Date   

Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator

Dave_Benjamin
 

David,

I agree that if you are at hull speed and there is enough excess power being generated by the sails, that you could reach a point at which the shaft generator is not slowing the boat down. It's the same thing when people run the diesel at much higher RPM than they need to. Once you hit max speed any additional force is just converted to wasted fuel at that point. However at any point where the boat has just enough power to reach hull speed or is below hull speed the prop will diminsh performance.

--- On Mon, 5/4/09, David Mackintosh <dlm48@aol.com> wrote:

From: David Mackintosh <dlm48@aol.com>
Subject: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, May 4, 2009, 3:41 AM

















YES and NO there is theory and there is practice.... ...on my O461 the boat

IS faster by up to a knot (unless you are at hull speed with plenty of wind)

if you let the prop free wheel and i know this is contrary to scientific

theory...i guess the prop is uneducated. I have discovered that this is the

case on quite a few boats i have sailed too - so this is not a one off

phenomenon.



Driving a shaft generator would i 'think' cause more drag - as you dont get

nothing for nothing - and the energy to drive that alternator has to come

from somewhere. However if you have an excess of sail power you 'might' not

see a decrease in boat speed which after all is all that matters. I am

ignoring wear and noise issues (for the pedantic).



regards



David



2009/5/3 Dave Benjamin <dave_benjamin@ yahoo.com>



Ettore and Silvana,
You are defying the laws of physics and hydrodynamics if you really think
the shaft alternator does not slow the boat down. In fact the turning
propeller acts almost like a disc. It generated more resistance than it
would if it was stationary. I would use one if it was already installed but
I would not go out of my way to install a speed brake like that. There are
some solutions in the form of a unit that is deployed from the transom. One
of my neighbors used one to and from Hawaii and it generated electricity
quite well.
--- On Sun, 5/3/09, Arca di Noè <arcadinoesailing@ hotmail.com<arcadinoesailing% 40hotmail. com>>
wrote:
From: Arca di Noè <arcadinoesailing@ hotmail.com<arcadinoesailing% 40hotmail. com>
Subject: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
To: amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com <amelyachtowners% 40yahoogroups. com>
Date: Sunday, May 3, 2009, 9:43 AM
Hi David and Hazel,
We use the shaft driven alternator in our Mango with much satisfaction.
No reduction the speed on sailing.
It will give 7/9 amp when running at 7/8 knots.
It don't works down 4 knots.
Very very important: if you have Hurth gearbox or similar, is imperative to
run the motor half our every 12 ours, to lubricate the gearbox because r
shaft running isn't enaugh to lubricate the interior of the gearbox: if the
motor is not on, is easy to break the interior disks of the gearbox.
Now our Mango is independent for the electriciy of Marina: 2 solar panel
and 1 wind generator is perfectly.
With 15/20 wind knots We have cooking the pizza in the electric four at
220v!!!
Ettore & Silvana of Arca di Noè
----- Original Message -----
From: "David and Hazel Worthington" <spritoaffine@ yahoo.co. uk>
To: <amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com>
Sent: Friday, May 01, 2009 1:43 PM
Subject: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
Hi All
Due to the charges being imposed by marina operators now for electricity
in the Med I have been considering various options to allow free battery
charging
Our rattly Max Prop needs rebuilding and I was wondering about replacing
it with a standard fixed prop in order to use the propshaft alternator
but
am concerned about loss of speed and increase in noise when sailing, does
anyone still use their prop driven alternator or has everyone turned to
solar and wind power instead. I understand we would need a 19 inch prop
but am not sure whether the 13 mentioned is inches or degrees of pitch.
Our aft cabin is too noisy to sleep in on passage due to
propshaft/cutless
bearing noise even after replacing the cutless bearing, is this normal?
Also would we go backwards straighter with the Max Prop or a fixed prop?
we don't have a bow thruster
Your opinions would be appreciated
David and Hazel Sharki 148
------------ --------- --------- ------
Yahoo! Groups Links
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




























[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator

Dave_Benjamin
 

Eric,

My professional background is in aviation and props in the water and props in the air have some similarities. Air and water are both fluids albeit water is a much denser medium. Also the laws of physics come into play. Anotherwords the prop is not freewheeling since the generator places a load on it. You cannot extract energy from the water in the form of  a prop generator without creating friction. People can believe what they want to believe. The laws of physics and hydrodynamics will still apply. The only way to really reduce the prop drag penalty is with a feathering or folding prop which is precisely why the racing rules give credits for a fixed prop. The handicappers know the fixed prop will slow a boat down and give a 3 second or 6 second per mile credit for it.

--- On Mon, 5/4/09, Eric Lindholm <etlindholm@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

From: Eric Lindholm <etlindholm@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, May 4, 2009, 2:12 PM

















David,  I actually read a study where the results showed that there was less drag with the prop freewheeling, no alternator, like you said, rather than locked. I also agree that this goes against everything I have ever heard. Even after reading the article, I have a very difficult time believing it. If I can find it I will post it for your info, or at least amusement. It was a study comparing all of the props available for sailboats, and there efficiency in forward, reverse, and under sail. It compared 2 blade, 3 blade, maxi prop, etc. Eric maramu 105



--- On Mon, 5/4/09, David Mackintosh <dlm48@aol.com> wrote:



From: David Mackintosh <dlm48@aol.com>

Subject: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator

To: amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com

Date: Monday, May 4, 2009, 3:41 AM



YES and NO there is theory and there is practice.... ...on my O461 the boat

IS faster by up to a knot (unless you are at hull speed with plenty of wind)

if you let the prop free wheel and i know this is contrary to scientific

theory...i guess the prop is uneducated. I have discovered that this is the

case on quite a few boats i have sailed too - so this is not a one off

phenomenon.



