Date   

Re: Sea Chest

Thomas Peacock
 

Thanks as always for the tips, Bill.

On the short life of the generator impeller, I have much experience, and a tiny bit of advice.

After we bought our boat about ten years ago, the generator would go through impellers every 15 or 20 hours, obviously a major pain.

When in Martinique, I had Didiere, the local, very experienced diesel mechanic, work on a separate issue. He always looked into the impeller problem, and put a new one in, using some sort of glue-type substance on the Woodruff key that keeps the impeller working correctly. The new impeller lasted only about three hours. (That said, I still think Didiere is a great mechanic).

For the next one, I did three things:

1. I also put a mild glue on the Woodruff key

2. I sanded the inner part of the impeller housing (perhaps the metal is more prone to accumulating residue from the rubber, which then leads to excessive friction)

3. I lubricated the inner housing with Molykote. 

Since, then, I have had no impeller problems, 

Might be coincidence, but it works for me.

Tom Peacock
SM 240 Aletes
Chesapeake Bay, awaiting vaccine


On Nov 27, 2020, at 4:34 PM, Karen Smith via groups.io <karenharmonie@...> wrote:

Chris,

I have taken the photos and annotated them with the parts list.  

All of the fittings I used are standard NPT pipe fittings.  In the case of the outlet fitting on the strainer, that is actually a female 1-1/2” BSP thread.  In this size, the NPT and BSP threads are compatible enough that they will screw together just fine, but they will not make a reliable high pressure seal.  Don’t expect “teflon tape” to help here.  You’ll need paste type pipe sealant.  For the very low pressures seen here, it works fine despite the small mismatch in thread shapes..

We have been running this long enough now, we can confidently say that it works with no issues. Well, no issues that were not already there with the stock Amel manifold.

Here is the only problem we have with the “sea chest” design.  As we sail, air is entrained under the hull.  Some of this air finds the sea chest thruhull and rises into it, displacing the water.  If we are sailing fast, enough air comes through that in a very few hours the strainer and standpipe are empty of water. I am pretty confident that needing to purge this entrained air is the primary reason that the generators on Amel’s have such short lived raw water impellers.  I have a couple of ideas on how to improve this situation, but nothing ready to implement yet.

Our new generator has a hair trigger on its exhaust temperature shutdown which has made this problem more obvious.  Occasionally, and only when we are sailing, the high exhaust temp triggers a shut down right after it starts.  A second start try and it runs fine. If I crack the lid of the strainer and purge the air, it never happens. 

Short of closing the sea cock, I can’t think of a way to keep the air out, so I am trying to figure out a way to easily purge it.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Fort Lauderdale, FL, USA


<9495D3AA-FC12-427B-AD1A-C082BAE84D49.jpeg><288A2531-8543-43CF-91FA-F8D6F4D69446.jpeg>


--
Tom Peacock
SM 240 Aletes
Chesapeake Bay


Re: Sea Chest

Mark Pitt
 

I always run the anchor washdown pump for 20 seconds, turn it off, and then immediately turn on the generator or Yanmar.  Haven’t lost an impeller since I started doing this a few years ago.

Mark Pitt
Sabbatical III, SM419


On Nov 27, 2020, at 3:34 PM, Karen Smith via groups.io <karenharmonie@...> wrote:

Chris,

I have taken the photos and annotated them with the parts list.  

All of the fittings I used are standard NPT pipe fittings.  In the case of the outlet fitting on the strainer, that is actually a female 1-1/2” BSP thread.  In this size, the NPT and BSP threads are compatible enough that they will screw together just fine, but they will not make a reliable high pressure seal.  Don’t expect “teflon tape” to help here.  You’ll need paste type pipe sealant.  For the very low pressures seen here, it works fine despite the small mismatch in thread shapes..

We have been running this long enough now, we can confidently say that it works with no issues. Well, no issues that were not already there with the stock Amel manifold.

