Hi Gary,

Thank you for your detailed response to my query. My apologies for not
spotting your reply before. There are many Amel Owners posts that I have yet
to catch up with. OK I shall reinstall the TDS sensor just downstream of the
membranes and allow time for the meter to stabilize and let you know what
happens.

Thank you also for carrying out the sensor tests that I was planning to do
when I have time. The results are very discouraging. I just wonder why
Dessalator install the probe in the first place when it appears to do
precisely nothing? It just does not make sense. Maybe the full answer is
further down my backlog of posts?

Regards

Ian SM 414 Crusader

Ian:
I do not know the exact Amel paint but Amel rold me that it is a hard, non-ablative paint.
I have used Trinidad SR for the last 5 years with good results. All hard paints require
periodic scrubbing of the hull to expose new anti fouling as sailing alone will not
create enough paint removal to expose new anti fouling. I have repainted with two coats
every two years. I just scuff sand the old paint to create tooth adhesion for the new coats
and have had good results. I only get 2 years out of two coats of paint in the tropics. I
used the Trinidad recommended metal primer for the metal cast iron where I had lost
some paint. Grind to fresh metal, wipe down with acetone or MEK, paint immediately,
wait NO MORE THAN 10 minutes between coats or you have to scuff sand between coats.
It sticks to everything but it won't stick to itself if allowed
to dry because it is such a hard paint. Immediately coat with the Trinidad SR or you
have to scuff sand before applying.

My understanding is that you can put an ablative paint over a hard paint but not the
opposite.

Hope this helps.

Regards,
Gary

Ian:
I do not know the exact Amel paint but Amel rold me that it is a hard, non-ablative paint.
I have used Trinidad SR for the last 5 years with good results. All hard paints require
periodic scrubbing of the hull to expose new anti fouling as sailing alone will not
create enough paint removal to expose new anti fouling. I have repainted with two coats
every two years. I just scuff sand the old paint to create tooth adhesion for the new coats
and have had good results. I only get 2 years out of two coats of paint in the tropics. I
used the Trinidad recommended metal primer for the metal cast iron where I had lost
some paint. Grind to fresh metal, wipe down with acetone or MEK, paint immediately,
wait NO MORE THAN 10 minutes between coats or you have to scuff sand between coats.
It sticks to everything but it won't stick to itself if allowed
to dry because it is such a hard paint. Immediately coat with the Trinidad SR or you
have to scuff sand before applying.

My understanding is that you can put an ablative paint over a hard paint but not the
opposite.

Hope this helps.

Regards,
Gary

Can anyone give me a quick answer as to what brand of anti fouling Amel
use? I just missed them on the phone today and need a rapid answer. Time
difference will make a call too late tomorrow.

I shall be trying the antibiotic enhancement to the paint which I am told
greatly extends the paints life. Maybe a harder grade of paint would be a
good idea too if it is going to last maybe 5 years, though I want to stick
to the same brand to minimize the need for a complete rub down and primer.

Ian Shepherd SM 414 Crusader

HI JOEL,

BOTH OF THE HOLDING TANKS WERE LEAKING. I AM WORKING
ON CUSTOM POLYPROPYLENE TANKS WHICH I HOPE WILL LAST
FOREVER. THANKS FOR THE TIP ON LEWIS MARINE, I WILL
CHECK WITH THEM.

REGARDS, DENNIS STULLER MARAMU HULL 186



--- "Joel F. Potter" <jfpottercys@att.net> wrote:

Hi Mr. Stuller,

Having done refits on more than a dozen AMEL boats
over the
years, the one piece of advice I can give you is
that if
your holding tanks are stainless steel, THROW THEM
AWAY.
They rarely last 15 years and when they fail...you
don't
want to experience this. The welds corrode from the
inside
out and rarely give an indication of immanent
failure.

