collar is what overhangs the fitting.  If I can get the fitting and collar out, I can just reinstall, properly this time.  I think I'll buy a slide hammer, it seems there are any number of things it could be useful for.  If I can get the fitting on the other end of the pole off, I can probably tap the stuck fitting out with a long piece of wood.
Kent

Kent Robertson
S/V Kristy
Panama cell: +507-61171896
USA cell: 828-234-6819

On Oct 21, 2017, at 10:56 PM, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Hi Kent,

sounds like there is a bit of the tube overhanging the fitting. Why not do a careful hacksaw job on it, unless you feel you want to get back to full length.

Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 22 October 2017 at 14:33 "sangaris@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Yes, do be careful as that fitting can break - I had a clever Greek welder fix a cracked one for me by puddling a lot of new metal and it was a good fix. (Although I had a spare). My first thought for your situation was to get a new jockey pole tube and destructively cut off / peel the old one away from the fitting. Whatever you do, be a bit gentle with the fitting itself.

Rotsa ruck,
Craig, SN68


---In amelyachtowners@..., <karkauai@...> wrote :

Oops, you're right, Craig.  That didn't make any sense at all.  It's the inboard end of the long (whisker) pole that was damaged.  When the machinist put it back together, he mounted the inner cone-shaped aluminum piece too far into the aluminum tube.  Now it doesn't stick out far enough to allow the jockey pole Spring-loaded clip to catch.

It's stuck fast, if I can get it out, I can reassemble it properly.

But I haven't been able to get it out, just looking for some tricks that might work without damaging the pole center fitting piece, or composite material collar.

Kent
S/V Kristy
SM243
Jacksonville, FL
 

 


 

 

 


 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Whisker Pole

Courtney Gorman
 

kent could you heat up the pole to allow for som expansion to remove it?
Courtney


-----Original Message-----
From: Kent Robertson karkauai@... [amelyachtowners]
To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Sun, Oct 22, 2017 10:04 am
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Whisker Pole

 
I don't think that's necessary, Danny.  Actually, the composite collar is what overhangs the fitting.  If I can get the fitting and collar out, I can just reinstall, properly this time.  I think I'll buy a slide hammer, it seems there are any number of things it could be useful for.  If I can get the fitting on the other end of the pole off, I can probably tap the stuck fitting out with a long piece of wood.
Kent

Kent Robertson
S/V Kristy
Panama cell: +507-61171896
USA cell: 828-234-6819

On Oct 21, 2017, at 10:56 PM, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Hi Kent,
sounds like there is a bit of the tube overhanging the fitting. Why not do a careful hacksaw job on it, unless you feel you want to get back to full length.
Regards
Danny
SM 299 Ocean Pearl
On 22 October 2017 at 14:33 "sangaris@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Yes, do be careful as that fitting can break - I had a clever Greek welder fix a cracked one for me by puddling a lot of new metal and it was a good fix. (Although I had a spare). My first thought for your situation was to get a new jockey pole tube and destructively cut off / peel the old one away from the fitting. Whatever you do, be a bit gentle with the fitting itself.
Rotsa ruck,
Cra ig, SN68


---In amelyachtowners@..., wrote :

Oops, you're right, Craig.  That didn't make any sense at all.  It's the inboard end of the long (whisker) pole that was damaged.  When the machinist put it back together, he mounted the inner cone-shaped aluminum piece too far into the aluminum tube.  Now it doesn't stick out far enough to allow the jockey pole Spring-loaded clip to catch.

It's stuck fast, if I can get it out, I can reassemble it properly.

But I ha ven't been able to get it out, just looking for some tricks that might work without damaging the pole center fitting piece, or composite material collar.

Kent
S/V Kristy
SM243
Jacksonville, FL
 
 

 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] staysail mizzen setup

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Just a short comment here.

Judy and I always answered the question, "What is that sail" with this answer: "Secret Sail."

And if you try to set and retrieve this sail without a Sock, you are in for a workout. With a Sock, you can simply ease the sheet and then "blow the tack," then "sock-it." Use a shackle that can be opened under load at the tack. The Secret Sail is perfect for wind at 90-100 degrees and a lot of fun...if it is in a Sock. That Sock will cost between $150-$200.

BTW, the Secret Sail on the 54s I have sailed on looks like a lightweight solid white dacron, but it may be nylon...I am not sure.

Have fun flying your Secret Sail.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus

Amel School  http://www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550

+1(832) 380-4970

On Sun, Oct 22, 2017 at 9:57 AM, greatketch@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

James,


Interesting....  I have never seen or heard of a dacron mizzen staysail--on an Amel or any other  ketch.  It seems to me like it would be an odd beast.  I would think if the wind was far enough forward to make it worth it, the main would be a more efficient use of that space.  The closest thing I can think of is the main staysail on a staysail schooner, but on that rig there is no boomed sail on the foremast to interfere.

On my old boat I always rigged my mizzen staysail to the mizzen boom.  On my Super Maramu I started doing that when I realized it was a way to keep the sheet from tangling with the swimladder.  With the mizzen furled, and the staysail sheeted to the mizzen boom, and the boom eased all the way out, you can sail quite a bit further off the wind.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Harris Creek, Eastern Shore, MD
< div>



Re: Mizzen Staysail setup, aka foc d'artimon, aka "Little Artie"

Craig Briggs
 

Ian,
The two blocks I was referring to for the Ballooner are forward just behind the deck lockers - actually they are the foreguy blocks for the poles, not the ballooner sheet, sorry if my wording wasn't too clear.  