Driving a shaft generator would i 'think' cause more drag - as you dont get

nothing for nothing - and the energy to drive that alternator has to come

from somewhere. However if you have an excess of sail power you 'might' not

see a decrease in boat speed which after all is all that matters. I am

ignoring wear and noise issues (for the pedantic).



regards



David



2009/5/3 Dave Benjamin <dave_benjamin@ yahoo.com>



Ettore and Silvana,
You are defying the laws of physics and hydrodynamics if you really think
the shaft alternator does not slow the boat down. In fact the turning
propeller acts almost like a disc. It generated more resistance than it
would if it was stationary. I would use one if it was already installed but
I would not go out of my way to install a speed brake like that. There are
some solutions in the form of a unit that is deployed from the transom. One
of my neighbors used one to and from Hawaii and it generated electricity
quite well.
--- On Sun, 5/3/09, Arca di Noè <arcadinoesailing@ hotmail.com< arcadinoesailing % 40hotmail. com>>
wrote:
From: Arca di Noè <arcadinoesailing@ hotmail.com< arcadinoesailing % 40hotmail. com>
Subject: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
To: amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com <amelyachtowners% 40yahoogroups. com>
Date: Sunday, May 3, 2009, 9:43 AM
Hi David and Hazel,
We use the shaft driven alternator in our Mango with much satisfaction.
No reduction the speed on sailing.
It will give 7/9 amp when running at 7/8 knots.
It don't works down 4 knots.
Very very important: if you have Hurth gearbox or similar, is imperative to
run the motor half our every 12 ours, to lubricate the gearbox because r
shaft running isn't enaugh to lubricate the interior of the gearbox: if the
motor is not on, is easy to break the interior disks of the gearbox.
Now our Mango is independent for the electriciy of Marina: 2 solar panel
and 1 wind generator is perfectly.
With 15/20 wind knots We have cooking the pizza in the electric four at
220v!!!
Ettore & Silvana of Arca di Noè
----- Original Message -----
From: "David and Hazel Worthington" <spritoaffine@ yahoo.co. uk>
To: <amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com>
Sent: Friday, May 01, 2009 1:43 PM
Subject: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
Hi All
Due to the charges being imposed by marina operators now for electricity
in the Med I have been considering various options to allow free battery
charging
Our rattly Max Prop needs rebuilding and I was wondering about replacing
it with a standard fixed prop in order to use the propshaft alternator
but
am concerned about loss of speed and increase in noise when sailing, does
anyone still use their prop driven alternator or has everyone turned to
solar and wind power instead. I understand we would need a 19 inch prop
but am not sure whether the 13 mentioned is inches or degrees of pitch.
Our aft cabin is too noisy to sleep in on passage due to
propshaft/cutless
bearing noise even after replacing the cutless bearing, is this normal?
Also would we go backwards straighter with the Max Prop or a fixed prop?
we don't have a bow thruster
Your opinions would be appreciated
David and Hazel Sharki 148
------------ --------- --------- ------
Yahoo! Groups Links






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator

Eric Lindholm
 

David,  I actually read a study where the results showed that there was less drag with the prop freewheeling, no alternator, like you said, rather than locked. I also agree that this goes against everything I have ever heard. Even after reading the article, I have a very difficult time believing it. If I can find it I will post it for your info, or at least amusement. It was a study comparing all of the props available for sailboats, and there efficiency in forward, reverse, and under sail. It compared 2 blade, 3 blade, maxi prop, etc. Eric maramu 105

--- On Mon, 5/4/09, David Mackintosh <dlm48@aol.com> wrote:

From: David Mackintosh <dlm48@aol.com>
Subject: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, May 4, 2009, 3:41 AM








YES and NO there is theory and there is practice.... ...on my O461 the boat
IS faster by up to a knot (unless you are at hull speed with plenty of wind)
if you let the prop free wheel and i know this is contrary to scientific
theory...i guess the prop is uneducated. I have discovered that this is the
case on quite a few boats i have sailed too - so this is not a one off
phenomenon.

Driving a shaft generator would i 'think' cause more drag - as you dont get
nothing for nothing - and the energy to drive that alternator has to come
from somewhere. However if you have an excess of sail power you 'might' not
see a decrease in boat speed which after all is all that matters. I am
ignoring wear and noise issues (for the pedantic).

regards

David

2009/5/3 Dave Benjamin <dave_benjamin@ yahoo.com>



Ettore and Silvana,

You are defying the laws of physics and hydrodynamics if you really think
the shaft alternator does not slow the boat down. In fact the turning
propeller acts almost like a disc. It generated more resistance than it
would if it was stationary. I would use one if it was already installed but
I would not go out of my way to install a speed brake like that. There are
some solutions in the form of a unit that is deployed from the transom. One
of my neighbors used one to and from Hawaii and it generated electricity
quite well.

