Date   

How I plan to get to St Maarten.

eric freedman
 

Hi Tom,

 

I am working with the government of St Maarten to take Kimberlite out of the island.

I will fly into St Thomas and enter St Maarten either via private plane of chartered motor boat.

I would then sail over to St Thomas to fuel up , provision , and sail back to NY.

 

I might have to single hand to NY.

It looks like the government might have a plan for a number of people to arrive via private conveyance

and sail away. 

 

Is there anyone else in the group trying to get to St Maarten?

If so we could share the cost of the trip from St Thomas to St Maarten.

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Thomas Peacock
Sent: Monday, April 20, 2020 8:35 PM
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Excessive usage of water maker membranes

 

She is at Club Nautico in San Juan. I will be flying down as soon as I can be sure that I won’t have to spend 2 weeks in quarantine at the airport hotel. Even though there’s more square feet in most hotel rooms than on a Super Maramu, I think I would go certifiably nuts in a hotel.



On Apr 20, 2020, at 8:04 PM, eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

 

Hi Tom,

Do you have any Idea when you will attempt to get back to your boat? Where  is she?

I might be flying into STT to get to SXM.

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Thomas Peacock
Sent: Monday, April 20, 2020 2:36 PM
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Excessive usage of water maker membranes

 

Hi Eric,

 

No idea. Need to be on more intimate terms with the governor. I heard today from the dockmaster in the marina where Aletes is that a captain of a mega yacht flew in, told the authorities that he was going to quarantine on his boat. They told him no way, and he is now spending 14 days at the airport hotel. Not what he had planned.




On Apr 19, 2020, at 8:50 PM, eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

 

Hi Tom,

Have you heard when they are lifting the quarantine on puerti Rico?

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Thomas Peacock
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020 12:13 PM
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Excessive usage of water maker membranes

 

My only thought is like others, make certain that there is no chlorine. Obviously, there shouldn’t be if all you do is make RO water. Do you ever put water in the tank from the marina? We often have both RO and shore water, tough to tell how much chlorine, although you can buy test strips. I will sometimes flush with a couple of gallons of RO water drawn from the control panel tap, rather than flush with water from the tank.

 

 

This details some of what can go wrong, including post-mortem pictures. Interestingly, there are several causes for physical damage to the membranes (as opposed to chemical) that might have some bearing on your issue.

 

Tom Peacock

SM 240 Aletes, San Juan PR

Waiting to fly back down to PR next month

 

On Apr 18, 2020, at 8:21 PM, Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote:

 

I need a little help with water maker usage and maintenance, please.

 

Cream Puff has a 24v D60 water-maker. My problem is we seem to be going through membranes at the rate of a pair a year. I have read where others have used the same set of membranes for years and still get drinkable water. This is not the case with us. We are in our 5th year of full time cruising and are now on our 6th set of membranes. 

 

When I last change membranes in Colombia, this was about March 2019. Our current membranes are just over a year old. The PPMs are starting to creep up a bit now and we have gone from the 300 range to the 500 range. We notice a change in drinking quality over 600 PPMs. This is when we usually change the membranes. 

 

We run the water-maker at least once a week when in a marina, flush it with the fresh water rinse. I have a double charcoal filter set up for the tank rinse. When on anchor it is run just about every day. I am careful to watch the pressure and water making float gauge. I normally set it at 55 liters per hour and this put the pressure in lower side of the green range. 

 

Any ideas why our membranes are not lasting or why our PPMs creep up? 

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

 

 

 

 


New files uploaded to main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io

main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io Notification <main+notification@...>
 

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that the following files have been uploaded to the Files area of the main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io group.

Uploaded By: CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...>

Cheers,
The Groups.io Team


Re: Zink Anode for SPURS Line Cutter

 

Teun,

To the back of the Onan heat exchanger
image.png
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Mon, May 18, 2020 at 11:19 AM Teun BAAS <teun@...> wrote:

Hi Alexander,

 

I am aware of all the anodes you mention but, maybe a dumb question, where is the anode on the ONAN Generator?