I am all but certain that I obtained the correct
thread ball
values in years past from Lewis Marine in Ft.
Lauderdale.
It's a "trade only" dealer but they do have a web
site at
www.lewismarine.com <http://www.lewismarine.com/>; .
Good
luck

Joel F. Potter
AMEL 54 # 14, HOLLIS

Joel F. Potter - Cruising Yacht Specialist
Amel's Sole Associate for the Americas
Phone: 1 (954) 462-5869 Fax: 1 (954) 462-3923



[Non-text portions of this message have been
removed]

__________________________________________________
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Hi John:
Don't be afraid to use your machine!! It will last longer and the membranes
definitely benefit from frequent use. Just be cautious and that the weaknesses
have been illuminated we can take precautions that should prevent further
problems.

The control panel can NOT be removed from the galley side without first
detatching multiple items from the back side (the back side is accessed
from the port lazarette in the cockpit). There is a plywood panel on the
forward end of the lazarette that is held in place with two wood screws.
It is removed easily and gives great access to the back side of the
control panel. I will post a picture of this area soon. Clean out the
lazarette a bit and you can lay down comfortably to work.

The electronical box lid is removed by a quarter turn latch in each
corner, and the electrical circuit board with the fuses is in the lid of
the box as it is removed. There is 220 VAC and 24 VDC power in this
box so make sure all breakers are off before working here. I am
not sure where the 24 VDC power comes from. I haven't measured
it with a multimeter but I suspect it is live bus 24 VDC so be careful
not to short anything when checking the fuses. My fuses were all
ok (there are 4).

The documentation from Dessalator is indeed the worst of anything
on our boats. That is why I have been trying to provide it here. I
plan on posting a pdf schematic of the electronics when I get them
fully traced.

From what I can gather if you flush the system with fresh water every
one to two weeks there is no need for the pickling agent. I am in
the process of installing a timer to flush my system automatically every
few days when I am away from the boat. i will post more on that
as I get that project complete.

Bottom line, USE THE SYSTEM.

Best regards, Gary
I

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "John and Anne on Bali Hai" <hollamby@...>
wrote:

Hi Gary,
Thanks for the pics of the guts of the watermaker which seem to be
incredibly complex and it also seems from the website unreliable.
I have not dared to use mine since the recent spate of reports and
have grave doubts about the reliability of the installation. I have
ordered an RDS meter which has yet to arrive but in the meantime I
wonder if one of the fuses have gone. It seems from yor pics that
they are not in the box behind the panel in the galley which does
not want to come out easily. Is this fuse box panel hidden behind
the ply cover to the galley panel in the big cockpit locker? My boat
came with detailed instructions for everything except the intestines
of the watermaker and so I remain in total ignorance of its intimate
parts and maintenance. I do how ever remember Olivier telling me
that we did not have to bother with treating the machine with any
chemicals and should only flush it with product water after use if
it was not going to be used for more than a couple of weeks. We have
followed this advice for four years without any problems but recent
stuff on this site has got me frightened. Anyhow thanks for your
efforts on our behalf.
Best wishes, John SM 319

In regard to recent emails about yacht security, it is inconceivable to me that a person who would not dare go to sleep in his own house in the US or UK with the front door open would venture to a third world country and go to bed with hatches and doors wide open. I personally could never sleep. For thirty years on board our previous boat a 38 Soverel sloop, my wife and I have sailed safely to distant places around the world and stayed in hundreds of remote anchorages. Our success is simply security: we installed bars on all the hatches and had a drop in flat bar screen in the main hatch. These allow hatches to be left open for ventilation but prevent intruders from getting in. (The one and only time we were boarded in the middle of the night was one evening in Turkey when we forgot to put the drop screen in.) On our Super Maramu I installed similar systems of two stainless steel bars (powdercoat painted white) into all our deck hatches. These can also be easily made of aluminum bar and painted. (In the bow and stern cabins, you do need to have a screwdriver stored near by to remove them in case of fire in the main cabin) For the main companionway I built a 2 piece slide-in screen of flat aluminum bars about 3/8 thick. The two pieces slide in the hatch door groove and a barrel bolt secures the horizontal hatch top closed, keeping the screen pieces from coming out and preventing burglars from getting in. You have to build it in 2 pieces to be able to slide them up and out (if in one piece it is too tall and will hit the hard dodger before coming completely out). You could also attach insect screen to these pieces if you wish. Another benefit besides sleeping securely at night with hatches open is the ability to leave the boat during the day without locking the entire boat up. Photos of these are on the Moon Dog album on the Amel group Yahoo site.

