Date   

Re: Isolated ground solenoid

eric freedman
 

Sorry Tom= Mark--
I have been sending all this to Marks attention--
One step at a time however the black solenoid to the left of the valeo is a Yanmar oem starter solenoid is also in this circuit.
This could also be the problem. But, lets check out the voltage to the Valeo first.
Fair Winds,
Good Night.
Eric
Sm376 Kimberlite

On July 5, 2020 at 4:47 AM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

STOP LEAVER

On July 5, 2020 at 4:47 AM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

You might note a very small voltage drop at the positive valeo stud .5 volts as the electric goes through a diode first.
You should get about 12 volts here when the key is turned. If you keep the top leaver depressed you can keep the key in the start position for a bit

On July 5, 2020 at 4:42 AM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

The negative attachment is on the big stud to the left. The Positive for the meter is the stud on the valeo with the orange and blue wire (start and stop) note there is a small black wire sneaking behind the Valeo connected to the battery stud connection--that is the negative connection that actuates the solenoid-- always connected to the battery

On July 5, 2020 at 3:25 AM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

Hi Mark,
The Valeo solenoid works to both start and stop the engine.
It is isolated by a pair of diodes. One is fed by the start key and the other is fed DC from the stop button Without the Motorola diodes the engine would try to start and stop at the same time. The function of the Valeo solenoid is to temporarily connect the engine block to the battery negative for both starting and stopping the engine. the stop solenoid in the fuel injector pump and the starter motor are operated by their respective buttons and are really not Toms problem. His problem is that the Valeo Solenoid is not closing to ground the block.
Fair Winds,
Eric
sm 376

Pardon my typing and speling. I tore tendons off the bone in my right arm when we were knocked down flat by a microburst. last winter They just reattached them last week. It was amazing we were sailing along in clear cloudless air and bam in a second Kimberlite had he sails in the water. I ripped the tendons off trying to cranking the mizzen after releasing the genoa.

On July 5, 2020 at 12:54 AM Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote:

Tom,

 

In addition to the great advice from Eric, be sure to take a look at the stop solenoid. This is often overlooked when dealing with a start issue.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of eric freedman
Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2020 4:33 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Isolated ground solenoid

 

To,

Before you start chasing zebras, try these simple tests.

Does the engine start id you depress the valeo solenoid and someone tries to start the engine?

If you are able to start the engine then try the following.

Measure the voltage at the engine between the power + wire to the valeo solenoid and the battery ground when someone tries to start the engine.. IF you get 12.5 volts + then there is a problem either with the valeo solenoid or the yanmar black solenoid mounted next to the valeo solenoid.

 

If you do not get 12.5+ volts then there is a problem with the red wire from the panel. Look at the yanmar B panel wiring diagram.

 

The red wire is a wire going from the Yanmar engine panel to a 3 wire harness. The wire is Red but it might be spliced into a white wire.

Remove the Yanmar panel and look behind it for a solderless crimp connector joining the 2 wires.

It is about 1 foot from the panel down in the mess of wires. If you have that connection remove it and solder the wires together. That is the wire that both closes the valeo solenoid and starts the engine.

 

That wire runs to the smallest of the 3 harness connectors at the engine Starboard side possibly under the insulation. There is a red, blue, and white wire on the 3 wire connectors. Open it up and spray it with corrosion x. 

 

I would love to know what you find.

The valeo is just an expensive starter motor solenoid for 12 volt vehicles. . What makes it different is the back actuator button.

 

If you have an automobile starter solenoid make it is an isolated ground solenoid. If the negative wire is connected to the metal body of the solenoid it is not isolated ground and defeats the Amel bonding.

It could be an internal connection.  It is a great spare to have.

 

The 24 volt valeo solenoid if for the genoa furler mounted most forward port side forward cabin.

The Valeo 12 V solenoid is 160 euros and the Auto version is about $20- Thats a lot of money for a rubber button

Where are you located?

Fair Winds,

Eric

SM 376

 

Ps do you have a switch mounted in a white plastic perforated box outboard of the engine stringer and forward of a Calpeda AC pump? It is for a high water alarm. If you have this switch please see if you can identify the maker or at least send me a photo with measurements.

somehow the top 1/2 of that switch disappeared on Kimberlite. 

