Date   

Photos of damaged Amels - remove or not?

Zanareva
 

What do you--the members that make up this Forum--want? So far four
owners have spoken up: two to remove the photos; two to keep the
photos. This is your forum; if you have an opinion about this please
speak up!

I know why I started this Forum 3 years ago: to share knowledge about
these boats with other owners out there. The good. The bad. Seeing
photos of hurricane damaged Amels hasn't changed my opinion about
these great yachts. In fact, by posting the photos we--again--learned
something very interesting about our manufacturer. One of our members
reports that Amel arranged for a barge to pull 'their' boats out of
the water and to transport the damaged boats back to La Rochelle.
Hmmm. Has Swan or HR or Oyster gone that far?

I too am troubled by removing these photos. Where could this lead? To
censoring anything negative that comes up? We all have spent
considerable sums purchasing these yachts--could it be that we are so
concerned on resale value that we don't want any flaws or negative
findings to get 'out there'?

Some could say there was nothing to learn from these photos--but
morbid fascination. But is that true? Perhaps the owner the sunk
Mango/Maramu/Sharki will tell us if he/she had the watertight doors
shut tight or not. I learned that even putting the boats on the hard
didn't remove the boats from danger.

That's where I sit? What about you?

Richard Tate
SM #5 "Spice"


Damaged Amels

amelliahona <no_reply@...>
 

I too am a little distressed that the photo's were removed. Was it
because of limited space for photos and these photos could be found
elsewhere? I have since searched out a number of other photos of the
sad situation in Grenada. My Amel was in one of those yards two
years ago for hurricane season and I felt smug and secure that I was
outside the hurricane belt. This was really a wake up call for me.
Liahona was in a canal in Ft. Lauderdale but that didn't keep me from
sweating bullets during Francis, Ivan, and Jeanne.

Bottom line is that if there is a direct hit of a category 5
hurricane there is little that anyone can do. I was surprised,
howevere, to see a lot of sails and even dinghys on boats. I thought
it was standard practice to take everything down to minimize windage
etc.

I count many in Grenada as good friends and I feel genuine pain for
their losses as well as the losses of everyone else that has suffered
during this active hurricane season.

Amel has always been a quality company, in my opinion there are none
better when it comes to owner service. I hope this forum will remain
a place where both good points and bad points of view can be
tolerated.

God bless those who have suffered losses, Gary Silver SM # 335
Liahona


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Photos removed

Erick MEJEAN <maramu@...>
 

I'm very sorry to see that the politically correct diktat has reached this forum. May I remind to those who gets so easily offended by the naked truth that sailing carries some objective risks. Its is better to be prepared...... In the case of Ivan a good set of picture is better than a pontoon forum....
What is wrong in showing some damaged Amel? Is this forum not about Amel? Does it damage the image of the yard????? I don't think so as any sensible sailor who has gone through some real rough weather knows that the sea can be incredibly powerful. Thus,the damaged occurred by the Amel's yacht are not worrying at all given the magnitude of Ivan. Even the Titanic went down.......... As far as I understand the main purpose of this forum is to share any kind of experience, good or bad about Amel's yachts, it is not mean to be an advertising center for Amel..........Despite the picture I would still prefer to face a Hurricane in my SM than in most of the similar yachts available on the market.
One last question? Does this means that from today onwards only good things about our beloved yachts can be said on this forum?
Regards to all

----Original Message Follows----
From: "closereach" <closereach@...>
Reply-To: amelyachtowners@...
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Photos removed
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 2004 11:41:22 -0000


Eric, Jerome and Amel owners,
Photos of damaged Amels have been removed for this site. If anyone
wants to see how Ivan ravaged Grenada, the Seven Seas Cruising
Association has a link to several websites loaded with photos. Go to
http://www.ssca.org

_________________________________________________________________
Download MSN Messenger emoticons and display pictures. http://ilovemessenger.msn.com/?mkt=en-sg


Re: Digest Number 492

asm283 <no_reply@...>
 

You must understand that there were 20 foot waves crashing into that
marina. I think that Amel was flung in the air and landed on another
boat and that is how it was holed. In other cases catamarans were
flying trough the air and holed boats. That is how a 72' custom Farr
was sunk. At another marina a mid 80s Halberg rassy 42 was holed and
sunk as well as a hans Christian, Yet righ next to these boats was an
Oday 35 that survived quite well!

V C


--- In amelyachtowners@..., "Tom Keesling"
<tkeesling@m...> wrote:



Could you comment on your observations of the damage to the Amels
vs. the
others? For those of us that have not had a factory tour of all
the major
offshore manufactures, we sadly observed that you can learn a lot
about boat
construction when they are tossed about and put into piles after a
hurricane. This was quite evident after hurricane Fran hit the NC
coast...but we had a high proportion of sport fisherman, I/O
cruisers, etc.
I am curious in the one photo of why the Amel sank...especially
given the
water tight bulkheads (doors open...leak unattended for several
days?) I am
in the process of looking for a Santorin...and regretfully one
doesn't get
to do a damage comparison until these catastrophic weather events
occur.

