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Re: Batteries: single failed battery in the house bank, impact for other batteries
Mark McGovern
David,
I was going to suggest the following but you beat me to it: "we will disconnect the pair containing the remaining single from the pair that contained the dud battery" However, I would suggest that you do this immediately so as to not risk damaging the other pairs. Especially if you want to wring a little more life out out of the remaining batteries in the bank. -- Mark McGovern SM #440 Cara Deale, MD USA
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Re: Amel 54 Standing Rigging and changes to the Mainmast Lower and Intermediate Shrouds
Hi Bill,
I get that, but it does not reveal the real cause for the increase. I would imagine Amel would issue a safety bulletin if they found out the original sizes too small. Loosing your rig seems a bit much to find out the shrouds were not beefy enough. Arno SV Luna, A54-121
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Re: Batteries: single failed battery in the house bank, impact for other batteries
David Vogel
Thanks Alan,
The old start battery seems to be OOK in service. However, it appears that the battery that was paired with the failed one is also on the way out (if not already failed, just showing signs of life). We are leaning towards replacing the whole lot with Fireflies, but this is introducing scheduling issues – namely, the clock it already ticking on our French Long-Stay visas, and if we don’t get away soon, the VISAs wil time-expire. Naming that we will have to move on (to NZ), where we might well have otherwise done the replacement anyway (if the current remaining batteries do not fail in the meantime). Which Battery Balancer to you use (&/or recommend)? Best, David&Leanne, PERIGEE, SM#396, Panama Bound for French Poly From: <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> on behalf of Alan Leslie <s.v.elyse@hotmail.com> Reply-To: <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> Date: Monday, 27 May 2019 at 2:14 am To: <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Batteries: single failed battery in the house bank, impact for other batteries David. I think it highly likely that the AGM start battery is not in the same state of charge as the house bank AGMs that have been charged quite differently. All house bank batteries should be the same brand, type and age to minimise differences in charging. Further I believe that if you have batteries in series parallel, the in between links should be connected in parallel banks and also with a battery balancer to ensure equal charging to each individual battery. I'm afraid I agree with Bill, you should replace the complete house bank. Cheers Alan Elyse SM 437
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Re: Vetus Flexi coupling
Gary, I think you identified two big issues. The heat will reach the operating temperature of the engine, which is 80C. I just did a search of nylocs. The temperature range is all over the place, but 80 degrees seems within the range of all I checked that specify a temperature range. And 10-15 used seems to be the range of those that claimed multiple use. The fact is that most of us would not think of these things and grab nylocs from a bin without any verification of material used, or specifications. That fact, along with the fact that Chinese manufacturers probably make most of these, spells problems. Best, CW Bill Rouse Yacht School - Supporting Amel Owners www.YachtSchool.us 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970
On Thu, May 30, 2019, 9:17 AM Gary Silver via Groups.Io <garysilver=mac.com@groups.io> wrote: Hi Kent:
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Re: Batteries: single failed battery in the house bank, impact for other batteries
David Vogel
Thanks Bill, for the double-barrel response,
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Batteries: We are leaning towards replacing the whole lot with FIREFLYs, per Bill KINNEY on Harmonie. If this does not prove possible within a reasonable time frame, we will disconnect the pair containing the remaining single from the pair that contained the dud battery, and head on out, anticipating replacement in NZ late 2020 if we can keep things going for that long, otherwise Tahiti. ONAN: In addition to replacing the Starter and –ve solenoid, I went through all the troubleshooting steps as suggested and per the Service Manual – all apparently OK and with no change – still a failure to crank. When I finally got the technicians on board, they poked around finding nothing and eventually plugged in an old Control-Board from an ONAN 21kVa Genset. This, apparently, has enough commonality with the 7MDKAV to enable our unit to crank, start and run (for 3 seconds before the protective mechanisms engaged and shut the unit down; this test repeated 3 times). Thereby indicating that all our switches, relays etc are OK, but the PCB itself is at fault. We’re n ow trying to source one of these control