 

 

 

On July 4, 2020 at 5:46 PM Thomas Kleman <lorient422@...> wrote:

So, engine doesn't start intermittently. After corrosion x in the solenoid, cleaning contacts, problem re-emerges. Can start engine by pushing button but need to fix this. Broke out spares purchased across the years and noticed my spare solenoid is 24 volt (need a 12 volt). I have a Cole Hersee 12 volt solenoid (no button) but am not sure if the wiring relating to the "s" and "I" marked small terminals on the solenoid relative to the red and black wires on the existing valeo solenoid. Any thoughts ? Internet research suggests red to "I" but I'm not confident enough to do it. Of course will order correct solenoid when possible.

Tom and Kirstin
SM2K 422
Kauai

 



 

 


 


 


 

 

 

 

 

 


Re: Isolated ground solenoid

eric freedman
 

STOP LEAVER

On July 5, 2020 at 4:47 AM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

You might note a very small voltage drop at the positive valeo stud .5 volts as the electric goes through a diode first.
You should get about 12 volts here when the key is turned. If you keep the top leaver depressed you can keep the key in the start position for a bit

On July 5, 2020 at 4:42 AM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

The negative attachment is on the big stud to the left. The Positive for the meter is the stud on the valeo with the orange and blue wire (start and stop) note there is a small black wire sneaking behind the Valeo connected to the battery stud connection--that is the negative connection that actuates the solenoid-- always connected to the battery

On July 5, 2020 at 3:25 AM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

Hi Mark,
The Valeo solenoid works to both start and stop the engine.
It is isolated by a pair of diodes. One is fed by the start key and the other is fed DC from the stop button Without the Motorola diodes the engine would try to start and stop at the same time. The function of the Valeo solenoid is to temporarily connect the engine block to the battery negative for both starting and stopping the engine. the stop solenoid in the fuel injector pump and the starter motor are operated by their respective buttons and are really not Toms problem. His problem is that the Valeo Solenoid is not closing to ground the block.
Fair Winds,
Eric
sm 376

Pardon my typing and speling. I tore tendons off the bone in my right arm when we were knocked down flat by a microburst. last winter They just reattached them last week. It was amazing we were sailing along in clear cloudless air and bam in a second Kimberlite had he sails in the water. I ripped the tendons off trying to cranking the mizzen after releasing the genoa.

On July 5, 2020 at 12:54 AM Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote:

Tom,

 

In addition to the great advice from Eric, be sure to take a look at the stop solenoid. This is often overlooked when dealing with a start issue.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of eric freedman
Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2020 4:33 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Isolated ground solenoid

 

To,

Before you start chasing zebras, try these simple tests.

Does the engine start id you depress the valeo solenoid and someone tries to start the engine?

If you are able to start the engine then try the following.

Measure the voltage at the engine between the power + wire to the valeo solenoid and the battery ground when someone tries to start the engine.. IF you get 12.5 volts + then there is a problem either with the valeo solenoid or the yanmar black solenoid mounted next to the valeo solenoid.

 

If you do not get 12.5+ volts then there is a problem with the red wire from the panel. Look at the yanmar B panel wiring diagram.

 

The red wire is a wire going from the Yanmar engine panel to a 3 wire harness. The wire is Red but it might be spliced into a white wire.

Remove the Yanmar panel and look behind it for a solderless crimp connector joining the 2 wires.

It is about 1 foot from the panel down in the mess of wires. If you have that connection remove it and solder the wires together. That is the wire that both closes the valeo solenoid and starts the engine.

 

That wire runs to the smallest of the 3 harness connectors at the engine Starboard side possibly under the insulation. There is a red, blue, and white wire on the 3 wire connectors. Open it up and spray it with corrosion x. 

 

I would love to know what you find.

The valeo is just an expensive starter motor solenoid for 12 volt vehicles. . What makes it different is the back actuator button.

 

If you have an automobile starter solenoid make it is an isolated ground solenoid. If the negative wire is connected to the metal body of the solenoid it is not isolated ground and defeats the Amel bonding.

It could be an internal connection.  It is a great spare to have.

 

The 24 volt valeo solenoid if for the genoa furler mounted most forward port side forward cabin.

The Valeo 12 V solenoid is 160 euros and the Auto version is about $20- Thats a lot of money for a rubber button

Where are you located?

Fair Winds,

Eric

SM 376

 

Ps do you have a switch mounted in a white plastic perforated box outboard of the engine stringer and forward of a Calpeda AC pump? It is for a high water alarm. If you have this switch please see if you can identify the maker or at least send me a photo with measurements.

somehow the top 1/2 of that switch disappeared on Kimberlite. 