The ballooner sheet runs the same way as the genoa sheet to the primary winches. After setting the genoa out on the port side pole, take the genoa lazy sheet out of the turning and sheet blocks and run the ballooner sheet through them to the primary winch, then hoist the ballooner and trim it on the starboard pole. 

The two permanently attached blocks you have in front of the rear cleats indeed would be for Little Artie. To what are they attached? I have nothing in the vicinity of the stern cleats like a pad eye or whatever.

We also came from the sloop world, but now really appreciate the ketch. Forget the mizzen upwind - it acts as a brake. Upwind motor sailing with the main is fine and we find we can frequently add the genoa rolled out to a #3 equivalent. Off wind fly whatever you can - Little Artie is great from about 110 to 140 apparent. From 135 on we frequently furl the main either partially or fully to get some air to the genoa. 

Offwind we frequently use the genny and the main wing-on-wing, or, if the breeze is up, the genoa rolled up to a #2 or #3 equivalent, no main and the mizzen wing-on-wing.  From about 150 to 150 the twin jibs are fantastic. We furl them together a bit after about 15 apparent (20-ish true) to reduce the strains.  Occasionally, if it's rolly, we'll add the mizzen trimmed hard in the middle to reduce roll.

Cheers,
Craig, SN68 Sangaris



---In amelyachtowners@..., <parkianj@...> wrote :

Craig
Thanks for quick reply.
The boat already had two pretty substantial blocks permanently attached in front of the rear cleats. I assumed these had been for the Ballooner (but as you said you only need one). I automatically assumed they were for the mizzen staysail too, but at some angles the foot of the sail doesn’t tension enough leaving the sail a bit baggy. I like the idea of the 1m pennant - I’ll give that one a try.
There was no Santorin handbook with the boat, so I’ve worked mainly from the SM handbook where there are similarities.
Still learning how to sail a ketch! There are no books about it…..
Nice name ‘Little Artie’ !

Ian
Ocean Hobo SN96


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] staysail mizzen setup

greatketch@...
 

James,

Interesting....  I have never seen or heard of a dacron mizzen staysail--on an Amel or any other  ketch.  It seems to me like it would be an odd beast.  I would think if the wind was far enough forward to make it worth it, the main would be a more efficient use of that space.  The closest thing I can think of is the main staysail on a staysail schooner, but on that rig there is no boomed sail on the foremast to interfere.

On my old boat I always rigged my mizzen staysail to the mizzen boom.  On my Super Maramu I started doing that when I realized it was a way to keep the sheet from tangling with the swimladder.  With the mizzen furled, and the staysail sheeted to the mizzen boom, and the boom eased all the way out, you can sail quite a bit further off the wind.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Harris Creek, Eastern Shore, MD


Re: Mizzen Staysail setup, aka foc d'artimon, aka "Little Artie"

Ian Park
 

Craig
Thanks for quick reply.
The boat already had two pretty substantial blocks permanently attached in front of the rear cleats. I assumed these had been for the Ballooner (but as you said you only need one). I automatically assumed they were for the mizzen staysail too, but at some angles the foot of the sail doesn’t tension enough leaving the sail a bit baggy. I like the idea of the 1m pennant - I’ll give that one a try.
There was no Santorin handbook with the boat, so I’ve worked mainly from the SM handbook where there are similarities.
Still learning how to sail a ketch! There are no books about it…..
Nice name ‘Little Artie’ !

Ian
Ocean Hobo SN96


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Whisker Pole

karkauai
 

I don't think that's necessary, Danny.  Actually, the composite collar is what overhangs the fitting.  If I can get the fitting and collar out, I can just reinstall, properly this time.  I think I'll buy a slide hammer, it seems there are any number of things it could be useful for.  If I can get the fitting on the other end of the pole off, I can probably tap the stuck fitting out with a long piece of wood.
Kent

Kent Robertson
S/V Kristy
Panama cell: +507-61171896
USA cell: 828-234-6819

On Oct 21, 2017, at 10:56 PM, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Kent,

sounds like there is a bit of the tube overhanging the fitting. Why not do a careful hacksaw job on it, unless you feel you want to get back to full length.

Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 22 October 2017 at 14:33 "sangaris@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Yes, do be careful as that fitting can break - I had a clever Greek welder fix a cracked one for me by puddling a lot of new metal and it was a good fix. (Although I had a spare). My first thought for your situation was to get a new jockey pole tube and destructively cut off / peel the old one away from the fitting. Whatever you do, be a bit gentle with the fitting itself.

Rotsa ruck,
Craig, SN68


---In amelyachtowners@..., wrote :

Oops, you're right, Craig.  That didn't make any sense at all.  It's the inboard end of the long (whisker) pole that was damaged.  When the machinist put it back together, he mounted the inner cone-shaped aluminum piece too far into the aluminum tube.  Now it doesn't stick out far enough to allow the jockey pole Spring-loaded clip to catch.

It's stuck fast, if I can get it out, I can reassemble it properly.

But I haven't been able to get it out, just looking for some tricks that might work without damaging the pole center fitting piece, or composite material collar.

Kent
S/V Kristy
SM243
Jacksonville, FL
 

 


 


Re: SM Furling Motor Brush Dimensions

Miles
 

HI,

As I have recently discovered, Amel used several different motors which had different brushes.  The only sure way to get the correct replacement is to copy the numbers off the plate on the motor and buy them from the manufacturer.  The motors on my boat have different brushes.  I just bought a correct set from the manufacturer branch in Canada (it is on the internet).  Cleaning all of the carbon dust (with a vacuum nearby) also helps the motors.

Regards,

Miles B ,  sm 216, Ladybug , in Newport, preparing to sail to Martinique