boards. Cheers, David&Leanne, PERIGEE, SM#396, Panama Bound for French Polynesia From: <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> on behalf of Bill Rouse <brouse@gmail.com> Reply-To: <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> Date: Sunday, 26 May 2019 at 1:30 pm To: <main@amelyachtowners.groups.io> Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Batteries: single failed battery in the house bank, impact for other batteries I am not sure, and I believe you believe the same. With thousands of miles ahead of you and 3+ year old battery bank, I would consider changing the entire house bank, especially since getting 3-4 years is average for high-use Amels. Good on the lead acid start battery. When troubleshooting the Onan, I believe the weak point is the cable that runs inside from the negative connection post to the battery side of the Negative start solenoid. The connection post where cables from the battery switches connect is located on the left side, facing, about half way down. I believe you can easily bypass this undersized cable by connecting a jumper from that connection post to the battery side of the negative start solenoid. You could also test the negative start solenoid by connecting that jumper cable to the starter side of the negative solenoid. 1 jumper cable can be used to test two items. If the problem turns out to be the negative start solenoid, don't leave that jumper on the starter side of the solenoid permanently. Best, CW Bill Rouse Yacht School - Supporting Amel Owners www.YachtSchool.us 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970
On Sun, May 26, 2019, 11:24 AM David Vogel <david.vogel@westnet.com.au> wrote:
Greetings all, Whilst trouble-shooting an unserviceable ONAN (failure to crank), I checked out the health of the 105Ah 800CCA AGM start battery (good), and house-bank (12x105Ah AGMs). Start and house batteries were all AGM, same model and date-of-install (Sep'16). All tested OK, with the exception of one battery in the house bank, which failed the State-of-Charge test with an Open-Circuit-Voltage (OCV) of 11.00V (as measured, so no surprises here), unstable; and failed State-of-Health of CCA of 35.0A). The other battery in the pair containing the failed battery surprisingly tested OK, with SoC 12.72V [92%] and SoH CCA of 642A [91%]. As an interim step, whilst considering broader options ... ... I replaced the good start-battery with a 100Ah/700CCA flooded lead-acid battery; removed the failed AGM battery from the house bank, and replaced it with the 'good' AGM start battery. The performance of the house battery bank immediately improved, I guess due to the absence of the parasitic load of the failed battery. However, concerned about the remaining battery in the new pair contained the failed battery, I have been keeping a close eye on the charge volts, current, and temps of all batteries. 24 hours after the swap-out/in, during the second charge cycle, I noted high charging current to the new battery-pair containing the old-start battery. The smart-charger was ordering ~150Amps from the 175A/24V Leece-Neville (normal for the start-of-charge-cycle) - 5 battery-pairs were accepting about 20Amps each (OK and as expected, at ~20% of the '20-hour rate' of 105Ah), but the 'at risk' pair was accepting 40 to 50Amps. Temps for the 5 'good' pairs were about 1ºC above ambient and stable; but the temp of the questionable pair was ambient +2ºC and rising. I stopped the charge cycle after 30 minutes; and isolated the questionable pair from the house-bank by removing the bridging strap between the batteries in the pair. Shortly after the cessation of the interrupted charge cycle, the temperature of the high-current pair peaked at 36.5ºC (ambient other batteries +2.5ºC). I am seeking clarification regarding: Is is likely that the remaining battery from the 'old pair' had already suffered irreversible damage (such as an internal short), thereby reducing internal resistance, thereby accepting a higher charge (than the other 'good' battery pairs). On the basis of temperature alone , I do not think I have suffered temperature-related damage to the old start battery. However: Question - is it likely that 30-minutes of charge at twice the maximum recommend bulk/absorption current charge-rate has resulted in permanent damage to the previously 'good' start-battery? This discussion shared for the learning, and also for the benefit of trouble-shooting by other unfortunates who may in future find themselves in a similar predicament. Thanks in anticipation ... David SM#396/Perigee On anchor, Brisas, Pacific side of Panama Departure for the Marquesas pending the return of the ONAN to service Diagnostic tools: Magneti Marelli BT002 Battery Tester; FLIR TG165 Spot Thermal Camera; Voltcraft VC-595OLED Digital Clamp Multimeter. Note: the OLED display on the Voltcraft multimeter is impossible to read in direct sunlight, so next time I would choose a model with a different type of display. Otherwise, this is a great tool, although I do not use the BlueTooth functionality.
