Date   

Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF Maybe Gary Silver will respond

Arno Luijten
 

I've had this Square D switch with safety feature for some time now. The added safety is good but if a hose starts leaking it will do nothing to prevent pumping your fresh water tank empty unless the leak is massive and close to the pump. The main objective of the safety is to prevent the pump from running when the tank is empty.

Our pump never runs continuously when using the taps or the showers. Only for the toilets the demand exceeds the pump-supply capacity. In all other cases the pump supplies more water then requested, causing the pressure vessel to fill up. At some point the pressure exceeds the shut off pressure (even when the tap is still running) and the pumps stops for a short while until the pressure vessel has lost enough pressure to re-activate the pump. In other words in many cases the pressure drop will not be enough to activate the safety feature on the Sqare D switch.
So when, let's say the shower tape starts leaking it will happily empty out the watertank even with the Square D safety feature.

The most simple way to secure the system is obviously switching off the pump when you leave. A timer may work but with a big leak you can pump quite a lot of water out of the system in an hour so the question becomes at what duration the time should be set.

Regards,

Arno Luijten
SV Luna,
A54-121


Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF Maybe Gary Silver will respond

Robert Giroux
 

Pardon me if this is a stupid question but how does the pressure switch know the difference between a leak and an open running faucet?

 

 

Regards,

Robert Giroux

Future Amel Owner

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of John Clanton
Sent: Monday, May 11, 2020 3:06 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF Maybe Gary Silver will respond

 

The 55 has the same Square D pressure switch.  If the pressure drops below a certain level, one must manually engage, and hold, the pressure switch (by way of a small lever on the lower, right side of the Square D unit) until a minimum pressure is achieved.  This is typically only a few seconds.

 

I always turn the pressure pump breaker off when I leave, but never considered do so at night.  It makes sense.

 

 

John Clanton

S/V Devereux

Antibes, France


Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF Maybe Gary Silver will respond

John Clanton <jclanton@...>
 

The 55 has the same Square D pressure switch.  If the pressure drops below a certain level, one must manually engage, and hold, the pressure switch (by way of a small lever on the lower, right side of the Square D unit) until a minimum pressure is achieved.  This is typically only a few seconds.

 

I always turn the pressure pump breaker off when I leave, but never considered do so at night.  It makes sense.

 

 

John Clanton

S/V Devereux

Antibes, France


Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF

Thomas Kleman
 

We went with the SOP solution; keep the breaker off. Additionally, the fresh water pump LED goes green when the breaker is pushed in vs when the pump is active.....it helps me remember to turn it off.

Tom and Kirstin
SV L'ORIENT
Cruising Oahu, Hawaii


Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF Maybe Gary Silver will respond

 

Gary,

If Borell happens to be out of production, tell them that I will promote this alarm in my book, my website, and here. 

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 12:28 PM Gary Silver via groups.io <garysilver=mac.com@groups.io> wrote:
This is a good discussion.  I have had three forays into this arena:
1.  I once manually set my Dessalator fresh water flush valve to the flush position, got distracted and pumped 800 liters of "flush" water thru my membranes.  This while motoring into Providencialis in the Turks and Caicos (the lesser draft may have aided in this circumstance).  Only when I investigated why my water tank was empty, did I discover my forgetfulness induced error. In this instance my fresh water was pumped overboard while coming into port, so no major issues.

2.  Once while under sail and running the water maker, I was surprised to hear the bilge water-level alarm go off,  I raised the engine compartment cover to see water sloshing about just around the feet of the Calpeda  AC seawater pump.  A quick finger lick proved it to be salt water and investigation revealed it was coming from the seal of the low pressure Dessalator feed pump.  I assume my bilge pump had been operating for some time until it was overwhelmed.

3.  While sailing from Grenada to Carriacou one boisterous day I overheard a one sided MayDay discussion and noted we were only about 5 miles away from the lat-long of a vessel that was sinking.  We arrived first on scene about 20 minutes after the 4 folks took to their life-raft and watched their home disappear into 11,000 ft of water 2 days before Christmas.   Getting them and their life-raft aboard in 25+ knots and 8 ft seas was quite an adventure. They were sailing along, when the wife decided to go below and get something to eat only to find the floor boards floating.  All attempts to find the site of the water intrusion were futile as the water was already too deep.  Early warning may have helped them save their boat. 

