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Re: Getting to St Maarten
Thomas Peacock
Hi Eric,
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
This is Tom, not sure if the right Tom. We have just entered the Chesapeake, having spent 8 days coming up from Puerto Rico. Glad to be back in the US. Sorry that Kimberlite remains in limbo. I am not able to help out bringing her up. But let me know about anything else. Tom Peacock Aletes SM 240 with its tiny keyboard
On May 22, 2020, at 7:36 PM, eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:
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Re: Starting Capacitor size for a 220v, 50Hz 2.5 kw water maker high pressure motor
Mark & Debbie Mueller
The 48 mfd you measured is approximately 20% below the specified value for that motor. Industry standards say a 10% deviation is OK. I would not discount the capacitor as the culprit. Also, try and rotate the motor from the cooling fan end by hand to see if the motor or pump is locked up – verify the power is off. Good Luck. -- Mark Mueller Brass Ring A54
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Re: Insurance
Patrick McAneny
Mark,
I emailed Kent yesterday, that I was going to stop responding to posts on this subject ,as I don't want to take the time or clog up this site. But the 2% proposed deposit into a reserve fund ,was a one time deposit, which upon leaving the group, you would receive a 50% refund,provided you had not made any claims during your membership. With the group protecting you from a total loss ,perhaps an owner may chose to continue full coverage , but could insure his boat at a much lower fixed value ,which should result in a much lower annual premium. If you parked $4000. in the reserve fund and it lowered your premium by a significant amount ,it could be a good return on your deposit .
However ,I agree and related this to Kent ,its like herding cats , I have read comments that were based on false assumptions or the misinterpretations of what was originally proposed and I felt compelled correct them,can't keep doing it. For this to work ,it would need to be lead by someone well organized, it would have to be kept simple and limited in scope. I have said that ,it may be a case of a good idea whose time is yet to arrive. If underwriters continue to leave the market ,and coverage continues to shrink and continue to get more expensive ,its time may arrive .
But I don't think it is now, I did not make the original post on this subject , but I have proposed some plans for it, and believe it has merit, if an Amel Risk co-op ever evolves , count me in. But for now ,I will now respond to further discussions on this site , as often a subject goes on and on , clogging the site without end.
Stay Safe,
Pat
SM#123
-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io Sent: Fri, May 22, 2020 6:15 pm Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Insurance Not wanting to poop on this idea, I am in favor or the concept,
but the proposed numbers just do not seem to work.
If I am to
contribute 2% of the insured value of my boat, this amount is greater than what
I am currently paying for my current company provided insurance (with minimal
deductable and liability included).
Just my 2¢ but
to think 200 owners would agree to this is IMO a bit of a pipe dream. Getting
10 people to agree on anything is difficult let alone 200.
Also, the idea
of an assessment is frightening to me. Being at the mercy of others concerning
my out of pocket expenses is very unappealing.
Perhaps the
more reasonable approach is to join an association such as the OCC and utilize
their recommendations and discounts pre-arranged for members at Top-Sail. I am
not sure but, there might be other groups about the world. Or, form a group to
obtain group-rate policies as someone else suggested we can favor one particular
insurance company. However, the latter suggestion has already been pursued by
Bill Rouse to no avail.
One last
thought is licensing. Without valid verification, it might be impossible to
stay in marinas etc. or for those that need it, a mortgage on the vessel.
Just my 2¢
worth.
Regardless of
the outcome of this thread, I would like to see members of this group continue
discussions as they find good options for their Amels.
