On Jun 13, 2018, at 11:49 AM, sangaris@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

James,

If some bolts won't come out and have never been removed before it seems likely there has not been water ingress - they're just being uncooperative and can wait for you to get back to your shop for better tools. If you're concerned, I'd treat them with Captain Tolley's (Amazing) Creeping Crack Cure - great product.

I had the embedded plate of the port side aft-most stanchion get wet after the original GPS antenna cable was removed along with the silicon Amel had sealed it with. After many years the rusting plate swelled up and cracked the toe rail open. A few years ago I cut out the old plate, replaced it and re-glassed the toe rail, which now looks like new. This can also be an issue if you rewire the bow lights.

Others have reported swelling in the SM engine-room hatch cover supports (I think BebeBill was the first to post about it). Don't recall any issues reported about the genoa track rail bolts, which I believe you're working on.

Craig Briggs, SN68 Sangaris

---In amelyachtowners@..., <lokiyawl2@...> wrote :

Craig,

   Thanks for the advice and information on how you dealt with the bolts on your boat that are tapped into the embedded plates, that was very helpful to me! 

   I will definitely take Joel’s advice on sealing and using new bolts.  I have read about the problems that can occur if water gets to the backing plates and I certainly want to avoid that if at all possible.  My thoughts are to remove any of the rail bolts that I can get out easily and replace/reseal those as soon as I can.    The remainder that are  difficult to remove will have to wait until I get Sueño back to my shop in Florida.  I am wondering if there are any options to help prevent water ingress on the fasteners that I cannot easily remove?

   Best of luck to you and your project.

James Alton

SV Sueño

Maramu #220

    

On Jun 12, 2018, at 8:51 PM, sangaris@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

My experience was some bolts were easily removed, others really stubborn. After trying BIG screwdriver with square shaft and a wrench on that to add to torque, the ultimate solution for the ones that got "buggered" was to weld a short hex head bolt onto the flat slotted head of the stanchion bolt and put a socket wrench on that - easy peasy removal.

Do take Joel's advice to heart to be SURE you seal the new/replaced bolts totally. This forum has many reports of the embedded carbon steel backing plates corroding and some bursting open - believe me, it's a BIG fiberglass repair job to cut out the old plates and rebuild the fiberglass and gel coat.

Good luck with it!

Craig Briggs, SN68 Sangaris.

---In amelyachtowners@..., wrote :

Gary,

  Thanks for the information.  I am curious about what percentage of the bolts you were able to extract from the embedded bar stock?  Also what technique for removal of the fasteners seemed to work the best for you?

   Best of luck with the rest of your hurricane repairs.

James Alton

SV Sueño

Maramu #220

On Jun 12, 2018, at 1:54 AM, amelliahona <no_reply@...> wrote:

Hi Bill

I echo what Joel and others have said but with a few caveats.  I just had about 10 of my stanchions off for repairs following hurricane damage.  Most are attached with the threaded-into-embedded-bar stock method but those in the immediate vicinity of the aft "garage" lazarette had washers and nuts on the back side of the vertical face of the toe-rail and the top horizontal face of the toe-rail.   This included the three most aft stanchions on the starboard stern area.  I didn't have damage on the port side in that area and so I can't speak to that (plus the propane locker is in that area so you'll have to  inspect in that area for nuts if that is where your damage is).  

I had always assumed that the stanchion that has the outboard rail board on it was welded at the top rail and the block was fabricate in-situ but not so.  That stanchion is about 1.5 inches sh ort of going to the top rail and inserts in a hole that is about 75% of the depth of the the wooden block. 

Sincerely, 

Gary S. Silver

s/v Liahona

Amel SM 2000 #335

currently completing hurricane repairs at Island Marine, Inc, Puerto Del Rey, Puerto Rico

PS I have a son who is a certified welder so I have been taught a lot about quality welding by him.  The guys that did my stainless repairs were highly skilled and true professionals.  Besides fabricating and installing a 10 ft section of rail and stanchions (done off the boat after tack welding everything on the boat, they weld repaired some broken bales on the underside of the stanchions that retain the jib-sheet-car traveler line.  They did this by removing the stanchion base screws, flexing the lifeline about an inch away from the toe-rail, putting protective metal plating between the fibergla ss and the work piece and TIG welding the bale-to-base, upside down, in close quarters while laying on the deck.  Amazing work.  I can't believe the results of all their work.  Perfect in every way.