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 18, 2020 09:18:17

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Alexander Hofmann via groups.io
Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2020 23:57
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Zink Anode for SPURS Line Cutter

 

Bonjour Olivier, hello Rudi and Scott,

I want to add my observations of some years: The zinc anode of the Spurs line cutter is completely away after a year, if you do not have the zinc anode on the nose of (in my case folding) propeller. This means, the protection of the big 2 anodes on the rudder blade is most seemingly not enough to protect the line cutter (and the propeller I believe) from corrosion.
After installing the zinc anode on the propeller (instead of the 'red nose plastic' - as Olivier says), which by the way is quite easy also in diving, I detect no corrosion anymore at the zinc anode of the Spurs line cutter.
I am happy now with a full set of zinc anodes from bow to aft, on (1) the bow thruster, (2) the Onan Generator, (3) the spurs line cutter, (4) the nose of the Propeller and (5) the 2 big ones at the rudder blade.

This should last and avoid any corrosion easily a year!

Best regards
Alexander Hofmann, SY Oceanica I, Amel 54#156


Re: A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

Sv Garulfo
 

Hi Paul,
Thanks for sharing those details.
I wonder if the lid of the top loading fridge/freezer being heavier, would not require a stronger strut. Any thoughts?
Thanks


Re: Whole Boat Permanent Inverter for 220VAC 50Hz

michael winand
 

Hi Scott, I haven't yet installed the isolation transformer,  at present we don't have a need for one, I  may have  misunderstood the victron information, I  thought the largest one's could adjust the  hrtz.
Regards Michael winand  nebo sm251


On Mon, 18 May 2020 at 8:25 am, Scott SV Tengah
<Scott.nguyen@...> wrote:
Michael,

Have you used the VE-Config software, or other means, to check the output hz on your system when connected to 60hz shorepower? Does it show that you're getting 50hz output?

When I was designing my system, the Victron tech I talked to stated that the Victron Isolation Transformer is flexible in that it can accept 50/60hz but will not adjust a 60hz input to 50hz or vice versa. The data sheet seems to imply the same.
--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Re: A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

Paul Dowd and Sharon Brown
 

Soraya,

I don't know about the original, but I got the attached. Haven't fitted it
yet as I'm away from the boat. Its for the under seat fridge in the saloon.

Cheers,
Paul
S/Y Ya Fohi - Amel 54 #98 - Grenada

-----Original Message-----
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On
Behalf Of Sv Garulfo
Sent: 18 May 2020 18:15
To: Amel Yacht owners Group <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

Hello

Could anyone please confirm the details for the strut of the top loading
fridge/freezer of the AMEL 54? And suggest a provider/ website?

Thanks for your help
Best
Soraya


Garulfo A54-122
Tahuata, French Polynesia



--
Cheers
Paul
Ya Fohi - Amel 54 #98


Re: Hot Water Heater Power Consumption

eric freedman
 

Or it could be a cold - to warm water heater.

Just Kidding around.

Fair Winds

Eric

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Craig & Katherine Briggs SN 68 Sangaris Tropic Isle Harbor, FL via groups.io
Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2020 7:22 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Hot Water Heater Power Consumption

 

Thanks, Eric ... and good point Ken - guess it is a "Hot Water Heater" after all!
We don't have any solar, so the Hot Water Heater heats either from the engine coolant (which may also be a misnomer - "hotant?") or from the genset, which adds a nice electrical load to that.


Re: Prisoner in St Maarten

eric freedman
 

Sorry St Maarten.

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of eric freedman
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 5:09 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Prisoner in St Maarten

 

Hi,

Does anyone have a boat in St Marten and are trying to get to the island to sail out of the Hurricane zone?

 

Kimberlite is in St Marten, I am in New York. I have been working with people in the government to allow me to arrive and sail out.

It is a huge bureaucracy.

I hope to get the go ahead in the next two weeks—which means I will have no insurance till I get back to NY.

I will also probably have to sail home single handed.

 

If I get the go ahead to land on the Island, I will sail over to St Thomas,  fuel, provision and leave asap.

 

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376

 


Prisoner in St Maarten

eric freedman
 

Hi,

Does anyone have a boat in St Marten and are trying to get to the island to sail out of the Hurricane zone?

 

Kimberlite is in St Marten, I am in New York. I have been working with people in the government to allow me to arrive and sail out.

It is a huge bureaucracy.

I hope to get the go ahead in the next two weeks—which means I will have no insurance till I get back to NY.

I will also probably have to sail home single handed.

 

If I get the go ahead to land on the Island, I will sail over to St Thomas,  fuel, provision and leave asap.

 

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376

 


Re: New files uploaded to main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io

eric freedman
 

HI Gary,

Would you please send the phone number of Cummins.

I need a manual for my MDKAV.

I believe it is very similar to the generator that is in the manual.

