Date   

Re: Genoa Chain Plate bolts Leaking in aft hanging closet

eric freedman
 

I have been using that butyl tape over the boat for a few years. However, for this application I think I would use a polysulfide like boat life or something similar. I would not feel comfortable using butyl as I don't think I could get a continuous bond all the way through the hull.. Using butyl on deck fittings is great as you can put some around the underside of bolt holes and then some under the head of the bolts and it works great , but for the chain plate bolts I would not use butyl.

On October 14, 2020 at 9:57 PM Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...> wrote:

Hello James,

After several Amelians suggested the use of Butyl Tape, and after a bit of research on the subject....  I am going to use the Butyl Tape.  Though I am a bit worried about completely removing the chainplate.....

Ken

 


Re: Sq. footage of hull

Craig Briggs
 

Interesting that the Delos crew seem not to know that Amel has always used a barrier coat inside the gelcoat such that blisters are not an issue. After sand-blasting, which may have compromised the gelcoat/barrier coat they then applied 3 layer$ of barrier coat. Oh well, belts and suspender$ and suspender$ and suspender$. Great that a blog can handle the budget.
SN68 Sangaris, Tropic Isle Harbor, FL


Re: Genoa Chain Plate bolts Leaking in aft hanging closet

Ken Powers SV Aquarius
 

Hello James,

After several Amelians suggested the use of Butyl Tape, and after a bit of research on the subject....  I am going to use the Butyl Tape.  Though I am a bit worried about completely removing the chainplate.....

Ken


Re: Sq. footage of hull

Sheriffdep
 
Edited

SV Delos has a good video for measuring the sq footage of the SM2k bottom and they used 9 gal of primer "I think"for their bottom. Around 705sqft. One layer grey, one white, and another grey. Then they used a new tech type spray on coating for the anti foul.  But that video is SV Delos Bottom Work in Grenada and that will tell you exactly how much they used, I just haven't watched it in awhile.  Hope this helps, in reading what others put you have several options for sizes.  


Re: Leather steering wheel cover install

Alan Leslie
 

Yes you can see the unused holes, but it's really of no consequence


Re: Leather steering wheel cover install

Alan Leslie
 

Hi Gary,
No kit number, we had to measure.
And they are different, some wheels like ours with alloy spokes, some have round stainless spokes, no sure if the diameters are the same.
Cheers
Alan
Elyse SM437


Re: Leather steering wheel cover install

amelforme
 

By a small amount I think all the dimensions were different enough to need a good accurate measurement. Sorry I can't remember more details. Should have written things down...

JOEL F. POTTER
CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST LLC
THE EXPERIENCED AMEL GUY
Office 954-462-5869 

On Oct 14, 2020, at 4:14 PM, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS <simms@...> wrote:



Thanks Joel. That would explain why two covers I got from Amel were too small. Maud didnt seem to know about the different diameters. Was the difference in wheel diameter or the size of the tube used. 

Danny

SM 299

Ocean Pearl

On 15 October 2020 at 08:47 "Arnold Mente via groups.io" <Arnold.mente@...> wrote:

I choose this solution without changing the signature of Henry Amel!!

Arnold
SM203
SV Zephyr

Am 14.10.2020 um 21:41 schrieb amelforme < jfpottercys@...>:

There were at least three distinctly different steering wheels used on the Super Maramu during the production that yielded 479 examples over 16 years. I don’t remember the time period each wheel was built in, so sending measurements is a good idea. When I asked Jacques Carteau the reason for the changes, he mentioned that he was always looking to lighten the wheel without decreasing strength. Why? To put less of a load on the chain riven autopilot drive to the steering rack and reduce inertial loads on the entire system as it shifts direction.
 
This is just one interesting example of the thought and minutia present in the evolution of the Super Maramu. 
 
All the best,
Joel 
 
            JOEL F. POTTER ~ CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST, L.L.C.
                                         The Experienced AMEL Guy
UNSURPASSED AMEL MARKETING EXPERIENCE AND PRODUCT KNOWLEDGE
                                  Office 954-462-5869  Cell 954-812-2485
 
From:   main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io  < main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>   On Behalf Of Gary Wells
Sent:  Wednesday, October 14, 2020 11:19 AM
To:   main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject:  Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Leather steering wheel cover install
 

Looks awesome!  

I wrote to them and asked about a kit for the SM .. Their reply was that "there are different sizes" so I needed to send measurements ...  
I didn't think this was the case.