With best
regards,
Mark
Skipper
Sailing Vessel
- Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
Currently
cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia
www.creampuff.us
From: <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> on behalf of "karkauai
via groups.io" <karkauai@...>
Reply-To: <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> Date: Sunday, 17 May 2020 at 3:22 pm To: <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Insurance Hi All,
Given the insurance problems everyone is having, I thought I'd see if there is enough interest and/or expertise to pursue an AYOG self-insurance program. Pat (Shenanigans) and I have talked about it a little. Here's the gist of what we discussed: 1. A buy-in of some percentage of your boat's value that would be enough to cover the first year. For example, a $300,000 SM owner might pay 2% or $6,000. If we had 200 similar owners, we'd have $1,200,000 to pay out. 2. It would' be a high deductible coverage designed primarily to pay for total loss. Maybe something like 20% of the boat's value. 3. The most common claim would probably be lightening damage, which often amounts to $50,000 or more. Our plan might pay for half of a major claim like that? 4. Boat's would have to be out of the hurricane zones during the season. Any other restrictions? 5. Yearly Assessments could replenish what was paid out Or we could continue to pay in until the principle was self-sustaining. That would require investing the funds and a whole added layer of complexity. 6. A rotating Board of unpaid members would oversee the plan (maybe a LLC?), and an administrator would be hired to do the paperwork. 7. Owners would purchase their own liability insurance. This is all just a very rough framework that can be built on, scrapped and something else adopted, or what ever seems appropriate. Any and all thoughts and suggestions are encouraged. I'm hoping we might have an owner or two that have some insurance or legal expertise to help us understand the potential pitfalls and options available. Thanks for your ideas. Kent Kristy S M 243
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Getting to St Maarten
eric freedman
I have made a reservation to get to St Thomas June 1st. I will then be chartering a powerboat to St Maarten. Once I arrive, I will check all systems and leave the following day. Is there anyone who would also like to get to St Maarten to rescue their boat? We could share the cost of the trip from St Thomas to St Maarten?
Is there anyone trapped in St Maarten who would like to sail back to New York? Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376
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Re: Mizzen furler gearbox, A54 peculiarity?
Sv Garulfo
Hi, To close the thread: I gave up on trying to unscrew the bottom. It was getting too risky to damage the unit and no one would be impressed with the drama. I think the only difference between the SM and the A54 (later hull numbers) gearboxes is 1. the absence of top screwed lid on the A54 version, 2. The bottom lid holes are not drilled through on the 54. The rest is designed the same. I eventually managed to loosen the bottom part of the internal column. After much fresh water cleaning, the column rotates freely. I drilled the bottom lid holes through. They now act as drains like on the SM. I find that makes more sense. I cleaned the horizontal winch handle shaft and bushing. This is where the stiffness really comes from. I treated the aluminium/stainless steel interface with Tef-Gel. I lightly greased the gears interface with marine grade grease. I left the Delrin balls alone and I’ll monitor how that evolves. Thanks all for your help, Thomas A54-122 Tahuata, French Polynesia
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Re: Insurance
Not wanting to poop on this idea, I am in favor or the concept, but the proposed numbers just do not seem to work.
If I am to contribute 2% of the insured value of my boat, this amount is greater than what I am currently paying for my current company provided insurance (with minimal deductable and liability included).
Just my 2¢ but to think 200 owners would agree to this is IMO a bit of a pipe dream. Getting 10 people to agree on anything is difficult let alone 200.
Also, the idea of an assessment is frightening to me. Being at the mercy of others concerning my out of pocket expenses is very unappealing.
Perhaps the more reasonable approach is to join an association such as the OCC and utilize their recommendations and discounts pre-arranged for members at Top-Sail. I am not sure but, there might be other groups about the world. Or, form a group to obtain group-rate policies as someone else suggested we can favor one particular insurance company. However, the latter suggestion has already been pursued by Bill Rouse to no avail.
One last thought is licensing. Without valid verification, it might be impossible to stay in marinas etc. or for those that need it, a mortgage on the vessel.
Just my 2¢ worth.
Regardless of the outcome of this thread, I would like to see members of this group continue discussions as they find good options for their Amels.
