Date   

[Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker Dead

amelliahona <no_reply@...>
 

Hi Ian:

Regarding:

"I am careful with o-rings and do clean the groove thoroughly before
smearing them with silicone grease. Amel says that Vaseline will do.
Being petroleum based, I am not so sure. I certainly use silicone
grease on all my diving seals. I know it's safer when in contact with high
pressure air than grease. I would appreciate your thoughts on silicone
versus Vaseline on 0-rings"

I had no doubt that you would be meticulous about your work, I just
couldn't think of other reasons, so I threw it out there. In my aviation
mechanic training I was taught to use silicone grease (we actually
use a 3M product called DC4.) We use silicone in the aviation industry
because it tolerates higher temps without coking (turning to charred
material) like a petroleum distilate will (i.e vaseline). I don't think that
would be an an issue here. So silicone grease it is for me just out of habit.

"The latest failure had never been disturbed by me, being under the
curved end cap bracket that carries the hose connection."

Could it just have been calendar age? Where the o-rings 'checked'
(i.e. cracked) or did they appear to be stiff or in poor condition?

How many sodium metabisulfite (pickling solution) treatments?
(it is a strong oxidizer resulting in corrosion and attack on
seals etc).

"I doubt if my HP gauge is poorly calibrated else the flow rate would
be off the top of the sight tube."

Point well taken. Wish I had better answers. Those darn gremlins
just seem to like our watermakers.

Regards, Gary


Re: Watermaker Dead

amelliahona <no_reply@...>
 

DAVID, THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A DUMB QUESTION!!!

Here is a site that will hopefully answer your question:

http://www.simplyhydro.com/tds-ec.htm

To quote from that site (which by the way is talking about plant nutrient solutions, but
which are the same principles as for sea water)

"TDS, EC, PPM, microSiemens: What do all those letters mean?

What is the best way to calibrate a TDS or Ec meter?
Answer: Standard reference solutions are used. The bottles are marked with the
conductivity (EC) value in microSiemens/cm and the corresponding ppM values for sodium
chloride (NaCl) and potassium chloride (KCl) solutions, and sometimes for a "442"
reference mixture. The conductivity of sodium chloride solutions is close to that of
hydroponic mineral nutrients, so a "1000 ppM NaCl" standard is most frequently used
when calibrating the meter for hydroponic solutions. You should follow the calibration
instructions in the manual which the manufacturer of your meter provided.

What does a TDS or EC meter measure?
Answer: The electrical conductivity (EC) of your nutrient results from motion of mineral
ions when the meter applies an electrical voltage. The ppM value of a sodium chloride
solution happens to be very close to half of its conductivity value (in microSiemens/cm), so
many meters display the conductivity as an equivalent NaCl amount.

What does the term parts per million (ppm) mean?
Answer: It is a common unit for measuring the concentration of elements in the nutrient
solution. One ppm is one part by weight of the mineral in one million parts of solution.

How do I convert between TDS and EC readings?
Answer: To obtain an approximate sodium chloride TDS value, multiply the EC reading (in
microSiemens/cm) by 1000 and divide by 2.

To get an EC value, multiply the ppm reading by 2 and divide by 1000.
Thus, if your EC is 1:
1*1000/2= 500 ppm.
And if your ppm is 500:
500*2/1000= 1 EC

Is it better to use an EC or a TDS meter?
Answer: If you have plant nutrient recommendations in EC units, an EC meter is
convenient. If your plant nutrient recommendations are in ppM values, a sodium chloride
TDS calibration is easier to use."

Hope this helps.

My EC meter usually shows about 500-550 microSiemens when the water maker is
running. It will start out at 550 and fall to as low as 460 after it has been running
for an hour or so. Water makers work better (at least the membranes do) when
they are used for prolonged periods frequently. Thus my water maker TDS readings
should be about 250 ppm.

Regards, Gary Silver, MD

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "Dr. Goodman" <drdavegoodman@...> wrote:

Forgive my ignorance--What is a TDS reading, and how is it obtained.
Presumably it has to do with water purity?

