Date   

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

James Alton
 

Alan,

   Your inner forestay arrangement sounds like a great solution for setting a smaller jib on the foredeck.  How much wind can you use the staysail in  (with the wind well forward of the beam) before reefing?  Does the staysail still have a nice shape when reefed down to storm jib size?  How are the running backs setup/attached?

   90 degree tacks in a boat with that level of comfort, huge water tankage in the keel, enclosed protected steering station, solar arch etc.?  Don’t you feel a little sorry for the poor chaps out there will there with their low topsides, open cockpits trying to do that well?  (grin)   I would be quite happy and surprised to see 110 degrees with Sueno…  I am going to look into getting a quote from your sailmaker.

Best,

James


On Nov 18, 2016, at 7:09 PM, divanz620@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Hi James,


There are lots of messages in here about inner forestays...and pictures.
Ours was factory installed and is a furler on a permanent stay at the top spreader with dyneema running back stays. The furler is anchored fwd of the windlass to a 13mm SS plate under the deck that runs under the deck from the windlass to the bow fitting.
I'll try post some track pics from Maxsea that show the 90 degree tacks !
Cheers'
Alan
Elyse SM437




Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Santorin with D2-55 Engine - Range

tfortner1975
 

Thank you all for the information. 

Trevor
SV Iris SN27
Langkawi

On Sat, Nov 19, 2016 at 4:03 AM, 'Herbert Lackner' herbert@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Perkins Prima M50 (Volvo MD22) fuel consumption on KALI MERA varies from 1,8 l/ hour with 1500 rpm (motor-sailing) and goes up to 4l/hour with 2300 rpm.  As we are not in a hurry with no wind we cruise with 5kn and ~ 1800  rpm and use about 2,2 l / hour.    If the prop is really dirty than add about o,5 - 1 l / hour

 

herbert

SN120 KALI MERA, Trinidad, 11 more days on the hard



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Jib Furling Pin Free to a Good Home

Bill Kinney <greatketch@...>
 

It’s been claimed…

On Nov 18, 2016, at 22:36, greatketch@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


Hello all,


As part of a repair and upgrade to our jib furler we replaced the furling drum with the new style two piece drum. (Note:  Don't make this change for fun. The new unit is better designed than the old one, but it is NOT a drop in replacement. Significant engineering and machining required!)


Salvaged from the old unit, and not usable in our new one, is the stainless pin that pulls up to disengage the drum and foil from the motor and transmission so you can furl manually with a line wrapped around the drum.


This is both the pin, and the housing that contains it that screws into the furling drum. Fully functional, the spring is good, no corrosion.  The previous owners of Harmonie were sticklers for maintenance and kept everything lubricated as it should be.


First person to raise their hand gets it for the cost of shipping from Florida.


Bill Kinney

SM#160 Harmonie

On the Hard in Fort Lauderdale, Fl

"Ships and men rot in port."

fetchinketch








Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Jib Furling Pin Free to a Good Home

Mark Erdos
 

I have my hand up

 

We are currently in FL.

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Super Maramu 2000

Hull #275

www.creampuff.us

Currently cruising:  Tampa Bay for hurricane season

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Friday, November 18, 2016 10:36 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Jib Furling Pin Free to a Good Home

 

 

Hello all,

 

As part of a repair and upgrade to our jib furler we replaced the furling drum with the new style two piece drum. (Note:  Don't make this change for fun. The new unit is better designed than the old one, but it is NOT a drop in replacement. Significant engineering and machining required!)

 

Salvaged from the old unit, and not usable in our new one, is the stainless pin that pulls up to disengage the drum and foil from the motor and transmission so you can furl manually with a line wrapped around the drum.

 

This is both the pin, and the housing that contains it that screws into the furling drum. Fully functional, the spring is good, no corrosion.  The previous owners of Harmonie were sticklers for maintenance and kept everything lubricated as it should be.

