main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io

Impeller Puller Tool

gwollenberg <bozocinq@...>

#3235

I am looking for information on who to contact to acquirer the Impeller
Puller Tool shown in the photo section. Thankyou

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] davits on 54

Hugh Levins <hlevins@...>

#3234

Martin,

I saw Caducius exhibited at Southampton last week - very nice!

Can you please send me the davits photo? Is the trim visibly affected by combined weight - davits/tender/outboard? It would be interesting also to get photo and more info on the fibreglass arch.

Hugh

Show quoted text

----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Martin Bevan 
  To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2007 11:31 PM
  Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] davits on 54

  We took delivery of Amel 54 No 56, Caduceus, in May 2007 and are delighted with it.

  We took the only davit option currently offered, the SL electric. We like them and they are easy to use. Do note however that they are placed on the outside of the stern and are hence a longer distance apart than on many other 54 footers. We have a Southern Pacific Shearwater 3.2m dinghy that was bought because of its light weight, and it just fits, anything smaller would have been a problem. Anything too much bigger would also be a problem as it would be wider than the stern. The davits are definately overkill for this size of dinghy but they do work well.

  The attached photograph may help explain. If it does not arrive due to Yahoo, let me know and I will send it directly to your email.

  The main difficulty that we have encountered is that we cannot raise the dinghy fully, for travelling, with the outboard in situ. This would have required a larger dinghy which as I have explained, we did not want. 

  We have seen other 54's fitted with a white fibreglass arch that supports dinghy davits and provides a platform for solar panels, wind generators etc. These are not either supplied by Amel or approved and have been fitted elsewhere. We cannot help with any further information, perhaps other owners can?

  Hope that this helps.

  Regards,

  Martin and Elizabeth Bevan

  ----- Original Message ----
  From: Laurens & Rineke <laurens@fun4two.nl>
  To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
  Sent: Monday, 10 September, 2007 10:10:19 PM
  Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] davits on 54

  Does anyone has experience with the electrical or manual davits on 
  the new 54 offered by Amel ?
  Due to the fact we will get ours delivered beginning next year we're 
  looking for more info about this practical option.
  Think they will be very handsome in overall use but we also have the 
  opinion that they give this beautiful 54 a bit ugly look.
  Will be very thankful for all tips, experiences and suggestions 
  regarding the 54

  Good winds
  Laurens & Rineke Vos

  A special place, for special people:
  www.fun4two. com

  __________________________________________________________ 
  Want ideas for reducing your carbon footprint? Visit Yahoo! For Good http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/forgood/environment.html

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SLAPPING NOISE IN REAR CABIN

Peps <dji314@...>

#3233

I would like to know if the slapping noise in the rear cabin is as annoying on the 54 as it is on a super maramu.
Can a 54 user who also know the SM (I guess many do) comment on this?
Georges Pellegrini

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] davits on 54

Martin Bevan <yachtcaduceus@...>

#3232

We took delivery of Amel 54 No 56, Caduceus, in May 2007 and are delighted with it.

We took the only davit option currently offered, the SL electric.  We like them and they are easy to use.  Do note however that they are placed on the outside of the stern and are hence a longer distance apart than on many other 54 footers.  We have a Southern Pacific Shearwater 3.2m dinghy that was bought because of its light weight, and it just fits, anything smaller would have been a problem.  Anything too much bigger would also be a problem as it would be wider than the stern.  The davits are definately overkill for this size of dinghy but they do work well.

The attached photograph may help explain.  If it does not arrive due to Yahoo, let me know and I will send it directly to your email.

The main difficulty that we have encountered is that we cannot raise the dinghy fully, for travelling, with the outboard in situ.  This would have required a larger dinghy which as I have explained, we did not want. 

We have seen other 54's fitted with a white fibreglass arch that supports dinghy davits and provides a platform for solar panels, wind generators etc.  These are not either supplied by Amel or approved and have been fitted elsewhere.  We cannot help with any further information, perhaps other owners can?

Hope that this helps.

Regards,

Martin and Elizabeth Bevan

Show quoted text

----- Original Message ----
From: Laurens & Rineke <laurens@fun4two.nl>
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, 10 September, 2007 10:10:19 PM
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] davits on 54

Does anyone has experience with the electrical or manual davits on 
the new 54 offered by Amel ?
Due to the fact we will get ours delivered beginning next year we're 
looking for more info about this practical option.
Think they will be very handsome in overall use but we also have the 
opinion that they give this beautiful 54 a bit ugly look.
Will be very thankful for all tips, experiences and suggestions 
regarding the 54

Good winds
Laurens & Rineke Vos

A special place, for special people:
www.fun4two. com

      ___________________________________________________________ 
Want ideas for reducing your carbon footprint? Visit Yahoo! For Good  http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/forgood/environment.html

Bottom paint

drdavegoodman

#3231

Thank you all for your words of advice on bottom painting.  I have
posted your messages below and started a new topic called "bottom paint."

To my knowlege, there are no blisters on the hull and the hull/keel
joint is sound with any evidence of damage.  I have no intention of
removing the keel.  The boat has 8 years of bottom paint which I plan
to sand off, carefully, without damaging the gel coat.  My inquiry had
mostly to do with determining any group concensus about putting a
barrier coat on the hull.
The group's responses have been varied and helpful.  I wonder if there
is any reason to put a barrier coat over the iron keel??  Limiting the
barrier coat to only the fiberglass section of the hull seems to make
sense, but this is a project I've never done before, hence the inquiry.
Dave

   [[[  Dave,
    When you ask "If the barrier coat between the keel and hull is in
    good condition", and also note Joel's advice on refinishing the cast
    iron keel, it sounds like you're removing the keel,(the only way to
    see if there's barrier coat between the keel and hull).

