Date   
Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Balooner usage advice

James Alton
 

Miles,

   I have used the Ballooner on Sueño a few times now.  My boat also just has two grooves so once I hoist the ballooner up the second groove using my spare halyard, I am unable to furl either the ballooner or the genoa until the ballooner has been lowered. Perhaps this limitation is what Eric is referring to in his post.  Because of this limitation,  I have so far always taken the ballooner down before dark and only used it during stable conditions.  

Best,

James
SV Sueño
Maramu #220

On Apr 18, 2018, at 11:40 PM, 'sailormon' kimberlite@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


Miles,

Without the triple groove plus thes pecial gadget at the top of the headstay you can’t use the ballooner.

 

I find  it much easier to fly a 1400-1500 sq foot gennaker in a sock, works like a charm’

Fair Winds

 

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] 
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2018 4:13 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Balooner usage advice

 

  

Hello there

I’m new to the Amel way and have been learning lots from this fabulous forum as I get to know my older 1985 Maramu 

I’m still unsure of a the best approach to my downwind rig and would benefit hugely from this groups thoughts and experience of getting the best from the balooner sail. 

Thus far I have been moving toward the option of adding a 2nd removable forestay on my older Maramu. Positioned as close to the furling Genoa as possible and as high up the mast as possible to avoid running back stays. 

I’d use his mainly for a twin headsail downwind set up with independence between the furler and a smaller 80-90% jib poled to windward. 

I’ve used this setup before and like it lots I chose it over the option of hoisting two sails up the furler luff groove and loved its simplicity, independence of sails, provision of a spare forestay, ability to set a storm sail etc etc

But on the group lots of people advice is to not change anything on these well though out and well tested boats and I presume my old Maramu has sailed the World already without these changes 😊

So ..... considering other options ....apparently the large spinnaker looking sail lurking in my locker is a balooner. 

How do people use these?

Just in combination with the Genoa as a double headsail rig or also on its own downwind wind (perhaps with the mizzen goose winged) ?

It’s worth pointing out that unfortunately I do not have the Amel furler but a profurl electric number with only 2 luff grooves. So I don’t have the wonderful 3 luff groove independent sail hoisting and lowering option available to most of you lucky chaps! 

My concern with the balooner plus Genoa is that I will be short handed with kids aboard and given my profurl furler would have to hoist and lower the balooner and Genoa on the same halyard Ie unfurl a massive total sail area if I had problems and needed to get sails down. 

Thoughts and hard won experience very much appreciated

Fair winds 

Miles 
Maramu #162



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Balooner usage advice

eric freedman
 

Miles,

Without the triple groove plus thes pecial gadget at the top of the headstay you can’t use the ballooner.

 

I find  it much easier to fly a 1400-1500 sq foot gennaker in a sock, works like a charm’

Fair Winds

 

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2018 4:13 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Balooner usage advice

 

 

Hello there

I’m new to the Amel way and have been learning lots from this fabulous forum as I get to know my older 1985 Maramu

I’m still unsure of a the best approach to my downwind rig and would benefit hugely from this groups thoughts and experience of getting the best from the balooner sail.

Thus far I have been moving toward the option of adding a 2nd removable forestay on my older Maramu. Positioned as close to the furling Genoa as possible and as high up the mast as possible to avoid running back stays.

I’d use his mainly for a twin headsail downwind set up with independence between the furler and a smaller 80-90% jib poled to windward.

I’ve used this setup before and like it lots I chose it over the option of hoisting two sails up the furler luff groove and loved its simplicity, independence of sails, provision of a spare forestay, ability to set a storm sail etc etc

But on the group lots of people advice is to not change anything on these well though out and well tested boats and I presume my old Maramu has sailed the World already without these changes 😊

So ..... considering other options ....apparently the large spinnaker looking sail lurking in my locker is a balooner.

How do people use these?

Just in combination with the Genoa as a double headsail rig or also on its own downwind wind (perhaps with the mizzen goose winged) ?

It’s worth pointing out that unfortunately I do not have the Amel furler but a profurl electric number with only 2 luff grooves. So I don’t have the wonderful 3 luff groove independent sail hoisting and lowering option available to most of you lucky chaps!

My concern with the balooner plus Genoa is that I will be short handed with kids aboard and given my profurl furler would have to hoist and lower the balooner and Genoa on the same halyard Ie unfurl a massive total sail area if I had problems and needed to get sails down.

Thoughts and hard won experience very much appreciated

Fair winds

Miles
Maramu #162

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Balooner usage advice

greatketch@...
 

Miles,

I do love the double headsail rig for a lot of reasons.  

From a safety standpoint, there are no booms to worry about accidentally gybing. The number of boats that I have seen with serious rig damage after a flying gybe is sobering.

