Tony,

Did you have the fuel tank cleaned and fuel polished in BVI or elsewhere?
Our boat is also currently lying in BVI and we would like to do the same.

We won't be back down there until May. Will try to stop by Trellis Bay &
share that Sundowner and conversation before we head south.

Thanks,


Judy
S/V Security
SM2 #387

Hello Gary,

What a good idea! Of course I would start bt reaing the engine down
only to fine the fuel shut off valve half closed!!! I am in
Paramaribo, Suriname at the moment, but will return to Tortola in a
few days, and will certainly check it out. I did have the tank
cleaned and fuel polished right after I bought the boat, so your
suggestion would be an easy fix!

BTW: WORLD CITIZEN is on a mooring at Trellis Bay, Tortola BVI, and
any Amel's are certainly welcome to stop by for a Sundowner and
conversation. We should be there for quite sometime.

Tony
WORLD CITIZEN SM#266

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, amelliahona <no_reply@...>
wrote:

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "agav8ter" <agav8ter@>

wrote:

Tony:

This is a simple thing but once when I couldn't get adequate RPM

from my Yanmar (SM

Hull # 335), and after I checked everything else I found that the

fuel shut off valve had

been bumped and was slightly restrictive of fuel flow. Have you

checked to make sure you

don't have excess fuel suction? Other things would be restricted

fuel filters etc. The

engine would start and run fine but just wouldn't develope full

RPM (power).

Just my two cents worth.

Gary Silver

Hello all,
We have a S/M #266 and it is fairly new to us. Question: #266

has the

Volvo engine that has a sticker on it saying built by Perkins,

we were

told it is 80hp. We also have the Amel autoprop. The prop

itself is

clean and the roller bearings that are visable are clean. The

blades

rotate easily. When in calm water she will run at about 7.5 kts

wide

open, but she will only turn up 2,200 RPM. The Volvo manual

says it

should turn up over 4000 RPM. In rough water and head winds, at

2,200

RPM we are lucky to get 3 to 4 kts. Is this a typical situation

for a

SM? Sure seems overpitched. Does not make much smoke and runs

at

90C. Ideas? Thanks for your help. Tony

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "agav8ter" <agav8ter@...> wrote:

Tony:

This is a simple thing but once when I couldn't get adequate RPM from my Yanmar (SM
Hull # 335), and after I checked everything else I found that the fuel shut off valve had
been bumped and was slightly restrictive of fuel flow. Have you checked to make sure you
don't have excess fuel suction? Other things would be restricted fuel filters etc. The
engine would start and run fine but just wouldn't develope full RPM (power).

Just my two cents worth.

Gary Silver

Hello all,
We have a S/M #266 and it is fairly new to us. Question: #266 has the
Volvo engine that has a sticker on it saying built by Perkins, we were
told it is 80hp. We also have the Amel autoprop. The prop itself is
clean and the roller bearings that are visable are clean. The blades
rotate easily. When in calm water she will run at about 7.5 kts wide
open, but she will only turn up 2,200 RPM. The Volvo manual says it
should turn up over 4000 RPM. In rough water and head winds, at 2,200
RPM we are lucky to get 3 to 4 kts. Is this a typical situation for a
SM? Sure seems overpitched. Does not make much smoke and runs at
90C. Ideas? Thanks for your help. Tony

Hi Tony

If you go trough the archives of this site you will see that the low
RPM problem is almost exclusively caused by carbon built up in the
turbo. The side of the turbo that this accurs is on the side by the
heat exchange and muffler. I remember reading a post that explains
the process of cleaning the turbo. I have had 2 Super Maramus with
this engine and both times it was the turbo.

Good luck

Vito

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "agav8ter" <agav8ter@...>
wrote:

Hello Vito,

Thanks for the reply. I was hoping that it was in the prop, as I
removed the ducting from the intake side of the turbo (this was

when

I was first looking at her) and was able to rotate the turbine

drive

wheel easily. That is where I would expect the carbon deposits,

not

in the actual compressor side. Do you agree? When I went to the
Volvo manual it said that at the operating RPM I am gettng the
engine is only putting out 33HP. (This from memory so my numbers
might be off a bit. I am in Suriname right now and the boat in the
BVI) I also checcked to see if the wastegate valve was stuck, and
it appears to be working correctly.

I do appreciate you reply and any others you might suggest. This
board is a wealth of info!!!! I can't wait to have my wife read
about how to repaint the stripes on the decks!!!!!