Regards,

Tom Keesling
____________________________________

Message: 8
Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 16:48:08 -0000
From: asm283
Subject: Amels in Grenada


Hello

My Super Maramu Wanderer was in Grenada during Hurricane Ivan. She
was on the hard in Spice Island marina. She sustained moderate
damage. Lost the Main Mast, rudder damage, bent chainplates and
water
got inside the boat. I did well as compared to other Super Maramus.
I
also did well as compared to other Oysters, Morris,halbergs and
Swans. I have pictures of stanctions going trough 1.3mm Oysters and
sunk 72' swan, Halbergs with no rigs, benetaus without keels.


Wanderer@u...


Photos removed

Zanareva
 

Eric, Jerome and Amel owners,
Photos of damaged Amels have been removed for this site. If anyone
wants to see how Ivan ravaged Grenada, the Seven Seas Cruising
Association has a link to several websites loaded with photos. Go to
http://www.ssca.org


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] SULAJON SM 347 NANNY CAY TORTOLA

eric freedman
 

I am heading south to St Thomas 11/1/04 and was looking to just say hi to
someone on the ssb on the way down.

Fair winds,

Eric

SM 376 kimberlite



_____

From: jfolino901 [mailto:jfolino901@...]
Sent: Thursday, October 21, 2004 4:06 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] SULAJON SM 347 NANNY CAY TORTOLA




--- In amelyachtowners@..., "eric freedman"
<kimberlite@o...> wrote:

Hi
is anyone heading to the caribbean from the northeast in the next
few weeks?
fair winds,
eric
s/m 376 kimberlite
ERIC,
YES ON 11/14 I WILL BE MAKING MY FIRST TRIP THIS SEASON. HOW MAY I
HELP YOU?
JOHN






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Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Amels In Grenada during Ivan - pics posted

eric freedman
 

Hi,

I was curious as to the name of the boat shown sunken on the website, as I
was afraid it belonged to one of my friends.

I agree that showing other peoples suffering does no good to either them or
the Fine name of Amel.

I would for one would like to see the photos removed from the website.



I am glad that Amel sent a barge to the island to help out our brother and
sister Amel owners.

I revel in the Quality of my Amel and am proud to know Jean-Jacques, Joel
Potter, and the rest of the Amel Family.

Fair winds,

Eric Freedman

SM 376 Kimberlite





_____

From: closereach [mailto:closereach@...]
Sent: Thursday, October 21, 2004 11:20 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Amels In Grenada during Ivan - pics posted




Jerome,

If a majority of members that respond want these photos removed, I
will delete them. I don't understand the publicity issue--Ivan
damaged all makes and kinds of yachts. However, if members are
sensitive in seeing damaged Amels, I'll delete the photos.

Richard

--- In amelyachtowners@..., Jérôme LE CONTE
<jeromeleconte@c...> wrote:

--- In amelyachtowners@..., "closereach"
<closereach@y...> wrote:

Pics of Amels affected by hurricane Ivan have been uploaded in
Photos section.
I really do not see why you posted the photo. It is sad and does
not
give any info : the name of the boat is not even indicated,
neither
the exact location. Morbidity is not the usual tone of this forum.
Plus it is bad publicity for AMEL: not very palatable for the Amel
lovers we are.





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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Digest Number 492

Tom Keesling <tkeesling@...>
 

Could you comment on your observations of the damage to the Amels vs. the
others? For those of us that have not had a factory tour of all the major
offshore manufactures, we sadly observed that you can learn a lot about boat
construction when they are tossed about and put into piles after a
hurricane. This was quite evident after hurricane Fran hit the NC
coast...but we had a high proportion of sport fisherman, I/O cruisers, etc.
I am curious in the one photo of why the Amel sank...especially given the
water tight bulkheads (doors open...leak unattended for several days?) I am
in the process of looking for a Santorin...and regretfully one doesn't get
to do a damage comparison until these catastrophic weather events occur.

Regards,

Tom Keesling
____________________________________

Message: 8
Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 16:48:08 -0000
From: asm283
Subject: Amels in Grenada


Hello

My Super Maramu Wanderer was in Grenada during Hurricane Ivan. She
was on the hard in Spice Island marina. She sustained moderate
damage. Lost the Main Mast, rudder damage, bent chainplates and water
got inside the boat. I did well as compared to other Super Maramus. I
also did well as compared to other Oysters, Morris,halbergs and
Swans. I have pictures of stanctions going trough 1.3mm Oysters and
sunk 72' swan, Halbergs with no rigs, benetaus without keels.


Wanderer@...


Re: Amels In Grenada during Ivan - pics posted

Zanareva
 

Jerome,

If a majority of members that respond want these photos removed, I
will delete them. I don't understand the publicity issue--Ivan
damaged all makes and kinds of yachts. However, if members are
sensitive in seeing damaged Amels, I'll delete the photos.