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Re: Vetus Flexi coupling
Gary Silver
Hi Kent:
You are correct that Nylock nuts a single use items (at least in aircraft applications and I assume in other critical applications). They are also low heat suitable as nylon deforms at temperature. I don't know how hot this area gets but perhaps metal locking nuts would be better. In the aircraft industry metal locking nuts are used in virtually all engine compartment applications. There are specially coated metal locking nuts that are suitable even on exhaust components. Various types such as https://jlanfranco.com/products/all-metal-locknuts/ or for aircraft https://catalog.continental-aero.com/viewitems/all-metal-lock-nuts/all-categories-all-metal-lock-nuts-aero-flex You will have to do some research to find the metric size and grade you need. All the best, Gary S. Silver s/v Liahona Amel SM 2000 # 335 Puerto Del Rey Marina, Puerto Rico
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Re: Amel 54 Standing Rigging and changes to the Mainmast Lower and Intermediate Shrouds
Peter, Probably not. Rudi probably changed them before you bought her. Amel 54 #46 was made several months after #35 and had 10mm Lower Shrouds. #46 reported to this group a failure of both lower shrouds which caused rig failure near Easter Island. You can search topics in this group for "Lower Shrouds Main Mast" to see that report. Best, CW Bill Rouse Yacht School - Supporting Amel Owners www.YachtSchool.us 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970
On Thu, May 30, 2019, 7:59 AM Peter Forbes <ppsforbes@...> wrote:
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Re: The two "sticks" on the genoa top swivel
Mike, take a look at the photos Bill has posted. There appears to me to be something missing from your swivel where the shackle is attached. Mine, like the one in the photo, has a spacer fitted to keep that shackle away from the foil. It would seem to me that if that shackle got pinched or caught sideways it could cause some scratching/damage to the foil up there.
Secondarily, I've tried a soft shackle at that point and even after polishing the pass-through point as best I could, it chafed very quickly so I think the metal shackle is the better idea. Gary W. SM 209, Adagio Galesville, MD USA
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Re: Amel 54 Standing Rigging and changes to the Mainmast Lower and Intermediate Shrouds
My Main Aft Lowers are 12mm- on AMEL 54 #035 - I imagine these are the original. Peter Forbes Amel 54 Carango La Rochelle
On Thu, 30 May 2019 at 13:40, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:
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Re: Amel 54 Standing Rigging and changes to the Mainmast Lower and Intermediate Shrouds
Arno, I think we can assume that ACMO did this on instructions from Amel because the larger rigging wire was installed on later production 54s, and obviously ordered that way by Amel. Best, CW Bill Rouse Yacht School - Supporting Amel Owners www.YachtSchool.us 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970
On Thu, May 30, 2019, 6:45 AM Arno Luijten <arno.luijten@...> wrote: Hi Bill,
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Re: Vetus Flexi coupling
"Unlocks" may be the right name for Paul's nylocks, though!
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Re: Amel 54 Standing Rigging and changes to the Mainmast Lower and Intermediate Shrouds
Hi Bill,
On hull 121 the sizes are still the original ones so 8 intermediate, 10 lower. I have not noticed any issues with these shrouds. I have more concern with the lower shroud on the mizzen as it is 7 mm and seems to be a bit too stretchy when sailing. Did the OEM rigger give any reason why they beefed up the main mast rigging? Arno Luijten SV Luna, A54-121
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Re: Vetus Flexi coupling
Darn spellcheck...I guess unlocks is a bad name for nylocks.
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Kent Robertson
On May 30, 2019, at 6:25 AM, karkauai via Groups.Io <karkauai@...> wrote:
I understand that unlocks should be replaced every time you remove them...at least on critical applications. Kent Robertson S/V Kristy Might be, no vibration though, I guess the nylock have been on and off a few times and the locking capability get reduced. time to replace the nuts maybe
Paul
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Re: Vetus Flexi coupling
I understand that unlocks should be replaced every time you remove them...at least on critical applications.
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Kent Robertson S/V Kristy
On May 29, 2019, at 4:48 PM, Paul Osterberg <osterberg.paul.l@...> wrote:
Might be, no vibration though, I guess the nylock have been on and off a few times and the locking capability get reduced. time to replace the nuts maybe Paul
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Re: Watermaker
ianjenkins1946 <ianjudyjenkins@hotmail.com>
Thanks, Mark, That will save me few bucks. It seems that I am going to have to strip down the pipework to dislodge the present blockage. Thankfully, the tank is still filling and the membranes are only two seasons old so I know the quality is good.
Ian and Judy, Pen Azen, SM 302 Lavrion Greece
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> on behalf of Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...>
Sent: 28 May 2019 16:15 To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Watermaker Hi Ian and Judy,
The tap is available in most hardware stores for under $5
With best regards,
Mark
Skipper Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275 Currently cruising - Panama www.creampuff.us
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io]
On Behalf Of ianjenkins1946 <ianjudyjenkins@...>
Hi all,
We have the 60 lph Dessalator which has nearly 3,200 hours on it in 19 years. Really pleased with its performance. However, one weakness is the chrome tap on the control board, because its cock depends on a rubber washer which perishes too easily and I haven't found a way to replace the washer so have had to buy new taps from Dessalator. I think we are now on our fourth.