Tony

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, asm283 <no_reply@> wrote:

Hello Tony

This is not an uncommon accurence on the Volvo 80hp. What you

need

done is to have the turbo charger removed and have the carbon

inside

the turbo removed. This is not a big deal so dont let your

mechanic

make it one. What happens is that carbon deposits built up

inside

the turbo housing and stop the turbo from rotating. Thus the
reduction in power. Once this is done and all things being clean

you

should be able to run at 2700 to 2800 RPM and have a speed of

about

8.5 knots.

Hope this helps

Vito

WANDERER ASM#283

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "agav8ter" <agav8ter@>
wrote:

Hello all,
We have a S/M #266 and it is fairly new to us. Question: #266

has

the

Volvo engine that has a sticker on it saying built by Perkins,

we

were

told it is 80hp. We also have the Amel autoprop. The prop

itself

is

clean and the roller bearings that are visable are clean. The

blades

rotate easily. When in calm water she will run at about 7.5

kts

wide

open, but she will only turn up 2,200 RPM. The Volvo manual

says

it

should turn up over 4000 RPM. In rough water and head winds,

at

2,200

RPM we are lucky to get 3 to 4 kts. Is this a typical

situation

for a

SM? Sure seems overpitched. Does not make much smoke and

runs

at

90C. Ideas? Thanks for your help. Tony

Hello Vito,

Thanks for the reply. I was hoping that it was in the prop, as I
removed the ducting from the intake side of the turbo (this was when
I was first looking at her) and was able to rotate the turbine drive
wheel easily. That is where I would expect the carbon deposits, not
in the actual compressor side. Do you agree? When I went to the
Volvo manual it said that at the operating RPM I am gettng the
engine is only putting out 33HP. (This from memory so my numbers
might be off a bit. I am in Suriname right now and the boat in the
BVI) I also checcked to see if the wastegate valve was stuck, and
it appears to be working correctly.

I do appreciate you reply and any others you might suggest. This
board is a wealth of info!!!! I can't wait to have my wife read
about how to repaint the stripes on the decks!!!!!

Tony

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, asm283 <no_reply@...> wrote:

Hello Tony

This is not an uncommon accurence on the Volvo 80hp. What you need
done is to have the turbo charger removed and have the carbon

inside

the turbo removed. This is not a big deal so dont let your

mechanic

make it one. What happens is that carbon deposits built up inside
the turbo housing and stop the turbo from rotating. Thus the
reduction in power. Once this is done and all things being clean

you

should be able to run at 2700 to 2800 RPM and have a speed of

about

8.5 knots.

Hope this helps

Vito

WANDERER ASM#283

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "agav8ter" <agav8ter@>
wrote:

Hello all,
We have a S/M #266 and it is fairly new to us. Question: #266

has

the

Volvo engine that has a sticker on it saying built by Perkins,

we

were

told it is 80hp. We also have the Amel autoprop. The prop

itself

is

clean and the roller bearings that are visable are clean. The

blades

rotate easily. When in calm water she will run at about 7.5 kts

wide

open, but she will only turn up 2,200 RPM. The Volvo manual

says

it

should turn up over 4000 RPM. In rough water and head winds, at

2,200

RPM we are lucky to get 3 to 4 kts. Is this a typical situation

for a

SM? Sure seems overpitched. Does not make much smoke and runs

at

90C. Ideas? Thanks for your help. Tony

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, eric <kimberlite@...> wrote:

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, eric <kimberlite@...> wrote:

Eric:

Peter Grimm's Company is Super Sailmakers, of Ft. Lauderdale. He is who Joel
recommended to me. He has built lots of 110% Jibs for Amel SMs. His phone is 954
522-4663.

They call the 110% a "Carribean Blaster". It is 502 square feet, of 9.5 oz low aspect
Dacron and has a foam luff with a UV boarder. You need 135 ft of sheet. Peter
recommended 1/2 inch line for the sheets and I have found that 1/2 inch is a little too
small for our jib sheet winches. I have to put at least 5 turns on to prevent slippage.

I purchased the sail last year and the price was $ 2,684 USD with Joel's referral discount. I
had a chance to use it for the first time last month in the BVI. What a great sail. I find I
can point about 5 to 8 degrees higher (about 45 degrees), have speeds that match the
Gateff 155% and it seems to be more foregiving of poor trimming. I am very impressed.
Of course I was sailing in 15-25 knots of wind the whole time but I could sail completely
un-furled where I would have had the 155% furled up during most of that last trip.