On the issue of stolen dinghies and outboards, it never ceases to amaze me that a cruiser who is going on his life long dream of sailing the world seeing places and smelling the flowers would want a 15 to 30 horsepower motor so they can speed through the anchorages and villages. That said, I was in the Caribbean a couple years ago and was appalled at seeing 32 dinghies at one dinghy dock in Martinique. All but one had outboards on them that looked like they just came out of the box. First of all, these outboards represent a years salary for most third world people. Second, they are big and can be well used by the fishermen. The dinghies that are stolen are primarily stolen for the outboards. No native Ive ever seen has a rubber dinghy for fishing. And Ive never been greeted in the islands by a native in a rubber dinghy. If only your dinghy is stolen, then no doubt it was stolen by a fellow yachtie. I use a 3 hp and a 7 hp outboard. No self respecting fisherman would be caught dead with a 3 hp. The first thing I do with a new outboard is take a heat gun or hair dryer and remove the brand name decal from it. Then I sand the engine cowl down and repaint it, putting my yacht name and some artwork on it. Once I painted an engine cowl with 7 different colors or paint, it was truly ugly. No one was going to steal that engine. I do the same with my dinghy, personalized with boat name and some artwork.

As for firearms, I carry a single barrel sawed off shotgun painted international orange. It will shoot flares and I dont hide it. In port, I keep a 12 gauge shotgun shell in it with the shot cut out of shell. When you need to scare someone on deck just aim it at him and fire. Lots of noise, smoke and flames but nobody gets killed over stealing something.

I also keep a 12 guage Mossberg stainless steel pump shotgun for the open ocean (I do keep it hidden). If Im attacked at sea I will bide my time with the gun hidden from sight until Im boarded. With hands on the railing trying to come aboard, and your boat in a rolling sea, the intruder will easily be eliminated and his fellow pirates sitting ducks. Surprise is the answer to pirates, cunning is the answer to thieves.

Regards,

John Martin
SM #248 Moon Dog

_________________________________________________________________
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Hi Mr. Stuller,

Having done refits on more than a dozen AMEL boats over the
years, the one piece of advice I can give you is that if
your holding tanks are stainless steel, THROW THEM AWAY.
They rarely last 15 years and when they fail...you don't
want to experience this. The welds corrode from the inside
out and rarely give an indication of immanent failure.

I am all but certain that I obtained the correct thread ball
values in years past from Lewis Marine in Ft. Lauderdale.
It's a "trade only" dealer but they do have a web site at
www.lewismarine.com <http://www.lewismarine.com/>; . Good
luck

Joel F. Potter
AMEL 54 # 14, HOLLIS

Joel F. Potter - Cruising Yacht Specialist
Amel's Sole Associate for the Americas
Phone: 1 (954) 462-5869 Fax: 1 (954) 462-3923

Hi Gary,
Thanks for the pics of the guts of the watermaker which seem to be
incredibly complex and it also seems from the website unreliable.
I have not dared to use mine since the recent spate of reports and
have grave doubts about the reliability of the installation. I have
ordered an RDS meter which has yet to arrive but in the meantime I
wonder if one of the fuses have gone. It seems from yor pics that
they are not in the box behind the panel in the galley which does
not want to come out easily. Is this fuse box panel hidden behind
the ply cover to the galley panel in the big cockpit locker? My boat
came with detailed instructions for everything except the intestines
of the watermaker and so I remain in total ignorance of its intimate
parts and maintenance. I do how ever remember Olivier telling me
that we did not have to bother with treating the machine with any
chemicals and should only flush it with product water after use if
it was not going to be used for more than a couple of weeks. We have
followed this advice for four years without any problems but recent
stuff on this site has got me frightened. Anyhow thanks for your
efforts on our behalf.
Best wishes, John SM 319