Here is the only problem we have with the “sea chest” design.  As we sail, air is entrained under the hull.  Some of this air finds the sea chest thruhull and rises into it, displacing the water.  If we are sailing fast, enough air comes through that in a very few hours the strainer and standpipe are empty of water. I am pretty confident that needing to purge this entrained air is the primary reason that the generators on Amel’s have such short lived raw water impellers.  I have a couple of ideas on how to improve this situation, but nothing ready to implement yet.

Our new generator has a hair trigger on its exhaust temperature shutdown which has made this problem more obvious.  Occasionally, and only when we are sailing, the high exhaust temp triggers a shut down right after it starts.  A second start try and it runs fine. If I crack the lid of the strainer and purge the air, it never happens. 

Short of closing the sea cock, I can’t think of a way to keep the air out, so I am trying to figure out a way to easily purge it.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Fort Lauderdale, FL, USA


<9495D3AA-FC12-427B-AD1A-C082BAE84D49.jpeg>
<288A2531-8543-43CF-91FA-F8D6F4D69446.jpeg>


Re: Sea Chest

Karen Smith
 

Chris,

I have taken the photos and annotated them with the parts list.  

All of the fittings I used are standard NPT pipe fittings.  In the case of the outlet fitting on the strainer, that is actually a female 1-1/2” BSP thread.  In this size, the NPT and BSP threads are compatible enough that they will screw together just fine, but they will not make a reliable high pressure seal.  Don’t expect “teflon tape” to help here.  You’ll need paste type pipe sealant.  For the very low pressures seen here, it works fine despite the small mismatch in thread shapes..

We have been running this long enough now, we can confidently say that it works with no issues. Well, no issues that were not already there with the stock Amel manifold.

Here is the only problem we have with the “sea chest” design.  As we sail, air is entrained under the hull.  Some of this air finds the sea chest thruhull and rises into it, displacing the water.  If we are sailing fast, enough air comes through that in a very few hours the strainer and standpipe are empty of water. I am pretty confident that needing to purge this entrained air is the primary reason that the generators on Amel’s have such short lived raw water impellers.  I have a couple of ideas on how to improve this situation, but nothing ready to implement yet.

Our new generator has a hair trigger on its exhaust temperature shutdown which has made this problem more obvious.  Occasionally, and only when we are sailing, the high exhaust temp triggers a shut down right after it starts.  A second start try and it runs fine. If I crack the lid of the strainer and purge the air, it never happens. 

Short of closing the sea cock, I can’t think of a way to keep the air out, so I am trying to figure out a way to easily purge it.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Fort Lauderdale, FL, USA



Re: In mast furler - Brake - Amel 54 + top cap

Courtney Gorman
 

I have had the same issue those motors are regularly back ordered mine took 2 months during this same time period two years ago 
Cheers 
Courtney
Trippin 
54 #101


On Nov 27, 2020, at 3:53 PM, Sv Garulfo <svgarulfo@...> wrote:



We went through the same exercise 3 years ago. Only managed to remove the bottom cap, using a similar method. Couldn’t do the top cap no matter how hard we tried. 

Some permanent magnets had come loose and had to be reglued. The break was functional but upon testing after everything was put back together, still misbehaved and felt like it was still applying some level of break while the motor ran. The break itself is an electromagnetic clutch and can be somewhat adjusted for friction, but we never found the amount suitable for the motor to be 100% happy.
We eventually got a replacement unit from Amel when we reached martinique.


Hope that helps,

Thomas
GARULFO 
A54-122
Moorea






On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 at 01:46, Stefan Schaufert <mail@...> wrote:
Dear Porter,

the top cap was a real problem and appr. 2 hours work.
Finally, I hung the lower end of the pipe under the boom so that the top cap is at the bottom.  Then carefully place a screwdriver between the cap and tube and - as carefully as possible with a rubber mallet - hit it down step by step.  The top cap is glued in with silicon or something similar.  So this is not a good, but possibly the only, treatment method and the edges no longer look good.  But the biggest mess was the motor.  There was no water in it, but it was full of gear grease, 2 permanent magnets had come loose and stuck to the rotor, others were loose to the stator, many edges broken. So, if your in mast furler keeps stopping again and again, this can be a good reason.
But the brushes were - contrary to my assumption - ok :-).

