Date   

Re: leaking membrane cap Dessalator

Porter McRoberts
 

Oscar.  
Bula Bula
Been down this road and happy to help.  Come on over!

Porter
A-54-152

On Jun 6, 2021, at 2:31 PM, Oscar De Schaetzen <oscar.de.schaetzen@...> wrote:

Dear Amelians,

First of all : thank you Bill Rouse for adding me in this group. We've been full-time sailing for 3 years and I only knew about the FaceBook Group. There is much more information in this group!

We are currently in Fiji and we have a leak at the membrane end-cap of our Dessalator Duo 100l/h. To my knowledge, we've never changed the membranes from this watermaker. It now has 676hours. We only changed the oil of the HP pump as well as the O-rings, lip-seals nd a plunger on the HP-CAT pump (as it started leaking last year).

I noticed a small leak of saltwater at the HP tube that is going out of the watermaker after the membranes. I tought : I will undo the hose as well as the 2 screws of the stainless steel part (that is +/- a half-circle) and I put some loctite on the screws. Unfortunately, I made the leak (below the stainless steel part) more important and now it even leaks when I do a manual rincing with fresh water (using the 3-way valve). So If there would be pressure in the membranes, I would spray saltwater everywhere... and thus my watermake is currently out of service... 

My questions :
- Do I need to change the membrane cap (I don't have one in spare) or is it possible to repair the leak?
- I removed the 2 screws that hold the stainless steel part but the stainless steel part didn't come off. Does someone knows if it is possible to remove it? It might be glued / sealed. Because if the answer is yes, I can try to remove it and make it watertight again (with a sillicone gasket or something like that). Has anyone tried that? This could be a temporary solution. Has anyone pictures from the end-cap with the stainless steel part removed? So I can see how it looks inside?

I have written to Dessalator and I await their feedback as well.

I guess I am not the first one with leaking end-caps. So thank you in advance for sharing your experience!!

Kind regards,

Oscar - SV ESTRAN - A54, hull n°4 <membrane endcap.jpg>


Re: Prop Settings for older SM with Volvo/MaxProp

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

The Volvo TMD 22 as installed by Amel in the SM has a design max rpm under load of 2800. Many of us suffered untold grief trying to get more. It will rev cheerfully to 4000 no load. Ie in neutral. If you get higher revs under load it is likely the turbo wastegate is frozen. This causes the engine to get excessive turbo boost pressure which over time will do serious harm to pistons and rings. The wastegate opens progressively as rpm increases to prevent this. Carbon build up causes them to freeze (stick) and periodic maintenance is to remove the exhaust mixer elbow to access the wastegate and free it. 

Kind Regards

Danny

SM 299

Ocean Pearl

On 07 June 2021 at 11:35 Germain Jean-Pierre <jp.germain45@...> wrote:

Hello 2 X Bills,

My previous boat had an identical TDM22.  It was setup to reach 4200 rpm. 

Was very noisy with lots of vibes... but the 46 footer reached 9.5 at full power. 

I’ve noted exacty the symptoms described by Bill K too but given the torque curve of the engine, I understand why Amel decided to keep the max revs down at 3000.  Though 3350 is still well into the good range. 


Jean-Pierre Germain, Eleuthera SM007, NZ

 

On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:28, Bill Kinney <cruisingconsulting@...> wrote:

When we got our Amel (SM #160) it came with what was then the standard 22” diameter MaxProp. All of our documentation pointed to using a setting of 20 degrees (15” Pitch)  With the boat set up like this, it checked all of the standard performance boxes.  Maximum engine RPM 3000: Check. Boat speed with a clean bottom: 8.0 knots, Check.  Should be perfect...

Except... under some conditions, the boat was just not happy.  Motoring into a strong headwind, or steep chop, and the engine RPM could not QUITE climb up high enough that the turbo boost come up enough to continue up the power curve.  It would “get stuck” at 1800 RPM and the boat would really struggle. In flat water, this never happened, it worked just as expected.