DEAR GROUP,

WE ARE ENGAGED IN A MAJOR REFIT ON "DIFFERENT DRUMMER"
1985 MARAMU HULL#186 AND ARE HAVING DIFFICULTY FINDING
NEW THROUGH HULL VALVES FOR THE HEAD THROUGH HULL
FITTINGS. ON THIS BOAT THE VALVES SCREW ON TO BRONZE
FITTINGS WHICH ARE GLASSED INTO THE HULL AND WHICH ARE
FLUSH AND AT A SEVERE ANGLE TO THE HULL.
THE VALVES ON THIS BOAT ARE STAMPED 1 1/4 AND 1 1/2
AND APPEAR TO BE OF STANDARD IPS SIZE EXCEPT THAT THEY
ARE SLIGHTLY LARGER IN SIZE AND THE THREAD PITCH IS
SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT.
PER VETUS THESE ARE A BRITISH STANDARD PIPE SIZE BASED
ON A CASTING MARK WHICH LOOKS LIKE A STYLISED LETTER Y
WITH A SMALL O IN THE CROOK OF THE Y. VETUS FIRST
PROMISED US DELIVERY IN THREE DAYS BUT NOW AFTER 2
MONTHS THEY ARE VAUGUE ABOUT DELIVERY AND ARE TALKING
ABOUT ADDITIONAL MONTHS OF WAITING.

DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY INFORMATION OR SUGGESTIONS? I AM
ON THE VERGE OF CUTTING THE FITTINGS OUT AND
INSTALLING CONVENTIONAL THROUGH HULL FITTINGS BUT THIS
WILL NECESSITATE MODIFICATION OF THE HOLDING TANKS AS
WELL.

REGARDS, DENNIS STULLER "DIFFERENT DRUMMER"

__________________________________________________
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I just posted in the Dessalator Water Maker Service File a picture of the plumbing and
electrical connections on the back side of the water maker on my Hull # 335 RO system. I
have the reverse engineering partially completed on the circuit board and will post more on
that soon.

Gary Silver

RE THE NAUTIC 45
For those of you who have not had the pleasure of changeing the
zincs I thought I would post this message. I have just completed
the awful task on my supermarmu #369 "CALLISTO".
You will need:
1. Small phillips srewdriver
2. Staigth edge screwdriver
3. Pen or tape to mark hoses and electrical wires. (mark everything)
4. Small bucket
5. 13 mm box end wrench
6. 13 mm rachet drive
7. Rags
8. Time (4 hrs)
9. Patients

1. Disconnect from shore power, throw hot water breaker off (220v
circuit), turn off water pump (24v circuit)
2. Drain water using the release valve on the hot water outlet (the
bottom hose). It may not drain all of the water.
3. Disconnect cold water inlet and hot water outlet. Stand back
there will be more water.
4. Disconnect from the hot water heater the two hoses coming from
the engine. You will need to catch the fluid in a small bucket or
you will have a mess that you can not get to.
5. Disconnect the two bands securing the heater in place (disconnect
the stern side). You can now raise the empty heater (about 40 pounds)
to a horizontal level. It will wedge in place.
6. Remove the plastic shield form the bottom of the heater.
7. Disconnect all electrical connections.
8. Remove the eight bolts that hold the bottom of the heater in
place.
9. Remove the bottom. It will be a little sticky - pry loose with
screw driver.
10. Inspect the zincs, find that they are still in good shape and
that you have wasted your time. Mine are a year old and still 3/4
left.
11. Put the whole business back together.
12. Clean up the mess.
13. Remember. "there is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much
worth doing as simply messing about in boats" GRAHAME

Peter Pappas

Hello

Seals leaking is a common problem. Changing the seals regularly
helps. I change them every time the boat is out of the water. It is
a very simple procedure. There are 3 seals 1 inside the boat and two
between the shaft and the unit.

The Bow Thruster can be removed and serviced while the boat is in
the water. You need a special tool from Amel or a diver. I have
never done this but I believe if you search this site you can find
the best procedure.

There is a way to adjust the pressure that is put on the seals by
adjusting the motor travel. I have described how to do this in the
previous post about bow thruster not going up all the way. Also if
you put the safety pin in this may help.

When you remove the unit dont forget to change the oil. If there is
water in the oil you will also need to change the seal on the prop.
Again very simple procedure.

