Date   

Re: Bottom paint

Patrick McAneny
 

Craig, Three coats have to be better than one ,and the barrier coats can only  help to keep the keel dry ,plus it provides a better bond for the bottom paint . Looking at Petit Premium HRT ,the manager at a local marina has gotten 3 yrs. and only $129. Gal. 


-----Original Message-----
From: Craig Briggs via groups.io <sangaris@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Sep 29, 2020 2:59 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Bottom paint

Pat,
You're right - their Technical Bulletin says one coat and their Product Data Sheet says three minimum. Also says don't let anything dry before the next coat until you've got the High Build Epoxy primer on (first coat, I'd assume.)
Their words suggest the Rustloc is the water proof part, so a specific barrier coat seems redundant, plus there is no fiberglass to protect from osmosis. 
Good luck with it.

Craig - SN68 Sangaris, Tropic Isle Harbor, FL


Re: Bottom paint

Craig Briggs
 

Pat,
You're right - their Technical Bulletin says one coat and their Product Data Sheet says three minimum. Also says don't let anything dry before the next coat until you've got the High Build Epoxy primer on (first coat, I'd assume.)
Their words suggest the Rustloc is the water proof part, so a specific barrier coat seems redundant, plus there is no fiberglass to protect from osmosis. 
Good luck with it.

Craig - SN68 Sangaris, Tropic Isle Harbor, FL


Re: Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Ken, what is the make and model of your fls. Does it have a stand alone display.

Thanks

Danny

SM 299

Ocean Pearl

On 29 September 2020 at 22:14 Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...> wrote:

Z and I have sailed a fairly good distance on Aquarius, and we touched the reef one time...  And that was when I didn't follow the guidance of my FLS.  All the maps said 2.5M, and we were at high tide..  Well, it was less than 2M, and I thought the FLS was wrong because it was saying 1.5M in front of me....  I was wrong, FLS was right, but luckily I only go .5KTS in those situations and was just a light bump and we backed out...  Now, I always listen to the FLS...  

There are Captains out there that will say, "I circled the globe without GPS, Who needs that"!   It's like some people want to prove they are better than others because they don't rely on such technology. "I just stick my wife up there, and she can spot everything". I don't use my FLS........  Great!

Last night I talked to another captain here in Thailand over a drink, and he was telling me the story about another captain he met that complained about other sailors that had to rely on their GPS... WHAT?  It's a device that when used properly, can make you safer captain. 


Here is my OPINION......  IF IT WILL MAKE YOU SAFER, AND IT's EASY TO USE, AND YOU WILL USE IT.  YOU SHOULD PROBABLY THINK ABOUT GETTING IT.   For that old sailor that thought GPS was useless, just think how safe he would be with a GPS, and the knowledge on how to use it properly...  All that old sailing knowledge, along with all the new tech, now that's what I would call... SAFE!  My friend said that he never again sailed with the old captain that didn't want to use a GPS.  

I have been saved twice by my forward looking sonar (FLS) "Echo Pilot".  I have several videos that show how I use the Echo Pilot when I am in shallow water, or potentially shallow water on our channel.  The Echo Pilotl helps me understand the shape of the bottom at and anchorage, or when I am trying to work my way in a narrow shallow channel.  Now, Yes, you can stick someone up on the bow....  That might be good idea in some cases.... BUT, in the Tuamotu Archipelago you might think twice about leaving you wife up on the bow for 5 hours as you make your way across one of the Atolls.   And, is she going to be sharp the entire time?  One of our friends hit the reef in the Tuamotu's, and they thought they were being safe.  Someone on lookout on the bow, but just a few second not watching after 4 hours of not seeing a thing, and WHAM they hit the reef.  Had to patch the hole, and head to Tahiti to get hauled out and repaired.  A nice $10K and 3 months later, everything good.  I was crossing one of the Atols, and my Alarm went off, I could see the reef in front of me on the FLS, and immediately applied full reverse, and we came within 10Ms of the reef.... Since I can only see what is directly in front of me, I don't try to turn, I just back out.   Aquarius would have hit that day.  I would like to add.....Sometimes the glare on the water makes it difficult to see the reef, but not for the FLS.  And.....Sometimes the clouds make it difficult to see the reef systems.  And, if the water is really clear... EVERYTHING LOOKS LIKE IT's 2M deep, then what do you do?  So, I guess you can stick someone up on the bow, and do you feel lucky.  Because they might not see it...   Fact is, you have the best chance of seeing the reef with someone up on the bow, and and FLS.   But, the person on the bow will get fatigued over time, and this will reduce the effectiveness of the watch.   $1500...  That's my 2cents....