--- On Sun, 5/3/09, Arca di Noè <arcadinoesailing@ hotmail.com<arcadinoesailing% 40hotmail. com>>
wrote:

From: Arca di Noè <arcadinoesailing@ hotmail.com<arcadinoesailing% 40hotmail. com>
Subject: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
To: amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com <amelyachtowners% 40yahoogroups. com>
Date: Sunday, May 3, 2009, 9:43 AM


Hi David and Hazel,

We use the shaft driven alternator in our Mango with much satisfaction.

No reduction the speed on sailing.

It will give 7/9 amp when running at 7/8 knots.

It don't works down 4 knots.

Very very important: if you have Hurth gearbox or similar, is imperative to


run the motor half our every 12 ours, to lubricate the gearbox because r

shaft running isn't enaugh to lubricate the interior of the gearbox: if the


motor is not on, is easy to break the interior disks of the gearbox.

Now our Mango is independent for the electriciy of Marina: 2 solar panel

and 1 wind generator is perfectly.

With 15/20 wind knots We have cooking the pizza in the electric four at

220v!!!

Ettore & Silvana of Arca di Noè

----- Original Message -----

From: "David and Hazel Worthington" <spritoaffine@ yahoo.co. uk>

To: <amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com>

Sent: Friday, May 01, 2009 1:43 PM

Subject: [Amel] shaft driven alternator

Hi All
Due to the charges being imposed by marina operators now for electricity
in the Med I have been considering various options to allow free battery
charging
Our rattly Max Prop needs rebuilding and I was wondering about replacing
it with a standard fixed prop in order to use the propshaft alternator
but

am concerned about loss of speed and increase in noise when sailing, does

anyone still use their prop driven alternator or has everyone turned to
solar and wind power instead. I understand we would need a 19 inch prop
but am not sure whether the 13 mentioned is inches or degrees of pitch.
Our aft cabin is too noisy to sleep in on passage due to
propshaft/cutless

bearing noise even after replacing the cutless bearing, is this normal?
Also would we go backwards straighter with the Max Prop or a fixed prop?
we don't have a bow thruster
Your opinions would be appreciated
David and Hazel Sharki 148
------------ --------- --------- ------
Yahoo! Groups Links










[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: URGENT Help Needed - RPM Issues

Howard Berger
 

We had a similar thing happen to us in our previous boat, a Caliber 40, on passage from the Canaries to the Caribbean. That engine was a Yanmar, but the cause may apply in your case, too. It turned out to be the injector pump. The symptom was we could only get about 1,600 RPM in gear, but in neutral the engine would run up to 3,400. It happened when I switched fuel tanks at the manifold (the Caliber has two, separate fuel tanks) and the fuel in tank #2 was contaminated. We had the injector pump rebuilt in St. Thomas, USVI and the engine ran fine after that.

Good luck with your problem and hope you solve it soon.

Howard Berger
s/v Jazz
Maramu 144


Re: URGENT Help Needed - RPM Issues

amelliahona <no_reply@...>
 

Please ask Kent to let this forum know what you find as the cause. Curious minds like to know.
Thanks, Gary


Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator

Arca di Noè
 

Dave Bejamin,

fortunately, we aren't physic and hydrodynamic engineers, but only Medical
Doctors who crossed Atlantic Ocean 3 times and we stayed at mooring many
weeks in Mediterranean and in Caribbean sea.

In our profession, even if we know it, we aren't following teory: but in
medical pratice is absolutely necessary to obtain risult which solves the
problem.

For this reason, when our Mango sails at over 7 knots, the speed loss is so
minimum to be virtually considered 0.

We are sorry if that is defying laws of physics and hydrodynamics, but the
shaft driven alternator works very well during ocean crossing, but wind
generator with solar panels is the top at mooring.

Regards

Ettore & Silvana

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Benjamin" <dave_benjamin@yahoo.com>
To: <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, May 04, 2009 12:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator


Ettore and Silvana,

You are defying the laws of physics and hydrodynamics if you really think
the shaft alternator does not slow the boat down. In fact the turning
propeller acts almost like a disc. It generated more resistance than it
would if it was stationary. I would use one if it was already installed but
I would not go out of my way to install a speed brake like that. There are
some solutions in the form of a unit that is deployed from the transom. One
of my neighbors used one to and from Hawaii and it generated electricity
quite well.

--- On Sun, 5/3/09, Arca di No <arcadinoesailing@hotmail.com> wrote:

From: Arca di No <arcadinoesailing@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sunday, May 3, 2009, 9:43 AM

















Hi David and Hazel,



We use the shaft driven alternator in our Mango with much satisfaction.

No reduction the speed on sailing.

It will give 7/9 amp when running at 7/8 knots.

It don't works down 4 knots.

Very very important: if you have Hurth gearbox or similar, is imperative to

run the motor half our every 12 ours, to lubricate the gearbox because r

shaft running isn't enaugh to lubricate the interior of the gearbox: if the

motor is not on, is easy to break the interior disks of the gearbox.



Now our Mango is independent for the electriciy of Marina: 2 solar panel

and 1 wind generator is perfectly.



With 15/20 wind knots We have cooking the pizza in the electric four at

220v!!!