Sorry to butt into your thread but I am so impressed with this sail that I couldn't resist.

Regards, Gary Silver s/v Liahona Hull # 335> John,

Nice speaking to you yesterday.
Were you able to find the name of the sail maker in Ft Lauderdale that made
your 110?
Fair Winds,
Eric
Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite

Hello Tony

This is not an uncommon accurence on the Volvo 80hp. What you need
done is to have the turbo charger removed and have the carbon inside
the turbo removed. This is not a big deal so dont let your mechanic
make it one. What happens is that carbon deposits built up inside
the turbo housing and stop the turbo from rotating. Thus the
reduction in power. Once this is done and all things being clean you
should be able to run at 2700 to 2800 RPM and have a speed of about
8.5 knots.

Hope this helps

Vito

WANDERER ASM#283

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "agav8ter" <agav8ter@...>
wrote:

Hello all,
We have a S/M #266 and it is fairly new to us. Question: #266 has

the

Volvo engine that has a sticker on it saying built by Perkins, we

were

told it is 80hp. We also have the Amel autoprop. The prop itself

is

clean and the roller bearings that are visable are clean. The

blades

rotate easily. When in calm water she will run at about 7.5 kts

wide

open, but she will only turn up 2,200 RPM. The Volvo manual says

it

should turn up over 4000 RPM. In rough water and head winds, at

2,200

RPM we are lucky to get 3 to 4 kts. Is this a typical situation

for a

SM? Sure seems overpitched. Does not make much smoke and runs at
90C. Ideas? Thanks for your help. Tony

Hello all,
We have a S/M #266 and it is fairly new to us. Question: #266 has the
Volvo engine that has a sticker on it saying built by Perkins, we were
told it is 80hp. We also have the Amel autoprop. The prop itself is
clean and the roller bearings that are visable are clean. The blades
rotate easily. When in calm water she will run at about 7.5 kts wide
open, but she will only turn up 2,200 RPM. The Volvo manual says it
should turn up over 4000 RPM. In rough water and head winds, at 2,200
RPM we are lucky to get 3 to 4 kts. Is this a typical situation for a
SM? Sure seems overpitched. Does not make much smoke and runs at
90C. Ideas? Thanks for your help. Tony

John,
Nice speaking to you yesterday.
Were you able to find the name of the sail maker in Ft Lauderdale that made
your 110?
Fair Winds,
Eric
Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite

Hi Dennis

In the Perkins at least, the heat exchanger has its own zinc which should be changed each year as a service item. Low down at the aft end of the exchanger and quite accessible is a normal looking bolt which, if you unscrew it will look just a like a flat plug, because the zinc, a tube shape of a few centimetres length, will have worn away. Take the plug to a good chandlery and you should find a replacement easily. I believe there is also an exchangeable zinc plug for the water heater but not on my boat.

Regards, Roger, Zorba, Mango 28

Dennis if you are having problems with your heat exchanger, the remedy will probably have nothing to do with the rest of your bonding system. The connection of the heat exchanger to your external zinc, or the conductivity of the water lines coming in and out of the exchanger, are not the issue or the problem. The heat exchanger needs its own protection separate from the rest of the metal fittings on your boat. The metal in the exchanger, and the water around it, create their own problem. A battery of sorts. The exchanger needs its own internal zinc plug. Connecting the heat exchanger and or the engine to the bonding system does nothing. Roger has given a good recap of the various theories and applications. I believe that it is better to connect everything together. More is better. The whole idea behind the connection of all the metal parts is to equalize the conductivity between each of them, and then attach the same bonding cable to the zinc which is lower on the galvanic scale so
it corrodes. Only those parts which are exposed to the same body of water are protected by the zinc which they are connected to. That is why your exchanger needs a separate system. So would your water pump, transmission cooler, etc, but you can only do so much. Connecting everything only works if there is no stray current coming from other sources. Maybe there was a problem with stray 12 volt current coming from your engine, which was causing a problem, so a previous owner severed the bonding ground to eliminate it rather than addressing the problem that was causing it. The same is true with the dockside power. Another boats electrical problems can be transferred to your boat through the ground wire in the power cord, causing your boat to become its zinc. A power cord that has dipped into the water for a period of time can get saturated with water inside and current will cross over from the hot wire to the ground. You can also get a salt bridge just inside the plug on the dock cord
from exposure to the air alone. I personally studied bonding systems intensively and although I learned a lot of theories, it is clear that the application is part science, part myth, and part luck. I think every boat has its own issues, and needs a system tailored to it. Some boats have no problem connecting the bonding system to the ac ground, some do. I think you just have to take in a much info as you can, make your own choices, and then monitor it as best you can. Eric maramu 105