I still think if you're going to cross oceans and sail new places...  Get an FLS that is easy to use, and you get good information...  I have one, and have been very happy with it.  Quite disappointed when we hit a log off Columbia and cracked my transducer.  It was down for several months....

Downsides to FLS.. Sometimes they will not work if there is heavy sediment in the water sometimes I was not able to get the depth for unto 5 minutes or so..  You can also get weird readings in fast currents with sediment in the water, or when looking into Prop Wash from a large vessel or tugboat.  But, you will get used to reading the prop wash with experience.

Ken Powers
Aquarius 
Super Maramu 262


Re: Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Ken Powers SV Aquarius
 

Hello Ian,

It would be nice to know how the Echo Pilot died.  What happened, how it happened?   We hit a log off Columbia, and had to replace the transducer.  I really missed the EchoPilot when it was INOP, and was nice to get it operational again.   It's nice to get more information than... it died.   Also, you say you "Wanted to replace it".  So, I would think with this statement, you thought at the time having the FLS was in a word... "worthwhile".  Then you write.... "talked with all the major electronics manufacturers, none of whom seemed enthused by the technology."  What does this mean?  You talked with all the manufacturers of FLS units and none were enthused with their technology?  They all told you you should not replace your FLS because they are all junk?  

Seems very interesting that all the FLS manufacturers would say this!  Sorry for the sarcasm, just can't help myself. 

Ken


Re: Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Ken Powers SV Aquarius
 

Justin,

No, I have not seen anything on their website, but had told them a year ago they could use any video they wanted from our YouTube channel.

Ken on Aquarius


Re: Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Ian Townsend
 

We had an EchoPilot on our SM until it died two years ago. We wanted to replace it and talked with all the major electronics manufacturers, none of whom seemed enthused by the technology. So we have been without it since then including spending a lot of time in shallow and reef-laden waters. We don't miss it.

Ian
SM153
Loca Lola II



Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


-------- Original message --------
From: Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...>
Date: 2020-09-29 12:06 (GMT-05:00)
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

You may find this a good read:

 

 

https://www.pbo.co.uk/gear/5-forward-looking-sonar-tested-29321

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 


Re: Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Justin Paulsen
 

Ken,

Did you know that they have a video of Aquarius on the Echo Pilot website?

It is right under the "Get Quote" button on this page:  https://echopilot.com/products/fls-2d/

- Justin
Hopeful future SM/SM2k owner


On Tue, Sep 29, 2020 at 10:50 AM Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...> wrote:

[Edited Message Follows]

Z and I have sailed a fairly good distance on Aquarius, and we touched the reef one time...  And that was when I didn't follow the guidance of my FLS.  All the maps said 2.5M, and we were at high tide..  Well, it was less than 2M, and I thought the FLS was wrong because it was saying 1.5M in front of me....  I was wrong, FLS was right, but luckily I only go .5KTS in those situations and was just a light bump and we backed out...  Now, I always listen to the FLS...  

There are Captains out there that will say, "I circled the globe without GPS, Who needs that"!   It's like some people want to prove they are better than others because they don't rely on such technology. "I just stick my wife up there, and she can spot everything". I don't use my FLS........  Great!

Last night I talked to another captain here in Thailand over a drink, and he was telling me the story about another captain he met that complained about other sailors that had to rely on their GPS... WHAT?  It's a device that when used properly, can make you safer captain. 


Here is my OPINION......  IF IT WILL MAKE YOU SAFER, AND IT's EASY TO USE, AND YOU WILL USE IT.  YOU SHOULD PROBABLY THINK ABOUT GETTING IT.   For that old sailor that thought GPS was useless, just think how safe he would be with a GPS, and the knowledge on how to use it properly...  All that old sailing knowledge, along with all the new tech, now that's what I would call... SAFE!  My friend said that he never again sailed with the old captain that didn't want to use a GPS.  