    Unless you've got some bad damage, this seems a pretty drastic and
    unnecessary maintenance item. Also, I doubt that Amel would have used
    a barrier coat on the underside of the fiberglass keel stub/water
    tank sump.

    OTOH, perhaps you are making a distinction between two sections of
    the fiberglass hull, that is, between a.)the fiberglass hull
    structure from the water line down to where it turns straight down on
    the side of the keel stub/tank sump and b.)the fiberglass hull
    structure from that turning point at the top of the keel stub down to
    the cast iron shoe plate.

    If so, it sound like you have observed barrier coat on b.) but not on
    a.) - which seems a bit odd.

    Be that as it may, if you're going to strip the entire fiberglass
    hull (from waterline to the top of the cast iron keel, you'll
    certainly be removing the barrier coat (if there is any on your
    section b.)

    With the fantastic history of Amels not blistering, you might simply
    skip the barrier coat altogether. Of course, you'll want to
    chemically stip, rather than sanding so you don't affect the
    integrity of the gel coat. (If you did, adding a barrier case would
    seem prudent, indeed.)

    I stripped my boat down to bare fiberglass 8 years ago (same "caking"
    of old paint you described), and did apply barrier coat plus bottom
    paint with super results. Of course, whether it's the super quality
    of Amel's fiberglass (I've read that'ol Henri was nicknamed
    the "father of fiberglass" in France) - or the barrier coat that has
    kept the blisters away is anybody's guess. I'd bet on the former,
    but wearing both belts and suspenders is fine.

    As to primer, just follow your paint manufacturer's instructions - as
    Joel says, "Read the instructions and read 'em again."

    Good luck with your project.

    Cheers,
    Craig, s/v Sangaris - Santorin #62

    Back to top
    Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post
    Messages in this topic (16)
1b.
    Re: Amel Keel - & Bottom Painting
    Posted by: "BeyersWF" BeyersWF@aol.com   crashbeyers
    Mon Sep 24, 2007 7:02 pm (PST)
    Folks, et al,

    I have a 1982 Mango, hull N&#226;&#8212;&#166; 29 which I bought in 2000. I&#226;&#8364;&#8482;m
the third owner after the original owner was a Greek and sailed
extensively in the Med. The second owner was a Brit who sailed all
over the Med and Atlantic, cruising and racing. Upon reaching the
Caribbean, he decided to sell her. I bought her in Ft. Lauderdale, NOT
FROM POTTER! After six months of waiting for a non-reply, I contacted
other brokers. I was chasing an Amel for two years.

    Enough of that. The surveyor at the time of purchase said I had
micro-blisters and to use that [as well as a few other findings to
negotiate with]. But no big deal. He asked where I would be birthing
her. I said the Chesapeake Bay, Oh, he advised then that I would have
to address the blisters within three to five years. Yep, after four
years, I had to address them. I could get a non-guarantee job [gouging
out each blister and patching] or get a guaranteed job for a lot more
bucks. Long story short, I took the high dollar option since
&#226;&#8364;&#339;Windrush&#226;&#8364; is my home. They ground the outer layer of gel coat and
glass off the hull and replaced it. I visited her once a week to
caress her on the hard, so I observed the work. The keel bulb was not
removed and according to the marina, no work at the keel bulb and keel
interface was required. Blisters will happen! It is the nature of
glass and its environment over time. I also had a Max Prop added just
for fun while in the yard.

    I always have two coats of bottom paint put on her and it lasts
for about two years here in the Bay. This may not be much help to you;
but, it gave me a venue to brag. If you are really, really concerned
about the keel bulb, you may want the keel bulb bolts checked for wear
and corrosion. The bolts will have to be removed one at a time to
evaluate their condition. I doubt that any problem will be discovered.
The Amels are built like M1-A1 Abrams tanks.

    AE,

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] RE:[Amel Keel

Richard Piller <richard03801@...>

#3230

Dave, given tthat Amel changed the resen mix in the
prior to your boat being built there is no real need
to strip and use a barrier coat.  Regarding the keel
to hull joint area that is not normally a big deal
unless there is some damage to joint.

I don't know the area of the hull out however be sure
the air temp is over 50 F when you paint.  IF you do
remove all the old paint be very careful not to in
harm the gelcoat.  If you do then use a good barrier
coat.  If you don't don't... 

The more important issue what kind of paint is on the
bottom...  be sure that what you plan to use is ok
with what is there.

Good luck
Richard SM 209

--- drdavegoodman <drdavegoodman@gmail.com> wrote:

I will be hauling out in November to redo bottom
paint on a 1998 SM
#230. I have read the postings about the iron keel,
hull, general
absence of blisters on Amel's.  Joel's comments
regarding taking
special care when preparing and painting the keel
are duely noted. 
When I purchased the boat in April this year, the
surveyor recommended
removing the old layers of bottom paint prior to
repainting, as past
uneven hard bottom paint application has resulted in
an uneven
surface.  Others have suggested that if I was going
to do that, I
might as well apply an epoxy barrier coat prior to
repainting.  The
boat has been in the Caribbean its entire life.  I
plan to sail up the
East Coast of US next year, and also perhaps to Med.
 My questions
are:  If the barrier coat between keel and hull is
in good condition,
is any addtional barrier coat needed?  And/or,
regardless of the
condition of the barrier coat between keel and hull,
is it a good idea
to put a barrier coat on the below waterline hull? 
What about use of
a primer?  Any other thoughts on the matter?
Thanks
Dave
s/v Bel Ami
SM#230



      ____________________________________________________________________________________
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sink/Shower grey water

Judy Rouse

#3229

Hugh,

Yes, it is possible to achieve an almost empty bilge with the manual
bilge pump; but several times we have manually pumped the bilge too
dry, causing the pump to lose its prime.  Not a big deal and easily
corrected by simply priming the pump, but not something Bill likes
dealing with.  We do make certain the bilge is as empty as possible
and we add a cap full of bilge cleaner before setting out to sea.
This prevents any bilge smell from backing up through the aft shower
drain which can happen after a couple of days in rough seas if
attention is not paid to this in advance.

