Date   

Re: A54 bow thruster emergency switch

Jamie Wendell
 

Oh, I see what you are talking about. That disconnects a lot more than the bow thruster.
It also shuts off the anchor controls. I had to replace mine with a rotary switch, as the original pushbutton rusted solid.
Thanks
Jamie
Phantom, A54 #44


Re: Secondary Saltwater Manifold SMs & 54s, and possibly some Santorins, Mangos, and Maramus

Chris Doucette
 

Hi Bill,

I am certainly interested and have a late model SM 2K.   I was honestly working on doing the same project INCLUSIVE of the manifold that comes out of the sea strainer. 

I am working on a concept for using parts manufactured from a glass reinforced nylon composite - as it is High strength and light-weight. 

Goals:
1) maintain or increase volume and flow dynamics 
2) shut-off valves for specific components
3) non corrosive
4) strong & resistant to crushing, breaking and temperature
5) serviceable with more off-the shelf types of components
6) replaceable barb adapters so as hoses change they can be adjusted.
6) easily assembled (within reason)

This company has most of the components, inclusive of the ball valves needed to accomplish this.   

These guys make Stainless BSP to NPT adapters that could be useful also to take on the sea strainer part.

The crux for me is getting all the measuring of the required hose barbs etc. for the first and second manifold correct- I would be replacing ALL the hoses off of the first manifold (feeds to the  Yanmar, Genset, and second manifold) and fewer of the second manifold.  For example, fiberglass reinforced elbow on the sea strainer- could be 1.5 - 2.0 inch - I can't tell without tearing into it.


Chris
Amarok SM 385
 


Re: A54 bow thruster emergency switch

Wolfgang Weber <webercardio@...>
 

This red knob  is the emergency switch for the bow thruster on Amel 54#162.
Inside the box are relay and fuse.
Wolfgang


Re: Secondary Saltwater Manifold SMs & 54s, and possibly some Santorins, Mangos, and Maramus

Ross Hickey & Donna Hammond
 

Hi Bill,

We are interested.

Ross and Donna
SV Intrepid Kiwi
SM2K #356
Currently in Finike, TURKEY


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad

On Monday, December 14, 2020, 9:42 pm, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:

Yes,

For the 54 we are finalizing a design that will look like the following. I expect that it will mount slightly higher than the original where there is 10mm clearance between the Cockpit drain and the bulkhead insulation. The cockpit drain will be in front of the Blue Coupling. It will ship with a new 35mm hose that connects to the Primary Saltwater Manifold. Other issues are still being worked out and a test install will be done on a 54. It will likely be Jan or Feb of next year before the 54 is available to purchase. The SM should be available sooner. 

I need to find a SM owner willing to test the install before it is available for ordering. Someone in Europe would be best.

Below is the 54 design as it is currently:
image.png
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Mon, Dec 14, 2020 at 12:25 PM Stefan Schaufert <mail@...> wrote:
Dear Bill,

thanks a lot for this project.

I am interested.

But mine looks a bit different (1 connector right of the cockpit drain, 3 (4) left, no connector behind the cockpit drain).
That is why I like to see it in advance.

Best regards and a Merry Christmas to all
Stefan
A 54 #119 Lady Charlyette, currently Bahamas


 


Re: A54 bow thruster emergency switch

Jamie Wendell
 

Wolfgang, maybe this switch you are referencing is only on late model A54s. I do not have one to my knowledge.
Where is it located on your boat?
Thanks,
Jamie
Phantom, A54 #44


Re: Watermaker: Dessalator D60 Freedom Pump Problem

Doug Smith
 

I was able to source the high pressure pump seal kit, for the duo 100, which is a CAT 277 pump.  The distributor for CAT in NJ, USA is EDI distributors.  Skip is the one I worked with, he was able to give me the seal kit for 170 USD, with a new customer discount of 30%. Total cost of $119.00.  I didn’t have to ask for it, but just emailed him for a quote and he provided those prices.  Dessallator has it on their website for more than twice that amount, plus whatever it would cost to ship.

info@...  It isn’t listed on their website as a part, or in their catalogue, but when I emailed him, it was in stock. Then it was shipped the same day, shipping included, as when I communicated with him and I received it the next day.  Incredible customer service.

Regarding the DC motor, it was much easier to work on, simply by pulling the water maker assembly out of the engine room.  Removing the brushes and cleaning out the holes with a shop vac, as Bill R has recommended in his book, did the trick for mine. I put them back in and it started working again, reliable thus far.  And as Bill K indicates below, if there isn’t water flow through the HP pump, then it won’t pull water from anywhere.  It requires the water to have a head pressure on it, to make high pressure flow.