With the Amel set up of continuous reefing of both sails, I can dial down the sail area as the wind picks up. And I can do this without needing to come up into the wind as I would need to to furl a boomed sail.

The biggest improvement over wing 'n wind sailing for me is the great reduction in the boat's tendency to roll while sailing downwind. The key is to not trim the sails in as much as you think you should.  If the top 20% or so of the sail is loose enough to twist forward, the boat's roll is greatly dampened.  I think the damping effect is improved in the Amel setup because both sails are the same size.  

We do sometimes do wing 'n wing sailing, but I don't like the roll, and I find that my VMG downwind is faster if I point up a bit (about 150º to the true wind) and reach off. This is faster than the twin headsails in winds of less than 8 knots or so.  By the time the wind is up to 10 knots, the twin sails outrun the reach.

Without the triple foil and latching mechanism, you do lack some of the flexibility, but twin headsails on twin headstays is an old, tried and true cruising rig.  

I am not sure how you can use the ballooner without the triple slot foil.  You have expressed concern about flying it without an easy reefing mechanism, and I agree!  The ballooner is not made to fly on its own luff, it needs to be in a foil.  Maybe your friendly neighborhood sailmaker could have some ideas... hanks?  or a flexible foil?

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Cat Island, Bahamas

---In amelyachtowners@..., <smilesbernard@...> wrote :

Thanks Danny and Craig

Craig it is indeed a balooner. It’s labeled and has a luff tape so I suspect it’s a legacy thing as the profurl is only about 6 yrs old 

Danny that sounds worth a try! The thing I love about the twin headsail rig when I’ve used it before is that reefing is so easy. 
On my old boat the hanked on 80% sail was poled to windward and just stayed up all the time and the furling Genoa was like the accelerator. Squally? Reed the genny. Light winds? Let it all hang out. 

Really good to hear other options for though android for though so thanks again

All the best
Miles 


On 18 April 2018 at 20:12 "smiles bernard smilesbernard@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hello there

I’m new to the Amel way and have been learning lots from this fabulous forum as I get to know my older 1985 Maramu

I’m still unsure of a the best approach to my downwind rig and would benefit hugely from this groups thoughts and experience of getting the best from the balooner sail.

Thus far I have been moving toward the option of adding a 2nd removable forestay on my older Maramu. Positioned as close to the furling Genoa as possible and as high up the mast as possible to avoid running back stays.

I’d use his mainly for a twin headsail downwind set up with independence between the furler and a smaller 80-90% jib poled to windward.

I’ve used this setup before and like it lots I chose it over the option of hoisting two sails up the furler luff groove and loved its simplicity, independence of sails, provision of a spare forestay, ability to set a storm sail etc etc

But on the group lots of people advice is to not change anything on these well though out and well tested boats and I presume my old Maramu has sailed the World already without these changes 😊

So ..... considering other options ....apparently the large spinnaker looking sail lurking in my locker is a balooner.

How do people use these?

Just in combination with the Genoa as a double headsail rig or also on its own downwind wind (perhaps with the mizzen goose winged) ?

It’s worth pointing out that unfortunately I do not have the Amel furler but a profurl electric number with only 2 luff grooves. So I don’t have the wonderful 3 luff groove independent sail hoisting and lowering option available to most of you lucky chaps!

My concern with the balooner plus Genoa is that I will be short handed with kids aboard and given my profurl furler would have to hoist and lower the balooner and Genoa on the same halyard Ie unfurl a massive total sail area if I had problems and needed to get sails down.

Thoughts and hard won experience very much appreciated

Fair winds

Miles
Maramu #162


 

Re: 2nd Forestay on Super Maramu

greatketch@...
 

Danny,

The only place I have a minor issue with your comments is your total opposition to the rope luff.  

PROPERLY MADE, with multiple pieces of rope, of properly selected lengths and diameters, SEWN in place in a well made pocket, in my experience it can do just as good a job at bulking up the middle of the sail as a foam luff. (Note, there are a LOT of caveats on that...)

Improperly made and shaped neither a rope NOR a foam luff will do a good job.  I have seen foam luffs that were not properly tapered, and resulted in terrible sail shapes when furled.

On my SM I have a foam luff, on my old boat I had sails with both foam and rope luffs, and would be very hard pressed to say there was a dramatic difference between them in furled sail shape.

I suspect, but can not prove, that a foam luff will be longer lasting just because it should result in a smoother roll.  I have never had a rope luff chafe through... but I can imagine it happening.

We always have to make compromises when we ask one sail to do multiple jobs.  They are never going to be perfect...  