 

First person to raise their hand gets it for the cost of shipping from Florida.

 

Bill Kinney

SM#160 Harmonie

On the Hard in Fort Lauderdale, Fl

"Ships and men rot in port."

fetchinketch

image

fetchinketch

Sailing where we want, when we can!

Preview by Yahoo

 

 

 

 


Jib Furling Pin Free to a Good Home

greatketch@...
 

Hello all,


As part of a repair and upgrade to our jib furler we replaced the furling drum with the new style two piece drum. (Note:  Don't make this change for fun. The new unit is better designed than the old one, but it is NOT a drop in replacement. Significant engineering and machining required!)


Salvaged from the old unit, and not usable in our new one, is the stainless pin that pulls up to disengage the drum and foil from the motor and transmission so you can furl manually with a line wrapped around the drum.


This is both the pin, and the housing that contains it that screws into the furling drum. Fully functional, the spring is good, no corrosion.  The previous owners of Harmonie were sticklers for maintenance and kept everything lubricated as it should be.


First person to raise their hand gets it for the cost of shipping from Florida.


Bill Kinney

SM#160 Harmonie

On the Hard in Fort Lauderdale, Fl

"Ships and men rot in port."

fetchinketch






Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

Alan Leslie
 

Bill,
This day was exceptional I have to admit, we usually are more like 100 degrees, but Elyse continues to surprise me.
The sails are Hydranet triadials from Deme Voiles, the main and mizzen have positive roach with short vertical battens and we always hike up the traveller on the main to keep the boom on the centre line when hard on the wind.
Cheers
Alan
Elyse SM437


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

Bill Kinney <greatketch@...>
 

Alan,

You really get a SM to tack through 90 degrees measured by COG?  Wow!  Who’s your sailmaker?  That’s a COG tacking angle I’d expect from a J-105!

What apparent wind angle do you have to pull to get that, and how do you do it?

In normal sea conditions, I expect to hold 35º to 37º to the apparent wind, which gives us about a 50º+/- angle to the true wind, but we haven’t counted for leeway yet, so I normally think I am doing well with 102º to 105º change in COG on a tack. If I get to 110º in small seas I know I am getting sloppy on my sail trim.  My autopilot tweaks the course while beating to optimize VMG, and it always settles down very close to those numbers--if the seas aren’t too rough.

In perfect conditions (10-12 knots true, flat water) I can pinch a little more out before the keel stalls and I start going sideways.  I’ll expect to get a little better with new sails, but nothing like what you see.

Bill Kinney
SM #160, Harmonie
On the Hard, Fort Lauderdale, FL
“Ships and men rot in port."



On Nov 18, 2016, at 18:09, divanz620@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Hi James,


There are lots of messages in here about inner forestays...and pictures.
Ours was factory installed and is a furler on a permanent stay at the top spreader with dyneema running back stays. The furler is anchored fwd of the windlass to a 13mm SS plate under the deck that runs under the deck from the windlass to the bow fitting.
I'll try post some track pics from Maxsea that show the 90 degree tacks !
Cheers'
Alan
Elyse SM437



Re: Santorin with D2-55 Engine - Range

Herbert Lackner
 

Perkins Prima M50 (Volvo MD22) fuel consumption on KALI MERA varies from 1,8 l/ hour with 1500 rpm (motor-sailing) and goes up to 4l/hour with 2300 rpm.  As we are not in a hurry with no wind we cruise with 5kn and ~ 1800  rpm and use about 2,2 l / hour.    If the prop is really dirty than add about o,5 - 1 l / hour

 

herbert

SN120 KALI MERA, Trinidad, 11 more days on the hard


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

Alan Leslie
 

Hi James,

There are lots of messages in here about inner forestays...and pictures.
Ours was factory installed and is a furler on a permanent stay at the top spreader with dyneema running back stays. The furler is anchored fwd of the windlass to a 13mm SS plate under the deck that runs under the deck from the windlass to the bow fitting.
I'll try post some track pics from Maxsea that show the 90 degree tacks !
Cheers'
Alan
Elyse SM437