With best regards,
Mark
Skipper Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275 Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia www.creampuff.us
From: <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> on behalf of "karkauai
via groups.io" <karkauai@...>
Hi All,
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Re: Starting Capacitor size for a 220v, 50Hz 2.5 kw water maker high pressure motor
Sorry about that. It is actually µF
On Fri, May 22, 2020 at 2:14 PM Jose Venegas via groups.io <josegvenegas=icloud.com@groups.io> wrote: Thank you BIll,
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Re: Starting Capacitor size for a 220v, 50Hz 2.5 kw water maker high pressure motor
Jose Venegas
Thank you BIll,
It looks almost identical but mine has a single capacitor with 54 micro F. Yours has 2 of 30 mF in parallel (60 mF). is the m for micro of mili? If it is micro, it is bad news for me because it would mean that my capacitor is OK and the motor is dead. If it is mil, then my capacitor needs to be replaced. Jose SM2K 278
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Re: Starting Capacitor size for a 220v, 50Hz 2.5 kw water maker high pressure motor
Jose, This probably is not what you are looking for, but....here you go. This is the 220 volt motor for the Dessalator 150/160 liter water maker, but maybe newer than you SM. If that is yours, this may help:
On Fri, May 22, 2020 at 1:42 PM Jose Venegas via groups.io <josegvenegas=icloud.com@groups.io> wrote: The water maker high-pressure pump motor is not starting and breaking the AC circuits of shore power and Onan Generator. It is a LeRoy motor. I have checked for a short circuit and seems OK. (1-ohm resistance between poles and 12.5 Khoms from pole to the earth) The starting motor capacitor specs are not visible. I measured 48 micro F, which seems small for the motor size. Does anybody know if that is the proper size? The motor makes a very short humming sound before the AC circuits jump. Before I remove the motor and proceed with major surgery, I would like to know if the capacitor is the proper one or has failed.
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Starting Capacitor size for a 220v, 50Hz 2.5 kw water maker high pressure motor
Jose Venegas
The water maker high-pressure pump motor is not starting and breaking the AC circuits of shore power and Onan Generator. It is a LeRoy motor. I have checked for a short circuit and seems OK. (1-ohm resistance between poles and 12.5 Khoms from pole to the earth) The starting motor capacitor specs are not visible. I measured 48 micro F, which seems small for the motor size. Does anybody know if that is the proper size? The motor makes a very short humming sound before the AC circuits jump. Before I remove the motor and proceed with major surgery, I would like to know if the capacitor is the proper one or has failed.
Thanks in advance Jose Venegas Ipanema SM2000 278 Currently grounded in Grenada awaiting for the opening of Colombian ports to proceed.
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Re: Onan ballbearing check and valves values
Gary Silver
Hi All:I inquired of Cummins (Onan) about the specifics of changing the generator bearing. The original person that helped me sent me copies of the updated (latest and greatest) parts and master service manuals for my 7MDKAL-431 genset (posted them in the files section with May 2020 in the title). He escalated my request for help to his superiors and they responded but indicated that the service should only be done my a "certified Onan" technician. After explaining to them that several of us (out of a group of owners having about 800 of their gen-sets) had attempted using a "Onan certified technician" and the technicians had never done it and didn't want to do it. I finally prevailed on Onan to give me the procedure after explaining that I am an FAA certified aircraft mechanic and know my way around wrenches. Here is the reply to my questions that I request be directed to a technician who had actually done the procedure:Question 1. Is the rotor able to be self supported when the end-bell is removed. Answer: "The rotor can support itself for a small amount of time. I would not leave it unsupported for more than 60 minutes, but it should be fine to remove the end bell" This is in line with what Craig said relative to a Northern Lights genset.Question 2. What is the degree of engineered interference fit for the bearing in the counter-bore and on the rotor shaft. In other words how much difficulty can I expect in removing the end-bell. The service manual says to “tap” it off. Is that realistic or can I expect a major struggle. Answer: "I personally used a 2 jaw puller or if the end bell has threaded holes a steering wheel puller to remove it. The other option is to use 2 pry bars at the outside edges and slowly work it off. It is a fairly tight fit or should be unless the bearing began to turn in the end bell housing Note: be sure to disconnect F1 and F2 as the exciter stator will come off with the end bell."