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Cat Island, Bahamas

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Balooner usage advice

smiles bernard
 

Thanks Danny and Craig

Craig it is indeed a balooner. It’s labeled and has a luff tape so I suspect it’s a legacy thing as the profurl is only about 6 yrs old 

Danny that sounds worth a try! The thing I love about the twin headsail rig when I’ve used it before is that reefing is so easy. 
On my old boat the hanked on 80% sail was poled to windward and just stayed up all the time and the furling Genoa was like the accelerator. Squally? Reed the genny. Light winds? Let it all hang out. 

Really good to hear other options for though android for though so thanks again

All the best
Miles 


On 18 Apr 2018, at 20:21, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Miles

There will be much advice on this as to extra sails for downwind. I offer you a simple safe option. Obviously not as effective as adding a large extra.

I call it triple wing on wing. Mizzen to  (say) port and held there with the preventer. Main to starboard, and held with preventer, 155%  headsail to port. The wind hits the mizzen and accelerates across it and exhausts into the main, accelerates more  as it crosses the main and then into the largest sail twice accelerated. Because of the way the accelerated wind hits the headsail it stands up well  without being poled out. Don't have the mizzen and main out to near right angles to the boat, a bit of angle helps the wind flow/acceleration. If you want the effort, pole out the headsail

You will be surprised how effective this method is.

Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 18 April 2018 at 20:12 "smiles bernard smilesbernard@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hello there

I’m new to the Amel way and have been learning lots from this fabulous forum as I get to know my older 1985 Maramu

I’m still unsure of a the best approach to my downwind rig and would benefit hugely from this groups thoughts and experience of getting the best from the balooner sail.

Thus far I have been moving toward the option of adding a 2nd removable forestay on my older Maramu. Positioned as close to the furling Genoa as possible and as high up the mast as possible to avoid running back stays.

I’d use his mainly for a twin headsail downwind set up with independence between the furler and a smaller 80-90% jib poled to windward.

I’ve used this setup before and like it lots I chose it over the option of hoisting two sails up the furler luff groove and loved its simplicity, independence of sails, provision of a spare forestay, ability to set a storm sail etc etc

But on the group lots of people advice is to not change anything on these well though out and well tested boats and I presume my old Maramu has sailed the World already without these changes 😊

So ..... considering other options ....apparently the large spinnaker looking sail lurking in my locker is a balooner.

How do people use these?

Just in combination with the Genoa as a double headsail rig or also on its own downwind wind (perhaps with the mizzen goose winged) ?

It’s worth pointing out that unfortunately I do not have the Amel furler but a profurl electric number with only 2 luff grooves. So I don’t have the wonderful 3 luff groove independent sail hoisting and lowering option available to most of you lucky chaps!

My concern with the balooner plus Genoa is that I will be short handed with kids aboard and given my profurl furler would have to hoist and lower the balooner and Genoa on the same halyard Ie unfurl a massive total sail area if I had problems and needed to get sails down.

Thoughts and hard won experience very much appreciated

Fair winds

Miles
Maramu #162


 

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Balooner usage advice

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Miles

There will be much advice on this as to extra sails for downwind. I offer you a simple safe option. Obviously not as effective as adding a large extra.

I call it triple wing on wing. Mizzen to  (say) port and held there with the preventer. Main to starboard, and held with preventer, 155%  headsail to port. The wind hits the mizzen and accelerates across it and exhausts into the main, accelerates more  as it crosses the main and then into the largest sail twice accelerated. Because of the way the accelerated wind hits the headsail it stands up well  without being poled out. Don't have the mizzen and main out to near right angles to the boat, a bit of angle helps the wind flow/acceleration. If you want the effort, pole out the headsail

You will be surprised how effective this method is.

Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 18 April 2018 at 20:12 "smiles bernard smilesbernard@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hello there

I’m new to the Amel way and have been learning lots from this fabulous forum as I get to know my older 1985 Maramu

I’m still unsure of a the best approach to my downwind rig and would benefit hugely from this groups thoughts and experience of getting the best from the balooner sail.

Thus far I have been moving toward the option of adding a 2nd removable forestay on my older Maramu. Positioned as close to the furling Genoa as possible and as high up the mast as possible to avoid running back stays.

I’d use his mainly for a twin headsail downwind set up with independence between the furler and a smaller 80-90% jib poled to windward.

I’ve used this setup before and like it lots I chose it over the option of hoisting two sails up the furler luff groove and loved its simplicity, independence of sails, provision of a spare forestay, ability to set a storm sail etc etc

But on the group lots of people advice is to not change anything on these well though out and well tested boats and I presume my old Maramu has sailed the World already without these changes 😊

So ..... considering other options ....apparently the large spinnaker looking sail lurking in my locker is a balooner.

How do people use these?