--
David Goodman
email: drdavegoodman@...
cell: 608-772-0634
STT: 340-998-2169


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] watermaker filters

Ian Shepherd
 

Hi John,

Amel told me 25 Micron on the pre filter and 5 Micron on the next filter
(closest to the pump). It's worked well for me though when heeled to port,
the inlet through hull can get uncovered causing a fluctuation of pressure
at times. I did have the water maker circuit breaker trip yesterday as the
boat tacked. This might have bee attributed to interrupted water flow
perhaps?

I believe that the Dessalator manual also recommends 25/5.

Cheers

Ian

-------Original Message-------

From: John and Anne on Bali Hai
Date: 19/09/2007 16:57:47
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] watermaker filters

Perhaps my last message was not clear. It seems to me that if the high
pressure pump produces high pressures on the out side it will produce
huge suction on the in side and if it cannot get water it will destruct
something en route.
It is a pity that the documentation does not suggest the size of
filter and it may well be that 5 micron is also too small.

Best wishes, Anne and John SM 319


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker Dead

Ian Shepherd
 

Hello David,

I believe that TDS stands for Total Dissolved Solids. Yes it measures the
water purity by immersing two probes in the water and taking a measurement.
Quite what is measured, I don't know. Gary Silver is the man to tell you. I
would guess it is the conductivity of the water?

There are many instruments on the market, some hand held and others in line
with the water maker output hose. Hanna Instruments sell a variety of
instruments, but you need to be careful that you buy one which covers the
correct range of readings applicable to marine water makers. TDS is normally
measured in parts per million or PPM. You want one that will read up to
about 1000 ppm. I got mine on E-Bay.

Hope that this helps.

Ian Shepherd SM 414 Crusader

-------Original Message-------

From: Dr. Goodman
Date: 19/09/2007 19:11:59
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker Dead

Forgive my ignorance--What is a TDS reading, and how is it obtained.
Presumably it has to do with water purity?

--
David Goodman
email: drdavegoodman@gmail.com
cell: 608-772-0634
STT: 340-998-2169


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Watermaker filters

Ian Shepherd
 

Hi John & Anne,

I am a bit confused as to your two sets of TDS readings. I have never seen
anything as low as 100-200, but somewhere around 550 has been common in the
past. I went to a seminar once in Georgetown Bahamas. The guest from from
HRO water makers. He was asked the same question as you have. He said that
anything up to 900 ppm was OK but if you were in the military, 1000 was
allowed for limited periods. He said readings under 600 indicated that the
system was functioning normally, though better could be expected when the
membranes were new.

Changing the subject John, I went to a chemist this morning in Larnaca to
buy some medicine for my son in England. After being served, I stood at the
counter for a while. The chemist looked up and said "Yes?" I said "I am
waiting for my change". He told me that he had given me the change and sure
enough it was in my pocket. I apologized and asked him if he sold pills for
Altzheimers? He said "Yes, but the problem is that you have to remember to
take the pills!"

It creeps up on us John! Sorry I missed you in Turkey this summer.

Regards

Ian

-------Original Message-------

From: John and Anne on Bali Hai
Date: 19/09/2007 15:33:12
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Watermaker filters

It may or may not be relevant but I replaced the saltwater filters
recently using a 30 and a 3 micron filters. The 3 micron one was too
much drag on flow and resulted in the reading on the top meter to
fluctuate wildly from normal to very low and the sight tube was showing
a continuous flow of bubbles which may perhaps have been air leaks past
the end fittings or somewhere else. I changed the fine filter to a 5
micron one which solved the problem although my ppm meter now shows a
reading of 580 instead of the previous figure of about 450.
I do not know at what level one should worry. the 580 is about the same
as tap water in Malta which is claimed to be safe. We have done a blind
testing with bottled water and neither of us could tell which was which.
When we collected the boat seven years ago Olivier told us not to
bother with sterilising and so we never have without any untoward
effects. The product water at 100 or 200ppm is so pure that it will not
nourish pot plants and indeed we met a French boat in the South Pacific
with a dozen people on board and it was their practice to add sea water
to get some minerals into it.
So we are not psychotic about ppms but wonder at which level bacteria
can pass the membrane.