My only complaint with the arrangement is that, IMHO, one must be very
careful about not allowing any food to drain through the galley sink.
 We have a stainless strainer with tiny diameter holes which we leave
in place at all times in the galley sink, just like we did in our land
home.  Canned foods are never drained into the sink and food residue
on all dishes and pots are wiped with paper towels before washing.
Leftover milk in cereal bowls is flushed down the head; simple
cleaning routines such as this.  No food is intentionally allowed down
the sink drain.  Others we know living on the same model boat do not
take these precautions; they do drain canned food down the galley sink
with no ill effects to the bilge pump.  I am probably over-doing this
but I don't want any food particles or residue to enter the bilge if
it can be avoided. The dead skin cells and soap residue that collect
in the bilge smell bad enough whenever we open up the bilge to clean
it; don't want to also add food into that mix.  The white plastic
shower strainers in the heads are cleaned at least once per week to
remove any hair and soap build-up.  Showers drain fine and there is no
smell in the heads.

Following these simple housecleaning tasks, the drain arrangement as
designed by Amel causes no problems whatsoever.  And, as Ian pointed
out, we don't have to listen to (and maintain) additional pumps.  We
like the Amel system and prefer it to the noisy shower pumps we had on
our previous boat.

FWIW, we completely empty and clean the bilge about once every six
months. A wet/dry van assists in this task.  Not sure why we do this;
just like cleaning things I guess.

Judy
S/V BeBe
Amel SM2 #387

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "Hugh Levins" <hlevins@...> wrote:

Judy, are you not able to achieve an (almost) empty bilge with themanual bilge pump?

Hugh

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] RE: Amel Keel - & Bottom Painting

BeyersWF

#3228

Folks, et al,

            I have a 1982 Mango, hull N◦ 29 which I bought in 2000.  I’m the third owner after the original owner was a Greek and sailed extensively in the Med.  The second owner was a Brit who sailed all over the Med and Atlantic, cruising and racing.  Upon reaching the Caribbean, he decided to sell her.  I bought her in Ft. Lauderdale, NOT FROM POTTER!  After six months of waiting for a non-reply, I contacted other brokers.  I was chasing an Amel for two years.



            Enough of that.  The surveyor at the time of purchase said I had micro-blisters and to use that [as well as a few other findings to negotiate with].  But no big deal.  He asked where I would be birthing her.  I said the Chesapeake Bay, Oh, he advised then that I would have to address the blisters within three to five years.  Yep, after four years, I had to address them.  I could get a non-guarantee job [gouging out each blister and patching] or get a guaranteed job for a lot more bucks.  Long story short, I took the high dollar option since “Windrush” is my home.  They ground the outer layer of gel coat and glass off the hull and replaced it.  I visited her once a week to caress her on the hard, so I observed the work.  The keel bulb was not removed and according to the marina, no work at the keel bulb and keel interface was required.  Blisters will happen!  It is the nature of glass and its environment over time.  I also had a Max Prop added just for fun while in the yard.



            I always have two coats of bottom paint put on her and it lasts for about two years here in the Bay.  This may not be much help to you; but, it gave me a venue to brag.  If you are really, really concerned about the keel bulb, you may want the keel bulb bolts checked for wear and corrosion.  The bolts will have to be removed one at a time to evaluate their condition.  I doubt that any problem will be discovered.  The Amels are built like M1-A1 Abrams tanks.



AE,

Crash [wings, wheels and rotors – I’ve busted at least one of each]



From: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com [mailto:amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Craig & Katherine
Sent: Monday, September 24, 2007 11:20 AM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] RE: Amel Keel - & Bottom Painting



Dave,
When you ask "If the barrier coat between the keel and hull is in
good condition", and also note Joel's advice on refinishing the cast
iron keel, it sounds like you're removing the keel,(the only way to
see if there's barrier coat between the keel and hull).

Unless you've got some bad damage, this seems a pretty drastic and
unnecessary maintenance item. Also, I doubt that Amel would have used
a barrier coat on the underside of the fiberglass keel stub/water
tank sump.

OTOH, perhaps you are making a distinction between two sections of
the fiberglass hull, that is, between a.)the fiberglass hull
structure from the water line down to where it turns straight down on
the side of the keel stub/tank sump and b.)the fiberglass hull
structure from that turning point at the top of the keel stub down to
the cast iron shoe plate.

If so, it sound like you have observed barrier coat on b.) but not on
a.) - which seems a bit odd.

Be that as it may, if you're going to strip the entire fiberglass
hull (from waterline to the top of the cast iron keel, you'll
certainly be removing the barrier coat (if there is any on your
section b.)

With the fantastic history of Amels not blistering, you might simply
skip the barrier coat altogether. Of course, you'll want to
chemically stip, rather than sanding so you don't affect the
integrity of the gel coat. (If you did, adding a barrier case would
seem prudent, indeed.)

I stripped my boat down to bare fiberglass 8 years ago (same "caking"
of old paint you described), and did apply barrier coat plus bottom
paint with super results. Of course, whether it's the super quality
of Amel's fiberglass (I've read that'ol Henri was nicknamed
the "father of fiberglass" in France) - or the barrier coat that has
kept the blisters away is anybody's guess. I'd bet on the former,
but wearing both belts and suspenders is fine.