Hope it helps.

Best regards
Stefan
A54 #119 Lady Charlyette Luperon, Dominican Republic

<IMG_1378-1.jpeg>
<IMG_1377.jpeg>
<6987C24C-6B52-4E55-B325-6C19A2A31C42.jpeg>


Re: In mast furler - Brake - Amel 54 + top cap

Sv Garulfo
 


We went through the same exercise 3 years ago. Only managed to remove the bottom cap, using a similar method. Couldn’t do the top cap no matter how hard we tried. 

Some permanent magnets had come loose and had to be reglued. The break was functional but upon testing after everything was put back together, still misbehaved and felt like it was still applying some level of break while the motor ran. The break itself is an electromagnetic clutch and can be somewhat adjusted for friction, but we never found the amount suitable for the motor to be 100% happy.
We eventually got a replacement unit from Amel when we reached martinique.


Hope that helps,

Thomas
GARULFO 
A54-122
Moorea






On Fri, 27 Nov 2020 at 01:46, Stefan Schaufert <mail@...> wrote:
Dear Porter,

the top cap was a real problem and appr. 2 hours work.
Finally, I hung the lower end of the pipe under the boom so that the top cap is at the bottom.  Then carefully place a screwdriver between the cap and tube and - as carefully as possible with a rubber mallet - hit it down step by step.  The top cap is glued in with silicon or something similar.  So this is not a good, but possibly the only, treatment method and the edges no longer look good.  But the biggest mess was the motor.  There was no water in it, but it was full of gear grease, 2 permanent magnets had come loose and stuck to the rotor, others were loose to the stator, many edges broken. So, if your in mast furler keeps stopping again and again, this can be a good reason.
But the brushes were - contrary to my assumption - ok :-).

Hope it helps.

Best regards
Stefan
A54 #119 Lady Charlyette Luperon, Dominican Republic


Re: A54 bow thruster seal replacement?

 

I have done this job several times, but each time the 54 never had the seals replaced since new. 

The issue I ran into was getting the lower unit separated from the motor. I had to seek out a sizeable puller. 

I believe that if you are going to do this that in addition to the parts you have from Amel, you will also want to buy a new flexible coupling. It is likely that you have the original two-piece Flexible Coupling. It has been replaced by the Side-Power One-Piece Flexible Coupling for SE120 Through SE170 Thrusters (3"X2 3/8"X3"). There was no issue with fit.

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Fri, Nov 27, 2020 at 11:47 AM Mohammad Shirloo <mshirloo@...> wrote:

Hi Scott;

 

We did replace the seals in 2018 at the Manoel Yard in Malta. We did not have any issues either, but had the seals and the yard replaced them for us. Typically I personally watch any work being done on Kokomo and never have anyone do any work without my own presence. This was one of the jobs that I had to check in on, once in a while, as we had multiple items being worked on at the same time. So, I do not have a good recollection of the steps required.

 

Is there a specific question? I may have the answer or be able to reach out to the yard and get you what you need.

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Scott SV Tengah via groups.io
Sent: Friday, November 27, 2020 9:28 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] A54 bow thruster seal replacement?

 

Has anyone replaced their bow thruster seals on the 54?

We are on the hard and have the parts on hand but the boat yard declined the project so I may have to give it a go myself. 

Anyone try this? We aren't leaking there but since amel suggested to do it every few years, I was considering tackling it now that we're in the air. 


--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Re: A54 bow thruster seal replacement?

Mohammad Shirloo
 

Hi Scott;

 

We did replace the seals in 2018 at the Manoel Yard in Malta. We did not have any issues either, but had the seals and the yard replaced them for us. Typically I personally watch any work being done on Kokomo and never have anyone do any work without my own presence. This was one of the jobs that I had to check in on, once in a while, as we had multiple items being worked on at the same time. So, I do not have a good recollection of the steps required.