I have been saved twice by my forward looking sonar (FLS) "Echo Pilot".  I have several videos that show how I use the Echo Pilot when I am in shallow water, or potentially shallow water on our channel.  The Echo Pilotl helps me understand the shape of the bottom at and anchorage, or when I am trying to work my way in a narrow shallow channel.  Now, Yes, you can stick someone up on the bow....  That might be good idea in some cases.... BUT, in the Tuamotu Archipelago you might think twice about leaving you wife up on the bow for 5 hours as you make your way across one of the Atolls.   And, is she going to be sharp the entire time?  One of our friends hit the reef in the Tuamotu's, and they thought they were being safe.  Someone on lookout on the bow, but just a few second not watching after 4 hours of not seeing a thing, and WHAM they hit the reef.  Had to patch the hole, and head to Tahiti to get hauled out and repaired.  A nice $10K and 3 months later, everything good.  I was crossing one of the Atols, and my Alarm went off, I could see the reef in front of me on the FLS, and immediately applied full reverse, and we came within 10Ms of the reef.... Since I can only see what is directly in front of me, I don't try to turn, I just back out.   Aquarius would have hit that day.  I would like to add.....Sometimes the glare on the water makes it difficult to see the reef, but not for the FLS.  And.....Sometimes the clouds make it difficult to see the reef systems.  And, if the water is really clear... EVERYTHING LOOKS LIKE IT's 2M deep, then what do you do?  So, I guess you can stick someone up on the bow, and do you feel lucky.  Because they might not see it...   Fact is, you have the best chance of seeing the reef with someone up on the bow, and and FLS.   But, the person on the bow will get fatigued over time, and this will reduce the effectiveness of the watch.   $1500...  That's my 2cents....

I still think if you're going to cross oceans and sail new places...  Get an FLS that is easy to use, and you get good information...  I have one, and have been very happy with it.  Quite disappointed when we hit a log off Columbia and cracked my transducer.  It was down for several months....

Downsides to FLS.. Sometimes an FLS will not work if there is heavy sediment in the water.  I have had times when I was not able to get the depth for up to 5 minutes in some areas..  You can also get weird readings in fast currents with sediment in the water, or when looking into Prop Wash from a large vessel or tugboat.  But, you will get used to reading the prop wash with experience.

Ken Powers
Aquarius 
Super Maramu 262



--
Justin Paulsen
IT Professional

"The world is open, are you?"


Re: Bottom paint

Patrick McAneny
 

Craig , I was just reading that page this morning,yet elsewhere they suggest a min. of three coats of Rustlok. The Petit tech guy this morning said that I don't need to use a barrier coat ,but it would provide more protection from water penetration, maybe their high build primer is a barrier coat. I already have Interlux 2000 ,so probably go with that . Three coats of rustloc and three barrier coats and two paint coats ,should be good .
Thanks,
Pat


-----Original Message-----
From: Craig Briggs via groups.io <sangaris@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Sep 29, 2020 1:43 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Bottom paint

Hi Pat,
Regarding your keel blasting and refinishing, I'd recommend you review Joel's "classic" post #2960 (and 2964 and 2116). (Just type the number in the "Msg #" box above.)

Plus you could review this Petit Technical Bulletin specifying only one coat of Rustlok, followed within 1/2 to 2 hours by three coats of Petit High Build Epoxy Primer, then fairing as needed with 7050 EZ Fair, then two coats of antifouling with a Petit product.

Note the Technical Bulletin does not call for any barrier coat, because, of course, this is cast iron, not fiberglass.

Joel's posts advise to stick to one manufacturer's system, so if you start with Petit, stay with Petit. And the key to all is to get the first coat (Rustlok) applied within minutes after sandblasting. 

Good luck with the project - and thanks for arranging the new rub rails - I'm picking mine up tomorrow.
Best,
Craig -- SN68 Sangaris, Tropic Isle Harbor, FL


Re: Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Paul Osterberg
 

Jean-Pierre!
What transducer did you choose, I though Raymarine was mor for fish finding?
Paul on SY Kerpa SM#259


Re: Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

James Alton
 

Ken,

     I was originally thinking of something that would interface with my B&G display but I think that you make a really good point about having a stand alone system in this case.  It helps a lot to hear from someone like yourself that has a lot of recent experience with a product, so thank you for sharing.  Easy and simple have a lot of value in my book as well so I will take a good hard look at the Echo Pilot option.  

Fair winds to you both,

James and Joann Alton
SV Sueno
Maramu #220



-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Sep 29, 2020 11:44 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Hello James,

I like the fact that the Echo Pilot is completely separate from the rest of the navigation equipment.  I would like a radar overlay on the chart plotter, but not the FLS.  You can spend more to have an integrated system, but I'm not sure it's useful for the FLS.  When I am in shallow water, I have the Echo Pilot going, and a few maps running.  Got my airplane pilot scan going, 1sec per screen, and then out of the cockpit... and repeat.  The FLS is just one of the inputs.  

Is this the best?  That, I could not say, because this is all I know.  Echo Pilot is easy to install, easy to use, and easy to set up.  Once set up, if the FLS needs more than an on off button that's too much.  For this reason, It's the best for me.

Ken
Aquarius SM2K#262


Re: Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Germain Jean-Pierre
 

Hi Ken,

Good to see your usage of FLS is like mine; like everything else electronic, what is really needed?