As to primer, just follow your paint manufacturer's instructions - as
Joel says, "Read the instructions and read 'em again."

Good luck with your project.

Cheers,
Craig, s/v Sangaris - Santorin #62




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] RE: Amel Keel - & Bottom Painting

Craig Briggs

#3227

Dave,
When you ask "If the barrier coat between the keel and hull is in
good condition", and also note Joel's advice on refinishing the cast
iron keel, it sounds like you're removing the keel,(the only way to
see if there's barrier coat between the keel and hull).

Unless you've got some bad damage, this seems a pretty drastic and
unnecessary maintenance item. Also, I doubt that Amel would have used
a barrier coat on the underside of the fiberglass keel stub/water
tank sump.

OTOH, perhaps you are making a distinction between two sections of
the fiberglass hull, that is, between a.)the fiberglass hull
structure from the water line down to where it turns straight down on
the side of the keel stub/tank sump and b.)the fiberglass hull
structure from that turning point at the top of the keel stub down to
the cast iron shoe plate.

If so, it sound like you have observed barrier coat on b.) but not on
a.) - which seems a bit odd.

Be that as it may, if you're going to strip the entire fiberglass
hull (from waterline to the top of the cast iron keel, you'll
certainly be removing the barrier coat (if there is any on your
section b.)

With the fantastic history of Amels not blistering, you might simply
skip the barrier coat altogether. Of course, you'll want to
chemically stip, rather than sanding so you don't affect the
integrity of the gel coat. (If you did, adding a barrier case would 
seem prudent, indeed.)

I stripped my boat down to bare fiberglass 8 years ago (same "caking"
of old paint you described), and did apply barrier coat plus bottom
paint with super results. Of course, whether it's the super quality
of Amel's fiberglass (I've read that'ol Henri was nicknamed
the "father of fiberglass" in France) - or the barrier coat that has
kept the blisters away is anybody's guess.  I'd bet on the former,
but wearing both belts and suspenders is fine.

As to primer, just follow your paint manufacturer's instructions - as
Joel says, "Read the instructions and read 'em again."

Good luck with your project.

Cheers,
  Craig, s/v Sangaris - Santorin #62

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sink/Shower grey water

Hugh Levins <hlevins@...>

#3226

Greetings Roger,

I confirm that Judy's response answered my question, as the question was intended. But, thank you for your considered response to the original post.

I am heartened that Judy, Ian, and Serge are satisfied with the yard's drains arrangement.

Judy, are you not able to achieve an (almost) empty bilge with the manual bilge pump?

Hugh

Show quoted text

----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Roger Banks 
  To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Friday, September 21, 2007 1:37 PM
  Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sink/Shower grey water


  Hi Ian

  I would agree with you and Judy if the original post was about what 
  you are suggesting, but I read it differently and was awaiting his 
  clarification.

  By the way, on my Mango, the sink and basins empty through the side, 
  above the water line, and only the shower goes into the sump by 
  gravity and is emptied by the bilge pump. I once gave consideration 
  to recycling and it was from that experience I responded; I realized 
  I am well off with the Mango arrangement, and could be more so with 
  yours as you get even more soap regularly neutralizing any bilge 
  greases. Not sure about food scraps from the sink though, sounds 
  disgusting and likely to clog the bilge pump; no wonder Judy reports 
  have to clean out the sump which i don't seem to need to do.

  I really don't think it's in the spirit of a forum to browbeat other 
  respondents, which is likely to frighten them away (not me though, no 
  worries). Wish I'd had the same level of response when I requested 
  the section diameter of the forestay recently (twice).

  Regards, Roger, Mango 28 Zorba

  On 21/09/2007, at 4:28 PM, Ian Shepherd wrote:

  > Hi Roger,
  >
  > I am afraid that I am also totally confused by your posts. You seem 
  > to be
  > confusing two separate areas of marine operation. I too have a 
  > Super Maramu
  > and have had no problems at all with the great water bilge 
  > arrangement. It's
  > a blessing to have the shower water go to the grey water bilge by 
  > gravity
  > rather than run noisy pump out motors. My only complaint about the 
  > system is
  > that if you forget to operate the manual override switch before 
  > docking, it
  > can pump out a full bilge when you are not expecting it and in full 
  > view of
  > the marina. It would have been better to have an 'off' switch as well.
  >
  > Having spent much time travelling into Australia, I can understand 
  > the over
  > reaction of the Australian Authorities. From what you say, throwing 
  > scraps
  > of food over the side to feed the fish may also be a health hazard! 
  > Not in
  > most parts of the world Mate!
  >
  > Cheers
  >
  > Ian SM 414 Crusader
  >
  > -------Original Message-------
  >
  > From: Roger Banks
  > Date: 09/20/07 22:29:18
  > To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
  > Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sink/Shower grey water
  >
  > Aggression I can do without, thanks, go jump down someone else's
  > throat. Clearly you didn't read my post or spend a moment thinking
  > about it.
  >
  > In Australia at least, recycling sink water containing any food is
  > considered a health risk without treatment, so needs to be let go. So
  > the question is whether to capture & recycle shower & basin water or
  > not. Desalinators like to be run as much as possible (see earlier
  > posts), thus giving fresh water for washing/showering. QED.
  >
  > Regards, Roger, Mango 28 Zorba
  >
  > On 21/09/2007, at 3:51 AM, Judy wrote:
  >
  > > I am totally confused by your response regarding grey water. Perhaps
  > > the term needs to be defined. The only marine definition of grey
  > > water that I am familiar with is the water run-off from the showers
  > > and sinks in the head and the galley sink. Toilet water is termed
  > > black water. At least those are the commonly used definitions of 
  > grey
  > > water and black water in the marine industry in the US. In parts of
  > > the Great Lakes, for example, release of any grey water is 
  > banned. In
  > > all US waters the release of black water is banned.
  > >
  > > Please explain how using a desalinator avoids the sludge in the 
  > bilge.
  > >
  > > As to the original question, we have experienced no problems with 
  > grey
  > > water going to the sump bilge on our Super Maramu. We have not used
  > > nylon stockings or other secondary filtration methods. If not 
  > cleaned
  > > frequently, the sump bilge will stink to high heaven. It must be
  > > cleaned periodically. We have encountered no problems in function 
  > with
  > > the sump bilge as designed by Amel. The original poster might 
  > want to
  > > invest in a wet/dry vac to make cleaning this bilge an easy job.
  > >
  > > Judy
  > > S/V BeBe
  > > Amel SM2 #387
  > >
  > > --- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, Roger Banks 
  > <roger.banks@...>
  > > wrote:
  > > >
  > > > Hi Hugh
  > > >
  > > > I considered the subject but abandoned it when I recalled that 
  > grey
  > > > water is used mainly to flush toilets and water gardens, the 
  > former
  > > > being done with sea water and the latter hardly applies. Use a
  > > > desalinator and avoid all that sludge in your bilges.
  > > >
  > > > Regards, Roger, Mango 28 Zorba
  > >
  > > >
  > >
  > >
  > >
  >
  > 
  >
  >
  >
  >
  >
  > 
  >
  >
  >

