Date   

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Long block failure on a Volvo D3-110 Amel 54-152

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Dean,

Your East Coast experience is a salutary lesson to us all. Seek out the simple first. When I was a teenager with an aged Norton Dominator twin 500 cc motorcycle my father gave me some sage advice:. "If you think you need an engine overhaul change the spark plug first" Good principle. The amount of oil you are seeing it wont be fatal in a hurry so take time to seek it out. While we are on oil I would mention that I had some warranty work done on my new Volvo D2 75. It was to do with the turbo and the symptoms included slight oil loss with a hard to trace oil leak. They fitted a new turbo after months of argument. They had suggested the sump may have been overfilled causing excessive oil vapor out of the breather which is routed to the turbo. They thought it possible the dip stick was incorrectly marked so did a careful oil change measuring the amount rather than trusting the dip stick.It was correct and the new turbo fixed the problem. That's just an example. Not suggesting that is your problem.

Kind Regards

Danny

SM 299

Ocean Pearl


On 21 August 2018 at 01:50 "Trifin trifin@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Hi Danny, That’s a good point you make. The bottom of the bellhousing is the lowest point, maybe it’s just collecting there. However, I can’t see any track marks, but maybe that’s not so unusual. The only other significant oil leak I’ve experienced was cruising the East coast of Australia. Motored into Yamba, did an engine check – big pool of oil on the floor, with no obvious leakage point at all. Local engineer looked at it sagely, shaking his head and suggesting we probably need a new engine. I called my regular engineer in Sydney, who asked a few questions, and diagnosed the problem in a couple of minutes. It was a minuscule split in the rubber cap of the oil evacuation tube. No sign whatsoever of any leakage from it, however one new rubber cap and one cable tie later, problem sorted.

We had been motor-sailing on a heel. The leaking oil was vapour and simply condensed on the floor of the engine bay. No drips, no tell-tale signs at all on the engine.

I will look more closely at the turbocharger as you suggest.

Motoring at 1650 today was very gentlemanly! Not much sea, 8knots, quiet engine, good economy. Such a shame it’s bad for the motor!

Cheers Dean

X

 


 


 


Re: Main sheet boom slider broken

Mark Isaac
 

All-

Just an FYI:  I contacted Nance and Underwood to have a boom slider fabricated (I'm within a few hull numbers of Steve).  Roger told me this would not be possible if they did not have the boom in house.  Apparently, they did not retain enough information on the job to be able to do this remotely.  He did say he may be able to pattern off a local SM.

Mark Isaac
Lulu, SM 391
South Freeport, Maine


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Anchor swivel [2 Attachments]

Ian Park
 

No chain between swivel and anchor. All the force goes sideways through the neck of the ball joint.

Ian

Ocean Hobo SN96


Kimberlite

Paul Stascavage
 

Eric,

I have tried to reach out to you via email a couple times last month and my emails went unanswered.  I think maybe they went to your spam folder?

Please shoot me an email at your earliest convenience paul dot stascavage at icloud dot com.

All the best,

Paul Stascavage
SM #466 - s/v Rita Kathryn
Cruising New England

www.RitaKathryn.com



Re: Amel Rendezvous St Michaels, MD Oct 1-4 2018

Paul Stascavage
 

Pat,

What comes after the @ for your direct email contact?

Thanks

Paul Stascavage
SM #466 - s/v Rita Kathryn
Cruising New England

www.RitaKathryn.com


selling Amel, Maramu 48'

Kenneth Coats
 

Hello, My name is Judith Golden an I am selling our 1985 that is equipped with the Amel furling mast and headsail. Joel Potter sold us the boat and we took ownership in 1999 and sailed for several great years. With age knocking on our door we decided to sell. My husband Ken and I were in the process of getting Golden Daze ready for market when he became ill and passed away before we were able to complete the work. Ken started projects that he always wanted to do while the engine was out to enhance the accessibility of pumps and other equipment in order to make things easier for everyone. Ken was a man unable to let something go unless it was done right and to his liking. Our boat is a project but when said and done it will be a sound sailing boat once again.                                                      
 
Joel Potter is again our broker and has sold this boat to everyone who has owned it and knows it well. He has deeply inspected the boat and will be able to answer almost any question you might have.  
                                             Judy Golden
 
                                                 


