Date   

Re: Bow Thruster Service

 

Mat,

It depends on how much heat is applied and you can certainly damage GRP with a heat gun. This is the reason I would never say to carefully use a heat gun, nor would I say enough heat.  "Carefully" or "enough" are non-specific. For instance, enough heat to separate, might be enough heat to damage GRP.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970



On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 1:33 PM Matt Salatino via Groups.Io <helmsmatt=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Bill,
Would a heatgun provide enoughheat without affecting the FRP?

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Aug 28, 2019, at 10:21 AM, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:

Bernd,

You should be very, very careful with heat because the Bow Thruster Tube and case is made of GRP, not metal. 

The contact point is Cast Iron to the GRP tube. The problem is a result of NOT replacing the lip-seal and foam donuts, and possibly leaving the bow thruster down while sailing or motoring. Saltwater has passed through the seals and has caused corrosion on the electric motor base which is made of Cast Iron. This corrosion (Iron Oxidation) has reduced the size of the opening for the tube at the base of the motor. Your photos show that this has been more than a little saltwater over a long time, possibly months/years. It is going to be very difficult to separate the tube from the motor base. You will need the tool designed by Amel, plenty of penetrating fluid and 3-4 days of constant pressure to cause separation. You can use some light tapping or vibration on the cast iron motor base intermittently while constant pressure is applied with the special tool. But take care not to strile the base too hard because it is made of cast iron.

<image.png>
I recommend that you closely check the lower bearing on the electric motor because I suspect it is also damaged.

In the future, replace the seals every 2 years...also replace the 0.3 liters of 80/90 Gear Oil when you replace the seals. Always use plenty of waterproof grease at the contact points of the tube and motor base.

This is the normal materials needed for service every 2 years (contact SAV"at"Amel.fr):
<image.png>
You will certainly get other advice, but I firmly believe that you will not get better advice.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970



On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 12:03 PM Matt Salatino via Groups.Io <helmsmatt=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
A little heat?

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Aug 28, 2019, at 9:44 AM, "jlm@..." <jlm@...> wrote:

Hi !

I had the  same problem ... You need a lot of patience, mutch WD40 and patience, do not forcing, do not break the threads, the contact is bronze on stainless  ...

I needed 2 days ...

good luck

JLM

CottonBay


Hold time 2 or 3 days with WD40, WD40 and much

Le 28/08/2019 à 18:35, Bernd Spanner a écrit :
Hello,
I wanted to change the seal on the bow thruster today.
Unforunately after removing the 4 screws I could not get the shaft disconnected. It’s badly rusted all over. Any ideas how I can loosen it?? Already used some wd40 & caramba to get it loose.... no success 
Pics attached
Best regards, 
Bernd
SN 119 / Cascais, Portugal

Garanti sans virus. www.avast.com


Re: Bow Thruster Service

Matt Salatino
 

Bill,
Would a heatgun provide enoughheat without affecting the FRP?

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Aug 28, 2019, at 10:21 AM, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:

Bernd,

You should be very, very careful with heat because the Bow Thruster Tube and case is made of GRP, not metal. 

The contact point is Cast Iron to the GRP tube. The problem is a result of NOT replacing the lip-seal and foam donuts, and possibly leaving the bow thruster down while sailing or motoring. Saltwater has passed through the seals and has caused corrosion on the electric motor base which is made of Cast Iron. This corrosion (Iron Oxidation) has reduced the size of the opening for the tube at the base of the motor. Your photos show that this has been more than a little saltwater over a long time, possibly months/years. It is going to be very difficult to separate the tube from the motor base. You will need the tool designed by Amel, plenty of penetrating fluid and 3-4 days of constant pressure to cause separation. You can use some light tapping or vibration on the cast iron motor base intermittently while constant pressure is applied with the special tool. But take care not to strile the base too hard because it is made of cast iron.

<image.png>
I recommend that you closely check the lower bearing on the electric motor because I suspect it is also damaged.

In the future, replace the seals every 2 years...also replace the 0.3 liters of 80/90 Gear Oil when you replace the seals. Always use plenty of waterproof grease at the contact points of the tube and motor base.

This is the normal materials needed for service every 2 years (contact SAV"at"Amel.fr):
<image.png>
You will certainly get other advice, but I firmly believe that you will not get better advice.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970



On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 12:03 PM Matt Salatino via Groups.Io <helmsmatt=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
A little heat?