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] RE:[Amel Keel

drdavegoodman

#3225

I will be hauling out in November to redo bottom paint on a 1998 SM
#230. I have read the postings about the iron keel, hull, general
absence of blisters on Amel's.  Joel's comments regarding taking
special care when preparing and painting the keel are duely noted.
When I purchased the boat in April this year, the surveyor recommended
removing the old layers of bottom paint prior to repainting, as past
uneven hard bottom paint application has resulted in an uneven
surface.  Others have suggested that if I was going to do that, I
might as well apply an epoxy barrier coat prior to repainting.  The
boat has been in the Caribbean its entire life.  I plan to sail up the
East Coast of US next year, and also perhaps to Med.  My questions
are:  If the barrier coat between keel and hull is in good condition,
is any addtional barrier coat needed?  And/or, regardless of the
condition of the barrier coat between keel and hull, is it a good idea
to put a barrier coat on the below waterline hull?  What about use of
a primer?  Any other thoughts on the matter?
Thanks
Dave
s/v Bel Ami
SM#230

grey water -electronics

Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...>

#3224

Grey water: On my Mango #51, the kitchen sinks empty overboard, while only grey water from the heads empty in the bilge. In accordance with Amel's recommendation a few capfull of bilge soap once a month seems to keep the bilge odor free. Of course large stainless mesh filters at the base of the shower drain retain any large residue of grey water, and particularly hair...
 
  Forward stay size: I am presently at home in Montréal and my boat (ketch rig) is in Martinique so I cannot help as to the size of my stay... but I am shure Rodger's mango would have originally been equipped with Sarma rigging, wich was used by Amel in 1980 and easily recognisible by the engraving of the date of frabrication of the stay and lenght on the base bolt of each stay. If Rodger's mango still has this rigging, the size of the existing rigging is good. However when in was in the port of Marseille in 2005, I met Mr Gateff ceo of the sailmaker for Amel who installed a new genoa on my boat, and he  cautioned me very strongly as to furling the genoa the wrong way, that is in the same direction as the strands of the stay. He also advised that the genoa should never be used, even partially furled in winds in excess of 35 knots and that beyond that speed, damage  is often caused to the furler extrusion tube either about 5 feet above the furling gearbox or immediately
 above it and of course to stay, just above the lower terminal. Finally upon installing the new sail, Gateff noticed that the 2 sticks,  called "cornes" in french (it could be "horns" in english), and screwed on the top swivel were damaged.  I replaced same, as Gateff indicated that not only they were key to the proper operation of the furling system, but also, in the absence of one of the horns,  the upper terminal of the forward stay could be damaged. When I purchased my boat in 2005, I noticed that the headstay had been recently changed and the furler extrusion repaired by welding 1 meter from the furling gear... Asto the diameter of Roger's stay, 1)I believe that when putting down my rigging for the hurricane season, my forward stay was the same size as that I have seen on a SuperMaramu, 2) a simple call or e-mail to Amel in Larochelle or Hyère will provide the definitive answer!

  Autopilot: I have a Neco system which has been properly serviced and maitained, but it is not very efficient, draining some 6 amp and constanly  moving. In 2005 I installed a strong metal extension on the top of the rudder post as well as a type 2 electrical linear drive to control the rudder right under the aft cabin bed and seat. The Autohelm 7000st was used for an Atlantic crossing this year, and has proven to be very efficient, and in case of problem with the Autohelm, the Neco cans be switched on...

  Radio communications antennas: many Amel are equipped with a whip antenna for HF radio. I had one on a previous boat and found it anoying and it would be difficult to install on my Mango because of the davit which alows the dinghy to be stored flat on the side at the rear of the boat.
  On my Mango I have 2 HF rig, one the Icom 710 drives thru a 130 icom tuner one isolated backstay of the mitzen mast, the second a Icom 706 MkII drives the other isolated bakstay for the same mast, thru a SG237 tuner. Of course I cannot operate both rigs simutaneously, but they function well and particularly the 706, many times in conditions where other ham stations close to mine cannot connect.