Re: Long block failure on a Volvo D3-110 Amel 54-152

Dean Gillies
 

Hi Danny,
That’s a good point you make.
The bottom of the bellhousing is the lowest point, maybe it’s just collecting there. However, I can’t see any track marks, but maybe that’s not so unusual. The only other significant oil leak I’ve experienced was cruising the East coast of Australia. Motored into Yamba, did an engine check - big pool of oil on the floor, with no obvious leakage point at all. Local engineer looked at it sagely, shaking his head and suggesting we probably need a new engine. I called my regular engineer in Sydney, who asked a few questions, and diagnosed the problem in a couple of minutes.
It was a minuscule split in the rubber cap of the oil evacuation tube. No sign whatsoever of any leakage from it, however one new rubber cap and one cable tie later, problem sorted.

We had been motor-sailing on a heel. The leaking oil was vapour and simply condensed on the floor of the engine bay. No drips, no tell-tale signs at all on the engine.

I will look more closely at the turbocharger as you suggest.

Motoring at 1650 today was very gentlemanly! Not much sea, 8knots, quiet engine, good economy. Such a shame it’s bad for the motor!

Cheers
Dean

Sent from my iPhone X


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Improvements to the Amel design.

michael winand
 

Yes 10mm chain  . All shackles  are rated swl, 6 tonne  at anchor  it is a close fit at the bow roller so I bring it up gently. I normally am at the bow when anchoring.  2.5 tonne swl at the end of the 10mm chain to the 16mm chain. 
The larger chain is easy to thread my 12mm line through to tie off the anchor when underway. 
If you have to buy a new anchor chain most chain manufacturers will put a larger link at each end. Where I am it is called fathom chain. 60 fathom  is near 117m. 
A swivel between the two chain 16mm and the 10mm would also be able to be used as the swivel is normally larger on one end to allow for the anchor. 

On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 at 19:31, divanz620@... [amelyachtowners]
wrote:
 

Thanks Michael...


So you have 10mm chain - shackle - 16mm x 1m chain - shackle - anchor?

What shackles do you use ?

Cheers
Alan
Elyse SM437


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Improvements to the Amel design.

Alan Leslie
 

Thanks Michael...

So you have 10mm chain - shackle - 16mm x 1m chain - shackle - anchor?

What shackles do you use ?

Cheers
Alan
Elyse SM437


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Long block failure on a Volvo D3-110 Amel 54-152

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi dean. Cruising = fixing boats in exotic locations is my second favourite quote. You'll know the other one. Wouldn't worry about losing your puff of smoke. A diesel engine (as many on this forum say) needs to work. 1500 rpm is thoroughly unkind to it. The drip of oil. Engine oil? Are you sure it's coming from the bell housing. Some stray oil can come from the turbo and finish up in unusual locations. With a young engine like yours a main bearing crankshaft seal is unlikely to have failed.

Regards

Danny

SM 299

Ocean Pearl

On 20 August 2018 at 19:55 "Trifin trifin@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Hi Danny, Thanks for that info.

The situation has also become a little curiouser. I did that test, and produced the big puff of smoke once and once only, now I cannot repeat the result!

I’ve tried again with engine hot and cold, but no big puff of smoke!

Maybe I had some kind of build up in there which got blown out? Quite strange.

Since this thread popped up I have been deliberately running the motor much harder than previously, typically motoring at 2150rpm (rather than 1500-1800) Since doing this I’ve had a couple of interesting issues raise their heads.

  1. Slight leakage from lid of C-Drive reservoir. I think I understand that issue fully.

  2. Some leakage of oil from the motor, which I’ve traced to the bellhousing breather at the bottom of the housing. A teaspoon per hour maybe. Right now I’m transiting at 1650rpm to see if it’s still the same.

The only sources of that leak that I can think of are the sump flange or the main shaft seal. (Wish I’d known about this before the new box went in!)

I’m becoming very familiar with fixing boats in exotic places :-)

Cheers Dean SY Stella Amel 54#154

X

 


 


 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Improvements to the Amel design.

michael winand
 

Hi Alan.  One meter of  chain. At present I have not yet added a swivel. Not needed one 


On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 at 17:00, divanz620@... [amelyachtowners]
wrote:
 

Thanks Michael,


How much 16mm chain do you use and do you have a swivel between that and your main anchor chain?
Cheers
Alan
Elyse SM437


Re: Long block failure on a Volvo D3-110 Amel 54-152

Dean Gillies
 

Hi Danny,
Thanks for that info.