Must go, time for a drink, regards, Anne and John SM319


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker Dead

Ian Shepherd
 

Hi Gary,

Thanks for your thoughts. I am careful with o-rings and do clean the groove
thoroughly before smearing them with silicone grease. Amel say that Vaseline
will do. Being petroleum based, I am not so sure. I certainly use silicone
grease on all my diving seals. I know it's safer when in contact with high
pressure air than grease. I would appreciate your thoughts on silicone
versus Vaseline on 0-rings. What I have not previously done is to run a pick
around under the seal. A good tip. I do however look at them carefully with
a magnifying glass before pushing the bobbin back into the end cap.

The latest failure had never been disturbed by me, being under the curved
end cap bracket that carries the hose connection. There did appear to be
some erosion of the lower seal in line with where the end cap material had
been washed away. Whether this was from escaping water or a badly fitted
seal is a matter of conjecture.

I doubt if my HP gauge is poorly calibrated else the flow rate would be off
the top of the sight tube. I adjust the pressure so that I achieve 160 l/h
(in warm water). The needle is usually about one third up the green band on
the HP gauge.

Regards

Ian

-------Original Message-------

From: amelliahona
Date: 19/09/2007 04:28:14
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker Dead

Hi Ian:

Thanks for your input. Regarding:

"To be exact, yet another leaking end cap, this time at the hose
connection end. Water had got pass the two 1.5mm x 9mm o-rings
and eroded the nylon, creating a serious leak. This was my 5th end
cap failure in just over 200 hours of operation! My end caps are
white. Has anyone else had a similar problem? Amel say that it is
very rare! I don't believe them."

I am not sure why you are having such leakage problems.

I have had no leaks from my end caps. My first set of end caps where
white plastic (?nylon) (see photo's in the photo section where I am
trying to remove the white end caps). They looked pristine when
removed during the replacement of my membranes that failed at
the 185 hour mark. I replaced the end caps anyway at the suggestion
of Amel's Olivier Beatue at that time (185 hours). I ordered the end
caps from Dessalator and received the black caps depicted in the
photo's section. I currently only have about 240 hours on the water
maker but I am still leak free.

Just a thought. Could it be that you got a batch of poor guality
o-rings? This might explain the recurrent leaks. The other
possibility is that the o-rings aren't seating well when installed.
Perhaps they have a twist in them?

When I install aircraft o-rings I lube them with a silicone lube, then
after meticulous cleaning of the o-ring groove, I roll the o-ring
into the groove. I then use a plastic pic to to lift a point on the
o-ring circumference and run the pic around the circumference
a couple of times to insure there are no twists.

Is it possible that your high pressure gauge is out of calibration
and the system is being over pressurized? Not sure if any of
these things are the actual cause but it certainly seems that you
are suffering from a higher failure rate than I have experienced
or heard about.

Regards, Gary


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker Dead

Ian Shepherd
 

Hi Bill & Judy,

Thank you for your quick response. I did not believe for one moment that I
was alone in experiencing this type of failure. Let's hope the black
material is more resilient. My latest leak occurred from the end hose
fitting bobbin, which is as you know, under the screw on curved bracket.
That is an area that I have never had to disturb when changing membranes, so
I am concerned at the design.

Whilst seeking a replacement end cap in Marmaris last August, I looked at
many other makes of designators. All of them had heavy duty machined end
caps, and the interconnection was achieved through a reinforced hose with
proper screw in fittings. I also believe that when I looked over the
prototype Amel 54 last September, the water maker installed was also of a
much more robust design. I am not certain, but it might well have been made
by Dessalator.

Quite why we ended up with what we have is a bit of a mystery. Were we early
on in the evolution of the product, or was this a non standard design
instigated by Amel's war on electrolysis perhaps? Maybe someone out there
knows?

Your TDS readings are lower than mine, as are John Hollanby's. This could be
due to residual preservative chemicals from the new membranes even after 30
minutes washing, or a difference in the calibration of our TDS meters. The
water passes the new boards specifications and I know that the new board is
picky when it comes to allowing good water into the tank.

Fair Winds

Ian SM 414 Crusader

-------Original Message-------

From: Judy
Date: 09/19/07 00:48:15
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker Dead

Ian,

Our endcaps on our 160 liter watermaker failed at about 180 hours
(almost 4 years). Your endcap failure sounds similar manner to ours.
The o-rings on the high pressure fittings ('salt water in' and the
'interconnect bobbin')on the endcaps failed and water eroded the
(white) nylon causing a leak. This was our only failure in less than
200 hours of operation. We bought replacement endcaps from
Dessalator. The replacements are black. We now have 284 hours on the
system.