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Aug 28, 2019, at 9:44 AM, "jlm@..." <jlm@...> wrote:

Hi !

I had the  same problem ... You need a lot of patience, mutch WD40 and patience, do not forcing, do not break the threads, the contact is bronze on stainless  ...

I needed 2 days ...

good luck

JLM

CottonBay


Hold time 2 or 3 days with WD40, WD40 and much

Le 28/08/2019 à 18:35, Bernd Spanner a écrit :
Hello,
I wanted to change the seal on the bow thruster today.
Unforunately after removing the 4 screws I could not get the shaft disconnected. It’s badly rusted all over. Any ideas how I can loosen it?? Already used some wd40 & caramba to get it loose.... no success 
Pics attached
Best regards, 
Bernd
SN 119 / Cascais, Portugal

Garanti sans virus. www.avast.com


In Martinique looking at Amels

Darren And Kel
 

We are in Martinique with a possible deal pending and looking at Amels.  If anyone is considering any boats here, and would like some info, we would be happy to pass it along. 

Kelly and Darren

ISPA YachtMaster Instructor Evaluator
ISPA YachtMaster Instructor. 


Re: Bow Thruster Service

 

Bernd,

You should be very, very careful with heat because the Bow Thruster Tube and case is made of GRP, not metal. 

The contact point is Cast Iron to the GRP tube. The problem is a result of NOT replacing the lip-seal and foam donuts, and possibly leaving the bow thruster down while sailing or motoring. Saltwater has passed through the seals and has caused corrosion on the electric motor base which is made of Cast Iron. This corrosion (Iron Oxidation) has reduced the size of the opening for the tube at the base of the motor. Your photos show that this has been more than a little saltwater over a long time, possibly months/years. It is going to be very difficult to separate the tube from the motor base. You will need the tool designed by Amel, plenty of penetrating fluid and 3-4 days of constant pressure to cause separation. You can use some light tapping or vibration on the cast iron motor base intermittently while constant pressure is applied with the special tool. But take care not to strile the base too hard because it is made of cast iron.

image.png
I recommend that you closely check the lower bearing on the electric motor because I suspect it is also damaged.

In the future, replace the seals every 2 years...also replace the 0.3 liters of 80/90 Gear Oil when you replace the seals. Always use plenty of waterproof grease at the contact points of the tube and motor base.

This is the normal materials needed for service every 2 years (contact SAV"at"Amel.fr):
image.png
You will certainly get other advice, but I firmly believe that you will not get better advice.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970



On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 12:03 PM Matt Salatino via Groups.Io <helmsmatt=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
A little heat?

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Aug 28, 2019, at 9:44 AM, "jlm@..." <jlm@...> wrote:

Hi !

I had the  same problem ... You need a lot of patience, mutch WD40 and patience, do not forcing, do not break the threads, the contact is bronze on stainless  ...

I needed 2 days ...

good luck

JLM

CottonBay


Hold time 2 or 3 days with WD40, WD40 and much

Le 28/08/2019 à 18:35, Bernd Spanner a écrit :
Hello,
I wanted to change the seal on the bow thruster today.
Unforunately after removing the 4 screws I could not get the shaft disconnected. It’s badly rusted all over. Any ideas how I can loosen it?? Already used some wd40 & caramba to get it loose.... no success 
Pics attached
Best regards, 
Bernd
SN 119 / Cascais, Portugal

Garanti sans virus. www.avast.com


Re: Bow Thruster Service

Matt Salatino
 

A little heat?

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Aug 28, 2019, at 9:44 AM, "jlm@..." <jlm@...> wrote:

Hi !

I had the  same problem ... You need a lot of patience, mutch WD40 and patience, do not forcing, do not break the threads, the contact is bronze on stainless  ...

I needed 2 days ...

good luck

JLM

CottonBay


Hold time 2 or 3 days with WD40, WD40 and much

Le 28/08/2019 à 18:35, Bernd Spanner a écrit :
Hello,
I wanted to change the seal on the bow thruster today.
Unforunately after removing the 4 screws I could not get the shaft disconnected. It’s badly rusted all over. Any ideas how I can loosen it?? Already used some wd40 & caramba to get it loose.... no success 
Pics attached
Best regards, 
Bernd
SN 119 / Cascais, Portugal

Garanti sans virus. www.avast.com


Re: Bow Thruster Service

jlm@jlmertz.fr
 

Hi !