The situation has also become a little curiouser.
I did that test, and produced the big puff of smoke once and once only, now I cannot repeat the result!

I’ve tried again with engine hot and cold, but no big puff of smoke!

Maybe I had some kind of build up in there which got blown out? Quite strange.

Since this thread popped up I have been deliberately running the motor much harder than previously, typically motoring at 2150rpm (rather than 1500-1800)
Since doing this I’ve had a couple of interesting issues raise their heads.

1. Slight leakage from lid of C-Drive reservoir. I think I understand that issue fully.

2. Some leakage of oil from the motor, which I’ve traced to the bellhousing breather at the bottom of the housing. A teaspoon per hour maybe. Right now I’m transiting at 1650rpm to see if it’s still the same.
The only sources of that leak that I can think of are the sump flange or the main shaft seal. (Wish I’d known about this before the new box went in!)

I’m becoming very familiar with fixing boats in exotic places :-)

Cheers
Dean
SY Stella
Amel 54#154


Sent from my iPhone X


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Improvements to the Amel design.

Alan Leslie
 

Thanks Michael,

How much 16mm chain do you use and do you have a swivel between that and your main anchor chain?
Cheers
Alan
Elyse SM437


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Long block failure on a Volvo D3-110 Amel 54-152

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Porter,

sorry for the late reply. Those changing out for a Kubota or similar seem to have good reasons. I would seriously consider that. Weight and HP and mounting and matching to the drive train would be issues I would examine. And of course isolated ground. As to Panama. When we went through we did not explore the area. Yvonne has never forgiven me. There are some amazing land trips available. Don't miss the chance to make the most of it. There is a lot to do around there. Also don't forget my motto fixed on the bulkhead at the helm. "Attitude, the difference between ordeal and adventure" To give credit I got it from Bob Bitchen, erstwhile editor of the defunct magazine Latitudes and attitudes.

Kind Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 18 August 2018 at 02:38 "Porter McRoberts portermcroberts@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Thank you Danny . Good to know. 


Teun was very helpful. He’s down on this model of D3 and got a new/different one. Smart man. The warranty for us only covers a new long block. Which seems realistic. I also have tones of spares for this engine. Etc. Getting CDM to understand an electrically isolated engine Pyle prove incredibly difficult. 
Surprisingly Panama might as well be Somalia in terms of good reliable Volvo work. Rest of the country splendid. 

Some have expressed suspicion that the long block was never actually changed. It’s mine too. Today I’m going to do some forensics. 

We work so hard to make sure everything is perfect. It’s frustrating to have rely on a system that seems so error prone, and over which we have so little control. 

One of the things I really need to learn is how to get the fault codes out of the helm display. 

Had I that, at the beginning, we’d be so much further along in this process. We’re 2.5 months here in Panama with the engine. 

But as my Guru says, “slow down enjoy the trip”. Bill R and Marcus Aurelius to the rescue. 

I’d love a mechanical engine. 

Thanks for all the comments from everyone 

Porter
A54-152. Ibis. 
Vista Mar Marina, Panama

Excuse the errors.  
Sent from my IPhone 

On Aug 15, 2018, at 1:33 PM, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] < amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Hi Porter,

Like everyone I feel for you. Some thoughts. Unless something like salt water ingress  happens and oil and filters are changed regularly diesel engines, mechanically are good for very high hours, 4000 ordinary, 8000, not unusual. You had all the mechanical parts renewed with the long block. I guess not all the wiring looms (which are considerable) nor the operational computer systems. That's where I would be looking. Teun Bass in Noumea has a similar story to tell and he may have something to offer.

Kind Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 16 August 2018 at 01:50 "Trifin trifin@... [amelyachtowners]" < amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Porter, I think your maintenance regime for the engine looks just fine. It must be very frustrating to have this problem happening again.

I’m not clear on exactly what is the cause of the problem, but then I’m no diesel mechanic! Has that been clearly laid out by Volvo to your satisfaction?

That tell-tale puff of smoke is interesting, which I guess tells of oil ending up where it shouldn’t be and then burning off. I wonder if you can share a few more details about the exact circumstances around when it puffs… does it happen once, only under load, in neutral, idling and then gunning quickly etc. That would allow others to test and report comparisons.