  Serge D Tremblay, Mango#51


---------------------------------
 Obtenez des réponses à vos questions ! Profitez des connaissances et des opinions des internautes sur Yahoo! Questions/Réponses.

OWNERS IN ANNAPOLIS

dan_bergin <captdan@...>

#3223

Any owners in Annapolis?  I am here for my USNA 25th reunion and would
love to see your boat to get some ideas on my refit in progress on my
2001 SM#317.  THANKS.  Cell is the best as I will only be in town til
Monday.
Dan Bergin
801-556-7858

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sink/Shower grey water

Roger Banks <roger.banks@...>

#3221

Hi Ian

I would agree with you and Judy if the original post was about what  
you are suggesting, but I read it differently and was awaiting his  
clarification.

By the way, on my Mango, the sink and basins empty through the side,  
above the water line, and only the shower goes into the sump by  
gravity and is emptied by the bilge pump. I once gave consideration  
to recycling and it was from that experience I responded; I realized  
I am well off with the Mango arrangement, and could be more so with  
yours as you get even more soap regularly neutralizing any bilge  
greases. Not sure about food scraps from the sink though, sounds  
disgusting and likely to clog the bilge pump; no wonder Judy reports  
have to clean out the sump which i don't seem to need to do.

I really don't think it's in the spirit of a forum to browbeat other  
respondents, which is likely to frighten them away (not me though, no  
worries). Wish I'd had the same level of response when I requested  
the section diameter of the forestay recently (twice).

Regards, Roger, Mango 28 Zorba

Show quoted text

On 21/09/2007, at 4:28 PM, Ian Shepherd wrote:

Hi Roger,

I am afraid that I am also totally confused by your posts. You seem  
to be
confusing two separate areas of marine operation. I too have a  
Super Maramu
and have had no problems at all with the great water bilge  
arrangement. It's
a blessing to have the shower water go to the grey water bilge by  
gravity
rather than run noisy pump out motors. My only complaint about the  
system is
that if you forget to operate the manual override switch before  
docking, it
can pump out a full bilge when you are not expecting it and in full  
view of
the marina. It would have been better to have an 'off' switch as well.

Having spent much time travelling into Australia, I can understand  
the over
reaction of the Australian Authorities. From what you say, throwing  
scraps
of food over the side to feed the fish may also be a health hazard!  
Not in
most parts of the world Mate!

Cheers

Ian SM 414 Crusader

-------Original Message-------

From: Roger Banks
Date: 09/20/07 22:29:18
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sink/Shower grey water

Aggression I can do without, thanks, go jump down someone else's
throat. Clearly you didn't read my post or spend a moment thinking
about it.

In Australia at least, recycling sink water containing any food is
considered a health risk without treatment, so needs to be let go. So
the question is whether to capture & recycle shower & basin water or
not. Desalinators like to be run as much as possible (see earlier
posts), thus giving fresh water for washing/showering. QED.

Regards, Roger, Mango 28 Zorba

On 21/09/2007, at 3:51 AM, Judy wrote:

I am totally confused by your response regarding grey water. Perhaps
the term needs to be defined. The only marine definition of grey
water that I am familiar with is the water run-off from the showers
and sinks in the head and the galley sink. Toilet water is termed
black water. At least those are the commonly used definitions of  grey
water and black water in the marine industry in the US. In parts of
the Great Lakes, for example, release of any grey water is  banned. In
all US waters the release of black water is banned.

Please explain how using a desalinator avoids the sludge in the  bilge.

As to the original question, we have experienced no problems with  grey
water going to the sump bilge on our Super Maramu. We have not used
nylon stockings or other secondary filtration methods. If not  cleaned
frequently, the sump bilge will stink to high heaven. It must be
cleaned periodically. We have encountered no problems in function  with
the sump bilge as designed by Amel. The original poster might  want to
invest in a wet/dry vac to make cleaning this bilge an easy job.

Judy
S/V BeBe
Amel SM2 #387

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, Roger Banks  <roger.banks@...>
wrote:

Hi Hugh

I considered the subject but abandoned it when I recalled that  grey
water is used mainly to flush toilets and water gardens, the  former
being done with sea water and the latter hardly applies. Use a
desalinator and avoid all that sludge in your bilges.

Regards, Roger, Mango 28 Zorba

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sink/Shower grey water

dlm48@...

#3222

DOWN BOY!!!
 
The only angry aggressive response i have seen is yours - perhaps you want  
to take a chill pill OR write in a more lucid and understandable manner.   Have 
you ever considered that the reason you are not getting the  'right' 
responses is that your are posting in a manner that is somewhat  confusing - QED
 
regards
 
David

Show quoted text

In a message dated 20/09/2007 23:27:00 GMT Daylight Time,  
roger.banks@mac.com writes:

Aggression I can do without, thanks, go jump down someone else's  
throat. Clearly you didn't read my post or spend a moment thinking  
about it.

In Australia at least, recycling sink water containing  any food is 
considered a health risk without treatment, so needs to be let  go. So 
the question is whether to capture & recycle shower & basin  water or 
not. Desalinators like to be run as much as possible (see earlier  
posts), thus giving fresh water for washing/showering.  QED.

Regards, Roger, Mango 28 Zorba

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sink/Shower grey water

Ian Shepherd

#3220

Hi Roger,

I am afraid that I am also totally confused by your posts. You seem to be
confusing two separate areas of marine operation. I too have a Super Maramu
and have had no problems at all with the great water bilge arrangement. It's
a blessing to have the shower water go to the grey water bilge by gravity
rather than run noisy pump out motors. My only complaint about the system is
that if you forget to operate the manual override switch before docking, it
can pump out a full bilge when you are not expecting it and in full view of
the marina. It would have been better to have an 'off' switch as well.