 

 

 

On July 4, 2020 at 5:46 PM Thomas Kleman <lorient422@...> wrote:

So, engine doesn't start intermittently. After corrosion x in the solenoid, cleaning contacts, problem re-emerges. Can start engine by pushing button but need to fix this. Broke out spares purchased across the years and noticed my spare solenoid is 24 volt (need a 12 volt). I have a Cole Hersee 12 volt solenoid (no button) but am not sure if the wiring relating to the "s" and "I" marked small terminals on the solenoid relative to the red and black wires on the existing valeo solenoid. Any thoughts ? Internet research suggests red to "I" but I'm not confident enough to do it. Of course will order correct solenoid when possible.

Tom and Kirstin
SM2K 422
Kauai

 



 

 


 


 


 

 

 

 


Re: Isolated ground solenoid

eric freedman
 

You might note a very small voltage drop at the positive valeo stud .5 volts as the electric goes through a diode first.
You should get about 12 volts here when the key is turned. If you keep the top leaver depressed you can keep the key in the start position for a bit

On July 5, 2020 at 4:42 AM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

The negative attachment is on the big stud to the left. The Positive for the meter is the stud on the valeo with the orange and blue wire (start and stop) note there is a small black wire sneaking behind the Valeo connected to the battery stud connection--that is the negative connection that actuates the solenoid-- always connected to the battery

On July 5, 2020 at 3:25 AM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

Hi Mark,
The Valeo solenoid works to both start and stop the engine.
It is isolated by a pair of diodes. One is fed by the start key and the other is fed DC from the stop button Without the Motorola diodes the engine would try to start and stop at the same time. The function of the Valeo solenoid is to temporarily connect the engine block to the battery negative for both starting and stopping the engine. the stop solenoid in the fuel injector pump and the starter motor are operated by their respective buttons and are really not Toms problem. His problem is that the Valeo Solenoid is not closing to ground the block.
Fair Winds,
Eric
sm 376

Pardon my typing and speling. I tore tendons off the bone in my right arm when we were knocked down flat by a microburst. last winter They just reattached them last week. It was amazing we were sailing along in clear cloudless air and bam in a second Kimberlite had he sails in the water. I ripped the tendons off trying to cranking the mizzen after releasing the genoa.

On July 5, 2020 at 12:54 AM Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote:

Tom,

 

In addition to the great advice from Eric, be sure to take a look at the stop solenoid. This is often overlooked when dealing with a start issue.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of eric freedman
Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2020 4:33 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Isolated ground solenoid

 

To,

Before you start chasing zebras, try these simple tests.

Does the engine start id you depress the valeo solenoid and someone tries to start the engine?

If you are able to start the engine then try the following.

Measure the voltage at the engine between the power + wire to the valeo solenoid and the battery ground when someone tries to start the engine.. IF you get 12.5 volts + then there is a problem either with the valeo solenoid or the yanmar black solenoid mounted next to the valeo solenoid.

 

If you do not get 12.5+ volts then there is a problem with the red wire from the panel. Look at the yanmar B panel wiring diagram.

 

The red wire is a wire going from the Yanmar engine panel to a 3 wire harness. The wire is Red but it might be spliced into a white wire.

Remove the Yanmar panel and look behind it for a solderless crimp connector joining the 2 wires.

It is about 1 foot from the panel down in the mess of wires. If you have that connection remove it and solder the wires together. That is the wire that both closes the valeo solenoid and starts the engine.

 

That wire runs to the smallest of the 3 harness connectors at the engine Starboard side possibly under the insulation. There is a red, blue, and white wire on the 3 wire connectors. Open it up and spray it with corrosion x. 

 

I would love to know what you find.

The valeo is just an expensive starter motor solenoid for 12 volt vehicles. . What makes it different is the back actuator button.

 

If you have an automobile starter solenoid make it is an isolated ground solenoid. If the negative wire is connected to the metal body of the solenoid it is not isolated ground and defeats the Amel bonding.

It could be an internal connection.  It is a great spare to have.

 

The 24 volt valeo solenoid if for the genoa furler mounted most forward port side forward cabin.

The Valeo 12 V solenoid is 160 euros and the Auto version is about $20- Thats a lot of money for a rubber button

Where are you located?

Fair Winds,

Eric

SM 376

 

Ps do you have a switch mounted in a white plastic perforated box outboard of the engine stringer and forward of a Calpeda AC pump? It is for a high water alarm. If you have this switch please see if you can identify the maker or at least send me a photo with measurements.

somehow the top 1/2 of that switch disappeared on Kimberlite. 