I have the same D3–110i-C model and the Amel specified autoprop. My WOT is 2950-3000rpm.

I hope for a satisfactory resolution for you, it inspires no confidence in your planned travels when things like this happen.

Cheers Dean SY Stella Amel 54 #154

X

 

 


 


 

 

 


 


 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Improvements to the Amel design.

michael winand
 

We use the area between the windlass and the anchor shackle to use 16mm chain. The heavy piece of chain improves the weight down at the shank and won't side load the swivel. 
You can also use a larger shackle on the anchor. 

On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 at 11:56, greatketch@... [amelyachtowners]
 

The real issue with swivels is not the breaking strength in a straight line.  Many brands can claim a breaking strength as high or higher than the chain then connect to. 


The real of concern is their susceptibility to side loading and other mis-aligned loads.

If the anchor is fixed in position either because of rocks or a deep and secure set, the problem with most swivels mounted on the anchor itself is that they can not well orient to a pull from the side as the result of a wind shift.  

The Wasi is a certainly a bit better at this than some, but once the pull is more than 30 degrees from axis of the anchor shank, you have the full load of the rode as a bending force on the small stem of the ball. It bends and, potentially, breaks.  Exactly as Mark and Porter observed.

The solution is either a better designed swivel, or to put a few links of chain between the swivel and the anchor shank so side loading can never happen.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Annapolis, MD, USA





---In amelyachtowners@..., wrote :

I have also used the Wasi PowerBall swivel for many years along with the WASI anchor and chain.  According to tests reported by WASI, the swivel is significantly stronger than the strongest chain.  Anyone not familiar with it would probably enjoy looking it up.

 

Regards to all,

Miles

 

s/y Ladybug , sm 216, offshore in Gulf of Maine, heading south to Cape Cod


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Long block failure on a Volvo D3-110 Amel 54-152

Porter McRoberts
 

Eric well said especially the last line: fair winds are so very important with the D3.
Porter McRoberts
S/V Ibis: Amel 54-#152
Panama City, Panama












On Aug 17, 2018, at 6:08 PM, eric kimberlite@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


Years ago, I went to Amel to visit and sail the prototype 54 on the far side of the marina in La Rochelle while they were still delivering the 53's
When I discussed discussed the engine, i was not happy with the Volvo "electronic" engine.
They said being that the boat was for export and the USA pollution regulations were not yet in place they could do it for a fee.
Unfortunately I thought I had health issues and did not order hull number 12.
It seems like the has a lot of problems.
I recall when I asked if i bought a spare electronics module and the Volvo engine still did not work what could i do?
They said just hook up the engine to the internet--that was the Volvo deal breaker for me.
Fair Winds,
eric
Sm 376 Kimbelite


On Fri, Aug 17, 2018 at 11:14 AM, Porter McRoberts portermcroberts@... [amelyachtowners] wrote:

 

Thanks Alan 

Great points. The elbow is very clean. But I have not looked beyond it. I will when we remove the engine. 
Thank you!  
Porter. 
A54-152

Excuse the errors.  
Sent from my IPhone 

On Aug 16, 2018, at 2:11 AM, divanz620@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Black smoke is caused by unburnt carbon....oil burning is blue smoke.

Unburnt carbon usually indicates there is a blockage somewhere
Airfilter..you checked that
Injectors..you've done that.
Another thing could be too high back pressure in the exhaust.
Has the exhaust system been taken apart and checked to be sure it is relatively clean and free flowing?
Cheers
Alan
Elyse SM437
Maskelyne Islands, Vanuatu




Re: Improvements to the Amel design.

greatketch@...
 

The real issue with swivels is not the breaking strength in a straight line.  Many brands can claim a breaking strength as high or higher than the chain then connect to. 

The real of concern is their susceptibility to side loading and other mis-aligned loads.

If the anchor is fixed in position either because of rocks or a deep and secure set, the problem with most swivels mounted on the anchor itself is that they can not well orient to a pull from the side as the result of a wind shift.  

The Wasi is a certainly a bit better at this than some, but once the pull is more than 30 degrees from axis of the anchor shank, you have the full load of the rode as a bending force on the small stem of the ball. It bends and, potentially, breaks.  Exactly as Mark and Porter observed.