I had the  same problem ... You need a lot of patience, mutch WD40 and patience, do not forcing, do not break the threads, the contact is bronze on stainless  ...

I needed 2 days ...

good luck

JLM

CottonBay


Hold time 2 or 3 days with WD40, WD40 and much

Le 28/08/2019 à 18:35, Bernd Spanner a écrit :
Hello,
I wanted to change the seal on the bow thruster today.
Unforunately after removing the 4 screws I could not get the shaft disconnected. It’s badly rusted all over. Any ideas how I can loosen it?? Already used some wd40 & caramba to get it loose.... no success 
Pics attached
Best regards, 
Bernd
SN 119 / Cascais, Portugal

Garanti sans virus. www.avast.com


Re: Replacing all my head/clew/tack lashings - suggestions?

 

Scott,

I believe that will work fine. Amel used "sail bolt" line. I am not sure why, but it was probably a decision of the sail subcontractor. 

As far as I know, Amel chose to never use metal shackles. 

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Amel Yacht Owners School - www.YachtSchool.us
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970


On Wed, Aug 28, 2019, 7:59 AM Scott SV Tengah <Scott.nguyen@...> wrote:
What are you all using to lash your sail heads/foots/clews?

The previous owner put a stainless shackle on the Genoa swivel and then attached the head to that. Of course, stainless + aluminum resulted in damage to the swivel enough that even though I tried to smooth it out, it caused the replacement lashing line to chafe right though in about a year. I only caught it recently when we took down the sails to have them refreshed - another few hundred miles and the Genoa would have taken a swim!

Rather than risk this happening again, I am replacing all my lashing lines. What do you guys use? I am considering 6mm double braid dyneema with a breaking strength similar to the recommended Genoa halyard. I'll be looping it a few times between the head and the swivel.

The other option is a soft shackle, which is what is used on the Genoa foot (included with the Bamar EFJ-1 furler).

Strength is important but I really want to oversize, at least the Genoa head swivel connection, to maximize longevity against abrasion. I'm actually going to add an additional, longer independent lashing so that if the primary lashing fails, the Genoa will sag, but not drop in the ocean. An alarm system, if you will.
--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Replacing all my head/clew/tack lashings - suggestions?

Scott SV Tengah
 

What are you all using to lash your sail heads/foots/clews?

The previous owner put a stainless shackle on the Genoa swivel and then attached the head to that. Of course, stainless + aluminum resulted in damage to the swivel enough that even though I tried to smooth it out, it caused the replacement lashing line to chafe right though in about a year. I only caught it recently when we took down the sails to have them refreshed - another few hundred miles and the Genoa would have taken a swim!

Rather than risk this happening again, I am replacing all my lashing lines. What do you guys use? I am considering 6mm double braid dyneema with a breaking strength similar to the recommended Genoa halyard. I'll be looping it a few times between the head and the swivel.

The other option is a soft shackle, which is what is used on the Genoa foot (included with the Bamar EFJ-1 furler).

Strength is important but I really want to oversize, at least the Genoa head swivel connection, to maximize longevity against abrasion. I'm actually going to add an additional, longer independent lashing so that if the primary lashing fails, the Genoa will sag, but not drop in the ocean. An alarm system, if you will.
--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Re: Engine Battery cable to starter motor to be replaced - looking for experience

Mark McGovern
 

Dominique,

I agree with what most of the others have said here.  It is highly unlikely that the cable itself is the problem.  It is way more likely to be a loose, corroded, or damaged termination on either the +12V or -12V cables going from the starting battery to the starter motor on your engine.  Check, clean, repair, re-install and apply Corrosion X (or your favorite corrosion inhibitor) on each termination on both + and - cables. 

Given that you say the starter battery is new, you should also check the voltage output on the 12V alternators on both the Yanmar and the Generator to make sure that they are working properly.  You should also check and clean all the terminations on the cables going from the alternators to the starter battery.

Last, get yourself a cheap battery tester like this one or similar:  https://www.amazon.com/BA7-100-1200-Electronic-Battery-System/dp/B0015PI7A4/ref=asc_df_B0015PI7A4/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=312280085431&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=4260724397295291035&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9007796&hvtargid=pla-499796143917&psc=1

Please let us know what you find and how you resolved the issue.  Good luck!
   
