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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Hi Elja,
You are correct, maybe the Lithium batteries will last longer, but maybe not. we don't really know! I know from experience the AGM's should last 5 years. I think its unlikely that the Lithium's would last 12.5 years. I will base my thinking on 7-8 years for the Lithium option which makes them effectively double the cost. Brent, I think I've tracked down my Mastervolt (Chargemaster 24/100-3) chargers and as far as I can ascertain, they are adjustable via MasterBus for a lithium charging profile. Still need to work out about the alternator charging ability. It's all a bit difficult from the other side of the planet! Many thanks Dean SY Stella A54-154
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
He Nick ,
He Dean I think the A2 B charger 24/200 from sterling have a profile for Licium charging from Altinator Elja SM Balu 222 Von meinem iPhone gesendet
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Hi Dean,
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
When I bought Amelia in 2017 I replaced the Onan. I spent about two months with no genset and there was no list. As soon as the new genset was installed we listed to port. I also bought new Lifeline AGMs. Still going 100%. I wanted Firefly at the time but availability was the problem. I understand the attractions of Lithium, but carbon foam AGM batteries are also very attractive. Firefly brand is the best but expensive and not available in the U.K. Pure lead carbon AGM by Leoch are available in the U.K. £239 inc delivery. I am sure you could get a discount for 12. I have no personal experience with these batteries. I currently use my boat for about 5 months per year. I have solar and wind. For the other seven months the solar keeps the batteries 100% charged. Whilst cruising I run the genset to make water, do the laundry etc for about 3 hrs per week. Call it 75 hours per year. So about 115 litres of diesel, one oil change and an oil filter pa. I anticipate that my battery bank will last quite a long time...but who knows. Now if I was to do it again now, that is buy a boat with the generator seized and dead. I would not replace the generator. I would go Lithium and big inverter and big solar and big alternator. The boat would have less weight and no list and it would have saved money. The thing is, you: Have a good generator Only use the boat six months pa Not sure Lithium is worth the trouble and expense unless you are cruising full time. If you had solar you would prolong the life of your AGM bank. All the best and looking forward to rolling out effective vaccines so we can get back on track. Nick S/Y Amelia Leros Gr AML54-019
On 15 Nov 2020, at 02:13, Scott SV Tengah <Scott.nguyen@...> wrote:
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Re: Valsat 03 dimesions
Thank you. I purchases Garmin 922 that will fit almost perfectly.
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Scott SV Tengah
Ah yes and we listed to port prior to lithium. Even more so now. Full diesel tank helps though.
-- Scott 2007 A54 #69 SV Tengah http://www.svtengah.com
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Scott SV Tengah
Dean,
If you have the master volt 110/24 alternator you'll need the alpha pro 2 or later regulator. You'll also need the masterbus-usb interface to pick the lithium profile. No way to do it otherwise. If you have a bms that can send a signal out to indicate over or under voltage, it's possible to setup the alpha pro 2 to safely stop charging. Took me a while (and included the help of an engineer who used to break into car ecus for fun and profit) to figure it out but it's relatively simple at the end of the day. My victron mains and solar chargers are turned off by an external bms signal too, so no worries about high voltage disconnect. I'm curious how it's done with these drop in batteries - I simply don't know how they protect against hvd without destroying the alternator, mains charger and solar charger. Further if the battery is disconnected from the circuit, wouldn't you have a voltage spike, damaging your electronics? Hvd has happened to me on more than one occasion due to high charging currents on batteries that went slightly out of balance. Didn't happen until after the first year, so don't be overconfident if it doesn't happen right away. For long term storage if you're storing on the hard, just disconnect everything at 40-50%soc and the self discharge is negligible. With master volt I believe you can set a charging limit based on soc. With my victron I did a workaround where I have the programmable relay within the bmv712 battery monitor turn on the inverter at say 75% and run a 230v load (dehumidifer) until it drops to 45% or so. Dries the boat and keeps it from keeping the battery overcharged when I leave the boat for extended periods Hope this helps. -- Scott 2007 A54 #69 SV Tengah http://www.svtengah.com
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Re: 𝗭𝗼𝗼𝗺 𝗠𝗲𝗲𝘁𝗶𝗻𝗴𝘀
Great idea. I know Chris. I will contact him. Best, CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School +1 832-380-4970 | brouse@... 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com Yacht School Calendar: www.preparetocastoff.blogspot.com/p/calendar.html
On Sat, Nov 14, 2020, 12:29 PM Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...> wrote:
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Re: 𝗭𝗼𝗼𝗺 𝗠𝗲𝗲𝘁𝗶𝗻𝗴𝘀
Perhaps some stuff related to weather forecasting and weather services? Chris Parker and Met Bob have always seemed very approachable.