Good luck

Vito

Wanderer

asm 283

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "L. CAMERON"
<solarconstruction@...> wrote:

FROM LADY DIVINA, SM 317
MY BOWTHRUSTER IS LEAKING ALOT OF SEAWATER ONLY WHEN SAILING

THRU SOME SWELL, BUT NOT AT ANCHOR. A 4-5 HOUR SAIL WILL LEAK 2-3
GALLONS INTO THE BILGE BY THE FORE HEAD PASSAGEWAY.

MY QUESTIONS ARE:
1) WHY IS THIS UNIT WITH VERY LITTLE USE LEAKING THRU THE SEALS

ON A YEAR 2001 BOAT?? DOES AMEL WARANTY THIS IF IT IS SO COMMON??

2) HAS ANYONE CHANGED THE SEALS WHILE AT ANCHOR?? IS THEIR SEA

WATER INTRUSION WHEN THE UNIT IS DROPPED OUT IN CALM WATERS?

3) WILL GREASING THE SHAFT AND MOVING THE UNIT UP & DOWN TO

LUBRICATE THE SEALS, MINIMIZE THE PROBLEM UNTIL I CAN HAULOUT MORE
CONVENIENTLY??

4) DOES ANYONE HAVE A CLEAR SCHEMATIC SHOWING THE SEALS?? HOW

MANY SEALS ARE THERE TO CHANGE??

THANKS FOR ANY HELP!!! LADY DIVINA SM#317



---------------------------------
Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for

just 2¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

FROM LADY DIVINA, SM 317
MY BOWTHRUSTER IS LEAKING ALOT OF SEAWATER ONLY WHEN SAILING THRU SOME SWELL, BUT NOT AT ANCHOR. A 4-5 HOUR SAIL WILL LEAK 2-3 GALLONS INTO THE BILGE BY THE FORE HEAD PASSAGEWAY.
MY QUESTIONS ARE:
1) WHY IS THIS UNIT WITH VERY LITTLE USE LEAKING THRU THE SEALS ON A YEAR 2001 BOAT?? DOES AMEL WARANTY THIS IF IT IS SO COMMON??
2) HAS ANYONE CHANGED THE SEALS WHILE AT ANCHOR?? IS THEIR SEA WATER INTRUSION WHEN THE UNIT IS DROPPED OUT IN CALM WATERS?
3) WILL GREASING THE SHAFT AND MOVING THE UNIT UP & DOWN TO LUBRICATE THE SEALS, MINIMIZE THE PROBLEM UNTIL I CAN HAULOUT MORE CONVENIENTLY??
4) DOES ANYONE HAVE A CLEAR SCHEMATIC SHOWING THE SEALS?? HOW MANY SEALS ARE THERE TO CHANGE??
THANKS FOR ANY HELP!!! LADY DIVINA SM#317



---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Mark

I am not sure that your setup is the same as the one on Wanderer
hull # 283. So this is how I adjust my Bow thruster.

If you observe the assembly as it rises and falls you will see that
there is a rod with two metal arrows on it.One at the top and the
other on the bootom. These arrows press on a button and this tells
the motor when to stop running. These arrows can be adjusted quite
easily using and allen wrench. Its quite simple once you do it.

Good luck.

Vito Ciaravino

ASM 283

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "markmpitt" <mark_pitt@...>
wrote:

A couple of days ago I did some work on the bow thruster that

involved

partly removing the motor as well as changing the seals and the

oil in

the bow thruster prop assembly. I have it all back together now

but I

cannot get the whole thing to ascend far enough to put the safety

pin

in place unless someone stands under the boat (it is on the hard)

and

pushes up with some force. Before this maintenance, I could insert
the safety pin judge by pulling lightly on the cable. How can I

adjust

things so that I can get the motor to rise a small amount more so

that

I can insert the safety pin? There were two spongy seals on

between

the prop assembly and the hull, so I replaced them with two new

seals.

Could two seals be the source of the problem?