--
Mark McGovern
SM #440 Cara
Deale, MD USA


Re: start stop engine

rossirossix4
 

Anybody have the diode part number and a US source for the diodes?  Seems like they are a popular enough problem with the Yanmar to merit carrying a spare.
Bob and Suzanne, KAIMI is on the hard in Varadero, Aruba we are in Crested Butte, CO 

Varadero has a 7' + low tide channel to the marina.  Use a hydraulic trailer lift for about $350USD with diver.  One of the best lifts we've ever had with our SM or our SN.   https://photos.app.goo.gl/2c1ZrAKD2gXcY7iQ6


Re: start stop engine

Gerhard Mueller
 

Altogether there are 15 diodes.


--
Gerhard Mueller
Amel Sharki #60
Currently Kalamata, Greece


Re: AMEL HAS AN OFFICE IN HUNTINGTON NY

Matt Salatino
 

We were in La Rochelle, looking at our boat being built (#27), in July. We spoke with the marketing director:
Amel sailed it across a few months ago.
They kept it in Mamaroneck, NY.
They plan to show at both Newport, and Annapolis.
Then the plan is to sell the boat.

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Aug 26, 2019, at 7:45 PM, John Clark <john.biohead@...> wrote:

Wow cool.  Is Amel going to set up a US based service center?

On Thu, Aug 22, 2019, 3:00 PM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

I went by the office as I heard there was a 50 in the harbor across from my boat.

The 50 was returned to the main office and is now back in Huntington.

I am going to take a look at it Saturday. If anyone is nearby and would like to see it  is here.

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376

 


Re: AMEL HAS AN OFFICE IN HUNTINGTON NY

John Clark
 

Wow cool.  Is Amel going to set up a US based service center?


On Thu, Aug 22, 2019, 3:00 PM eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

I went by the office as I heard there was a 50 in the harbor across from my boat.

The 50 was returned to the main office and is now back in Huntington.

I am going to take a look at it Saturday. If anyone is nearby and would like to see it  is here.

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376

 


Re: Insurance in Europe

John Clark
 

Agree as well. 

I have had experiences with venders that was good and bad requiring explaination.   No we shouldn't wontonly black list vendors without cause, and some discussion would be enlightening to others.  

I too am with IMIS with a Jackline policy after my long-term insurance provider in the UK backed out of Caribbean basin.  Knowledgible and responsive US based insurance.  More expensive than before but so is everyone else after that bad year.  

On Sun, Aug 25, 2019, 10:14 AM Matt Salatino via Groups.Io <helmsmatt=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Craig,
We vemently agree! :-)

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Aug 25, 2019, at 5:20 AM, Craig Briggs via Groups.Io <sangaris@...> wrote:

Hi Matt,
   Agree 100% with your statement that censorship does a disservice to us all and carefully filtered info is not helpful. I think opinions though, be they positive or negative, are much more helpful if they are supported by some facts. So the point I was making was simply that being "warned to avoid" with no facts supporting that opinion didn't seem helpful in making an informed decision - it's kind of like somebody's experience with no information attached. Then again, the venerable Consumer Reports organization gives "Customer Satisfaction" ratings in addition to their factual test-based ratings. However, those are not single data points as are prevalent in forums like this.
   Btw, I forgot to mention in my earlier post that there's an excellent recorded Webinar on buying insurance put on by SSCA that's available on their web site. It was initially developed by Al Golden of IMIS.  Interestingly, Al put me off of Pantaenius many years ago with some fact-based opinion - at the time, the Pantaenius product was a "Named Perils" type of policy (only covering their list of perils, albeit quite comprehensive). His Jackline policy through Markel was an "All-risk" policy that covered any type of loss unless specifically excluded. Being a Broker, he did offer to sell me the Pantaenius policy if I really wanted it - I stuck with Jackline.  Pantaenius switched to "All-risk" a couple of years later and I went there for the savings, so there's another twist available to you; stick with a Broker like IMIS who has a great reputation for service but get the product of the insurer you want. Then again, I've had excellent response from Pantaenius USA (albeit no claims).
  Happy shopping,  Craig


Re: Engine Battery cable to starter motor to be replaced - looking for experience

eric freedman
 

Hi Dominique,

I would first check that the battery connector at the starter motor is clean.