DENNIS STULLER <svcheechako@yahoo.com> wrote: HI ROGER,

THANKS FOR THE INFORMATION. I SOMETIMES FEEL THAT I
KNOW MORE ABOUT BOAT GROUNDING SYSTEMS THAN I
UNDERSTAND. IN MY CASE THE PROPELLOR SHAFT IS NOT
INSULATED AND IT APPEARS THAT I HAVE SOME CORROSION
PROBLEMS AS EVIDENCED AT THE TRANSMISSION COOLER AND
ENGINE HEAT EXCHANGER. I AM GOING TO DIG DEEPER AND
CHECK CONNECTEDNESS AND CONDUCTIVITY OF THE SYSTEM. I
WILL LET EVERYONE KNOW WHAT I FIND.

REGARDS, DENNIS STULLER MARAMU #186


--- Roger Banks <roger.banks@mac.com> wrote:

Hi Dennis

Yes, I've spent quite a bit of time looking at the
grounding systems
and there a few good articles in magazines and on
the internet, but
some how they never quite get down to specifics of
every situation.
There are four grounds which need to be kept
separate, subject to
certain approved interactions: AC, DC, HF, and
lightning. Regarding
the DC ground, which is the subject of your enquiry,
the logic not
many years ago was to connect together every metal
thru-hull, which
Amel have done elegantly with the grounding bus you
describe, which
connects to the zinc anodes mounted either side of
the rudder (at
least it's so on my Mango); this system still holds
good if you spend
your whole time in remote anchorages, but entering a
modern marina
exposes your boat to stray electrical currents from
and between other
boats (DC) and pontoon services (AC). This can set
up a galvanic
corrosion reaction, in which the current enters by
one thru-hull and
exits by another, taking with it some metal. This is
also a problem
where two or more metals are in contact in an
electrolyte, e.g. sea
water.

Therefore the common wisdom has altered since your
boat was built to
say that thru-hulls should not be linked together.
Bronze thru-hulls,
such as for toilet water intakes below the water
line, are considered
stable and may happily be left alone, i.e. not
connected via a strap
to any other thru-hull which would expose it to the
corrosion effects
described above.

There are some situations where connection is
unavoidable, such as
stainless steel (itself an alloy) prop shaft mounted
in bronze tube
and with copper propellor. It's essential to ensure
the grounding bus
is connected to both the prop shaft and its mounting
tube which, as I
recall, is visible inside the engine room, between
the engine and
stern gland. If you look further you will find that
the engine water
intake cock is connected by water to the raw water
manifold and to
the engine itself and, if I observe it correctly, to
the diesel
supply system via that fluid and to the fresh water
heater. Some of
the bus gets pretty inaccessible in these places.
I'm not 100% sure
of the electrical connectivity via fluids of some of
these items and
would be glad of contributions by others. It seems
to me that whether
the engine etc should be connected to the grounding
strap, and thus
the zinc anodes, is a question if there is more than
one connection
to the sea water, i.e. via the raw water intake and
what else? I
believe the prop shaft is isolated from the engine
by a flexible
coupling. The exhaust water exits above the water
line (as do all
basins and toilet water exit points), so does not
count. Thus if the
only connection point between the engine and sea
water is the raw
water inlet, it may be correct that the ground strap
was severed.

If your model of Maramu has a ground strap
connection to a keel bolt,
unlike my Mango where the rudder anodes are the
single point of
protection, then you may need to restore the
connection and make sure
the keel bolt is protected by an anode, but it may
be your analysis
of this is not correct.