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

James Alton
 

Bill,

   I am unfortunately not on my boat, however as I recall, on the bottom of my swivel are two eyes that line up with the two grooves in the furler.  These two eyes are the attachment points for the heads of my headsails.  One of will be used in the normal way with the head of my 150 lashed or shackled to it.  The remaining free eye which the head of the ballooner would normally be attached to if hoisted with the 150 is where I plan to hang the top block.  This should place the lift point directly above the slot in the foil for the ballooner.  

James


On Nov 18, 2016, at 5:27 PM, Bill Kinney greatketch@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


If the block is attached to the bottom of the swivel, it turns with the foil, and the job. The top of the swivel does not turn.  That's what makes it a swivel...



On Nov 18, 2016, at 16:16, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

Bill Kinney <greatketch@...>
 

If the block is attached to the bottom of the swivel, it turns with the foil, and the job. The top of the swivel does not turn.  That's what makes it a swivel...



On Nov 18, 2016, at 16:16, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

James,

You will be attaching a block to the swivel. It does not turn when the foil and sail is furled. Therefore, you will have that halyard wrap around the foil.

Do you get it?

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail


On Nov 18, 2016 5:10 PM, "James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Bill,


   My plan is to attach a small block at the location that the head of the second sail would be normally attached to and the second small block at the location where the tack of that sail is normally secured.  The continuous halyard will be looped through those two blocks. Unless I am missing something, both of those attachment points rotate with the foil, otherwise the sail itself would be wrapped. When the sails are rolled, the halyard will be buried under the sail.  I believe that the Ballooner that I have is a fair amount shorter than the hoist available so I should have room for the blocks and for tensioning. 

   If for some reason this solution does not work out, I want to look into the cost of upgrading the furling system with a new foil and add the locking device.  

   I am cutting the trail ing tails off of my posts but leaving the one immediately preceding to help with context.  If that is a problem, someone let me know.

James Alton
SV Sueno,  Maramu #220
Arbatax,  Italy 


On Nov 18, 2016, at 4:46 PM, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


If I understand you correctly, to hoist the second sail, you will have a block somehow attached to the swivel with a continuous loop halyard that you will somehow tie off in the top of the furler.

That block is going to remain stationary while the foil and the sail turn while furling and unfurling. If I understand you correctly, I see wrapping of that halyard around the foil and between the block and the top of the sail and probably halyard failure. 

Maybe you could attach the block to the foil somehow, but I see big problems there.

Maybe I don't understand you.

Bil l Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail




Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

Bill Kinney <greatketch@...>
 

Or maybe attach it to the shackle that holds the jib up to the swivel, avoiding the wrap problem?   

On Nov 18, 2016, at 15:46, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

If I understand you correctly, to hoist the second sail, you will have a block somehow attached to the swivel with a continuous loop halyard that you will somehow tie off in the top of the furler.

That block is going to remain stationary while the foil and the sail turn while furling and unfurling. If I understand you correctly, I see wrapping of that halyard around the foil and between the block and the top of the sail and probably halyard failure.

Maybe you could attach the block to the foil somehow, but I see big problems there.

Maybe I don't understand you.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail


On Nov 18, 2016 4:29 PM, "James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Bill,


   Well I can think of only two possible options:

1.  He didn’t think of it.
2.  He did think of it and decided it was bad idea, in which case I may have some details on why after doing some testing..

   I think that it will work and so far cannot think of a good reason not to give it a try.
 If you forsee a problem with this idea,  let me know.

James Alton
SV Sueno,  Maramu #220
Arbatax,  Italy

On Nov 18, 2016, at 4:11 PM, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

I have one question. I wonder why Henri Amel did NOT do it that way?