 

 

 

On July 4, 2020 at 5:46 PM Thomas Kleman <lorient422@...> wrote:

So, engine doesn't start intermittently. After corrosion x in the solenoid, cleaning contacts, problem re-emerges. Can start engine by pushing button but need to fix this. Broke out spares purchased across the years and noticed my spare solenoid is 24 volt (need a 12 volt). I have a Cole Hersee 12 volt solenoid (no button) but am not sure if the wiring relating to the "s" and "I" marked small terminals on the solenoid relative to the red and black wires on the existing valeo solenoid. Any thoughts ? Internet research suggests red to "I" but I'm not confident enough to do it. Of course will order correct solenoid when possible.

Tom and Kirstin
SM2K 422
Kauai

 



 

 


 


 


 

 


Isolated ground solenoid

eric freedman
 

The negative attachment is on the big stud to the left. The Positive for the meter is the stud on the valeo with the orange and blue wire (start and stop) note there is a small black wire sneaking behind the Valeo connected to the battery stud connection--that is the negative connection that actuates the solenoid-- always connected to the battery

On July 5, 2020 at 3:25 AM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

Hi Mark,
The Valeo solenoid works to both start and stop the engine.
It is isolated by a pair of diodes. One is fed by the start key and the other is fed DC from the stop button Without the Motorola diodes the engine would try to start and stop at the same time. The function of the Valeo solenoid is to temporarily connect the engine block to the battery negative for both starting and stopping the engine. the stop solenoid in the fuel injector pump and the starter motor are operated by their respective buttons and are really not Toms problem. His problem is that the Valeo Solenoid is not closing to ground the block.
Fair Winds,
Eric
sm 376

Pardon my typing and speling. I tore tendons off the bone in my right arm when we were knocked down flat by a microburst. last winter They just reattached them last week. It was amazing we were sailing along in clear cloudless air and bam in a second Kimberlite had he sails in the water. I ripped the tendons off trying to cranking the mizzen after releasing the genoa.

On July 5, 2020 at 12:54 AM Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote:

Tom,

 

In addition to the great advice from Eric, be sure to take a look at the stop solenoid. This is often overlooked when dealing with a start issue.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of eric freedman
Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2020 4:33 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Isolated ground solenoid

 

To,

Before you start chasing zebras, try these simple tests.

Does the engine start id you depress the valeo solenoid and someone tries to start the engine?

If you are able to start the engine then try the following.

Measure the voltage at the engine between the power + wire to the valeo solenoid and the battery ground when someone tries to start the engine.. IF you get 12.5 volts + then there is a problem either with the valeo solenoid or the yanmar black solenoid mounted next to the valeo solenoid.

 

If you do not get 12.5+ volts then there is a problem with the red wire from the panel. Look at the yanmar B panel wiring diagram.

 

The red wire is a wire going from the Yanmar engine panel to a 3 wire harness. The wire is Red but it might be spliced into a white wire.

Remove the Yanmar panel and look behind it for a solderless crimp connector joining the 2 wires.

It is about 1 foot from the panel down in the mess of wires. If you have that connection remove it and solder the wires together. That is the wire that both closes the valeo solenoid and starts the engine.

 

That wire runs to the smallest of the 3 harness connectors at the engine Starboard side possibly under the insulation. There is a red, blue, and white wire on the 3 wire connectors. Open it up and spray it with corrosion x. 

 

I would love to know what you find.

The valeo is just an expensive starter motor solenoid for 12 volt vehicles. . What makes it different is the back actuator button.

 

If you have an automobile starter solenoid make it is an isolated ground solenoid. If the negative wire is connected to the metal body of the solenoid it is not isolated ground and defeats the Amel bonding.

It could be an internal connection.  It is a great spare to have.

 

The 24 volt valeo solenoid if for the genoa furler mounted most forward port side forward cabin.

The Valeo 12 V solenoid is 160 euros and the Auto version is about $20- Thats a lot of money for a rubber button

Where are you located?

Fair Winds,

Eric

SM 376

 

Ps do you have a switch mounted in a white plastic perforated box outboard of the engine stringer and forward of a Calpeda AC pump? It is for a high water alarm. If you have this switch please see if you can identify the maker or at least send me a photo with measurements.

somehow the top 1/2 of that switch disappeared on Kimberlite. 