On Jun 16, 2018, at 12:12 PM, calbyy@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Just to express all the pleasure of benefitting from the outstanding (responsive, efficient, ) response of the Amel After Sales services.

Owner of a 1982 Maramu, I lost my bow thruster (tube, gear, propeller) to the caribean waters late April 2018, I sent a message to La Rochelle asking for possibility to replace; got a concise answer within 24 hrs proposing to try and recover Drawings & memory of the part & confirming that they were prompting production to meet my EAT in french port scheudle mid May.

Arrived May 20 in Canet en Roussillon, called the yard in La Rochelle & was informed that the part would be completed within a Week.

Good to know that Amel shipyard keep on supporting old (or better 'vintage' ?) boats, maintaining memory of Drawings, measurements & until now craftmanship to help us extend the sailing life of our boats.

christian alby - Désirade VIII - Maramu 116 - Back in Canet en Roussillon

 

Thanks for the details.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus
Amel School www..amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970

On Wed, Jun 6, 2018, 12:54 'S/V Garulfo' svgarulfo@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Bill and 54 owners,

The issue with the Port-only-thrusting was resolved by removing and dismantling the double-solenoid power relay. After cleaning the contacts with sandpaper and corrosionX-ing the springs, it functioned correctly again. The issue was confusing because each relay would behave correctly independently (connecting the top posts and disconnecting the bottom ones) but activating the starboard one would cause the other one to loose its bottom (idle) connection(!). 

Some more info I gathered in the meantime:

* The front relay (red and blue wires) is activated for starboard operation. The back relay (red and grey wires) for port. 

* Power cables are marked A1, A2, D1, D2. A1 and A2 are the stator posts, D1 and D2 are the rotor bobin posts.

* the rotor and stator circuits are in series. The voltage of the rotor is reversed depending on direction. 

* A1 is permanently connected to batteries Neg. A2, D1 and D2 are controlled by the relays. 

* on idle, A2, D1 and D2 are connected together. 

* on Starboard, the front relay connects D2 to batteries Pos (top posts). A2 and D1 are still connected by the bottom posts of the back relay. Circuit is: Pos=D2-rotor-D1=A2-stator-A1=Neg

* on Port, the back relay connects D1 to batteries Pos (top posts). A2 and D2 are still connected by the bottom posts of the front relay. Circuit is: Pos=D1-rotor-D2=A2-stator-A1=Neg

Hope that will help,

Fair winds and happy thrusting

(Oh, and the ground circuit leak got resolved too in the operation. Not sure exactly how, but it did)

Thomas

GARULFO

AMEL 54 #122

Bonaire 

On Mon, 28 May 2018 at 21:43, S/V Garulfo <svgarulfo@...> wrote:

Hi Bill,

I agree the motor is probably fine, as it can run in one direction. 

I can hear the big Albright double-solenoid motor-reversing contactor click for both starboard and port operation. So joystick is innocent.

I think i know what 4 relays you mean (in the plastic junction box) but didn't foresee they played a part in the thrusting operation. I assumed it was only the raising/lowering of the thruster, and that my problem was closer to the Side-Power unit. 

I measured voltage on the Albright contactor posts in port/starboard/idle operation to see if I can reverse engineer what is supposed to happen to the 4 power cables going into the motor.. Need to look at the results with a fresh pair of eyes in the morning. And maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree.

Thanks as always,

Thomas 

GARULFO

AMEL 54 #122

Bonaire 

On Mon, 28 May 2018 at 21:02, Bill Rouse brouse@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Thomas,

It is probably not the motor and is either the joystick or one of the 4 relays. 