Regards, Roger, Zorba, Mango 28


On 02/03/2006, at 1:15 PM, DENNIS STULLER wrote:

HAS ANYONE DELVED DEEPLY INTO THE AMEL GROUNDING

SYSTEM? IN THE

PROCESS OF CLEANING UP THE ENGINE COMPARTMENT ON

MY 1985 MARAMU HULL

#186 I HAVE FOUND THAT THE GROUND STRAP BETWEEN

THE ENGINE AND THE

GROUND BUS HAS BEEN SEVERED, APPARENTLY ON

PURPOSE. ALSO WHERE THE

GROUNDING BUSS PASSES IN FRONT OF THE ENGINE, IT

APPEARS AS IF THE

BUSS ORIGINALLY WAS EXTENED DOWN INTO THE BILGE

AND WAS BOLTED TO THE

KEEL BOLT AT THE BOTTOM OF THE BILGE. THIS MAKES

SOME SENSE, BUT ON MY

BOAT BOTH CONNECTIONS ARE SEVERED.

THANKS, DENNIS STULLER MARAMU #186 "CHEECHAKO"






SPONSORED LINKS
Sailing Sailing yacht Amel
Boating sailing

YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS

Visit your group "amelyachtowners" on the web.

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
amelyachtowners-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the

Yahoo! Terms of Service.

[Non-text portions of this message have been
removed]

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com


SPONSORED LINKS
Sailing Sailing yacht Amel Boating sailing

---------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS


Visit your group "amelyachtowners" on the web.

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
amelyachtowners-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


---------------------------------

HI ROGER,

THANKS FOR THE INFORMATION. I SOMETIMES FEEL THAT I
KNOW MORE ABOUT BOAT GROUNDING SYSTEMS THAN I
UNDERSTAND. IN MY CASE THE PROPELLOR SHAFT IS NOT
INSULATED AND IT APPEARS THAT I HAVE SOME CORROSION
PROBLEMS AS EVIDENCED AT THE TRANSMISSION COOLER AND
ENGINE HEAT EXCHANGER. I AM GOING TO DIG DEEPER AND
CHECK CONNECTEDNESS AND CONDUCTIVITY OF THE SYSTEM. I
WILL LET EVERYONE KNOW WHAT I FIND.

REGARDS, DENNIS STULLER MARAMU #186


--- Roger Banks <roger.banks@mac.com> wrote:

Hi Dennis

Yes, I've spent quite a bit of time looking at the
grounding systems
and there a few good articles in magazines and on
the internet, but
some how they never quite get down to specifics of
every situation.
There are four grounds which need to be kept
separate, subject to
certain approved interactions: AC, DC, HF, and
lightning. Regarding
the DC ground, which is the subject of your enquiry,
the logic not
many years ago was to connect together every metal
thru-hull, which
Amel have done elegantly with the grounding bus you
describe, which
connects to the zinc anodes mounted either side of
the rudder (at
least it's so on my Mango); this system still holds
good if you spend
your whole time in remote anchorages, but entering a
modern marina
exposes your boat to stray electrical currents from
and between other
boats (DC) and pontoon services (AC). This can set
up a galvanic
corrosion reaction, in which the current enters by
one thru-hull and
exits by another, taking with it some metal. This is
also a problem
where two or more metals are in contact in an
electrolyte, e.g. sea
water.

Therefore the common wisdom has altered since your
boat was built to
say that thru-hulls should not be linked together.
Bronze thru-hulls,
such as for toilet water intakes below the water
line, are considered
stable and may happily be left alone, i.e. not
connected via a strap
to any other thru-hull which would expose it to the
corrosion effects
described above.

There are some situations where connection is
unavoidable, such as
stainless steel (itself an alloy) prop shaft mounted
in bronze tube
and with copper propellor. It's essential to ensure
the grounding bus
is connected to both the prop shaft and its mounting
tube which, as I
recall, is visible inside the engine room, between
the engine and
stern gland. If you look further you will find that
the engine water
intake cock is connected by water to the raw water
manifold and to
the engine itself and, if I observe it correctly, to
the diesel
supply system via that fluid and to the fresh water
heater. Some of
the bus gets pretty inaccessible in these places.
I'm not 100% sure
of the electrical connectivity via fluids of some of
these items and
would be glad of contributions by others. It seems
to me that whether
the engine etc should be connected to the grounding
strap, and thus
the zinc anodes, is a question if there is more than
one connection
to the sea water, i.e. via the raw water intake and
what else? I
believe the prop shaft is isolated from the engine
by a flexible
coupling. The exhaust water exits above the water
line (as do all
basins and toilet water exit points), so does not
count. Thus if the
only connection point between the engine and sea
water is the raw
water inlet, it may be correct that the ground strap
was severed.