 

 

 

On July 4, 2020 at 5:46 PM Thomas Kleman <lorient422@...> wrote:

So, engine doesn't start intermittently. After corrosion x in the solenoid, cleaning contacts, problem re-emerges. Can start engine by pushing button but need to fix this. Broke out spares purchased across the years and noticed my spare solenoid is 24 volt (need a 12 volt). I have a Cole Hersee 12 volt solenoid (no button) but am not sure if the wiring relating to the "s" and "I" marked small terminals on the solenoid relative to the red and black wires on the existing valeo solenoid. Any thoughts ? Internet research suggests red to "I" but I'm not confident enough to do it. Of course will order correct solenoid when possible.

Tom and Kirstin
SM2K 422
Kauai

 



 

 


 


 


Re: Isolated ground solenoid

eric freedman
 

Hi Mark,
The Valeo solenoid works to both start and stop the engine.
It is isolated by a pair of diodes. One is fed by the start key and the other is fed DC from the stop button Without the Motorola diodes the engine would try to start and stop at the same time. The function of the Valeo solenoid is to temporarily connect the engine block to the battery negative for both starting and stopping the engine. the stop solenoid in the fuel injector pump and the starter motor are operated by their respective buttons and are really not Toms problem. His problem is that the Valeo Solenoid is not closing to ground the block.
Fair Winds,
Eric
sm 376

Pardon my typing and speling. I tore tendons off the bone in my right arm when we were knocked down flat by a microburst. last winter They just reattached them last week. It was amazing we were sailing along in clear cloudless air and bam in a second Kimberlite had he sails in the water. I ripped the tendons off trying to cranking the mizzen after releasing the genoa.

On July 5, 2020 at 12:54 AM Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote:

Tom,

 

In addition to the great advice from Eric, be sure to take a look at the stop solenoid. This is often overlooked when dealing with a start issue.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of eric freedman
Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2020 4:33 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Isolated ground solenoid

 

To,

Before you start chasing zebras, try these simple tests.

Does the engine start id you depress the valeo solenoid and someone tries to start the engine?

If you are able to start the engine then try the following.

Measure the voltage at the engine between the power + wire to the valeo solenoid and the battery ground when someone tries to start the engine.. IF you get 12.5 volts + then there is a problem either with the valeo solenoid or the yanmar black solenoid mounted next to the valeo solenoid.

 

If you do not get 12.5+ volts then there is a problem with the red wire from the panel. Look at the yanmar B panel wiring diagram.

 

The red wire is a wire going from the Yanmar engine panel to a 3 wire harness. The wire is Red but it might be spliced into a white wire.

Remove the Yanmar panel and look behind it for a solderless crimp connector joining the 2 wires.

It is about 1 foot from the panel down in the mess of wires. If you have that connection remove it and solder the wires together. That is the wire that both closes the valeo solenoid and starts the engine.

 

That wire runs to the smallest of the 3 harness connectors at the engine Starboard side possibly under the insulation. There is a red, blue, and white wire on the 3 wire connectors. Open it up and spray it with corrosion x. 

 

I would love to know what you find.

The valeo is just an expensive starter motor solenoid for 12 volt vehicles. . What makes it different is the back actuator button.

 

If you have an automobile starter solenoid make it is an isolated ground solenoid. If the negative wire is connected to the metal body of the solenoid it is not isolated ground and defeats the Amel bonding.

It could be an internal connection.  It is a great spare to have.

 

The 24 volt valeo solenoid if for the genoa furler mounted most forward port side forward cabin.

The Valeo 12 V solenoid is 160 euros and the Auto version is about $20- Thats a lot of money for a rubber button

Where are you located?

Fair Winds,

Eric

SM 376

 

Ps do you have a switch mounted in a white plastic perforated box outboard of the engine stringer and forward of a Calpeda AC pump? It is for a high water alarm. If you have this switch please see if you can identify the maker or at least send me a photo with measurements.

somehow the top 1/2 of that switch disappeared on Kimberlite. 

 

 

 

On July 4, 2020 at 5:46 PM Thomas Kleman <lorient422@...> wrote:

So, engine doesn't start intermittently. After corrosion x in the solenoid, cleaning contacts, problem re-emerges. Can start engine by pushing button but need to fix this. Broke out spares purchased across the years and noticed my spare solenoid is 24 volt (need a 12 volt). I have a Cole Hersee 12 volt solenoid (no button) but am not sure if the wiring relating to the "s" and "I" marked small terminals on the solenoid relative to the red and black wires on the existing valeo solenoid. Any thoughts ? Internet research suggests red to "I" but I'm not confident enough to do it. Of course will order correct solenoid when possible.