This got me to remembering my first offshore sail training aboard the Orange Coast College vessel Alaska Eagle en-route from Costa Rica to San Diego via Clipperton Atoll.  When standing watch we manually pumped the bilge every hour and logged it.  Able then to deal with any increase in bilge level.  At any rate, after one or more of the above episodes, I purchased a bilge pump run-on alarm from Borel Manufacturing of California.  Wired into the bilge pump circuit, if that circuit runs for more than 2 minutes it sounds a 110 dB sonalert that will awaken the dead.  Once the pump stops momentarily it resets the solid state timer of the run-on alarm.  When aboard I test it daily by switching the bilge pump to the manual position for more than 2 minutes.  

A similar alarm could be utilized on the fresh water pressure pump.  It would only activate if the pressure pump (Amfa or otherwise) ran for more than 2 minutes.  

I checked the Borel Mfg. web site just now and don't see this alarm offered currently, however, I have a call into the owner to inquire about its status.  

I do like the idea of switching the pressure pump power off at night or when off the boat and I plan to incorporate that into my routine.

Thanks for the discussion.  I'll post as soon as I hear from Borel Mfg.

Gary S. Silver, M.D. (retired)
Amel SM 2000 Hull #  335
Puerto Del Rey Marina, Puerto Rico 


Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF Maybe Gary Silver will respond

Matt Salatino
 

I think the Amel 50 has the safety cutoff switch. I go, weekly to a friend’s boat while they’re out of country and fresh water flush the watermaker. I have to turn on 24 volts. The pump will not come on, I assume now, as the pressure is low. I have to flip a lever on the pressure switch to start the pump. Once the pressure builds, it works fine after that. I thought it was a problem with the switch until this thread, when the lightbulb went off...(above my head). Amel finally figured it out....

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On May 11, 2020, at 6:54 PM, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:

Ryan & Kelly,

Great find!

I did not know that Square D offered this. This will work perfectly for any Amel with the OEM pump installed, but will not work for fans of Jabsco and others. That said, if I remember correctly, Gary Silver added an automatic cut-off switch that turned OFF the freshwater pump if it ran continuously for X minutes. Maybe Gary will respond.

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 10:08 AM Ryan Meador <ryan.d.meador@...> wrote:
On my last boat, I had exactly the scenario you suggest happen: a hose let go while I was away from the boat, the entire water supply was pumped into the bilge, and the pump's diaphragm failed.

I recently had to replace the pressure switch on our SM's AMFA water pump, which is a standard Square D switch.  Rather than exact replacement, I used the FSG2J24M4BP, which has a low-pressure cut off.  If a hose lets go, the pressure drops to such an extent that the pump will turn off and not turn on again until you manually flip the switch.  This should prevent the worst of this type of problem, but it won't protect against slow leaks.

Thanks,

Ryan and Kelly
SM 233 Iteration
Boston, MA, USA


On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 8:04 AM Arlo <svplanb@...> wrote:
On my last vessel  51 footer I used wall mounted timer from.McMaster carr that you could turn the dial from 15 to 120 minutes and then it would open the contacts electrically thereby turning off the water pump electric. It was placed by the galley sink. It worked flawlessly with daily use for 10 years. The reason we installed it was to ensure when we left the vessel that the water was turned off. On my Mango my SOP is simply turn off the water when I leave the boat. We have a bilge alarm when the water gets high for when we are onboard. 


Re: Updated Event: Zoom Meeting Presentation of the Amel 50 from La Rochelle - Saturday, 16 May 2020 #cal-invite

Tilo Peters
 

Thanks for setting this up, Bill!

As mentioned, the best experience is via Zoom link (https://epfl.zoom.us/j/98523568530, Meeting ID: 985 2356 8530), as it will give you the best output and you will see things as they are transmitted. So far, I have been amazed at how well zoom performs over relatively low-bandwidth connections. I especially recommend using the app that you can download for free at zoom.us.

I have also created a YouTube Live stream: https://youtu.be/Ffks9eEkGG4

This stream may be a bit off, as it seems to show my control view and not the speaker view that is normally transmitted via Zoom. After the meeting I will upload the Zoom recording to YouTube and send out that link as well, but these days Zoom is taking 48-72 hours to process the videos.

See you Saturday (or Sunday, depending upon what part of the world you’re in)!