Is there a step by step listing for removing the bearing?

I wonder how tight the bearing is on theshaft.

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io Notification
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 3:36 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] New files uploaded to main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io

 

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that the following files have been uploaded to the Files area of the main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io group.

Uploaded By: Gary Silver <garysilver@...>

Description:
Two Current Onan Genset service manuals: #1- Master Service Manual and #2- Parts Manual (latest and greatest i.e. current as of May 2020) as forwarded to me by Onan Service Rep. G. Silver, sv Liahona

Cheers,
The Groups.io Team


Re: A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

Mohammad Shirloo
 

Ok. I see. It was Bill’s fault. Lol.

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Teun BAAS via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 11:48 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Cc: Atefeh Towfigh <atyt@...>
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

 

Mohammad,

 

I wish it was something professional like a rolling sea but, in all honesty, we were on a mooring in NOUMEA and Bill ROUSE said something to me which really stunned/upset me that I dropped the lid on my finger :(.

 

Thanks for pic. 

 

 

T

 

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.

 

 

-------- Original message --------

From: "Mohammad Shirloo via groups.io" <mshirloo@...>

Date: 5/18/20 11:22 (GMT-07:00)

Cc: Atefeh Towfigh <atyt@...>

Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

 

Hi Teun;

 

Sorry about your finger. I can see how it would be dangerous to try to open the door in a rolling seaway, hold it open while you grab stuff. We just have one strut. Attached please find a picture.

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Teun BAAS via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 11:14 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

 

Hi Aty & Mohammad,

 

Strange – as I was told the small door 54 didn’t have a strut when I was looking to get a strut as the frigging door/cover fell on my finger and I can assure you that HURTS and gives you a black nail for several weeks. Mine doesn’t have any markings or signs of ever a strut(s) being installed.

 

You have 2 struts: 1 on each side?

 

OK – then I also like to have this info on the struts and will install.

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 18, 2020 11:14:12

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mohammad Shirloo via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 11:01
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

 

Hi Teun;

 

We have the small door for our top loading fridge in the galley and ours does have the struts. Ours also is getting weak and need replacing. So, input on this would also be appreciated if anyone has the part number.

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Teun BAAS via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 10:39 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

 

Hi Soraya,

 

Looking @ your hull number (being very close to mine) I have been told that if you have the small top loading fridge/freezer there are no struts and you have to hold it open yourself

Does GARULFO have the wide or narrow top?

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 18, 2020 10:37:48

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sv Garulfo via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 10:15
To: Amel Yacht owners Group <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

 

Hello

 

Could anyone please confirm the details for the strut of the top loading fridge/freezer of the AMEL 54? And suggest a provider/ website?

 

Thanks for your help

Best

Soraya

 

 

Garulfo A54-122

Tahuata, French Polynesia

 

 


Re: Bulkhead Thickness & Screw length

Richie Whyte
 

Hi Trevor
I tried emailing you at firstnamesurname@... but have not received a reply. Have I got the correct address?

Kind regards

Richie


Re: Onan ballbearing check and valves values

Gary Silver
 

Follow Up on Onan Genset Bearing Replacement.  I contacted Onan thru their web site and received a reply from Jesse Ketive, a 

Cummins Level 1 Diagnosis, representative.  He was most helpful and sent me the latest and greatest service and parts manuals for our Onan genesis.  These I just posted to the files section with the "Current as of May 2020" designation.  Having read the procedure for the generator bearing replacement again several times I have inferred that this isn't such a big job after all.  All the references to supporting the  engine and generator rotor etc etc are relative to complete removal of the generator and rotor from the engine and doesn't apply to our project.  

I have queried Jesse to get me some data from a person in the company who has actually done this and answer two questions:  1.  Is the rotor self supporting without damage when the endbell (i.e. the end frame that has the counterbore into which the bearing seats) is removed? and 2.  How tight of an engineering fit is the bearing in its counterbore and and the engineering fit of the bearing onto the rotor shaft?   The description uses the word "tap" to describe removing the endbell from the rotor so I am hopeful that these are light interference fits and not insurmountable by we owners.    I'll post more when I hear back from Jesse. 


All the best, 

Gary S.  Silver, M.D.
s/v Liahona
Amel SM 2000 # 335  lying Puerto Rico - Puerto Del Rey Marina


New files uploaded to main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io

main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io Notification <main+notification@...>
 

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that the following files have been uploaded to the Files area of the main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io group.