Tom and Kirstin
SM2K 422
Kauai


 

 


Re: File /CockpitEnclosure.pdf uploaded #file-notice

Gerhard Mueller
 

Ralf
You are welcome. I am at place A14 in the Marina Kalamata.
--
Gerhard Mueller
Amel Sharki #60
Currently Kalamata, Greece


Re: Isolated ground solenoid

Mark Erdos
 

Tom,

 

In addition to the great advice from Eric, be sure to take a look at the stop solenoid. This is often overlooked when dealing with a start issue.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of eric freedman
Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2020 4:33 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Isolated ground solenoid

 

To,

Before you start chasing zebras, try these simple tests.

Does the engine start id you depress the valeo solenoid and someone tries to start the engine?

If you are able to start the engine then try the following.

Measure the voltage at the engine between the power + wire to the valeo solenoid and the battery ground when someone tries to start the engine.. IF you get 12.5 volts + then there is a problem either with the valeo solenoid or the yanmar black solenoid mounted next to the valeo solenoid.

 

If you do not get 12.5+ volts then there is a problem with the red wire from the panel. Look at the yanmar B panel wiring diagram.

 

The red wire is a wire going from the Yanmar engine panel to a 3 wire harness. The wire is Red but it might be spliced into a white wire.

Remove the Yanmar panel and look behind it for a solderless crimp connector joining the 2 wires.

It is about 1 foot from the panel down in the mess of wires. If you have that connection remove it and solder the wires together. That is the wire that both closes the valeo solenoid and starts the engine.

 

That wire runs to the smallest of the 3 harness connectors at the engine Starboard side possibly under the insulation. There is a red, blue, and white wire on the 3 wire connectors. Open it up and spray it with corrosion x. 

 

I would love to know what you find.

The valeo is just an expensive starter motor solenoid for 12 volt vehicles. . What makes it different is the back actuator button.

 

If you have an automobile starter solenoid make it is an isolated ground solenoid. If the negative wire is connected to the metal body of the solenoid it is not isolated ground and defeats the Amel bonding.

It could be an internal connection.  It is a great spare to have.

 

The 24 volt valeo solenoid if for the genoa furler mounted most forward port side forward cabin.

The Valeo 12 V solenoid is 160 euros and the Auto version is about $20- Thats a lot of money for a rubber button

Where are you located?

Fair Winds,

Eric

SM 376

 

Ps do you have a switch mounted in a white plastic perforated box outboard of the engine stringer and forward of a Calpeda AC pump? It is for a high water alarm. If you have this switch please see if you can identify the maker or at least send me a photo with measurements.

somehow the top 1/2 of that switch disappeared on Kimberlite. 

 

 

 

On July 4, 2020 at 5:46 PM Thomas Kleman <lorient422@...> wrote:

So, engine doesn't start intermittently. After corrosion x in the solenoid, cleaning contacts, problem re-emerges. Can start engine by pushing button but need to fix this. Broke out spares purchased across the years and noticed my spare solenoid is 24 volt (need a 12 volt). I have a Cole Hersee 12 volt solenoid (no button) but am not sure if the wiring relating to the "s" and "I" marked small terminals on the solenoid relative to the red and black wires on the existing valeo solenoid. Any thoughts ? Internet research suggests red to "I" but I'm not confident enough to do it. Of course will order correct solenoid when possible.

Tom and Kirstin
SM2K 422
Kauai


Re: Isolated ground solenoid

eric freedman
 

To,

Before you start chasing zebras, try these simple tests.

Does the engine start id you depress the valeo solenoid and someone tries to start the engine?

If you are able to start the engine then try the following.

Measure the voltage at the engine between the power + wire to the valeo solenoid and the battery ground when someone tries to start the engine.. IF you get 12.5 volts + then there is a problem either with the valeo solenoid or the yanmar black solenoid mounted next to the valeo solenoid.


If you do not get 12.5+ volts then there is a problem with the red wire from the panel. Look at the yanmar B panel wiring diagram.


The red wire is a wire going from the Yanmar engine panel to a 3 wire harness. The wire is Red but it might be spliced into a white wire.

Remove the Yanmar panel and look behind it for a solderless crimp connector joining the 2 wires.

It is about 1 foot from the panel down in the mess of wires. If you have that connection remove it and solder the wires together. That is the wire that both closes the valeo solenoid and starts the engine.


That wire runs to the smallest of the 3 harness connectors at the engine Starboard side possibly under the insulation. There is a red, blue, and white wire on the 3 wire connectors. Open it up and spray it with corrosion x. 


I would love to know what you find.