Tilo
Zurich, Switzerland


On 11May, 2020, at 17:19, main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io Calendar <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> wrote:

Zoom Meeting Presentation of the Amel 50 from La Rochelle

When:
Saturday, 16 May 2020
20:00 to 21:00
(UTC+00:00) UTC

Where:
From La Rochelle, France aboard Amel 50 SPEED OF LIFE

An RSVP is requested. Click here to RSVP

Description:

Group members Matt & Cindy Salatino will present their brand new Amel 50 #27 "Speed of Life" from the Amel pontoon in La Rochelle. Matt and Cindy will give us a virtual tour during this presentation and answer your questions at the end of the presentation. Tilo Peters will administer the ZOOM meeting and I suspect that things will run smoothly and be enjoyed by all attending. Tilo may record this on YouTube and also may do a YouTube simulcast, but your best experience will be with ZOOM. Tilo will update you on what he will do with YouTube.
 
   Direct link to Join the 16 May at 20:00 UTC - ZOOM Meeting https://epfl.zoom.us/j/98523568530
   Meeting ID: 985 2356 8530
   Join by SIP 98523568530@...

If you missed our first ZOOM meeting, you can view it on YouTube: https://youtu.be/7Mm1bbL-PaA. The first meeting was a test to understand the process. We did not have an expert guest speaker but we plan to have an expert guest speaker for most future meetings. I am currently working to line up experts for:
   Standing Rigging
   Sails 
   Refrigeration
   And more

Times for participation around the world.

       
Country GMT +/- Scheduled Time Scheduled Date
(GMT) 0 2000 5/16/2020
UK Summer Time 100 2100 5/16/2020
NZ 1200 800 5/17/2020
AU Queensland 1000 600 5/17/2020
Tahiti -1000 1000 5/16/2020
USA West DST -700 1300 5/16/2020
USA East DST -400 1600 5/16/2020
USA Central DST -500 1500 5/16/2020
Martinique -400 1600 5/16/2020
Germany 200 2200 5/16/2020
Central EU Summer Time 200 2200 5/16/2020
Note: The above was checked with: https://greenwichmeantime.com/time-gadgets/time-zone-converter/

<Mail Attachment.ics><invite.ics>


Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF Maybe Gary Silver will respond

Gary Silver
 

This is a good discussion.  I have had three forays into this arena:
1.  I once manually set my Dessalator fresh water flush valve to the flush position, got distracted and pumped 800 liters of "flush" water thru my membranes.  This while motoring into Providencialis in the Turks and Caicos (the lesser draft may have aided in this circumstance).  Only when I investigated why my water tank was empty, did I discover my forgetfulness induced error. In this instance my fresh water was pumped overboard while coming into port, so no major issues.

2.  Once while under sail and running the water maker, I was surprised to hear the bilge water-level alarm go off,  I raised the engine compartment cover to see water sloshing about just around the feet of the Calpeda  AC seawater pump.  A quick finger lick proved it to be salt water and investigation revealed it was coming from the seal of the low pressure Dessalator feed pump.  I assume my bilge pump had been operating for some time until it was overwhelmed.

3.  While sailing from Grenada to Carriacou one boisterous day I overheard a one sided MayDay discussion and noted we were only about 5 miles away from the lat-long of a vessel that was sinking.  We arrived first on scene about 20 minutes after the 4 folks took to their life-raft and watched their home disappear into 11,000 ft of water 2 days before Christmas.   Getting them and their life-raft aboard in 25+ knots and 8 ft seas was quite an adventure. They were sailing along, when the wife decided to go below and get something to eat only to find the floor boards floating.  All attempts to find the site of the water intrusion were futile as the water was already too deep.  Early warning may have helped them save their boat. 

This got me to remembering my first offshore sail training aboard the Orange Coast College vessel Alaska Eagle en-route from Costa Rica to San Diego via Clipperton Atoll.  When standing watch we manually pumped the bilge every hour and logged it.  Able then to deal with any increase in bilge level.  At any rate, after one or more of the above episodes, I purchased a bilge pump run-on alarm from Borel Manufacturing of California.  Wired into the bilge pump circuit, if that circuit runs for more than 2 minutes it sounds a 110 dB sonalert that will awaken the dead.  Once the pump stops momentarily it resets the solid state timer of the run-on alarm.  When aboard I test it daily by switching the bilge pump to the manual position for more than 2 minutes.  

A similar alarm could be utilized on the fresh water pressure pump.  It would only activate if the pressure pump (Amfa or otherwise) ran for more than 2 minutes.  

