Date   

Re: Mast foot rubber seal pad

 

Porter,

One of the best Amel riggers is Phil Ash, Gulf Harbour Rigging in Gulf harbour Marina.
Gulf Harbour Rigging
Gulf Harbour Marina
P.O.Box 729
Whangaparaoa 0943
Auckland
New Zealand
Phone: +64 9 424 1320
Mobile: +64 27 292 7198
Email: phil"at"gulfharbourrigging.co.nz

The Amel Matinique tool is basically a custom metal frame used with a hydraulic jack that lifts the mast just high enough to replace the mast pad. I have seen it, but do not have a photo of it.


--
CW Bill Rouse Amel Yacht Owners School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
   


On Wed, Sep 18, 2019 at 1:16 PM Porter McRoberts via Groups.Io <portermcroberts=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Our main past pad is nearly nonexistent now. Plan to change it in NZ. The shrouds are still incredibly tight, on the lee side as well.  I suspect a slight loosening of the forestay. When changing load directions there is a small shimmy in the boat which I suspect is new, but I doubt myself. 
Regardless, the rig seems tight and integrous (with a magnifying glass at the shroud based) but plan on a change in NZ, the primary reason being this pad, and going into the 10th year new wire seems prudent. 

I am considering doing the rewire myself, ordering the ACMO and then having a rigger check my work vs, since I have to get a crane to lift the mast, just have the whole thing done by a rigger- wire and all. 

The only reason I have to pull the mast is this mast pad: has anyone seen the Martinique gizmo that obviates that need in order to replace the pad?  

Any experience with rerigging one’s self?

Any suggestions for a rigger around Auckland?  

As always thanks for your help. This forum is such a wonderful resource. 


Porter McRoberts 
A54-152
Vava’u Tonga


Excuse the errors.  
Sent from my IPhone 

On Sep 19, 2019, at 6:54 AM, ngtnewington Newington via Groups.Io <ngtnewington@...> wrote:

Hi Arno,

Did the guys in Martinique actually tell you the pad was to dampen the load on the deck when pounding?

I can not imagine that there will really be any give in it, after the rig is tensioned. The worst thing for a mast is for it to go slack and then tight again. If the pad really is for that purpose then that is what would happen, obviously to a very small degree. The compression load on that mast base must be immense. If we say that the rigging is tensioned to 50% of the wire strength and work out the angles, the downward vector of all the shroud tensions added together must be in the order of 50-100 tons. (very quick mental arithmetic)

Although Amels are very well constructed there must be much more spring in the whole structure of the boat than that 5mm plate. All boats bend a little, which is most of the reason that when sailing in a stiff breeze there is much less tension on the leeward shrouds. That and the stretch the wire itself, which is actually quite a lot.

I do not know for sure but I think the pad is to prevent the paint on the base of the mast from chipping. As you point out it is interesting to note that the mizzen plate lasts longer. Maybe that is not from less compression but because it is less exposed to sun and sea. It is interesting, and I would like to know for sure.

Nick
Amelia 
AML54-019
On 18 Sep 2019, at 18:19, Arno Luijten <arno.luijten@...> wrote:

Hi Ruedi,
Strange answer you have got from Amel as the crew in Martinique has even build a special rig to replace the pad with a standing mast. It is meant to dampen the forces of the mast on the deck when sailing turbulent seas. Mine was replaced when I bought the boat (July 2018), nine years old. The one under the mizzen does not receive much pounding so it stays much better over time.

Regards,

Arno
SV Luna,
A54-121


Re: Free or Tie-on the steering wheel

Patrick McAneny
 

Ruedi, I would advise against securing the quadrant ,in the event of an emergency a boat should be ready to move immediately . Having to leave the cockpit and go down to the aft stateroom ,lift the bed and untie the quadrant sounds like a bad idea.
I have a small stainless hook secured to the bulkhead about six inches below the wheel ,I use a black rubber bungee with hooks on the ends , I put those hooks over two of  the spokes on the wheel and the bungee under the hook. This allows a very little bit of play, but 99 % a the time no movement at all and we live on a mooring. I can unsecure the wheel in one second if need be.
Good Luck,
Pat
SM Shenanigan