Uploaded By: Gary Silver <garysilver@...>

Description:
Two Current Onan Genset service manuals: #1- Master Service Manual and #2- Parts Manual (latest and greatest i.e. current as of May 2020) as forwarded to me by Onan Service Rep. G. Silver, sv Liahona

Cheers,
The Groups.io Team


Re: Self Insurance

karkauai
 

Brent, Thank you for that great offer. It would be a great way to determine interest AND to find out claim information for the last decade or two. It could also be presented to insurance companies if we ask about group coverage.
Initially, poll questions might include:

1.Owner
2. Hull Number
3. Year boat built
4. How long owned by current owner
5. Cruising experience
*Years sailing
*Nautical Miles Sailed
*Cruising ground in past
*Future Sailing Plans
6. Last Out of Water Survey
7. Any Insurance Claims
*Year
*Circumstances
*Amount of claim
*Amount recovered
8. Are you interested in participating in a group insurance plan or a self-insured plan for members only?

Anything else we should ask?

Even if some owners are not interested, please complete the poll. Your personal information would not be revealed if that was requested.

Thanks again, Brent.  Contact me personally while we design the poll.

I don't do Facebook, anyone like to volunteer to steer those folks to this poll?

Kent
SM 243
Kristy






On May 18, 2020 8:56 AM, "Patrick McAneny via groups.io" <sailw32@...> wrote:
This is a rough outline of a self insurance or shared risk co-op, that I sent Kent and thought I would share with the group. It was prompted by the hassle I have had with obtaining insurance, the restrictions and expense.  Bill suggested self insuring and just buying liability insurance, however in the event of a total loss, it would be a big financial hit, that I could not afford. However, if I could share that risk with even ten others or better yet many more, it would soften the loss. When you consider how few Amel's have been lost outside of a hurricane zone, the risk seems very low, and yet we need to insure against such a great financial lose.

1. A  LLC. formed
 
2. An administrator and board to accept membership ,assess deposit amount , administer funds and assess claims.
 
3. A one time deposit could be a percentage of agreed fixed value, perhaps 2 or 2.5% ,eg. $200,000 boat would amount to a $5000 deposit into the fund
 
4. Coverage would be for total loss , fixed value minus say 10% deductible. Figuring most owners could absorb some loss ,and insurance companies have deductibles as well. Hurricane zones excluded.
 
5. Perhaps lightning strike coverage , perhaps coverage would be ,replace with new equipment ,minus a 30 % deductible.This would probably be the largest source of loss. May have a surcharge or higher deductible for Florida locations.
 
6. All funds would be in an interest bearing account,if you can find anyone paying interest.
 
7. Upon leaving the group , the owner would receive a 50% refund of his deposit assuming they had no claims. 
 
8. Perhaps a .20% of fixed value annual fee to go to cost of administration .eg. $3000,000. boat x.20% = $600. annual fee
 
Assuming 200 owners/members at average boat value of $300,000 x 2.5 % = $7,500 deposit or $1,500,000.00 in funds.
a $300,000. loss of a boat would break down to a loss of $1,350. for each of the 200 members.
 
This could even work on a smaller scale . If ten owners shared responsibility for loss. $300,000 minus deductible of 10% ,would be $ 270,000.000 divided by ten owners or $27,000 per owner. Its all about spreading the risk.
 
I wonder why no group has formed a risk co-op as yet. Maybe because insurance used to be less restrictive and more reasonably priced .
 
Stay Safe,
Pat
SM 123
Shenanigans
 
 


Re: Self Insurance

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Bill Rouse, your thoughts

Danny

On 19 May 2020 at 07:21 "Patrick McAneny via groups.io" <sailw32@...> wrote:

Danny, I was thinking (dangerous) we Amel owners, are probably paying for the sins of others. We are lumped in with other owners that for the most part have inferior boats and less experience. I see many  out there that do not even know how to anchor, last winter one drug anchor in Guadeloupe and did $28,000.00 damage to my boat. So many owners out there are making bad decisions leading to losses that we all pay for. Amels are very safe boats ,with knowledgeable owners and it would be nice if that was reflected in the coverage/premiums.
Be Safe,
Pat
SM#123


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS <simms@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Mon, May 18, 2020 3:02 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

Hi Pat, I like that idea better. More workable I think.
Danny
SM 299 Ocean Pearl
On 19 May 2020 at 05:18 "Patrick McAneny via groups.io" <sailw32@...> wrote:

Teun, I have often thought if we as sizable sub group of Amel owners approached an Insurance Co. with a group buy ,if it would be possible to obtain better coverage at a better price. The same way groups obtain group medical insurance at a better rate than individuals. 
Just a thought,
Pat
SM#123


-----Original Message-----
From: Teun BAAS <teun@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, May 18, 2020 12:41 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

Hi Pat & Kent,
 
Since we might be able to make the point of: A) AMEL boats; B) AMEL owners - and therefore a lower risk (????) - combined with thoughts/approach similar to your concept below it might make sense to research a synthetic form by approaching an insurance company for a joint?
 