 

Is there a specific question? I may have the answer or be able to reach out to the yard and get you what you need.

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Scott SV Tengah via groups.io
Sent: Friday, November 27, 2020 9:28 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] A54 bow thruster seal replacement?

 

Has anyone replaced their bow thruster seals on the 54?

We are on the hard and have the parts on hand but the boat yard declined the project so I may have to give it a go myself. 

Anyone try this? We aren't leaking there but since amel suggested to do it every few years, I was considering tackling it now that we're in the air. 


--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


A54 bow thruster seal replacement?

Scott SV Tengah
 

Has anyone replaced their bow thruster seals on the 54?

We are on the hard and have the parts on hand but the boat yard declined the project so I may have to give it a go myself. 

Anyone try this? We aren't leaking there but since amel suggested to do it every few years, I was considering tackling it now that we're in the air. 


--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Re: In mast furler - Brake - Amel 54 + top cap

Stefan Schaufert
 

Dear Porter,

the top cap was a real problem and appr. 2 hours work.
Finally, I hung the lower end of the pipe under the boom so that the top cap is at the bottom.  Then carefully place a screwdriver between the cap and tube and - as carefully as possible with a rubber mallet - hit it down step by step.  The top cap is glued in with silicon or something similar.  So this is not a good, but possibly the only, treatment method and the edges no longer look good.  But the biggest mess was the motor.  There was no water in it, but it was full of gear grease, 2 permanent magnets had come loose and stuck to the rotor, others were loose to the stator, many edges broken. So, if your in mast furler keeps stopping again and again, this can be a good reason.
But the brushes were - contrary to my assumption - ok :-).

Hope it helps.

Best regards
Stefan
A54 #119 Lady Charlyette Luperon, Dominican Republic


Re: In mast furler - Brake - Amel 54

Porter McRoberts
 

Stefan
I am heartily impressed you got the top cap off. How did you do it?  I’d love to know and I know a few other who would too. 

Thanks. 

Porter


Porter McRoberts 
S/V IBIS A54-152
WhatsApp:+1 754 265 2206
Www.fouribis.net

On Nov 26, 2020, at 12:44 PM, Stefan Schaufert <mail@...> wrote:



Dear Amelians,

 

after a lot of work there is still a problem with the brake of the in-mast-furler.

I disassembled the furling unit (it had no water inside; repaired also the motor etc.), but not the brake, completely and reassembled it.

At first the brake was working fine again (clearly clicking when switching). After some trails it stops working. I checked the relay (green, small box) and changed it. It is working (clicking). 

 

I can only assume, the brake is broken/ has a kind off loose contact (perhaps in the wires).

BUT may be there is another reason/ something else from your experiences.

For example Alexander (A54#156) wrote once, „It (the brake) needs a carefull synchronisation with the furler engine.“
What does it mean?

 

Any hints are much appreciated.

 

Best regards 

Stefan

A54 #119 Lady Charlyette currently Luperon, Dominican Republic

<IMG_1369.jpeg>



In mast furler - Brake - Amel 54

Stefan Schaufert
 

Dear Amelians,

 

after a lot of work there is still a problem with the brake of the in-mast-furler.

I disassembled the furling unit (it had no water inside; repaired also the motor etc.), but not the brake, completely and reassembled it.

At first the brake was working fine again (clearly clicking when switching). After some trails it stops working. I checked the relay (green, small box) and changed it. It is working (clicking). 

 

I can only assume, the brake is broken/ has a kind off loose contact (perhaps in the wires).

BUT may be there is another reason/ something else from your experiences.

For example Alexander (A54#156) wrote once, „It (the brake) needs a carefull synchronisation with the furler engine.“
What does it mean?

 

Any hints are much appreciated.