I checked the Borel Mfg. web site just now and don't see this alarm offered currently, however, I have a call into the owner to inquire about its status.  

I do like the idea of switching the pressure pump power off at night or when off the boat and I plan to incorporate that into my routine.

Thanks for the discussion.  I'll post as soon as I hear from Borel Mfg.

Gary S. Silver, M.D. (retired)
Amel SM 2000 Hull #  335
Puerto Del Rey Marina, Puerto Rico 


Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF Maybe Gary Silver will respond

 

Ryan & Kelly,

Great find!

I did not know that Square D offered this. This will work perfectly for any Amel with the OEM pump installed, but will not work for fans of Jabsco and others. That said, if I remember correctly, Gary Silver added an automatic cut-off switch that turned OFF the freshwater pump if it ran continuously for X minutes. Maybe Gary will respond.

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 10:08 AM Ryan Meador <ryan.d.meador@...> wrote:
On my last boat, I had exactly the scenario you suggest happen: a hose let go while I was away from the boat, the entire water supply was pumped into the bilge, and the pump's diaphragm failed.

I recently had to replace the pressure switch on our SM's AMFA water pump, which is a standard Square D switch.  Rather than exact replacement, I used the FSG2J24M4BP, which has a low-pressure cut off.  If a hose lets go, the pressure drops to such an extent that the pump will turn off and not turn on again until you manually flip the switch.  This should prevent the worst of this type of problem, but it won't protect against slow leaks.

Thanks,

Ryan and Kelly
SM 233 Iteration
Boston, MA, USA


On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 8:04 AM Arlo <svplanb@...> wrote:
On my last vessel  51 footer I used wall mounted timer from.McMaster carr that you could turn the dial from 15 to 120 minutes and then it would open the contacts electrically thereby turning off the water pump electric. It was placed by the galley sink. It worked flawlessly with daily use for 10 years. The reason we installed it was to ensure when we left the vessel that the water was turned off. On my Mango my SOP is simply turn off the water when I leave the boat. We have a bilge alarm when the water gets high for when we are onboard. 


Updated Event: Zoom Meeting Presentation of the Amel 50 from La Rochelle - Saturday, 16 May 2020 #cal-invite

main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io Calendar <main@...>
 

Zoom Meeting Presentation of the Amel 50 from La Rochelle

When:
Saturday, 16 May 2020
20:00 to 21:00
(UTC+00:00) UTC

Where:
From La Rochelle, France aboard Amel 50 SPEED OF LIFE

An RSVP is requested. Click here to RSVP

Description:

Group members Matt & Cindy Salatino will present their brand new Amel 50 #27 "Speed of Life" from the Amel pontoon in La Rochelle. Matt and Cindy will give us a virtual tour during this presentation and answer your questions at the end of the presentation. Tilo Peters will administer the ZOOM meeting and I suspect that things will run smoothly and be enjoyed by all attending. Tilo may record this on YouTube and also may do a YouTube simulcast, but your best experience will be with ZOOM. Tilo will update you on what he will do with YouTube.

 

   Direct link to Join the 16 May at 20:00 UTC - ZOOM Meeting https://epfl.zoom.us/j/98523568530
   Meeting ID: 985 2356 8530
   Join by SIP 98523568530@...

If you missed our first ZOOM meeting, you can view it on YouTube: https://youtu.be/7Mm1bbL-PaA. The first meeting was a test to understand the process. We did not have an expert guest speaker but we plan to have an expert guest speaker for most future meetings. I am currently working to line up experts for:
   Standing Rigging
   Sails 
   Refrigeration
   And more

Times for participation around the world.

       
Country GMT +/- Scheduled Time Scheduled Date
(GMT) 0 2000 5/16/2020
UK Summer Time 100 2100 5/16/2020
NZ 1200 800 5/17/2020
AU Queensland 1000 600 5/17/2020
Tahiti -1000 1000 5/16/2020
USA West DST -700 1300 5/16/2020
USA East DST -400 1600 5/16/2020
USA Central DST -500 1500 5/16/2020
Martinique -400 1600 5/16/2020
Germany 200 2200 5/16/2020
Central EU Summer Time 200 2200 5/16/2020
Note: The above was checked with: https://greenwichmeantime.com/time-gadgets/time-zone-converter/


Re: ZOOM Meeting - Presentation of the Amel 50 from La Rochelle #ZOOM #IMPORTANT

Mohammad Shirloo
 

Thanks to Bill and Tilo for taking the time to make these happen.