This might have been due to an aging powerplant (she’s up to 8200 hours) or some other quirk unique to our boat, but just in case anybody else is left with one of these engine/propeller combinations and has had some of the same issues, here is what we did.

It seemed the engine needed to be un-loaded just a tiny bit.  The next lower setting on the MaxProp is 18 degrees with gives a 13.5” Pitch.  All other things being equal, I calculated this as bringing the engine speed at any given boat speed up by about 8%.  I knew from observations if the engine reached 2100 that was more than enough to get the boost pressure up and let it generate full power.  After consulting people who know a lot more about turbochargers than I do, we made the change.

Maximum engine RPM is now about 3350RPM (still way below the engine makers recommended maximum) Highest boat speed is still just about 8.0 knots, maybe just a hair faster.  So that was all as expected.  The performance against headwinds and seas has dramatically improved.  We haven’t yet found any conditions where the boat gets “stuck.” Unless we find something dramatic, I expect this to be a change we will stick with.

Bill Kinney
SM160,  Harmonie
Eleuthera, BS



 


 


leaking membrane cap Dessalator

Oscar De Schaetzen
 

Dear Amelians,

First of all : thank you Bill Rouse for adding me in this group. We've been full-time sailing for 3 years and I only knew about the FaceBook Group. There is much more information in this group!

We are currently in Fiji and we have a leak at the membrane end-cap of our Dessalator Duo 100l/h. To my knowledge, we've never changed the membranes from this watermaker. It now has 676hours. We only changed the oil of the HP pump as well as the O-rings, lip-seals nd a plunger on the HP-CAT pump (as it started leaking last year).

I noticed a small leak of saltwater at the HP tube that is going out of the watermaker after the membranes. I tought : I will undo the hose as well as the 2 screws of the stainless steel part (that is +/- a half-circle) and I put some loctite on the screws. Unfortunately, I made the leak (below the stainless steel part) more important and now it even leaks when I do a manual rincing with fresh water (using the 3-way valve). So If there would be pressure in the membranes, I would spray saltwater everywhere... and thus my watermake is currently out of service... 

My questions :
- Do I need to change the membrane cap (I don't have one in spare) or is it possible to repair the leak?
- I removed the 2 screws that hold the stainless steel part but the stainless steel part didn't come off. Does someone knows if it is possible to remove it? It might be glued / sealed. Because if the answer is yes, I can try to remove it and make it watertight again (with a sillicone gasket or something like that). Has anyone tried that? This could be a temporary solution. Has anyone pictures from the end-cap with the stainless steel part removed? So I can see how it looks inside?

I have written to Dessalator and I await their feedback as well.

I guess I am not the first one with leaking end-caps. So thank you in advance for sharing your experience!!

Kind regards,

Oscar - SV ESTRAN - A54, hull n°4


Re: Prop Settings for older SM with Volvo/MaxProp

Germain Jean-Pierre
 

Hello 2 X Bills,

My previous boat had an identical TDM22.  It was setup to reach 4200 rpm. 

Was very noisy with lots of vibes... but the 46 footer reached 9.5 at full power. 

I’ve noted exacty the symptoms described by Bill K too but given the torque curve of the engine, I understand why Amel decided to keep the max revs down at 3000.  Though 3350 is still well into the good range. 


Jean-Pierre Germain, Eleuthera SM007, NZ


On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:28, Bill Kinney <cruisingconsulting@...> wrote:

When we got our Amel (SM #160) it came with what was then the standard 22” diameter MaxProp. All of our documentation pointed to using a setting of 20 degrees (15” Pitch)  With the boat set up like this, it checked all of the standard performance boxes.  Maximum engine RPM 3000: Check. Boat speed with a clean bottom: 8.0 knots, Check.  Should be perfect...