Ettore & Silvana of Arca di No



----- Original Message -----

From: "David and Hazel Worthington" <spritoaffine@ yahoo.co. uk>

To: <amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com>

Sent: Friday, May 01, 2009 1:43 PM

Subject: [Amel] shaft driven alternator



Hi All
Due to the charges being imposed by marina operators now for electricity
in the Med I have been considering various options to allow free battery
charging
Our rattly Max Prop needs rebuilding and I was wondering about replacing
it with a standard fixed prop in order to use the propshaft alternator but
am concerned about loss of speed and increase in noise when sailing, does
anyone still use their prop driven alternator or has everyone turned to
solar and wind power instead. I understand we would need a 19 inch prop
but am not sure whether the 13 mentioned is inches or degrees of pitch.
Our aft cabin is too noisy to sleep in on passage due to propshaft/cutless
bearing noise even after replacing the cutless bearing, is this normal?
Also would we go backwards straighter with the Max Prop or a fixed prop?
we don't have a bow thruster
Your opinions would be appreciated
David and Hazel Sharki 148
------------ --------- --------- ------
Yahoo! Groups Links































------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: [Amel] Engine RPM and Davit problems

David Mackintosh <dlm48@...>
 

Not knowing what dinghy you have or davits the solution is to stop the
dinghy moving (but i am sure you know this). Webbing ratchet straps would
be my method and you can get them with stainless steel ratchets now and
fairly cheaply. Just dont buy them from any Davit outlet as they seem to
like to mark them up astronomically. They come with hooks and or soft loops
in the ends - so you can choose which fits your application easily. With
Four of these it should be easy to hold the dinghy stationary....perhaps you
might need to make a 'receptacle' or two that fixed into the deck - davits -
or stern rails into which the dinghy tube was located - i am sure you could
have these made easily from GRP using the tube as a mould and then lining
the GRP with 1/2" of neoprene so you have a soft landing pad.

regards

David


2009/5/4 John and Anne on Bali Hai <annejohnholl@gmail.com>



The problem is most likely to be one of fuel supply into the injectors as
if it was a prop thing the incorrect pitch overloading the engine would
generate black smoke.It could be an algae growth in the fuel tank which has
an internal filter which might be nearly blocked. My last boat was an Oyster
435 which I suffered until I got my Amel. One of the many problems was algae
build up on the filter im the fuel tank. This filter was formed with two
brass plates held apart by fine gauze around the periphery and the suction
from the engine battling the algae build up caused the thing to collapse. I
scrapped that filter which fortunately was accessible without totally
draining the tank as would be necessary on my SM to get at the filter. There
were two feed pipes coming from the filter,one for the engine and the other
for a heater if fitted.I bent the heater pipe down to touch the lowest point
in the tank and the fuel pipe to about a couple of inches above that. I had
the dirty fuel polished in Fiji and then from time to time drained several
water bottles full of fuel from the bottom of the tank until I got a bottle
of clear fuel. After allowing the water in the bottles to settle I then
poured the clear fuel back into the tank. I copy this system with my Amel by
removing the plate from the top of the tank,threading a copper pipe down to
the bottom where the outlet/filter is and pumping out the watery fuel until
I get the clean sample.
I have davits but can only use them for lifting the dinghy out of thieves
way when at anchor or in totally flat seas as I have found it impossible to
pull my RIB up tight enough to stop it chafing against the davits. If we
want to lift the dinghy with engine I use one of the lines from the mizzen
fixed to the engine end davit and take up the weight on the main sheet winch
whilst Anne takes up the slack on the davit lines. Any advice on how to use
the davits on short passages without chafe would be appreciated.

Happy revving, Anne and John SM 319



Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator

David Mackintosh <dlm48@...>
 

YES and NO there is theory and there is practice.......on my O461 the boat
IS faster by up to a knot (unless you are at hull speed with plenty of wind)
if you let the prop free wheel and i know this is contrary to scientific
theory...i guess the prop is uneducated. I have discovered that this is the
case on quite a few boats i have sailed too - so this is not a one off
phenomenon.

Driving a shaft generator would i 'think' cause more drag - as you dont get
nothing for nothing - and the energy to drive that alternator has to come
from somewhere. However if you have an excess of sail power you 'might' not
see a decrease in boat speed which after all is all that matters. I am
ignoring wear and noise issues (for the pedantic).

regards

David

2009/5/3 Dave Benjamin <dave_benjamin@yahoo.com>



Ettore and Silvana,

You are defying the laws of physics and hydrodynamics if you really think
the shaft alternator does not slow the boat down. In fact the turning
propeller acts almost like a disc. It generated more resistance than it
would if it was stationary. I would use one if it was already installed but
I would not go out of my way to install a speed brake like that. There are
some solutions in the form of a unit that is deployed from the transom. One
of my neighbors used one to and from Hawaii and it generated electricity
quite well.

--- On Sun, 5/3/09, Arca di Noè <arcadinoesailing@hotmail.com<arcadinoesailing%40hotmail.com>>
wrote:

From: Arca di Noè <arcadinoesailing@hotmail.com<arcadinoesailing%40hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com <amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>
Date: Sunday, May 3, 2009, 9:43 AM


Hi David and Hazel,

We use the shaft driven alternator in our Mango with much satisfaction.