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of CW Bill Rouse via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 11, 2020 7:05 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [Special] [AmelYachtOwners] ZOOM Meeting - Presentation of the Amel 50 from La Rochelle #IMPORTANT #ZOOM

 

Re: Confirmation of Amel 50 ZOOM Meeting: Saturday, May 16th at 20:00 UTC.

This Saturday at 2000 hours GMT, we will have a presentation of a new Amel 50. Group members Matt & Cindy Salatino will present their brand new Amel 50 #27 "Speed of Life" from the Amel pontoon in La Rochelle. Matt and Cindy will give us a virtual tour during this presentation and answer your questions at the end of the presentation. Tilo Peters will administer the ZOOM meeting and I suspect that things will run smoothly and be enjoyed by all attending. Tilo may record this on YouTube and also may do a YouTube simulcast, but your best experience will be with ZOOM. Tilo will update you on what he will do with YouTube.

 

   Direct link to Join the 16 May at 20:00 UTC - ZOOM Meeting https://epfl.zoom.us/j/98523568530

   Meeting ID: 985 2356 8530

   Join by SIP 98523568530@...

 

If you missed our first ZOOM meeting, you can view it on YouTube: https://youtu.be/7Mm1bbL-PaA. The first meeting was a test to understand the process. We did not have an expert guest speaker but we plan to have an expert guest speaker for most future meetings. I am currently working to line up experts for:
   Standing Rigging
   Sails 
   Refrigeration
   And more

Times for participation around the world.

 

 

 

 

Country

GMT +/-

Scheduled Time

Scheduled Date

(GMT)

0

2000

5/16/2020

UK Summer Time

100

2100

5/16/2020

NZ

1200

800

5/17/2020

AU Queensland

1000

600

5/17/2020

Tahiti

-1000

1000

5/16/2020

USA West DST

-700

1300

5/16/2020

USA East DST

-400

1600

5/16/2020

USA Central DST

-500

1500

5/16/2020

Martinique

-400

1600

5/16/2020

Germany

200

2200

5/16/2020

Central EU Summer Time

200

2200

5/16/2020

Note: The above was checked with: https://greenwichmeantime.com/time-gadgets/time-zone-converter/

Best,

Bill

 

 

--

CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School

 

Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 

 

 

View My Training Calendar


Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF

Ryan Meador
 

On my last boat, I had exactly the scenario you suggest happen: a hose let go while I was away from the boat, the entire water supply was pumped into the bilge, and the pump's diaphragm failed.

I recently had to replace the pressure switch on our SM's AMFA water pump, which is a standard Square D switch.  Rather than exact replacement, I used the FSG2J24M4BP, which has a low-pressure cut off.  If a hose lets go, the pressure drops to such an extent that the pump will turn off and not turn on again until you manually flip the switch.  This should prevent the worst of this type of problem, but it won't protect against slow leaks.

Thanks,

Ryan and Kelly
SM 233 Iteration
Boston, MA, USA


On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 8:04 AM Arlo <svplanb@...> wrote:
On my last vessel  51 footer I used wall mounted timer from.McMaster carr that you could turn the dial from 15 to 120 minutes and then it would open the contacts electrically thereby turning off the water pump electric. It was placed by the galley sink. It worked flawlessly with daily use for 10 years. The reason we installed it was to ensure when we left the vessel that the water was turned off. On my Mango my SOP is simply turn off the water when I leave the boat. We have a bilge alarm when the water gets high for when we are onboard. 


Re: Parasailor on A54

Joerg Esdorn
 

Scott, my procedure is similar to yours.  Getting the main unfurled is helpful and easing the sheet is vital, although there is a point where easing it too much results in the sail coming down twisted.   I lead the snuffer line to an opening block attached to the Leeward forward mooring cleat with a soft shackle and pulling through that block, I’ve not needed a winch to pull down the snuffer.   If you don’t have the block, you cannot really pull effectively and a light person risks being hoisted up by the line!   I’m having the snuffer line lengthened now so I can get it on one of the cockpit winches when necessary.   As it was, I could put it on the anchor capstan but it was not long enough to reach the mast winches.  I want to be able to pull the snuffer down from the cockpit, which could be a big safety factor.  