Except... under some conditions, the boat was just not happy.  Motoring into a strong headwind, or steep chop, and the engine RPM could not QUITE climb up high enough that the turbo boost come up enough to continue up the power curve.  It would “get stuck” at 1800 RPM and the boat would really struggle. In flat water, this never happened, it worked just as expected.

This might have been due to an aging powerplant (she’s up to 8200 hours) or some other quirk unique to our boat, but just in case anybody else is left with one of these engine/propeller combinations and has had some of the same issues, here is what we did.

It seemed the engine needed to be un-loaded just a tiny bit.  The next lower setting on the MaxProp is 18 degrees with gives a 13.5” Pitch.  All other things being equal, I calculated this as bringing the engine speed at any given boat speed up by about 8%.  I knew from observations if the engine reached 2100 that was more than enough to get the boost pressure up and let it generate full power.  After consulting people who know a lot more about turbochargers than I do, we made the change.

Maximum engine RPM is now about 3350RPM (still way below the engine makers recommended maximum) Highest boat speed is still just about 8.0 knots, maybe just a hair faster.  So that was all as expected.  The performance against headwinds and seas has dramatically improved.  We haven’t yet found any conditions where the boat gets “stuck.” Unless we find something dramatic, I expect this to be a change we will stick with.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Eleuthera, BS



Re: Play in Brunson H6 prop blade

Denis Elborn
 

Hi Mohammad,

When you replace the bearings there is adjustment to get the correct play which is locked by a locking ring, this may have come loose, assuming you don’t have a bearing problem.

I think it will be an ‘out of the water’ repair.

Regards, Denis
Fortune A54 #159
St. Raphael 


On 7 Jun 2021, at 9:01 am, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:

It sounds to me like something was done wrong, or something is wrong. I have seen the bearings. That is way too much play.

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Sun, Jun 6, 2021 at 4:52 PM Mohammad Shirloo <mshirloo@...> wrote:
Hi everyone;

While diving to clean the hull and the prop, I noticed that one of the blades rocks back and forth about 1/8” to 1/4”. The other two are tight. 

The blades had new bearings installed in 2018  with about 1800 hours on the engine. This is about the time Brunton recommends an overhaul. The work was done at Manoel”s in Malta by workers that seemed competent.

Has anyone run into this ? Any information on repairs ot solutions would be appreciated.



Respectfully;


Mohammad Shirloo
+1-323-633-2222 Cell
+1-424-644-0908 Fax




Re: Play in Brunson H6 prop blade

 

It sounds to me like something was done wrong, or something is wrong. I have seen the bearings. That is way too much play.

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Sun, Jun 6, 2021 at 4:52 PM Mohammad Shirloo <mshirloo@...> wrote:
Hi everyone;

While diving to clean the hull and the prop, I noticed that one of the blades rocks back and forth about 1/8” to 1/4”. The other two are tight. 

The blades had new bearings installed in 2018  with about 1800 hours on the engine. This is about the time Brunton recommends an overhaul. The work was done at Manoel”s in Malta by workers that seemed competent.

Has anyone run into this ? Any information on repairs ot solutions would be appreciated.



Respectfully;


Mohammad Shirloo
+1-323-633-2222 Cell
+1-424-644-0908 Fax


Re: Prop Settings for older SM with Volvo/MaxProp

 

Bill,

Very interesting. You may be on to something. When I checked with MaxProp, I was told 22°

image.png
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Sun, Jun 6, 2021 at 4:28 PM Bill Kinney <cruisingconsulting@...> wrote:
When we got our Amel (SM #160) it came with what was then the standard 22” diameter MaxProp. All of our documentation pointed to using a setting of 20 degrees (15” Pitch)  With the boat set up like this, it checked all of the standard performance boxes.  Maximum engine RPM 3000: Check. Boat speed with a clean bottom: 8.0 knots, Check.  Should be perfect...