Just in combination with the Genoa as a double headsail rig or also on its own downwind wind (perhaps with the mizzen goose winged) ?

It’s worth pointing out that unfortunately I do not have the Amel furler but a profurl electric number with only 2 luff grooves. So I don’t have the wonderful 3 luff groove independent sail hoisting and lowering option available to most of you lucky chaps!

My concern with the balooner plus Genoa is that I will be short handed with kids aboard and given my profurl furler would have to hoist and lower the balooner and Genoa on the same halyard Ie unfurl a massive total sail area if I had problems and needed to get sails down.

Thoughts and hard won experience very much appreciated

Fair winds

Miles
Maramu #162


 

Re: Balooner usage advice

Craig & Katherine Briggs
 

Hi Miles,
Before you go much further it seems you'll want to find out what that spinnaker-looking sail in your locker really is. Since your headstay is not the Amel style 3-slot for a ballooner it may well be a spinnaker; asymmetrical or conventional. If so, you may be all set and can just sail the boat for a season to focus on whether you really want to change anything.
Cheers,
Craig SN68 Sangaris 


---In amelyachtowners@..., <smilesbernard@...> wrote :

Hello there

I’m new to the Amel way and have been learning lots from this fabulous forum as I get to know my older 1985 Maramu


I’m still unsure of a the best approach to my downwind rig and would benefit hugely from this groups thoughts and experience of getting the best from the balooner sail.

Thus far I have been moving toward the option of adding a 2nd removable forestay on my older Maramu. Positioned as close to the furling Genoa as possible and as high up the mast as possible to avoid running back stays.

I’d use his mainly for a twin headsail downwind set up with independence between the furler and a smaller 80-90% jib poled to windward.

I’ve used this setup before and like it lots I chose it over the option of hoisting two sails up the furler luff groove and loved its simplicity, independence of sails, provision of a spare forestay, ability to set a storm sail etc etc

But on the group lots of people advice is to not change anything on these well though out and well tested boats and I presume my old Maramu has sailed the World already without these changes 😊

So ..... considering other options ....apparently the large spinnaker looking sail lurking in my locker is a balooner.

How do people use these?

Just in combination with the Genoa as a double headsail rig or also on its own downwind wind (perhaps with the mizzen goose winged) ?

It’s worth pointing out that unfortunately I do not have the Amel furler but a profurl electric number with only 2 luff grooves. So I don’t have the wonderful 3 luff groove independent sail hoisting and lowering option available to most of you lucky chaps!

My concern with the balooner plus Genoa is that I will be short handed with kids aboard and given my profurl furler would have to hoist and lower the balooner and Genoa on the same halyard Ie unfurl a massive total sail area if I had problems and needed to get sails down.

Thoughts and hard won experience very much appreciated


Fair winds

Miles
Maramu #162

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] 2nd Forestay on Super Maramu

James Alton
 

Danny,

   Thanks for sharing your opinions on this subject.  My working jib has the foam luff, and is tri-radial cut in Hydranet and I think that it does reef well.  I think that my working jib however is a larger roll (hence more windage) than my Dacron 150 Genoa without the foam so there always seems to be a price.  

 Best,

James SV Sueño
Maramu #220

On Apr 17, 2018, at 6:36 PM, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


Hi James,

A furling headsail, if it is to be used partly furled must have a properly shaped and constructed foam pad at the luff. Many sail makers use a rope sewn in just behind the luff as an alternative. It is not effective because it is not shaped to take up the extra draft in the middle of the sail.

That's that one dealt with. If you have a sail with the afore descried foam pad at the luff furling does no damage as the sails shape is maintained. Without the foam pad the sails shape would be terrible and damage would be done.

Next point. What wind strength is the sail maker envisioning when designing this huge sail. I would guess 15 knots true and they use cloth of a weight matching this with some margin for error. I told the sailmaker I could be using the sail reefed in 40 knots true and that they were to use a cloth weighted for that. As I said in my previous they ignored me and used a lighter cloth and rope on the luff and had t o replace the sail. 

As I said in my previous, if I have a long period of on the wind sailing in strong wind I change down to my 90%. The ability to sail furled is to allow rapid change as the weather does what it does best...change

When I raced yachts I always told sailmaker to use a heavier/stronger stretch resistant  cloth on all my sails as I reasoned that the short term benefit of a lighter cloth would soon be lost as the sail distorted with age. Not being a hot shot that had sponsors replacing my sails each regatta I wanted years of life not months.

This certainly applies to my cruising now. I note many of the SM I see with their head-sails furled  have a much smaller bundle than mine. I guess they have a much lighter cloth than mine.

I think this answers your question as to how using the sail partly furled would be related to loss of sail shape over time. If the above is followed, very little to none.