 

Best regards 

Stefan

A54 #119 Lady Charlyette currently Luperon, Dominican Republic




Re: Rudder Stuffing Box Packing Material

rossirossix4
 

Hi Mike,
The Amel packing is impregnated with what looks like PTEF.  Professionals I have talked with recommend some kind of grease.  It helps seal and helps you slide the packing into the gap effectively.  Any excess will be forced out when you tighten the nut down.  Some owners have been challenged with seating 3 layers of the material.  We have had good luck with Starbrite White PTEF Lubricant which we have aboard and use for many things.  If you have easy access to it..... http://www.starbrite.com/item/white-ptef-lubricant
Bob and Suzanne, KAIMI  SM429


Re: Rudder Stuffing Box Packing Material

Mike Longcor (SV Trilogy)
 

Should any grease be used when packing in the new material from Amel?

Cheers,
Mike Longcor
SV Trilogy SM23

On Sat, Nov 14, 2020, 6:54 PM James Alton via groups.io <lokiyawl2=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Paul,

   I wonder if you might have had a deteriorated old style flax packing in your stuffing box?  That material will break down and become weak over time so does tend to break into pcs.  If you use a modern fiber packing I think that you will find that the packing rings will come out in one pc. as it is quite strong.   I am glad to hear that the specialty tool worked better for you. 

James
SV Sueno
Maramu #220

On Nov 13, 2020, at 5:33 PM, Paul Stascavage via groups.io <pstas2003@...> wrote:

James,

I used your suggestion to get the majority of the second ring removed.  It worked, but it was a slow and tedious process as the material was only coming out in pieces,

Dan,

Thank you for referring me to the Palmetto 1101 tool.  I used it today to remove the last 25% of the second ring as well as the third ring.  What took me a few hours was accomplished today in about 15 minutes with this tool.  I highly recommend it.

All the best,


Paul Stascavage
SM #466 - s/v Rita Kathryn
On The Hard - Severn Yachting Center - Hayes, VA


Re: HATCH DOOR REPAIR WITHOUT REMOVING THE HATCH

eric freedman
 

Hi Slavko,

I just put it on with contact cement. I allowed the cement to dry on both surfaces and the carefully applied the laminate. I used a laminate roller, like a paint roller, but much harder, to make sure the laminate was completely secure. Contact cement is very strong and once attached it is almost impossible to remove or change the position.

It has been on for 8-10 years and no problems.

You need to make guides on either side of the area where the companionway enters the slot so you can get a router level and get right to the edge. It is shown in my photos. The rest is rather simple.

 

Fair Winds

Eric

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Slavko Despotovic
Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2020 2:08 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] HATCH DOOR REPAIR WITHOUT REMOVING THE HATCH

 

Hi Eric,

I was thinking to do the same but the carpenter  I asked for advise said that I would need to use a press to glue veneer to the hatch. So hatch have to be removed. How did you do it? It looks great.

Thank you for reply.

Slavko
SM 2000
#279 Bonne Anse in Portoroz


Re: HATCH DOOR REPAIR WITHOUT REMOVING THE HATCH

Slavko Despotovic
 

Hi Eric,

I was thinking to do the same but the carpenter  I asked for advise said that I would need to use a press to glue veneer to the hatch. So hatch have to be removed. How did you do it? It looks great.

Thank you for reply.

Slavko
SM 2000
#279 Bonne Anse in Portoroz


Re: HATCH DOOR REPAIR WITHOUT REMOVING THE HATCH

eric freedman
 

Hi Bill,

No I did not. I used a teak patterned  laminate.  I replaced that veneer 8 years ago and with care it looks great.

I guess in another 5 years I will have to do it again.

But for now I am very happy with my companionway.

Fair Winds

Eric

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of CW Bill Rouse
Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2020 4:49 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io Notification
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] HATCH DOOR REPAIR WITHOUT REMOVING THE HATCH

 

Eric,

 

Did you use 3M pre-glued and prefinished peel & stick veneer?

Bill

CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School

Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 

 

View My Training Calendar

 

 

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 6:24 PM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

This is how I did it on Kimberlite.
I felt it was not necessary to replace the veneer where it cannot be seen.
I just raised the door to its maximum height and removed the old veneer.
Quite simple but takes a bit of time.
Fair Winds
Eric
Amel Super Maramu #376







Re: HATCH DOOR REPAIR WITHOUT REMOVING THE HATCH

 

Eric,

Did you use 3M pre-glued and prefinished peel & stick veneer?