Except... under some conditions, the boat was just not happy.  Motoring into a strong headwind, or steep chop, and the engine RPM could not QUITE climb up high enough that the turbo boost come up enough to continue up the power curve.  It would “get stuck” at 1800 RPM and the boat would really struggle. In flat water, this never happened, it worked just as expected.

This might have been due to an aging powerplant (she’s up to 8200 hours) or some other quirk unique to our boat, but just in case anybody else is left with one of these engine/propeller combinations and has had some of the same issues, here is what we did.

It seemed the engine needed to be un-loaded just a tiny bit.  The next lower setting on the MaxProp is 18 degrees with gives a 13.5” Pitch.  All other things being equal, I calculated this as bringing the engine speed at any given boat speed up by about 8%.  I knew from observations if the engine reached 2100 that was more than enough to get the boost pressure up and let it generate full power.  After consulting people who know a lot more about turbochargers than I do, we made the change.

Maximum engine RPM is now about 3350RPM (still way below the engine makers recommended maximum) Highest boat speed is still just about 8.0 knots, maybe just a hair faster.  So that was all as expected.  The performance against headwinds and seas has dramatically improved.  We haven’t yet found any conditions where the boat gets “stuck.” Unless we find something dramatic, I expect this to be a change we will stick with.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Eleuthera, BS



Re: Lofran windlass electro motor

 

The Foot Control momentary ON push-button switches are Vetus
switches and available at SAV@...

image.png
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Sun, Jun 6, 2021 at 8:36 AM Olaf Bauer <olaf.bauer@...> wrote:

Hi Slavko,

 

Normally you can get them in (almost) every marine shop. I bought mine over there.

 

But you can also make a research on Amazon with the keywords “marine button rubber”. You will find some 😉

 

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Slavko Despotovic
Sent: Sonntag, 6. Juni 2021 03:21
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Lofran windlass electro motor

 

I got new motor and replacement was easy and massy. But it work now perfectly. One more question.  I would need to replace push button that is on the windlass itself. Any idea where I can order? I searched internet but no success.
Adding some photos.... 
--
Slavko
SM 2000
#279 Bonne Anse in Portoroz


Play in Brunson H6 prop blade

Mohammad Shirloo
 

Hi everyone;

While diving to clean the hull and the prop, I noticed that one of the blades rocks back and forth about 1/8” to 1/4”. The other two are tight. 

The blades had new bearings installed in 2018  with about 1800 hours on the engine. This is about the time Brunton recommends an overhaul. The work was done at Manoel”s in Malta by workers that seemed competent.

Has anyone run into this ? Any information on repairs ot solutions would be appreciated.



Respectfully;


Mohammad Shirloo
+1-323-633-2222 Cell
+1-424-644-0908 Fax


Prop Settings for older SM with Volvo/MaxProp

Bill Kinney
 

When we got our Amel (SM #160) it came with what was then the standard 22” diameter MaxProp. All of our documentation pointed to using a setting of 20 degrees (15” Pitch)  With the boat set up like this, it checked all of the standard performance boxes.  Maximum engine RPM 3000: Check. Boat speed with a clean bottom: 8.0 knots, Check.  Should be perfect...

Except... under some conditions, the boat was just not happy.  Motoring into a strong headwind, or steep chop, and the engine RPM could not QUITE climb up high enough that the turbo boost come up enough to continue up the power curve.  It would “get stuck” at 1800 RPM and the boat would really struggle. In flat water, this never happened, it worked just as expected.

This might have been due to an aging powerplant (she’s up to 8200 hours) or some other quirk unique to our boat, but just in case anybody else is left with one of these engine/propeller combinations and has had some of the same issues, here is what we did.

It seemed the engine needed to be un-loaded just a tiny bit.  The next lower setting on the MaxProp is 18 degrees with gives a 13.5” Pitch.  All other things being equal, I calculated this as bringing the engine speed at any given boat speed up by about 8%.  I knew from observations if the engine reached 2100 that was more than enough to get the boost pressure up and let it generate full power.  After consulting people who know a lot more about turbochargers than I do, we made the change.