I attended a free Chris Parker seminar at the St Pete boat show. About 50 others joined. He did a great job of explaining weather in layman’s terms (and of course promoted his book – very softly). He also tells some great stories of his cruising days and how he got into the business of weather.
With best regards,
Mark
Skipper Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275 Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia www.creampuff.us
From:
main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On
Behalf Of CW Bill Rouse
I have had difficulty scheduling someone to speak at our Zoom meetings for November and December.
Hopefully, we will be able to resume these meetings next year.
I am always open to suggestions.
Bill
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𝗭𝗼𝗼𝗺 𝗠𝗲𝗲𝘁𝗶𝗻𝗴𝘀
I have had difficulty scheduling someone to speak at our Zoom meetings for November and December. Hopefully, we will be able to resume these meetings next year. I am always open to suggestions. Bill
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Transporter Energy distributes the Battle Born batteries in Europe under the brand Transporter Fact Sheet For more information or a Custom Bundle Quote contact: Tell him that I referred you for an Amel Discount Bill
On Fri, Nov 13, 2020 at 7:57 PM Dean Gillies <stella@...> wrote: Hi all,
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
I just installed 12 12v Relion batteries and 2 40v chargers everything was a straight swap
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Batteries 900$ each Chose the 40v because they can use any shore voltage and can run at the same time if wanted like with the Generator Obviously no long term experience but my failed chargers killed a 1 year old bank of AGMs so easy decision Cheers Courtney Trippin 54 #101 Brunswick
On Nov 13, 2020, at 8:57 PM, Dean Gillies <stella@...> wrote:
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
He Dean
By the calkulation for the price by AH you have to think abaut the time foe working in good contitione the AGM batteries maybe 5-8 years Li maybe 10-12 years ( we dont now realy ) I think two month agow to change to LI in this winter but it seams to dificult for my an now i thange by a new charge system victron multiplus , victron solar charger , and new agm Batteries an then i can change in 5 yaers by LI Batteries Elja SM Balu 222 Von meinem iPhone gesendet
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Re: Rudder Stuffing Box Packing Material
James Alton
Paul,
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
I wonder if you might have had a deteriorated old style flax packing in your stuffing box? That material will break down and become weak over time so does tend to break into pcs. If you use a modern fiber packing I think that you will find that the packing rings will come out in one pc. as it is quite strong. I am glad to hear that the specialty tool worked better for you. James SV Sueno Maramu #220
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Thanks Brent, Good point about the profiles. I have circa 2010 Mastervolt mains chargers which I believe have lithium profiles, and a Victron solar controller which I know definitely does have the lithium profile. I'll check up on the Mastervolt products, and also that the Alternator external regulator is compatible.
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Re: Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Dean, Battle Born is the US distributor for Dragon Fly Energy. In the UK, the same batteries are sold as Transporter Energy. This is what Brian on Delos installed. In addition to the alternator regulators you will need to ensure your chargers support a Lithium profile as well.