No reduction the speed on sailing.

It will give 7/9 amp when running at 7/8 knots.

It don't works down 4 knots.

Very very important: if you have Hurth gearbox or similar, is imperative to


run the motor half our every 12 ours, to lubricate the gearbox because r

shaft running isn't enaugh to lubricate the interior of the gearbox: if the


motor is not on, is easy to break the interior disks of the gearbox.

Now our Mango is independent for the electriciy of Marina: 2 solar panel

and 1 wind generator is perfectly.

With 15/20 wind knots We have cooking the pizza in the electric four at

220v!!!

Ettore & Silvana of Arca di Noè

----- Original Message -----

From: "David and Hazel Worthington" <spritoaffine@ yahoo.co. uk>

To: <amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com>

Sent: Friday, May 01, 2009 1:43 PM

Subject: [Amel] shaft driven alternator

Hi All
Due to the charges being imposed by marina operators now for electricity
in the Med I have been considering various options to allow free battery
charging
Our rattly Max Prop needs rebuilding and I was wondering about replacing
it with a standard fixed prop in order to use the propshaft alternator
but

am concerned about loss of speed and increase in noise when sailing, does

anyone still use their prop driven alternator or has everyone turned to
solar and wind power instead. I understand we would need a 19 inch prop
but am not sure whether the 13 mentioned is inches or degrees of pitch.
Our aft cabin is too noisy to sleep in on passage due to
propshaft/cutless

bearing noise even after replacing the cutless bearing, is this normal?
Also would we go backwards straighter with the Max Prop or a fixed prop?
we don't have a bow thruster
Your opinions would be appreciated
David and Hazel Sharki 148
------------ --------- --------- ------
Yahoo! Groups Links














[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Engine RPM and Davit problems

John and Anne on Bali Hai <annejohnholl@...>
 

The problem is most likely to be one of fuel supply into the injectors as if it was a prop thing the incorrect pitch overloading the engine would generate black smoke.It could be an algae growth in the fuel tank which has an internal filter which might be nearly blocked. My last boat was an Oyster 435 which I suffered until I got my Amel. One of the many problems was algae build up on the filter im the fuel tank. This filter was formed with two brass plates held apart by fine gauze around the periphery and the suction from the engine battling the algae build up caused the thing to collapse. I scrapped that filter which fortunately was accessible without totally draining the tank as would be necessary on my SM to get at the filter. There were two feed pipes coming from the filter,one for the engine and the other for a heater if fitted.I bent the heater pipe down to touch the lowest point in the tank and the fuel pipe to about a couple of inches above that. I had the dirty fuel polished in Fiji and then from time to time drained several water bottles full of fuel from the bottom of the tank until I got a bottle of clear fuel. After allowing the water in the bottles to settle I then poured the clear fuel back into the tank. I copy this system with my Amel by removing the plate from the top of the tank,threading a copper pipe down to the bottom where the outlet/filter is and pumping out the watery fuel until I get the clean sample.
I have davits but can only use them for lifting the dinghy out of thieves way when at anchor or in totally flat seas as I have found it impossible to pull my RIB up tight enough to stop it chafing against the davits. If we want to lift the dinghy with engine I use one of the lines from the mizzen fixed to the engine end davit and take up the weight on the main sheet winch whilst Anne takes up the slack on the davit lines. Any advice on how to use the davits on short passages without chafe would be appreciated.

Happy revving, Anne and John SM 319


Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator

Robin Cooter <robincooter@...>
 

On our Santorin there is a definate reduction of speed when the shaft charger is switched on.   At slower boat speed it is not viable as it reduces a greater percentage of the boat speed but on longer passages, when the speed is greater, it is worthwhile.  It was really useful on an atlantic passage where it provided most of the necessary charge, only requiring a couple of top ups with the generator.
 
Robin Cooter
Santorin 004, Belouga.

--- On Sun, 3/5/09, Dave Benjamin <dave_benjamin@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Dave Benjamin <dave_benjamin@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sunday, 3 May, 2009, 11:48 PM








Ettore and Silvana,

You are defying the laws of physics and hydrodynamics if you really think the shaft alternator does not slow the boat down. In fact the turning propeller acts almost like a disc. It generated more resistance than it would if it was stationary. I would use one if it was already installed but I would not go out of my way to install a speed brake like that. There are some solutions in the form of a unit that is deployed from the transom. One of my neighbors used one to and from Hawaii and it generated electricity quite well.

--- On Sun, 5/3/09, Arca di Noè <arcadinoesailing@ hotmail.com> wrote:

From: Arca di Noè <arcadinoesailing@ hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
To: amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Sunday, May 3, 2009, 9:43 AM

Hi David and Hazel,

We use the shaft driven alternator in our Mango with much satisfaction.

No reduction the speed on sailing.

It will give 7/9 amp when running at 7/8 knots.

It don't works down 4 knots.

Very very important: if you have Hurth gearbox or similar, is imperative to

run the motor half our every 12 ours, to lubricate the gearbox because r

shaft running isn't enaugh to lubricate the interior of the gearbox: if the

motor is not on, is easy to break the interior disks of the gearbox.

Now our Mango is independent for the electriciy of Marina: 2 solar panel

and 1 wind generator is perfectly.

With 15/20 wind knots We have cooking the pizza in the electric four at

220v!!!