Maximum engine RPM is now about 3350RPM (still way below the engine makers recommended maximum) Highest boat speed is still just about 8.0 knots, maybe just a hair faster.  So that was all as expected.  The performance against headwinds and seas has dramatically improved.  We haven’t yet found any conditions where the boat gets “stuck.” Unless we find something dramatic, I expect this to be a change we will stick with.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Eleuthera, BS



Re: For those that missed the first procurement of Rub Rails

EricOpdeweegh
 

Thanks Pat, 

Sounds great. Looking forward to some photos of the final result.

Happy Sailing
Eric
sv Abayomi SM 158 


Re: 32mm 1 1/4" Bronze Ball Valves - USA

Mark Erdos
 

Thanks Mark! Having the part number really helps and now gives me better options.

 

I also just found BSP thread valves at http://www.absvalve.com/ in Ft. Lauderdale. They are the US distributor for Maetrini (good quality Italian made).

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mark McGovern
Sent: Sunday, June 6, 2021 1:38 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] 32mm 1 1/4" Bronze Ball Valves - USA

 

Mark,

I just replaced the ball valve in my forward head.  Believe it or not, but I got mine on Walmart.com.  Do a google search for "IBV-1250BSPP" which is Groco's part number for this valve and you will find several sources for it.  Defender will also special order it for you from Groco but it takes awhile.  They will do that for most of the manufacturer's they carry.

--
Mark McGovern
SM #440 Cara
Deale, MD USA


Re: For those that missed the first procurement of Rub Rails

Patrick McAneny
 

Eric, I just installed mine last week, I will take a picture later this week ,but it looks exactly like the brown one you have,except it is white. I also think the newer SMs came with it white.
Pat
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: EricOpdeweegh <sv.abayomi@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Sun, Jun 6, 2021 1:50 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] For those that missed the first procurement of Rub Rails

Price sounds fine. 
Is there anyone else in the group who has some more photos what it looks like finished completely.
Some photo’s from a distance maybe?

rgrds 
Eric
sv ABAYOMI SM 158
currently in Italy sailing soon for the Azores 


Re: For those that missed the first procurement of Rub Rails

EricOpdeweegh
 

Price sounds fine. 

Is there anyone else in the group who has some more photos what it looks like finished completely.
Some photo’s from a distance maybe?

rgrds 
Eric
sv ABAYOMI SM 158
currently in Italy sailing soon for the Azores 


Re: BT SEAL INSTRUCTIONS

Jose Venegas
 

Ken,

I am not sure that we have been on the same page. I appreciate that you are trying to describe the process with fool prof detail, but I don’t appreciate the way you have approached me regarding your questions. I will be happy if you contact me privately and clarify the issues that I have already described twice in this string and twice more in the previous string. As I said, I mounted “the Jose” seals (two of them in series); The wiper and the lip seal, and I stated that I thought the order on which they were mounted may not affect much the result.

Again, your interpretation of how I installed the seals is wrong.
I mounted them in the order that can be seen from the picture I appended, First the lip seal and then the wiper on top of it. In fact it is more like in the seal replacement 2 but there you are missing the wiper seal on top of the lip seal. NOTE that the lip seal height is exactly the depth of the cavity, and thus the once the wiper is mounted it will protrude out a few millimeters but, because it is glued the upper surface of the lip seal. it remains solidly attached to it. One alternative approach that may also work is to glue both seals before mounting them.

Once mounted this way, the “lips” of both seals face down and are abut 2 millimeters apart. Also, the combined seal is pretty solid supporting side motions of the trunk.

If you mount the wiper first, it has a height that fills 1/2 the depth of the cavity and its lip extends below the surface of it. This leaves 1/2 of the depth to insert the lip seal and glue it to both the upper surface of the wiper and 1/2 the hight of the side wall of the cavity which will be more than enough.