If your model of Maramu has a ground strap
connection to a keel bolt,
unlike my Mango where the rudder anodes are the
single point of
protection, then you may need to restore the
connection and make sure
the keel bolt is protected by an anode, but it may
be your analysis
of this is not correct.

Regards, Roger, Zorba, Mango 28


On 02/03/2006, at 1:15 PM, DENNIS STULLER wrote:

HAS ANYONE DELVED DEEPLY INTO THE AMEL GROUNDING

SYSTEM? IN THE

PROCESS OF CLEANING UP THE ENGINE COMPARTMENT ON

MY 1985 MARAMU HULL

#186 I HAVE FOUND THAT THE GROUND STRAP BETWEEN

THE ENGINE AND THE

GROUND BUS HAS BEEN SEVERED, APPARENTLY ON

PURPOSE. ALSO WHERE THE

GROUNDING BUSS PASSES IN FRONT OF THE ENGINE, IT

APPEARS AS IF THE

BUSS ORIGINALLY WAS EXTENED DOWN INTO THE BILGE

AND WAS BOLTED TO THE

KEEL BOLT AT THE BOTTOM OF THE BILGE. THIS MAKES

SOME SENSE, BUT ON MY

BOAT BOTH CONNECTIONS ARE SEVERED.

THANKS, DENNIS STULLER MARAMU #186 "CHEECHAKO"






SPONSORED LINKS
Sailing Sailing yacht Amel
Boating sailing

YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS

Visit your group "amelyachtowners" on the web.

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
amelyachtowners-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the

Yahoo! Terms of Service.

[Non-text portions of this message have been
removed]

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

I am going to buy my first Amel : a 1989 Maramu but there is only on
board genoa, mainsail and mizzen.

I wonder if it is better to buy an asymmetrical spinnaker or a
ballooner ?


Do you also think the mizzen "genoa" is useful

Thank you

Hi Michael

Nice to hear from a Mango owner; there don't seem to be too many of
us participating in the forum.

I wouldn't describe myself as an expert, but am happy to help you
with some suggestions. The zincs rapid disappearance definitely
indicates something is wrong. After 18 months my rudder anodes were
slightly used, and of course I changed them anyway. I was puzzled
about why the only anodes are those on the rudder and was worried how
I could place a suitable anode to protect the propshaft and engine.
Investigation revealed that the rudder anodes are connected to the
grounding strap which can be seen emerging by the rudder post (under
the aft bunk), passing along the locker under the aft bunk, then
appearing again in the engine room close to the prop shaft, tacked
along the bilges under the engine, across to the engine earthing
point, and so on through the boat. Thus no other zincs should be
required. I've tested this with a multimeter and can report there was
no resistance between the rudder anodes and the grounding strap
sampled at several places through the boat.

Your situation indicates that there is regular electrical activity
through your anodes into the sea water; perhaps also your anti-
fouling is copper-based (as is common), which might be producing the
paint blistering you describe. It's important to recall that the DC
grounding system to the anodes is intended to connect your anodes
together for protection from galvanic corrosion, i.e. it is not
necessary or desirable in the context of your DC battery circuits,
particularly the services side. With regard to the services side,
unlike a car, where a single wire leads to, say, a lamp and the
return wire is grounded to the car body, on a boat all DC circuits
should return via a negative cable to the battery (bearing in mind
that many services cables lead back to the common earthing point in
the electrical cupboard above the galley, and thence by a heavy-duty
cable to the service batteries). The engine, being an automotive
component, does have a number of electrical contacts, mainly sensors,
which run to earth via the engine casting; however these circuits are
completely separate from the services-side circuits and, when the
engine batteries are isolated, are inert. In operation there should
be no reason for earth leakage unless there is a resistance or break
in the route back to earth, so perhaps you should check your main
fuse (mounted on a tray at the aft end of the engine) and all
connections on the route from there back via the starter-motor to the
batteries (on my boat it's to a services battery negative post and
thus via heavy-duty cable to the engine batteries); check all the
connections around the starter-motor especially as inability of the
commutator cranking current to return to battery negative would
result, presumably, in a heavy discharge via the grounding strap into
the sea (consistent with your description); similarly if the services-
side to engine battery negative connection is not good. (Did you do
your protection check also while the engine was running?) If in
doubt, clean or replace all these cables until your problem disappears.