Ettore & Silvana of Arca di Noè

----- Original Message -----

From: "David and Hazel Worthington" <spritoaffine@ yahoo.co. uk>

To: <amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com>

Sent: Friday, May 01, 2009 1:43 PM

Subject: [Amel] shaft driven alternator

Hi All
Due to the charges being imposed by marina operators now for electricity
in the Med I have been considering various options to allow free battery
charging
Our rattly Max Prop needs rebuilding and I was wondering about replacing
it with a standard fixed prop in order to use the propshaft alternator but
am concerned about loss of speed and increase in noise when sailing, does
anyone still use their prop driven alternator or has everyone turned to
solar and wind power instead. I understand we would need a 19 inch prop
but am not sure whether the 13 mentioned is inches or degrees of pitch.
Our aft cabin is too noisy to sleep in on passage due to propshaft/cutless
bearing noise even after replacing the cutless bearing, is this normal?
Also would we go backwards straighter with the Max Prop or a fixed prop?
we don't have a bow thruster
Your opinions would be appreciated
David and Hazel Sharki 148
------------ --------- --------- ------
Yahoo! Groups Links










[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: URGENT Help Needed - RPM Issues

joseph mc donnell
 

An extra thought, check the throttle cable. It may be that it is just not opening enough to allow the extra fuel through to the injectors to increase the revs. May be corroded, have streached or slipped over time, to give a gradual decline in revs and now just needs a slight adjustment or replacing if there is corrosion .
Regards Joe


Re: [Amel] solar power

Eric Lindholm
 

The panels are 123 watts at 15 volts. The manufacturer claims 351 amps per week at 15 volts. The panels are 60 " long by 26" wide. I get about 70% of what the manufacturer claims. The panels don't get hat from the production of  electricity, but from the outside tempreature. On hot days the output is reduced somewhat. Hope this helps. Eric Maramu 105

--- On Sun, 5/3/09, Iv Pepe <iv_pepe@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Iv Pepe <iv_pepe@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Amel] solar power
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sunday, May 3, 2009, 5:36 PM








HI,
How big (wats) your solar panels are?
We order  two 24V semiflex solar panel 2.2A each, for marine use  5mm thick.
they do not get hot ( acording manifacturer SUNWARE ) Can we get abb. 50A per day?
Pepe
SM 223

--- El dom, 3/5/09, Eric Lindholm <etlindholm@sbcgloba l.net> escribió:

De: Eric Lindholm <etlindholm@sbcgloba l.net>
Asunto: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
Para: amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com
Fecha: domingo, 3 mayo, 2009 11:20

I use my shaft driven alternator and generally get 6 to 8 amps at 6 or 7 knots. Little if any noise in the aft stateroom, and I don't notice any reduction in speed. I have run with the trans locked out in a steady wind measured the speed, then released it with no change. Solar power is really limited. The largest array only puts out about 7 amps, and that is if the panel is cool, and only between about 11:00am and 3:00pm on an average day from May through September northern hemisphere. I am in California and I average closer to 4.5 amps., from about 10:00am to 5:00pm. Be sure you have a controller installed, because the panel will discharge at night if you don't. Never tried a wind generator, but it looks attractive.
 
Eric Maramu 105

--- On Fri, 5/1/09, David and Hazel Worthington <spritoaffine@ yahoo.co. uk> wrote:

From: David and Hazel Worthington <spritoaffine@ yahoo.co. uk>
Subject: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
To: amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Friday, May 1, 2009, 4:43 AM

Hi All
Due to the charges being imposed by marina operators now for electricity in the Med I have been considering various options to allow free battery charging

Our rattly Max Prop needs rebuilding and I was wondering about replacing it with a standard fixed prop in order to use the propshaft alternator but am concerned about loss of speed and increase in noise when sailing, does anyone still use their prop driven alternator or has everyone turned to solar and wind power instead. I understand we would need a 19 inch prop but am not sure whether the 13 mentioned is inches or degrees of pitch. Our aft cabin is too noisy to sleep in on passage due to propshaft/cutless bearing noise even after replacing the cutless bearing, is this normal? Also would we go backwards straighter with the Max Prop or a fixed prop? we don't have a bow thruster
Your opinions would be appreciated
David and Hazel Sharki 148




















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: URGENT Help Needed - RPM Issues

amelliahona <no_reply@...>
 

Additional Thought:

When you dive on the prop make sure the blades are freely rotating and not binding.

Gary


Re: URGENT Help Needed - RPM Issues

amelliahona <no_reply@...>
 

Here are a couple of thoughts:

1. Prop Clean: I have seen enough prop growth in three weeks to affect RPM a lot.
2. Fuel Shut Off Valve: Verify that the fuel shut off valve in the quarter berth companionway hasn't been bumped to a partially closed position. You can verify it is fully actuating in the engine room. I had this happen once and it is the first thing I check now.
3. Engine Fuel Filter: How about the on engine fuel filter? Is this a Yanmar or Volvo Penta? The Yanmar has an on engine fuel filter, I don't know about the Volvo Penta.
4. Raycor Filters: what was the condition of the Raycors? Where they dirty? Are the bowls clean now. In a tank that has accumulated a lot of crud over the years there could be enough crud to easily overwhelm a new filter and may require fuel polishing or at least several filter changes.
5. Exhaust blockage after the turbocharger: Remove and inspect the sea water injection elbow to make sure it isn't partially plugged.
6. Injectors, ? condition.