Mark Pitt
"Sabbatical III" ASM #419

A couple of days ago I did some work on the bow thruster that involved
partly removing the motor as well as changing the seals and the oil in
the bow thruster prop assembly. I have it all back together now but I
cannot get the whole thing to ascend far enough to put the safety pin
in place unless someone stands under the boat (it is on the hard) and
pushes up with some force. Before this maintenance, I could insert
the safety pin judge by pulling lightly on the cable. How can I adjust
things so that I can get the motor to rise a small amount more so that
I can insert the safety pin? There were two spongy seals on between
the prop assembly and the hull, so I replaced them with two new seals.
Could two seals be the source of the problem?

Mark Pitt
"Sabbatical III" ASM #419

Hi Vito, Following your example I have now had my heat exchanger cleaned. After 2000 hours needed it!Thanks for the tip. Ian

Dear Mr. Potter,

Thank you for the helpful information. The engine seems ok a t this point. I
definitely need new motor mounts and some seals.

The Max Prop settings are great. Thank you. Do you happen to know to much
rpm this engine should go up to under full forward power?



Udo J. Reich

ambiente european tile design

Direct 206. 388 1025

Fax 206. 388 1043



_____

From: Joel F. Potter [mailto:jfpottercys@att.net]
Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2006 1:15 PM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engine change



Dear Mr. Reich,

Is your Perkins engine in need of a re-build? I have a very
low hour VOLVO TMD 22 engine which is actually a Perkins
Prima/M80 Turbo with green paint. When Caterpillar bought
Perkins, initially they stopped Perkins from retail
marketing and instead focused on supplying other
manufacturers. Volvo marketed the Prima/M80T for several
years.

Anyway, I have one in a warehouse that was removed from a
Super Maramu because of a recurrent rear oil pan seal
failure where oil would leak out slowly. This has been
fixed. I would be willing to sell it for a lot less than a
rebuild. It has less than 500 hours, can't remember exactly
but I have it written down on the engine.

The MAX PROP numbers follow:
560 m.m
22º
X =E XRAY – ECHO
Y = D YANKEE – DELTA

Consult your MAX PROP manual if this reads like Greek to
you.

Best regards,
Joel F. Potter
AMEL 54 "HOLLIS" Hull #14







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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Dear Mr. Reich,

Is your Perkins engine in need of a re-build? I have a very
low hour VOLVO TMD 22 engine which is actually a Perkins
Prima/M80 Turbo with green paint. When Caterpillar bought
Perkins, initially they stopped Perkins from retail
marketing and instead focused on supplying other
manufacturers. Volvo marketed the Prima/M80T for several
years.

Anyway, I have one in a warehouse that was removed from a
Super Maramu because of a recurrent rear oil pan seal
failure where oil would leak out slowly. This has been
fixed. I would be willing to sell it for a lot less than a
rebuild. It has less than 500 hours, can't remember exactly
but I have it written down on the engine.

The MAX PROP numbers follow:
560 m.m
22º
X =E XRAY – ECHO
Y = D YANKEE – DELTA

Consult your MAX PROP manual if this reads like Greek to
you.

Best regards,
Joel F. Potter
AMEL 54 "HOLLIS" Hull #14


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thank you Richard. I'll check it out.



Udo J. Reich

ambiente european tile design

Direct 206. 388 1025

Fax 206. 388 1043



_____

From: closereach [mailto:closereach@yahoo.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2006 6:04 PM
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: engine change



Udo,

I have a 1989 Super Maramu with perhaps the same model M80T Perkins.
I suggest you give Foley Engines up in Mass a call or email--they
have everything you'll need to get your Perkins and Hurth
transmission running smoothly. Phone is 508-753-2979 or email
info@foleyengines.com. Even if your Perkins wasn't taken care of
properly and needs an overhaul, that may be a better (and less
costly) way to proceed.

Richard
SM#5 Spice

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "Udo J. Reich" <udo@...>
wrote:

We are the new owners of a SM built in 1991 with the 80 hp Perkins

Turbo and

a Maxprop. I have several questions.

Has anybody changed engines and switched to the 4JH3-HTE Yanmar

engine?

If we keep the Perkins, we need new motor mounts. Any idea where to

get

them?

Anybody who has the same set up with the Maxprop. What is your

cruising rpm

and your max rpm under power?

Does anybody with a max prop and the 80 hp Perkins know the setting

of the

pitch of the prop?

I'd appreciate any input.





Udo J. Reich

Cloud seven

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