Bill ROUSE
BeBe


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

James,

You will be attaching a block to the swivel. It does not turn when the foil and sail is furled. Therefore, you will have that halyard wrap around the foil.

Do you get it?

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail


On Nov 18, 2016 5:10 PM, "James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Bill,


   My plan is to attach a small block at the location that the head of the second sail would be normally attached to and the second small block at the location where the tack of that sail is normally secured.  The continuous halyard will be looped through those two blocks. Unless I am missing something, both of those attachment points rotate with the foil, otherwise the sail itself would be wrapped. When the sails are rolled, the halyard will be buried under the sail.  I believe that the Ballooner that I have is a fair amount shorter than the hoist available so I should have room for the blocks and for tensioning. 

   If for some reason this solution does not work out, I want to look into the cost of upgrading the furling system with a new foil and add the locking device.  

   I am cutting the trail ing tails off of my posts but leaving the one immediately preceding to help with context.  If that is a problem, someone let me know.

James Alton
SV Sueno,  Maramu #220
Arbatax,  Italy 


On Nov 18, 2016, at 4:46 PM, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


If I understand you correctly, to hoist the second sail, you will have a block somehow attached to the swivel with a continuous loop halyard that you will somehow tie off in the top of the furler.

That block is going to remain stationary while the foil and the sail turn while furling and unfurling. If I understand you correctly, I see wrapping of that halyard around the foil and between the block and the top of the sail and probably halyard failure. 

Maybe you could attach the block to the foil somehow, but I see big problems there.

Maybe I don't understand you.

Bil l Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail




Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

James Alton
 

Bill,

   My plan is to attach a small block at the location that the head of the second sail would be normally attached to and the second small block at the location where the tack of that sail is normally secured.  The continuous halyard will be looped through those two blocks. Unless I am missing something, both of those attachment points rotate with the foil, otherwise the sail itself would be wrapped. When the sails are rolled, the halyard will be buried under the sail.  I believe that the Ballooner that I have is a fair amount shorter than the hoist available so I should have room for the blocks and for tensioning. 

   If for some reason this solution does not work out, I want to look into the cost of upgrading the furling system with a new foil and add the locking device.  

   I am cutting the trailing tails off of my posts but leaving the one immediately preceding to help with context.  If that is a problem, someone let me know.

James Alton
SV Sueno,  Maramu #220
Arbatax,  Italy 


On Nov 18, 2016, at 4:46 PM, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


If I understand you correctly, to hoist the second sail, you will have a block somehow attached to the swivel with a continuous loop halyard that you will somehow tie off in the top of the furler.

That block is going to remain stationary while the foil and the sail turn while furling and unfurling. If I understand you correctly, I see wrapping of that halyard around the foil and between the block and the top of the sail and probably halyard failure. 

Maybe you could attach the block to the foil somehow, but I see big problems there.

Maybe I don't understand you.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail




Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Bill
Perhaps because as a manufacturer he was able to fit a three track headsail foil, not work a system around two tracks.
Danny



From: "'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners]"
To: "amelyachtowners@..."
Sent: Saturday, 19 November 2016 9:11 AM
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

 
I have one question. I wonder why Henri Amel did NOT do it that way?

Bill ROUSE
BeBe

On Fri, Nov 18, 2016 at 3:17 PM, James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 
Bill,

   Thanks,  I hope that it does work!  I will update the group once I have used it for a while to find out.

Best,

James Alton
SV Sueno,  Maramu #220
Arbatax,  Italy

On Nov 18, 2016, at 11:53 AM, Bill Kinney greatketch@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups. com> wrote:

James,

For what it’s worth, I really like your idea about the looped halyard. Simple and elegant.  Wish I had thought of it :)  Maybe you can market it to all those “other boats” who have twin track foils! :-)

I don’t think we have seen ANYTHING in the basic design of our boat that we would change.  Almost all of the minor tweaks in execution we have made, or contemplate, are things that Amel had already changed by the time they got to building the 54.