I would also check The Valeo solenoid to see if it has clean connections both the battery cable and the small wire that goes to the engine block.

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dominique Guenot
Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2019 7:25 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Engine Battery cable to starter motor to be replaced - looking for experience

 

Hello, 

My engine battery was not able to start the Yanmar this morning.
I jumped start the engine successfully using the House battery bank 
The engine battery is 2 month old and charged.

 A reputable electro-mechanic tested Volt and Amp during the start when you turn on the key with the engine battery:
- at battery level it is correct 
- at starter motor level there is a significant drop in Volt and Amp, (way more than expected when the starter kicks in) and cannot launch the starter motor. 
Therefore he recommends changing the cables which are "consuming Amp" and will eventually stop working.

I never thought that such big cables (35mm2) could degrade and/or stop working?
Is someone had similar problems? 
Any recommendation? 

Thanks
Dominique   
sv Viva 
SM #374
Papeete, French Polynesia 


Re: start stop engine

eric freedman
 

Hi Kent,

My engine has 2 diodes.

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of karkauai via Groups.Io
Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2019 4:24 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] start stop engine

 

To make it clearer, Amel uses a “floating”, or “isolated” ground system that disconnects battery negative from the bonding (zincs) system. It makes a connection to the engine block only when the starter, stop solenoid, or glow plugs are energized.  A solenoid in the line between battery negative and the engine block is energized to complete the circuit.  There are three diodes in the circuit that prevent a feedback loop which would energize the stop and start solenoids at the same time.  If the stop diode failed, the button wouldn’t work.  If the start diode shorted, you would hear the starter motor when you pushed the stop button.
If the stop diode shorted the engine wouldn’t start because the stop solenoid would be energized when you keyed the engine to start.

Craig, Bill, Danny, etc, if I don’t have this quite right, please correct me, .
Kent
SM243
Kristy


Re: Shore power contactor burnt out

Matt Salatino
 

Wow!
I’ve had, maybe 3 connections, over the years, that I was investigating due to poor performance fridge, pump, light), where the termination was hot enough to ignite the surroundings. Fortunately, I caught them in time, cleaned, and treated.....yes, terminations require maintenance....

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Aug 26, 2019, at 3:41 AM, Craig Briggs via Groups.Io <sangaris@...> wrote:

Spot on, Matt.  We had one actually ignite into flames - only time I ever had to use a fire extinguisher - scary. Corrosion-X etc on the shore power prongs wouldn't hurt either - that's where the heat built up in ours.
Craig


Re: Shore power contactor burnt out

Eamonn Washington
 

Hi

I am happy Tom found the problem before it became a big one. 

I added a 32A galvanic isolator in the aft lazarette, so the setup is complete.  It is very handy having the rotary selection switch (Genset, Off, Shore) in the galley beside the Genset start switch.

While I was looking for a solution I ordered the original contactor, second hand but looks OK and is vacuum packed.  I don’t need it.  If anyone wants it (free) they can have it, ideally by anchoring in the same bay but I could post it.

Eamonn Washington
Travel Bug
Super Maramu #151
Currently in Alghero, Sardinia, Italy.


Re: Shore power contactor burnt out

Craig Briggs
 

Spot on, Matt.  We had one actually ignite into flames - only time I ever had to use a fire extinguisher - scary. Corrosion-X etc on the shore power prongs wouldn't hurt either - that's where the heat built up in ours.
Craig


Re: Shore power contactor burnt out

Matt Salatino
 

Clearly high resistance in that terminal block. Unfortunately, this isn’t so uncommon.
In our 32 years of boat ownership, we found that electrical terminations are just another item to be maintained.
May I suggest, when replacing this terminal block, use a nonconducting, oxidation-preventing gel to eliminate oxygen exposure to the wire ends. There are several brands... Corrosion-X, I-nox, etc.....


~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Aug 25, 2019, at 4:12 PM, Thomas Peacock <peacock8491@...> wrote:

Once again, the value of this group astounds me. Because of this thread, I checked the contactor box in the cockpit lazarette. The terminal block connecting three wires was close to failing and/or starting a small fire. Not sure why. But replacement of this lets me sleep much more easily. The rest of the gear in the box looked ok, but tough to say how the inside of the main switch is. 
Tom Peacock
Aletes SM 240
Chesapeake Bay US


<DDE0202D-E6D2-4272-B6F1-55DD7A0959D9.jpeg>