I have hit the reef twice; lightly in both cases... in Fiji.  First time was in a buoyed channel near northern Taveuni and it was reported to Navionics as it was not shown on any chart and the second time was on exit from Fulanga with a 5 knot following current.  Just a glancing hit.  Reported to Navionics as well.  Perhaps added to their database by now.

Greets to Z.  Stay safe.


Jean-Pierre Germain



On 30 Sep 2020, at 04:44, Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...> wrote:

Hello James,

I like the fact that the Echo Pilot is completely separate from the rest of the navigation equipment.  I would like a radar overlay on the chart plotter, but not the FLS.  You can spend more to have an integrated system, but I'm not sure it's useful for the FLS.  When I am in shallow water, I have the Echo Pilot going, and a few maps running.  Got my airplane pilot scan going, 1sec per screen, and then out of the cockpit... and repeat.  The FLS is just one of the inputs.  

Is this the best?  That, I could not say, because this is all I know.  Echo Pilot is easy to install, easy to use, and easy to set up.  Once set up, if the FLS needs more than an on off button that's too much.  For this reason, It's the best for me.

Ken
Aquarius SM2K#262


Re: Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Mark Erdos
 

You may find this a good read:

 

 

https://www.pbo.co.uk/gear/5-forward-looking-sonar-tested-29321

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 


Re: Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Ken Powers SV Aquarius
 

Hello James,

I like the fact that the Echo Pilot is completely separate from the rest of the navigation equipment.  I would like a radar overlay on the chart plotter, but not the FLS.  You can spend more to have an integrated system, but I'm not sure it's useful for the FLS.  When I am in shallow water, I have the Echo Pilot going, and a few maps running.  Got my airplane pilot scan going, 1sec per screen, and then out of the cockpit... and repeat.  The FLS is just one of the inputs.  

Is this the best?  That, I could not say, because this is all I know.  Echo Pilot is easy to install, easy to use, and easy to set up.  Once set up, if the FLS needs more than an on off button that's too much.  For this reason, It's the best for me.

Ken
Aquarius SM2K#262


Re: Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Germain Jean-Pierre
 

Hello Gang,

When I decided to integrate an FLS, I chose a Raymarine unit.  Integrates perfectly with the rest of the electronics and displays on either of my 2 plotters.

Additionally, having sailed in close company for many days, I would say Raymarine system compares favourably with Interphase with good data reception up to 2.5 knots SOG.  Obviously, the same restrictions apply in waters obscured by sediments etc.

Kind regards,


Jean-Pierre Germain, Eleuthera, SM007, Opua, NZ




On 29 Sep 2020, at 07:14, Paul Osterberg <osterberg.paul.l@...> wrote:

I thinking of  install an Echopilot but can't find the real performance difference between the Platinum an the FLS 2D, the Platinum cost about 1500 € and has no screen and NMA0183 and video S  so can be connected to a MFD given it has an Video S port. the FLS cost 1200 € and has it' own screen. Looks like the FLS is better value but ....
Paul on SY Kerpa SM#259


Re: SM - How to remove the bumper

Mark McGovern
 
Edited

Phillipe,

The bumper is held in place by four (4) M8 bolts that are molded into the bumper.  You can see the four mounting holes for the bumper bolts in the picture below:  



You access the nuts from the aft lazarette. 

Unfortunately, you do not have access to the heads of the bolts since they are molded into the bumper.  So if there is any corrosion on the nuts and bolt, the bolts will just end up spinning inside the bumper.  At that point you will just have to pull the bumper off the bolt(s) and then re-seat them.  

--
Mark McGovern
SM #440 Cara
Deale, MD USA


Re: Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

James Alton
 

Ken,

   A great educated/ personal review of FLS.   Your logic concerning the value and useage of FLS seems sound to me.  This is timely as I am looking at adding FLS to our boat.  Recognizing that this seems to be a still developing technology, may I ask you if you feel that the unit that you have installed on Aquarius is the best unit to consider?

Stay safe and keep having fun out there! We have really enjoyed your videos.

James and Joann
SV Sueno
Maramu #220


-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Sep 29, 2020 5:14 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Z and I have sailed a fairly good distance on Aquarius, and we touched the reef one time...  And that was when I didn't follow the guidance of my FLS.  All the maps said 2.5M, and we were at high tide..  Well, it was less than 2M, and I thought the FLS was wrong because it was saying 1.5M in front of me....  I was wrong, FLS was right, but luckily I only go .5KTS in those situations and was just a light bump and we backed out...  Now, I always listen to the FLS...  