Kind Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 17 April 2018 at 15:02 "James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Danny,
   Some great discussion!   I am curious about how deep you feelnthat you can reef a well made Genoa and still have good shape?    Also,  I was wondering your thoughts on how much using a well made Genoa reefed might be related to the loss of sail shape over time?   

Best,

James
SV Sueno
Maramu #220

On Apr 16, 2018 3:05 PM, "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms @xtra.co.nz [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

 

Hi Paul,

that's a bit new to throw away. Car position, halyard tension and leach cord are significant adjustments for performance as I am sure you know but if the sail is poorly shaped or of too light a cloth there is a limit as to what you can achieve.Do you have a foam luff. As I said in my previous it is quite possible to get satisfactory performance to windward in stronger winds with a partly furled 155%.but if its a slog of over 24 hours I change to my 90%

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 16 April 2018 at 20:17 "osterberg.paul.l@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Danny!

My "old" Genoa is less than 2 years so it still has a few miles left. bu t I agree with you that a poor 150% can give less performance than a good 100%, have experienced that a few times on previous boats . I will continue with my "old" Genoa cruising North towards Nova Scotia this summer, then decide upon action before heading down to the Caribbean this fall.
Paul on S/Y Kerpa SM#259

 


 

 

 


 



Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Transport of SM from Australia to Suez/Turkey

SAMET GOLGECI
 

Hello Donato,

Mr. Max Ranke from Sevenstar company will give you their best offer with our reference.

Here is their contact details:


SEVENSTAR YACHT TRANSPORT

 

Max Ranke

 

Address

Phone

 

Radarweg 36, 1042 AA, Amsterdam – The Netherlands

+31 204488643

Mobile 

+31 620626370

Fax

+31 204488596

Email

Website:

m.ranke@...

sevenstar-yacht-transport.com



Saygilarimizla / Best Regards / Mit Freundliche Grusse;
 
 
Samet Golgeci
Managing Owner
Finike Yachting Agency
 
Mobile      : +90 542 657 43 03 (Whatsapp Available)
Web         : www.finikeyachting.com
E-mail      : finikeyachting@...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Transitlog Renewals + Check in & out procedures for Turkey + Brokerage
Yacht Guardianage including technical services and maintenance
Real Estate consultancy including organise house repairs + Maintenance
Supervising vacant property + Fresh Provisions & Supplies + Duty Free Diesel
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 

2018-04-18 12:53 GMT+03:00 Donato Valente ing.d.valente@... [amelyachtowners]

 

Hi 
We are planning to put our SM on a cargo this September from Australia to any Mediterranean eastern port. 
We’re finding some difficulties to get quotations from companies found on the internet. Has someone any suggestion on the topic ? 
Many thanks

Donato 
SM2000 #468 Ocean Bird
now on the hard in Raiatea 


Posted by: Donato Valente <ing.d.valente@...

Transport of SM from Australia to Suez/Turkey

Donato Valente
 

Hi 
We are planning to put our SM on a cargo this September from Australia to any Mediterranean eastern port. 
We’re finding some difficulties to get quotations from companies found on the internet. Has someone any suggestion on the topic ? 
Many thanks

Donato 
SM2000 #468 Ocean Bird
now on the hard in Raiatea 

Re: Fixe Propeller

Beaute Olivier
 

Hello Rudy,

it is normal to get more rpm with the AUTOPROP, as this is a self-adjustable pitch propeller with free rotating blades.
When the vessel has no speed, you can really get full power (3400 rpm) from the engine as the blades have very little resistance. As soon as the vessel gets some speed, the pitch changes because of the water flow (making the blades turn a bit) and then your rpm go down.

With a fix prop, the pitch does not change, and the propeller resists more to the engine torque. As the pitch is fixed, you will probably get a maximum of 2800/2900 rpm. This is normal.

In my opinion, an AUTOPROP in good condition is better than a fixed prop. The idea of supplying a fixed prop in every SM was just to give a back-up possibility in case of damage (or maintenance) of the AUTOPROP.

Could you tell us why you changed your prop?

Have a good day.


Olivier


Balooner usage advice

smiles bernard
 

Hello there

I’m new to the Amel way and have been learning lots from this fabulous forum as I get to know my older 1985 Maramu


I’m still unsure of a the best approach to my downwind rig and would benefit hugely from this groups thoughts and experience of getting the best from the balooner sail.

Thus far I have been moving toward the option of adding a 2nd removable forestay on my older Maramu. Positioned as close to the furling Genoa as possible and as high up the mast as possible to avoid running back stays.

I’d use his mainly for a twin headsail downwind set up with independence between the furler and a smaller 80-90% jib poled to windward.