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Re: Insurance
David Vogel
Owners of SM#396, svPerigee, Australian registered, are interested in potential aspects of self-insurance within a group of AMEL owners.
Currently insured with: Pantaenius Australia, expiry Oct’20; FORM: comprehensive (all risks); Amount insured: ~AUD450k (~USD295k); Premium: ~AUD9k (~USD6k)
1.Owner: D&L Vogel 2. Hull Number: SM#396 3. Year boat built: 2003 4. How long owned by current owner: since Oct’16 5. Cruising experience *Years sailing: 20+, on and off. *Nautical Miles Sailed: ~10,000nm prior to ownership; since ownership ~16,000nm; *Cruising ground in past: Australia QLD; Med; UK; US East Coast; Caribbean; Central Americas; South Pacific *Future Sailing Plans: South Pacific, expect 3,000 to 5,000nm per annum 6. Last Out of Water Survey: Oct’16 7. Any Insurance Claims *Year: no marine or aviation claims (non-current commercial pilot); Automobile, 2010; *Circumstances: other car merged into me *Amount of claim: ~CHF10k *Amount recovered: unknown; I simply paid the insurance excess (deductible) 8. Are you interested in participating in a group insurance plan or a self-insured plan for members only? Potentially YES,
Understanding, based on quick read-though of the discussions: Concept: covered only against total constructive loss @ 10% deductable; named tropical storm (subject to date/geographic limitations, and other caveats to minimise exposure) @ [30]% deductible; or lightning damage @ [30]% deductable (higher deductibles to 60% or even 80% for those making claims in known high-risk areas, such as Florida – basically, self-insuring against such risk in those known high-risk areas). Annual premiums: [5] years buy-in “deposit” @ ~2.0% (~USD6k pa); thereafter annual top-up to cover annual losses due to claims plus annual contribution to cover operating/admin costs in order of 0.2% (USD600-pa). New members do the same. Co-insurance with underwriter to cover losses greater than [3] total-loss-claims in any given year. Notional buy-out is 50% of deposits paid, with an final adjustment paid after a further 5 years’ fund operation – that is, cash-value, not allowing for gains, such as interest received (and no refund of annual top-ups). Adjustment of annual premiums / calls etc conducted like a real-estate body corporate (administering shared common property) with a “sinking fund” (making provision for known future potential expenses/risks, only some of which may, or may not, come to be realised).
Proposal: Insured value is range-based on a value determined by AMEL owners’ cooperative – with provisions for / based on existing known (blue-book) depreciation schedules, with variation for various states of upgrades / maintenance etc. – that is, could not insure a well-maintained and operated year 2000 SM for, say, USD500k; only within a range of, say, USD[250]k to USD[275]k, diminishing at, say, [3-5]% in dollar terms for exceptionally well-maintained (all to better than OEM spec); [5-8]% for well-maintained (all to spec); [8-12]% for maintained ‘mostly to spec’; [>12]% for maintained less than spec … or whatever – has to be simple to do (for an owner to both do and to prove), and to externally assess.
Concept expansion: built assets to cover worst reasonably foreseeable losses for [5] years running; say, [5] hulls per year, for [5] years, = 25 hulls at weighted-average of USD350k @ 90% payout figure =~USD8.0m to fund the insurance fund. Basically, need to rapidly build to 250 hulls, each contributing 2% for 5 years, with no losses in the first 5 years (or with underwriting to cover any losses in the first 5 years). Consider that.
From: <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> on behalf of "karkauai via groups.io" <karkauai@...>
Hi All,
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Re: A54 mainsail manual furler gearbox maintenance
Is a seal there in the box is filled with Grease it’s probably time for you to dismantle and repack it
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
On May 20, 2020, at 4:53 PM, Sv Garulfo <svgarulfo@...> wrote:
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Re: Onan ballbearing check and valves values
Hi Oliver,
Yes, that does seem to be a strange statement in the manual to "inspect every 2000h or 5 years". I am at a loss to know what or how you would inspect it, unless perhaps, it was visibly corroded or something like that. Sorry but I don't know the spec/size for the bearing on your Onan genset. Cheers, Craig
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Re: Victron Quattro charger/inverter installation
Mohammad Shirloo
Thank you Thomas. I’ll review and am sure will have some questions.