The services and engine battery banks should have completely separate
electrical wiring systems except for the one heavy-duty cable direct
between the battery bank negatives. There should be one position only
at which the DC system interconnects with the grounding strap, which
is at the engine earthing point; on my Perkins 4.236 this is forward
on the port side of the engine. Thus, when the engine batteries have
been isolated, which is presumably most of the time, there is no
cause for electricity to be circulating via the engine into the
grounding strap and so on to the rudder anodes.

You may want to check your wiring carefully to see if any other DC/
grounding interconnects have been made; check that each grounding
system (DC, AC, HF, lightning) is separate from the others, subject
to sensible interconnects, e.g. if the HF counterpoise is grounded to
the engine or the grounding system, there needs to be a gap of one
tenth of an inch (by fastening to a piece of phrenolic or electrical
circuit board), bridged by suitable capacitors (which are transparent
to HF but block DC); consider cutting the grounding strap from the
aft head intake and from any other "passive" thru-hulls below the
water line (I'm afraid I'm not familiar with a MaxProp). I addressed
this sort of thing in my previous posting.

They're great boats but in all these years many pairs of hands have
been doing stuff. I'm amazed at what I find even professionals have
done wrong. For instance, only recently in hunting down the cause of
excess gassing in the service batteries, I found the regulator on
some new solar panels I had installed last year is undersized; and
just last week I found through detailed enquiry on the manufacturer's
website that the regulator on my wind generator is under-sized too. I
do everything myself now!

Have fun and don't forget to report back if you have a success.

Regards, Roger, Zorba, Mango 28

Dennis, I am doing the same thing, and trying to figure out what was intended to be bonded to what in my maramu as well. I didn't know that there was a bonding ground attached to the rudder until I read a response to your question. I have been having my dive service install the zincs, but I thought they were a stand alone system. Now I really have to look. I will watch the reply's to your question, and supply my own info when I figure it out. Eric Maramu 105

DENNIS STULLER <svcheechako@yahoo.com> wrote:
HAS ANYONE DELVED DEEPLY INTO THE AMEL GROUNDING SYSTEM? IN THE
PROCESS OF CLEANING UP THE ENGINE COMPARTMENT ON MY 1985 MARAMU HULL
#186 I HAVE FOUND THAT THE GROUND STRAP BETWEEN THE ENGINE AND THE
GROUND BUS HAS BEEN SEVERED, APPARENTLY ON PURPOSE. ALSO WHERE THE
GROUNDING BUSS PASSES IN FRONT OF THE ENGINE, IT APPEARS AS IF THE
BUSS ORIGINALLY WAS EXTENED DOWN INTO THE BILGE AND WAS BOLTED TO THE
KEEL BOLT AT THE BOTTOM OF THE BILGE. THIS MAKES SOME SENSE, BUT ON MY
BOAT BOTH CONNECTIONS ARE SEVERED.

THANKS, DENNIS STULLER MARAMU #186 "CHEECHAKO"






SPONSORED LINKS
Sailing Sailing yacht Amel Boating sailing

---------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS


Visit your group "amelyachtowners" on the web.

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
amelyachtowners-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


---------------------------------

Hi Dennis

Yes, I've spent quite a bit of time looking at the grounding systems
and there a few good articles in magazines and on the internet, but
some how they never quite get down to specifics of every situation.
There are four grounds which need to be kept separate, subject to
certain approved interactions: AC, DC, HF, and lightning. Regarding
the DC ground, which is the subject of your enquiry, the logic not
many years ago was to connect together every metal thru-hull, which
Amel have done elegantly with the grounding bus you describe, which
connects to the zinc anodes mounted either side of the rudder (at
least it's so on my Mango); this system still holds good if you spend
your whole time in remote anchorages, but entering a modern marina
exposes your boat to stray electrical currents from and between other
boats (DC) and pontoon services (AC). This can set up a galvanic
corrosion reaction, in which the current enters by one thru-hull and
exits by another, taking with it some metal. This is also a problem
where two or more metals are in contact in an electrolyte, e.g. sea
water.

Therefore the common wisdom has altered since your boat was built to
say that thru-hulls should not be linked together. Bronze thru-hulls,
such as for toilet water intakes below the water line, are considered
stable and may happily be left alone, i.e. not connected via a strap
to any other thru-hull which would expose it to the corrosion effects
described above.