I’ve used this setup before and like it lots I chose it over the option of hoisting two sails up the furler luff groove and loved its simplicity, independence of sails, provision of a spare forestay, ability to set a storm sail etc etc

But on the group lots of people advice is to not change anything on these well though out and well tested boats and I presume my old Maramu has sailed the World already without these changes 😊

So ..... considering other options ....apparently the large spinnaker looking sail lurking in my locker is a balooner.

How do people use these?

Just in combination with the Genoa as a double headsail rig or also on its own downwind wind (perhaps with the mizzen goose winged) ?

It’s worth pointing out that unfortunately I do not have the Amel furler but a profurl electric number with only 2 luff grooves. So I don’t have the wonderful 3 luff groove independent sail hoisting and lowering option available to most of you lucky chaps!

My concern with the balooner plus Genoa is that I will be short handed with kids aboard and given my profurl furler would have to hoist and lower the balooner and Genoa on the same halyard Ie unfurl a massive total sail area if I had problems and needed to get sails down.

Thoughts and hard won experience very much appreciated


Fair winds

Miles
Maramu #162

Re: Jib Halyard Sheave

pepinoamel <no_reply@...>
 

Hi Mark,


I'm just having correspondence with Maud in La Rochelle regarding the masthead sheaves.  I'd like to order replacements for all the sheaves and Maud is asking for photos which I don't have.  I'd like to avoid going up the mast just for this.  Have you been able to locate your old ones and if so, could you post a picture with dimensions if possible.  I believe there are 3 sheaves on the main mast, 1 for the mainsail, 1 for the jib and 1 for the spare halyard.  The mizzen probably only has 1 for the mainsail.  Do you know if they're all the same dimensions?


Many thanks.


Gerhard Hoffmann

SY Pepino SM381

Greece

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Water coming through below rudder quadrant

Rick Swinemar Jazz II Maramu #144
 

Hi Eric,
Not sure if I am using the reply system properly. I sent you a link but not sure if it went through. Guess i need a little tutorial in how to use the forum and the back channel system as well. 
Cheers
Rick

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] 2nd Forestay on Super Maramu

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi James,

A furling headsail, if it is to be used partly furled must have a properly shaped and constructed foam pad at the luff. Many sail makers use a rope sewn in just behind the luff as an alternative. It is not effective because it is not shaped to take up the extra draft in the middle of the sail.

That's that one dealt with. If you have a sail with the afore descried foam pad at the luff furling does no damage as the sails shape is maintained. Without the foam pad the sails shape would be terrible and damage would be done.

Next point. What wind strength is the sail maker envisioning when designing this huge sail. I would guess 15 knots true and they use cloth of a weight matching this with some margin for error. I told the sailmaker I could be using the sail reefed in 40 knots true and that they were to use a cloth weighted for that. As I said in my previous they ignored me and used a lighter cloth and rope on the luff and had to replace the sail.

As I said in my previous, if I have a long period of on the wind sailing in strong wind I change down to my 90%. The ability to sail furled is to allow rapid change as the weather does what it does best...change

When I raced yachts I always told sailmaker to use a heavier/stronger stretch resistant  cloth on all my sails as I reasoned that the short term benefit of a lighter cloth would soon be lost as the sail distorted with age. Not being a hot shot that had sponsors replacing my sails each regatta I wanted years of life not months.

This certainly applies to my cruising now. I note many of the SM I see with their head-sails furled  have a much smaller bundle than mine. I guess they have a much lighter cloth than mine.

I think this answers your question as to how using the sail partly furled would be related to loss of sail shape over time. If the above is followed, very little to none.

Kind Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 17 April 2018 at 15:02 "James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Danny,
   Some great discussion!   I am curious about how deep you feelnthat you can reef a well made Genoa and still have good shape?    Also,  I was wondering your thoughts on how much using a well made Genoa reefed might be related to the loss of sail shape over time?   

Best,

James
SV Sueno
Maramu #220

On Apr 16, 2018 3:05 PM, "Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

 

Hi Paul,

that's a bit new to throw away. Car position, halyard tension and leach cord are significant adjustments for performance as I am sure you know but if the sail is poorly shaped or of too light a cloth there is a limit as to what you can achieve.Do you have a foam luff. As I said in my previous it is quite possible to get satisfactory performance to windward in stronger winds with a partly furled 155%.but if its a slog of over 24 hours I change to my 90%

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 16 April 2018 at 20:17 "osterberg.paul.l@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Danny!

My "old" Genoa is less than 2 years so it still has a few miles left. but I agree with you that a poor 150% can give less performance than a good 100%, have experienced that a few times on previous boats . I will continue with my "old" Genoa cruising North towards Nova Scotia this summer, then decide upon action before heading down to the Caribbean this fall.
Paul on S/Y Kerpa SM#259

 


 

 

 


 

Fixe Propeller

r.zurkirchen
 

Hi, is  there anyone who has experienced the change from Autoprop to fix Propeller.