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 6:24 PM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:
This is how I did it on Kimberlite.
I felt it was not necessary to replace the veneer where it cannot be seen.
I just raised the door to its maximum height and removed the old veneer.
Quite simple but takes a bit of time.
Fair Winds
Eric
Amel Super Maramu #376








Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration

michael winand
 

Hi Scott,  in the early days of producing them there were a few issues, these could have been from those. 
I am running a set of 8 g31 in the super maramu. Just coming up to 2 years. Would say around 300 cycles down to 60 to 70 percent. We use around 150amps overnight  
1 freezer. 2 fridge's. 
Recent additions of  1kw of solar see them topped off around 3pm.
Main battery charger is a 120amp quattro.
Alternator is a 150 amp electrodyne  going through a balmar 624.
I have the victron battery balancers. 

They charge fast  i have seen the Alternator put 165amps into the bank. 
You will need to program the charger and Alternator regulator to suit. 
Very low discharge,  left disconnected for 4 months, put the small 15 amp charger on each battery to top off and 15min was all required. 

Like any battery system. It needs to be set-up, monitored, understood. 
Any type can be damaged. 
Lithium  needs low voltage disconnect. 
So far they are going well, probably know if they are living up to their claims in another year of full time cruising. 
Food for thought 
Michael Nebo sm251 



On Tue, 24 Nov 2020 at 2:58 pm, Scott SV Tengah
<Scott.nguyen@...> wrote:
Michael,

I am not sure if they are worse. Given that Jamie was getting below 24 volts overnight after only a year, that sounds pretty bad though. Even our old gel batteries weren't that bad.

My concern with Firefly was that the sales pitch was that you could run them down to low SOC without damaging the battery, but if the voltage sags so much, the batteries may not get damaged, but your boat will not like the low voltage. Therefore the ability to take it to low SOC is only academic.



On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 10:48 AM michael winand via groups.io <mfw642000=yahoo.com.au@groups.io> wrote:
Hi Scott,  would you suggest that the firefly batteries are worse than other lead batteries regarding their voltage drop curve?
I would think that the state of change would have been important to know. 
Thanks  Michael  Nebo sm251 



On Tue, 24 Nov 2020 at 2:23 am, Scott from SV Tengah
Arno,

I think it would be best if Jamie could chime in. He replaced his Fireflies precisely because he experienced severe voltage drop under load, one of the "hidden" downsides of carbon foam. As always, there could have been other confounding factors. That said, I would be careful trusting specs. The Victron Battery Protect should have worked fine on my system but instead melted within a day. 

Regarding gen usage during BT, I spent about a year diagnosing and fixing my BT, so learned a bit more than I ever wanted to know. My understanding is an Amel54 owner experienced a solenoid that melted closed because ohm's law tells us that when voltage drops, amps have to increase to compensate. That owner spun like a top in the marina. That's why Amel suggested that I install an emergency stop switch.  My understanding is that repeated use (think 30 knots on the beam in a tricky marina) will result in cumulative voltage drops so the genset/charger is supposed to help the batteries recover a bit between uses, not replace the batteries.

I considered carbon foam as a cheaper, easier upgrade than lifepo4, but decided against them for the voltage drop issues. 
If you look at the firely SOC vs. voltage curves, you will see that the main benefit of being able to deeply discharge and also not fully recharge is negated by the fact that voltage drops to unacceptable levels at low SOC.

Here's another guy who took the baby step and then ended up going all the way. That said, I understand your use case is primarily marina life, so in your case, I would not get lithium either. Just wanted to make the info available to people who live full time off the grid who think Fireflies are lithium like:
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f14/firefly-oasis-voltage-sag-225444.html#post3002627

Perhaps you will have better success with respect to voltage drops than others who have tried. 