Just some thoughts, Best of Luck, Gary


Re: [Amel] solar power

Iv Pepe <iv_pepe@...>
 

HI,
How big (wats) your solar panels are?
We order  two 24V semiflex solar panel 2.2A each, for marine use  5mm thick.
they do not get hot ( acording manifacturer SUNWARE ) Can we get abb. 50A per day?
Pepe
SM 223

--- El dom, 3/5/09, Eric Lindholm <etlindholm@sbcglobal.net> escribió:

De: Eric Lindholm <etlindholm@sbcglobal.net>
Asunto: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
Para: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Fecha: domingo, 3 mayo, 2009 11:20








I use my shaft driven alternator and generally get 6 to 8 amps at 6 or 7 knots. Little if any noise in the aft stateroom, and I don't notice any reduction in speed. I have run with the trans locked out in a steady wind measured the speed, then released it with no change. Solar power is really limited. The largest array only puts out about 7 amps, and that is if the panel is cool, and only between about 11:00am and 3:00pm on an average day from May through September northern hemisphere. I am in California and I average closer to 4.5 amps., from about 10:00am to 5:00pm. Be sure you have a controller installed, because the panel will discharge at night if you don't. Never tried a wind generator, but it looks attractive.
 
Eric Maramu 105

--- On Fri, 5/1/09, David and Hazel Worthington <spritoaffine@ yahoo.co. uk> wrote:

From: David and Hazel Worthington <spritoaffine@ yahoo.co. uk>
Subject: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
To: amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Friday, May 1, 2009, 4:43 AM

Hi All
Due to the charges being imposed by marina operators now for electricity in the Med I have been considering various options to allow free battery charging

Our rattly Max Prop needs rebuilding and I was wondering about replacing it with a standard fixed prop in order to use the propshaft alternator but am concerned about loss of speed and increase in noise when sailing, does anyone still use their prop driven alternator or has everyone turned to solar and wind power instead. I understand we would need a 19 inch prop but am not sure whether the 13 mentioned is inches or degrees of pitch. Our aft cabin is too noisy to sleep in on passage due to propshaft/cutless bearing noise even after replacing the cutless bearing, is this normal? Also would we go backwards straighter with the Max Prop or a fixed prop? we don't have a bow thruster
Your opinions would be appreciated
David and Hazel Sharki 148

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


URGENT Help Needed - RPM Issues

ericmeury <ericmeury@...>
 

hello, i'm helping kent bring his SM hull number 243 to richmond via bahamas. We are currently at the docks in ft lauderdale.

Kent sailed the boat from tx to ft laurdale and was only able to acheive a max of 1600 rpm.

Based upon previous experience and all the posts Ray Eaton was convinced that it was the turbo. Ray took the turbo off the boat had some part was broken and need to be replaced. The turbo was fixed and cleaned, so no carbon issues.

Also the prop ws cleaned before he left texas. So the probability that it is the prop is not high either. We haven't dove in yet to check but i do plan to do that on monday.

We are only able to do 1250 RPM under load. Engine doesn't smoke at all btw.

The Raycor's have also been cleaned.

Clearly this is an issue with these engines and most of the problem is related to carbon build up. After tracing the above and finding no problems, where do we go from here... injectors? fuel pump? and also any easy way to check.

Thank you.


Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator

Dave_Benjamin
 

Ettore and Silvana,

You are defying the laws of physics and hydrodynamics if you really think the shaft alternator does not slow the boat down. In fact the turning propeller acts almost like a disc. It generated more resistance than it would if it was stationary. I would use one if it was already installed but I would not go out of my way to install a speed brake like that. There are some solutions in the form of a unit that is deployed from the transom. One of my neighbors used one to and from Hawaii and it generated electricity quite well.

--- On Sun, 5/3/09, Arca di Noè <arcadinoesailing@hotmail.com> wrote:

From: Arca di Noè <arcadinoesailing@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sunday, May 3, 2009, 9:43 AM

















Hi David and Hazel,



We use the shaft driven alternator in our Mango with much satisfaction.

No reduction the speed on sailing.

It will give 7/9 amp when running at 7/8 knots.

It don't works down 4 knots.

Very very important: if you have Hurth gearbox or similar, is imperative to

run the motor half our every 12 ours, to lubricate the gearbox because r

shaft running isn't enaugh to lubricate the interior of the gearbox: if the

motor is not on, is easy to break the interior disks of the gearbox.



Now our Mango is independent for the electriciy of Marina: 2 solar panel

and 1 wind generator is perfectly.



With 15/20 wind knots We have cooking the pizza in the electric four at

220v!!!