Eliminate the joystick first... 

It is unlikely that your relays are numbered because out of about 10 54s, I have only seen 1 with numbered relays, but they are all the same relay. If all 54s are wired the same, I think it will be relay #2, but, if you have a spare relay, it is easy enough to replace them one at a time until you find the culprit. Of course the problem can be corrosion between the relay terminals and the female spade connectors.

If I owned a 54, I would have 4 spare relays.

Good Luck!

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus
Amel School  http://www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970

On Mon, May 28, 2018 at 4:22 PM, 'S/V Garulfo' svgarulfo@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Hi Scott,

Talking of the devil...

I haven't looked into the carbon dust and brushes yet, cause I reconnected the thruster for a quick stop in a marina and after the initial 'all-good' tests, it decided to only thrust to port and not starboard....

So I've got a second issue to troubleshoot. If anyone has experienced it and has clues, it's very welcome.. 

I'll check the state of the brushes for uneven wear too, to give you another data point.. 

Note that i don't have an oil reservoir in my unit.

Fair winds to all,

Thomas

GARULFO

AMEL 54 #122

Bonaire 

On Mon, 28 May 2018 at 05:54, cpp_berkeley <no_reply@...> wrote:

Craig,

Answers to your questions below:

1) After we let it cool down (~30 minutes) it ran fine. Perhaps a bit weaker but that's probably to be expected considering that some of the brushes have worn down considerably and actually even cracked, exposing just bare conductors. My fear is that going forward, it will continue to overheat prematurely and leave us without a bow thruster when we most need it.

2) The sidepower bowthruster has a drain plug underwater between the two props and a fill reservoir in the bow locker. Obviously oil is changed on the hard. My understanding is that the way to change the oil is to open the plug and continue filling the reservoir until the oil coming out of the plug looks clean. That way, you don't get air into the system.

The mechanic drained all of the oil and he put the plug back and filled the reservoir. The next day, the oil level had dropped, indicating that the air migrated upwards (and/or the thick oil slowly migrated downwards). This drop in oil level continued for a few days. It seems reasonably stable now, but I'm unsure whether some air was still stuck in the gearleg and never made its way out..

Also, we now have a strong "Mass -" leak. Thomas of S/V Garulfo posted that he had a bow thruster leak, possibly from carbon dust. I'll go check that now and report back.

But in general, any idea why the carbon brushes would be wearing so unevenly?

Scott

A54 #69 

S/V Tengah 

---In amelyachtowners@..., wrote :

Hi Scott,

Your post raises a couple of questions. 

1. You say the unit had a thermal shutdown - did it work after it cooled  down?  Any problems?

2. In what way did the mechanic have trouble getting air out of the system? On the SN and SM one simply turns the bottom section upside down to drain and then pours in new oil. No issue with air. Perhaps the 54 is a different design that I'm not familiar with.

Craig

---In amelyachtowners@..., <no_reply@yahoogroups...com> wrote :

Hi all,

I was coming into the quay at Zante yesterday in our A54 with about 10-15 knots on the beam and used the sidepower bow thruster in 10-15 second bursts and all of the sudden, thermal shutdown!

After executing an exciting no thruster stern-to med mooring into a tight spot (with expectant spectators!) I opened up the bow thruster compartment to see a lot of carbon dust. I took the motor cover off and inspected the brushes and found that for each of the pairs (4 pairs, 8 total brushes), one was worn MUCH more than the other one. On some pairs, it's the top one that was worn more, on some, it was the bottom one. Some brushes were down to loose wire.

On the attached photo, you can see the extent of the uneven wear for one pair.

We recently had the boatyard change the bowthruster oil and they drained it all before adding new oil, which resulted in challenges getting all the air out of the system. We then completed a 1350 mile passage. These probably have nothing to do with it, but maybe I'm wrong.

Before I go out and spend money to replace the brushes and possibly experience similar uneven wear, anyone have any ideas as to why this happened and how to rectify it?

Thanks!

Scott

A54 #69 

S/V Tengah