The valeo is just an expensive starter motor solenoid for 12 volt vehicles. . What makes it different is the back actuator button.


If you have an automobile starter solenoid make it is an isolated ground solenoid. If the negative wire is connected to the metal body of the solenoid it is not isolated ground and defeats the Amel bonding.

It could be an internal connection.  It is a great spare to have.


The 24 volt valeo solenoid if for the genoa furler mounted most forward port side forward cabin.

The Valeo 12 V solenoid is 160 euros and the Auto version is about $20- Thats a lot of money for a rubber button

Where are you located?

Fair Winds,

Eric

SM 376


Ps do you have a switch mounted in a white plastic perforated box outboard of the engine stringer and forward of a Calpeda AC pump? It is for a high water alarm. If you have this switch please see if you can identify the maker or at least send me a photo with measurements.

somehow the top 1/2 of that switch disappeared on Kimberlite. 




On July 4, 2020 at 5:46 PM Thomas Kleman <lorient422@...> wrote:

So, engine doesn't start intermittently. After corrosion x in the solenoid, cleaning contacts, problem re-emerges. Can start engine by pushing button but need to fix this. Broke out spares purchased across the years and noticed my spare solenoid is 24 volt (need a 12 volt). I have a Cole Hersee 12 volt solenoid (no button) but am not sure if the wiring relating to the "s" and "I" marked small terminals on the solenoid relative to the red and black wires on the existing valeo solenoid. Any thoughts ? Internet research suggests red to "I" but I'm not confident enough to do it. Of course will order correct solenoid when possible.

Tom and Kirstin
SM2K 422
Kauai


Re: Isolated ground solenoid

Thomas Kleman
 

Oops. Should have mentioned that. 4JH3-HTE.
100 HP yanmar 


Re: New Thread on A54 fridge pumps (ATTN: OLIVER Vela Nautica)

Dean Gillies
 

Jamie,
Great news, it seems to be operating as designed.

The 24V indicator led is lit up by the 24V power supply from the compressors. This shows that the system is operating from a 24V supply. It can also operate from 12V, in which case the 12V LED will be illuminated.

The drop from 24V to 12V of the pump supply under load is the expected operation. There are various circuit incarnations which could be inside the E51385, but it is not unusual to see this behaviour in a 24-12V conversion circuit.

I'm planning to write up a detailed description of the intended operation of the system as originally delivered and post it in the files.

Good luck with the brushless motor experiment.

Best regards
Dean
SY Stella

Sent from my iPhone X


Re: Isolated ground solenoid

Mark Erdos
 

Tom,

 

What engine is this on? I am unfamiliar with a button on the solenoid.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Thomas Kleman
Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2020 11:47 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Isolated ground solenoid

 

So, engine doesn't start intermittently. After corrosion x in the solenoid, cleaning contacts, problem re-emerges. Can start engine by pushing button but need to fix this. Broke out spares purchased across the years and noticed my spare solenoid is 24 volt (need a 12 volt). I have a Cole Hersee 12 volt solenoid (no button) but am not sure if the wiring relating to the "s" and "I" marked small terminals on the solenoid relative to the red and black wires on the existing valeo solenoid. Any thoughts ? Internet research suggests red to "I" but I'm not confident enough to do it. Of course will order correct solenoid when possible.

Tom and Kirstin
SM2K 422
Kauai


Isolated ground solenoid

Thomas Kleman
 

So, engine doesn't start intermittently. After corrosion x in the solenoid, cleaning contacts, problem re-emerges. Can start engine by pushing button but need to fix this. Broke out spares purchased across the years and noticed my spare solenoid is 24 volt (need a 12 volt). I have a Cole Hersee 12 volt solenoid (no button) but am not sure if the wiring relating to the "s" and "I" marked small terminals on the solenoid relative to the red and black wires on the existing valeo solenoid. Any thoughts ? Internet research suggests red to "I" but I'm not confident enough to do it. Of course will order correct solenoid when possible.

Tom and Kirstin
SM2K 422
Kauai


Re: File /CockpitEnclosure.pdf uploaded #file-notice

Ralf Schroeder
 

Hi Gerhard,

many thanks for the information with the primer on the defekt areas. My first idea was a complete removal from the old painting to the glass fiber. But so, I think, it´s a good alternative.
With the sailmaker job - this is the different from a german to a greece sailmaker :-).

When it is possible, I'm in september in the kalamata for a charter week. So, when you are there, too, it´s possible, that I meet you?