 

Doug Smith

S/V Aventura, Amel 54-113

Patuxent River, MD USA

 

From: <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> on behalf of "Karen Smith via groups.io" <karenharmonie@...>
Reply-To: <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Date: Tuesday, December 15, 2020 at 9:07 AM
To: <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Watermaker: Dessalator D60 Freedom Pump Problem

 

A 24V motor suitable for the D60 watermaker is available from industrial sources in the USA for ~US$300.  Parts for the CAT high pressure pump are also available from CAT.  Dessalator's spare parts prices make Volvo's look a bargain, and that takes some doing!!!!

Woody,

I assume that your D60 does not have an additional low pressure feed pump, which most of the larger later model Dessalitors do.  Be sure that the pressure valve on the watermaker control panel is fully open.  If that is closed, priming can be difficult or impossible.  I also assume that the pump was not run dry at any time except during your priming attempts.

If the pump is turning, the fault is most likely in the water feed, because it is unlikely (but possible!) that the pump could fail totally over the maintenance period.  The water feed is probably restricted.  If you haven't done so, try changing the feed water filter, see if that helps.

The pump inlet is below the waterline, so if you disconnect the inlet from the pump copious amounts of water should flow out when the seacock is open. If not, track down the debris clogging the hoses or other issue with water feed.

If the inlet water is free flowing, and the pump is running, and nothing seems to be coming out, try disconnecting the outlet hose from the pump.  If the outlet doesn't push lots of water under high pressure, it is possible the pump needs a rebuild. If the pump is not leaking water, the internal check valves could be bad, but it seems odd that all of the cylinders would go bad at once.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Fort Lauderdale, FL, 32043


Re: Watermaker: Dessalator D60 Freedom Pump Problem

Karen Smith
 

A 24V motor suitable for the D60 watermaker is available from industrial sources in the USA for ~US$300.  Parts for the CAT high pressure pump are also available from CAT.  Dessalator's spare parts prices make Volvo's look a bargain, and that takes some doing!!!!

Woody,

I assume that your D60 does not have an additional low pressure feed pump, which most of the larger later model Dessalitors do.  Be sure that the pressure valve on the watermaker control panel is fully open.  If that is closed, priming can be difficult or impossible.  I also assume that the pump was not run dry at any time except during your priming attempts.

If the pump is turning, the fault is most likely in the water feed, because it is unlikely (but possible!) that the pump could fail totally over the maintenance period.  The water feed is probably restricted.  If you haven't done so, try changing the feed water filter, see if that helps.

The pump inlet is below the waterline, so if you disconnect the inlet from the pump copious amounts of water should flow out when the seacock is open. If not, track down the debris clogging the hoses or other issue with water feed.

If the inlet water is free flowing, and the pump is running, and nothing seems to be coming out, try disconnecting the outlet hose from the pump.  If the outlet doesn't push lots of water under high pressure, it is possible the pump needs a rebuild. If the pump is not leaking water, the internal check valves could be bad, but it seems odd that all of the cylinders would go bad at once.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Fort Lauderdale, FL, 32043


Re: Watermaker: Dessalator D60 Freedom Pump Problem

karkauai
 

I had a similar experience with my D60 when I replaced the membranes a couple of years ago.  I used the fresh water pump to flush water thru the high pressure pump for a minute or two, then turned the watermaker pump on at zero pressure with the fresh water pump still running... it took another minute or so and finally the pump started pumping. I switched to sea water, cranked up the pressure and it worked fine. I guess it gets an air lock or something that takes a good bit of water to displace. No problem since.
Kent
SM 243
Kristy

--
Kent & Iris
KRISTY
SM243


Re: Onan Generator removal

Craig Briggs
 

Hi Chris,
We've done this three times on our SN which has a 6kw Northern Lights genset. Very easy to do with the ship's halyards and then you can swing it over the dock with the main boom - no boatyard needed.
Cheers, Craig - SN68 Sangaris, Tropic Isle Harbor, FL


Re: A54 bow thruster emergency switch

Wolfgang Weber <webercardio@...>
 

Hello to the group,
One word about the BT emergency switch. 
Amel recommended to push (without load)the emergency switch regularly several times to prevent malfunction. There might be a risk of corrosion. 
Wolfgang Weber SY Elise Amel 54 #162






Re: A54 bow thruster seal replacement?