Ettore & Silvana of Arca di Noè



----- Original Message -----

From: "David and Hazel Worthington" <spritoaffine@ yahoo.co. uk>

To: <amelyachtowners@ yahoogroups. com>

Sent: Friday, May 01, 2009 1:43 PM

Subject: [Amel] shaft driven alternator



Hi All
Due to the charges being imposed by marina operators now for electricity
in the Med I have been considering various options to allow free battery
charging
Our rattly Max Prop needs rebuilding and I was wondering about replacing
it with a standard fixed prop in order to use the propshaft alternator but
am concerned about loss of speed and increase in noise when sailing, does
anyone still use their prop driven alternator or has everyone turned to
solar and wind power instead. I understand we would need a 19 inch prop
but am not sure whether the 13 mentioned is inches or degrees of pitch.
Our aft cabin is too noisy to sleep in on passage due to propshaft/cutless
bearing noise even after replacing the cutless bearing, is this normal?
Also would we go backwards straighter with the Max Prop or a fixed prop?
we don't have a bow thruster
Your opinions would be appreciated
David and Hazel Sharki 148
------------ --------- --------- ------
Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: Secteur Blanc Davids

rossirossix4
 

I think the web site is http://www.secteurblanc.fr/

Bob, Brittany de la Mer

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "svbebe" <yahoogroups@...> wrote:

You can contact Franck at secteurblanc"at"aol.com.

Secteurblanc made custom drapries and throw pillow covers for #387 and also cockpit cushions and a really good shade cover that was custom fitted between the main and mizzen


Best,

Bill
s/v BeBe SM2 #387


--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "ralph.heilig" <ralph.heilig@> wrote:

Craig

thank you for the fast response! I'm going to La Rochelle on Wednesday. I'm in the final selection of the Equipment.

Currently I have few open points I want to discuss with AMEL:

1) Iridium Sat Phone installation
2) External WLAN Antenna
3) Mastcamera (pan/tilt/zoom)

Ralph


--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "sv_seabbatical" <sv.lonestar@> wrote:

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "ralph.heilig" <ralph.heilig@> wrote:

Can someone tell me what manufactorer and type this davits is. I awaiting a new 54 so I'm interested into this solution as an alternative for the Simpson. Also what weight it can carry.

Is there a www link with more technical details? I did not find it on the web.

Thanks

Ralph
Ralph,
The web address is www.secteurblanc.com but I do not think the web sight is working. If you have trouble connecting via the web you should email Franck Chive at Secteur Blanc. His email is "secteurblanc@". I had them look after our boat in La Rochelle last winter and they did an excellent job.
Craig
Lone Star - Amel 54 #101


Re: Secteur Blanc Davids

svbebe <yahoogroups@...>
 

You can contact Franck at secteurblanc"at"aol.com.

Secteurblanc made custom drapries and throw pillow covers for #387 and also cockpit cushions and a really good shade cover that was custom fitted between the main and mizzen


Best,

Bill
s/v BeBe SM2 #387

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "ralph.heilig" <ralph.heilig@...> wrote:

Craig

thank you for the fast response! I'm going to La Rochelle on Wednesday. I'm in the final selection of the Equipment.

Currently I have few open points I want to discuss with AMEL:

1) Iridium Sat Phone installation
2) External WLAN Antenna
3) Mastcamera (pan/tilt/zoom)

Ralph


--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "sv_seabbatical" <sv.lonestar@> wrote:

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "ralph.heilig" <ralph.heilig@> wrote:

Can someone tell me what manufactorer and type this davits is. I awaiting a new 54 so I'm interested into this solution as an alternative for the Simpson. Also what weight it can carry.

Is there a www link with more technical details? I did not find it on the web.

Thanks

Ralph
Ralph,
The web address is www.secteurblanc.com but I do not think the web sight is working. If you have trouble connecting via the web you should email Franck Chive at Secteur Blanc. His email is "secteurblanc@". I had them look after our boat in La Rochelle last winter and they did an excellent job.
Craig
Lone Star - Amel 54 #101


Re: [Amel] shaft driven alternator

Arca di Noè
 

Hi David and Hazel,

We use the shaft driven alternator in our Mango with much satisfaction.
No reduction the speed on sailing.
It will give 7/9 amp when running at 7/8 knots.
It don't works down 4 knots.
Very very important: if you have Hurth gearbox or similar, is imperative to run the motor half our every 12 ours, to lubricate the gearbox because r shaft running isn't enaugh to lubricate the interior of the gearbox: if the motor is not on, is easy to break the interior disks of the gearbox.

Now our Mango is independent for the electriciy of Marina: 2 solar panel and 1 wind generator is perfectly.

With 15/20 wind knots We have cooking the pizza in the electric four at 220v!!!

Ettore & Silvana of Arca di No

----- Original Message -----
From: "David and Hazel Worthington" <spritoaffine@yahoo.co.uk>
To: <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, May 01, 2009 1:43 PM
Subject: [Amel] shaft driven alternator


Hi All
Due to the charges being imposed by marina operators now for electricity in the Med I have been considering various options to allow free battery charging

Our rattly Max Prop needs rebuilding and I was wondering about replacing it with a standard fixed prop in order to use the propshaft alternator but am concerned about loss of speed and increase in noise when sailing, does anyone still use their prop driven alternator or has everyone turned to solar and wind power instead. I understand we would need a 19 inch prop but am not sure whether the 13 mentioned is inches or degrees of pitch. Our aft cabin is too noisy to sleep in on passage due to propshaft/cutless bearing noise even after replacing the cutless bearing, is this normal? Also would we go backwards straighter with the Max Prop or a fixed prop? we don't have a bow thruster
Your opinions would be appreciated
David and Hazel Sharki 148



------------------------------------

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