There are Captains out there that will say, "I circled the globe without GPS, Who needs that"!   It's like some people want to prove they are better than others because they don't rely on such technology. "I just stick my wife up there, and she can spot everything". I don't use my FLS........  Great!

Last night I talked to another captain here in Thailand over a drink, and he was telling me the story about another captain he met that complained about other sailors that had to rely on their GPS... WHAT?  It's a device that when used properly, can make you safer captain. 

Here is my OPINION......  IF IT WILL MAKE YOU SAFER, AND IT's EASY TO USE, AND YOU WILL USE IT.  YOU SHOULD PROBABLY THINK ABOUT GETTING IT.   For that old sailor that thought GPS was useless, just think how safe he would be with a GPS, and the knowledge on how to use it properly...  All that old sailing knowledge, along with all the new tech, now that's what I would call... SAFE!  My friend said that he never again sailed with the old captain that didn't want to use a GPS.  

I have been saved twice by my forward looking sonar (FLS) "Echo Pilot".  I have several videos that show how I use the Echo Pilot when I am in shallow water, or potentially shallow water on our channel.  The Echo Pilotl helps me understand the shape of the bottom at and anchorage, or when I am trying to work my way in a narrow shallow channel.  Now, Yes, you can stick someone up on the bow....  That might be good idea in some cases.... BUT, in the Tuamotu Archipelago you might think twice about leaving you wife up on the bow for 5 hours as you make your way across one of the Atolls.   And, is she going to be sharp the entire time?  One of our friends hit the reef in the Tuamotu's, and they thought they were being safe.  Someone on lookout on the bow, but just a few second not watching after 4 hours of not seeing a thing, and WHAM they hit the reef.  Had to patch the hole, and head to Tahiti to get hauled out and repaired.  A nice $10K and 3 months later, everything good.  I was crossing one of the Atols, and my Alarm went off, I could see the reef in front of me on the FLS, and immediately applied full reverse, and we came within 10Ms of the reef.... Since I can only see what is directly in front of me, I don't try to turn, I just back out.   Aquarius would have hit that day.  I would like to add.....Sometimes the glare on the water makes it difficult to see the reef, but not for the FLS.  And.....Sometimes the clouds make it difficult to see the reef systems.  And, if the water is really clear... EVERYTHING LOOKS LIKE IT's 2M deep, then what do you do?  So, I guess you can stick someone up on the bow, and do you feel lucky.  Because they might not see it...   Fact is, you have the best chance of seeing the reef with someone up on the bow, and and FLS.   But, the person on the bow will get fatigued over time, and this will reduce the effectiveness of the watch.   $1500...  That's my 2cents....

I still think if you're going to cross oceans and sail new places...  Get an FLS that is easy to use, and you get good information...  I have one, and have been very happy with it.  Quite disappointed when we hit a log off Columbia and cracked my transducer.  It was down for several months....

Downsides to FLS.. Sometimes they will not work if there is heavy sediment in the water sometimes I was not able to get the depth for unto 5 minutes or so..  You can also get weird readings in fast currents with sediment in the water, or when looking into Prop Wash from a large vessel or tugboat.  But, you will get used to reading the prop wash with experience.

Ken Powers
Aquarius 
Super Maramu 262


Re: Main mast Antennas

Slavko Despotovic
 

Thank you Arnold.

Slavko


Re: generator pcb board

Barry Connor
 

Thank you Jeff,

Early this year my Onan generator was giving trouble and I thought that it might be the PCB, it was the 2 relays which I changed. I have  ordered from your supplier so now Arkansas Valley Diesel Service are only showing one left available on Ebay. The delivery time to Florida seems very slow, I hope that they still have this board and they don't have to source it!
Last year I had to have my Desallator board fixed, was lucky that Desallator, Antibes had a person in Holland who did this for them as the boards for the 220v Desallator are not available.
As our boats age we will find many more parts that are becoming rare.
This forum is actually the best, I doubt any other boat builder has anything to match.
Thank you also Bill for all your assistance. 

Hope the Colombian contact can assist.

Very Best

Barry and Penny
"SV Lady Penelope II"
Amel 54  #17
Sainte Anne anchorage Martinique

On Tuesday, September 29, 2020, 7:29:58 AM EDT, JEFFREY KRAUS <jmkraus@...> wrote:


Eric,
I'll call you this week


Re: Amel 55 sea chest strainer part#

Billy Newport
 

Thanks John
Looks like a vetus ftr1320, confirming with Amel before ordering.


Re: generator pcb board

JEFFREY KRAUS
 

Eric,
I'll call you this week