Scott SV Tengah
 

Dean,

When I was troubleshooting my 1 year old replacement BT motor, those were the words out of the mouth of the lead tech at Sleipner USA (IMTRA). They had some trouble with lifepo4 equipped boats because they designed it to operate at much lower voltage than the lifepo4 batteries provided under load. Perhaps they were trying to get out of warranty work, but that's what they stated. Turns out my trouble was something else, btw.

Regarding the shutoff switch, apparently newer A54s came with an emergency shutoff switch in the bow locker. Olivier suggested in his survey that I install one. I did a bit of asking around and my understanding is there was an A54 that had the solenoids melt closed (probably due to high amperage as a result of low voltage) and thereafter it was recommended that you have the emergency shutoff switch and run the genset and chargers when you're using the BT. It was third hand, but I also definitely have read, more than once, the recommendation to run the genset/chargers in docking operations.

I had the Sleipner shutoff switch but it's not that waterproof and quickly failed in that sometimes wet bow locker. I now have three 450A fuses, one for each pair of batteries, installed.  I also have a third battery switch at the passage berth dedicated to turning off the BT power in an emergency.

On Mon, Dec 14, 2020 at 5:22 PM Dean Gillies <stella@...> wrote:
Hi Scott,

On Tue, Dec 15, 2020 at 11:53 AM, Scott SV Tengah wrote:
That said, lower than 22v is very plausible with normal batteries.
In an Amel, yes, but not always.
A fully charged 115Ah AGM (such as Rolls S12-128AGM) will deliver 67A for two minutes while retaining terminal voltage above 12V.  Put 12 of these in a 2S6P arrangement and you get 400A at 24V. That's almost 10kW delivered to the cable with terminal voltage above 24V. In an Amel the voltage drop at 400A would be around 2V, hence 22V delivered to the BT. However, in a boat where the batteries are located close to the BT, then the voltage drop in the cable can be much less, so the delivered voltage to the BT will be much closer to 24V. 

I find it difficult to believe Sleipner would produce a "24V" BT which does not operate reliably if powered with 24V which is exactly what LIthium batteries would provide in an Amel cabling setup.

Btw I didn't quite understand ... why (and where) did Amel ask you to install a shut off switch? I understand there is no breaker/fusing on the BT cables, which is interesting in itself.

Cheers, Dean
SV Stella A54-154


--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Re: Bow Thruster Issue SM 292

Matt Salatino
 

That’s exactly what Amel suggested we do when running the bow thruster.

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Dec 14, 2020, at 10:57 PM, Karen Smith via groups.io <karenharmonie@...> wrote:

Heinz,

If I understand your problem, when you run the bow thruster, your instruments shut down, and the bow thruster stops after a few seconds.

It sounds like the high power draw of the bow thruster (>480 Amps) is pulling down the voltage of the batteries to the point where the instruments shut down.  My first guess is that that problem is the batteries are weak.  

It will not completely fix the problem, but a help would be to run the generator with all battery chargers whenever you are running the bow thruster.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Fort Lauderdale, FL, USA


Re: Bow Thruster Issue SM 292

Karen Smith
 

Heinz,

If I understand your problem, when you run the bow thruster, your instruments shut down, and the bow thruster stops after a few seconds.

It sounds like the high power draw of the bow thruster (>480 Amps) is pulling down the voltage of the batteries to the point where the instruments shut down.  My first guess is that that problem is the batteries are weak.  

It will not completely fix the problem, but a help would be to run the generator with all battery chargers whenever you are running the bow thruster.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Fort Lauderdale, FL, USA


Re: A54 bow thruster seal replacement?

Dean Gillies
 

Hi Scott,

On Tue, Dec 15, 2020 at 11:53 AM, Scott SV Tengah wrote:
That said, lower than 22v is very plausible with normal batteries.
In an Amel, yes, but not always.
A fully charged 115Ah AGM (such as Rolls S12-128AGM) will deliver 67A for two minutes while retaining terminal voltage above 12V.  Put 12 of these in a 2S6P arrangement and you get 400A at 24V. That's almost 10kW delivered to the cable with terminal voltage above 24V. In an Amel the voltage drop at 400A would be around 2V, hence 22V delivered to the BT. However, in a boat where the batteries are located close to the BT, then the voltage drop in the cable can be much less, so the delivered voltage to the BT will be much closer to 24V. 

I find it difficult to believe Sleipner would produce a "24V" BT which does not operate reliably if powered with 24V which is exactly what LIthium batteries would provide in an Amel cabling setup.

Btw I didn't quite understand ... why (and where) did Amel ask you to install a shut off switch? I understand there is no breaker/fusing on the BT cables, which is interesting in itself.