Having spent much time travelling into Australia, I can understand the over
reaction of the Australian Authorities. From what you say, throwing scraps
of food over the side to feed the fish may also be a health hazard! Not in
most parts of the world Mate!

Cheers

Ian SM 414 Crusader

Show quoted text

-------Original Message-------

From: Roger Banks
Date: 09/20/07 22:29:18
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sink/Shower grey water

Aggression I can do without, thanks, go jump down someone else's 
throat. Clearly you didn't read my post or spend a moment thinking 
about it.

In Australia at least, recycling sink water containing any food is 
considered a health risk without treatment, so needs to be let go. So 
the question is whether to capture & recycle shower & basin water or 
not. Desalinators like to be run as much as possible (see earlier 
posts), thus giving fresh water for washing/showering. QED.

Regards, Roger, Mango 28 Zorba

On 21/09/2007, at 3:51 AM, Judy wrote:

I am totally confused by your response regarding grey water. Perhaps
the term needs to be defined. The only marine definition of grey
water that I am familiar with is the water run-off from the showers
and sinks in the head and the galley sink. Toilet water is termed
black water. At least those are the commonly used definitions of grey
water and black water in the marine industry in the US. In parts of
the Great Lakes, for example, release of any grey water is banned. In
all US waters the release of black water is banned.

Please explain how using a desalinator avoids the sludge in the bilge.

As to the original question, we have experienced no problems with grey
water going to the sump bilge on our Super Maramu. We have not used
nylon stockings or other secondary filtration methods. If not cleaned
frequently, the sump bilge will stink to high heaven. It must be
cleaned periodically. We have encountered no problems in function with
the sump bilge as designed by Amel. The original poster might want to
invest in a wet/dry vac to make cleaning this bilge an easy job.

Judy
S/V BeBe
Amel SM2 #387

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, Roger Banks <roger.banks@...>
wrote:

Hi Hugh

I considered the subject but abandoned it when I recalled that grey
water is used mainly to flush toilets and water gardens, the former
being done with sea water and the latter hardly applies. Use a
desalinator and avoid all that sludge in your bilges.

Regards, Roger, Mango 28 Zorba

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sink/Shower grey water

Judy Rouse

#3219

Sorry if you thought my first posting was aggressive because that was
not the intent.  But your second posting has me just as totally
confused as your first.  I have read both several times and do not
understand what you are saying as regards grey water in an Amel.  The
original poster inquired about the Amel standard method of draining
shower and sink water (grey water) into what we call the sump bilge.
He did not mention anything about desalination and I truly don't see
how desalination has anything to do with how the shower and sink
drain-off water is handled.  I understand his question to be whether
there is a better method of handling this grey water than the standard
manner in which Amel boats are plumbed to drain to the sump bilge. 

Others in the past have posted that they use secondary filtration
systems to prevent small items of trash from entering the sump bilge.
 We have had no problems with this and do not use a secondary
filtration system of any kind.  Our previous boat drained the galley
sink grey water directly overboard without any pump required, and had
sump pumps to drain the shower and head sink grey water overboard.
Perhaps the original poster was thinking of a similar arrangement, but
our experience with the way Amel does the system of handling grey
water is better than our last boat because the Amel requires only one
sump pump instead of two or more.

Perhaps the original poster could clarify his query.

Judy
S/V BeBe
Amel SM2 #387

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, Roger Banks <roger.banks@...>
wrote:

Aggression I can do without, thanks, go jump down someone else's
throat. Clearly you didn't read my post or spend a moment thinking
about it.

In Australia at least, recycling sink water containing any food is
considered a health risk without treatment, so needs to be let go. So
the question is whether to capture & recycle shower & basin water or
not. Desalinators like to be run as much as possible (see earlier
posts), thus giving fresh water for washing/showering. QED.

Regards, Roger, Mango 28 Zorba



On 21/09/2007, at 3:51 AM, Judy wrote:

I am totally confused by your response regarding grey water. Perhaps
the term needs to be defined. The only marine definition of grey
water that I am familiar with is the water run-off from the showers
and sinks in the head and the galley sink. Toilet water is termed
black water. At least those are the commonly used definitions of grey
water and black water in the marine industry in the US. In parts of
the Great Lakes, for example, release of any grey water is banned. In
all US waters the release of black water is banned.

Please explain how using a desalinator avoids the sludge in the bilge.

As to the original question, we have experienced no problems with grey
water going to the sump bilge on our Super Maramu. We have not used
nylon stockings or other secondary filtration methods. If not cleaned
frequently, the sump bilge will stink to high heaven. It must be
cleaned periodically. We have encountered no problems in function with
the sump bilge as designed by Amel. The original poster might want to
invest in a wet/dry vac to make cleaning this bilge an easy job.

Judy
S/V BeBe
Amel SM2 #387

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, Roger Banks <roger.banks@>
wrote:

Hi Hugh

I considered the subject but abandoned it when I recalled that grey
water is used mainly to flush toilets and water gardens, the former
being done with sea water and the latter hardly applies. Use a
desalinator and avoid all that sludge in your bilges.

Regards, Roger, Mango 28 Zorba


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sink/Shower grey water

Roger Banks <roger.banks@...>

#3218

Aggression I can do without, thanks, go jump down someone else's  
throat. Clearly you didn't read my post or spend a moment thinking  
about it.

In Australia at least, recycling sink water containing any food is  
considered a health risk without treatment, so needs to be let go. So  
the question is whether to capture & recycle shower & basin water or  
not. Desalinators like to be run as much as possible (see earlier  
posts), thus giving fresh water for washing/showering. QED.