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS <simms@...>
To: main <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Wed, Sep 18, 2019 2:03 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Free or Tie-on the steering wheel

Hi Ruedi, if the wheel is tied tight and there is clonking it is possible your steering cables need adjustment. Easy to do where they are mounted by the quadrant. Just like adjusting cables on a bicycle.
Regards
Danny
SM 299
Ocean Pearl
On 19 September 2019 at 00:19 "jlm@..." <jlm@...> wrote:

Hi Ruedi,
The best is to fix it, but if you fix it it MUST be without any gap (possibility that the rude can move) ... else do not fix it ...
JLMERTZ
CottonBay


Le 18/09/2019 à 11:52, Rudolf Waldispuehl a écrit :
Dear Amel'ias

I’m curious about experience with tie on the steering wheel and maybe someone has a proven technical answer. 
When I’m on Anchor or in a Marina I always fix/tie the steering wheel in the cockpit with a rope. After this summer in many anchorages with some swell I was not sure anymore if these is the right solution. 
 
Always when small waves hitting the rudder the wheel tried to turn in one or other direction and there is a noticeable noise (little dong) on the cables. 
When I was loosing the rope then the noise was notable under the aft bed because the Autopilot linear drive gear is moving and made noise.   
I’m now quite unsecure which option is the better, -  fix the wheel or let it move around?  Both ways are working on either AP Linear drive and/or steering cables. 
 
Would be the best option to make a fix/tie on the rudder quadrant to stop moving? Has someone done it?
What is your experience and long-term observations? 
 
Thanks for your thought and best regards
Ruedi
SY-WASABI 
AMEL 54#55

Garanti sans virus. www.avast.com

 

 


Re: Mast foot rubber seal pad

Porter McRoberts
 

Our main past pad is nearly nonexistent now. Plan to change it in NZ. The shrouds are still incredibly tight, on the lee side as well.  I suspect a slight loosening of the forestay. When changing load directions there is a small shimmy in the boat which I suspect is new, but I doubt myself. 
Regardless, the rig seems tight and integrous (with a magnifying glass at the shroud based) but plan on a change in NZ, the primary reason being this pad, and going into the 10th year new wire seems prudent. 

I am considering doing the rewire myself, ordering the ACMO and then having a rigger check my work vs, since I have to get a crane to lift the mast, just have the whole thing done by a rigger- wire and all. 

The only reason I have to pull the mast is this mast pad: has anyone seen the Martinique gizmo that obviates that need in order to replace the pad?  

Any experience with rerigging one’s self?

Any suggestions for a rigger around Auckland?  

As always thanks for your help. This forum is such a wonderful resource. 


Porter McRoberts 
A54-152
Vava’u Tonga


Excuse the errors.  
Sent from my IPhone 

On Sep 19, 2019, at 6:54 AM, ngtnewington Newington via Groups.Io <ngtnewington@...> wrote:

Hi Arno,

Did the guys in Martinique actually tell you the pad was to dampen the load on the deck when pounding?

I can not imagine that there will really be any give in it, after the rig is tensioned. The worst thing for a mast is for it to go slack and then tight again. If the pad really is for that purpose then that is what would happen, obviously to a very small degree. The compression load on that mast base must be immense. If we say that the rigging is tensioned to 50% of the wire strength and work out the angles, the downward vector of all the shroud tensions added together must be in the order of 50-100 tons. (very quick mental arithmetic)

Although Amels are very well constructed there must be much more spring in the whole structure of the boat than that 5mm plate. All boats bend a little, which is most of the reason that when sailing in a stiff breeze there is much less tension on the leeward shrouds. That and the stretch the wire itself, which is actually quite a lot.

I do not know for sure but I think the pad is to prevent the paint on the base of the mast from chipping. As you point out it is interesting to note that the mizzen plate lasts longer. Maybe that is not from less compression but because it is less exposed to sun and sea. It is interesting, and I would like to know for sure.