Now if you want to know what I think, this order of mounting the seals (first the the wiper and then the lip seal) leaves the “lips" of both seals separated vertically by about one centimeter, and the combined seal provides less stiffness supporting side motions of the trunk. The could be better in terms of reducing the friction between the seals and the trunk, perhaps increasing its life span, but I am not sure whether over time the lack of lateral support will be better at preventing water intake.

One thing I know: I still have the same set I ordered originally, mounted in the order I described, and after 4 years I have had no water intake.

I do remember that someone had problems inserting back the trunk because he had not used the wood tool, and that may have damaged the lips of the seals or even partially dislodged them. I am not sure if that person was Steve, but that would explain the initial failure.

Jose
Ipanema SM 2K 278
Currently in Cartagena Colombia


BT Seal Source

david bruce
 

For those that could not open the zip file i sent in a message recently, here is a screenshot of the details and contact information i received from Jose and successfully used to order the seals, which was a very smooth transaction, 20 piece minimum as Ken said.   IMO since there is no volume discount, it would seem to make sense to work in small groups to order and distribute the seals, using Venmo or similar to send/receive payment for seals and shipping charge, thus taking the load off Ken.  

Best
Dave Bruce
Liesse SN006




Re: BT seals

Jose Venegas
 

Hi Fred,

Here are the specs for the silicone. I am sure there could be a better material but this is the one I used.

https://www.sspseals.com/materials/vinyl-methyl-silicone-rubber


Re: BT seals

Jose Venegas
 

Dear Fred,
These are the characteristics of the seals I ordered from SSP in 2019.  It looks like they have increased a little bit the price but not much.

I am sure you can find a manufacturar in europe or Asia that would make something similar.

You can go to their website and find out more about the materials they use. 

Jose

10 pcs. Silicone wiper 59.5 x 80 x 4/12 =$ 31.65ea.
20 pcs.                          ditto                          =$ 29.75ea.
 
10 pcs. Silicone u-cup 59.5 x 80 x 12 = $ 32.50ea.
20 pcs.                          ditto                     =  $ 30 75ea.
Will need 14-17 business days to ship.      
 
Ray Romanick
200_logo_contact_2 email small
SSP Manufacturing Inc.
83 Spring Lane
Hackettstown, NJ 07840
Phone: 908-852-3125
Fax: 908-852-3425
1-888-238-SEAL
Web Page:www.sspseals.com


Re: Lofran windlass electro motor

Olaf Bauer
 

Hi Slavko,

 

Normally you can get them in (almost) every marine shop. I bought mine over there.

 

But you can also make a research on Amazon with the keywords “marine button rubber”. You will find some 😉

 

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Slavko Despotovic
Sent: Sonntag, 6. Juni 2021 03:21
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Lofran windlass electro motor

 

I got new motor and replacement was easy and massy. But it work now perfectly. One more question.  I would need to replace push button that is on the windlass itself. Any idea where I can order? I searched internet but no success.
Adding some photos.... 
--
Slavko
SM 2000
#279 Bonne Anse in Portoroz


Re: Lofran windlass electro motor

Hans Schaidinger
 

Hello Slavko,

last year I ordered the push buttons direct at amel service in Hyeres, good qualitiy and works perfect!

 

Cordially

Hans

SM2K #411 ALADEMAR Rogoznica

 

Von: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> Im Auftrag von Slavko Despotovic
Gesendet: Sonntag, 6. Juni 2021 09:21
An: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Betreff: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Lofran windlass electro motor

 

I got new motor and replacement was easy and massy. But it work now perfectly. One more question.  I would need to replace push button that is on the windlass itself. Any idea where I can order? I searched internet but no success.
Adding some photos.... 
--
Slavko
SM 2000
#279 Bonne Anse in Portoroz

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