We use the tap regularly to test the quality of the water with a handheld gadget.
What has now happened is that the pipe to the tap has become blocked, so that even with a new tap fitted no water comes out when the tap is opened.
When you switch off the w/m , if you leave the tap open you will hear a sucking noise as air is sucked into the tap. I think what must have happened is that when the last washer perished a piece of the washer broke off and was sucked into the pipe and now blocks is.
I have tried blowing and sucking but to no avail. The next step would be to insert a wire very gently to see if I can dislodge the obstruction, but I am reluctant to do this is there is a safer way.
Has anyone else had this problem ? Any solutions ?
Ian and Judy, Pen Azen, SM 302 Lavrion, Greece
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Re: The two "sticks" on the genoa top swivel
Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
Hi Mike, this week I fitted a new "pencil". I thought I would have to open up one or other of the ends of the track to get it in. It was too tight to enter where the track widens for the sail entry. I had looked at it and discarded the idea of getting it in there. Paul Smith (known to his friends as Buddha) of NZ Yacht Services Opua looked at the problem for me. He was fiddling with it in that widened slot area and agreed it was too tight. Then when my back was turned he gave it a light sharp blow with an alloy hammer. Bingo. Done. Well done Paul, saved potentially hours of work. I mention this as an advisory to the many I am sure need to do this. Then it was a simple matter with the swivel down to remove the tongue and re enter it into the pencil. I believe many will find the tongue is worn through and needs replacing so it would be wise to have both on hand when the job is undertaken. Amel have both parts available. Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl.
On 23 May 2019 at 04:34 SV Trilogy <svtrilogy53@...> wrote:
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Re: Genoa Fair Leads
Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
Hi Ken, Loved the video. However NSR did not need to cut the track. Had they taken the screws out of the stanchion just forward of the track end they could have easily pushed it sideways to allow the car to be removed. I share this information for others who may need to do this.
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Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl
On 29 May 2019 at 07:10 Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@ksa.com> wrote:
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Amel 54 Standing Rigging and changes to the Mainmast Lower and Intermediate Shrouds
Amel 54 owners,
Many of you are considering new standing rigging. It has come to my attention that sometime between 2009 and 2010 Amel installed larger size Mainmast Lower and Intermediate Shrouds on Amel 54s. I am not sure at which hull number the change took place, but I know that the smaller shrouds were still being used from the first Amel 54 to hull 117 (2009); and I know that the larger shrouds were installed on hull 162 (2010). Between these two hull numbers, Amel increased the wire size, first on the Lower and later on both the Lower and Intermediate shrouds.
Amel 54 Mainmast Shrouds latest information (French):
Top Shroud (Galhaubans) 12mm (no change)
Intermediate Shroud (Inters) 10mm (changed from 8mm)
Lower Shroud (Bas Haubans AR) 12mm (changed from 10mm)
ACMO, Amel's OEM standing rigging supplier, currently ships the larger Lower and Intermediate shrouds when they receive orders for either these shrouds separately, or a complete standing rigging kit. If you have already installed new rigging and you or your rigger ordered the rigging from ACMO, you are likely fine. If the rigging was not made by ACMO, chances are your new wire is the same size as the wire you had. This may be a problem for you.
Obviously, you will need to inform any rigger you use of this change. This week I have informed several riggers that I regularly contact, As with some information I share with the Amel Yacht Owners Group, my information is not necessarily officially from Amel. I do not speak for Amel. This is the case with this Amel 54 rigging wire size change. Because some of you are currently in the process of changing rigging, I am posting what I know today. If I learn more about this subject, I will update you here.
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Re: Vetus Flexi coupling
Might be, no vibration though, I guess the nylock have been on and off a few times and the locking capability get reduced. time to replace the nuts maybe
Paul
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Re: Furling motor brushes
I thought the brush was slightly smaller than the channel. Best, CW Bill Rouse Yacht School - Supporting Amel Owners www.YachtSchool.us 720 Winnie St Galveston Island, TX 77550 +1(832) 380-4970
On Wed, May 29, 2019, 3:07 PM Kelly Ran <naryllek@...> wrote:
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