May I ask if you got a "Kit" number or part number from them I could reference? If not, I'll start measuring (whick means stripping the old stuff off first, I presume).

Thanks!


Gary W.
SM 209, Adagio
Maryland, USA

 




 


--
Arnold
SY Zephyr SM203


 


Re: Leather steering wheel cover install

Thomas Kleman
 

Gary- you have to remove the old cover and measure very carefully. I even sent pics of some of the measurements. Oddly, boat leather.com does not save measurements from previous orders. I was pretty sure I have Alan's same wheel (his is 437) but while the owner had a record that he sold something to Alan, he didn't save the measurements.

Thomas Kleman
SV L'ORIENT
SM2K 422


Re: Leather steering wheel cover install

Thomas Kleman
 

Thanks Alan- so can you see the disused holes in the wheel cover where it moves over the spoke or no ?

Thomas Kleman
SV L'ORIENT
SM2K 422
Oahu


Re: Leather steering wheel cover install

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Thanks Joel. That would explain why two covers I got from Amel were too small. Maud didnt seem to know about the different diameters. Was the difference in wheel diameter or the size of the tube used. 

Danny

SM 299

Ocean Pearl

On 15 October 2020 at 08:47 "Arnold Mente via groups.io" <Arnold.mente@...> wrote:

I choose this solution without changing the signature of Henry Amel!!

Arnold
SM203
SV Zephyr

Am 14.10.2020 um 21:41 schrieb amelforme < jfpottercys@...>:

There were at least three distinctly different steering wheels used on the Super Maramu during the production that yielded 479 examples over 16 years. I don’t remember the time period each wheel was built in, so sending measurements is a good idea. When I asked Jacques Carteau the reason for the changes, he mentioned that he was always looking to lighten the wheel without decreasing strength. Why? To put less of a load on the chain riven autopilot drive to the steering rack and reduce inertial loads on the entire system as it shifts direction.
 
This is just one interesting example of the thought and minutia present in the evolution of the Super Maramu. 
 
All the best,
Joel 
 
            JOEL F. POTTER ~ CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST, L.L.C.
                                         The Experienced AMEL Guy
UNSURPASSED AMEL MARKETING EXPERIENCE AND PRODUCT KNOWLEDGE
                                  Office 954-462-5869  Cell 954-812-2485
 
From:   main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io  < main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io>   On Behalf Of Gary Wells
Sent:  Wednesday, October 14, 2020 11:19 AM
To:   main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject:  Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Leather steering wheel cover install
 

Looks awesome!  

I wrote to them and asked about a kit for the SM .. Their reply was that "there are different sizes" so I needed to send measurements ...  
I didn't think this was the case.

May I ask if you got a "Kit" number or part number from them I could reference? If not, I'll start measuring (whick means stripping the old stuff off first, I presume).

Thanks!


Gary W.
SM 209, Adagio
Maryland, USA

 




 


--
Arnold
SY Zephyr SM203


 


Re: Leather steering wheel cover install

Arnold Mente
 

I choose this solution without changing the signature of Henry Amel!!

Arnold
SM203
SV Zephyr

Am 14.10.2020 um 21:41 schrieb amelforme <jfpottercys@...>:

There were at least three distinctly different steering wheels used on the Super Maramu during the production that yielded 479 examples over 16 years. I don’t remember the time period each wheel was built in, so sending measurements is a good idea. When I asked Jacques Carteau the reason for the changes, he mentioned that he was always looking to lighten the wheel without decreasing strength. Why? To put less of a load on the chain riven autopilot drive to the steering rack and reduce inertial loads on the entire system as it shifts direction.
 
This is just one interesting example of the thought and minutia present in the evolution of the Super Maramu. 
 
All the best,
Joel 
 
           JOEL F. POTTER ~ CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST, L.L.C.
                                         The Experienced AMEL Guy
UNSURPASSED AMEL MARKETING EXPERIENCE AND PRODUCT KNOWLEDGE
                                  Office 954-462-5869  Cell 954-812-2485
 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gary Wells
Sent: Wednesday, October 14, 2020 11:19 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Leather steering wheel cover install
 

Looks awesome!  

I wrote to them and asked about a kit for the SM .. Their reply was that "there are different sizes" so I needed to send measurements ...  
I didn't think this was the case.

May I ask if you got a "Kit" number or part number from them I could reference? If not, I'll start measuring (whick means stripping the old stuff off first, I presume).