Bill Kinney
SM #160, Harmonie
On the Hard, Fort Lauderdale, FL
“Ships and men rot in port."





Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

If I understand you correctly, to hoist the second sail, you will have a block somehow attached to the swivel with a continuous loop halyard that you will somehow tie off in the top of the furler.

That block is going to remain stationary while the foil and the sail turn while furling and unfurling. If I understand you correctly, I see wrapping of that halyard around the foil and between the block and the top of the sail and probably halyard failure.

Maybe you could attach the block to the foil somehow, but I see big problems there.

Maybe I don't understand you.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail


On Nov 18, 2016 4:29 PM, "James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Bill,


   Well I can think of only two possible options:

1.  He didn’t think of it.
2.  He did think of it and decided it was bad idea, in which case I may have some details on why after doing some testing..

   I think that it will work and so far cannot think of a good reason not to give it a try.
 If you forsee a problem with this idea,  let me know.

James Alton
SV Sueno,  Maramu #220
Arbatax,  Italy

On Nov 18, 2016, at 4:11 PM, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

I have one question. I wonder why Henri Amel did NOT do it that way?

Bill ROUSE
BeBe


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

James Alton
 

Bill,

   Well I can think of only two possible options:

1.  He didn’t think of it.
2.  He did think of it and decided it was bad idea, in which case I may have some details on why after doing some testing..

   I think that it will work and so far cannot think of a good reason not to give it a try.
 If you forsee a problem with this idea,  let me know.

James Alton
SV Sueno,  Maramu #220
Arbatax,  Italy

On Nov 18, 2016, at 4:11 PM, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

I have one question. I wonder why Henri Amel did NOT do it that way?

Bill ROUSE
BeBe


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

I have one question. I wonder why Henri Amel did NOT do it that way?

Bill ROUSE
BeBe

On Fri, Nov 18, 2016 at 3:17 PM, James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Bill,


   Thanks,  I hope that it does work!  I will update the group once I have used it for a while to find out.

Best,

James Alton
SV Sueno,  Maramu #220
Arbatax,  Italy

On Nov 18, 2016, at 11:53 AM, Bill Kinney greatketch@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

James,


For what it’s worth, I really like your idea about the looped halyard. Simple and elegant.  Wish I had thought of it :)  Maybe you can market it to all those “other boats” who have twin track foils! :-)

I don’t think we have seen ANYTHING in the basic design of our boat that we would change.  Almost all of the minor tweaks in execution we have made, or contemplate, are things that Amel had already changed by the time they got to building the 54.

Bill Kinney
SM #160, Harmonie
On the Hard, Fort Lauderdale, FL
“Ships and men rot in port."



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] New sails

James Alton
 

Bill,

   Thanks,  I hope that it does work!  I will update the group once I have used it for a while to find out.

Best,

James Alton
SV Sueno,  Maramu #220
Arbatax,  Italy

On Nov 18, 2016, at 11:53 AM, Bill Kinney greatketch@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

James,


For what it’s worth, I really like your idea about the looped halyard. Simple and elegant.  Wish I had thought of it :)  Maybe you can market it to all those “other boats” who have twin track foils! :-)

I don’t think we have seen ANYTHING in the basic design of our boat that we would change.  Almost all of the minor tweaks in execution we have made, or contemplate, are things that Amel had already changed by the time they got to building the 54.

Bill Kinney
SM #160, Harmonie
On the Hard, Fort Lauderdale, FL
“Ships and men rot in port."


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Santorin with D2-55 Engine - Range

karkauai
 

Of course,Joel.  That reminds me of two other rules I've learned:

The 50-90 rule:  if there are two ways of doing something and you're not sure which is right, you have a 50% chance of getting it right the first time...and a 90% chance of getting it wrong.  It is amazingly accurate for me.

The boat list rule:  if you have 10 things to do, and you do 7 of them, there are only 8 on the list.

Kent
Kristy
SM243