F.e: no USA insurance company is willing to write/cover my ASTON MARTIN but HAGERTY in MI specializes in this and insured at a lower premium than my the main USA insurers carry my BMW/AUDI.
 
Best Regards Teun
SV AMELIT   A54  #128
 
In storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA
May 18, 2020 09:38:21
 
USA cell: +1 832 477 8842
AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909
 
 
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 05:56
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance
 
This is a rough outline of a self insurance or shared risk co-op, that I sent Kent and thought I would share with the group. It was prompted by the hassle I have had with obtaining insurance, the restrictions and expense.  Bill suggested self insuring and just buying liability insurance, however in the event of a total loss, it would be a big financial hit, that I could not afford. However, if I could share that risk with even ten others or better yet many more, it would soften the loss. When you consider how few Amel's have been lost outside of a hurricane zone, the risk seems very low, and yet we need to insure against such a great financial lose.
 
1. A  LLC. formed
 
2. An administrator and board to accept membership ,assess deposit amount , administer funds and assess claims.
 
3. A one time deposit could be a percentage of agreed fixed value, perhaps 2 or 2.5% ,eg. $200,000 boat would amount to a $5000 deposit into the fund
 
4. Coverage would be for total loss , fixed value minus say 10% deductible. Figuring most owners could absorb some loss ,and insurance companies have deductibles as well. Hurricane zones excluded.
 
5. Perhaps lightning strike coverage , perhaps coverage would be ,replace with new equipment ,minus a 30 % deductible.This would probably be the largest source of loss. May have a surcharge or higher deductible for Florida locations.
 
6. All funds would be in an interest bearing account,if you can find anyone paying interest.
 
7. Upon leaving the group , the owner would receive a 50% refund of his deposit assuming they had no claims. 
 
8. Perhaps a .20% of fixed value annual fee to go to cost of administration .eg. $3000,000. boat x.20% = $600. annual fee
 
Assuming 200 owners/members at average boat value of $300,000 x 2.5 % = $7,500 deposit or $1,500,000.00 in funds.
a $300,000. loss of a boat would break down to a loss of $1,350. for each of the 200 members.
 
This could even work on a smaller scale . If ten owners shared responsibility for loss. $300,000 minus deductible of 10% ,would be $ 270,000.000 divided by ten owners or $27,000 per owner. Its all about spreading the risk.
 
I wonder why no group has formed a risk co-op as yet. Maybe because insurance used to be less restrictive and more reasonably priced .
 
Stay Safe,
Pat
SM 123
Shenanigans
 
 
 
 
 


Re: Self Insurance

Patrick McAneny
 

Danny, I was thinking (dangerous) we Amel owners, are probably paying for the sins of others. We are lumped in with other owners that for the most part have inferior boats and less experience. I see many  out there that do not even know how to anchor, last winter one drug anchor in Guadeloupe and did $28,000.00 damage to my boat. So many owners out there are making bad decisions leading to losses that we all pay for. Amels are very safe boats ,with knowledgeable owners and it would be nice if that was reflected in the coverage/premiums.
Be Safe,
Pat
SM#123


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS <simms@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Mon, May 18, 2020 3:02 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

Hi Pat, I like that idea better. More workable I think.
Danny
SM 299 Ocean Pearl
On 19 May 2020 at 05:18 "Patrick McAneny via groups.io" <sailw32@...> wrote:

Teun, I have often thought if we as sizable sub group of Amel owners approached an Insurance Co. with a group buy ,if it would be possible to obtain better coverage at a better price. The same way groups obtain group medical insurance at a better rate than individuals. 
Just a thought,
Pat
SM#123


-----Original Message-----
From: Teun BAAS <teun@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, May 18, 2020 12:41 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

Hi Pat & Kent,
 
Since we might be able to make the point of: A) AMEL boats; B) AMEL owners - and therefore a lower risk (????) - combined with thoughts/approach similar to your concept below it might make sense to research a synthetic form by approaching an insurance company for a joint?
 