Nick
Amelia 
AML54-019
On 18 Sep 2019, at 18:19, Arno Luijten <arno.luijten@...> wrote:

Hi Ruedi,
Strange answer you have got from Amel as the crew in Martinique has even build a special rig to replace the pad with a standing mast. It is meant to dampen the forces of the mast on the deck when sailing turbulent seas. Mine was replaced when I bought the boat (July 2018), nine years old. The one under the mizzen does not receive much pounding so it stays much better over time.

Regards,

Arno
SV Luna,
A54-121


Re: Free or Tie-on the steering wheel

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Ruedi, if the wheel is tied tight and there is clonking it is possible your steering cables need adjustment. Easy to do where they are mounted by the quadrant. Just like adjusting cables on a bicycle.

Regards

Danny

SM 299

Ocean Pearl

On 19 September 2019 at 00:19 "jlm@..." <jlm@...> wrote:

Hi Ruedi,

The best is to fix it, but if you fix it it MUST be without any gap (possibility that the rude can move) ... else do not fix it ...

JLMERTZ

CottonBay



Le 18/09/2019 à 11:52, Rudolf Waldispuehl a écrit :

Dear Amel'ias

I’m curious about experience with tie on the steering wheel and maybe someone has a proven technical answer. 

When I’m on Anchor or in a Marina I always fix/tie the steering wheel in the cockpit with a rope. After this summer in many anchorages with some swell I was not sure anymore if these is the right solution. 

 

Always when small waves hitting the rudder the wheel tried to turn in one or other direction and there is a noticeable noise (little dong) on the cables. 

When I was loosing the rope then the noise was notable under the aft bed because the Autopilot linear drive gear is moving and made noise.   

I’m now quite unsecure which option is the better, -  fix the wheel or let it move around?  Both ways are working on either AP Linear drive and/or steering cables. 

 

Would be the best option to make a fix/tie on the rudder quadrant to stop moving? Has someone done it?
What is your experience and long-term observations? 

 

Thanks for your thought and best regards

Ruedi

SY-WASABI 

AMEL 54#55


Garanti sans virus. www.avast.com


 


 


Re: Mast foot rubber seal pad

ngtnewington Newington
 

Hi Arno,

Did the guys in Martinique actually tell you the pad was to dampen the load on the deck when pounding?

I can not imagine that there will really be any give in it, after the rig is tensioned. The worst thing for a mast is for it to go slack and then tight again. If the pad really is for that purpose then that is what would happen, obviously to a very small degree. The compression load on that mast base must be immense. If we say that the rigging is tensioned to 50% of the wire strength and work out the angles, the downward vector of all the shroud tensions added together must be in the order of 50-100 tons. (very quick mental arithmetic)

Although Amels are very well constructed there must be much more spring in the whole structure of the boat than that 5mm plate. All boats bend a little, which is most of the reason that when sailing in a stiff breeze there is much less tension on the leeward shrouds. That and the stretch the wire itself, which is actually quite a lot.

I do not know for sure but I think the pad is to prevent the paint on the base of the mast from chipping. As you point out it is interesting to note that the mizzen plate lasts longer. Maybe that is not from less compression but because it is less exposed to sun and sea. It is interesting, and I would like to know for sure.

Nick
Amelia 
AML54-019

On 18 Sep 2019, at 18:19, Arno Luijten <arno.luijten@...> wrote:

Hi Ruedi,
Strange answer you have got from Amel as the crew in Martinique has even build a special rig to replace the pad with a standing mast. It is meant to dampen the forces of the mast on the deck when sailing turbulent seas. Mine was replaced when I bought the boat (July 2018), nine years old. The one under the mizzen does not receive much pounding so it stays much better over time.

Regards,

Arno
SV Luna,
A54-121


Re: Free or Tie-on the steering wheel

Paul Osterberg
 

I use shokcord to secure the steering wheel that give some flex.
Paul on SY Kerpa SM 259 Lagos, Portugal 


Re: Mast foot rubber seal pad

Arno Luijten
 

Hi Ruedi,
Strange answer you have got from Amel as the crew in Martinique has even build a special rig to replace the pad with a standing mast. It is meant to dampen the forces of the mast on the deck when sailing turbulent seas. Mine was replaced when I bought the boat (July 2018), nine years old. The one under the mizzen does not receive much pounding so it stays much better over time.