I cannot bring up the engin to 3500 T/min as it was with the Autoprop. Is this normal ?

SAMANTHA

SM 2000 #407  Rudy

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] ENGINE OVERHEATING ISSUE

Olivier Ruhlmann <o_ruhlmann@...>
 

John,

It seems like I had the same issue on my 1992 SM 80hp prima engine.
I got all the parts from :


It should cost you a lot less and the shipping to France was really fast.

From what I found out on the internet, it seems that you are not supposed to re-assemble the piece holding the "drive coupling" without the "special alignement tool" from Perkins. If you did dissassemble it (like I did), and not re-aligne it perfectly using the special tool it could be the cause of your problem.
Since I did not have the special Perkins tool, I tried to build one myself using a roll of tape and a wrench. So far so good...

Good luck





From: "James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners]"
To: amelyachtowners@...
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 12:41 PM
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] ENGINE OVERHEATING ISSUE

 
John,

   That is great that the oil pressure is still good.  Could the shavings from the wearing pump drive components plug the ability of the lubricating oil to flow back to the oil pan?  The only other possibility causing accelerated wear that I can think of is that somehow the pump drive components are not in correct alignment.  Hopefully you can get a more informed answer for your question.  

Best of luck,

James
SV Sueño
Maramu #220 

On Apr 17, 2018, at 4:51 AM, John Hayes johnhayes862@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Thanks James but oil pressure is good and we change oil every 100 hours and the oil filter. Also the engine uses little oil between changes

It’s a puzzle !

Best

John 


On 17/04/2018, at 3:56 PM, James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
John,

   This is just a guess since I am not familiar with this particular engine.   I am wondering if you might have a lubrication issue that is causing accelerated wear?  Do you know if your oil pressure is within specs. ?   When the oil pressure gets critically low, the top end of an engine tends to suffer first.

Best of luck and I hope that you find the problem,

James

SV Sueño
Maramu #220
Perkins 4.154 series 200

    
On Apr 16, 2018, at 5:34 PM, John Hayes johnhayes862@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


Good morning all,
 
My 1991 Santorin has a Perkins Prima 50 hp diesel of about 13000 hours. It runs like a sewing machine, has been serviced with new oil and filter every 100 hours and has a written engine log.
 
Twice in the last 300 hours the engine has overheated. The problem is that the spline drive bolted on to a drive cam on the top of the engine is wearing away in the shaft of the Jabsco water pump which drives the raw water cooling system.
 
The result is the spline is being chewed up and ends up rotating in the shaft of the water pump so that the water circulation stops because the water pump shaft is not rotating and the engine overheats.
 
Bugger! The pump and spline cost $1500 to replace … and I’m now on my third pump and spline. 
There is no detectable movement in the drive cam ………..
 
There is another identical motor in another boat in our marina with the same issue.
 
Has anyone out there encountered this issue and identified its cause?
 
John Hayes
 
Nga Waka 
Wellington NZ
From: <amelyachtowners@...> on behalf of "reswinemar@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...>
Reply-To: <amelyachtowners@...>
Date: Tuesday, 17 April 2018 at 8:56 AM
To: <amelyachtowners@...>
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Water coming through below rudder quadrant
 
  
Hey Guys
Thanks.
I think the email got chopped off by the site algorithms. Should I assume it's amel.fr or something like that..
Bill,
If you're up this way and we can help you out or just share a toddy let us know. 
We're planning on heading to Cape Breton's Bras'Dor Lakes in mid August then back down to Mahone Bay in late August. 
You can reach me any time at reswinemar at gmail dot com. (Let me know if that fools the algorithms;-)
Cheers
Rick







Re: ENGINE OVERHEATING ISSUE

Herbert Lackner
 

John,

this is a common problem to this engine and occurs if the water pump flange is mounted without beeing aligned (not centered).  It has to be aligned with a special tool available from Volvo.  If the tool is not available it may help to center the alignment by turning the engine by hand before tighting the bolts.

Mine got damaged due to mechanics in turkey removing it and not aligning it when putting it back.

I have to exchange the part that is mounted on the shaft next year, too.

br herbert
SN 120 KALI MERA, Panama

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] ENGINE OVERHEATING ISSUE

James Alton
 

John,

   That is great that the oil pressure is still good.  Could the shavings from the wearing pump drive components plug the ability of the lubricating oil to flow back to the oil pan?  The only other possibility causing accelerated wear that I can think of is that somehow the pump drive components are not in correct alignment.  Hopefully you can get a more informed answer for your question.  