We have been getting between 130 and 200 TDS readings since the
replacement of the membranes which came from AirWaterIce. The longer
the system runs the less TDS.

We should note that we have a manual diverter valve and we discard the
first several minutes of product water until the TDS reading moves
below 200. We always check the TDS before we shut the system down and
usually have a reading of less than 140...in other words TDS does
improve the longer the system runs. A TDS reading from our fresh
water tank is usually about 135.

Regards,

Bill Rouse, sailing with captain Judy
s/v BeBe, SM2 #387

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "Ian Shepherd"
<sv_freespirit@...> wrote:

Hi Gary,

I managed to run the water maker fitted with the new control board today
with a brand new set of membranes. The unit worked fine as far as the
electronics were concerned, giving a green light after exactly 2
minutes of
high pressure operation. You will recall I said that I said that
they built
a two minute delay into the new board for commonality with the old
board.
The TDS reading of the water produced was 340 ppm which is marvelous
compared with an off scale reading on the failed membranes.

So the board did previously do exactly what it was supposed to do.
It dumped
the water overboard as soon as it detected a problem with my
membranes and
activated the bad water LED.

I did experience another problem. To be exact, yet another leaking
end cap,
this time at the hose connection end. Water had got pass the two
1.5mm x 9mm
o-rings and eroded the nylon, creating a serious leak. This was my
5th end
cap failure in just over 200 hours of operation! My end caps are
white. Has
anyone else had a similar problem? Amel say that it is very rare! I
don't
believe them.


Re: Watermaker Dead

drdavegoodman
 

Forgive my ignorance--What is a TDS reading, and how is it obtained.
Presumably it has to do with water purity?

--
David Goodman
email: drdavegoodman@gmail.com
cell: 608-772-0634
STT: 340-998-2169


watermaker filters

John and Anne on Bali Hai <annejohn@...>
 

Perhaps my last message was not clear. It seems to me that if the high
pressure pump produces high pressures on the out side it will produce
huge suction on the in side and if it cannot get water it will destruct
something en route.
It is a pity that the documentation does not suggest the size of
filter and it may well be that 5 micron is also too small.

Best wishes, Anne and John SM 319


Watermaker filters

John and Anne on Bali Hai <annejohn@...>
 

It may or may not be relevant but I replaced the saltwater filters
recently using a 30 and a 3 micron filters. The 3 micron one was too
much drag on flow and resulted in the reading on the top meter to
fluctuate wildly from normal to very low and the sight tube was showing
a continuous flow of bubbles which may perhaps have been air leaks past
the end fittings or somewhere else. I changed the fine filter to a 5
micron one which solved the problem although my ppm meter now shows a
reading of 580 instead of the previous figure of about 450.
I do not know at what level one should worry. the 580 is about the same
as tap water in Malta which is claimed to be safe. We have done a blind
testing with bottled water and neither of us could tell which was which.
When we collected the boat seven years ago Olivier told us not to
bother with sterilising and so we never have without any untoward
effects. The product water at 100 or 200ppm is so pure that it will not
nourish pot plants and indeed we met a French boat in the South Pacific
with a dozen people on board and it was their practice to add sea water
to get some minerals into it.
So we are not psychotic about ppms but wonder at which level bacteria
can pass the membrane.

Must go, time for a drink, regards, Anne and John SM319


[Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker Dead

amelliahona <no_reply@...>
 

Hi Ian:

Thanks for your input. Regarding:

"To be exact, yet another leaking end cap, this time at the hose
connection end. Water had got pass the two 1.5mm x 9mm o-rings
and eroded the nylon, creating a serious leak. This was my 5th end
cap failure in just over 200 hours of operation! My end caps are
white. Has anyone else had a similar problem? Amel say that it is
very rare! I don't believe them."

I am not sure why you are having such leakage problems.