Happy Sailing;
Mohammad and Aty B&B Kokomo AMEL 54 #099
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
On Behalf Of Sv Garulfo via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2020 4:17 PM To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Victron Quattro charger/inverter installation
Mohammad, Arno,
In the message
I described the implementation of the MasterVolt MassCombi Pro 24V/3500W/100A on Garulfo (amongst other things)
Hope it helps,
Mohammad, Note that we have a dessalator duo100 (24V and 220V), so we can run it directly on the batteries. The overall unit is about 900W, so we could also use the 220V side through the inverter, say if the 24V side was faulty and didn’t want to run the genset. If your watermater 150L/h is 220V only and uses 3kW, you’ll need to take that into consideration for your inverter choice.
Best,
Thomas GARULFO A54-122 Tahuata, French Polynesia
On Wed, 20 May 2020 at 13:14, Arno Luijten <arno.luijten@...> wrote:
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Re: Victron Quattro charger/inverter installation
Sv Garulfo
Mohammad, Arno, In the message I described the implementation of the MasterVolt MassCombi Pro 24V/3500W/100A on Garulfo (amongst other things) Hope it helps, Mohammad, Note that we have a dessalator duo100 (24V and 220V), so we can run it directly on the batteries. The overall unit is about 900W, so we could also use the 220V side through the inverter, say if the 24V side was faulty and didn’t want to run the genset. If your watermater 150L/h is 220V only and uses 3kW, you’ll need to take that into consideration for your inverter choice. Best, Thomas GARULFO A54-122 Tahuata, French Polynesia
On Wed, 20 May 2020 at 13:14, Arno Luijten <arno.luijten@...> wrote: Hi Scott,
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Re: Victron Quattro charger/inverter installation
Hi Scott,
On my A54 the cables for the chargers (Mastervolt 100 A and 40 A) are routed individually to the batteries. They are actually connected on the primary side of the big red switches (so connected to the battery side). Pretty sure they did this to make sure the charger "knows" the exact battery voltage and to enable charging with the red switches off (when the boat is decommissioned for example) . The junction in the engine room is only supplying the gray fuse box as far as I can see. This is also where the inverter gets it power from (via a circuit breaker). I did not investigate where this 95mm2 feed cable is exactly going to. That is not so easy, hence my question on this forum. At the back of the red switches there is a plethora of cables going in all directions, the markings are not easy to read. There are also two studs distributing the power as well. Regards, Arno Luijten SV Luna, A54-121
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Re: Drawings and/or Schematic of Sharki fuel tank
Marco Baldan
Hello Graham,
I am in the looking to purchase a Sharki. Any useful information would be most welcome. Marco Baldan Albin Vega 3339 - Spray
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A54 mainsail manual furler gearbox maintenance
Sv Garulfo
Hi all, Can anyone advise on the maintenance required for the manual furler box for the mainsail on the A54? Ours shows signs of corrosion around the winch handle socket. Another confinement project starts! Cheers Thomas GARULFO A54-122 Tahuata, French Polynesia
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Re: Victron Quattro charger/inverter installation
Scott SV Tengah
Hmm, are you suggesting that the 95mm2 cables go from that engine room junction to the batteries directly? Take a look behind your battery main switches and see if there's a pair of 95mm2 cables running towards the engine room.
I recall when replacing my Dolphin 100a and 30a, there were separate wires behind the main switches, by the batteries, that were labelled 100a and 30a. That implies that the wires for each charger went directly to the batteries vs. through that "junction" in the engine room. Note we re-used the 100a cables for our Skylla-i 80a. And as noted, we installed two pairs of 50mm2 for the new Quattro 5kw/120a. The wire sizing was for the inverter portion (5000/26.3 = 190+ amps). -- Scott 2007 A54 #69 SV Tengah http://www.svtengah.com
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