Thanks!


Gary W.
SM 209, Adagio
Maryland, USA



--
Arnold
SY Zephyr SM203


Re: Leather steering wheel cover install

amelforme
 

There were at least three distinctly different steering wheels used on the Super Maramu during the production that yielded 479 examples over 16 years. I don’t remember the time period each wheel was built in, so sending measurements is a good idea. When I asked Jacques Carteau the reason for the changes, he mentioned that he was always looking to lighten the wheel without decreasing strength. Why? To put less of a load on the chain riven autopilot drive to the steering rack and reduce inertial loads on the entire system as it shifts direction.

 

This is just one interesting example of the thought and minutia present in the evolution of the Super Maramu.

 

All the best,

Joel

 

           JOEL F. POTTER ~ CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST, L.L.C.

                                         The Experienced AMEL Guy

UNSURPASSED AMEL MARKETING EXPERIENCE AND PRODUCT KNOWLEDGE

                                  Office 954-462-5869  Cell 954-812-2485

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gary Wells
Sent: Wednesday, October 14, 2020 11:19 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Leather steering wheel cover install

 

Looks awesome! 

I wrote to them and asked about a kit for the SM .. Their reply was that "there are different sizes" so I needed to send measurements ...  
I didn't think this was the case.

May I ask if you got a "Kit" number or part number from them I could reference? If not, I'll start measuring (whick means stripping the old stuff off first, I presume).

Thanks!


Gary W.
SM 209, Adagio
Maryland, USA


Re: Genoa Chain Plate bolts Leaking in aft hanging closet

James Alton
 

Ken,

   I have worked on boats that used the butyl tape and use it myself for applications.  It is good stuff overall and I always carry some on the boat.  Works best it seems on mating parts that keep  pressure on the buytl.  If for instance you removed the chainplate and used the buytl tape between the chainplate and the fiberglass, the material would be pressed into the bolt holes and seal well.  You can also come back later and retighten the bolts if a new leak occurs and sometimes it will reseal, not so with caulk.  But I have not had the best luck sealing bolt holes alone with Butyl since the material does not want to stay on the bolt and fully fill the voids like caulking can.    So if I were just sealing the bolts I would go with a caulking. Best, James



-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Oct 14, 2020 11:50 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Genoa Chain Plate bolts Leaking in aft hanging closet

Hi Bill,

I knew the copper vent pipe for the fuel tank in the closet area, however, I didn't know about the potential condensation problem within the closet.  I will look a bit closer at the potential places where the water could come from, but I am pretty sure it is coming from at least one of the bolt holes on the bottom row of 4 bolts holding the Genoa chainplate.  Stick a few paper towels in various places and see which one gets wet.  

Next, I guess I need to do some research about Butyl tape.  See if that could be the silver bullet I've been looking for...

Ken
Aquarius
SM2K262 stuck in Thailand.


Re: Genoa Chain Plate bolts Leaking in aft hanging closet

Ken Powers SV Aquarius
 

Hi Bill,

I knew the copper vent pipe for the fuel tank in the closet area, however, I didn't know about the potential condensation problem within the closet.  I will look a bit closer at the potential places where the water could come from, but I am pretty sure it is coming from at least one of the bolt holes on the bottom row of 4 bolts holding the Genoa chainplate.  Stick a few paper towels in various places and see which one gets wet.  

Next, I guess I need to do some research about Butyl tape.  See if that could be the silver bullet I've been looking for...

Ken
Aquarius
SM2K262 stuck in Thailand.


Re: Genoa Chain Plate bolts Leaking in aft hanging closet

James Alton
 

Ken,

   Your plan should get you sealed back up.  I didn't mention my recommendations for a sealant since I assume that you have a limited selection to pick from.  The  5200 or 4200 will work for you.  If you however can find the Polyether caulking called Multicaulk, sold in the States by West Marine, this would be my top choice because it does not seem to break down and turn gooey like the Polyurathenes can over time.  Exposure to any kind of oil such as diesel is a problem for Polyurathenes and accelerates the softening.   The Multicaulk is a bit softer and more flexible than the Polyurathenes,  even the 4200. The softeness is a benefit in the bond of the sealant.    Exposure to oils can temporarily soften the Polyether but as the oil is washed away,  the polyether tends to return to it's original cured state.  I have had complete failures with 4200 (and 5200 would be no different) from painting over the caulking seams on a wooden hull with traditional oil paints.  Polyether caulking can be painted or vanished over without problems.  