F.e: no USA insurance company is willing to write/cover my ASTON MARTIN but HAGERTY in MI specializes in this and insured at a lower premium than my the main USA insurers carry my BMW/AUDI.
 
Best Regards Teun
SV AMELIT   A54  #128
 
In storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA
May 18, 2020 09:38:21
 
USA cell: +1 832 477 8842
AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909
 
 
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 05:56
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance
 
This is a rough outline of a self insurance or shared risk co-op, that I sent Kent and thought I would share with the group. It was prompted by the hassle I have had with obtaining insurance, the restrictions and expense.  Bill suggested self insuring and just buying liability insurance, however in the event of a total loss, it would be a big financial hit, that I could not afford. However, if I could share that risk with even ten others or better yet many more, it would soften the loss. When you consider how few Amel's have been lost outside of a hurricane zone, the risk seems very low, and yet we need to insure against such a great financial lose.
 
1. A  LLC. formed
 
2. An administrator and board to accept membership ,assess deposit amount , administer funds and assess claims.
 
3. A one time deposit could be a percentage of agreed fixed value, perhaps 2 or 2.5% ,eg. $200,000 boat would amount to a $5000 deposit into the fund
 
4. Coverage would be for total loss , fixed value minus say 10% deductible. Figuring most owners could absorb some loss ,and insurance companies have deductibles as well. Hurricane zones excluded.
 
5. Perhaps lightning strike coverage , perhaps coverage would be ,replace with new equipment ,minus a 30 % deductible.This would probably be the largest source of loss. May have a surcharge or higher deductible for Florida locations.
 
6. All funds would be in an interest bearing account,if you can find anyone paying interest.
 
7. Upon leaving the group , the owner would receive a 50% refund of his deposit assuming they had no claims. 
 
8. Perhaps a .20% of fixed value annual fee to go to cost of administration .eg. $3000,000. boat x.20% = $600. annual fee
 
Assuming 200 owners/members at average boat value of $300,000 x 2.5 % = $7,500 deposit or $1,500,000.00 in funds.
a $300,000. loss of a boat would break down to a loss of $1,350. for each of the 200 members.
 
This could even work on a smaller scale . If ten owners shared responsibility for loss. $300,000 minus deductible of 10% ,would be $ 270,000.000 divided by ten owners or $27,000 per owner. Its all about spreading the risk.
 
I wonder why no group has formed a risk co-op as yet. Maybe because insurance used to be less restrictive and more reasonably priced .
 
Stay Safe,
Pat
SM 123
Shenanigans
 
 
 
 


Re: Self Insurance

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Pat, I like that idea better. More workable I think.

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 19 May 2020 at 05:18 "Patrick McAneny via groups.io" <sailw32@...> wrote:

Teun, I have often thought if we as sizable sub group of Amel owners approached an Insurance Co. with a group buy ,if it would be possible to obtain better coverage at a better price. The same way groups obtain group medical insurance at a better rate than individuals. 
Just a thought,
Pat
SM#123


-----Original Message-----
From: Teun BAAS <teun@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, May 18, 2020 12:41 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

Hi Pat & Kent,
 
Since we might be able to make the point of: A) AMEL boats; B) AMEL owners - and therefore a lower risk (????) - combined with thoughts/approach similar to your concept below it might make sense to research a synthetic form by approaching an insurance company for a joint?
 
F.e: no USA insurance company is willing to write/cover my ASTON MARTIN but HAGERTY in MI specializes in this and insured at a lower premium than my the main USA insurers carry my BMW/AUDI.
 
Best Regards Teun
SV AMELIT   A54  #128
 
In storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA
May 18, 2020 09:38:21
 
USA cell: +1 832 477 8842
AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909
 
 
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 05:56
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance
 
This is a rough outline of a self insurance or shared risk co-op, that I sent Kent and thought I would share with the group. It was prompted by the hassle I have had with obtaining insurance, the restrictions and expense.  Bill suggested self insuring and just buying liability insurance, however in the event of a total loss, it would be a big financial hit, that I could not afford. However, if I could share that risk with even ten others or better yet many more, it would soften the loss. When you consider how few Amel's have been lost outside of a hurricane zone, the risk seems very low, and yet we need to insure against such a great financial lose.
 