I have had no leaks from my end caps. My first set of end caps where
white plastic (?nylon) (see photo's in the photo section where I am
trying to remove the white end caps). They looked pristine when
removed during the replacement of my membranes that failed at
the 185 hour mark. I replaced the end caps anyway at the suggestion
of Amel's Olivier Beatue at that time (185 hours). I ordered the end
caps from Dessalator and received the black caps depicted in the
photo's section. I currently only have about 240 hours on the water
maker but I am still leak free.

Just a thought. Could it be that you got a batch of poor guality
o-rings? This might explain the recurrent leaks. The other
possibility is that the o-rings aren't seating well when installed.
Perhaps they have a twist in them?

When I install aircraft o-rings I lube them with a silicone lube, then
after meticulous cleaning of the o-ring groove, I roll the o-ring
into the groove. I then use a plastic pic to to lift a point on the
o-ring circumference and run the pic around the circumference
a couple of times to insure there are no twists.

Is it possible that your high pressure gauge is out of calibration
and the system is being over pressurized? Not sure if any of
these things are the actual cause but it certainly seems that you
are suffering from a higher failure rate than I have experienced
or heard about.

Regards, Gary


[Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker Dead

Judy Rouse
 

Ian,

Our endcaps on our 160 liter watermaker failed at about 180 hours
(almost 4 years). Your endcap failure sounds similar manner to ours.
The o-rings on the high pressure fittings ('salt water in' and the
'interconnect bobbin')on the endcaps failed and water eroded the
(white) nylon causing a leak. This was our only failure in less than
200 hours of operation. We bought replacement endcaps from
Dessalator. The replacements are black. We now have 284 hours on the
system.

We have been getting between 130 and 200 TDS readings since the
replacement of the membranes which came from AirWaterIce. The longer
the system runs the less TDS.

We should note that we have a manual diverter valve and we discard the
first several minutes of product water until the TDS reading moves
below 200. We always check the TDS before we shut the system down and
usually have a reading of less than 140...in other words TDS does
improve the longer the system runs. A TDS reading from our fresh
water tank is usually about 135.

Regards,

Bill Rouse, sailing with captain Judy
s/v BeBe, SM2 #387


--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "Ian Shepherd"
<sv_freespirit@...> wrote:

Hi Gary,

I managed to run the water maker fitted with the new control board today
with a brand new set of membranes. The unit worked fine as far as the
electronics were concerned, giving a green light after exactly 2
minutes of
high pressure operation. You will recall I said that I said that
they built
a two minute delay into the new board for commonality with the old
board.
The TDS reading of the water produced was 340 ppm which is marvelous
compared with an off scale reading on the failed membranes.

So the board did previously do exactly what it was supposed to do.
It dumped
the water overboard as soon as it detected a problem with my
membranes and
activated the bad water LED.

I did experience another problem. To be exact, yet another leaking
end cap,
this time at the hose connection end. Water had got pass the two
1.5mm x 9mm
o-rings and eroded the nylon, creating a serious leak. This was my
5th end
cap failure in just over 200 hours of operation! My end caps are
white. Has
anyone else had a similar problem? Amel say that it is very rare! I
don't
believe them.


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker Dead

Ian Shepherd
 

Hi Gary,

I managed to run the water maker fitted with the new control board today
with a brand new set of membranes. The unit worked fine as far as the
electronics were concerned, giving a green light after exactly 2 minutes of
high pressure operation. You will recall I said that I said that they built
a two minute delay into the new board for commonality with the old board.
The TDS reading of the water produced was 340 ppm which is marvelous
compared with an off scale reading on the failed membranes.

So the board did previously do exactly what it was supposed to do. It dumped
the water overboard as soon as it detected a problem with my membranes and
activated the bad water LED.

I did experience another problem. To be exact, yet another leaking end cap,
this time at the hose connection end. Water had got pass the two 1.5mm x 9mm
o-rings and eroded the nylon, creating a serious leak. This was my 5th end
cap failure in just over 200 hours of operation! My end caps are white. Has
anyone else had a similar problem? Amel say that it is very rare! I don't
believe them.

I have unfortunately now got to go to a funeral in Switzerland Gary, so I
won't be able to photograph the new board till I get back at the end of the
month, but I will do so as soon as I can.

NOTE for John Abercrombie: John I have replied twice to your e-mail and it
has got bounced. Do you have another address please?