Regards,

Arno
SV Luna,
A54-121


Re: Mast foot rubber seal pad

ngtnewington Newington
 

Hi Ruedi,

The pad under my mast is pretty feeble and crumbly. I have scraped it out and regularly blast it with fresh water. It is barely visible now. As for the rig tension, to my eye the main mast on Amelia could do with a touch more rake aft, so I have left the forstay and staysail stay and baby stay  as they were and tensioned the rest a turn or two. It is all bar taught and even when sailing in say 15 knots true wind the lee shrouds are still very firm. I have also had a good look at the mast base when sailing upwind at 9 knots boat speed, dropping off waves. There is no movement. So I am happy to leave it be until such a time that I pull the mast down when I will have a new Tufnol one made.

Happy sailing

Nick
Amelia 
AML 54-019

On 18 Sep 2019, at 16:47, Roque <ediroque@...> wrote:

Hi Ruedi

If the leak you are worried about is water getting inside the boat, then don’t. This pad is not intended to seal that.

It is made out of PU (polyurethane), 90 SH (“hardness”), 5 mm thick. Several A54 reported a short life span of this material. Mine was paper thin after 8 years. The Mizzen pad usually holds longer.

I have discussed this with a few experienced Amel owners and with a very knowledgeable Naval Engineer who build boats over 100 ft. and it seems that replacing it with phenolic laminated (such as Tufnol), would be an improvement. It is a little harder (103 SH), though. 

Regarding Amel statement that “Even if it looks ugly and very worn there is no need to change it”, I would only add that, as it gets thinner and thinner, you have to check and adjust the standing rigging. 

Enjoy Sicily

Roque

Attika A54 117

Paraty- Rio de Janeiro


Em qua, 18 de set de 2019 às 06:48, Rudolf Waldispuehl <Rudolf@...> escreveu:
Hi Folks 

The mast foot rubber pad on my boat is quite brown and very brittle. I’m a bit nervous that it will leak one day (see pictures). 
I heard from Barry “Lady Penelope II” that he changed the Mast-Foot Rubber Pad in Hieres recently. 

 

I asked AMEL and got the answer that they haven’t done it very often and I should not worry about it. “Even it looks ugly and very worn there is no need to change it”, Amel said. In Hieres they did it first time 2 weeks ago with “Lady Penelope II”. Barry mentioned the rubber was like fluid and I’m confused about the answers from AMEL. 
What is your experience and who has done it on their SM or 54 over the years? 

 

Thanks a lot and kind regards
Ruedi 

 

SY-WASABI 
AMEL 54#55
Sicily




Re: Mast foot rubber seal pad

Roque
 

Hi Ruedi

If the leak you are worried about is water getting inside the boat, then don’t. This pad is not intended to seal that.

It is made out of PU (polyurethane), 90 SH (“hardness”), 5 mm thick. Several A54 reported a short life span of this material. Mine was paper thin after 8 years. The Mizzen pad usually holds longer.

I have discussed this with a few experienced Amel owners and with a very knowledgeable Naval Engineer who build boats over 100 ft. and it seems that replacing it with phenolic laminated (such as Tufnol), would be an improvement. It is a little harder (103 SH), though. 

Regarding Amel statement that “Even if it looks ugly and very worn there is no need to change it”, I would only add that, as it gets thinner and thinner, you have to check and adjust the standing rigging. 

Enjoy Sicily

Roque

Attika A54 117

Paraty- Rio de Janeiro


Em qua, 18 de set de 2019 às 06:48, Rudolf Waldispuehl <Rudolf@...> escreveu:

Hi Folks 

The mast foot rubber pad on my boat is quite brown and very brittle. I’m a bit nervous that it will leak one day (see pictures). 

I heard from Barry “Lady Penelope II” that he changed the Mast-Foot Rubber Pad in Hieres recently. 

 

I asked AMEL and got the answer that they haven’t done it very often and I should not worry about it. “Even it looks ugly and very worn there is no need to change it”, Amel said. In Hieres they did it first time 2 weeks ago with “Lady Penelope II”. Barry mentioned the rubber was like fluid and I’m confused about the answers from AMEL. 