On your other point, I fully agree.  It’s very important to make sure the people doing the work have done the specific work before and have an excellent reputation.  And you or a third person whom you trust must check the work carefully.  I’m having Lithium batteries installed on my boat by the local Mastervolt dealer.  At the end, a Mastervolt technician will travel to the boat and certify the installation.   I’m hoping that is being careful enough!  Cheers. Joerg 


ZOOM Meeting - Presentation of the Amel 50 from La Rochelle #ZOOM #IMPORTANT

 

Re: Confirmation of Amel 50 ZOOM Meeting: Saturday, May 16th at 20:00 UTC.

This Saturday at 2000 hours GMT, we will have a presentation of a new Amel 50. Group members Matt & Cindy Salatino will present their brand new Amel 50 #27 "Speed of Life" from the Amel pontoon in La Rochelle. Matt and Cindy will give us a virtual tour during this presentation and answer your questions at the end of the presentation. Tilo Peters will administer the ZOOM meeting and I suspect that things will run smoothly and be enjoyed by all attending. Tilo may record this on YouTube and also may do a YouTube simulcast, but your best experience will be with ZOOM. Tilo will update you on what he will do with YouTube.

 

   Direct link to Join the 16 May at 20:00 UTC - ZOOM Meeting https://epfl.zoom.us/j/98523568530
   Meeting ID: 985 2356 8530
   Join by SIP 98523568530@...

If you missed our first ZOOM meeting, you can view it on YouTube: https://youtu.be/7Mm1bbL-PaA. The first meeting was a test to understand the process. We did not have an expert guest speaker but we plan to have an expert guest speaker for most future meetings. I am currently working to line up experts for:
   Standing Rigging
   Sails 
   Refrigeration
   And more

Times for participation around the world.

       
Country GMT +/- Scheduled Time Scheduled Date
(GMT) 0 2000 5/16/2020
UK Summer Time 100 2100 5/16/2020
NZ 1200 800 5/17/2020
AU Queensland 1000 600 5/17/2020
Tahiti -1000 1000 5/16/2020
USA West DST -700 1300 5/16/2020
USA East DST -400 1600 5/16/2020
USA Central DST -500 1500 5/16/2020
Martinique -400 1600 5/16/2020
Germany 200 2200 5/16/2020
Central EU Summer Time 200 2200 5/16/2020
Note: The above was checked with: https://greenwichmeantime.com/time-gadgets/time-zone-converter/

Best,

Bill

 

 

--
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
 
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
 
View My Training Calendar


Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF

Matt Salatino
 

I believe it’s the valves in the diaphragm. It’s usually a gang of 3 or 4 valves that are replaced as a set on a common “diaphragm”. Easily replaced, and spare part at most chandleries or from Amazon/EBay. Replacing that part fixes the problem.

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On May 11, 2020, at 3:38 PM, Patrick McAneny via groups.io <sailw32@...> wrote:

William , I have that problem , my pump cycles on for a maybe two seconds every five minutes or so. I have looked everywhere for a leak and finally concluded it had to be a leak in the pump, allowing water to go back to the tank. Can the check valves be accessed to clean ? 
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: william reynolds <sail23692@...>
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Sent: Mon, May 11, 2020 9:19 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF

 we suggest you always kill the power  to the fresh water pump when leaving the boat.We check all clamps on the fresh water system every 6 months. I keep the water pressure at about 40 psi to reduce pressure on all water components. A final note, all Shurflo and Jabsco pumps have tiny check valves on the inlet and outlet. They do not tell you about this. Any tiny particles can lodge in these valves and bleed off the system pressure. The symptom of this problem is an infrequent cycling of the pump with no apparent leaks. I have always installed a prefilter on my fresh water system and have rarely had a pump problem. See attached pic CloudStreet
Bill Reynolds SM2K 331


Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF

Patrick McAneny
 

William , I have that problem , my pump cycles on for a maybe two seconds every five minutes or so. I have looked everywhere for a leak and finally concluded it had to be a leak in the pump, allowing water to go back to the tank. Can the check valves be accessed to clean ? 
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: william reynolds <sail23692@...>
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Sent: Mon, May 11, 2020 9:19 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF

 we suggest you always kill the power  to the fresh water pump when leaving the boat.We check all clamps on the fresh water system every 6 months. I keep the water pressure at about 40 psi to reduce pressure on all water components. A final note, all Shurflo and Jabsco pumps have tiny check valves on the inlet and outlet. They do not tell you about this. Any tiny particles can lodge in these valves and bleed off the system pressure. The symptom of this problem is an infrequent cycling of the pump with no apparent leaks. I have always installed a prefilter on my fresh water system and have rarely had a pump problem. See attached pic CloudStreet
Bill Reynolds SM2K 331


Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF

william reynolds
 

 we suggest you always kill the power  to the fresh water pump when leaving the boat.We check all clamps on the fresh water system every 6 months. I keep the water pressure at about 40 psi to reduce pressure on all water components. A final note, all Shurflo and Jabsco pumps have tiny check valves on the inlet and outlet. They do not tell you about this. Any tiny particles can lodge in these valves and bleed off the system pressure. The symptom of this problem is an infrequent cycling of the pump with no apparent leaks. I have always installed a prefilter on my fresh water system and have rarely had a pump problem. See attached pic CloudStreet
Bill Reynolds SM2K 331


Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF

Arlo
 

On my last vessel  51 footer I used wall mounted timer from.McMaster carr that you could turn the dial from 15 to 120 minutes and then it would open the contacts electrically thereby turning off the water pump electric. It was placed by the galley sink. It worked flawlessly with daily use for 10 years. The reason we installed it was to ensure when we left the vessel that the water was turned off. On my Mango my SOP is simply turn off the water when I leave the boat. We have a bilge alarm when the water gets high for when we are onboard. 


Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF

Gerhard Mueller
 

It is far easier to use faucets or water taps equipped with micro switches. The micro switches operate a relay to start/stop the pump. So the pump only runs when a faucet is opened. You can get such faucets with micro switches e.g. from Whale.
--
Gerhard Mueller
Amel Sharki #60
Currently Kalamata, Greece


Re: FRESH WATER SAFETY CUTOFF

Matt Salatino
 

I’ve seen some boats use an ordinary light timer, available in any hardware store. They crank it on when they use the water system, and it times out, shutting off the pump. There is also a device made specifically for this purpose for boats.
This device would need a relay to operate a higher amperage pump:

On May 11, 2020, at 7:51 AM, Steven Bode - SV Intention 1994-SM#117 <steve@...> wrote:

FRESH WATER SAFETY SHUTOFF SYSTEM REQUEST FOR COMMENTS

Amelians, I believe that there is a serious issue with the fresh water pump system on the Super Maramu and I would like your input. 

The problem: In the event of a failure of the pressurized freshwater system — a break anywhere in the water plumbing, the entire freshwater supply could be drained overboard resulting in (a) loss of critical freshwater, (b) overuse of the freshwater pump (killing it) and (c) over use of the main bilge pump (killing it, too). Don’t ask me how I know.

Situational description: The freshwater pump may be left on. This is often the case when people are onboard, for example overnight or sometimes when they are ashore (off the boat).

The pump will pressurize the water system and remain off as long as the system remains pressurized. The pump will activate automatically any time there is a drop in water pressure.

If there is a break in the pressurized water system — a fault, then the pump will activate and run continuously until it is switched off, draining the entire fresh water supply into the bilge where it will be pumped overboard by the main bilge pump. This is a costly occurrence or possibly a safety issue if fresh water can not be resupplied, for example if the boat is off shore and there is no water maker.

A Proposal: A safety mechanism is needed to prevent this. A simple solution would be a timer that is activated every time the pump is activated. When the timer expires the pump is automatically deactivated until the system is manually reset. By determining the average time the pump is running each time it is activated, the timer could be set to shut off the system whenever above average run time is encountered. For example, if the pump typically runs for an average of 60 seconds, then the timer could be set for five minutes. If the pump runs for five minutes, then the timer turns off the power to the water pump, functioning like a breaker. The pump must be reset manually like a breaker.

Resetting the breaker: Ideally, this timer circuit would reset automatically once water pressure is restored, but that is much more complicated as it would require the deactivated pump to be turned on again or some other system employed.

 

This is a request for comments from those of you out there who have either considered this issue or who would like to develop a solution. I propose that a timer circuit be introduced between the breaker and the pump to serve as a safety device. It would be unobtrusive as long as the water was not to remain open for more than the timer duration. I am not a circuit designer, but I have been researching homebuilt circuits that might work.

--
Steve Bode, Sailing Vessel Intention
Amel Super Maramu #117 (1994) 
Western Mediterranean
+1 415-710-6659 voice/text/whatsapp