Regards

Ian Shepherd SM 414 Crusader

-------Original Message-------

From: amelliahona
Date: 10/09/2007 18:34:32
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker Dead

Hi Ian:
Thanks for your reply. Wonderful to hear how well the new board is working.
A couple of questions:

"I am not sure if my new board does contain an automatic reverse flush or
not
I received no documentation. "

Would it be possible to post a photo on this site of the new board? Feel
free to
put it in the Dessalitor Technical Folder. I have posted a wiring diagram
in that file of the new board that was provided to me by Dessalator.

Thanks for the description of your tests. Well done.

" When I spoke with their sub contractor (an Englishman), "

Could you please provide a phone number so that I could contact him?

"Incidentally, the failed one(s) lasted only 13 months, even with
meticulous back flushing."

Any thoughts on why the seeming premature failure?

Thanks again for your input.

Gary


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: rating

brgdebakker
 

Hi Achim,

The mentioned site was helpfull. Thanx!

Bart.

----- Original Message -----
From: achimschroeder2005
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 11:36 PM
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: rating


Hi Bart,

there is a German Kirk which has an ORC Club rating. The values are
not on hand but can be send if necessary. Otherwise look on the
www.dsv.org for ORC Club ratings for GER 5858 "Yes".
Greetings from Hamburg
Achim

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "brgdebakker"
<brgdebakker@...> wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
> I'm curious to know if anyone knows the IRC rating or any other race
> rating for an Amel Kirk. I'm planning on joining a racing circuit in
> the Netherlands.
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Bart de Bakker, Amel Kirk 146 Folie à Deux
>





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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re:Maramu fuel tank

Jim Dernehl <jim.dernehl@...>
 

Richard
I am sorry that I have not yet sent you pictures but I am traveling
and will not be back to my boat until November-----in any case, your
adding dual filters is a great idea.I assume you put RACOR filters on
the boat or something similar. I have dual RACOR filters on PAO-SAN and
they work great. Even with the cleaning ports I have installed these
filters still are a life saver. It is always in the rough seas that you
need to change them----better them then having the engine stop. I can
not answer your question regarding the exact position of the
baffles----I can only assume that they are in a vertical position-----as
the installed ports do allow access to the bottom of the tank. I have
never been at the boat when cleaning has been done on the tank-----but
no one has complained about access. I will send you pictures plus some
measurement so you can get an idea of what seems to works.

Jim Dernehl
Pao-San # 88

________________________________

From: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Richard Piller
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2007 1:34 PM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re:Maramu fuel tank



Jim, we did the job a bit different, We used a fuel
polishing guy to pump the tank a number of times to
clean things out. Once the tank was fully pumped we
took off the fuel lines prior to the fist fuel filter
and put some air pressue to the tank to blow out and
grim still in the lines. It work very well no longer
did we have an issue with bad fuel.

We also added a dual filter system to keep from having
prolbems underway should be a get a bad batch of
fuel..

Good luck and fair winds
Richard SM 209
--- Don Henderson <maramu48@yahoo.com <mailto:maramu48%40yahoo.com> >
wrote:

James,
Thanks for your comments. Can you describe the
size and positions of the baffles? Are they welded
to the sides and bottom? Are there limber holes at
the bottom corners, or is there a space between the
bottom edge of a baffle and the bottom of the tank?
thanks

Jim Dernehl <jim.dernehl@operatingtech.com
<mailto:jim.dernehl%40operatingtech.com> > wrote:
Jochen
You are correct, that the lack of access ports in
these well made
stainless steel tanks must be addressed at some
point on every boat.
Diesel will shed crud---living and dead---that must
be removed. I
addressed this issue on my Amel by having a series
of access ports cut
in the lower part of the tanks between each
baffle----about 4-5 ports
were cut. Each port is large enough to reach through
with a brush and
vacuum hose. The fellow who did the work for me
claimed to pull from the
tank about 12 gallons of crud accumulated over a 9
year period. Next
time I am at the boat, I will take some pictures and
send them on with
dimensions. It is very important to seal these ports
with gasket and
solid sections of stainless steel that will take the
normal strain of
sailing with out leaking.

James Dernehl
Maramu # 88 PAO-SAN

________________________________

From: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>
[mailto:amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf
Of Jochen Hofmann
Sent: Monday, August 20, 2007 6:48 AM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re:Maramu fuel tank

To the best of my knowledge this is one of the flaws
in the Maramu
design -
there isn't any.