Richard

--- In amelyachtowners@..., Jérôme LE CONTE
<jeromeleconte@c...> wrote:

--- In amelyachtowners@..., "closereach"
<closereach@y...> wrote:

Pics of Amels affected by hurricane Ivan have been uploaded in
Photos section.
I really do not see why you posted the photo. It is sad and does
not
give any info : the name of the boat is not even indicated,
neither
the exact location. Morbidity is not the usual tone of this forum.
Plus it is bad publicity for AMEL: not very palatable for the Amel
lovers we are.


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amels In Grenada during Ivan - pics posted

Zanareva
 

Eric,

There's a new folder with several photos. Another member posted the
lone photo of the Mango/Maramu/Sharki (not a Super Maramu).

Richard

--- In amelyachtowners@..., kimberlite <kimberlite@o...>
wrote:
Hi,

Did you post just one photo?

Do you know the name of the yacht?

Fair winds,

Eric

s/m 376 Kimberlite


Re: Amels In Grenada during Ivan - pics posted

Jérôme LE CONTE <jeromeleconte@...>
 

--- In amelyachtowners@..., "closereach"
<closereach@y...> wrote:

Pics of Amels affected by hurricane Ivan have been uploaded in
Photos section.
I really do not see why you posted the photo. It is sad and does not
give any info : the name of the boat is not even indicated, neither
the exact location. Morbidity is not the usual tone of this forum.
Plus it is bad publicity for AMEL: not very palatable for the Amel
lovers we are.


SULAJON SM 347 NANNY CAY TORTOLA

jfolino901 <jfolino901@...>
 

--- In amelyachtowners@..., "eric freedman"
<kimberlite@o...> wrote:

Hi
is anyone heading to the caribbean from the northeast in the next
few weeks?
fair winds,
eric
s/m 376 kimberlite
ERIC,
YES ON 11/14 I WILL BE MAKING MY FIRST TRIP THIS SEASON. HOW MAY I
HELP YOU?
JOHN


Is anyone heading south

eric freedman
 

Hi
is anyone heading to the caribbean from the northeast in the next
few weeks?
fair winds,
eric
s/m 376 kimberlite


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amels In Grenada during Ivan - pics posted

eric freedman
 

Hi,

Did you post just one photo?

Do you know the name of the yacht?

Fair winds,

Eric

s/m 376 Kimberlite





_____

From: closereach [mailto:closereach@...]
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2004 4:13 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amels In Grenada during Ivan - pics posted




Pics of Amels affected by hurricane Ivan have been uploaded in
Photos section.








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Amels In Grenada during Ivan - pics posted

Zanareva
 

Pics of Amels affected by hurricane Ivan have been uploaded in
Photos section.


Re: Amel Santorin

tkeesling <tkeesling@...>
 

Could your recommend how to get this article in English?


--- In amelyachtowners@..., "lololjljlj" <domo@s...>
wrote:
You will find an article in the monthly french magazine "voiles et
voiliers" http://www.voilesetvoiliers.com/ intitled 38000 milles en
Santorin. Voiles et voiliers can be bought any where in france or
can be bought on line.

emmanuel cocq-hougard
french sail instructor and stcw sail deck officer


--- In amelyachtowners@..., "slavko_despotovic"
<slavko.despotovic@p...> wrote:
Dear all,

I am considering buying one of the Amel Santorin currently on the
used boats market. There is not much of the info about this Amel
model. I would appreciate any information, experience, plan....
about this boat.
We currently own Bavaria 40 Ocean. With her we have sailed more
than
4000 miles in Med this year.

Best regards,

Slavko


CHANGEMENT D'ADRESSE INTERNET - INTERNET ADDRESS CHANGE

peps47@...
 

Please take note of the e-mail address change for Marie and Georges
Pellegrini
_peps47@... (mailto:peps47@...) will soon be unusable.
New address is: _dji314@... (mailto:dji314@...)

A tous: nous changeons d'adresse e-mail
_peps47@... (mailto:peps47@...) va passer aux oubliettes.
Nouvelle adresse: _dji314@... (mailto:dji314@...)

Thank you, merci


bali hai forestay "U" bolt

John and Anne on Bali Hai <hollamby@...>
 

Hi Eric,
The reason is that whilst we were taking delivery of the boat the
S/S strap aft of the turnbuckle buckled. Amel said that this was
because I had eased the halyard too much thus putting the whole
weight of the genoa plus the weight of the furling gear onto the
strap. They straightened it for me but when it happened again I
fitted the U bolt and solved the problem permanently.

Regards from Malta, John


bali-hai forestay "u" bolt

eric freedman
 

hi,
i was looking at your photos and wonder why you put a "u" bolt on
the forestay turnbuckle?
fair winds,
eric
s/m 376 kimberlite


Wind vane steering

north
 

I would be very interested to get the group's ideas about wind vane steering for my Sharki.
I am looking most closely at the Windpilot Pacific Plus. http://www.windpilot.de/en/Ra/raproen.html
Thank you for your input,
-North
Sharki #30
Laboratorium (nee Amadee)