What is your experience and who has done it on their SM or 54 over the years? 

 

Thanks a lot and kind regards

Ruedi 

 

SY-WASABI 

AMEL 54#55

Sicily


Re: Amel OEM Rigging

Gerhard Mueller
 

I just get new shrouds here in Kalamata, Greece, manufactured by a shop in Athen, Greece and fitted by the sailmaker here. For the Sharki the total is 2800,- Euro.
--
Gerhard Mueller
Amel Sharki #60
Currently Kalamata, Greece


Re: OG Maramu Mizzen Sheet Cars

Gerhard Mueller
 

Dennis is correct.
No problem to order a machine shop for a new disk. Often the pin is still OK.
I have changed all disks.


--
Gerhard Mueller
Amel Sharki #60
Currently Kalamata, Greece


Re: OG Maramu Mizzen Sheet Cars

sbmesasailor
 

Hi Jeremy,

I had a failure just like yours and it was no problem and not very expensive to have a machine shop produce a new disk and pin.

Dennis
Libertad
Maramu #121


Re: Re :[AmelYachtOwners] OG Maramu Mizzen Sheet Cars

Matt Salatino
 

Don Green has a business of making sheaves and rebuilding Genoa cars and blocks.
You can find him on FaceBook and the Sailing and Cruising Page.

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Sep 18, 2019, at 1:37 AM, christian alby via Groups.Io <calbyy@...> wrote:

Good day to you,
Try rigrite.com (Rig-rite Inc.)
They are the experts on vintage rigging (goiot incld) & their catalog is well documented.
I need to replace my travelers also & will send them a request.
Good hunting
Christian alby - Desirade VIII - Maramu 116 - Canet


Le mer., sept. 18, 2019 à 2:28, mr_hermanns
<jeremy@...> a écrit :
Hey there!

One of my Mizzen Sheet Cars has died on me - the center disk just shattered when using it last sail.

its a odd ‘Y’ shaped track and any replacement or part advice would be awesome!
<692F8B45-B27F-4BA4-9B5E-10AFE31F8498.jpeg><771CAB7B-91A3-40F9-A9FE-712AE0C89757.jpeg><96D02AFC-6601-4058-92B6-84C482AAE535.jpeg><39CE1157-0EB3-418D-9154-6A531FA7FDBE.jpeg>
--
Jeremy Hermanns - "Jer"
SVCerulean.com
Maramu #105
Marina Del Rey, CA
<771CAB7B-91A3-40F9-A9FE-712AE0C89757.jpeg>
<692F8B45-B27F-4BA4-9B5E-10AFE31F8498.jpeg>
<39CE1157-0EB3-418D-9154-6A531FA7FDBE.jpeg>
<96D02AFC-6601-4058-92B6-84C482AAE535.jpeg>


Re: Free or Tie-on the steering wheel

jlm@jlmertz.fr
 

Hi Ruedi,

The best is to fix it, but if you fix it it MUST be without any gap (possibility that the rude can move) ... else do not fix it ...

JLMERTZ

CottonBay



Le 18/09/2019 à 11:52, Rudolf Waldispuehl a écrit :

Dear Amel'ias

I’m curious about experience with tie on the steering wheel and maybe someone has a proven technical answer. 

When I’m on Anchor or in a Marina I always fix/tie the steering wheel in the cockpit with a rope. After this summer in many anchorages with some swell I was not sure anymore if these is the right solution. 

 

Always when small waves hitting the rudder the wheel tried to turn in one or other direction and there is a noticeable noise (little dong) on the cables. 

When I was loosing the rope then the noise was notable under the aft bed because the Autopilot linear drive gear is moving and made noise.   

I’m now quite unsecure which option is the better, -  fix the wheel or let it move around?  Both ways are working on either AP Linear drive and/or steering cables. 

 

Would be the best option to make a fix/tie on the rudder quadrant to stop moving? Has someone done it?
What is your experience and long-term observations? 