We have the same issue on our Blue Song - so far
fortunately it hasn't
become an issue !

Has anyone had an inspection opening made for the
Maramu fuel tank ?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated !

Fair Winds,

Jochen Hofmann

Maramu # 143 Blue Song

[Non-text portions of this message have been
removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been
removed]






---------------------------------
Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! -
their life, your story.
Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games.

[Non-text portions of this message have been
removed]

__________________________________________________________
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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re:Maramu fuel tank

Richard Piller <richard03801@...>
 

Jim, we did the job a bit different, We used a fuel
polishing guy to pump the tank a number of times to
clean things out. Once the tank was fully pumped we
took off the fuel lines prior to the fist fuel filter
and put some air pressue to the tank to blow out and
grim still in the lines. It work very well no longer
did we have an issue with bad fuel.

We also added a dual filter system to keep from having
prolbems underway should be a get a bad batch of
fuel..

Good luck and fair winds
Richard SM 209
--- Don Henderson <maramu48@yahoo.com> wrote:

James,
Thanks for your comments. Can you describe the
size and positions of the baffles? Are they welded
to the sides and bottom? Are there limber holes at
the bottom corners, or is there a space between the
bottom edge of a baffle and the bottom of the tank?
thanks

Jim Dernehl <jim.dernehl@operatingtech.com> wrote:
Jochen
You are correct, that the lack of access ports in
these well made
stainless steel tanks must be addressed at some
point on every boat.
Diesel will shed crud---living and dead---that must
be removed. I
addressed this issue on my Amel by having a series
of access ports cut
in the lower part of the tanks between each
baffle----about 4-5 ports
were cut. Each port is large enough to reach through
with a brush and
vacuum hose. The fellow who did the work for me
claimed to pull from the
tank about 12 gallons of crud accumulated over a 9
year period. Next
time I am at the boat, I will take some pictures and
send them on with
dimensions. It is very important to seal these ports
with gasket and
solid sections of stainless steel that will take the
normal strain of
sailing with out leaking.

James Dernehl
Maramu # 88 PAO-SAN

________________________________

From: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Jochen Hofmann
Sent: Monday, August 20, 2007 6:48 AM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re:Maramu fuel tank

To the best of my knowledge this is one of the flaws
in the Maramu
design -
there isn't any.

We have the same issue on our Blue Song - so far
fortunately it hasn't
become an issue !

Has anyone had an inspection opening made for the
Maramu fuel tank ?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated !

Fair Winds,

Jochen Hofmann

Maramu # 143 Blue Song

[Non-text portions of this message have been
removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been
removed]






---------------------------------
Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! -
their life, your story.
Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games.

[Non-text portions of this message have been
removed]



____________________________________________________________________________________
Tonight's top picks. What will you watch tonight? Preview the hottest shows on Yahoo! TV.
http://tv.yahoo.com/


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re:Maramu fuel tank

Don Henderson <maramu48@...>
 

James,
Thanks for your comments. Can you describe the size and positions of the baffles? Are they welded to the sides and bottom? Are there limber holes at the bottom corners, or is there a space between the bottom edge of a baffle and the bottom of the tank?
thanks

Jim Dernehl <jim.dernehl@operatingtech.com> wrote:
Jochen
You are correct, that the lack of access ports in these well made
stainless steel tanks must be addressed at some point on every boat.
Diesel will shed crud---living and dead---that must be removed. I
addressed this issue on my Amel by having a series of access ports cut
in the lower part of the tanks between each baffle----about 4-5 ports
were cut. Each port is large enough to reach through with a brush and
vacuum hose. The fellow who did the work for me claimed to pull from the
tank about 12 gallons of crud accumulated over a 9 year period. Next
time I am at the boat, I will take some pictures and send them on with
dimensions. It is very important to seal these ports with gasket and
solid sections of stainless steel that will take the normal strain of
sailing with out leaking.

James Dernehl
Maramu # 88 PAO-SAN

________________________________

From: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jochen Hofmann
Sent: Monday, August 20, 2007 6:48 AM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re:Maramu fuel tank

To the best of my knowledge this is one of the flaws in the Maramu
design -
there isn't any.