The solution is either a better designed swivel, or to put a few links of chain between the swivel and the anchor shank so side loading can never happen.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Annapolis, MD, USA





---In amelyachtowners@..., <milesbid@...> wrote :

I have also used the Wasi PowerBall swivel for many years along with the WASI anchor and chain.  According to tests reported by WASI, the swivel is significantly stronger than the strongest chain.  Anyone not familiar with it would probably enjoy looking it up.

 

Regards to all,

Miles

 

s/y Ladybug , sm 216, offshore in Gulf of Maine, heading south to Cape Cod


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Long block failure on a Volvo D3-110 Amel 54-152

 

A puff of smoke on acceleration of a D3 is probably not an indication of something going wrong.

Black smoke on acceleration almost always indicates unburnt fuel. One of the  reasons for computer controlled diesel engines was to eliminate this source of pollution. When rapidly accelerating  a conventional diesel engine, it will allow more fuel in the chamber than it can burn causing black smoke. The Volvo D3 systems are supposed to limit most of this, but an initial puff is likely very normal. I know that the 100hp Yanmar Turbo without a computer will allow lots of unburnt fuel on rapid acceleration and when the AutoProp is fouled.

I also know if I floor my 1985 Mercedes Turbo Diesel, I can smoke you if you are behind me. Sometimes this can add joy to my day😀.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus

Amel School  http://www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550

+1(832) 380-4970

Any opinions and conclusions expressed in this message are solely those of the author and should not be construed as representing the opinion of an expert. Manufacturers' and Expert's precautions must be considered when dealing with mechanical and/or electrical systems to ensure that you are NOT harmed, and/or the device and/or system is NOT ruined. If in doubt, do not touch any mechanical and/or electrical device or system referred to above.


On Sun, Aug 19, 2018 at 4:42 PM Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Hi dean. Ive operated diesels all my life. Most not vommon rail l acknowledge. However believe I can offer something here. Overloaded diesels smoke. The throttle opening delivers more fuel than can burn at the present revolutions. The modern computer controlled systems eliminate this mostly. However, if you slam the throttle down with the prop shaft stationary there is a moment of super overload intil it gets moving,hence your  puff of smoke.

I don't think you have an issue here.

Regards

Danny

SM299

Ocean pearl

On 18 August 2018 at 21:50 "trifin@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Porter,
I’ve done your smoke test.
Yes, under the rapid throttle action, a puff of black smoke comes from our Volvo exhaust exactly as you describe. Not confidence inspiring! Hmmm.

I look forward to seeing other owners results of this quick test.

Dean
SY Stella
Amel 54#154


 


 


Re: Improvements to the Amel design.

Miles
 

I have also used the Wasi PowerBall swivel for many years along with the WASI anchor and chain.  According to tests reported by WASI, the swivel is significantly stronger than the strongest chain.  Anyone not familiar with it would probably enjoy looking it up.

 

Regards to all,

Miles

 

s/y Ladybug , sm 216, offshore in Gulf of Maine, heading south to Cape Cod


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Anchor swivel [2 Attachments]

 

Mark,

Maybe your photo proves the opposite. What kind of load did it take to deform? Think about it.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus

Amel School  http://www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550

+1(832) 380-4970

Any opinions and conclusions expressed in this message are solely those of the author and should not be construed as representing the opinion of an expert. Manufacturers' and Expert's precautions must be considered when dealing with mechanical and/or electrical systems to ensure that you are NOT harmed, and/or the device and/or system is NOT ruined. If in doubt, do not touch any mechanical and/or electrical device or system referred to above.


On Sun, Aug 19, 2018 at 4:08 PM brass.ring@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 
[Attachment(s) from brass.ring@... [amelyachtowners] included below]

I believe the WASI anchor swivel may be the weak point in the current anchor system.  It may have been state of the art 10 years ago - things change.  I found the WASI swivel deformed, see photos, as Porter described.  Ours was attached to a 33kg Rockna.  It was replaced with a Mantus swivel due to the chain attachment method and its general construction, it appears to a brute.  Additionally, the customer support from the US distributor for WASI was horrible, multiple phone calls with no return calls, etc. - you may know the drill.

Mark & Debbie Mueller
Brass Ring  A54 - 68
Beaufort, NC

16981 - 17000 of 58528