Regards, Roger, Mango 28 Zorba

Show quoted text

On 21/09/2007, at 3:51 AM, Judy wrote:

I am totally confused by your response regarding grey water. Perhaps
the term needs to be defined. The only marine definition of grey
water that I am familiar with is the water run-off from the showers
and sinks in the head and the galley sink. Toilet water is termed
black water. At least those are the commonly used definitions of grey
water and black water in the marine industry in the US. In parts of
the Great Lakes, for example, release of any grey water is banned. In
all US waters the release of black water is banned.

Please explain how using a desalinator avoids the sludge in the bilge.

As to the original question, we have experienced no problems with grey
water going to the sump bilge on our Super Maramu. We have not used
nylon stockings or other secondary filtration methods. If not cleaned
frequently, the sump bilge will stink to high heaven. It must be
cleaned periodically. We have encountered no problems in function with
the sump bilge as designed by Amel. The original poster might want to
invest in a wet/dry vac to make cleaning this bilge an easy job.

Judy
S/V BeBe
Amel SM2 #387

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, Roger Banks <roger.banks@...>
wrote:

Hi Hugh

I considered the subject but abandoned it when I recalled that grey
water is used mainly to flush toilets and water gardens, the former
being done with sea water and the latter hardly applies. Use a
desalinator and avoid all that sludge in your bilges.

Regards, Roger, Mango 28 Zorba

Testing water purity

drdavegoodman

#3217

Dear Ian and Gary;
I have looked at the Simply Hydroponics website that Gary referred me
to and it did have the answers to my question.  So I'm getting one of
the TDS meters--good selection on ebay
Thanks!
Dave

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, amelliahona <no_reply@...> wrote:

DAVID, THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A DUMB QUESTION!!!

Here is a site that will hopefully  answer your question:

http://www.simplyhydro.com/tds-ec.htm

To quote from that site (which by the way is talking about plantnutrient solutions, but
which are the same principles as for sea water)

"TDS, EC, PPM, microSiemens: What do all those letters mean?

What is the best way to calibrate a TDS or Ec meter?
Answer: Standard reference solutions are used. The bottles aremarked with the
conductivity (EC) value in microSiemens/cm and the corresponding ppMvalues for sodium
chloride (NaCl) and potassium chloride (KCl) solutions, andsometimes for a "442"
reference mixture. The conductivity of sodium chloride solutions isclose to that of
hydroponic mineral nutrients, so a "1000 ppM NaCl" standard is mostfrequently used
when calibrating the meter for hydroponic solutions. You shouldfollow the calibration
instructions in the manual which the manufacturer of your meterprovided.

What does a TDS or EC meter measure?
Answer: The electrical conductivity (EC) of your nutrient resultsfrom motion of mineral
ions when the meter applies an electrical voltage. The ppM value ofa sodium chloride
solution happens to be very close to half of its conductivity value(in microSiemens/cm), so
many meters display the conductivity as an equivalent NaCl amount.

What does the term parts per million (ppm) mean?
Answer: It is a common unit for measuring the concentration ofelements in the nutrient
solution. One ppm is one part by weight of the mineral in onemillion parts of solution.

How do I convert between TDS and EC readings?
Answer: To obtain an approximate sodium chloride TDS value, multiplythe EC reading (in
microSiemens/cm) by 1000 and divide by 2.

To get an EC value, multiply the ppm reading by 2 and divide by 1000.
Thus, if your EC is 1:
1*1000/2= 500 ppm.
And if your ppm is 500:
500*2/1000= 1 EC

Is it better to use an EC or a TDS meter?
Answer: If you have plant nutrient recommendations in EC units, anEC meter is
convenient. If your plant nutrient recommendations are in ppMvalues, a sodium chloride
TDS calibration is easier to use."

Hope this helps.

My EC meter usually shows about 500-550 microSiemens when the watermaker is
running.  It will start out at 550 and fall to as low as 460 afterit has been running
for an hour or so.  Water makers work better (at least the membranesdo) when
they are used for prolonged periods frequently.  Thus my water makerTDS readings
should be about 250 ppm.

Regards,  Gary Silver,  MD

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "Dr. Goodman"<drdavegoodman@> wrote:

Forgive my ignorance--What is a TDS reading, and how is it obtained.
Presumably it has to do with water purity?

--
David Goodman
email:  drdavegoodman@
cell:  608-772-0634
STT:  340-998-2169


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Sink/Shower grey water

Judy Rouse

#3216

I am totally confused by your response regarding grey water.  Perhaps
the term needs to be defined.  The only marine definition of grey
water that I am familiar with is the water run-off from the showers
and sinks in the head and the galley sink.  Toilet water is termed
black water.  At least those are the commonly used definitions of grey
water and black water in the marine industry in the US.  In parts of
the Great Lakes, for example, release of any grey water is banned.  In
all US waters the release of black water is banned.

Please explain how using a desalinator avoids the sludge in the bilge.

As to the original question, we have experienced no problems with grey
water going to the sump bilge on our Super Maramu.  We have not used
nylon stockings or other secondary filtration methods. If not cleaned
frequently, the sump bilge will stink to high heaven. It must be
cleaned periodically. We have encountered no problems in function with
the sump bilge as designed by Amel.  The original poster might want to
invest in a wet/dry vac to make cleaning this bilge an easy job.

Judy
S/V BeBe
Amel SM2 #387

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, Roger Banks <roger.banks@...>
wrote:

Hi Hugh

I considered the subject but abandoned it when I recalled that grey
water is used mainly to flush toilets and water gardens, the former
being done with sea water and the latter hardly applies. Use a
desalinator and avoid all that sludge in your bilges.

Regards, Roger, Mango 28 Zorba