We have the same issue on our Blue Song - so far fortunately it hasn't
become an issue !

Has anyone had an inspection opening made for the Maramu fuel tank ?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated !

Fair Winds,

Jochen Hofmann

Maramu # 143 Blue Song










---------------------------------
Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story.
Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games.


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker Dead

Ian Shepherd
 

Hi Gary,

I will try and take a photo next week. I am rather busy this weekend as a
gliding instructor, and hopefully a quick visit to Doodlebug in Limassol. I
hope that a photo taken in it's housing box will be sufficient? I have a
good camera that will take close ups.

I only had e-mail correspondence with a Mr Peter Wolstenholme, who works for
Dessalator's sub contractor. If I pass on his e-mail address to you, I would
prefer to outside of this forum. You can e-mail me at crusader53 AT gmail
com or sv_freespirit AT yahoo.co.UK

I really don't know why the membranes failed so early. I thought it may have
been an o-seal failure, but changing all of them had no effect. I have also
had two failures of the end caps. It would seem that high pressure water has
been getting past the seals on the cross connector tube and eroding the
nylon material to such an extent that a serious leak occurred on both
occasions. My third set of end caps are made of a new black material. I hope
that these will be more resilient.

I may consider relocating the membrane assembly to overhead the Gen-set.
Their present location in the far left corner makes for difficult access,
especially as I have a 110/220V transformer there that restricts access
further.

I looked at the diagram you posted. Looks really professional Gary. Well
done.

Cheers

Ian SM 424 Crusader

-------Original Message-------

From: amelliahona
Date: 09/10/07 18:34:32
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Watermaker Dead

Hi Ian:
Thanks for your reply. Wonderful to hear how well the new board is working.
A couple of questions:

"I am not sure if my new board does contain an automatic reverse flush or
not
I received no documentation. "

Would it be possible to post a photo on this site of the new board? Feel
free to
put it in the Dessalitor Technical Folder. I have posted a wiring diagram
in that file of the new board that was provided to me by Dessalator.

Thanks for the description of your tests. Well done.

" When I spoke with their sub contractor (an Englishman), "

Could you please provide a phone number so that I could contact him?

"Incidentally, the failed one(s) lasted only 13 months, even with
meticulous back flushing."

Any thoughts on why the seeming premature failure?

Thanks again for your input.

Gary


New file uploaded to amelyachtowners

amelyachtowners@...
 

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amelyachtowners
group.

File : /Dessalator Technical Info/Schematic-Dessalator Board.pdf
Uploaded by : amelliahona
Description : Dessalator Logic Circuit Board Power/Interconnect Schematic, Revision 4, 14 Sept 2007

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amelyachtowners/files/Dessalator%20Technical%20Info/Schematic-Dessalator%20Board.pdf

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

amelliahona


Re: Watermaker Dead

edmund_steele
 

Hi Gary,
The wire from Pin 4, Plug 1 is paralleled to the wire from Pin 5,
about an inch and half from the plug. The joint was buried right
under the first cable tie and well hidden.

Thank you for the kind offer of mailing spares. We are in cruising
mode and will be stopping at ports of entry and anchorages for just a
few days at most. We plan to winter in Marmaris, Turkey and fix all
then.
Best Regards,
Ed


--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "edmund_steele"
<edmundsteele@...> wrote:

Hi Gary,
We have been at sea and just got to an internet connection again
(Limassol, Cyprus). I did try to physically track both wires from
pins 4 and 5 without success. I will try again really HARD and let
you know.

BTW, the manual override of the control board works fine.
Ed

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, amelliahona <no_reply@>
wrote:

Hi Ed:

Any chance you have had a moment to trace the red wire
on Plug 1, Pin 4? If it indeed goes to the same point on
the rotary switch as the red wire on pin 5 give me your
thoughts on why Dessalator would do that. Is it just a
jumper wire?

I have T1 spares, as well as some spare relays.
I could probably mail the voltage regulators to you in a
standard envelope, the relay might be another matter.

The latest schematic in the files section (revision 3) shows
the coils on RY1, RY2, RY3, and the data sheet in the files
section gives you the pin layout.

Thanks for the info.

Gary