1. A  LLC. formed
 
2. An administrator and board to accept membership ,assess deposit amount , administer funds and assess claims.
 
3. A one time deposit could be a percentage of agreed fixed value, perhaps 2 or 2.5% ,eg. $200,000 boat would amount to a $5000 deposit into the fund
 
4. Coverage would be for total loss , fixed value minus say 10% deductible. Figuring most owners could absorb some loss ,and insurance companies have deductibles as well. Hurricane zones excluded.
 
5. Perhaps lightning strike coverage , perhaps coverage would be ,replace with new equipment ,minus a 30 % deductible.This would probably be the largest source of loss. May have a surcharge or higher deductible for Florida locations.
 
6. All funds would be in an interest bearing account,if you can find anyone paying interest.
 
7. Upon leaving the group , the owner would receive a 50% refund of his deposit assuming they had no claims. 
 
8. Perhaps a .20% of fixed value annual fee to go to cost of administration .eg. $3000,000. boat x.20% = $600. annual fee
 
Assuming 200 owners/members at average boat value of $300,000 x 2.5 % = $7,500 deposit or $1,500,000.00 in funds.
a $300,000. loss of a boat would break down to a loss of $1,350. for each of the 200 members.
 
This could even work on a smaller scale . If ten owners shared responsibility for loss. $300,000 minus deductible of 10% ,would be $ 270,000.000 divided by ten owners or $27,000 per owner. Its all about spreading the risk.
 
I wonder why no group has formed a risk co-op as yet. Maybe because insurance used to be less restrictive and more reasonably priced .
 
Stay Safe,
Pat
SM 123
Shenanigans
 
 
 
 


Re: Self Insurance

Patrick McAneny
 

Teun, This idea came about after Bill & I spoke about insurance and he suggested self insuring.Which in the event of a total loss , would be too big of a hit for me. That got me thinking ,if a small group,but bigger the better , would spread the risk ,than the individual loss would be small.Then this weekend I was talking (emailing ) Kent about something else, then I threw this idea at him and he thought it had merit, and would put it out to the group. I followed up by posting what I sent Kent ,that hit on a few other points. 
 I guess Kent did put it out there to determine interest . I assume what Bill did was to organize a group insurance buy. I did not know that. One problem is that this risk co-op would need a paid administrator ,someone well organized ,to make it work. One person comes to mine, and it is not me,a more disorganized man ,you will never find.
Be Safe,
Pat
SM#123


-----Original Message-----
From: Teun BAAS <teun@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, May 18, 2020 1:49 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance

Pat,
 
Agree; understand Bill ROUSE tried this over the last 2 years w/o success. But if we come up with a concept that as a group we would share part of the risk it might be different. It is now not so much anymore a matter of premium costs but it is becoming a matter of being able to get a quote at all on reasonable conditions.
 
Luckily I was able to get AMELIT insured for this coming year but the writing is on the wall.  I hope there is a member of the AYOG who has some experience in this. I would think this should be of interest to LLOYDS. My companies used to have a COMMERCIAL LLOYDS OPEN MARINE POLICY where we would declare at the END of each month what cargo we had on the high seas to be insured during that previous month; was all based on integrity (and the risk of an annual audit hahahahahaha).
 
First step might be to get an idea how many people would be interested in concept (synthetic or not) to get a feeling on the size of the pool.
 
Best Regards Teun
SV AMELIT  A54  #128
 
In storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA
May 18, 2020 10:49:12
 
USA cell: +1 832 477 8842
AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909
 
 
 
 
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 10:18
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance
 
Teun, I have often thought if we as sizable sub group of Amel owners approached an Insurance Co. with a group buy ,if it would be possible to obtain better coverage at a better price. The same way groups obtain group medical insurance at a better rate than individuals. 
Just a thought,
Pat
SM#123

-----Original Message-----
From: Teun BAAS <teun@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, May 18, 2020 12:41 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance
Hi Pat & Kent,
 
Since we might be able to make the point of: A) AMEL boats; B) AMEL owners - and therefore a lower risk (????) - combined with thoughts/approach similar to your concept below it might make sense to research a synthetic form by approaching an insurance company for a joint?
 
F.e: no USA insurance company is willing to write/cover my ASTON MARTIN but HAGERTY in MI specializes in this and insured at a lower premium than my the main USA insurers carry my BMW/AUDI.
 