 

Thanks for your thought and best regards

Ruedi

SY-WASABI 

AMEL 54#55


Garanti sans virus. www.avast.com


Re: Amel OEM Rigging

jlm@jlmertz.fr
 

Hi,

In France with our President Emmanuel Macron we are Champion in the World for Taxes and Taxes and Taxes !




Le 18/09/2019 à 11:51, Eric Meury a écrit :
hello.

I just got the quote for new rigging from ACMO.  Background.  my boat is an Amel Santorin. Ketch.  Boat is in Georgia USA.  The quote i received is for 6197 Euro for the parts plus     684 TPF  (some sort of france tax) and then another 1400 for shipping.

I have no idea what TPF is but google says it is some sort of transfer of ownership of Realestate?  and 1400 seems a bit high for shipping?  Thoughts.  

Garanti sans virus. www.avast.com


Free or Tie-on the steering wheel

Rudolf Waldispuehl
 

Dear Amel'ias

I’m curious about experience with tie on the steering wheel and maybe someone has a proven technical answer. 

When I’m on Anchor or in a Marina I always fix/tie the steering wheel in the cockpit with a rope. After this summer in many anchorages with some swell I was not sure anymore if these is the right solution. 

 

Always when small waves hitting the rudder the wheel tried to turn in one or other direction and there is a noticeable noise (little dong) on the cables. 

When I was loosing the rope then the noise was notable under the aft bed because the Autopilot linear drive gear is moving and made noise.   

I’m now quite unsecure which option is the better, -  fix the wheel or let it move around?  Both ways are working on either AP Linear drive and/or steering cables. 

 

Would be the best option to make a fix/tie on the rudder quadrant to stop moving? Has someone done it?
What is your experience and long-term observations? 

 

Thanks for your thought and best regards

Ruedi

SY-WASABI 

AMEL 54#55


Amel OEM Rigging

Eric Meury
 

hello.

I just got the quote for new rigging from ACMO.  Background.  my boat is an Amel Santorin. Ketch.  Boat is in Georgia USA.  The quote i received is for 6197 Euro for the parts plus     684 TPF  (some sort of france tax) and then another 1400 for shipping.

I have no idea what TPF is but google says it is some sort of transfer of ownership of Realestate?  and 1400 seems a bit high for shipping?  Thoughts.  


Mast foot rubber seal pad

Rudolf Waldispuehl
 

Hi Folks 

The mast foot rubber pad on my boat is quite brown and very brittle. I’m a bit nervous that it will leak one day (see pictures). 

I heard from Barry “Lady Penelope II” that he changed the Mast-Foot Rubber Pad in Hieres recently. 

 

I asked AMEL and got the answer that they haven’t done it very often and I should not worry about it. “Even it looks ugly and very worn there is no need to change it”, Amel said. In Hieres they did it first time 2 weeks ago with “Lady Penelope II”. Barry mentioned the rubber was like fluid and I’m confused about the answers from AMEL. 

What is your experience and who has done it on their SM or 54 over the years? 

 

Thanks a lot and kind regards

Ruedi 

 

SY-WASABI 

AMEL 54#55

Sicily


Bow Thruster

heinz@quetzal.berlin
 

Hello 
I lost the bottom of my bow thruster on my Sm 2000
Why I don't know. I am currently in Berlin and would like to make a new one. I will be back in Tahiti on the 30. Can someone tell me the dimensions and the angle of the bottom?
Fair Winds 
Heinz 
QUETZAL, Sm 2000, 292


Re :[AmelYachtOwners] OG Maramu Mizzen Sheet Cars

christian alby <calbyy@...>
 

Good day to you,
Try rigrite.com (Rig-rite Inc.)
They are the experts on vintage rigging (goiot incld) & their catalog is well documented.
I need to replace my travelers also & will send them a request.
Good hunting
Christian alby - Desirade VIII - Maramu 116 - Canet


Le mer., sept. 18, 2019 à 2:28, mr_hermanns
<jeremy@...> a écrit :
Hey there!

One of my Mizzen Sheet Cars has died on me - the center disk just shattered when using it last sail.

its a odd ‘Y’ shaped track and any replacement or part advice would be awesome!

--
Jeremy Hermanns - "Jer"
SVCerulean.com
Maramu #105
Marina Del Rey, CA