--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Re: SM 2000 autopilot

Rob Smith
 

Thank you Germain


On Mon, 23 Nov 2020, 08:26 Germain Jean-Pierre, <jp.germain45@...> wrote:
Hi Rob,

Disregard the mess... tiny leak now fixed. 

Start with a ss base plate with the bolts welded onto it as per the hydraulic ram base plate. Epoxy the plate to the hull; build up grp layers as shown. 

Remove the bell rank and design a lower L shape lip   Attach the business end of the ram. Install the pump somewhere convenient 

Sorry for the delay

Jean-Pierre Germain, Eleuthera, SM007, NZ






On 20/11/2020, at 10:40 AM, Rob Smith <robfromcornwall.1966@...> wrote:


Thanks for the speedy reply. Some photos would be great. 


On Thu, 19 Nov 2020, 21:38 Germain Jean-Pierre, <jp.germain45@...> wrote:
Hi Rob,

I installed a Raymarine ACP 400 with hydraulic drive through Lecomte & Schmidt hydraulic rams. Works superbly and has been my primary AP for the last 5 years. My 7000 is a backup only. Hydraulic is far smoother. 

One small limitation... due to restrictions of space, the rams only give 22 degrees steering angle to bot P & S. In reality, had no effect on operations. 

I can perhaps send photos...

Jean-Pierre Germain, Eleuthera, SM007, NZ



On 20/11/2020, at 10:05 AM, Rob Smith <robfromcornwall.1966@...> wrote:


Hello I am somebody can help me, I have a Sm #152 and I would like to fit another autopilot directly onto the quadrant. Can anybody help with this? I'd like to know what systems are used on the SM2000.

Regards

Rob Smith
S/Y FORESIGHT 
SM #152


Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration

Scott SV Tengah
 

Michael,

I am not sure if they are worse. Given that Jamie was getting below 24 volts overnight after only a year, that sounds pretty bad though. Even our old gel batteries weren't that bad.

My concern with Firefly was that the sales pitch was that you could run them down to low SOC without damaging the battery, but if the voltage sags so much, the batteries may not get damaged, but your boat will not like the low voltage. Therefore the ability to take it to low SOC is only academic.



On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 10:48 AM michael winand via groups.io <mfw642000=yahoo.com.au@groups.io> wrote:
Hi Scott,  would you suggest that the firefly batteries are worse than other lead batteries regarding their voltage drop curve?
I would think that the state of change would have been important to know. 
Thanks  Michael  Nebo sm251 



On Tue, 24 Nov 2020 at 2:23 am, Scott from SV Tengah
Arno,

I think it would be best if Jamie could chime in. He replaced his Fireflies precisely because he experienced severe voltage drop under load, one of the "hidden" downsides of carbon foam. As always, there could have been other confounding factors. That said, I would be careful trusting specs. The Victron Battery Protect should have worked fine on my system but instead melted within a day. 

Regarding gen usage during BT, I spent about a year diagnosing and fixing my BT, so learned a bit more than I ever wanted to know. My understanding is an Amel54 owner experienced a solenoid that melted closed because ohm's law tells us that when voltage drops, amps have to increase to compensate. That owner spun like a top in the marina. That's why Amel suggested that I install an emergency stop switch.  My understanding is that repeated use (think 30 knots on the beam in a tricky marina) will result in cumulative voltage drops so the genset/charger is supposed to help the batteries recover a bit between uses, not replace the batteries.

I considered carbon foam as a cheaper, easier upgrade than lifepo4, but decided against them for the voltage drop issues. 
If you look at the firely SOC vs. voltage curves, you will see that the main benefit of being able to deeply discharge and also not fully recharge is negated by the fact that voltage drops to unacceptable levels at low SOC.

Here's another guy who took the baby step and then ended up going all the way. That said, I understand your use case is primarily marina life, so in your case, I would not get lithium either. Just wanted to make the info available to people who live full time off the grid who think Fireflies are lithium like:
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f14/firefly-oasis-voltage-sag-225444.html#post3002627

Perhaps you will have better success with respect to voltage drops than others who have tried. 



--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com

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