Best of luck,

James
SV Sueño
Maramu #220 

On Apr 17, 2018, at 4:51 AM, John Hayes johnhayes862@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Thanks James but oil pressure is good and we change oil every 100 hours and the oil filter. Also the engine uses little oil between changes


It’s a puzzle !

Best

John 


On 17/04/2018, at 3:56 PM, James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

John,


   This is just a guess since I am not familiar with this particular engine.   I am wondering if you might have a lubrication issue that is causing accelerated wear?  Do you know if your oil pressure is within specs. ?   When the oil pressure gets critically low, the top end of an engine tends to suffer first.

Best of luck and I hope that you find the problem,

James

SV Sueño
Maramu #220
Perkins 4.154 series 200

    
On Apr 16, 2018, at 5:34 PM, John Hayes johnhayes862@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


Good morning all,

 

My 1991 Santorin has a Perkins Prima 50 hp diesel of about 13000 hours. It runs like a sewing machine, has been serviced with new oil and filter every 100 hours and has a written engine log.

 

Twice in the last 300 hours the engine has overheated. The problem is that the spline drive bolted on to a drive cam on the top of the engine is wearing away in the shaft of the Jabsco water pump which drives the raw water cooling system.

 

The result is the spline is being chewed up and ends up rotating in the shaft of the water pump so that the water circulation stops because the water pump shaft is not rotating and the engine overheats.

 

Bugger! The pump and spline cost $1500 to replace … and I’m now on my third pump and spline. 

There is no detectable movement in the drive cam ………..

 

There is another identical motor in another boat in our marina with the same issue.

 

Has anyone out there encountered this issue and identified its cause?

 

John Hayes

 

Nga Waka 

Wellington NZ

From: <amelyachtowners@...> on behalf of "reswinemar@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...>
Reply-To: <amelyachtowners@...>
Date: Tuesday, 17 April 2018 at 8:56 AM
To: <amelyachtowners@...>
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Water coming through below rudder quadrant

 

  

Hey Guys

Thanks.

I think the email got chopped off by the site algorithms. Should I assume it's amel.fr or something like that.

Bill,

If you're up this way and we can help you out or just share a toddy let us know. 

We're planning on heading to Cape Breton's Bras'Dor Lakes in mid August then back down to Mahone Bay in late August. 

You can reach me any time at reswinemar at gmail dot com. (Let me know if that fools the algorithms;-)

Cheers

Rick






Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] ENGINE OVERHEATING ISSUE

JOHN HAYES
 

Thanks James but oil pressure is good and we change oil every 100 hours and the oil filter. Also the engine uses little oil between changes

It’s a puzzle !

Best

John 


On 17/04/2018, at 3:56 PM, James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

John,


   This is just a guess since I am not familiar with this particular engine.   I am wondering if you might have a lubrication issue that is causing accelerated wear?  Do you know if your oil pressure is within specs. ?   When the oil pressure gets critically low, the top end of an engine tends to suffer first.

Best of luck and I hope that you find the problem,

James

SV Sueño
Maramu #220
Perkins 4.154 series 200

    
On Apr 16, 2018, at 5:34 PM, John Hayes johnhayes862@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


Good morning all,

 

My 1991 Santorin has a Perkins Prima 50 hp diesel of about 13000 hours. It runs like a sewing machine, has been serviced with new oil and filter every 100 hours and has a written engine log.

 

Twice in the last 300 hours the engine has overheated. The problem is that the spline drive bolted on to a drive cam on the top of the engine is wearing away in the shaft of the Jabsco water pump which drives the raw water cooling system.

 

The result is the spline is being chewed up and ends up rotating in the shaft of the water pump so that the water circulation stops because the water pump shaft is not rotating and the engine overheats.

 

Bugger! The pump and spline cost $1500 to replace … and I’m now on my third pump and spline. 

There is no detectable movement in the drive cam ………..

 

There is another identical motor in another boat in our marina with the same issue.

 

Has anyone out there encountered this issue and identified its cause?

 

John Hayes

 

Nga Waka 

Wellington NZ

From: <amelyachtowners@...> on behalf of "reswinemar@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...>
Reply-To: <amelyachtowners@...>
Date: Tuesday, 17 April 2018 at 8:56 AM
To: <amelyachtowners@...>
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Water coming through below rudder quadrant

 

  

Hey Guys

Thanks.

I think the email got chopped off by the site algorithms. Should I assume it's amel.fr or something like that.

Bill,

If you're up this way and we can help you out or just share a toddy let us know. 

We're planning on heading to Cape Breton's Bras'Dor Lakes in mid August then back down to Mahone Bay in late August. 

You can reach me any time at reswinemar at gmail dot com. (Let me know if that fools the algorithms;-)

Cheers

Rick