Cheers, Dean
SV Stella A54-154


Re: Onan Generator removal

Karen Smith
 

Chris,

Not exactly what you were asking for, but hopefully some help nonetheless.  Just a couple months ago we removed our MDKD 6.5 KVA generator from our engine room past our Volvo.

Before the lift, I stripped off all the bolted on bits I could.  Fuel filter, exhaust manifold, etc. and unbolted it from the pan so we weren’t lifting that as well.  It would have fit without all this, but is still seemed a good idea.

We tied a line from the crane hook, down into the engine room so the hook was up and out of the way. A piece of plywood leaned up against the engine served as a skid so it didn’t bounce against the Volvo. Some kind of solid guide on the port side of the cockpit opening would be a good idea to keep the lift line from abrading the engine room insulating foam.  

Thera was a LOT of extra room, not a squeak fit at all.


Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Fort Lauderdale, FL, USA


Re: A54 bow thruster seal replacement?

Scott SV Tengah
 

Dean, 


I agree that at higher voltages, current should just go down. 

That said, lower than 22v is very plausible with normal batteries. Put that big of a load on even a big lead acid bank and I would expect a big voltage drop. 

Amel suggested I add the emergency shut off switch. I believe it's for that reason. 


On Mon, Dec 14, 2020, 14:32 Dean Gillies <stella@...> wrote:
On Tue, Dec 15, 2020 at 04:07 AM, Scott SV Tengah wrote:
Sleipner said that they spec theirs to expect 21-22 volts or thereabouts under load and we are closer to 24.5-25
Scott, that's an interesting point.  
The cabling to the BT is 70sqmm (according to Amel drawings), and the run must be about 10m or so?  The voltage drop in the cable at say 360A (8kW@24V) will be about 1.5V, plus a bit for connections and internal resistance of the battery. So the voltage will definitely be higher than 22V, but should be less than 24V.  However, I don't believe the BT will be damaged in any way by a 24V drive. It should just take less current.   Don't forget that many (most?) BT installations have dedicated LA batteries in close proximity, with minimal voltage drop in cabling. Amel's are a little unusual in having the batteries so far away from the BT.  If the Sleipner product did not work properly at 24V I would be very surprised. I suspect their comment reflects their view that it will "still work" down at those voltages rather than not working at 24V.

Lithium is still on my mind!
Cheers
Dean
SV Stella A54-154
 


--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Re: A54 bow thruster seal replacement?

Dean Gillies
 

On Tue, Dec 15, 2020 at 04:07 AM, Scott SV Tengah wrote:
Sleipner said that they spec theirs to expect 21-22 volts or thereabouts under load and we are closer to 24.5-25
Scott, that's an interesting point.  
The cabling to the BT is 70sqmm (according to Amel drawings), and the run must be about 10m or so?  The voltage drop in the cable at say 360A (8kW@24V) will be about 1.5V, plus a bit for connections and internal resistance of the battery. So the voltage will definitely be higher than 22V, but should be less than 24V.  However, I don't believe the BT will be damaged in any way by a 24V drive. It should just take less current.   Don't forget that many (most?) BT installations have dedicated LA batteries in close proximity, with minimal voltage drop in cabling. Amel's are a little unusual in having the batteries so far away from the BT.  If the Sleipner product did not work properly at 24V I would be very surprised. I suspect their comment reflects their view that it will "still work" down at those voltages rather than not working at 24V.

Lithium is still on my mind!
Cheers
Dean
SV Stella A54-154
 


Re: Onan Generator removal

Mark Erdos
 

Here you go: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfUXTi_UXn0&ab_channel=SailingSVDelos

 

 

With best regards,

 

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Chris Doucette
Sent: Monday, December 14, 2020 9:01 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Generator Removal

 

Does anyone know if you can remove an Onan Type 7MDKAV-2317 MDKAV 7 kW 50 Hz Diesel out of a later model SM without removal of the Yanmar engine?  If you have done this would love to here your experiences. 

Thanks!
Chris

Amarok SM385


Re: Super Maramu Spinnaker Halyard Bracket Shackle Size

Mark McGovern
 

Chris,

I guess you are the SM owner that I met at Bert Jabin's that had his masts down.

If you ever need any pics of your masts I have a ton of them.  Just ask me. ;)

--
Mark McGovern
SM #440 Cara
Deale, MD USA


Re: Super Maramu Spinnaker Halyard Bracket Shackle Size

Chris Doucette
 

Hmm this picture looks surprisingly familiar--- no wait! that is my mast!  lol  

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