Best of luck,

James
SV Sueno
Maramu #220


-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Oct 14, 2020 5:04 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Genoa Chain Plate bolts Leaking in aft hanging closet

Thanks to all you Amelians for helping me through this mess!  I think I have a good procedure for the repair now.  But as aways, subject to change once I get into job.  It looks as though it should take all of 3 hours to complete this task, but as boat jobs go, I alway grossly underestimate time required 'til completion.

So, here is my revised plan of attack for this
1.  Remove 1 or 2 of the bolts.  Not to remove the entire chainplate.
2.  Clean hole and bolt with acetone.  
3.  Verify no damage or pitting to the bolts. 
4.  Tape off area that I don't want to be covered in 4200.
5.  Put good amount of 4200 into hole.  Use a small toothbrush or q-tip to make sure that 4200 is completely covering the walls of bolt hole.
6 . Replace bolts and nuts.
7.  Repeat (1 to 6)  until finished with all the bolts.  Except, I am only planing to do the 4 bottom bolts under the rub rail, not the single bolt in the middle of the chainplate.  This bolt does not show signs of leaking, and even if it did, the leak should be at most, minor, due to the location.  Unlike the 4 bottom bolts which could submersed in water for extended periods of time under the rub rail rubber. 
8. Glue interior back together.  Planing to use 3M Super 77 Spray Adhesive.  This part should be straightforward.
9. Replace Rub Rail rubber piece.  Using lots of soap and a bit of water!

If anyone has any suggestions, or reasons why I should change the process, let me know?

Thank you all!!

Ken
Aquarius SM2K#262
In Krabi Boat Lagoon, Thailand


Re: Leather steering wheel cover install

Gary Wells
 

Looks awesome! 

I wrote to them and asked about a kit for the SM .. Their reply was that "there are different sizes" so I needed to send measurements ...  
I didn't think this was the case.

May I ask if you got a "Kit" number or part number from them I could reference? If not, I'll start measuring (whick means stripping the old stuff off first, I presume).

Thanks!


Gary W.
SM 209, Adagio
Maryland, USA


Re: Genoa Chain Plate bolts Leaking in aft hanging closet

Jose Venegas
 

Ken, 
Perhaps something you already did but just in case, were you able to visualize water going through the bolt?  Now that you have it stripped down the rub rail you can put some water outside and make sure the leak is through the bolt and, if not visualize where it is actually coming from.

Jose 
Ipamena SM 278 


VP TMD 22 muffler

Paul Osterberg
 

I do some services New elbow, cleaning the heat exchanger and turbo etc. My question what to do, if anything with the Stainless steel muffler? I have seen that some have had corrosion dammage is that common? Shall I replace while at it or will it likely last another 5-10 years? now 20years old.
Paul on sykerpa SM 259 Lagos Portugal 


Re: Genoa Chain Plate bolts Leaking in aft hanging closet

 

Ken,

You probably are aware of the fact that the copper pipe vent for the fuel tank is above the area where you have a leak, and this copper vent pipe will create more water than you may realize because of condensation. I bring this up because you are focussed on the chainplate on the starboard side/aft. 

In certain climate conditions, we experienced more condensation because of that copper fuel tank vent than we thought would happen, and we did not notice the cause until after we smelled mold.

Just a thought that I had that I am sure you are aware of.

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Tue, Oct 13, 2020 at 8:47 PM Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...> wrote:

[Edited Message Follows]

Hello Paul,

Thanks for the response.  Are there nuts under the rub rail, because the bolt heads are in the closet?  Or, are the bolts threaded into the chainplate somehow?  Other questions...  There is also one bolt head holding the chainplate to the side of the boat for the outside.  This single bolt head is near the middle of the chain plate facing out.  Is this bolt treaded into a nut embedded in fiberglass, or will I have to find the nut on the inside of the boat.  I can't see at this time where the nut would be.  Also, anyone that has had the problem know the correct way to repair the leak?  I am worried about putting on a bunch of sealant on the stainless steel which may promote the stainless steel to corrode.

Thanks for the help.

Ken
Aquarius SM2K#262
Currently in Thailand


Re: Genoa Chain Plate bolts Leaking in aft hanging closet

Ruslan Osmonov
 

Hi Ken, did you consider Butyl tape as a sealant? Many prefer it to seal hatches, it stays tacky for years and years and you can easily remove it if needed. 

Regards,
Ruslan. 
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