Brent
On Nov 13, 2020, 8:58 PM -0500, Dean Gillies <stella@...>, wrote:
--
Brent Cameron Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada
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Lithium Batteries under Consideration
Hi all,
12 months ago I ordered 12x new Rolls S12-128AGM batteries to replace Stella's (A54-154) waning 5 year old battery bank. My thinking at the time was that I would seek another 5 years from AGM's before seriously considering lithium. The pandemic happened and I was unable to return to the boat (in the UK) in 2020, so I cancelled my battery order. Fast forward 12 months and I am thinking again about my battery replacement. During the pandemic I bought a caravan (RV) which is fitted with a 12Vx 200Ah lithium battery, and it has given me some good first-hand experience of using a lithium system in an off-grid scenario. In practical terms, I am impressed by its ability to accept high charge rates even when SOC is high, and also to operate effectively with stable voltages when in low SOC states, even when delivering high currents. My boat use-case is ideally 6 months constant cruising and 6 months in storage, although the current cycle will be 18 months in storage due to the pandemic. I am least impressed by the logistics of maintaining a lithium battery during long periods of storage. That said, I am now considering making the jump to lithium when I (hopefully) return to the UK in 2020. I don't want to get involved in a lithium "project" and I'm not particularly interested in turning Stella into a "smart boat". I'm also not interested in retiring my generator, and I am happy to continue using this for AirCon and Laundry appliances, so I don't need a big invertor, and I don't want to replace the cabling between batteries and Engine Room charging devices. My preferred path would be to install "drop-in" replacement lithium batteries, and then upgrade any other components necessary to ensure safe and reliable operation. I believe the main thing I will need to re-configure/augment is my 175A charger to ensure it doesn't overheat with too much constant load, and doesn't destroy itself in a HV battery disconnect. Any other critical things I should consider here? The lithium batteries I would prefer are the 24V models since they should always be properly balanced by the BMS, whereas the 12V models need to be separately managed for proper balancing in a 24V system (just like Lead Acid batteries do). I understand about not having 12V redundancy for engine starting, and I'm comfortable with my contingencies there. I considered the BattleBorn 24V/50Ah batteries, and apart from the strange terminal configuration making them not "drop-in", these would seem to be a good choice. However I cannot find a supplier in the UK. Has anyone purchased these in the UK? Has anyone purchased them for shipping to the UK from the US? My other serious contender is the Relion RB24V50. This has a slightly lower max discharge current (50A) than the BB battery (60A) which is important particularly for bow thruster operation but the terminal arrangement means that it is a true drop-in replacement AND it is available for purchase in the UK. I wonder if anyone has any experience of this battery, or other Relion batteries? Cost vs power The set of 12x AGM batteries is GBP2800 and provides about 250Ah of usable capacity at 24V without taking the batteries below about 65% SOC (which is my preference). So lets say about GBP11 per Ah of usable capacity. A set of 8x 24Vx50Ah Relion batteries would cost about GBP8000 and give a usable capacity of about 280Ah without taking the batteries below 30% SOC. That is therefore about GBP28 per Ah of usable capacity. The rule of thumb seems to be that the lithium option is about 2.5 times more expensive than AGM for equivalent capacity. Does that stack up with other experiences or did I miss something? Weights The 12x AGM batteries total mass is 393.6kg whereas the 8x lithium batteries weigh in at 105.6kg That's a weight saving of 288kg. I know that Stella, like other A54's, has a slight list to one side, but I just can't remember if it's port or starboard, can someone please remind me which it is? Hmmm, I didn't intend this post to be quite so involved, but just typing it has helped to clarify my thinking :-) Cheers Dean SY Stella A54-154 Currently (still) ashore in Ardrossan, Scotland.
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Re: Rudder Stuffing Box Packing Material
Paul Stascavage
James,
I used your suggestion to get the majority of the second ring removed. It worked, but it was a slow and tedious process as the material was only coming out in pieces, Dan, Thank you for referring me to the Palmetto 1101 tool. I used it today to remove the last 25% of the second ring as well as the third ring. What took me a few hours was accomplished today in about 15 minutes with this tool. I highly recommend it. All the best, Paul Stascavage SM #466 - s/v Rita Kathryn On The Hard - Severn Yachting Center - Hayes, VA
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Re: more on 160 LPH Desalinator
Thanks for this information Bill, Best regards Daniel and Lori Carlson on sv BeBe, SM #387
On Fri, Nov 13, 2020, 8:25 AM william reynolds <sail23692@...> wrote: I recently replaced my high pressure switch. It was leaking profusely and corroded. It wasn't working.
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more on 160 LPH Desalinator
william reynolds
I recently replaced my high pressure switch. It was leaking profusely and corroded. It wasn't working.
The desal unit will work fine without the switch in the system. It is there to prevent over-pressurization. The new switch came with some installation instructions. The switch comes pre-set at a very low cut-out pressure. The instructions tell you to "Install the switch, start up the desal unit and increase the high pressure knob until the high pressure pump cuts out. Note where the cut out happens on the hi-pressure scale. Repeat until the cut-out occurs at the top of the green zone on the hi-pressure gauge." This procedure is hard on the generator and high pressure pump. I inquired to the Dessalator techs as to why they could not supply the switch preset at some value of 800-850 PSI which is the industry standard for these pumps and also why a numerical pressure gauge is not fitted or recommended as a refit. No answer has been forthcoming as yet. Bill Reynolds Cloudstreet SM2K 331
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Re: Installing a diesel heater
Forgot to mention my heater is an Eberspracher. Bill Shaproski
On Sat, Nov 7, 2020 at 10:35 AM Paul Osterberg <osterberg.paul.l@...> wrote: Hello! --
Bill Shaproski Cell: +1-206-375-2787
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