Best wishes
Ralf
SV Baghira, Sharki 42


NMEA 2000 Updating software

Adam Body
 

I have just installed a new chartplotter with prexisting NMEA 2000/ Seatalkng components and spent significant time sorting out a problem with as it turned out a simple solution.  The solution to components not communicating correctly was to disconnect all but the one requiring the update, update that one, then continue in the same way with the other components. Hope this helps others in the group. 
--
Adam Body "Flora"   SM128 Annee 1994


Re: Slap Silencer

Jamie Wendell
 

I like the swimming noodle concept. Thanks for the feedback. What I have is not what I thought it was.
Jamie


Re: Slap Silencer

Barry Connor
 

Hi Scott,

Below attached is the Costco "Wet and Forget mold/algea cleaner"
I actually bought the 5lt concentrate.
Much safer to use than any bleach.

Very Best

Barry

On Saturday, July 4, 2020, 3:48:46 PM EDT, Barry Connor via groups.io <connor_barry@...> wrote:


Hi Scott,
Just checked and my environment friendly mold/algae remover has run out. Purchased at Costco UK 5lt concentrate lasts a long time and can use it on any type of mold/algae, really cleans sails and not harmful to the boat. I will have to search for the brand. Hope Costco US has this. Still hope to make it north towards the end of this year.

Very Best 

Barry and Penny
“SV Lady Penelope II”
Amel 54. #17
Sainte Anne anchorage Martinique 


On Jul 4, 2020, at 15:14, Scott SV Tengah <Scott.nguyen@...> wrote:

I have this for our A54. I don't get bothered by the noise, but the admiral is more sensitive to sounds. 

Works reasonably well, but you're right, it gets nasty. Do you just clean it with a brush and bleach?
--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Upcoming Event: ZOOM Meeting, Presentation from the owner of QSails on sailcloth and sail construction - Sat, 07/11/2020 20:00-21:00, Please RSVP #cal-reminder

main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io Calendar <main@...>
 

Reminder: ZOOM Meeting, Presentation from the owner of QSails on sailcloth and sail construction

When: Saturday, 11 July 2020, 20:00 to 21:00, (GMT+00:00) UTC

An RSVP is requested. Click here to RSVP

Description: Over 60 Amel owners have purchased sails from QSails, Izmir, Turkey. QSails has shipped these sails worldwide. Emrah Oge, owner, manager, and avid sailor will present how sails are made and some key points to be aware of in the selection of sails for your Amel.

Join Zoom Meeting
https://epfl.zoom.us/j/93628807246

Meeting ID: 936 2880 7246

Join by SIP
93628807246@...

Please RSVP as soon as possible

See you on ZOOM!

Bill Rouse


Re: Slap Silencer

Barry Connor
 

Hi Scott,
Just checked and my environment friendly mold/algae remover has run out. Purchased at Costco UK 5lt concentrate lasts a long time and can use it on any type of mold/algae, really cleans sails and not harmful to the boat. I will have to search for the brand. Hope Costco US has this. Still hope to make it north towards the end of this year.

Very Best 

Barry and Penny
“SV Lady Penelope II”
Amel 54. #17
Sainte Anne anchorage Martinique 


On Jul 4, 2020, at 15:14, Scott SV Tengah <Scott.nguyen@...> wrote:

I have this for our A54. I don't get bothered by the noise, but the admiral is more sensitive to sounds. 

Works reasonably well, but you're right, it gets nasty. Do you just clean it with a brush and bleach?
--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Re: Slap Silencer

Scott SV Tengah
 

I have this for our A54. I don't get bothered by the noise, but the admiral is more sensitive to sounds. 

Works reasonably well, but you're right, it gets nasty. Do you just clean it with a brush and bleach?
--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Re: sm 53 vs 54

Scott SV Tengah
 

If money were no object, I'd get an A60. Just kidding - after spending so much time and money making our A54 into exactly what we want and need, I wouldn't change her for anything. I enjoy the lifestyle associated with long term cruising and don't want to spend all that time "perfecting" a new boat.

To the original poster - I think that's the bucket of salt you need to take with everyone's responses. Most have never owned both and have prejudices based on their own love of their own vessel and their predictions of what they wouldn't like about other vessels (without actual live aboard experience). For example, after my last unexpected 31 day /4800 nm passage (because of covid, stopping for fuel was not an option), any thought I had about getting the Amel 50 is quashed because of the 50's small fuel and water tanks. But then again, I've never lived on a 50 and frankly, I think planning for a future coronavirus is a bit overkill. But that's my prejudice now.

--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com