Best Regards Teun
SV AMELIT  A54  #128
 
In storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA
May 18, 2020 09:38:21
 
USA cell: +1 832 477 8842
AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909
 
 
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Patrick McAneny via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 05:56
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Self Insurance
 
This is a rough outline of a self insurance or shared risk co-op, that I sent Kent and thought I would share with the group. It was prompted by the hassle I have had with obtaining insurance, the restrictions and expense.  Bill suggested self insuring and just buying liability insurance, however in the event of a total loss, it would be a big financial hit, that I could not afford. However, if I could share that risk with even ten others or better yet many more, it would soften the loss. When you consider how few Amel's have been lost outside of a hurricane zone, the risk seems very low, and yet we need to insure against such a great financial lose.
 
1. A  LLC. formed
 
2. An administrator and board to accept membership ,assess deposit amount , administer funds and assess claims.
 
3. A one time deposit could be a percentage of agreed fixed value, perhaps 2 or 2.5% ,eg. $200,000 boat would amount to a $5000 deposit into the fund
 
4. Coverage would be for total loss , fixed value minus say 10% deductible. Figuring most owners could absorb some loss ,and insurance companies have deductibles as well. Hurricane zones excluded.
 
5. Perhaps lightning strike coverage , perhaps coverage would be ,replace with new equipment ,minus a 30 % deductible.This would probably be the largest source of loss. May have a surcharge or higher deductible for Florida locations.
 
6. All funds would be in an interest bearing account,if you can find anyone paying interest.
 
7. Upon leaving the group , the owner would receive a 50% refund of his deposit assuming they had no claims. 
 
8. Perhaps a .20% of fixed value annual fee to go to cost of administration .eg. $3000,000. boat x.20% = $600. annual fee
 
Assuming 200 owners/members at average boat value of $300,000 x 2.5 % = $7,500 deposit or $1,500,000.00 in funds.
a $300,000. loss of a boat would break down to a loss of $1,350. for each of the 200 members.
 
This could even work on a smaller scale . If ten owners shared responsibility for loss. $300,000 minus deductible of 10% ,would be $ 270,000.000 divided by ten owners or $27,000 per owner. Its all about spreading the risk.
 
I wonder why no group has formed a risk co-op as yet. Maybe because insurance used to be less restrictive and more reasonably priced .
 
Stay Safe,
Pat
SM 123
Shenanigans
 
 


Re: A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

Teun BAAS
 

Mohammad,

I wish it was something professional like a rolling sea but, in all honesty, we were on a mooring in NOUMEA and Bill ROUSE said something to me which really stunned/upset me that I dropped the lid on my finger :(.

Thanks for pic. 


T

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


-------- Original message --------
From: "Mohammad Shirloo via groups.io" <mshirloo@...>
Date: 5/18/20 11:22 (GMT-07:00)
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Cc: Atefeh Towfigh <atyt@...>
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

Hi Teun;

 

Sorry about your finger. I can see how it would be dangerous to try to open the door in a rolling seaway, hold it open while you grab stuff. We just have one strut. Attached please find a picture.

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Teun BAAS via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 11:14 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

 

Hi Aty & Mohammad,

 

Strange – as I was told the small door 54 didn’t have a strut when I was looking to get a strut as the frigging door/cover fell on my finger and I can assure you that HURTS and gives you a black nail for several weeks. Mine doesn’t have any markings or signs of ever a strut(s) being installed.

 

You have 2 struts: 1 on each side?

 

OK – then I also like to have this info on the struts and will install.

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In Storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 18, 2020 11:14:12

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mohammad Shirloo via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 11:01
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

 

Hi Teun;

 

We have the small door for our top loading fridge in the galley and ours does have the struts. Ours also is getting weak and need replacing. So, input on this would also be appreciated if anyone has the part number.

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Teun BAAS via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 10:39 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

 

Hi Soraya,

 

Looking @ your hull number (being very close to mine) I have been told that if you have the small top loading fridge/freezer there are no struts and you have to hold it open yourself

Does GARULFO have the wide or narrow top?

 

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

In storage on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

May 18, 2020 10:37:48

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sv Garulfo via groups.io
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2020 10:15
To: Amel Yacht owners Group <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] A54 top loading fridge /freezer strut

 

Hello

 

Could anyone please confirm the details for the strut of the top loading fridge/freezer of the AMEL 54? And suggest a provider/ website?

 

Thanks for your help

Best

Soraya

 

 

Garulfo A54-122

Tahuata, French Polynesia