There are some situations where connection is unavoidable, such as
stainless steel (itself an alloy) prop shaft mounted in bronze tube
and with copper propellor. It's essential to ensure the grounding bus
is connected to both the prop shaft and its mounting tube which, as I
recall, is visible inside the engine room, between the engine and
stern gland. If you look further you will find that the engine water
intake cock is connected by water to the raw water manifold and to
the engine itself and, if I observe it correctly, to the diesel
supply system via that fluid and to the fresh water heater. Some of
the bus gets pretty inaccessible in these places. I'm not 100% sure
of the electrical connectivity via fluids of some of these items and
would be glad of contributions by others. It seems to me that whether
the engine etc should be connected to the grounding strap, and thus
the zinc anodes, is a question if there is more than one connection
to the sea water, i.e. via the raw water intake and what else? I
believe the prop shaft is isolated from the engine by a flexible
coupling. The exhaust water exits above the water line (as do all
basins and toilet water exit points), so does not count. Thus if the
only connection point between the engine and sea water is the raw
water inlet, it may be correct that the ground strap was severed.

If your model of Maramu has a ground strap connection to a keel bolt,
unlike my Mango where the rudder anodes are the single point of
protection, then you may need to restore the connection and make sure
the keel bolt is protected by an anode, but it may be your analysis
of this is not correct.

Regards, Roger, Zorba, Mango 28

HAS ANYONE DELVED DEEPLY INTO THE AMEL GROUNDING SYSTEM? IN THE
PROCESS OF CLEANING UP THE ENGINE COMPARTMENT ON MY 1985 MARAMU HULL
#186 I HAVE FOUND THAT THE GROUND STRAP BETWEEN THE ENGINE AND THE
GROUND BUS HAS BEEN SEVERED, APPARENTLY ON PURPOSE. ALSO WHERE THE
GROUNDING BUSS PASSES IN FRONT OF THE ENGINE, IT APPEARS AS IF THE
BUSS ORIGINALLY WAS EXTENED DOWN INTO THE BILGE AND WAS BOLTED TO THE
KEEL BOLT AT THE BOTTOM OF THE BILGE. THIS MAKES SOME SENSE, BUT ON MY
BOAT BOTH CONNECTIONS ARE SEVERED.

THANKS, DENNIS STULLER MARAMU #186 "CHEECHAKO"

As I have recently sold all my other business interests in Greece, I wish to
advise all of you that you can Charter ALMA LIBRE SM-2000 ( 2002 Model) in
Greece. I believe that this a good opportunity to charter the boat in Greece
for sailing in the Aegean Sea which is a sailing paradise.

More information at www.almalibre.gr/chartering/index.htm . All the details
and inventory of the boat are at the website www.almalibre.gr I will be
glad to welcome you onboard and please refer this also to your friends that
wish to charter a well found boat in this part of the world.

Regards

Dimitris Krassopoulos
dkra@almalibre.gr

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "markmpitt" <mark_pitt@...> wrote:

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "agav8ter" <agav8ter@> wrote:

Hello,

Can anyone tell me where the Amel facility in Guadalupe is located?
We are currently in the BVI's and as new S/M owners (with no manuals)
we thought we might sail to the Amel Service Center and get a proper
briefing on our boat. Thanks for your help.

Tony and Heidi
WORLD CITIZEN S/M 266

They are in Marina Bas du Fort near Point-a-Pitre.
Their email is marina@...
You come up the main shipping channel toward
Point-a-Pitre and it is to your left. It is well
marked on charts.

Mark Pitt "Sabbatical III" ASM #419

Sorry, that is the email for the marina in my earlier post. The email
for Amel in Guadeloupe that I have is:

amel.caraibes@wanadoo.fr

Mark Pitt "Sabbatical III" ASM #419

--- In amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com, "agav8ter" <agav8ter@...> wrote:

Hello,

Can anyone tell me where the Amel facility in Guadalupe is located?
We are currently in the BVI's and as new S/M owners (with no manuals)
we thought we might sail to the Amel Service Center and get a proper
briefing on our boat. Thanks for your help.

Tony and Heidi
WORLD CITIZEN S/M 266

They are in Marina Bas du Fort near Point-a-Pitre.
Their email is marina@marina-pap.com.
You come up the main shipping channel toward
Point-a-Pitre and it is to your left. It is well
marked on charts.

Mark Pitt "Sabbatical III" ASM #419